here. Okay. Welcome everyone. This is the June 16th Park and Recreation Committee meeting. Uh we will start I'll call the meeting order and we'll do a roll call. So we start at this end. Just say your name. Alex, Adam Der, Chris Casey, Larry Schulz, Amanda Cahill, Mary Larson, and Jenna Smith. Okay, thanks. Um, first item on our agenda is approval of the minutes from the last regular meeting which was held on May 19th. The uh minutes were sent out with your packet. Um, is there a motion to approve those minutes? Um I have just one little edit. Okay. Um and it says like question 1D split into two questions to ask for clarify. And I think it just should probably be clarity. Do you see that? I'll get it. Okay. Okay. We want to make a motion that change. So moved. Okay. Motion by Mary. Second. Second. The motion's been made and seconded to approve the minutes of the May 19th uh 2025 meeting with the small edit. Uh all those in favor signify by saying I. I. I. Are there any opposed? Uh motion carried. Uh, next item are petitions, proclamations, suggestions, or complaints from citizens, committee members, or staff. Does anybody have anything this evening they would like to bring up? No. All right. So, I've got some city updates and news. Okay. Um, so, uh, this coming Wednesday, we have, uh, an event at Wasserman Lake Preserve. It's bingo in the park. Um, and so it should be a fun time. It's $5 to participate. We can still take registrations all the way up until the time it starts. Um there's prizes. Um it should be a great time. Uh we also I just want to make sure everybody is aware that the um recreation center is going to be closed this coming Thursday in observance of Junth. So if you show up to the rec center and are surprised that no one's there, that would be why. Um the uh registration is uh being accepted still for some of our summer programs. So we've got Wonders of Wasserman camps that are uh coming up. The first one is on Friday, June uh 27th, and it has a theme of A Bug's Life. Um and so we have a guest from the Watershed District um leading some programming for that one. And then we have another one coming up in August um with the outdoor sportsman theme um that is in partnership with our Carver County um parks and recreation. Uh we've also got our summer engagement events. We've talked about it many times in this group. Um but just for public benefit, we do have those events coming up. um soon with the first one happening next uh Tuesday. And then we've also got um farmers markets um kicking off here shortly. Um and then the parks and recreation department will be out um doing some more engagement on Thursday, July 3rd. Um and this will be in the parking lot over at Omni Anki Brewing Lot. Okay, any questions for Jenna? Will there be some more information coming out for those that volunteered to? Yes, I will be contacting um the committee members directly. Okay, great. Thanks. There is no old business, so we'll move right into the new business, which is review of the non-traditional park spaces, and Jenna's going to kick that off for us. All right. So, um for these park spaces, there are a lot of different ways that people recreate within um parks. It could be playgrounds, it could be fields, it could be courts. Um, but we've also got nontraditional park spaces which tend to fall in the category of like open green space, some more passive parks. Um, and so for the purpose of tonight's conversation, we're going to be taking a look at some parks that fall into the category of defining um this non-traditional park space as um any type of playground that doesn't have a or any type of park that doesn't have a playground, a sports field, or a court of some variety. So like a tennis court or a basketball court. And so it's anything that kind of falls outside of that realm. Um and so um as we go on, I'm going to bring up uh several that I've not or noticed that fall into these categories for us to discuss. I will give you some brief information about them as we move along. Um and then obviously if there's any uh other ones that you would like to be added to this list, there'll be time for that and then we'll talk about um some possibilities of how we can be utilizing these spaces. So, um, the first one is, uh, Alageney Park. Um, and this one, um, you'll see, and I structured this the same on all of the slides where the top one is either a map or, um, an overview of the park. And so, you'll be able to see that this particular park kind of falls within um, this boundary. Um, primarily an Alagany Park um, is a trail and a storm water pond. And so the center portion is that storm water pond. Um and then the trail circumferences it and then has some juts out into the neighborhood. Um and so this is um one of the ones that we can discuss this evening. The next one is Church Lake Park. Um this one you'll see um it has um this is mostly the open area um where the park is. If you go to this location, see the sign, that's where it will be. Um and so this one is a pretty large area of open green space and then this section is more of like the flat open area. Um this particular space is