I will call the May 19th, 2025 EDA meeting to order. Uh second item on the agenda first, we've got some um new members, so we need the oath of office for new members and and uh Matt. Sure. Take care of that. We'll start out with Mr. Miller. Yes. Uh if you want to raise your right hand or repeat after me. I Tim Miller I, Tim Miller, do solemnly swear to support. do solemnly swear to support the Constitution of the United States constitution of the United States the Constitution of the State of Minnesota constitution of the state of Minnesota and to discharge faithfully the duties as a member and to discharge faithfully the duties of a member of the city of East Bethl Economic Development Authority of the city of East Bethl Economic Development Authority in the county of Anoka and state of Minnesota in the county of Anoka and the state of Minnesota to the best of my judgment and ability to so best of my ability and judgement So help me God. Congratulations. Thank you. And Mr. Miller uh Mundle, raise your right hand. I, Brian Mundle, do solemnly swear to support I, Brian Mundle, do so solemnly swear to support the Constitution of the United States the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of the State of Minnesota. Constitution of the State of Minnesota. and to discharge faithfully the duties as a member. and to discharge faithfully the duties as a member of the city of East Bethl Economic Development Authority. of the city of East Bethl Economic Development Authority in the county of Anoka and state of Minnesota. In the county of Anoka and the state of Minnesota. To the best of my judgment and ability, so help me God. To the best of my judgment and ability, so help me God. Congratulations. All right. Okay. So now at this point we are ready to adopt the agenda. I'll make a motion to adopt the agenda. Do I have a second? I'll second. Thank you. All in favor? I opposed. That carries. Um item number four, we need to approve our January 21st, 2025 minutes. So, if you had a chance to review if there's any questions or comments or corrections. If not, I will take a motion. And then do we need to have those present make the motion and second it? That'd be best. Yeah. Okay. I'll make a motion to adopt the January 2125 minutes. I'll second. All right. All in favor? I opposed. All right. We've got approved minutes. So, item number five, the uh 2026 EDA levy levy review and recommendation. Uh, Madame Chair and uh, commissioners, we have before you uh, the 2026 EDA levy review and um, recommendation and it's kind of budget season right now. Uh, and so we have some background information for you here on on the 2025 budget and uh, kind of what we're thinking for 2026. So, um, this isn't necessarily set in stone. If uh you want to adopt it this evening, you probably still have time to to make modifications if need be before September, which is when the preliminary levies are adopted, and then um you can go down from there from September until November, but you cannot go up. So, um in 2025, the budget levy was set at $136,200. The EDA budget was 134,300. And um and essentially we have right now a balance in that account of $98,000 uh which uh is unbudgeted and can be used for expenditures. Uh for 2026 we're proposing a budget of 147300 and this is um based on assumptions of salaries and some assumptions of increases. Those haven't happened yet but um but we have to go off of something. And um this this uh budget obviously supports myself, the community development director, which uh is a budgeted for position, although we've not hired that person, a finance director, and the administrative support for the EDA related projects and marketing marketing efforts. Um and just a matter of note uh the maximum statutory levy that we can charge is uh 018 uh13% of the previous year's estimated market value of all property in the city. So we could essentially uh levy um $338,718 off of um off of the current market value in the city. And uh and so it's as you can see it's significantly below that. I know we've had some conversations about uh you know what are the goals of EDA and what sort of projects might want to be undertaken and what would the cost be of that uh this budget doesn't doesn't account for any of those um type of ideas. So if if some like I say if something comes up uh before September we can always uh modify uh the EDA budget or the council can modify it before they adopt it. Uh but um but we're kind of in that kind of middle ground right now of trying to decide uh some of the uh things we want to maybe undertake and if those have budget ramifications obviously we need to account for that. So I'll stand for questions. So my question is we have a $98,000 in there that weren't spent. So why are we doing even doing an increase? Why can't we just leave it the same? Uh, Madame Chair and, uh, Commissioner Urkl, um, again, you know, the thought is that you want to be slowly building up a balance in there so that ultimately if you want to, um, you know, do a study of some sort or, uh, if you want to pay for a new flyover to kind of freshen up the, you know, the the work that's being done on the corridor, you know, and kind of show that to other perspective. of uh developers or or people that are looking to invest. Um you want to have some dollars in there to do that. You don't want to say, "Well, we have nothing in a budget for that, so we'll have to wait till next year, you know, to get something like that done." Um we can certainly use those dollars, but it's I think it's prudent to keep a reasonable amount of money in there to um to do the function of what an EDA does and try and promote economic development uh within the city. So one one of the projects that the ED EDA has done in the past is attend various expos to uh promote the city. So that takes care of any expo fees and there's a certain amount of uh marketing dollars that goes into that for uh previous years we gave away uh little flash drives that had information about East Bethl on it. So that's what those kind of funds do. So it's not just saying there it can be utilized for these various things. There may be I get that there may be an opportunity to uh have some matching funds with a utility company to put in some infrastructure that is needed. There's uh lots of reasons to Yeah. Well, I'm not saying to cut it. I'm just saying to leave it as it was. I don't think the extra $2,000 is makes that much of a difference, but um so 134 to 136 is correct, right? No, it' be 136 to 147. So the the levy proposed amount was 136. What was actually spent was 134. Would that be correct? Yeah. if I can just run through some of the uh line items of the budget. Yeah, I I just want to say I was looking at the bottom where it says recommendation the 2026 budget levy of 136200. That's right. I'm sorry. The it is 136200. The actual budget is 147300. We would be using the balance from reserves from that 98,000. But let me let me just um go through uh the budget line items here. uh we have for commission and boards. So aside from the council members seated um that you know the the public members we have $1,000 budgeted for that for the um pdiums that they receive. Under professional service and fees we have $12,300 that would be noa county regional economic economic development authority um uh annual costs that the website is always coded in economic development as well. Um and uh so that's 12,300 in there. The general um reimbursement and transfers would be for as indicated the various different positions of $134,000. So that totals out 147300 uh for the 2026 budget. So again, it's not a lot of not a lot of extras in there at all. Um and um then it somewhat limits your