it's called a meeting to order I am sitting in for Reed today or am I sitting in for Cindy yes true we are really we are really getting desperate the third string is here okay are you starting then um probably do the you want to do the action agenda to other side page one Jim's well vers at this it's just been okay we call the meeting order approve the agenda I'll make a motion second any discussion all in favor I I all right [Music] now motion to approve the March 17th Planning Commission me minutes I get a motion so moved second second any discussion all in favor okay new business I'll let you take over now thank you Mr chair um right uh Commissioners uh so today we're here to talk a little bit about the uh Brookview development it's coming through as a final plat recently seen it plat made it all the way through the review process for that and was approved at Council So today we're just going to do a little bit of presentation on what's changed what the final plot's about then we'll leave some time for the developer to make a presentation or to make comments and then we'll fin discussion so what the Planning Commission is charged to do today for final plat is to make a recommendation on this to city council that's a recommendation either to approve or to deny uh the final plat and that plat or this plat will go in front of City Council on June 6 so just next month for uh just a little bit of detail on the project you know again just kind of showing where it is I'm sure all you are very familiar at this point but um just south of The Meadows development um what we're looking at is uh and here's the plat in front of you we're looking at 22 Lots now instead of 24 kind of get into that a little bit later um and then there's two sizable out lots that will be created uh this out lot will be dedicated to the city uh there will end up being some sort of trail on it and we'll uh kind of talk about the details a little bit later on you know again just to talk a little bit about the planning process uh you know planning uh City Administration engineering Public Services fire uh legal we've all reviewed the final plot that's in front of you uh we've all signed off on it and made sure that it's compliant with our ordinances whether it's zoning or Bluff ordinance tree preservation um does it meet Minnesota state statutes as fire code uh and is it compliant with the comprehensive plan so you know again just to talk a little bit about process we've gone through all of these different steps from concept to prelate plot um for staff taking uh a few extra looks at the final plot just to make sure everything's perfect and then now we're uh in front of the uh Planning Commission and then soon to be city council for uh recommendation and approval or denial of this project you know again your role is to review this from uh you know process point of view a zoning point of view as well as from the comprehensive plan and to make a recommendation to city council uh stating whether you uh suggest that they approve or deny the plan for this final plat uh you know again it's being proposed by manly development uh the developer is here tonight if you do have questions um the uh manly development will not be the home builder for the project uh the site will be sold to someone else once the planning process uh has been fully gone through you know once they have all the entitlements to the project it'll be sold uh the Builder as far as I know is not known at this time you did select the build you did okay I'll let you talk about that during your during your presentation but um the engineering for this particular final plat and for also the plary plat was by satech and like I mentioned before uh the original plan was to have 24 Lots at city council this was reduced to 22 lots and so that is why there is a slight difference between what you recall before and what you're seeing now um the trail connection to Broadway is still there it might be in a slightly different location and again we still need to to uh fit it according to the landscape um so that's a little bit to be decided but it will be roughly in the same location uh just to hit it again in terms of the future land use map and our comprehensive plan we're looking at um this site being guided all the way to 2040 uh as a part of the comprehensive plan as low density single family so that's about 3 to five units per um this does exclude areas that are uh burdened by Bluffs or if there's right of way um you know any sort of water bodies whether they're you know a stream a lake uh a river so this three to five units per acre excludes all of that um what we can determine through the comprehensive plan is that this particular site is buildable um that it will be single family housing and that the owner does have some rights to develop that property so that's kind of why we've gone through all the other processes uh through P plat and everything and why we're now here at final plat regarding site access as well streets um the fire chief and fire marshall have reviewed the plans and have determined that there's adequate access for you know the largest truck that they have um engineering is reviewed it in terms of uh the details and how be um you know how there are construction vehicles that will be coming to the site how they will or will not impact um those streets that lead up to this project um there will be the addition of a new culdesac to The Meadows development that will come out of this um out of this proposal um everything has met both fire and Engineering require some codes for Brookview Court which is the uh East West Street that will be at the top of this particular subdivision um it will be a private Street that's owned and maintained by the HOA um this is sort of the benefit of going through the pur process or the planned residential development process is that you can create lots that do not have Frontage onto a public RightWay um and you can have something that's a little bit more private a little bit more um unique for this particular part of the neighborhood um this