the cats were gone cats were gone there was there was a woman yeah so keep in mind whatever you do somebody's not going to be's not going to be happy good point there is a for every all wet and comfortable okay well call the meeting border [Music] sorry as far as the agenda goes we just need to delete or remove item number four because we have no public hearing right because we have no public hearing okay I make a motion to approve the agenda second all in favor I I and opposed um let's see item number three approval of the minutes so we'll go with 3.1 August 30th Planning Commission minutes I'll make a motion to approve the August 30th 2018 Planning Commission meeting minutes can I can second that I will second that you can second that um all in favor I I I um 3.2 September 6 2018 Planning Commission minutes I'll make a motion to approve the September 6 2018 Planning Commission meeting meeting minutes okay and I can I'll second that I had one oh sorry go back up minor thing and I had emailed it because the copy I read said draft so maybe it's been updated since but I was um not at that meeting but I was at the August 30th meeting okay and oh well let's go back and look oh okay yeah so so we want to amend that September 6th yeah so I yes September 6 is correct I was in attendance you were not sorry let me let me go back to the actual date so I can see it it looks correct on here um yes September 6 is correct okay so we need to back up to the 30th yes yep I was not in attendance September 6th but I was in attendance and make comments on Thursday August 30th oh I know those two weeks in a row were kind of right and the comments kind of a blur the comments are included properly yes in the 30th yeah is that how you see it the comments are correct it's the attendance number one call to order okay the attendance it needs to be amended so which one is being amended the 30th the 30th I will make a motion to accept August 30th with the changes to ad's tant I'll second that okay all in favor I I Grand so now we're moving on to new business Aon we do the 30 and do we do the six we did the six that didn't need to be amended right so we're good right then we backtracked because of me yes that's fine you're that's perfectly appropriate okay all right Madam chair members of the commission thank you tonight we are reviewing the Tiff plan for Trident development if you'll remember this is the senior living facility on the current bus garage site it's the 7D units a mix of um assisted living and memory care so tonight we are just reviewing the Tiff plan and the planning commission's role in that is is to ensure that the proposed land use um relates and agrees with the city's comprehensive plan and housing goals so it's pretty easy to get pretty deep in the nitty-gritty financing information which falls to the city council it's the planning commission's just to make a resolution saying yes this meets the comprehensive plan and the goals of the city thinking a little bit about the Tiff timeline it can feel like this is a little blip in the radar it's something that we've actually been working on for quite a while with the development team so the process began formally on August 7th when the city council adopted a resolution calling for a public hearing on August 21st written notice goes to the County Commissioners for Carver County August 31st County and School District received the information tonight September 20th we're at the Planning Commission review for land use and then next Monday October 1st the city council will hold that public hearing that they called for on August 7th um review the Tiff plan and make a proposed motion so this can seem like it's just something that happens for the Planning Commission just once but it is worked collectively by the development team the city council the Planning Commission and staff so thinking about what Tiff means and the housing District which is a little bit different than what we reviewed for the lake view project at the August 30th meeting so the housing Tiff Basics are that the increment can be used to finance a housing project or public improvements directly related to the project this is generally the same the housing word is just added in there and something that's new and unique to the housing compared to the lak view Tiff is that the project must include occupancy in part by low to moderate income individuals so after the presentation by Trident they are anticipating 20% of their site will be low to moderate income which checks this box that it's eligible for Tiff so again the planning commission's role tonight is to evaluate the land end use related to the project not the detailed finances these slides are going to look really familiar because I stole them directly from Brent at his last presentation so thinking about Tiff if you think about the bus garage these numbers are all hypothetical but if you think that the city county and School District all collect $100 right now in tax as it stands but with the new project There's an opportunity to collect $1,000 or $900 in addition for the city county and School District obviously it's a tax increase but with the Tiff plan the city county and School District all go in and say this is an economic development tool this is important for the city we'll continue to collect that same $100 of the current bus site as it sits and then the tax increment captured which is the $2,700 can be used for site improvements so that can be anything specific to the project so we wouldn't be able to take that money and use it for a street that's four blocks down it needs to relate to the project directly so thinking about the increment that's captured this is where the um butt four test comes in it's the really kind of the gut reaction to a project so without the but for the increment if we weren't able to offer that to the project the project likely would not happen so again Tiff is a good Economic Development tool it aids in development costs to bring greater value to to the city the county the school district with tax value so again really high level it's just relating to the land use so thinking about the Trident project doesn't meet our objectives and the city's comprehensive plan I will take any and all questions no I was glad to I did when I was reading through the document I did notice that um there was a portion of the units that would be um for low income and that for the duration of this Tiff District those income limitations have to stay remain in place they can't change over the time and so I had highlighted that going o this is good I didn't realize it was a requirement of a housing Tiff so now it makes sense and I assume it's pretty standard for a 25 year duration so that's the maximum duration of a tiff district for the housing specific so that will be largely up to the council