options too is if you're going to take a more active role as an EDA. Any more questions on that? One more. So if we vote what this says it's going to be 147300 the budget which means next year it's going to be over 147 would be the it's not going to be the 130s correct. Anyways, my question is you said we can decrease it between now and September if we don't see a need for it. And these are for months from what months to what months for 2016? September is when you submit your preliminary levy. Uh and and then they, you know, calculate that and put that on the property tax bill and all that. Um November is when that's a final levy adoption. And I'm not sure the funding starts in January, right? So that would be for funding. So this budget goes up to January December 31st 25. The 2025 budget does. Yes. Okay. That's all right. That's all I've got. So e even if we tonight propose it to be 1473, if we change our minds by September, we can lower it. Correct. You can raise it before September, but what you adopt in September between September and November, you cannot raise after that adoption. You can lower after that point until you the final adoption, November. And then maybe during that time we can as we set our goals and figure out some budgetary items, we can figure out what what we can do with those dollars. Any other questions or comments? If not, I will I'll make a motion to set the 2026 EDA budget proposed budget to be 147300 to be reviewed before September. I'll second that. All in favor? I I opposed. Uh motion carries. All right. Item number six. Um Kushman and Wakefield Mark Market report. Madam Chair and uh commissioners, we have uh been here with Kushman Wakefield who has um so graciously offered to come in and kind of give us a rundown of the current maybe market in the area and what uh trends are and that sort of thing. I know um things are moving kind of fast out there and so um I think that uh a lot of the information is is going to be valuable in terms of decisions that we may we may want to undertake and and uh what we see trends to potentially be and and uh and get behind. So thank you for being here. Great. Well, thanks for having me. Um so I'm Ben Drew. I work for Kushman and Wakefield. I'm a land broker uh here in the Twin Cities and western Wisconsin. Uh I got um signed up with the Bader Elabage development team in the Sand Hill Parkway town home development and I'm working on their commercial acreage out front. Um the five or six acres out there that they've got guided for retail uh commercial uses. And we as the development continues to grow, um, one note, I'm not specifically involved in the residential part of the development, the town home development, but I do want to note that, um, the Bader Calivage folks wanted me to say that they're on track with their leasing projections for the town homes and still have significant demand. Construction should be complete by the end of August this year. continuing to move quick and on time and they're very very excited to move through the development and the leasing projections are are going well. So, all good news when it comes to more rooftops. Um, it's going to be a common theme at least tonight when we're talking about retail development and the neighborhood growth that needs to happen in order to support some of this development. So, I work specifically on land all over the metro uh both commercial and residential larger track uh with the national home builders and neighborhoods as well as uh on the industrial side. We represent Amazon and some of the larger larger developers in town. So, when we're working through neighborhoods, we usually come across a site that's guided and zoned for residential uses and then the city will want some commercial uses out front. And this is what we have here for specifically this development. So tonight I'm going to walk through what we see not only just here specifically on this site, but also kind of I'll try to blow it up to the Highway 65 corridor as well as just retail development in general. Um, so all over the Twin Cities, we're experiencing more suburban retail development than true infill reuse of other buildings. A lot of these tenants that are in the market now want newer product. They want to build the way that they want it built. and the developers that used to build these multi-tenant strip centers that house a pizza shop, um, a salon, a massage parlor, different different areas where there's tenants within a multi-tenant building. Those rents and those leases that need the amount of money right now that the developers need in order to make it work, it just doesn't pencil. So, we're seeing userdriven deals fall short of where these developers need to need to be in order for the rents to be where they are to support it. So, one, the multi-tenant buildings aren't as aren't being as built as often as they were. So, you have the mom and pop companies and businesses that used to be able to lease out space. It's becoming harder and harder to find. So, um, in the the second or third page, which I'm not going to get into the the numbers, um, too much, but we do see low vacancy rates based on what is available in the retail space right now. From a new development standpoint, in order for it to be multi-tenant, we're seeing these developers need the high tenant, high credit tenant, like a Chipotle, a Sport Clips. um some of the new development that you've seen along 65 and Blaine with the medical developers and the medical uses. Um you know what we're seeing right now are the daycarees are active, car washes clearly have been built on 65, but car washes are starting to slow down a little bit. Um the fast food quick service restaurants are still extremely popular and you know we're still seeing a growth in the senior care. um whether that's end of life memory care facilities or just senior housing in general. Uh the gas stations are are active Quick Trip. Um you know, clearly on this site specifically, um Bader did a great job landing them and they're, you know, one of the first groups that come in and try to fill the void of both a ger and a gas station and they do a great job doing it. There's one, you know, some of the best in town. So, you know, with that use there, it does limit a little bit. Going back to that five acres that sits out front, what can go there? I mean, Quick Drip would have been a great user there, but it's it's there already. So, we're seeing these, call it 5 to 10 acre developments fill up with one to two acre users, and those are daycarees um and then various retail options like medical facilities. And so with this site specifically, and I think in East Bethl, the rooftops are a huge thing. It's not just one neighborhood that creates a a need for a restaurant. It's, you know, it's multiple neighborhoods. It's hundreds of rooftops. Um, which was the current feedback that we get on a daily basis from users that are looking on Highway 65 or in the call it in the Blaine Ham Lake, East Bethl area. uh growth is absolutely coming north and the biggest I think component right now is trying to understand what users are not in Blaine or Ham Lake and would come up to East Bethl to kind of start start another market submarket for them. And so we're looking specifically at these users in order for them to not only from a developer standpoint, but also also the users. About 90% of the retail tenants or retail users in our market are represented by a broker. So um it it you know call it make 10 or 15 calls and you've got a pretty good market coverage of what's what some of the feedback is. Um current interest in the site has focused mainly towards industrial users. Uh we I get a lot of