there to protect the wetland area. The next one is Goodman Park. Um this one is um almost 8 acres of natural um land area. Um but tucked within here are some open fields. Um, and so you'll primarily see them here, but it is a very wooded, very tree area. Um, but it is accessible to the public. Um, and so this is another one that we want to um, take a look at. The next one is Notman Woods Park. Um, this one, uh, is primarily a system of trails um, within the park. This picture doesn't really show it very well because it's very well hidden under the canopies of the trees. And so you'll see here that you might see faint outlines of where some of the trails are, but if you look at the image on the lower portion, that's the way it looks primarily throughout the whole system. And so throughout this space, there is um a section of it that does open it up. So there is some open green space in there. Um and then there um is a bench along the trail um tucked in to this area as well. And then um the next one um is um Salters Park. Um this one is um just over three and a half um acres extending through this whole border here. Um and then this area is open green space um that is currently um fairly underutilized. Are there any other particular parks that you want to be included into tonight's conversation that fall into these kind of categories? I just thought maybe we might be able to do something with that gravel pad right out here in Bayfront Park. Bayfront Park. Yeah. Jenna, do you happen to have a map where you could point out where those parks are overall? Yeah, I know where three out of the where three or four of them are. I'm not missing one. Sure. And I'm guessing the new members are uh learning them there. Some of these are hidden pretty well. So also joining us this evening is our city planner. And so he is here to answer questions if we have questions for our sketches. the gazeos kind of surrounding a lot of these like if you book an event at whatever picnic shelters whatever we want to call them are those do we consider those open or kind of usage wise so all the rentable like gazebo picnic shelters um are typically larger ones and large very well utilized parks okay um so the only one that has some sort of something like that it's not rentable would be Kirk Locken but that is also a heavily utilized area so I didn't include it for the sheer fact of it's already being heavily utilized. So, it would fall in the category of non-traditional, but it is already like very popular. So, these are the ones that I identified as being a little bit more on the um not as utilized parks. All right. So, is Kirk Locken at the end of this bike trail? Yes. With the little kind of like wishing well. Yes. Okay. All right. So, Now come. All right. So, Alageney Park is located in this region. So, it is fairly close to the Victoria Recreation Center. Um, and it is tucked kind of back into this area. So, you're able to access it through some of these trails going in. Do we have any notes on like the history on why they kind of originally put them this way? I do not. Yeah. So, it this is 18 um has a big trail along it. So, this little entryway from 18 is like most public like, you know, like I would say like um I I've walked and run through here with the kids many times. So, it is it it is really accessible and it it is really nice and cute and like a surprise. I would agree. Like when we talk about like surprise and delight like it is a nice little um path inside there. Like it is a very small gravel path inside there but it is um like you can find it from a large main trail. All right. So, with this, some of the discussion questions that I have, um, and I'll pop back to the map here in a second, but, uh, discussion questions that I have, um, are what amenities would you like to be incorporated into some of these parks? And, and when I say amenities, I don't mean new playgrounds or things like that. We do want to preserve these natural green spaces, but we just want people to be able to utilize them in um, a more enhanced way. And so, could it mean, you know, benches? Could it mean picnic tables, gardens, maybe bike fix it stations, things like that? Um, scenic swings, like if we do have like a really pretty area that maybe instead of a traditional bench, there's a scenic area that we could put up a swing, could that be an option? Um, so some of those things considering and then um should any additional uses of the space be considered? Um, it could mean like focusing on specific user groups like maybe it's targeted towards bicyclists or maybe it's a dog park or um things like that to where we could utilize it. It's still um not something that we're going to have to invest um you know a capital improvement project onto, but it's something that we could enhance to pull people into the parks. And so as we're looking through these, those are the kinds of questions that I want um you guys to be thinking through to see what other ideas could we generate um in order to utilize these parks a little bit more. All right. So that's alligating. Do we have any comments about that one? Now, there was some discussion