to do something. Good evening everybody and welcome to the Chesa City Council meeting for Monday, June 30th. Can I have everyone rise for the pledge of allegiance? I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. All right, Elise, can you please call a role? Council member Hatfield here. Council member Bennish here. Council member Shavelin here. Council member here. Mayor Hubard here. All right, moving along. Uh I have adopted the agenda on the agenda. So are there any additions or corrections to the agenda? Otherwise, I'd entertain a motion to adopt. Motion. Second. All right. Motion by council member Hatfield and second by council member Chevlin. All those in favor say I. I. Opposed. All right. Agenda is adopted. Next, we move along to visitor presentation. Is anybody in the audience here for something that's not on the agenda? Um, I'm not really seeing anybody, so we will move right along. and then uh move down to approve previous meeting minutes from the uh June 16th meeting. Um does anybody have any uh additions or corrections to this? Otherwise, I would entertain a motion as well. Motion to adopt the minutes. Okay. A motion by council member Benes. Second. A second by council member Gra. Any discussion? Otherwise, all those in favor say I. I. Opposed. All right, minutes are adopted and then that moves us along to consent items. These items need little to no discussion unless somebody does want to pull it off and have a bigger discussion or has maybe a question on it. Does anybody have a question on a consent item? Otherwise, I would entertain a motion to approve. Motion to approve consent. Okay. Second. Motion by council member Hatfield and second by council member Benes. Any discussion? Otherwise, all those in favor say I. I opposed. All right. Consent items adopted. And then that moves us along to action items. 8A, adopt ordinance 2025-1062, regulating the keeping of chickens. Mayor and council member, this is an item that is coming back from a work session that we had as well as considering it a couple times in the past. I'll turn it over to Elise uh who has uh put together the the provisions for this. Mayor and council member Zmat mentioned this is coming back to you from the April 21st work session. So, we took what we heard during that time um and based upon the previously written ordinance that was not adopted in 2021 and worked off of that. So using that, we worked with our city attorney and made um to incorporate those comments and suggestions. Uh so just kind of key components. I'm not going to run through it all. So if you have questions, certainly let us know. But just generally in the general provisions here it is noted and this came out of the work session as well as some public comments that the this ordinance will not override any covenants from an HOA or common interest community. So, um, those if a HOA or common interest community does have provisions in place that do not allow for chickens, this ordinance will not um override that. Uh, requirements for keeping chickens. This subsection talks about there will be five uh no more than um five nonro crowing hens or roosters. As we come to learn, there are such things as crowing hens. Um, and so we we added that in there, but also it does include roosters as well, which this group talked about. Um, that they must be kept in the proper spaces, a coupe, Orion, exercise yard. The ordinance does talk about what those entail as well as the placement of those and other regulations regarding chicken food and waste. It also prohibits the sale of eggs and chicken as well. Uh the again the chicken runs in coups. There's uh allowed to be one coupe run and exercise yard on the property in the rear yard and must meet certain setbacks. And those setbacks are um the same as our accessory structure setbacks that we have throughout our ordinance screening and size requirements. Uh permits and fees. From what we heard from you during the work session, they must um residents who are seeking to have chickens must apply for a permit. Um it will be a or we are proposing a $100 fee associated with it. It would be a onetime fee, not an annual fee. Um and before a permit is issued, we would review the zoning and other code compliance will be um reviewed as part of that permit application before an actual permit is issued. And then um again, before a permit is issued, inspections will be carried out to verify that that coupe is in the correct location and the way it's been installed. And then finally, violations. If a violation of an ordinance is found, they have up to 10 days to fix that. Um, and failure to correct that will result in replication of the permit. So again, very um highlevel overview of what the ordinance entails. Happy to delve into specific sections if you have it, but um staff is recommending that you approve uh ordinance 2025-1062. If you do approve it, staff will finalize the administrative process for implementation. We have generally talked about what that process would look like. We need to finish those details and a permit application. So, it'd be it'd be a little bit of a time before permits would be ready if the council chooses to move forward. So, with that, I'm happy to answer any questions you might have. Does anybody have any questions for Elise? I assume that there is a delay and in time from passage, potential passage to to allow um associations to take action as well because obviously I suspect that there's no association that currently has it says you can't because why would you say you can't when the city overrides it right now, right? So, I was just curious because you you'd hate to see a situation where the excitement goes and they go out and do it and then the association where they're in says, "Hey, no, you can't." Um, so again, just confirming that there's some timeline of knowledge there uh and that works. Yeah, it does uh council member GR it does take some time to uh before the ordinance will become effective. we do need to publish it and wait so many days. That gives us the time to work on the application and inform the HOAs and whatnot of what will be happening. Yeah. What are the um setback rules for accessory buildings currently and that would apply in this regard? They are 10 feet 10 feet from property lines or buildings property lines. Okay. Yeah. One thing like sides too I believe so. Okay. Yeah. So it's from uh basically sides and backyard uh have to be 10 foot off. Uh when we had first looked at this, we had uh discussed like a 50 foot uh potential one. One of the challenges that we found when we went around and looked at the lots within the community, most would not be able to meet 50 foot. Uh so you know then in in essence you're passing an ordinance that says you can do something but somebody practically can't do it. That makes sense. And then I think this this violations one covers it but we had talked about if someone like has known issues on their property hoarders or people who you know don't care for their property well they would not be given a or you would give them one after they cleaned up whatever or what is that exactly saying? Yeah, Council Member Shablin. Uh that does um that is what that provision discusses is allows us to look at are there any other kind of uh nuisance issues on the property that may exist that we would want to see cleaned up first before this is allowed? And then are there any I I don't know a lot about chickens. Um, are there any issues with contamination to groundwater or you know like creeks and rivers and runoff from chickens? Is there any health? Yeah, none none that I have heard of. There's quite a few suburban communities on even like Minneapolis and St. Paul that allow for for chickens there. One of the things I think is key is in our ordinance, you know, speaks to it is that, you know, these chickens have to be kept in humane conditions. And so that they have to be, you know, if we if we if somebody if a coupe wasn't being maintained and had a lot of feces or things like that, that would be a reason we'd have to be able to go and say, you have to fix this or else you're going to have it revoked. There's also a provision in here where it says no part of a coupe run or exercise yard shall be located within 15 ft of any lake, pond, river, creek, stream, or wetland. So I think to maybe speak to if a chicken is loose or something that we'd have to impound the chickens, maybe talk that's in there about that. Yeah, that uh Mayor Hover, that is included in there that within so many days if we if we do have a chicken, we will um we will come get it and we will work with a group that will then keep that chicken, but you have only a certain number of days to come claim that chicken. It's very similar to other pets that if we impound them that they have a certain number of days for the owner to be able to claim them before They do what they do. Yes. If you ever find a little Yorkie running away, she would she'd got out. She didn't let out. She runs all the time. Does anybody else have any questions for Elise at all? Otherwise, um part of this opportunity is engaging with the public and giving the public an opportunity to um ask any questions or make comments. Um looking at myself on the camera, I see a really wild hair. H it's problem with curls. Um and so if anybody here in the chamber has anything they'd like to say, I'd lend an opportunity for you to come up and approach. and you just have to state your name and address for a public record. And then if there are individuals that are on virtually that would like to um comment. Um you do have an opportunity uh you can um put your comment in the in the chat and our our our moderator um will read that message and and so you would have an opportunity. You can't kind of unmute just with some of our protocols, but you you also have an opportunity. So, taking that away, go ahead and introduce yourself and state your name, record or address for the record. My name is John Bronzinski. I reside at 1160 Symphony Lane, Chaza. Um, thank you for giving me an opportunity to speak. Uh, Mayor Hubard, Councilman Benesh, I believe you're my representative, and other members of the council. Uh uh some of you maybe recognize me because I attended your 21st uh work session and um I've uh been following this issue since the draft of 2020. Um and my you know my concern is over process and what's really in the best interest of of neighbors and uh not creating an issue where one doesn't currently exist. Um, in my past history, I've uh had a lot of experience being in front of the council in terms of getting construction programs and uh designs and constructions approved uh with both the uh planning commission in this city as well as other cities and the council. So, I'm I'm familiar with your processes and I respect those. Um, I uh I took a look at the the draft from 2020 and compared it to the the current 2025 1062 and noted some uh things that had been changed or removed. Some good, some not so good in my opinion. Um, one of the uh, one of the concerns I have is in attending the work session, there was absolutely no conversation among the council members relative to the 50-foot setback. Yet, that was removed from the current 2025 um, 1062 and um, city administrator just explained the logic behind that and in a way that makes my argument. 