calls for auto dealerships. Uh I get a lot of calls for storage facilities. Uh trailer storage and dealerships. um not tractor trailer but recreational trailer storage and dealerships. Um I've had pole uh industrial poleb barn interest from folks that are potentially going to be running their business or expanding their business out of uh a residential property. And so those are the types of uses that we tend to see just north of Lane kind of as you move as you come into East Bethl and with some of the new development that um Designing Earth Contracting is doing and Jesse's new building and Quick Trip and Dollar General and all those that are starting to fill into the market. It's a good sign. It it absolutely is because there are some markets right now experiencing no new development on the retail front. And so the feedback's been more rooftops, more rooftops, not enough population density. Um it's all good signs with the neighborhoods that are being built, but the that's the common feedback at least at the moment. in I think the you know it seems pretty self-explanatory that you need to have residents in order to spend money at the at this at the retail locations but it's just it's not as easy as that. We've got locations in the metro that have Carver Minnesota for example off 212 has hundreds and hundreds of housing starts a year and we're list we're working on a site on 212 that we would think has great visibility. Um should be a great grocery site but we put it in front of every ger around town and they're they're not active. Hi Ve came in about a bunch of sites. They're now selling their land. Ones and buyer lease is on hold for a few of their projects. Uh I think a the common go-to ger that fits in maybe a smaller community would be an Aldi. Um Aldi likes to go next to other grocerers. They take business from other grocerers and Targets and Walmarts and they're okay operating off 10 or 20% of the revenue of one of those stores. And so the the Aldi concept is based on being around other stores, not being by itself. I I can find an example of one where they are maybe a little bit removed from that ger or from that target, but generally speaking, they like to piggy back on all of that other traffic generation, not necessarily generate their own. So, some that's some of the specific feedback we got. Um, working through this list specifically for East Bethl. Uh, clearly there's a ton of fast food in Blaine. It's it's a function of data, demographics. We, you know, we we've talked to the Taco Bell folks, for example, and they're they'll run their numbers and they'll look at the population, they'll look at the demographics, and it's it's either a yes or a no. it's really hard to kind of negotiate and and try to push what is coming up from a new development standpoint. So, from an EDA's perspective, and my job too is to show where the dirt's moving, how many rooftops are coming on board. Um, we we get imagery that's flown every 3 months. So, we try to update the aerials and my my job is to show where the growth's happening so that we can sell land and and promote the business. But it's it really does help visually to see that it's actually happening as opposed to here are some of the proposed starts or proposed neighborhoods, but if you can actually envision the dirt moving and infrastructure going in, it really does tell it tell a better story. So, from a city standpoint, it's it's nice to promote that, but from a marketing standpoint, that's also what, you know, I'm here to do. Uh, clearly the car wash, I'm just going to kind of work through some user groups, and I would love to take some questions. Um, the car washes clearly have exploded over the last handful of years. The subscription model is tough. I think there's going to be some car washes like breweries that just probably don't make it more than five years because there's either going to be um too many subscription turnovers and just potentially overbuilt. But the the feedback from some of those were um just not enough population density to support it. I also don't know if car wash is potentially a wanted use out in front of the the town home neighborhood where there's it's a neighborhood commercial use and it seems to be transit oriented if you will um like like a gas station. Uh daycarees are are a great neighborhood commercial use. Um I would fit that in with a a pet daycare. um a doggy daycare. They, you know, there is some barking and there's some outdoor noise, but generally speaking, it's a good mix within the neighborhood, commercial, medical, um kind of family oriented build the neighborhood up. Unfortunately, so far, we've seen a lot of daycarees been built over the last few years. There's been a few that have built in the newer areas of Blaine. It's a function of rooftops. soon as there's residence to to bring your kids to, then you know that that helps immensely. I think the traffic along 65 does help. Um, clearly there's visibility and and a ton of traffic on it. The the Bader Elabage site specifically is a little bit circuitous. you come around and you kind of have to work your way back in. And it's almost like you have to have another reason to go there as opposed to like you live there as opposed to just going to the daycare. But a daycare is a destination. So you are going there no matter where it is or how far you have to turn off. So if you see a dental office, you will take a right and you'll curl around and you'll go to the dental office. If you're going to go to McDonald's, you're probably going to want to find one that's really easy in and out or a coffee shop, for example, like where scooters went, you know, right in, right out, and then you're right back on 65. So those those uses will have a I think a difficult time with we've been trying to kind of work in all of the the other new development north in the single family neighborhood um of the redevelopment of the golf course and try to kind of illustrate that to the market. Again, we're just a little early. We're showing dirt moving. We're showing these housing starts. the retailers kind of just say, "All right, that's great, but we'll come back in a year or we'll, you know, we'll check back in a year or two." Kind of timeline is it's not three months, it's probably not 6 months, it's probably 6 to 12 months. We've had a lot of auto shop interest. Um, couple newer re uh auto shop Christian Brothers is in the market. Um, there are like take five oil changes, uh, quick service oil change groups. Again, that's not that pretty of a use. The buildings look pretty good. You But you do have auto bays and garage doors. So, they do a nice job of dressing up the building. You just you'd have to be, you know, from a city standpoint allow those auto uses within that area, which I believe they're allowed. It's just how does that mix with a new town home product and what you're trying to create from a city standpoint. You know, it's great to have a user. It's great to sell land. It's great to grow business, but I think there's a way to do it that helps promote the lease the leasing of those and purchases of the of the residential rooftops coming in around it. The developers, I I mentioned that a little bit. They're it's hard anywhere. Edina, uh, Plymouth, Woodbury, you know, there it's just a a handful of users and tenants that are actually making the new developments work right now. Uh, I'd love to see more restaurants being built. Uh, I'm working on uh the redevelopment of the data centers in Egan, right in the heart of Egan. And there is not one restaurant that wants to be built. Yeah, there's a lot of restaurants around there, but you know, every city we work with, whether