a number of years ago and uh there was talk about paving the trail there and the residents of that area didn't want it uh paved. I I don't understand why. I think they just didn't want to have more people going through there. Be my guess. But um I blocked that area and it as Amanda stated, it's a it's pretty neat area with a gravel path through it. It's a be a nice nice place to have a uh I know the senior group has put trails together or whatever and be a nice place to walk through. I like the idea as we go through all these the picnic bench type idea because I think I could see people um hey let's meet at this park and have a picnic or couple families or whatever or even people in the neighborhood to to meet there uh would be good. I know you're going to get the Goodman Park in a in a minute, but that's real close to the Lake Minnotonka Trail and uh that would be an ideal place for um you know a trail head or a stop along the trail or uh I think again picnic tables uh were for people who were biking and want to take a break or benches that sort of thing probably it might even the park may actually come up to the trail. I'm not sure exactly where the border is, but it's when we get to that, I'll pull it up so we can Okay, it's pretty close. Have we received any neighborhood or community in like input as to with respect to these specific underutilized spaces? No. or just generally then with respect to like certain items they'd want to see in in green or under public feedback we've gotten um dog park has been brought up. Um we've gotten more lake shelter areas, places for people to do picnics, things like that. Um but typically a lot of the comments are the bigger developments, but dog parks and picnic picnic areas have been brought up a few times. I'm a big Strava user, so I was looking at kind of the heat maps around these parks today. That was kind of an interesting one. 86 in Victoria, kind of that route. There's really no They're marking like amenities now where you can fix your bike, where you can use the bathroom. This was kind of a popular area. So, either bathrooms or like a the bike fix it could be a one here because the only one I think they have called it right now is the one downtown here from an amenity side. Not sure where you would put it. It would have to probably be closer to the entryway. All right. Any other comments on this one or should we move to the next? All right. So, I will find us. It's raining out. We'll have our water feature. Yeah, our water amenities coming for us. All right, so Church Lake Park. So, we'll let you orientate right quick. So, there's Highway 5, Arburedum, Victoria Drive. Over here, um, is the Church Lake Park. And again, this is fairly open um open space here. The main portion of the park is that protection of the wetland area. So, it's mostly just a spot here to overlook the whole area. So, on our on our park and wreck um map for the city, it said that this has a fishing access. Is that true? Don't what sort of a fishing you might be able to access. There's not a fishing pier here. Um but it's possible that you might be able to fish, you know, on the interactive Mhm. Um interactive map map. It was like in one of those check boxes about fishing. Well, you do have access like direct access to the water. So, it's possible that it was including it for that. Okay. Do we know if this park gets utilized at all? To my knowledge, no. It's a hard one because it's so close to downtown. They have a scavenger hunt to find the park. All right. Any thoughts? Because can can you get around to the main lake? Can you get around that? not from this particular location because this is all marsh land. Okay. Okay. So, a fishing amenity is likely not there. Not to the main lake. No. Okay. And there's Does it is there a trail that goes by there? It looks like there's sidewalk maybe or No, there is sidewalk. Sidewalk. And parking is just street parking. Mhm. Okay. Is there a residence then at 1880? See that little No, that's the that's that's the park. That's the park address. Is there mode a circle? Um just like this section right here. mode just yeah just this tiny that's the only flat section the rest of it's woodland or like a wetland area. Okay. Can you go to your um like street view in the corner there in the right corner? Um see the bottom right bottom right like the street view little arrow looking thing. Yep. Oh. So is that a uh it's a utility? Okay. This whole region is the park. Couple of benches. I mean like to sit and overlook the lake. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe this could be that swing idea where it's Yeah. at the lake. Yeah. Is there any like nature guide that we have of what's in that area? Uh, there isn't. Um, but that could be a possible programming opportunity. Yeah, Chesca has those close to Clover Ridge. Just like um I don't know, a placard that says like what wildlife you might see out over this marsh area. It's unique that it's close to downtown, so you could use that a lot easier. Mhm. Yeah, I love that we're preserving some green space for sure. Awesome. All right, we'll go to Goodman Park next. So, this one is a bunch of green space in this area. And then they do have um that one like open green space here as well. You know, you know, right now you see on Park Drive there at the intersection of Park Drive and Lake Minnotonka Regional Trail, there's a kind of a gravel. It's like a gravel. There's often times several cars parked there. People uh start there. Mhm. Um I would think that at some time if we want to relieve some of the pressure from parking downtown that conceivably you could create some more spots and put some picnic tables in the Goodman Park area there and use that as a um I don't want to say trail head, but a a place for for people to uh to start their journey. Some of them, some people keep going and up the hill to uh there's a dog park up there and there's some parking up there. I think some people the trail uh Carver Park Reserve trail goes through there. So, some people go on that up there as well. Uh if you go up a little higher. Yeah. Right. You see where the trail goes out? There's a parking area. Um, no. The other way up where it says Carver Park off dog leash up there, this trail that right there, there's a parking area there that I've seen. Um, not only people that take their dogs to the dog park, but some people park there too to access the trail. How do you get to that park is my question. Yeah. So, my girls and I went there today and there were people parked along the gravel spot that you mentioned. There was two different separate groups um parked along the gravel spot just, you know, before you would get to the Goodman Park. So, I pulled up and there wasn't like gravel right in front of where the Goodman Park sign was now. like you can see like, oh, there's there's a park back here because of the Victoria um parks um signage that's now been put out. But if you look in this upper left picture, that's like the the access um uh which would be fine on a dry day like this is showing in the upper left like a drought year, but um my girls and I went today and we couldn't physically get by this little area because it was so muddy and um actually standing water. So, like to encourage anyone to kind of venture back there, I think some sort of like path update would be needed cuz I was like, stop. Like, it's going to be mud and water up over your entire shoes, right? Um, so I would say, yeah, if if it's a park that we would want more people kind of exploring, it'd definitely be um some sort of little walkway would be needed. Now, there's another area, too. Um, if you go uh Park Drive and right at the uh be the northwest area of Goodman Park there where it says Coachia Lane that this area right in there on 74th Street, there's little walkway through the trees there. I don't think it's it's not developed. I just think it's probably people from that neighborhood that may walk through there once in a while. But I I saw that too. But it it didn't really look as like public, right? It's it's public area, but it's Yeah, it's not I don't think anything's been done in that park other than mold that uh grassy area since I've lived I live close to here and I I've never seen anybody in there. Um, but it's a pretty big area and I I do think I've I actually talked to some of my neighbors and they kind of say it be kind of a nice nice area for uh access for some people to access that the trails because it's it's very close to not only Lake Minnetonka trail but the Carver Park Reserve all those trails in there too and there's u so might have to create some parking I think if not creating parking, at least some picnic tables in there. And as Amanda states, some gravel or patio blocks or some something so people could access it and know what's in there and not have to bring their waiters. Uh yeah, I think the uh I don't know if the shel any sort of like shelter falls under a non capital project, but I think that would be really great here, especially in the Lake Man or off the LRT. And then same with the biking. I mean, if you had a bike fix it station there. Yeah, shelter would fall under a capital project, but it doesn't mean that we can't um put that in as a future um Yeah, desire for this. seen many people park there as well and I think that and have run down that trail and an additional shelter especially if it would be raining like this today. You'd really be thankful that one exists right there and it's just so easily accessible from that just from the LRT right there that I think that this this park I would assume as as you were saying that there's it's it's hard to even get into it. I think this one has probably the most potential to be a highly utilized park if people were even aware that or easier access to get into there. I think now that the signs are there, maybe there's more um recognition that it's a park um or the new signs especially, they catch more attention. Um but I think that this has a lot of lot of potential to to be used. How big is that green space would you say is like football field size uh for Goodman Park? Um the there's 7.8 88 total acres and that particular green space would probably be an acre of that. An acre. Okay. Just need signage how to