to talk about at their next meeting if they're comfortable with the 25 years but that is the maximum okay I don't have any more questions totally fits the needs of Economic Development we've been wanting this piece of property developed in this way meeting this particular need of our community and so it's the right use so I think it it fits um so yeah so yeah our our goal is to make sure that it conforms to our city plans for development or housing of the city as a whole and absolutely this fills a huge gap well it meets every when we did our guiding principles it fits that and it fits what we updated our comprehensive plan Amendment for the land use that's what I see with it I had I had a couple similar questions about the duration of the Tiff um that I clarified and then also on the financial piece of it on whatever page that is page two it does break it down specifically for low income and medium income and the total of those two are 60% correct yeah so yeah is that a requirement or is that what they added to I mean is that what how they wanted it to be so to be eligible for the Tiff housing District they do need to meet that requirement of the to 60% correct okay I think that's great too yeah it is madam chair and uh Miss Smith city planner I have some questions um and I'm just going to kind of go through um the pages in the packet because I I wrote down some notes and just looking for some clarification and I would like to see things a little more detailed um and what gets presented to the city council um can I ask a a clarifying question first when you present to the city council is it this presentation or it's a much more involved Financial presentation I presume yes it will be a lot more information okay and Springstead will likely be at the meeting too um they're our Financial Consultant and they do a really nice job of walking everyone through it at a level that City staff might understand and the developer might understand but also members of the public so they'll also be at the meeting on the 1 great and some of it too just for my questions has to do with wording and getting some numbers to um go with the terms so when I look at um after the table of context the page one and some of this has to do like when you're using and or or but I feel like the Tiff is really for low and moderate income and I feel like we're really only addressing moderate income not low so there are um income limitations that are set for the seven County region or the area under the Met Council so for a family of four today that's about $45,000 in some change so those limits are set Statewide so it's not something that we are able to necessarily say but Carvers needs to be this number is that helpful or hurtful uh yeah it would be nice to see like what number we need to be just because it looks like to be eligible for a tiff you would need to have moderate and low sure income housing available and then this is kind of a separate question I should have asked first is for this facility what does it take to live there is it a age requirement 55 and over so since it's assisted living and memory care you generally need a physic a physician to say you're eligible to live an assisted living so you couldn't go in and just say I'd like a room so it's generally physician based okay so it's not age it's more physician based on their medical cor condition or history you need to meet an age criteria too as well as I mean it is so does there need to be an age crit my question is does there need to be an age criteria yeah I would say that's a really fantastic question but relating to what we're working on tonight this probably isn't the right place for that discussion okay if I if I remember when he was here and we were discussing it I mean I don't you don't need a doctor to say you need assisted living sure for the memory care certainly but anybody who I mean I had a I had a mother in assisted living and she just couldn't live by herself anymore I mean usually it comes down to the physical needs of the person so and otherwise they have I mean anyway that's get information on those questions yep and have that ready that would be a great discussion likely at like the preliminary plat phase where the developer is here to field some of the questions tonight it's just land use related to Tiff so I appreciate the questions if you have a bunch and would like to send them to me so we could start tying them into preliminary plat review that would be fantastic but tonight is just super high Lev land use okay all right then I'll move on and um the following page on page two when it talks about Senior Living housing units and for them to be what I would think moderate income eligible So 20% of the units are 50% of the county median income and 40% is at 60% of the county medium income is it the medium income for a senior or for a Carver County Citizen and then if we could um equate a dollar amount to that sure I can't give you those numbers right now but yeah that's well received because what I'm foreseen is and maybe I just need more education on this is that someone would look to the county for vouchers to be eligible and receive that subsidy subsidize is that kind same lines this would work and just that you don't always know because it depends year by year who's going to be eligible or how many um residents would beat the criteria and actually get a voucher and then because that's such a year bye thing so then probably my next thought is I would like to see the council look at less than 25 years or just get some history and maybe the Trident developer can give us some data on what they're doing and done in the county because I know there's the chasa facility I know there's quite a few facilities I don't know if there's more within Carver County but I just feel like it's kind of hard to say okay yes for 25 years or these the couny you know median income I have a so are you concerned they're not going to meet eligibility criteria financially is that what your concern is or are you looking the the residents themselves the the residents themselves and I don't know enough about how somebody becomes qualified for that so maybe that um median income percentage needs to be lowered to make it for somebody at um not what I would consider moderate income but somebody that would be more defined as lwi income and then just get more data on at the county level are they likely to have this subsidized or not this is based off of State data isn't it correct yes okay and obviously meting income changes annually it does so I would presume that would be updated as we go through the process too because we're looking at a couple years before we even hit our 25 year Tiff right right and I believe we have at least two plus other residences in Carver County that follow like this type of housing independent living