it's Plymouth or Egan, all the infill cities, the suburban cities want restaurants. And you know, I was just driving up here on 65 and I looked at every bar and grill and they're packed. So, it it is people like to go out and enjoy it. And I think that's a good use for this site being that it's walkable. Um the the Bader Elevage site specifically, I think, would have a be a really nice for a walkable restaurant of some kind and maybe mix in a daycare. There's probably not much other acreage for uses. You probably have two or three users there. Would love to do a small ger obviously. You know, that's our top choice would be a ger all the take the five acres and it would be it would be a home run for everyone involved. So, that's our that's our priority. That's our main goal. But right now we're just it's slow. Um and I think some of the past 12 months has been uncertainty with the election. Uh uncertainty with now just yeah rates costs, tariffs, no tariffs. You know this is like live information as opposed to you know kind of what we're seeing six months ago or 12 months ago. I think this is it's a different story now because we are seeing here locally dirt moving and there's action. The leaseability has been really good for for Elivage and Bader. And so, you know, we're optimistic. I just know that I've worked on plenty of these kind of mixed use sites where there's a residential component and the commercial component. The commercial component always takes longer than expected. Um, and it's not that even I've one of the developers made a comment like even if you were giving me the land for free, I still can't make the numbers work right now with the tenants that would come in and want to lease up our space. So, there's just a little bit of a disconnect from a mark market standpoint with retail right now. It's very difficult. Um, but generally speaking, the residential market is extremely hot. I would continue to see I would I would envision more and more residential activity as as Blaine builds up and Am Lake doesn't develop like East Bethl. And so here we are in East Bethl with with new residential. So I can see that happening over the next couple years. We see no end in sight from um both town homes and single family. Multifamily is really tough right now. apartments, you know, from from an affordable standpoint, those projects do work, but they take a lot of time. Um, but your market rate apartments are are extremely difficult as well. I would talk about some of the industrial land and some of the industrial focused users that we see in the market, but I think for this site specifically, that's not the use that city wants to see. um not saying industrial as an outside storage, but more like a business service use some or a small manufacturer or something that's completely inside probably doesn't fit here. But we're going to start to see more and more of those businesses um either get pushed out of Blaine, need to need to uh have more space, there's no space available in Bla, need to build new. Where's land? Where do my employees want to work? Probably close to 65 for transit reasons. So, um I would imagine that the 65 corridor continues to grow and at good interchanges and those interchanges are continuing to happen, get safer, and I would say a little bit more complex, but if if you can educate the market to say this is how you go left and this is how you go right and here's how you can access the site, that's a huge plus because right now some of these retailers will look at these traffic control highways, say, "Well, Well, I can't go left. Well, can. You just have to take the U-turn 500 ft up the road. So, you know, it is a little bit of getting used to those types of maneuvers. Um, it's not as easy as just taking a right. So, cuz some of these retailers are out of town and so we're trying to educate them as they go. Um, I think, you know, to to end it, most of the retail development is in the suburbs right now, which is a good thing. When suburban areas continue to grow, the housing market is still extremely hot. And um, I don't know, just based on talking to to Bader Alibabage, and driving up here, I'm encouraged to to see what East Bethl and the 65 corridor is going to be. It's just not going to be real quick. So, we're talking years, not months, but um I'll be doing this for a long time, so I'll be around. So, um so we've got retailers in St. Francis, we've got some retailers in Ham Lake. So, if we get a successful leasing of some of of these town home units and then people could start to take a look at it, like scooters for example. I mean, what's their radius where they'll go? I mean, they're up on cross town. So, what is that? It's like a third of an acre or or I mean, what what radius? Um, I see. How far away? How far away? Sorry. Yep. So, if they're looking at where's the next one going? Yep. built. Is it three miles? Is it mile and a half or It's not scooters specifically, but like a caribou cabin. You know, we talked to them and so they're um if you're talking specifically coffee, they want to be on the AM side of the highway. So, that's going south on 65, which is why they picked there. Right. Quick Trip is saying I I believe we we do a lot of site their sites a year and they I would believe on the PM side going north are trying to hit the folks going home um to either grab grab a bite to eat, grab dinner, kind of the family quick family meals. Um, so depending on product type, there are reasons why they would want to be on the south side or the north side of 65 which is why I think specifically of the Bader Elabage site. It is a little bit circuitous. There's other land available around it. Sure. So, uh, it's a function of price and yeah, marketability and, you know, all of that. So, I I don't know specifically scooters from a a radius standpoint, but um but no, from a competition, it would be it would be good. Uh daycarees, it it totally depends on the population density around it. You know, you'll find daycarees right next to each other because they love to be next to each other. It's there's a need for that, but it's not necessarily specific to that company. Thank you. Any other questions? Does the empty parcel on the northwest northwest side of Highway 65 and Viking affect or could potentially affect the development at the Elvage site? Yeah. So, I think there is going to be talking sight specific. Yeah, I think there's going to be be competition there from where where a user would like to go. It's a from from a city standpoint, it's where sewer and water available. Where does the council see this use a use? Um, easy in and out. So, I think what we're trying to push from the BER alge site is that it's ready to go. infrastructurees in. You're going to be right next to some brand new town homes. The visibility is great. So, there are some hopeful positives to that site being that it's already teed up as opposed to just raw vacant land. Um, but it's user driven based on access, price, all the and all those other terms that they're going to look at. I know you don't have statistics off the top of your head, but just thinking about density and rooftops, are we halfway there? Are we Yeah. So, I like to think of it as hundreds of rooftops. Okay. Uh we were I'm listing 140 acres in Greenfield off Highway 55. So, outside of Corkran, uh Wisetta School District into another school district or Rockford school district. and Greenfield and Rockford have been, you know, they're enough removed from the true Musa boundary and where develop where sewer and water development is. They have their own sewer and water, but they are removed from it a touch. And what we're seeing there is just there's still