use it. Like if you put that as like a bike launch point Mhm. and put that digitally on a map, people would start to park there. That's going to be all time. Yeah. Yeah. Downtown parking for people coming down with their bikes can get kind of crowded on the hardc with a big gravel bike or a mountain bike. That's going to be really tough. Yeah. I just so just since I was just there today uh like I pulled off the side of Park Drive right in front of the the like Goodman Park sign and it's like I couldn't get fully off the road like cuz it it goes down like pretty drastically but um that doesn't mean further down or you know back towards the LRT. It wouldn't have additional opportunity the wooded area. Uh do you know how far back Goodman Park goes? Does it go all the way to how far to the east? Um with that one, let me pop us back to my map here. Um and so the park extends this entire section. Oh. Are there any that's a lot? Which granted, we wouldn't be developing all this. We do want to leave it as green space, but doesn't mean that we couldn't put a path in there. It couldn't mean that we extend this to be a picnic area, things like that. Um, but the green space that we do have there is pretty significant. Are there any trails within the wooded space at all to walk? Um, no. Okay. Not yet. That could be kind of fun. Yeah. I think that's I I still think that's a prime area for access to trails. Um yeah, but it needs to needs to we need to create some parking spots and I don't think it necessar has to be pave but just some place where people can pull off the road and some picnic tables there. I think it would get utilized with the picnic tables, people biking. There's a lot of um a lot of families that I see on the trail on the Lake Minnotonka trail there. Uh, and I could see them stopping there and having a picnic lunch or Absolutely. And we could phase it too where we do something smaller with some picnic tables and and I think the bike fix it station is probably the biggest thing draw attention to that area just being on the LRT and then you know maybe we can somehow figure out if it's being used more often and then we can figure out if it's worthwhile to put something more um sizable there. Absolutely. There is a bike fixing station down here though that's not that far. Yep. True. Okay. All right. Let's move on to Well, chilling outside. All right. So, we've got Notermanman Woods here. So this one again there is beautiful canopy coverage. There are actually lots and lots of trails under here and so um this one is a heavily um trailed area and so um there are pretty well-developed trails back here as well as um there are some benches already here. So this one is a pretty good trail area um but it's still potentially not used quite as as um it could be. So, if you guys have any great ideas for improving trail use in this area, I know there's a couple places in there that where there are benches. I think I can think of at least one. I might walk through there. It's a great little hidden gem. Like I don't I don't have much to say because I don't want to like mess it up honestly, you know, like like um you we cut through there, you know, to get to downtown from our house. And it's just like it's so canopied. It's like you're like a little nervous about like actually like am I going on the right trail in here? because there are so many little trails. Um, yeah, I just Yeah. So, that's why I'm just kind of quiet on it because I'm like, well, I I don't want to put something in there that no one wants. And I I think the running trend from what I've seen with the majority of these parks, minus Goodman, is that most of these parks are tucked away back in more neighborhoods. And I'd say most people looking to go to a park are going to go to the easiest access one. So, like Lions is just right there. everyone can see it. You drive past it. Um, LRT, everybody knows where it is and can walk on that. So, I think that that's likely why some of these are like the most reasons on why and and maybe like like Notreman, this is the way that it it should be. It should just be like kind of a quaint walking trail in the in the back for and it's going to be, you know, most utilized by the folks who live right on this trail. And I think that that's all right. I think I when I've walked there, I've often times seen other people walking as well. I mean, I think it gets utilized for that. I Yeah, I've taken my bike through there a couple times. It's not quite as good for that, but it's it's I mean, it's doable. And it's but it's like, where does the trail go? It's like, do I really want to go up this hill? Where does it go? But it's uh it's a nice walking trail and it seems like you're on can make a really nice loop through there. Yep. All right. Well, let's move on then. So, Salters Park. Um, it looks like there's amenities there. It is not. It is just a green space and it's a hill too if I remember right. Isn't it kind of like a a mound of a hill? There is a slight grade to it. We toured that one year. Yeah. Mhm. Can you go into the street view again in the bottom right? I can, but it'll show you amenities