50 feet is not a long way from a residential structure, but yet many of the lots, the majority of the lots in the city have 10 foot set back on one side, 10 foot on the other side. So literally from this panel to that panel, if you straightened it out, that would be 20 feet, 10 feet on each side. And you can imagine on a hot humid day, opening up your window, whether you're taking good care of the coupe or not, there's going to be some some disturbance and aesthetic impact of having a chicken coupe and a run that close. Imagine people who have a neighboring dog that comes out and barking at the chickens and that kind of thing. So, I've made many of these points before, but I am really disappointed that no consideration beyond the 10-ft setback that's already part of the ordinance for a, you know, for a shed. A shed is not the same as as a a chicken coupe. And I think you'd be hardressed to drive around to farms and find uh farmers who place a chicken coupe under their window 20 feet away. I don't think you'd see that. Um, so my my biggest concern is is this uh situation of setback. Maybe 50 foot is is too aggressive, but certainly 10 ft from the property line when it's 10 ft the other way is is not a good move for a residential community that is so densely populated as Chaza. And we're trying to move houses closer together to make them more dense. uh a lot of the lots aren't even a third of an acre. Um the one positive thing that was added was uh the condition regarding uh the uh um the situation with covenants and and so forth. And I just want to make make sure I understand if if if a person has a home that was built under a building covenant that runs with the land. This may be a question for the city attorney. Uh which takes precedent ordinance allowing chickens or the covenant that doesn't allow for uh chickens. the so members of the council I believe the question posed is whether the whether the ordinance how the ordinance addresses the the inter interaction between uh between private covenants and and the allowance of chickens in the ordinance the ordinance specifically states that the private covenants will override or will govern notwithstanding anything in the ordinance um those will be those private covenants are not affected by this ordinance. Um u Mr. Attorney, if if in the covenant it's there's a clause in a homeowner's covenant that says that in a city ordinance would take precedent over uh the covenant. You've got a two-way situation. How would you see that in that circumstance? Sir, are you asking for yourself or are you asking for the city? It sounds like you're asking me for legal advice. I represent the city of Chaza. If the council wants to ask the same question of me, I'm just not sure where the motivation for this is coming from. I I mean I don't Yeah. I mean I think that the the question that the the question you're asking is I if you have a covenant that says that city ordinances are going to override override um you know you know if you have that and you have our ordinance that says that we're not going to have this ordinance override. I mean, from the from the city's perspective, you know, we'd look at it and say, you know, we're not we're not going to touch something that's interfering with the covenant of on a household. Um, your question might be more if you took it to court, what would happen? You're asking which supersedes? Yeah. And I think at least the question is in that scenario, what would supersede? Yeah, exactly. So in that so even if you have an association and the association says chickens are not allowed. Uh however if the city passes in another section it says any ordinance approved by the city would take precedent over over uh homeowners association rules and regulations. Well I think this ordinance is specifically saying that it's not going to override a a covenant. Okay. And I guess my answer would be is uh in your in your covenants if it says a city ordinance it would override your covenant. We'd say okay. But then our we go back to our ordinance. Our ordinance would say well we're not going to override your covenant. Yeah. Understood. Yeah. So, council, I think in this in this situation, that would be a question for the the homeowner and their association to figure out exactly how those would apply. Um, that essentially would be u a private matter between those the the homeowners association and the homeowner. Um, the city's ordinance would not prohibit the the keeping of chickens in there. The city's ordinance allows the keeping of chickens within the city of Chaza. So the but it it specifically states that it's not going to interfere with the application of those private covenants. Um so whether it it does or doesn't that would be a matter for those uh the association and the homeowners to to figure out themselves and if there was ambiguity they could amend their documents to clarify or they could hold a meeting to to determine what the applicability would be. Well, because it is possible that a private it's possible because I've seen it happen in many different situations and associations I've been a part of. It is possible for a private covenant to be in place that association just doesn't enforce. Um so, you know, people have people will have the right under our ordinance to be able to apply for a license and as long as they meet our requirements, uh you know, we would issue a license to them. But then if a association then came along and said, "Okay, you got the license, but we're not going to allow it." But an association also could decide not to do that. They could decide, you know, we're not going to get involved in that. Uh we're just going to allow them to move forward. Um we just don't as a city have any ability to control that. They don't govern the private. Yeah. Yeah. So what what happens with the association is really going to be dependent on what the association decides to do. So Jonathan Association might go in and say, you know, sort of your point, if if if they haven't had to address this issue before, they probably haven't talked about it. But if we go and we tell them, hey, you know, we've adopted this ordinance, they may then say, you know what, we're going to sit down, we're going to talk about this and we're going to make a decision so that everybody in the Jonathan Association knows. So, you know, so that that's where to your point, the notification of the associations that they have the ability to be able to decide what they want to do. Yeah, that's what I was going to speak to is I think at least someone answered your question in regards to that gap of time between if it passes and and I wouldn't anticipate the city wanting to get in the middle of it. I understand that. However, your language is important in terms of creating uh the opportunity uh should a person in a covenant or homeowners association to make an issue of it if it becomes a nuisance. Um, so anyways, in summary, my biggest concern today after all my involvement is is that I think the setback is is far too limited and uh unreasonable and um and I I think if people in the community really knew what was happening, um we don't have a local paper anymore. Um and it'll be too late by the time they figure it out. Um, there will be concerns and I don't want to see neighbors pitted against neighbor either over something in the community that you totally have the control of approving or not approving that doesn't exist today. And my sense is is that there's there's just overall drive to to be like all the other neighboring communities rather than to be leaders and and do what's right for the city of Chasta. So, uh, the only other comment I have is that there's nothing in here. Should, uh, should you approve this and and people go on a one week's vacation, what to do with that? Clearly, it actually does address it in there, does it? Yeah, it talks about uh, basically it it allows the person who's going to be the caretaker of that to be uh, to be able to be responsible. Yep. Okay. And they would have the same responsibilities when they're gone that they'd have when they're there. Sure. So Sure. And then lastly, I at at the uh work session, the council realized that most of Chaska is in a homeowners association, so it made sense to put that language in. But just as much as saying a 50-foot setback makes it difficult for anybody in Chesca to have it, um, associations can put this language in and make it impossible to. So I I don't think that's a very good argument to take the 50ft setback. It may be that it should be 40 foot or 35, but 10 ft on both sides of the line pretty close. Each of these panels are 2 feet. 10 feet straighten that out. got your window open on a hot humid summer day and uh it's pretty unpleasant. Would actually be 20 feet though because your Yeah, this is 20 ft though. Okay. Isolation if you straighten it out from there to there. Assuming those panels are two feet each, that's your 20 ft. 10 feet on each side from center to end. Thank you. Appreciate your comments. Thank you, John. Uh does anybody on Zoom? Is there Christa? Is there any additional commentary? Okay. Anybody want to speak? Any council members want to speak about this at all? have a comment or I guess my thoughts are the same as they were several years ago when we last looked at this and having lived next to backyard chickens where I didn't smell them or hear them um on a small lot where I open my windows a lot. I guess my lived experience is that it's, you know, not it doesn't end up as being as much of an issue. And I do have a dog that would absolutely bark at them and didn't seem mind. He is a little murderer. He kills squirrels even. So if he It's not that he's a chill dog, he is a hound. So um he's very prey driven. But um yeah, and I I just in speaking to people that live in communities where there's backyard chickens and have them next to it, it it seems to be a chill thing that is not impactful. When I looked for any documentation that it impacts home values, there is none. In fact, it talks about how sometimes it it's a positive thing that people want to live in communities like this. Um, so I guess that's my thoughts is I haven't really changed in the last few years in my stance, I guess. All right. Um, appreciate that. Anybody else want to I think for every person that took time to and I I want to stop and I guess say I appreciate everyone taking the time to reach out to us either a phone call or an email or email the city staff that was passed along. Um I know there's a dedicated Facebook group to backyard chickens. I also know that there's been over the years a lot of commentary on on backyard chickens. So, um, but I feel like for almost, well, I would say for almost every person that is not really in the pro-ch camp, uh, there are there are maybe one to two people that are, and I think especially in the last year, and this isn't a driving factor for me uh, for decision- making because I have other thoughts on this, is that a lot of people look at it and say, egg prices are extremely high. I want to find a sustainable way of having affordable eggs. Personally, this is not an affordable way of having eggs. Um, I just want to put that out there that the, you know, general cost, I mean, I know a lot of people commentary that we're pro chicken, we're not happy about the $100 fee, but our staff time accounts for something. It counts for money. And my biggest driving point of allowing this is to make sure that the the maintenance of the animals are well cared for and that goes towards that. And I also want to make sure that neighbors um are inter interacting with each other well. But I also think that we shouldn't have uh let's say 20% of our city affected by a decision because um you know the other 80% happens to be in an HOA or have a neighborhood covenant that I think we need to allow for the opportunity for those other discussions to be had. If if those HOAs want to take up that and and um have that discussion, then that's something that should be available to them. But with the cost, I was looking at kind of the cost as far as the the chicken goes. Sorry, I'm kind of bouncing around everywhere. Um, it was, you know, on the low end, maybe $300 upwards to over $2,000 to have a coupe built. And then the yearly maintenance was anywhere from $500 to $1,500 depending on the kind of feed and bedding and all that sort of stuff. So, this isn't something that I think, you know, five chickens is going to be, you know, a way to really offset your grocery bill. This is a this is a lifestyle choice. This is, you know, that decision of of having that and knowing that. Um, I did talk to Sheriff Cameron this morning cuz I wanted to kind of see was there, you know, our neighboring communities were was there any sort of issues? Um, and there was none that he anecdotally could could think of with that. Um, and so I think sometimes when there's something that's somewhat unknown, it