a need. You know, there's still community members and residents around. It doesn't have to be dense necessarily. Um, but what what you're trying to minimize is the the rural 20 30 40 acre parcels and maybe one acre or two acre lots where you know you you'll you'll add 50 homes or 100 homes. Generally speaking, I would say that what's going on near Bader and Elage, you know, a few a couple more of those would be would be great. Okay. Thank you. I have a question. Do you ever tout the Anoka Blaine airport as a good selling point for businesses to come to East Bethl? Because I know that was one of the talking points that got this city as a member of that airport commission. So I was just wondering if you've checked those kind of businesses that use that airport and yeah we we're working on a site off Rison right now. Um so we we are familiar with with the whole that I would say whole area of both on the industrial side and on the residential side industrializ and business side. Um we we do try to promote that as much as possible. Uh right now we've kind of seen not much in uh it hasn't moved the needle much for groups that we're talking to. Maybe from a residential standpoint where you could be close to the airport that you've got your private jet at or your business coming in. I you know there people come traveling to you from regional other airports in the Midwest. We just we just don't see that a ton. Thanks. Kind of sounds to me that uh we just got to sit and wait until a big fish comes in and bites our bait. Yeah. I mean, we're we're checking the boxes, uh pushing it out to every group. Unfortunately, you know, feedback now really means feedback probably over the next couple months until something changes. Um, now that's not to say that there isn't a a dentist who lives 5 minutes from the site who wants to open his his or her own dental office and, you know, purchase an acre and little 10,000 foot building with 12 parking stalls and build a dentist, you know, dentist. So, that happens and we don't see that. We don't have a crystal ball know when those groups are going to show up, but you do see those. Absolutely. Um right now construction costs are insanely high. So hopefully, you know, we don't always like to kind of push that through, but at least there's um try to educate them on what these costs are going to be as opposed to um you know, hey, what's how much is the land? but trying to understand building costs and everything else to verify the buyer and help with the city on trying to figure out from a a fee perspective what those fees are going to be, how much land is needed, how much green space, how much ponding. Uh it seems like a lot of those, you know, call it newer developments with the newer buyers need to be educated based on, you know, what what new development entails from a civil engineering standpoint and everything that goes into it. it uh it's a lot. So your advice is just I I compar or I don't mean mean to put words in your mouth but be patient. I think patience is key here. Um I think the uncertainty is starting to from from all product types and new development. I think the uncertainty is starting to diminish. I think there's um we're going to see a ton of we're going to see more commercial growth coming up in the next five years I think than we've had in a long time just due to these these houses that are the housing shortage we're in the new developments that are being built even in community growing communities like East Bethl um we're going to continue to see that because you know we're 20 30 miles from this the CBD that's really not that far When you start measuring from around the metro where these other where these other municipalities are growing, it's all about a drive time to the central business district, Minneapolis, St. Paul, wherever you need to be. And the truth is that 65 is a great corridor for that from a drive time perspective just with some of the new interchanges and intersections that they've built. That's only going to get better. Um, so I think East Bethl is going to become a lot closer or feel a lot closer. It does feel a lot closer now than it did ever 10 years ago even. So, you know, these are all improvements that are going to help these users come up this way. Um, but over the past 10, 20 years, they've just stopped in Blaine. Truth is, Blaine's full and uh, growth's going to continue north. So, patience. I just I look back I mean I I was a carpenter by trade. I spent uh 30 years as a superintendent running commercial work. You would know a number of my employers that I' I'd work for if I dropped the names. I look back at when I was just a young kid carpenter framing on town homes in Maple Grove on the south side of the freeway down, you know, down in there for I forget who the, you know, who the developer was, but you know, it was town homes that we were building forplexes and then 15 years later, we're I'm building as a commercial man, superintendent, I'm building places on the north side of the road, specifically the Champs restaurant that was there. If you remember when that was there, now it's a pizza place and the famous Daves. And I mean, man, when we first started building Champs, it was nothing but gravel pit that was owned by Charlie McCross and going north. And now it's totally totally filled in. Yeah. It just it just it just happens. It does. And it's you started with the town homes or you started with the residential. And yeah, I uh call it the 0809 recession, if you will. These retailers got out ahead of the rooftops and they got burned by it. And so there's um just more thought about it today. It's there's there's a lot more research that goes into it. uh they slow play the rooftop and density count, population density, and they want to just make sure they're making the right decision. It's as everyone would, but there are times in history when they weren't as conservative as they are now. And um that's it's affected the the velocity of the market just because there aren't a ton of deals penciling right now. Yeah. I just have to say from the residents. What I've been hearing besides a grocery store, they want a place like a coffee shop or someplace where they can go in and sit down and and meet and have a conversation with somebody and not order a big meal, but you know, just quick 15, 30, 45 minute meetups with somebody, maybe business meetings, that kind of thing. And that's what they're hoping for. Sounds like a local deli or local restaurant. Yeah. Yep. a non-alcohol place. I see uh just last week the 40 acres just north of our northwest corner 65 and biking went up for sale. I saw that. I already had one person call me on it, too. So, yeah, looking at it. I guess the cost is up pretty high and uh downside of it is how much uh soil correction they'd have to do. pretty low of a lot the northwest corner just north of it right next to half a Hoffman sod field there site it'd be half a H offman sidefield there on the west side because yeah when you said when you said I mean I've been involved with way too much soil correction when you said soil correction I'm going that's how come the uh this is just north of budding north okay y So, so Ben, what's your read on interest rates? I mean, they keep talking about them coming down or that's the goal, pressing the Federal Reserve to adjust them. Are are sight selectors going to respond quickly if you know kind of pent pent back demand based on interest? Obviously, if if if you can't cash flow your project, you're not going to, you know, dive in. But an interest rate makes a little more affordable if it's reasonable. Yeah, it does. It doesn't I would say it it doesn't move the needle for