setup does allow for some additional screening on the north side of Brookview Court which has been I think pretty helpful in terms of getting this project through uh the development review process um and that culdesac at the end does meet the minimum requirements for fire code to be a fire turnaround location uh just to briefly hit on the Bluffs um so there are kind of two different tiers of buffer and setback that we're dealing with for Bluffs um the uh first tier setback is 25t from the top of the bluff and then there is a uh sort of like another Zone uh just after that that's another 25t away from the top of the bluff uh each Zone has a particular set of requirements if you're going to do anything within it uh the Zone that's closest to the top of the bluff the tier one that's the most restrictive um but helps protect things like the trees that are there that are keeping that particular part of the top of the bluff um safe and secure from any erosion um it limits the amount of um uh foliage that you can remove limit it limits it to most uh not you know invasive species um the second tier uh that's a little bit farther away from the top of the bluff allows uh people to utilize it for like lawn um you know if they wanted to take advantage of the fact that it's going to be a beautiful location and that they'll have a little bit of a view at that particular point they would be able to uh you know occupy that space have a lawn uh be able to use it um they just wouldn't be able to remove significant pieces of foliage like mature trees that are at that location um just to kind of reiterate from what was discussed from the prate plat grud does not require a variance from the city's Bluff ordinance so we've reviewed everything it meets our Bluff ordinance and uh all the requirements within it here's sort of a diagram as to kind of what I was talking about so this green line here is the uh top edge of that bluff and then this blue line here is sort of that tier one setback or that tier one um sort of bluff area and then the yellow line is the tier 2 um Bluff area so you can kind of think about it where you know some of this area you know gets somewhat close to these houses so it it sort of makes sense to look at it like you know right immediately outside of this house someone should be able to have a long on and be able to use it um but as soon as they get a lot closer to the top of that bluff uh there are some restrictions just to make sure there is no erosion and this is kind of that typical lot detail you know a little bit more focused in than kind of what I was just showing you but you know showing where it's buildable having a setback line you know all these easement lines and lot lines you know when we're looking at this particular image right here this sort of dash line at the very bottom that's the top of the bluff this is the tier one setback and and the tier two so this is where you'd be able to build um a home within that property that would be outside of all the setbacks and all the easements so we do a lot with uh homeowners as well as developers to help educate people about the bluff ordinance um you know home buyer education we have signage that we put up that says you know this is a conservation ement area that there are limited things that you can do within it um you know for surveys we do require the topography to be put on there so that we can determine at the time of building permit where exactly the top of that bluff is where that first setback would be and then that tier two setback um you know we do hear quite a bit from Neighbors uh that are um either along Bluffs or adjacent two people people that live along Bluffs you know if there is any sort of issue um with you know a property where the bluff ordinance is not being followed we do hear about it and we do follow up with people on it so we are pretty in tune with that um you know we also do inspections we do some utility work uh you know we'll do maintenance on these outlots particularly in the case of the outlaw that has that trail easement as well as the one that will have the storm water retention area to it um there are other projects within um within the city that have uh dealt with the bluff ordinance before and and are currently dealing with Bluffs uh they're all very successful projects um you know just kind of listing here and I just you know I won't go through them but just kind of show that we have done this before and we'll probably end up doing it again uh but we've learned from all these other different examples how we might be able to help people and to and to sort of educate them about you know let's protect Bluffs for Park dedication and Trails um the development is required to provide about $44,000 uh $4,070 per unit and so that will be the park line Dedication that they provide as as stipulated within the development agreement um alongside of that the developer has uh provided a Trail for um uh for public use and so that'll go from Brookview Court to the South and then it'll sort of meander its way uh down to Broadway um a trail will end up having to be sort of Field located uh like I had mentioned before there's just a little bit of topography that we're dealing with and so we're working with the developer to figure out exactly where that trail will be um but just as a note trails are allowed um within the Bluffs um by our city ordinance and that's very typical with a lot of other cities within the Metro as well just kind of pointing out again you know this is the this is where the neighborhood will be all the way up here just sou of Meadows this is showing the uh the rest of the trail Network this will provide another route for people uh you know not just within Brookview but also within Meadows uh to get to the trail network and to to enjoy it um as as people are are currently doing so just expanding that Network and making it a little bit more accessible for people for tree preservation um a lot of uh you know everything that you're seeing here that has this kind of like red hash is going to be impacted by uh this