can be a little bit fearful of this is going to really affect my quality of life. Uh, I in my profession have been around a lot of chicken coups and I will say until you get really right up close to those, you really can't smell them. But that that's just my own personal opinions on it. Um, and I think that, uh, you know, opening up that that avenue for folks that want to do this that that meet the criteria to do it and that the animals are well cared for. I don't really see an issue with that. I've got one and I don't know if Matt this is asking too much of the city, so maybe that is a a reason. you know, but if you have any other kind of pets, you know, you have to take your dog in for rabies shots every year and you have to maintain that that animal is a safe animal to be around and um so while I think maybe 100 might be a little much, but at the same time, why is that not a annual fee to make sure? Because somebody could pay it, put a chicken kebab, and then I will put myself in this category. We've gotten pets and all of a sudden I'm like, I really don't want this pet anymore and it's a hassle and I don't give it what it should. Um, so if somebody got into that with chickens and then a year later their chickens weren't, you know, not being cared for as well or they were smelling bad or whatever else, this is a way the city can make sure that then that owner is held responsible because yeah, I I will say that regardless of the cost or regardless of the revenue that comes in as a city, it's more of a cost. Well, we I I think, you know, regardless of how much revenue we take in, we're taking on a responsibility to say that that if we're putting in place ordinance, we need to enforce it regardless of what revenue we bring in. I personally think, you know, the you know, if we get into, you know, for the for the people for the people who are perfect owners and and we never see issues with them, $100 is plenty. For people who are an issue, $100 isn't nearly nearly enough. Yeah. But I think every year, could we make an inspection required so that you have to pay $100? We can. I I I think the you know the feedback that we've received is that people feel that that's a a really steep price to pay. Um but we absolutely can I mean I mean we could explore a renewal fee, right? Like maybe it's $100 as a you know but then yeah 50 or something. Yeah. I mean, we c we certainly for us toain and I don't actually don't think a million people are going to run out and get chickens, but for those that do, it's a way to ensure that they're, you know, living by the rules and and we're still taking pride in our city. And like I said, it's no different than taking your dog in for annual vaccines. It's expensive, but that's part of what you got into when you got a dog. So, um, just trying to think of how and there was another part in there when we talked about it last time, Elise, where if a neighbor had an issue, they could, you know, potentially say something. Do we still have that clause in there where Well, well, I think if it's they're in violation of it, that that is something that they should report. Well, no, but we what you're talking about is we had something in the ordinance before that said that your neighbors had to sign off on Oh, we talked about it. We talked about it, but but at the time the decision was, boy, that's a real good way to pit neighbors against neighbors is to do that. So, we had taken that part out and really just said if somebody is violating the ordinance that they should report it and that we'll go out, but so in this case, if his neighbor put chickens up and he was constantly smelling, that would mean they're not keeping their chickens. He could call and we would have to go out and say, you know, that's okay. Absolutely. Yep. opportunity to make a couple more comments. Absolutely. Come on forward, John. Um, I appreciate your discussion. However, there wasn't any discussion about the setback. Um, I do believe and I, Council Member Hatfield, I I don't have data to to put in front of you about uh home values, but I do know that as people are walking the perimeter and looking out the windows, if they if they see a chicken coupe 20t away from their window, it may not matter to some, but it it could make a difference on a sale. Clearly, no question about that. And in terms of lifestyle, yeah, if people want the lifestyle of a farm, they could buy two, three acres of land in an area and have as many chickens, cows, horses, whatever they want. but less than a third of an acre lot with residential homes so close together and domestic animals mixed in and all of the other situations um um I think is a real issue and and not getting your neighbors approval. I understand that. But because this kind of flies under the radar, an ordinance like this with uh very little known to the residents, the first time a homeowner might know about the ordinance is when a chicken coupe is being built next door and they call the city and there's nothing we can do about it. It's over. And now you got conflict. And you've probably all seen on the news that goofy basketball hoop story where where there was lawsuits and stuff over a basketball hoop, you know, the kids playing this. This is a different situation altogether. So I I really really encourage you to think again about the setback issue. Appreciate added thoughts. Um I think in I mean I understand the the property value argument. I think Like I I kind of touched on it earlier for for every person that doesn't like the idea of having backyard chickens, there were like two people that do. And so I think sometimes it's just all in the mindset of the person of whether or not it's acceptable or not. I've had, and this dates back to when we first talked about this back in 2020, numerous conversation with backyard chicken owners and their neighbors and said, "Has there been issues?" I didn't have a single neighbor that said it smelled, it was bad. They really enjoyed seeing the chickens and they liked having three eggs. So, that doesn't mean that that speaks for every single scenario or every single person. But that is kind of been my anecdotal evidence at least. So no, I live in a town home. Okay. So that that just would not be something that would be plausible for me. And I think as I sit up here as a decision maker, I can look at my lived experience and say I draw on that. But I also have the mindset of what is best for the community of Chaza. What is the community at whole going to benefit from? And we've had a lot of community members express the desire for this. And I feel that if we have a proper ordinance that addresses the health and well-being of not only the animals but of the setback with you know with the size of the coups and the the cost and maintenance and the make sure that the food is being maintained and make sure that the chickens are being protected you know from outside predators. I think all those rules and regulations kind of abide by making sure that the quality of life, everybody involved is is important. And so when I look at that and I do the due diligence, I don't want neighbors fighting neighbors. That's not something that is ideal for me. But somebody could put in a fence next door and that could upset their neighbor because maybe they want an open backyard. There's a lot of things that somebody can do on their property that the neighbor might feel like I wouldn't landscape my property like that. I wouldn't put that basketball court at the back end of my property, but those are all allowable things. I would put the swimming pool in, you know. So, I think I understand the fear, but I don't think that there are going to be hordes of people running to get a chicken permit either. Yeah, those were kind of my thoughts, too, is that a lot of the people we hear from wanting us to vote against this, it almost is a feeling like the city's going to be overrun with chickens if we allow it to happen. And given the the startup costs and the maintenance costs and the upkeep costs, uh, I don't I don't really see that happening. Um, I'm also not one to tell people how they should live their life or their lifestyle. And if people want to make this lifestyle choice, that's up to them if it's allowed by city law. Um, I do like the idea of amending the ordinance to increase the setbacks. I understand that 50 is probably too much. Um, but would a 20 or 25 foot setback be a considerable, you know, compromise. Um, I also have friends who have backyard chickens, multiple friends who have backyard chickens. And as recently as Saturday, I was at some of their houses and it was hot and it was humid. I didn't smell a thing and I didn't hear a thing. Um, so there is that. And that's my personal experience with them as well. Um, I just I don't I don't see the city being overrun by chickens here. And I even I don't think it as a nuisance of sorts. I feel like chickens can be more looked at as a domesticated animal that you get the benefit of eggs and again the startup costs and upkeep are not worth it if you don't want to buy your eggs at the grocery store. Um you could opt to get them from a farmer locally too or another a neighbor in a neighboring city as well. Um, but I don't see many people in a lot of areas of the city, especially with how many homeowners associations there are. I don't I don't see us having a chicken problem, per se, if this were to pass. I will say um just for the council's so in Eden Prairie, coups are allowed. They have to be 10 feet from the property line, but also 50 feet from any neighboring home. So that 50t overrides the 10-ft setback or this it it's both 10 foot and 50 feet and then Chanhassen is 10 feet and 25 ft from any adjacent residential including neighbor structure. So they've gone with their sorry they've gone with their 10-ft setbacks but they've added that language of in Eden 50t from any residential house in inchan 25. So I don't know if that the the So the getting to a setback issue, the smallest width lot we have is 30 foot. Uh so we have some 30-foot lots that are up in uh the Clover Ridge neighborhood and we probably have some 30 foot lots in downtown although most of them are probably in that 42 to 45 foot uh width. Um, so you know on the 30-foot ones if you if you you know in those cases th I mean those homes are right up to the 10 foot off the the line. So you know if you came in 20 foot then you'd be too close to the the one side. I mean that's that's sort of where we came up with the with with the 10 foot. you can certainly make it, you know, whatever setback we want to, but that just gives you sort of a sense of um, you know, some of the lots in downtown and some of the uh, you know, lots like in Clover Ridge uh, are 30 foot, at least gives you a sense of sort of what you have to work with with But if they're 30 foot, but the the ordinance is saying 10 feet from the setback, but 25 from a dwelling or 50 depending on which city we're talking about. So in length are they longer? Like do they have 60 foot length where you'd still be from the corner? Yeah. The problem would be though is that they're the 30 foot width and the house here. So if they move it 20 foot away from the house here now they're going to be closer than 20 foot to the house over here. But what if they went back like into their backyard? They'd still be the Oh, they would still be Yeah. I mean because the length of the I got because in those lots they have backyard. They well they have detached garages and so a lot of the depth of their of their lot is actually taken up by a garage. Okay. So they they really have just that central part of their lot to be able to work with. But wouldn't it still fit in with the parameters of language that talked about like within 25 ft of a structure because you're talking about the home the home's not going to be right on. So, the homes are the homes can be five foot off uh in that like a Clover Ridge neighborhood. There's they have to be 10 foot on one side and five foot on the other. Okay. And then they're 30 foot wide in total. Okay. Okay. So, but isn't that similar to that tight? Yeah. I mean, that's