most groups. Most groups their delta is way too big large as opposed to um you know because the land isn't just the only expense, right? The only line item, it's probably one of the smaller line items when you're building a building. And so um depends what's being buil. Uh we think they're going to continue to adjust down but not much is what our economic forecaster says at least in house for 2025. I don't have a crystal ball but I I I will say that it u it's trending in the right direction and we're seeing more and more activity from a commercial stamp commercial use standpoint than we've had in a long time. long time as in the last 12 to 24 months. Um the industrial industrial users and have really picked up and we're seeing some of the retailers come back at least uh and try to start competing with with some of the the folks that have been just developing like crazy. So, is there anything that this EDA or the city can do to help assist you in your efforts? Uh, anyone who is interested in land or has a question on land, uh, happy to help. Um, if they're looking for retail land, obviously I would love for them to talk to us about the Bader Elabage piece for a lot of different reasons. it's ready to go. Um, and I think promoting development there in and around residential areas is is helpful. It's just the growth is easier and um, a little bit more direct and it's walkable and there's a lot of lot of I think positives to that when it's when you're on a large corridor like 65 to promote businesses. It's always helpful to understand, you know, I think drive time is a huge key to um how if you look at a map, I think East Bethl looks far north, but if you actually look at the drive times and the minutes it takes to get somewhere um comparably to somewhere in the east metro or west metro, it's it's it's very relevant um to all these other suburban towns that are growing or have grown quicker or or in at different times. So I think there are requirements that cities put on like green space, ponding requirements, impervious coverage ratios, different things that you know if a user shows up, we we just try to be as flexible as possible based on the use. Um, we understand that, you know, there's only so much cities can do to promote growth, but sometimes park dedication fees, um, can, you know, all of those fees can add up. The soft cost, the soft fees going to can add up in a development when it's barely penciling out to begin with. That's probably the easiest one to ask for. Now, I understand that. I think it's it's more about where's the dirt moving, where these housing starts are going to be coming in. where's the city promoting development? Um visualizing where those where those growth corridors are going to be. I think all of that at least selfishly if I were to take some of the city's documentation of where where the growth's going to happen and I would love to market that for this site to just be able to say here are some of the progre here are some of the projections. Um, here are some areas within the city close by within a mile or two that potentially are developing or under contract or have uh have development applications in. You know, part of that is my job to research and do some of the market trends and and research the local area. But from a city standpoint, just kind of having that at your fingertips would be um you know, it goes a long way to show somebody from out of town what East Bethl is like or how close it is to the interstates or how close it is to Minneapolis St. Paul. I think it it goes a long way from people that are out of town and need to understand the market. Um it really does help. So, it's kind of a long-winded way of saying that promoting development means showing development and I think showing like I said where the growth's happening and just I mean Matt's been uh been great to deal with and there's we're trying to promote growth as much as possible from going south from the yellow de development that cornfield. Mhm. Back in there. I mean, you re I mean, I'm sure you realize that's prime developable land. Yeah. There's a lot of I mean, that's a good it's a great area to keep building on. Owned owned owned by a local couple of brothers. Mhm. I was just curious if you know you I'm sure that that had registered on your radar. Yeah, we're aware, you know, I'm aware of the property. not specifically, but I I'm aware of the property and um I know that there's growth for development, but it's I think just in this growing city, it it takes time for even a residential builder to kind of take the leap and want to put in all the infrastructure and get going. So even in this market, the costs are still high for even the residential single family homes or or the town homes, but we're we're seeing um just an insatiable appetite of of all the product types right now. So hopefully that continues and we can keep uh keep the builders going. Anything else? comments, questions? No. Well, thank you for coming tonight. Yeah, this is really helpful. Just coming from someone who's in it real time, you're getting direct response to to these sites. That's very helpful. It's not always fun to come and say it's going to be if you be patient and you know it's slow and you know you know I've talked with the Bader Elage folks and it's you know here's the feedback and but it's it's what's happening right now and everyone's a little bit cautious and uh but this is the perfect time to start promoting and showing where the dirt's moving and um just get it out there. So I'm hopeful that this isn't our first East Bethl project and would be happy to help out at at any point. Yeah. I if possible I' what like to invite you back in 6 months or a year for update of uh when you have something to update. That sounds great. So So just a quick question. I know that some cities are a lot of cities are using TIFF to try and you know bait developers in and write down infrastructure costs and that sort of thing. try and close that that funding gap. Uh do you see um do you see cities then owning land and making deals on owned land versus private owned land and developers coming in and trying to negotiate with private owners? Is there a you know I guess what are you seeing in in in regards to the two of those because that's generally either someone owns it or some entity you know uh a city owns it perhaps. Yeah. I mean, the cities are the city owns it. Usually, they're ready to promote development and kind of roll out the red carpet of incentives and get everything going. So, that's my personal experience with buying city- owned land or representing folks that are buying city- owned land from the kind of cherry pick. Yeah. And and cherry pick. I mean, I but it at the end of the day, you're not going to move McDonald's over to the city owned site when that's the site they want and that's the site they're going to pay for. So, it really is user driven. Um, I would say just product type. If you're a if you're a manufacturer, you probably don't care whether you're on the second spot or the third spot from the corner. So, if you're, you know, competing against a corner spot, but the city owned land is, you know, thousand feet up the road and you can offer some incentives. I think there's a a difference there depending on who your end user is. Um, TIFF is great. Right now, it doesn't mean the project's going to work. So, it's not a given that since there's TIFF available that it's just magically going to happen, but obviously we we've got a lot of lot of developers that love it and want it clearly, but it doesn't always fix the the the problem within their performance that's going on right now in today's world. Interesting. Cool. Well, thank