and assisted living and and the builders who did this also did the same building of assisted living under the similar model in chasa okay that's good to know when I clarify that with him last time he was here that's what I remember about it does that help it does okay so yeah I guess just those are kind of my comments as I would like to see more detailed so I guess included a question I think along those lines so is the definition of low income to meet the Tiff District 50% or less of the median income yes that's the definition Statewide correct I'm assuming so that's the definition of low income period right and so we're saying so they're saying at least 20% of the units would have to meet that low income and then another 40 is I don't know if I necessarily agree with um what what a definition of that 60% of median income because it doesn't seem like a lot more of the median income right it's an extra 10% which really isn't a lot probably but there's that extra swath that at least 40% an additional are that or below so I mean feasibly all 60% of the units could depending upon who's there they could all meet the low end of it right because it says no greater than no greater could fall underneath that y That's How IED that really good discussion but our discussion here is strictly land use yep underst understand what else you got yep I I just feel like there's not enough information to to say whether this it's just land use does this project meet our comprehensive so I felt that way originally when I read through it the first time and then I reread through it and then I made a call to clarify like our goal here you know and right go of the land use right how the property is developed the units that's all preliminary plat final plat type of responsible detailed discussion that's not this at all okay this has to do with the tax situation of this piece of property right and this this level that we're getting into right now falls directly to the council and so at our at our meeting that we or the neighborhood meeting was that was concept preliminary what was that con that was concept so we haven't even seen the preliminary plaid for this so we're going to see in much more detail next round yep yeah and more robust conversation yeah and a lot more detail cuz I even went back to those planning commissions when we did the concept and I didn't even see a lot of this Det detail in it about what's the definition of senior what's the definition of in right I didn't see that level of detail and that's why I asked I that was concept so we're going to get a lot more you know I I think people don't move into assisted living other than they need it I mean it's not right I'm going to I'm going to live there because it's I'm going to save five bucks actually it's generally more expensive it is yeah yeah I'm assuming if you had more income you would hire in home health right I would agree with that this is more just about moving forward learning more this is more about does this piece of property fit the use and so when we look at the comprehensive plan and the goals for the city absolutely goals of the city we want Senior Living we want Assisted Living we want this type um absolutely and you know that piece of property I don't think would be developed had not the city purchased it and said hey this is what we really want we want to put here I don't think we'd get this type of project project in our city had we not driven it right and I yeah I would like to commend the city too on working towards grants things about there was a lot of unanswered questions about soil condition oh yeah and um I just think they've done a great job of being resourceful for it yeah so so I think it fits that's good okay want to look through your notes make sure you're good yeah no you're right no no Madam chair I don't have any more questions but I I appreciate the dialogue yeah yeah that's understand this is this is unique I think I mean the Planning Commission doesn't usually see this type of agree okay of ask or Tiff we don't usually see this I hope we'll be seeing more but yeah otherwise I some of those numbers if those could be included for the council that would be my recommendation my input okay anything from you Jim no good all right I make a motion to approve the resolution of the tax of the Planning Commission finding that the tax District or tax increment financing plan for tax increment financing District number 1-10 conformed to the city plans for development or housing of the city as a whole I second that second I said I did sorry any further discussion everybody good yeah okay all in favor I I motion carries okay moving on to number six any kind of communications does a not sound what was that it's a new form of communication oh it's Jim um I don't know if I have any formal announcements just a little bit of a preview of what I think is coming in October and November for upcoming meetings uh in October we'll be reviewing the fee schedule so thinking about the fees that are charged at a city level for plan review I for C we're going to see Trident the Assisted Living project at the October meeting likely for preliminary plat rezoning and final plat Al together it's a pretty small site it's one parcel so we're working with them now on that entire application so pending staff's comfort with their level of the plans I suspect will be acting on all three that night um in November I heard from lenar recently that they are interested in phase three of oak tree so we've previously seen phase one and two this year and plans for phase three are likely forthcoming in October so I suspect they might hit the November Planning Commission meeting that one again uh just north of the fire station South of the school along Jonathan Carver Parkway okay so those are the things that I am tracking right now I suspect we'll a couple more is when was that land annexed into the city or has it been it has been I want to say it was 2016 and the one is it Meridian up on the Meridian Fields yes is that being annexed now or is that that's complete yes okay I will not be able to attend the October meeting okay and November is TBD okay thank you when when is the October is you know the 20th the 21st so I have it as the 18th that is very possible today's the 20th that sound that sounds right I have it as the 18th yeah I'll be out of town for that I don't know about November when's December I know oh good on the 20th okay I'll make that one anything Courtney no you guys continue to get kudos from both Aon and I about the multiple meetings a month and just coming to work and prepared and we appreciate it great good okay a motion to adjourn we have to I'll second that a journ let a Jour all in favor yay yay I hope the r has passed I I have an article on planning coming out I think on the 27 where in the chasa Herold