that's the question. or do you really envision a lot of those homeowners really wanting to partake in this sort of hobby? I would say no. What area of Clover Ridge are we discussing? So, we're talking about the detach single family homes are sort of in the heart of the community. So, if you remember where I used to live, yeah, Mark Twain area, Mark Twain Drive, that's all underneath the John and it's under the Cloverfield Association, too. Uh, so they may not, but I mean, they may I mean, yeah, I only throw it out there not saying that we should. I understand. But just to give some context to, you know, that we do have some smaller lots. Sure. I do think in general if you uh were, you know, that had the 10-ft set back but said there was 20 foot from uh structure, you would get that just because each house is 10 feet from their property. No, he's saying over in Clover Ridge that could be fine. Yeah, I think that I think those would be difficult. I think in any case, um but u let's say it's a you know the downtown lots, let's say they're 42 foot wide and the house is you know 10 foot off of that and it 20 I I would say probably most homes you could get by with the having a 10 foot setback but saying it had to be 20 foot from a home. Okay. Don't you think? I mean there there's going to be some that that is going to there there will be some homes like in a Clover Ridge neighborhood where that'll make it difficult to do that. Yeah. But I mean maybe that language the added might I mean it just it's more competitive. Keep it more in the middle if that's something that they want to do. So So then if that's the case we just amend. Well we don't have to amend anything. We don't because we haven't approved anything. We haven't approved anything. Yeah. Okay. And again, it doesn't have to be 20. It could be 25 or it could be whatever number you want it to be. But so would it have to be tabled until the language is changed? No, we can you guys can just direct approve it and direct us to to make those changes because there's two things I've heard so far you guys talking about. One is a setback. And then the second one is do you think we should have a renewal fee uh to be able to to to go out and basically reinspect those each year? Ensure that they're being kept humanely and Yeah. Yeah, cuz I think if we were going to have a renewal, cuz the way that we were approaching it initially is to say there's a $100 fee. We go out, make sure that they're all set up, okay? And then we would only go back out and inspect if there was a problem. If we did a renewal fee, I think we'd have to say part of that service that they're getting is us going out and doing a reinspection of it, right? And well, I we discussed it earlier today when we talked about this. I think immediately these coups are going to be really nice, but I think, you know, three years down the road, you know, it really is going to depend on that homeowner's ambition towards do this and we want to make sure that, you know, like again, this is a lifestyle choice. You know, you know, want to make sure that that I think that's a, you know, fair assessment. One final comment. Absolutely. But you got to come up to the mic because and only because people outside on like uh YouTube can't hear you. I just want to clarify what Matt's saying earlier. I said if a house has a 10-ft setback on one side and then a 10 foot, that's your 20T. Matt's saying if you have a five foot and a 10-ft setback, that's 15. If you say 20 feet from a structure, it's just adding five feet. It's it's not much. I I think you know 25 to 30 feet similar to Chanhass and Eden Prairie they did that for a reason. It makes sense and for Chesca to go the extreme the other way I I just don't think it's reasonable if if you have a lot that can accommodate it. Great. If you don't, you may want to sell your house. If you want that kind of lifestyle, get a bigger lot. But to but to encroach on someone else's property, I But they're not encroaching on property. Well, maybe I mean it kind of all comes down to like and and again I'm not afraid of chickens. I'm I'm principal centered on what you're doing with the ordinance having been in front of the council many times on landscape issues and so forth and how absolutely strict and tough you are on retaining walls and on other structures and plant materials and screening for lighting. Yeah. And here you're going to stick a chicken coupe within 10 ft of somebody's residence. It makes no sense to me. If the lot's big enough, great. If not, it it shouldn't happen. But that that's my I appreciate I guess my thought is that the setbacks are there to just make sure yeah, it's not butdding up against someone's property. And I the reason why I was, you know, like we can add more feet is if there is a concern of smell. Well, I mean, five feet makes a difference, but I don't I mean, you're going to look out your into your neighbor's yard and if they have a coupe, you're going to see you're going to see the coupe. That's just just what it is. Yeah. I think the distinction and I would want this distinction made because I've been just doing some Google distancing just now downtown um would be I think this is especially important downtown but even in like you know let's say Cage allowed it um distinguishing from the residence because several lots especially downtown a lot of detached garages and things that would cause a lot of issues from the principal residence right like the principal residence that it's clear that would be the only way I would support a setback ad to this is that it's not any building, it's the residents specifically. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I would agree with it. But generally, like when I'm zooming around downtown measuring random distances on people's lots, it seems like 20 would be acceptable. Okay. Well, I mean, if I mean, if if you want to be consistent with neighbor and make Chan has 25. Yeah. You know, they go 10 with a 25. I think 25 gets crazy. I think we could just stay at 20 and it's a nice number. And and I mean Chanassen, we have a historic downtown. Their lots are a little bit different down there than Chanhassen. Yeah. Chanass's lots are they have some smaller lots, but most of them are most of them are 80 foot lots. Yeah. You know, I think about the older part of Chanhassen has more of that Rambler style. Yeah. Down by the post office. Yeah. But yeah, but they're similar to ours. I mean, we have a lot of newer communities that have big lots and then a lot of and I think Eden Prey, too. The older 70s Eden Price is very close together, but then you've got the sprawling bear path with 5,000 square foot lots. I'm sure Bear Path doesn't allow chickens and it would I don't know if Bear Path doesn't they might you never know. Um, and it would be from a neighboring residence. So, somebody could put it on the back of their house, let's say. It wouldn't need to be 20 ft from their house, their own home. I would have no just neighboring propert because then yeah, even some of the tightest lots I know of downtown I think would still be okay with 20 25 not the lot I'm looking at right now but most lots seem like they'd be okay. That's more than currently states now because we say it's structure today on either side of you're not I'd be in support of 20 but no more than that. So that's I could comment now. I've been quiet. Um so I'll comment. Um welcome to the conversation. Welcome to the enter the room. Um, you know, I appreciate the thought in the conversation and appreciate truthfully it's interesting because a popular question I will get asked when people found out I've been on the council for six years. It's like, oh, what's like the most controversial thing you've talked about? It's like, you know, we had COVID, we had lots of stuff going on in the city and it's been chickens, which is what it is. Um, and so, you know, I and I actually I will some of you may not agree with this, but that's fair. Um, even the last time I encouraged that conversation to come back to the council when I was on the council last time because I wasn't educated about chickens, wanted to hear about it. I wasn't on the council the first time it came up. Um, and I am very appreciative of people getting involved. I appreciate you showing up here tonight. um because it's much easier and much harder and and um when you don't really have a sense and you talk to people and you hear different opinions and um and whatnot. So, I will say that I'm don't know what the vote will be, but I'm reading some tea leaves here and I I will tell you that my position has not changed in this. And I largely say that because I recognize in this situation there are a fair amount of community members who are silent or don't know or haven't been involved and I don't want to hold that against them. I have no issue with it being passed. I like the conversation of the setback changes and that shows that collaborative but just you know I again I will keep my opinion as previous um as a kind of a repres representation of that other that voice um because I don't think it's a unanimous in the city I think I think that um I think there are strong opinions I do think you know we do try best to communicate effectively We all know I do think the point is someone's going to build in like what's going on, what's in the backyard. That happens with a lot of things. So, for that reason, I I will I I don't necessarily know where it'll land, but I you know, kind of listening to the conversation, I do think it's important to make sure those people were heard as well. And I know you have. I know all of you've heard that voice, too. I'm not saying that. Um, but again, I I want to make sure people realize that I've been I've learned a lot more than I ever thought about chickens. That's awesome. Uh, I'm very appreciative of people being involved in the emails and the letters and the work sessions and the information because that is what government should be that involvement. Uh, but with government making sure that we're kind of speaking all the voices. That's kind of where I I sit because I I don't think it is a unanimous and I don't know don't know how it'll go. Um but I will make sure that it's not going to be unanimous if it goes that way. Um just because I think I think it is a controversial topic. Weirdly enough, chickens, if it passes, I'll be in support of it. I will not scorn anyone in the community. I think it's like I said, I think we've done a really strong due diligence and people have been involved, but I just want to make sure that all voices are elevated and heard. So that's what I'd like to say about that. All right. Appreciate your thoughts. Yes, this was back in 2021. Oh, early 2021. I remember first in 2015. This is the third time. Strong. Yes. very strong topic and lots of like lots of opinions um lots of assessment to be had over it, you know, and making sure that um if this does happen that it's done well and right and with respect to neighbors and HOAs, covenants, and the chickens themselves. So, uh, any other discussion? Well, to me, I think if if you are going to take action tonight, I do think we need just to make a clear setbacks and where it's going to be and then renewal fees. Uh, making sure that we get clear direction on that. Um, okay. So with that being said, should we talk about the renewal fee piece of so that the renewal is hard because the renewal fee I get and I don't think it would need to be a lot. I guess the expectation would be with the renewal fee would the coupe be reinspected? Yeah, I think we'd really personally I think that we should not be charging unless we're providing a service. And to me, the service we're providing, which is really to the neighbors and to the homeowner, is to go out to reinspect it to make sure that it's still fitting within our ordinance. Um, I think I don't think we should be charging a fee if we're not providing a service. Do you feel that fee should be tiered down from the application? Like would I mean 50 or 25 or somewhere in between be an appropriate price? In my gut, it should be no more than 50. Okay. Yeah. I