you. Thank you. Appreciate it. Take care. We'll get you on the docket in another 6 months or 12 months here. And yeah. All right. I would like to bring up a point now that, you know, he's sitting down. and I didn't want to have him sit, you know, stand up here for this, but I was going to save this for council, but I think this is a more appropriate place to bring it in. There's a property on uh 1347 Sims Road. It's right on the north west side of Sims and 65. Uh it's 2.2 acres. It's got an assessed value of 232,000. It's currently being marketed for 260. We just heard right now that one acre lots, twoacre lots uh are pretty popular. Um this is something I think uh we should take a hard look at as a city of purchasing. I really do as an investment. As you know, there's two ways to make taxes for the city or money for the city. Taxes and investment. This is going to be right in the hub of things as 65 corridor finishes and moves north. and like development is going to be doing. Um, it also allows the city to control it. Uh, who goes in there and have the red carpet that we want in an area that is going to be improving vastly with what's there right now. Um, I think we should take a hard look at it. uh haven't seen too many projects come through that we've invested in lately, but this would be one of them that I think would not only benefit the city immensely, right? Um and it would be uh something that we could split. It's zoned special right now, but we can always we can always change that zone special use. Um city sewer runs through the front of the property. Um, it's over by uh what is it? Right next to MC's. Yeah, Chucky Mickelson was renting that out. Yeah, that corner section there. Seen the signs and looking at it and I started to do some research on it and uh based on what they're asking for it. I don't think you're going to be able to find land cheaper. I really don't at that asking price and we haven't even started any negotiating with them. That's just what they're asking for. Yeah, they just reduced it six grand. So, I mean, I I think it's it's something that we should take a hard look at as an investment for the city to start controlling some of these pieces of property. It's kind of nice. It's right by the school, so it would be a perfect place for a coffee shop or Aldi. And like like Ben said, if we if we go to two acres or we go to one acre, you you could actually split that and have two new businesses come in there right on that section. And if that water tower bill comes through, we're going to be right in the middle of it. That'll be over in here. The water tower, that's city owned property there. So piping will go to the schools and then it'll go right by this area here all the way south to Hunter in which is been reszoned commercial industrial. So but it's that what corner right there. Mhm. Right here. Yep. Yeah. I mean if we can control that and control what goes in there it and the the price is really reasonable. It certainly seems to make a lot of sense. I do believe we have the money. We could at least put a third down and I think it we borrow from the city at that point for financing. Yeah. So, Madam Chair and commissioners, we, you know, we have a balance of, you know, almost $100,000 in EDA. We have some in HR as well. There's a house on here, so it'd be a quasi uh HA EDA effort. Um and um and essentially if you keep it strictly with uh EDA, you could do an internal loan transfer and kind of repay whatever account over the years as opposed to, you know, seeking funding somewhere else and paying interest. You're paying yourself back for it essentially. Um, but yeah, I mean, if this this bill, and I'll be talking a little bit about that later today under the council input, but we're we're proposing putting a water tower treatment plant and running pipes under the highway over to the schools uh to connect them to city sewer and water. Sewer is a forest main coming down here and then that'll be the water service. And then we'll stub it out right here to again feed that industrial park. Stubbing out to the north would be would be um very easy. Uh and so controlling a corner lot, whether it's that or we've often talked about every man's treasure, you know, um building there. uh those those are going to be the I think the top performing parcels uh in terms of interest uh if this project goes through um with the state. So, I think the only issue I see with that corner lot though is like typically the county and them are going to require your entrance to that property to be made it like 500 ft off of 65 300 I think. But yeah, that's going to be your only issue. I don't know that they can deny the entrance that exists there. Yeah. Um they they may say you have to come in off uh Ulisses 213th and Ulisses. We'll beat up Joe McFerson over there a little bit. But if you purchase the corner and the lot just to the west of it right here, you could redraw property lines and uh you can get an entrance in there. I think we'd want to do some due diligence on the lot to see if there's any sort of contamination, you know, um talk with the county, kind of get every all the information in line before you would, you know, you could certainly make an offer and make it contingent on all that, you know, being to the city's satisfaction, but um you know, it's a willing seller. And I think it'd be a great investment for this city. So, Madame Chair, if you if you'd like if you want to make a motion to direct staff to research it uh and come back with um all the specifics on it, we can certainly we can certainly do that. So, if I make a motion or ask for a motion, I can make a motion. It doesn't either way. Yeah, I I would make a motion to for city staff to look into the potential purchase of 13 Looks like it's 1347 Sims Road Northeast. No, approximately 2.2 acres. I'm looking at the land flyer right here. Oh, you are? Okay. Thanks, Ben. Um, I would make that motion. I'll second. All in favor? I I I I. So, just for the record, this is pin number 08-33-23-24. I'm sorry, 34-00002. Thank you. Okay. And opposed. All right. That motion carries. Yeah, I like that idea. Thanks for bringing that up. Thank you. Yeah. Do we on that same vein, I mean, I know we had sold or were looking at selling some property um over on Taylor Street. Uh yeah, Madam Chair and Commissioners, I've been uh working with Dave Wills uh who is with Price Homes. I think it's Price Homes. Oh, Dale. Dale Wills. Dave Wills. Dave. Dale. One of the two. Yeah. Okay. Wills. Mr. Wills um and they build a um kind of a patio home retirement product and um and they're very very interested in that property. Uh we were at a dollar figure that um that again based on what we heard tonight, you know, people have to come up with a performer. It's got to make sense. They can't tape money to a project and lose money. Uh so uh we you know it's a matter of coming to that that um that agreement on price. Now we last legislative session the legislature passed a quarter cent sales tax for housing and we received uh some dollars and you know for 60% of the year last year and now we'll be receiving more for for this year. And those type of dollars can be used for various different projects. There's some limitations and um and you know, senior housing probably will fit within that. So, is there a way we can combine those tax dollars? And if you don't use those tax dollars, by the way, uh you'll hear a huge sucking sound and they go into Minneapolis. You know, they use them. So, we we have a vested interest in making sure that the tax dollars that are extracted from our residents go back into our community, you know, if we can make that happen. And so, we're