Development coming in however it's it's worth it to note that there a limited amount of trees that are going to be impacted by this particular development so um you know when I'm looking at kind of the calculations here um our our requirements are that you know 40% of the total dbh of decidous trees and height feet of coniferous trees within the Ser area shall be protected so you know what's allowed is 60% and sort of the actual is is 50% um when we're actually looking at the removal though um 6% of the trees that are surveyed on this property are going to be removed so a pretty low number um it's a lot easier to swallow when you're kind of looking at that particular um at that particular number um and not all of these trees are sort of Apples to Apples comparison so ones that are smaller in terms of trunk diameter uh are less impactful when you remove them versus something that's a little bit larger so the larger ones count a bit more and the ones that are you know pretty skinny not as much for landscaping and buffering the developer has done a lot of work in order to make sure that there is adequate buffering between this development and uh The Meadows subdivision so as you can kind of see up here and in this next slide uh there's a lot of work being done in between Brookview court and these homes here um within Meadows and so this will provide a nice little buffer area in between those properties and this Brooky development and then additionally on the east side uh there's quite a bit of buffering over here that will help um buffer these homes from this storm water retention area as well as uh these homes that are along mulbury lanee just to wrap up um the developers agreement although you AR seeing it in front of you tonight um it will be at city council uh we're currently just trying to finish out a few of the of the of the Minor Details um it'll be recorded against the property and it'll include a lot of these things that we've talked about tonight the trail easement the Parkland dedication how exactly um the improvements are going to be made the letter of credit that we will take from the developer in order to make sure that if the developer walks away at any point that the city can actually go in there and use that letter of credit to build all of those improvements and to make sure this development still happens you know whether it's stop dry in the middle or you know they get most of the way there and then they leave so either way the developers agreement provides some protection for the city so so what I'm going to recommend to you tonight is that the Planning Commission move forward or forward the proposal of the Brookview final plat to see the council uh recommending approval with conditions that uh includes that the developer address the remaining comments from staff we just have a few small things that I've noted within the packet and included as part of the attachments um nothing particularly major we just want to be sure that everything is buttoned up uh before Earth starts moving um and again the Brookview final plot will be on the June 6 city council agenda so that's the conclusion of my presentation um happy to take any questions or we can go directly to the developer let me start m in the past we've had problems where home people buying houses for Lots we're not warned about the fluff ordinances and all a sudden they built a house and realized they can't put a deck on the back is there any way we can make sure they're alerted to the bluff issues right I think the probably the first step and and one thing that we're trying to make sure that we get as a part of this plat is a conservation easement and so that'll help protect the Bluffs that'll create an easement on top of um you know this area that we're trying to conserve uh that will impact the bluff if there's anything significant that happens within it and so you know just like the just like the different tiered setbacks you know you won't be able to remove trees but you might be able to have a lawn for you know 25 feet and then after that it needs to stay you know almost as is and that's to help protect the top of the bluff so the easement that comes up when you buy a property that comes up in some of that title work you know we hope that that'll be sort of the first inkling to a new homeowner within this area that hey there is an easement there that helps protect that bluff and so you might not be able to put anything within it okay anybody else have any questions and there wouldn't be a variance so if someone wants to put a deck on they'd have to come for Planning Commission and a request a variance which most likely wouldn't be approved anyway that is correct yeah and and it might not come specifically to the plan commission but it it will come to a public body um I mean the conservation easement is something that the city will hold and so if anyone tries to put something within it you have to have a very good reason or for us to get rid of part of in easement as well as Grant a variance to you know the bluff ordinance so it's kind of a two punch sort of system is that reviewed when they to put a deck on they have to get a permit the city so is that part of the process to maintain proper setbacks and mhm yes yeah so if someone comes in and has a permit for a deck that they want to put on you know we will look at um the plat we will look at uh you know generally when someone builds a new house there's a survey that we get from that and that includes a lot of the topography in there it has to include all the easements otherwise they're not a very good surveyor um and so all of that should be on that on that survey when they go and they submit for new house and we keep all those records here at City Hall so we have a lot of things that we can refer to in order to make sure okay you know at every step of the process whether they're building the house or they're just trying to build a deck we'll be able to make sure that the new structure development uh however you want to look at it will be outside of the bluff does the city you