was thinking if we're sending someone out like that staff time, I feel like it'd need to be more like 50 um to reinspect. So yeah, if I may council, the the appropriate measure of the fee is to offset the co the city's cost and enforcing and and and enforcing the entire ordinance scheme. So I mean it would be Yes. Well, then it should be 500, right? In part for for all of the all of the operations that that that go towards making this licensing scheme work. But in general, a good rule of thumb is is the city's costs for actually going out and making an inspection, processing the application, and there should be no revenue generated from this, but it should be a fee that's to offset the city's costs in in uh regulating. Sure. But you just said we make money off building permits. So, what's the difference? Well, we there uh we use it to pay for our inspectors, but that's what we should be doing with this, paying for the city's time to inspect the Yeah. the it's a you know, we're not going to have the same employees going out and doing that inspection. So, there's a different level of pay that they get. Um I I I personally think I mean I think $100 is is an appropriate initiation. I agree. Um, to me really it could be anywhere between$25 and $50 and I think it would be fine for renewal. Um, because um, you know, we're going to send one person out. They're going to, you know, probably spend about a half hour or whatever it takes to to go out there. I think between $25 and $50 is fine. So, I don't own I don't have a dog. You have to get your dog kind of registered, right? You have to pay a fee for that. What's is that theoretically if I did that for my No, I'm just kidding. No. Well, no, but like is that is that Yeah. So, we for a dog you have two year licenses. Okay. Um, so I can't remember the exact cost, but it I think it's like $18 or something. Yeah. It's super It's super cheap. To me, that's there's a dog park that you get and if your dog goes missing, they bring it back to you because it's licensed and they know our blogs. Yeah, sure. So, I think that's just a different service. Yeah. No, I'm just I'm trying to expecting but I know the same like what is you know I mean yeah if we're sending people back out I don't I think it should be something like 50 to make sure we're you know the rest of the community isn't paying for something that necessary. I think if it's 50 I think it I think that's adequate to cover the costs. Okay. All right. Okay. So, we've talked about the renewal fee. Um, sounds like 50 is maybe a an okay one. Uh, should we talk about the setbacks? What what our thoughts and feelings are in regards to that? Mayor, may I um add one thing before we move away from the renewal fee? What what should the the renewal period be in the license period? because the renewal fee um would have to be once every however long the license period should be reintroduce a license period that is no longer in the that's a good thing you bring up. Thank you. And I just that before it was just an application fee. Yeah, you're right. So we're kind of changing it now, aren't we? And so the these would both be the license time period would be in section 932050C. Um, and the P and the fee would go into 932.050D. Um, I' I've been keeping a running track of where these these modifications need to go if the city adopts or if the council adopts them as we go. So, there's there's a clear place for them, but we don't currently have a license period. And I wonder if that's like a space to be reasonable because I think about like maybe that aligning with some of our other licenses. I even think about like rental inspections. We're only sending the fire and I know it's a very different thing, but we're sending the fire department out every two years to inspect because not a lot happens in a year. I mean, but it doesn't. Yeah. I'm wondering if we maybe consider a two-year and I think that kind of meets a nice middle of we're still coming out and checking. Well, I think that the the idea is as it ages just to make sure that the and that's where I think maybe doing a two-year license could make a lot of sense. Yeah, we have other areas that that's demonstrated in our Well, and it and it I I think to make pe people feel comfortable is that doesn't mean that we aren't going to come back out there, right? I mean, if there's issues, we're going to come back. Even if says there's stuff, we're going to be out there. But I think that two-year then we can not overdo it, but also ensure that things are going well. So would it be easy if it was like you know January to December thing and then No, I would suggest that we like it is two years from when they apply. Well, it could be two years from when they apply or else we could I would again suggest that I think it should be uh summer months. A summer month. Yeah, we could use our you know to to say it's a July 1st to you know July 1 and it's a two-year period. Yeah. I mean because first of all that's first of all that's when people are going to notice the issues the most you because it's going to be the hottest. It's going to be you know and it's going to be when people are outside and they notice well Annie think about like chicks raising into hens. Usually they are chicks in the springtime and they'll be more but also you could like if the coupe was deteriorating or something like that you wouldn't necessarily see it if we had winter with snow. Yeah. Where in the summer you would be able to see that it's not being maintained. Yeah. I I really think it should be a July 1st time frame. All right. Yeah. And I think a two-year could make sense. Yeah. So, do you see any issues with that from a staff perspective? What's that? Doing a two-year is I think No, I think that makes sense. I mean, because it's uh again, it's not precluding us from dealing with problem issues and that coincides with how we deal with other animal licensing. Yeah. So $100 it's two year and then $50 every two years for every two years after that. I think that's fair. Very fair. Okay. All right. Uh Kristoff, did you have anything more you wanted us to kind of discuss in regards to that for No, those were the two items. Uh should we pivot to talk about setbacks? Uh what's amended? What it sounds like is being amended is keep the 10-foot but add language to have it be 20 feet from a principal residence residence of your neighbors, not yours, but your neighbors. But again, that's really not worth adding because it is the same thing. If you're 10 foot on each side, if you're each 10 feet, you'd get 20. It does make sense though in areas where uh where we have five and 10 foot setbacks on either side. Um because we do have some we do have some areas where it's five foot setback on one side and it's 10 foot on the other. And even like downtown because those lots weren't done like uniformly. They're kind of all over. So you can have houses that don't have a setback. There's some that go right up to the property line. If you know we're being we really want to protect from being too close from a house, I think it would make sense to add that language. Sure. Because I don't think if the idea is to keep it away from houses a little bit, then the setbacks alone. So if that's what we're trying to accomplish, that's where I think it makes sense. No, I'm neither here nor there if it actually exists. But if we're going to do it, I think 20 makes sense to ensure that it's for enough way, but we don't also that there's still a good number of our lots that would accommodate that. Okay. Thoughts or feelings from other? I I'm I'm fine with that language personally. Okay. So, those were kind of the two discussion items that were a little different from what the proposed original amend uh ordinance. So, at this point, if there's no other discussion, um I would entertain a motion. So, I'll make a motion with the addition of the 20 foot from principal address setback and the uh addition of the two-year lensure period with a $50 renewal. Did I capture it well enough? Make a motion. Okay. I have a motion from um council member Hatfield. I will second that. So, second from Mayor Hubard. Any other discussion? All right. All those in favor say I. I. I. I. Okay. Opposed? Nay. Motion or uh ordinance passes. Uh okay. When will I think just maybe a good quick housekeeping would be when can residents expect to know more about when so that nobody's like rushing out to buy chickens right now? Yeah. So, I mean I think it's important for us to to go out and and get connections with the associations out there. So, you know, if we and they and it'd be good to give them a little bit of time to have some discussion on it. Um my initial thought is is that it it feels like September 1st is a a time frame that uh you know could give people enough time to have that discussion and um you know be able to get our process in place. Um if if it was just our process to get in place, we could probably do it within the next probably three four weeks. But um but I think giving the association some time to be able to to consider their discuss I think we should if we're going to be genuine towards providing them an opportunity to do that I think we just need to give them enough time to so when are you proposing I was I what I was suggesting is that we just you know set September 1st okay as as a date uh that um that we make it effective and then that's something that we could communicate out to the associations to say, "Hey, we're notifying you that this ordinance was put in place. We understand that a lot of associations have or uh covenants against this or have not even addressed it and uh we're going to be putting it implementing it on September 1st and uh you know uh so it gives you enough time to to have a discussion." Sure. I know. Does that seem like fair? Yeah. I feel I was I was thinking in my head like a lot of them maybe have their annual meetings, you know, in that time frame. So, it's probably Yeah. But maybe maybe the annual meetings are are different dependent on the HOA. Yeah. I'm not sure. And if it's if they really feel it's an issue for the association that they want to address, I mean, I I think they'll I think they'll address it sooner than later. especially if we give them really sort of a couple months to to you know July and August to really sort of go through a little bit of process that at least gives them some chance to have that discussion. All right. Uh I know you're the only one here, John. Thank you for coming out. Thank you. I appreciate the discussion. I I really I want to waiting is I I just want to I want to speak that you know I understand you know there's a difference of opinion and and hopefully you felt heard in through this whole thing and when we you know look when I read through all your emails and I looked at what your suggestions were you know you had a lot of really great valid points and I just I want to make sure that you know that you know that is definitely a part of this process for me to really evaluate that and measure those and weigh those out. So I don't want you to feel like when you walk out of here that your feelings and thoughts and concerns and the opportunities that you know for change you know that you put in there that that wasn't anything that wasn't looked into because it really was. I appreciate everything and I know you're looking out for the greatest good but I do think you mistake on the shoulder. I understand that. So, you don't realize how much, but thank you. Yeah, thank you. So, well, have a good night. All right, moving right along on the agenda. We have another action item 8B, a public hearing for Comcast cable television franchise rem renewal and franchise ordinance. Uh, mayor and council members, this uh item is uh coming back to us tonight. It's Yeah, Kevin gets to give a presentation. I thought you were just in here to hang out. Well, you know, both. Yeah. So, this has to do with our cable franchise fee. This is something that uh franchise ordinance. This is something that we already have in place with cable. Uh but every or periodically we have to renew our agreement uh with uh with the