currently investigating whether we can offset some of that price with some of those dollars so that the city gets paid the dollar figure that they want. They're able to use uh these grant dollars, so to speak, to to close the gap on their end. And then a project like that can be built, which being next to the senior high-rise, I think that would be kind of a stage of life type of progression and um be a nice project actually. They build nice stuff. Thank you. Uh anything else or should we move to city council report? Madam Chair and commissioners, I just have a couple items. I'll I'll brief us all on here. Uh today we had the fire chief, the new fire chief start and uh came through and introduced them to folks and uh and we also in this process have um have upgraded the uh fire inspector position to deputy fire chief. So Ben is the new fire deputy fire chief and we'll be doing fire inspections as well. and that'll uh still uh keep our businesses safe out there as he's going around doing those inspections. Uh so this chief will be coming up to speed and he comes uh very well recommended, highly educated. He's uh got a master's in uh I believe it's fire safety and then he's working his PhD as well. So sharp guy, real sharp guy. And I think he's going to be a excellent addition to uh the um uh to the city and he will be an excellent addition to the team over there in helping to build a stronger fire department. So that's some of the news on the on staff sighting. Um we have a we're currently in the budget season right now. We're working with um uh the union right now to establish some of the wage issues and um and then we'll be continuing to meet with our department heads to finalize budgets. This is again this evening is one of the budgets that need to be kind of least established. Um and then I wanted to also touch on the community development director. I know we've we've had about three applications on that and we're kind of holding back a little bit. you've heard this evening that um you know this area is a little early to development. You know that it could be a year or so before people really start looking strongly at development. And um that's part of the reason I think for hesitation is we may not want to hire somebody to sit and not really do anything, you know, at that sort of wage. Um you know, we get a few calls about used car lots. I'm not sure we're chasing those, you know. Um I think uh you know I think when when you use people throw around the Aldi's or something like that you know a little higher level development. Um but again I think the interest rates and kind of um you know uh some of the realization that Blaine is built out and Ham Lake doesn't have the the density allowance and and they'll somewhat leaprog once some of the highway 65 work is done. I think that buys us a little time here before bringing a community development director on on staff. That at least that's my recommendation and sta and council can can change that if they'd love to. Um but uh I think we want to use someone efficiently based on need and um and right now we might be a little bit early on that. I uh Aaron was a community development director for us. We didn't have a planner at the time. he was doing a lot of planning work and so kind of looking at uh some of the um focus that he had and and limited work he was doing on community development, it kind of helps me to formulate that we might not have a full-time requirement yet for that. Um the planner that we have is coming up to speed. She's doing an excellent job. And um and we have also um Kendra who is uh from Landform also kind of providing a little uh training still on that on on her coming up to speed and so the two of them are are doing an excellent job. Um Elvage and Capstone are moving along uh very well. The uh Capstone is going to be I'm told will be dropping out building plans as early as tomorrow on models that they're going to be constructing out there. So, they are moving at an incredible rate of speed. Uh, and um, and I'm really really impressed with, you know, that this isn't the first rodeo. They they build homes and they know how to uh, and when they move in, it's it's full speed ahead. And so, we're we're going to be seeing a lot of that kind of popping out of the ground uh, shortly. And then I just wanted to give a um update on the legislative session. Today is the official day of adjournment. They have not adjourned yet. They may not adjourn until the wee hours of the night. Um and uh and by the sounds of it, they'll probably be looking at um additional uh sessions uh to try and get through some of the work that they uh have not been able to get through. Uh obviously the out of the gate this year they there was a lot of uh um I don't you want to use the word foolishness but a lot of things where people didn't uh necessarily trust each other and uh and so I think that's kind of playing out through this legislative session where everyone's taken to their separate corners and there's not a lot of compromise on on things. So, as as everyone knows, we're um we're we're trying to work with the state on the $10.5 million request for the uh water tower treatment plant and pipes to hook up the schools. We've impressed upon them that this is uh not um not a want, it's a need, an absolute need. uh we've impressed upon them that this city has made significant investments in the city city's uh sewer system to the tune of $20 million and for a city this size that's that's significant significant and uh and so the thought of spending another 10 million is just a failure to launch. Uh so it's a but for test but for the state stepping up on this um uh it's not going to happen anytime soon. And of course, there's uh some questionable water situations there that are going on that I don't necessarily want to get into full detail on, but um all of this will will uh be good for the schools and will certainly be good as indicated for the new industrial park uh that's proposed. So, we're um I I guess I would be absolutely surprised if we were awarded this project. Generally, uh, clean water projects are not contentious at the state legislature, but given the, uh, deficit that they're proposing, uh, after last year's spending bench, um, is, uh, limits the amount of bonding that they can have. And I and while they didn't bond last year, um, and they generally bond about a billion every year, I think their cap is around 700 million. Uh and so uh it will be a hard-fought battle there to bring home the bacon so to speak for each legislature legislator rather and uh and their pet projects will take priority certainly. So we're um we're working with uh Peggy Scott, Representative Peggy Scott and Senator Calbar to uh to advocate on our behalf. they understand the importance of this project and we're um we're hoping that uh that we'll be successful and if not we'll we'll add 5% to it and go back next year. It's just just inflation. So, as I as I told people on projects I worked at at the county, I said, uh if we're not going to talk about this, you know, if we're not going to fund this, let's stop talking about it because it's only going to get more expensive. Uh so it's uh it's something that I think is uh is critical critical that it get done and uh will be certainly important to uh the proposed development that'll be happening in in East Bethl. But aside from that, I think that's all I have for council update unless um there's questions. Anything else? Motion to adjurnn. Oh, just say uh hope everyone has a good Memorial Day weekend. It's right around the corner again. It is. Yeah. So, I I'll second the motion. Thank you. All in favor? I opposed. We are adjourned.