that don't exist. Pretend they're not there. Pretend they're not here because that Well, that's actually Kirk Locken. Lockin. Yeah. So, that's not even the right one. Oh, that's funny. So, let's see if it No, it won't even get us there. Nope. That's Girk Lockin. So, it's actually not far from there if you cross. Oh, that's weird. Yeah, it's just Yeah. So, where Oh, look. Yeah, it looks like the pins at the wrong It's almost impossible to get to this park. I mean, we went and toured it one time and you had to drive. It was like behind you had to go behind some businesses and um and it's just a big hill. Um, yeah. It it it's like what do you do with it? Because it it was a hill again. I suppose you could put a sledding hill. Yeah. That goes right into like a resident or some houses right at the bottom. Private properties. Those are private homes. Oh, so it's like one way downhill. Is the access on the access is here? Yeah. Oh, I see. Okay. I mean, one thing I thought it was like a little dog park, but you'd have to fence it in because right now, I mean, I don't know that this ever gets used cuz it's just it's just tucked in this little neighborhood. There aren't any amenities there. It's a hill and it's not it's not on the way to anything. You have to actually that would have to be the destination. Yeah, it's not it's at one point in time u they were talking and I don't know if it made any sense or not but somebody was talking about you know making it parking but that didn't make much sense and there was some bridge or something over to the trail and um but um I mean it looks like there's a if at the top of the picture that's is what trail is that up there? Looks like that's a trail. Yeah, maybe. And then there's kind of a grass. That's the LRT. It's not far from the LRT, which if it was good parking to launch the LRT, that'd be good. But I don't think there's really It's uh I'm trying to picture it. I think I think if you look at this, I think there was a big drop off to like go down to the trail and it was like wooded. Okay. So, it's not really I don't think there was a path or anything at this point. Okay. And there was something else was Whoa. Is that a Is that a tree coming down? What is that? For those that are online watching, the weather is uh taking a turn. Do we need to like go on a lower level? Next capital project's going to be replacing the roof. Yeah. All right. So, our our delightful city planner said that the noise is coming from hail from what he can see. So, how about we chug along and then if anything changes, then we take shelter. Okay. Okay. Sounds good. All right. Any other comments about Salters Park? Otherwise, um we'll move on to our next agenda item. It doesn't sound like it's a good fit for really adding any. Okay. We'll do some more exploring and see if there's something else that that can come up with that one. I I think if we took a look I mean not sure we need to spend the time now, but when you look at the street view and you get to the actual location where it's at. I've not been there. It there there is a flat space. I It's hard to tell like from a depth standpoint like how long that flat space runs. Um All right. Yeah, that would be a good one if you're out and about to go visit because it's it's go check it out. And it's one thing that with all these private residents right there, it's it's like a little road that kind of goes in there with no parking. So, I recall. Okay. All right. Then we will move to our next agenda item. Can we talk about the Oh, Bayr. That's why I think your swings would be a fabulous addition because there's so much flat space right there or so like like um like I'm picturing Centennial Lakes. If anyone has walked around Centennial Lakes and they have the the the swings like a porch, what did you call them? Like overlook swings. Yeah. Okay. Scenic swing. Yeah, it's they're like metal and wood and they're just like a real fun like when you're in a like area like that. So, I think could be highly utilized down there in front of the bandell. Isn't there a plan to pave that to make it more accessible? Isn't that in Not yet. There's been there's been talks to revision that, but there's no definitive plans for it. Was one time put the finished the paving pavers. That one point in time. There was talk about that. Yeah. it, you know, it's as we we're looking to build Victoria and the parks and wreck, you know, when they that's a kind of a focal area where people that come to Victoria, you know, whether they're stopping at the on the trail or they stop for one of the restaurants or for ice cream or whatever, it's such a or the car show nights and the band band shell and the performances there. And it's that's kind of an eyesore right now. It kind of looks like we didn't finish it. Yeah. So Bayfront is in the capital improvement plan and so that is something that will be um revisited um in the coming years with our capital improvement projects. Yeah, that that's good because I think that's we will come back to the vision for that park again. Yeah. Okay. But I I like the idea of like good place for a swing too because again you're