cable franchise. So in our community we have a cable franchise ordinance uh or agreement where we have in the past with Comcast. It's called a different corporate name. Um it's a non-exclusive uh franchise. uh we're not allowed to have exclusive franchises for for cable, but typically uh once a cable company comes into a community, another cable company doesn't. Uh so uh this gives us the ability to make sure that they're meeting certain requirements. So I'm going to turn over to Kevin and he can uh go over and talk a little bit about the history and what this agreement means. Yeah, Matt's already taken all my presentations so no. So, this will be done quick. Oh, yeah. Right. Um, that's why it's 8B tonight. Um, no. Um, actually, this is a long time coming because, uh, I think I've had this on my to-do list since I've started with the city. Um, so it's great to finally get to this point here. Um, it'll be great to get to the next point if we can, but this is a this is a great spot to be in as well. Um, so tonight is is really just for a public hearing uh to take and receive comments from anybody that's uh looking to comment on the proposed franchise renewal. As uh Matt mentioned, uh the the corporate name you mentioned before too was Azac. So this the current franchise we have dates back to 2000. So I think Azac was then became Time Warner which became Comcast. So you can see how long this has been in place. Um I think the the franchise renewal conversations have been on and off since 2013. Um so we've gotten to the point now where we have reached kind of a consensus on where we want to go with the renewal and how we want to kind of look at um the the proposed franchise compared to the existing franchise. So kind of again more on the history side of things currently how we operate we have three PEG channels. So PEG channels are public educational government channels. So those are programmed on Comcast. So anybody in CHASA that has Xfinity cable or Comcast cable gets those three channels. Uh 14 channel 14 is mostly community programming. So, you know, arts consortium events, um any sort of uh sporting events, those kinds of things. So, more of the event side of things, community center, uh based uh programming as well. Channel 15 is more of the governmental side of things. So, that's a lot of our council meetings, commission meetings, uh and then other kind of PSAs as well as as we as we fill in. And then channel 16 is not currently programmed. Uh it hasn't been since before I was here. that was primarily I think the school's channel before but they had since or prior to me coming had left uh or did not need that channel as well. So kind of the the biggest thing we uh kind of negotiated with uh renewal is turning in or exchanging channel 16 which we don't currently use uh to broadcast channels 14 and 15 in HD. So right now our three channels uh are only in SD. Um so the ability to get that in HD u was very important to us. I mean the quality of the broadcast, the ability to see presentations, slides, uh video, names um is very important and as you know most every TV now is in HD. It's would be valuable for us to also be in HD as well. So, that was kind of the the biggest point uh of kind of our negotiations. We did also keep our franchise fees the same as far as uh it's 5% of their gross revenue, which is the same. It's the max that's allowed as well. Um the PEG fees, we did change that from a subscriberbased cost. So, we used to get uh 40 cent or we currently get 40 cents per month per subscriber. uh the new the franchise the new franchise would would uh have that as 1% of Comcast gross annual uh revenue as well. Um so again now you're not relying on subscriber numbers uh which is a good thing for us uh for PEG fees too just in case well probably most of you don't really go into the weeds on this which I wouldn't blame you. Um so PEG fees are all all those are set aside for costs related to our broadcasts. So anything that we would use uh for creating videos um the audio visual in this room um all of the equipment we have in the back to broadcast our meetings out to the Comcast channels. That's what we can use those fees for. And we get those based on the people that have cable and they're paying it on their bill and that that and so that money is coming directly to us. Yep. Okay. Yeah. So both both of these costs are are listed on your bill. Yeah. As a line item on Yeah. Like a fee or whatever. Yep. Okay. So the franchise fee portion really is more so on the management side of right ofway. Uh and then just generally operating as a cable television provider in the city. The PEG fees is more to provide the city as the local franchising authority the ability to uh communicate more and better with with our residents and and utilize that cable uh station as an opportunity to provide programming and information. Have you found like over the last decade or so just with like the pivot of people using different providers for television or whatever has has that has that been adversely affected as far as the amount of funding to provide? Yes. Yeah. Every year every year it goes down. Yep. Yep. Now I I will what's sort of interesting is what I've sort of seen recently in last few years is that I haven't seen it go down. I've actually seen it stay the same. But in essence that's going down because we have more people in the community. So, um, so I I think we've always sort of just anticipated that we're just never ever going to see growth in that in the future just because there are so many different options and now we have fiber, you know, coming into neighborhoods. That's another option that's out there. We actually do not have the ability uh under uh federal law to be able to impose a franchise on a fiber. Yeah. Um but we can on cable which is sort of interesting because I mean fiber is like the new hot fiber is sort of like the new cable and you know they're they're both you know the intent of the federal law was to make sure that this communication infrastructure that's put in place is able to be used by the public to be able to educate the public and communicate to the public. Uh well the same thing can be said about fiber networks but it just it are there TVs that come through fiber networks or is it only internet? So just internet. So it's just internet consider like an overthetop service. I had no idea cuz I have internet too. So well because metronet when they first came into the community had explored actually doing TV over the internet. And one of the big reasons that they decided not to and it wasn't just our community. every community that they went to, they're like, "Well, you'll have to pay a franchise fee." And so then they went to just saying, "Well, we're going to provide just internet service and it doesn't really matter because people sub subscribe to internet based services that they just get using their internet." Yeah. Uh right. And so, and there's actually been a bill introduced the last two years now on the state level to to try to allow franchising authorities to have a franchise on broadband providers. Um, I know obviously last year it didn't pass. I don't think this year it also got through but it's it's something that um local franchising authorities so both cities and some cities combine their kind of they combine with other cities to create commissions um like if you go to kind of like Brooklyn Park Brooklyn Center they have CCX media so it's a group of cities that have joined together to create a um kind of a a station so to speak so is there any competitor to Comcast for TV or is You would have to go to Dish or something like that. Yeah, it's satellite. Yeah, you'd have to Yeah, I'm sure there's a Sure there are some. I don't Well, there's no competitor for for cable. Not here. Not here. You can compare the fees to That's exactly No, cuz like Mediacom is like in different markets. Media is kind of internet. Mediacom's like Chanassen as it just depends on what community you live in. They have all sort of divvied up and some communities and I guess I haven't checked on this in a few years but like Burnsville at one time they still might have two. Some cities do have two. It just depends on you know as as Matt mentioned who wants to come into the city. Yeah. Okay. And then if they do want to provide cable television then they need to kind So everybody's paying the fees. and a and a lot of these uh franchise agreements nowadays are are pretty much everyone's kind of come to terms on the kind of the standard terms. Um and then there like like I said there's just a few other things based on each city that are some negotiating points. There's not as many as there once was uh because everyone's kind of settled into what these are and and how these play out. Um, the other big piece for us, uh, was as we go to kind of remote locations or other buildings within the city, being able to broadcast back live events. Um, especially during COVID, you know, live event broadcasting became very popular. Um, and I don't think that's necessarily gone away. So, you know, whether that's curling events or Chaza Cub games or other things, um, we wanted to make sure we incorporated the ability to take a broadcast from those locations and then put it onto our channels here. So, um, that's mentioned here in our in the staff report as well. So, that's kind of those those were the two big pieces that's under live origination sites. So, uh, we kind of worked with them to, uh, have the ability to have a cable modem at certain locations so that we could, cuz a lot of things now are actually done kind of, you know, over the cloud, so to speak, then we used to have actually hard physical fiber lines run to locations, uh, that we just don't use that way anymore. So, so anyway, those are kind of the highlights. Uh the one uh typo I had on here was the franchise term will actually be 10 years not 15. So that's the only difference. So by my time I should start working on the next one now. Going to take a month off. No. Um anyway so the uh motion in front of you I guess is to open the public hearing uh to receive any public comments. No action as far as on the ordinance would happen today. uh we would come back to you if if uh if assuming we don't get any comments that would change how the uh franchise renewal looks we would come back at the next meeting which I believe is the 17th 21st 21st 21st there you go so any questions any questions for Kevin we're getting there though all All right, I will I This has nothing to do with the franchise, but you had me thinking about when we post videos to YouTube, does YouTube decide themselves whether or not they're going to run ads before or after or whatever? Is that like in But that's within theirs and Yep. That's within their um kind of I guess right as a provider. Okay. because of how our accounts set up is we don't monetize our accounts. Yeah. So, we don't I wondered about that. Not that I've seen any, but I just had me think. No, I mean it also dep I mean a lot of times it depends on how popular your video is. So, once you get to a certain number of views then they start then they start putting ads there. Um so, you know, locally yours and others could see those ads. All right. Yeah. So, striving striving to hit that mark. But, you know, anything we do, Got to get a viral video out there. And anything we do produce for YouTube is is also something that would go on our cable station. Uh, even more long form type programming. Sure. Uh, too. So, there's there's some opportunities out there like Between the Two Ferns sort of, you know. Yes, exactly. You knew what I was talking about. Oh, that's a great show. I love that show. Yeah, it shows up on my TikTok feed all the time. a lot of the greatest greatest hits. We could get a clever name for a podcast and video cast on YouTube between like the two like couple mayors. Yeah. Something. I guess we'll have to put our heads together. Yeah. Maybe that's it. Between two heads. Yeah. All right. Any other questions? Otherwise, I guess I'll step aside just for public hearing purpose. Um, any questions? still be here for questions