know since it's a private road in effect it's a community um and I'm assuming it's going to have Services you know where people will put pay they have their lawn done an association uh what what role does the city play in reviewing the covenants that are put in by the the Builder or the homeowners if any yeah so that actually gets folded in within the developers agreement um and that's something that the City attorney will review as a part of the developers agreement I do I have that right Brent yeah so under the new process that we're kind of working through with the city attorney to have a developer agreement at the time of final plat approval all of that will be factored in there we're working with um you know Mr Manley over there uh in order to make sure that everything gets buttoned up and that the covenants are reviewed before we sign off on this thank you I have another question can you confirm if Brookview court or Brookview is the only private Street and then mberry is not private mberry is not private mberry will will be a public ride of way uh it will be a public Street um Brookview Court will be a private Street okay and so that will be owned and maintained by the AG anything else let me just make a quick comment I was here in in fact I just been on the council in 1999 we had a large storm and there was a development up on the north side of Highway Fort with storm had six or seven inches of rain th a deep Gully ruptured a 10in water man which then drained our water top in fact I had been out playing golf came home and heard my water meter going backwards as the water was being drained out of my house by the fleet so the Bluffs here and the bluff ordinances are really a serious issue we need to remember that and it happened to be Fourth of July weekend so we went about four days without any water I'm sure Mr Henry remembers that time maybe not as much as I do up on the gloves okay any more questions before we move on does the developer would like would you like to speak good evening commission thanks for your time um there's only one thing I would like to add and that's I think staff's done a very good job of covering virtually everything um the Builder that we selected it's uh Jim Winchell's with wakon homes a smaller custom home builder does a lot of stuff out here so if you guys want to go on his website um you we talked to a lot of builders that kind of find the perfect fit and very very very high quality home and somebody that's going to you know have a diversity of product out there and I think it's something that the community will be very proud of and um we've met with him his banker and um you know I checked on some of the client customers that he's built for in the past and just Stellar reputation so we're we're proud to have him on board but if you have any other questions for me I didn't catch the name of the building uh walon Holmes if things go well out here he said he might change his name to Carver home so where are some of their developments he he's he does mostly in the western suburb so wakon Victoria okay out there so yeah I just encourage you to go on his website and like I said they build some very beautiful homes okay what's the price any idea what they're going to sell for yeah I I think you know I mean those buff I think you'll kind of put a premium on those so my my guess is that you know probably 750 um is going to be the price of the homes out there okay they're going be more of a custom home just because of the I mean those lots are pretty spectacular thank you yeah thanks for your time anybody have any questions Mr Man is it assumed that it will be an entire HOA for that I will I will have to check on so I know there'll be an HOA for I I would assume that it would be there has to be an HOA for the for the street so I'm saying there's about a 90% yes on there but I that answer June 6th yeah I know I know I'll be sorry but this is not a public hearing but does anybody in the audience have a comment they would like to make I have concern why don't you come up and introduce yourself with your where you're from I'm h k Thompson my wife and I own the property at the south end of uh got to get these year here in ag um we at the south end of Mall Murry and uh at the present time the drainage from our land a good part of it goes down mury to the north and uh the uh not too far away from where the low point is at the present time is the high point and there's a great deal of fi dir that goes in there to create that situation and uh it confuses me when I look at the plan and the plan and profile of the streets that uh that private Drive where the cuac is there's quite a de bit of dirt that's being filled at that point and at the spot oh 100 ft uh north of our property line there's a low spot where the existing water goes now what I understand is there's going at the CAC there's going to be some manholes there that will carry the water North to close to the north property line of the subdivision and then East to a a pond and uh when I looked at that it looked to me like there would be a whole lot of dirt that is being hauled into the prop property uh and I don't get that anybody can tell me how much dirt is going there so I did some cross-sections of the uh ex existing grade and proposed grade uh for the two areas the one by the each of the two cxs and there's a lot of dirt that's coming into the and uh I don't really think that makes a whole lot of sense in the area where you're uh were restricted by the bluff protection and to bring a whole lot of dirt into the site from off site uh I think there's going to be seven or 800 yards of dirt I mean not yards truckloads of dering that are going to be hauled into the site and I know that at the Planning Commission meaning there was one person that talked about the traffic coming in and out of the subis I don't really see why that amount of dirt has to be brought in there uh okay anybody want a comment in the city or the developer that's that's that's my concern and so far nobody's told me anything about how much dirt is actually