if you have some after public comment. Okay. It's gonna be a lot of public comment. All right. Well, I need a motion to open a public hearing. Motion to open public hearing. All right. Second. All right. I got a motion from council member Chevlin and then a second from council member Benes. Um, do we need a vote on opening a public hearing? I don't think technically we need actually motion. Well, it says here motion to open a public hearing. I think usually just I think you can just open the public hearing. Oh, that was weird. Sorry. I was taking some liberties on how I wrote that. Sorry. It sounded good. I thought there was something I knew I didn't know. I was like, no, you was just following along and reading the I'm glad I can have that kind of influence. Now we've just made our viral moment. Yes. Right there. All right. Okay. Well, now that that's been had, let's open a public hearing at 8:26. I opened a public hearing at 8:26. And seeing that no one's come forward, I will close that. Should we attack Zoom? Oh, yeah. Okay, Christa. Uh, any Zoom? No one is online. So, okay. Well, I can't I can't talk for 30 more seconds to kind of get it to officially be Yeah, I mean, I could try to talk. Yeah. But I think what what I'll do is I will close this public hearing at 8:27 and that's all we need to do at this point, right? Yeah. Unless you guys Unless you guys have any other comments that you want us to include in Does anybody have any more comments or questions for Kevin or any other motions you want me to ask for? I know I was just reading the bottom. No, I Hey, that's on me. I'm the one that wrote it. So So it's all good. That was fun. All right. Well, then that that feels kind of weak. see it. You'll see it back at the July 21st meeting. Cool. Moving on on the agenda. Uh, bills 9A. Does anybody have a question on a bill? I had a question, but I Googled it, so then I found out what it was. So, okay. No questions. So, I'm not hearing a lot of clamor for questions. So, I'll entertain a motion to um pay the bills. Motion to pay the bills. All right. Second. All right. I've got a motion from Council Member Chevlin and a second from Council Member Gra. Uh would you be so kind to do a roll call, please? Council member Hatfield. Yes. Council member Vanish. Yes. Council member Chevlin. Yes. Council member McGrath. I. Mayor Hubard. Hi. All right. That moves us along to other business. Um Let's start with Council Member Benes. I feel like I never start with you. That's okay. I I don't really have anything, actually. Darn. Okay. Well, moving along. Let's do Council Member Shlinin then. Honestly, don't have anything either. Okay. I'm on a roll. Let's maybe go to Council Member Hatfield then. Sure. I have things. Okay. Um just a few events coming up. Um well, and I guess to comment, um the I saw pictures from the Pride event. I didn't get to make it to this year. Oh yeah, now that they're on Saturdays, that's when Wend weddings happen. When they It's on a Sunday, it was different. But it's weddings on Saturdays. Um but the pictures looked great and looked like great turnout, even though it was disgustingly humid and hot that day. But um great job to the uh human rights commission for putting that on. Um and then just a few things coming up. Uh, Riverview Terrace is celebrating 50 years. So, I just want to congratulate them on that. That's a they're a great partner in our community. They create a great space for people to live. Um, and just they just do a great job. Um, and so July 2nd from 4:00 to 7:00, they are having an event to with food trucks and llamas and bounce houses to celebrate. Um, and they did say it's open to the public. So, um, that is on Wednesday. So congratulations and excited for that event. Um and then some other things coming up. Fire and ice. July 11th and 12th. The month of July here you can really have a lot of fun. So July 11th and 12th is fire and ice. And then River City Days is the last weekend in July. So um Fourth of July fireworks on Friday. Everyone be safe. Those will be going off at Lake Grace Lake Mcnite. Mcnite Lake Mcnite Park. They're going to go off somewhere. Um, and then we always have great fireworks for fire and ice. So, two two nights of those. Two nights of those. So, you can really get your fill of fireworks in. Be respectful to your neighbors. Don't be jerks. Maybe this year we won't see any comments on Facebook about I doubt it, but um other than that, I think Oh, one other thing. Congratulations to um our neighboring communities. Mayor Courtney Johnson um was elected as first vice president for the League of Minnesota Cities, which is great. Um it's nice for the league to have representation from smaller communities, communities in our area. And I know that um while Courtney is the mayor of another community, she is always um a great advocate for her neighbors as well. So, congratulations to Courtney. Absolutely. Welld deserved. Yes. And earned. She's amazing. Huh? Who is she the mayor of? I don't Carver. Good for her. Yeah, that's awesome. Absolutely. Uh is that that's it? Okay. Uh Council Member Grath, sorry, I got hung up there. Uh two things. Uh just a real quick question. I know I I think we maybe all saw an email. I'm not sure if we all get emails or not sometimes. I know there's a conversation about the bike path and particularly the Evergreens that are very proud on that. I and I thought you answered it very well in the email, but I think it's it's a lot of good conversation because it's a very visible roads. I I'm just giving you opportunity to kind of talk about that project, talk about a lot of brown evergreens and people are maybe asking like, hey, that doesn't look the greatest anymore. What's what's the story? Well, that's a new variety of of pine trees. Might be. But uh no, so the bike trail going through uh did recently get completed. In fact, I uh when I was coming back from lunch today, I saw uh somebody like look like they were doing a regional ride, which I thought was pretty cool to see somebody using that. But uh so that was a county project. Uh they were the ones that let that. And as part of that contract, they have landscaping as part of it. Just like our projects, uh we have uh trees that don't survive and we have warranty periods uh that exist for the trees on there. So the county uh is aware of the the trees that have not survived through that process and then just like us they go out they the they don't get charged for them. They're part of the warranty uh process for the contractor. Uh the trees have to last at least a certain amount of certain amount of time. Like our trees through downtown I think are a two-year uh warranty that we have on there. Uh but it can be anywhere from a year to two years a but uh uh but they will be replaced when they go back and do sort of the punch list items there. Second question was just question that came to mind with all the rain. What is where are we at with like river levels and flood levels and uh we should be pretty good. Um, you know, I I drove back from South Dakota yesterday and and so we saw the Minnesota River in a number of places and it's high. Um, but it hasn't gone over its banks in any of the areas and the weather forecast is looking pretty decent uh going out the next uh few days. It's going to remain high, but we do not anticipate that it's going to uh come up and be like last year's unless next week we get some monsoon that comes through. Um, we're not expecting at this point that it's going to reach Athletic Park. And then lastly, I said I had two, but I just thought of a third one. Just a shout out to all the agencies and groups and Facebook posts and uh with the weather events last Saturday. Technically, it was probably Sunday morning, I guess. Um, with the tornadoes in Carver County. Oh, yeah. You threw me off as Saturday. I was like, what happened? Technical was Sunday. It was It was like 12:30. I specifically know cuz I was up before what happened. Yeah. Boy, that um but it just you know anywhere you look you could find kind of what was going on and information and the siren went and um you know it was just it's it's just interesting because I had this conversation with my kids and I one was awake and one I had to wake up to go in the basement. But that was the cushions because they knew there was some bad weather coming like well how do will we hear will we hear the siren and and and it's like it's pretty close it's right there and so you will hear it. But then we talked about, you know, the push notifications that go out on phones now and it's just, you know, people have no weather radios and then you went to Facebook and the ches police and fire and car, you know, everyone was was keeping people updated in hopes everyone is paying attention and keeps people safe because it is rare truthfully for storms of that nature to go through at that time of night. Um, and that's what you always kind of worry about because you do kind of like, well, yeah, it's a sign right there, but what if I've been in deep sleep, right? Um, your kids are sleeping and you choose to ignore it. Yeah. Um all those things, right? So, I just think it was it was just good because again, it's it's easy to be aware in the loop of what's going on when it's in the day or three, you know, that prime 3 to seven period. But, um and thankfully, I think some damage, but I didn't hear any, you know, major injuries or anything like that, which is good because you do worry like those middle of the night storms, which are rare. You can't see them coming. You can't see them coming and everything like that, too. So just a shout out for all those people who are out there keeping us safe and keeping us comm uh in the know when the weather strikes at all times of day. So it is kind of nice. We have you know the National Weather Service located in Chanhassen and last year about this time I took a tour. They were so great. My son gets so anxious over severe weather. So one of the things that I did as mom was like maybe if we learn about it more then it can take some of that anxiety away. And so I reached out to them and they were so gracious to give us a tour, we actually got to go out and watch them launch the weather balloon at six o'clock. And that's actually something that they do worldwide at the same time. So everybody, you know, launches it and it goes away and it does I mean it doesn't come back. It's gone. But you know, I got to learn that process. But part of it was learning also the the radar software that they use and kind of he was showing us, you know, what they do when they they they can see it in the layers. and they can do all that and then they can pull and trigger the warnings and sound the sirens and and all that stuff. So, it's it's really kind of neat, but it's also one of those things where they lean on each other because I think, you know, with the way that their radar is like that's like a cone, you know, where they can't really see over the top of themselves. So, then you have your other National Weather Services that are looking at that to make sure that we're still all safe up down here too, right next to them. So, but there um sorry, one more popped in. No, you're fine. I weather related. Do we have we heard anything from Carver County in regards to localized alarms? You know, city us and what I mean like like when there's a tornado warning in any part of the county, it alarms the entire county and like Henipin now has gone to localized and so like they can section off areas and it's a county decision. Have we heard any talk or discussion about what Carver Countyy's thinking when it comes to localized No, I mean we can ask the the question. I mean they have taken a more general approach in Carver County. I personally think it's a little problematic because I mean they move because you can have something out in Watertown, let's say, and you hear well and this happened what was a week and a half ago. there was sirens that went off and it was stuff that was more up towards the, you know, north of Lake Okone Watertown area. You don't want to get to a point where people don't pay attention to to those things because of that. But I can ask the question in the past it is their decision to do. I think there's only two counties so far in the state that have gone to localiz I forget what the other one is. Um and then it's just you have to reprogram your Noah weather radio and all that type of thing. So, I was just curious because it um you're right. It's right. It is a little bit interesting when it's not really near you perspective. So, okay. Okay. And now I promise you I'm done. That's okay. Um Elise, thanks. All right, Kristoff. Now, Matt, uh you guys should have on your desk here invitations to the Minnesota Municipal Power Agencies. Do you want them back? Yep. you can give them to me and we can get them in. Um or you can take them home and give some thought to whether you're able to attend. But if you are able to attend, uh this is our annual meeting. It's over at Canterbury this year. We try to rotate it amongst the member communities. Um it's a really good opportunity to learn about the agency and what we're doing from the agency's perspective to meet sort of local goals. uh learn about where your electricity is being generated, how we deal with, you know, what our goals are for pricing, what we are doing for renewables, all those different types of things. So, it's it's definitely a worthwhile thing to go to if if you haven't been before. Um but, uh um we'll make sure to notice it uh so that everybody can go and uh yeah, you can either give it to me or send it back in if you want to go and we'll get it in. Okay. Thanks. Awesome. Uh, all right. Um, some of the stuff was mentioned. I did attend the Pride Picnic and it was about as hot as you would imagine it was going to be, but I will say considering how hot it was, it was really well attended. Um I was really surprised at the amount of folks that came out and actually were out for a long duration because I I don't know I was there for almost almost the whole thing. But um and then they had a couple of food vendors and they had some arts and crafts. There were some other um community organizations like uh like public health was out there and I um I know some local congregations were out there. Um, and so it just it was uh it was a nice um community gathering. There was melted ice cream. They called it ice cream soup. Um but yeah, lots of fun to be had out there. I think I'm going to put this on record that next year they should talk about maybe having a pop-up splash bad because I think that that would be good because it's been the second year I think it's been really really hot. Um, and that might be a really fun thing. So, anyways, thank you to our human rights commission and park and Rex and all the other city staff for for making that that happen and having it be such a great event. Last week, we also hosted the was it last week? No, it was the week before, hosted the Met Council. They came on like kind of a traveling road show. we were able to um kind of host a lot of the district's uh representatives on the ME Met Council. So, a lot of people that don't live in our area were able to come down and really see um Chaza and really see, you know, Fireman's Park and see that vision, you know, of a project that, you know, at the time was something that was, you know, kind of scary and kind of controversial of taking a park and then kind of making it something different and kind of the success of that. But um our former mayor, Mr. Windshuttle here spoke to that. And then there were some other panelists like uh Carver uh Mayor uh Courtney Johnson and some business owners in Shak and the Dakota Compost and and myself included. So it was a it was a great quick conversation, but it was really nice to see. And um and that actually led into an invitation to go to the Dakota Prairie Compost site. They had a grand opening last week. So, I went and attended and I got to see that facility and kind of what their their plans are when they get the like food machinery in there and what they're doing right now like with composting like the irration of stuff. Um, and I'll say when you get up close to it, there's definitely smells, but when you're not so far away, it's it's actually not it's not bad. So, it's kind of surprising. Um, but kind of see the technique that normally it takes. I don't know how long it normally takes. I think it was like normally 90 days, but it's only take takes 26 days because they they have these bays and they use air and they do all this stuff to kind of airate it so that it breaks down faster. So, really interesting. Uh and then, uh the police picnic was cancelled due to weather, unfortunately. So, that was kind of a bummer. Um oh, River City Days question. We're obviously we're having a city booth, but are we doing the parade? Are we participating in the parade again? Is that something that Yeah, we we typically council members typically have uh we haven't heard anything as far as like registration or anything like that for the parade. Not for the parade. Okay. Okay. I see it. I see the route being advertised, but I I didn't know and I was like I don't know what our plans are, so I figured I'd ask. Um, and then we have, yes, fire and ice. You know, you talked about the dates, the 11th and 12th. Awesome food, fun, music, fireworks. There's also the dunk tank, which I don't know if anybody else had been emailed to sign up for that. Got it. Unfortunately, so maybe. Yes. See, because you've never done it, it's really cold. Yeah. And it Yeah. So my hardest thing I remember last year was I'm my height and so if I just fell off it that was kind of boring, right? Not for you for them. And I I'm I play the game. So like I like went down. My legs were so sore. I felt like I did like squats the whole time, right? Because like I had to like do Well, then you got to climb the like ladder and get yourself. Oh my gosh, I am sore from sitting on the duct tape. But that's funny. I was I'm hoping I'm hoping that state baseball schedule lines up that I can participate. But that is a state baseball time. Yeah, I know. The kids are merciless, too. My kids are stuff. You participated in it as well. Yeah, I know. I had a bruise on my um tailbone that lasted for for weeks after that from Who doesn't want to dunk a lawyer? But but sadly I was like I felt like oh I should sign up for this again. So I did sign up for it. So if you have grievances with me you can show up from 12:30 to 1:00 and you can throw balls at the Yeah. Matt's like planning it out already. So how many strikes do I get? Yes. I try to go early so because I heard the longer that water is in the more uh suspicious it is. So, um, but that is happening. So, uh, Fourth of July, uh, it's coming up Friday. Be careful, have good fun, be safe, be safe with fireworks, be safe out and about. Um, we have, oh, and just last, uh, just a shout out to our Chesa Cubs, man. They're having a great season so far. Um, topped a lot of lists or in the top 10. So, great job. Been able to partially attend mini games. I've had to like leave early, but um yeah, it's been a great event. So, um and then we have our next meeting for council is on July 21st, but we do have an EDA meeting following this one. So, that's all I have. Unless anybody has anything else, I'd make a entertain a motion to adjurnn. Motion to adjurnn. All right. A motion from council member Chevlin. Second. Second from council member Hatfield. Uh all those in favor say I. I. Meaning a journ. All right. President Hover here. All right. Um uh next is to adopt the agenda. Does anybody have any additions or correction to the agenda? Otherwise, I entertain a motion to adopt it. Motion to adopt agenda. Okay. A motion by council member Hatfield. Second. Or sorry, Commissioner Hatfield and a second from Commissioner Benes. All those in favor say I. I. All right. Agenda is adopted. Moving on along is approval of the previous meeting minutes. These meeting minutes uh are back from February 24th, 2025. Does anybody have any additions or uh corrections for the meeting minutes? I had to think real hard to remember it all, but motion motion to approve meeting minutes. Okay. Motion from council or commissioner Hatfield. Second. and a second from Commissioner Benes. Any other discussion? All right. All those in favor say I. I. Opposed. Minutes are approved. And then that moves us to our discussion items. We have none. So that moves us to other business which is 6A. Uh consent of the Chaska Economic Development Authority to assignment of tax increment financing development agreement for Chesca Place uh parentheses North Meadows permits. All right. Uh, Mr. President and commission members. Uh, so the item in front of you tonight is with uh what started out as being called North Meadows Apartments then became Chesca Place which is just adjacent to our public safety uh facility just to the west of that uh and has 127 uh units that have been around since 2002. uh when that uh when North Meadows was first uh uh constructed, uh there was a TIFF district that was put in place to help make uh units uh a certain number of units within there more affordable. Uh there was a note, it was basically a pay as you go note where uh they got rebated back to them for certain number of years uh to uh take care of uh paying off that note. um that note has been uh fulfilled, but we still have additional years that the TIFF district can remain open that we can actually pull those dollars and be able to use it towards other affordable housing projects within the community. Uh because of that, um if we're keeping it open, they are currently going through the process of selling to another uh entity uh which is a granite hybrid fund uh to LLC. And uh to do that uh we have to actually uh we basically have to approve the execution of an assignment of that development agreement that we had with them. Uh a subordination agreement and an estoppel uh which is basically everything that keeps uh keeps our ability to keep that tiff district running for the the remainder of the time uh and make uh make it uh that that that those conditions run with the next owner uh of the property. Uh so we have done this in the past because originally it was built by clinginguts uh development corporation and then it was sold to uh SB uh Chaza Partners and we did the same t type of action with that back uh in uh 2009 and uh now we're being asked again to do it this year. So, uh, it's pretty simple, uh, sort of belt and suspender sort of, uh, action, but, uh, uh, staff is recommending, uh, authorizing the president and the executive, uh, director to execute these closing documents, uh, for this project. Certainly can answer any questions. All right. Does anybody have any questions for Matt? I mean, it seems pretty cut and dry. Yeah. So, I don't I don't have any questions, but No questions. No. All right. Well, I would entertain a motion here to uh authorize uh us to execute the closing agreements. Motion to execute. Okay. All right. We have a motion from uh Commissioner Benes. Second. A second from Commissioner Shland. Any other discussion? Not hearing any. Uh, all those in favor say I. I. Opposed. All right. Motion carries. And that leads us to Well, was that in like the wrong category? Yes. Okay. I was sending that, but I was like, what? I'm discussion. I feel like uh Ron Burgundy from Baker Man. Like you just put something in front of me and I'm just going to read it tonight like blindly apparently. Um Burgundy. No thought. Yeah. Put a question mark after that. Like am I? Um well, okay. Well, since we're still in new other business, uh does anybody have any other business in in the EDA capacity here? Okay. No, no KFC updates. Nothing. Okay. They might want to come back now with Just kidding. All right. What you did there? Thank you. Okay. Well, if that's the case, then um I entertain a motion to adjurnn. Second. No. Oh, I'll make a motion to adjurnn. Fine. Second. Okay. Okay. So, a motion from Mayor Huard and second from Coun or Commissioner or President Hubard. Second from Commissioner Grath. It's really hard for my mind tonight. All those in favor say I. I. We are adjourned. Thank you everybody.