being hold in there um it seems Seems excessive and it does not seem to perform with the uh concerns that are addressed by the bluff protection it's it seems as though Bluff protection to me it means that you're also protecting The Ravines and gullies to the South where the storm Waters would be going to uh and it I just I haven't studied that to see how it does with a two 100 Year rainfall but it seems as all that uh it's a little lacking on storage place for water I don't uh I didn't do enough calculations on it to determine just how that storm Rudder situation is going to be and if The Ravines and gullies are actually protected enough but it doesn't seem like they are and I wonder well okay I you've said your piece now is is anybody in a position to contact to discuss it I can do that Mr chairman so I can't speak specifically to the volume of cut or fill that's on the site that's not something that we can enforce from a code perspective if they're without um outside of the bluff protection limits what they're doing um that's a choice that the development team has to make for themselves whether it's you know you know from an economic perspective or whatever it is that's really not something that we can dictate so if they if they choose that they want to um put in walkouts or Lookouts on the property that's their that's really their prerogative as long as it meets you know storm sewer design requirements as long as the house is you know above the pond high enough and and all that sort of stuff there's from from the city's perspective there's there's nothing that we can do to to say no is really what I'm trying to to say well but we do when we review these plans we do engineer it so that we feel it will not cause a problem definitely So like um to Mr Thompson's point the the storm sewer Basin out there is designed to to carry a 100-year storm event so um you know there's 100e high water levels established which what which is what directly dictates how how high the houses have to be they have to be above that obviously um we look at emergency overflow routes throughout the whole development what will happen in that 100e storm event where's the water going to go so that's something that we look at um very closely that's one of the key um pieces you know of grading design for for the development is where's the water going to go in the in the big storm so okay I don't know if that fully is your question but our engineering people have addressed what they feel are the issues of concern here water drainage do you have any figures on how much f is going to happen there know when we had when we met at Perkins for lunch with you and your two daughters you had said that you thought the site was going to be very long on said at that point in time we weren't sure where it was at remember when I called the engineer from our table at Perkins got a number from him he said it was about he said it was about 18,000 yard that we need to bring in we adjusted the crate a little bit so I think we're down around 14,000 yard F which we a which isn't and and obviously the trucks that come in there they'll over all the speed limits just like the concrete trucks the lumber trucks everybody know there's hundreds of trucks going throughout the Mi development and they they all are very aware that there's you know people out our people do the same they'll oby all the all the laws and stuff so you know 14,000 yards of fill is not really a lot for development I have a development of Farmington right now bringing in 210,000 yard of from so it's a relatively small amount in the development World remember we did have the discussion and I I gave you the name the number of our on tag to the engineering compan so you guys have questions feel free to call them at any point in time and and I've I've told them that you're concern at the end and that you're free to you know get any information from them that you call me again you it's fairly close to well in my world like said sometimes we're dealing with sites that have you know 80 that so that's pretty close okay I'll ask at this point you guys take it offline if you want to have further discussion okay anybody want to make a motion to recommend approval for this PL final PL I'll make a motion for a final plat for Brookview to the city council with the conditions that the developer and the city Staff address the remaining comments on the developers agreement second second okay any further discussion okay all in favor say I I I opped okay moving on to uh any communication from the members well from the city any communication from the city Mr Davis um I don't have a whole lot to report Mr chair uh other than you know in the future we'll probably see Timber Creek Phase 2 come through as a final plat and then um I'm forgetting off the top of my head the other subdivision The Preserve there we go so those will probably be coming uh probably next month is when we anticipate those coming through and those are both final plots I will ask a favor if you can the earlier in the month you know that we're going to have a meeting or not have a meeting let us know since it's the summer months and a lot of us like tonight will be gone for a time so yes you want to cut into your golf games I'm beyond that I've removed too many fingertips and knees to get into that is more I have a question so with all these new developments coming in is there any maps on our City website that talk about what each development's name is and how many houses are planned or started or anything like that as we as we get to the middles um we do try to update the site to include what are the current projects that are coming through um I can't recall the top of my head if we have a map but that sounds like a good idea we can take a look at that we uh Aon Smith has a map with all the subdivision names so we can send that out it doesn't have a real time count on Lots but it'll give you a good start so we'll send that out tomorrow perfect thank you any other Communications can I get a motion to adjourn so moved second second all in favor