looking out uh over the water. You got uh performances on car show nights or people just riding their bike want to stop. um something to look at or even a cheaper option if we just need an interim thing because Bayfront is going to be in the improvement plan like some picnic tables there because right now it's just the little benches on the edges and then the whole middle space is underutilized and empty. Um, and there's always everyone is always fighting for seats down in that area. Yeah. All right. Okay. Shall we move to our first sketch plot? Yeah. All right. So, um, our first sketch plot that we're reviewing tonight is one for, uh, Bell Maple Farm. And so, this one, um, has, um, 8.3 acres. They're proposing uh 15 single family homes. Um there are no parks that are included in their submitt. Um they do have one sidewalk proposed on one side of the street included. Um and they did look into the feasibility of the trail connection, but unfortunately due to trees that need to be removed. Um the type of land that it is and the fact that it is owned by the arborita makes it not feasible to cut a trail through there. So for this particular location, um, so where you see this square is the very rough drawn out area of where that particular farm is. And so you'll see the closest Victoria Park is the Swiss Mountain Park, but in order to get there, there are no paths directly to it. So you would have to drive around. And so technically, this is where Chanhassen begins. And so Roadhouse Park in Chanhassen is the closest um park to this location. And how far is that? That's about a quarter mile or half a mile. Yep. A little little less than half a mile. It is walkable. There is paths to it. Yeah. All right. So, for this particular one, um the questions that um we should be focusing on are um are we okay with the locations of the nearest parks um and accepting the parkland dedication in lie of any parkland? Um how do we feel about pedestrian access? So, the amount of sidewalks for this type of area and then are there concerns with any trail connections. Are there going to be any is there is that going to be the last development in there? Is that the only space? Uh, the land is owned by the arboritum surrounding it. So, okay. So, probably not. Probably not. So, Fox Hollow Drive, is that an arboritum private drive or is that a This is where I'm going to tag in my friend over here. A residence he he is a lot better at knowing these things than I am. Fox Drive. I drove it. I I mean I I didn't drive Foxh Hall. I went there today to the park to curious. There's a few homes on the This is Brian. He is our city planner. So, he can address some of our questions. Hi, chair parks and committee. Thanks for having me. um related to what is potential for out here for development. So all the properties to the west, so just to the left of that red box on the screen there, uh that is the arboritum area in between the LMRT and the red box. Everything north of that is existing single family homes. Uh Fox Hollow Drive is a private road. There's only three houses serving that private street. Um there is potential that those could redevelop in the future for more houses and there are also some agriculture uh properties just to the south which could also develop as well. So there is potential for growth out there but it's likely not going to happen anytime soon. Thank you. And the dedication fee does that just go into a broader pool? Can you remind us how that works? So park dedication fees when they come in, they go into a park fund and th those dollars can only be used for future developments um for new developments. So it's not for park remodels or anything like that. It's for new developments. And so there are new parks that will be coming up with the expansion of Victoria. There are some existing locations like Brookar Park that exists that currently doesn't have a funding source. And so potential future developments um could benefit from accepting park dedication fees for smaller developments such as this. It's very walkable and bikable to Roundhouse Park. Like there's a there's a really nice, you know, paved concrete sidewalk along Kings Road all the way from Roundhouse Park all the I mean it it deadends, you know, at this tip of Kings Road, but then there's also sidewalk on the inside of that Kings Road neighborhood. So any kids coming into this Bell Maple Farm neighborhood would just have to cross King's Road, which is a very residential little loop, to get onto a sidewalk to bike down to the park. I thought it was Yeah. Like it would be very It's like that would be their neighborhood park really. I agree too. I think for for a park being half mile from it regardless if it's a Chan Park or a Victoria Park that that will become their park. And I think just the the difficulties of getting over to the trail and getting over to Swiss Mountain, they could certainly um access it by driving there, but I think by default they'll end up over at Roundhouse. Seems like one to take the dedication fee. Yeah. Can we go back to the flat? So, they do have one sidewalk going through the development. Yes. Yellow. Yes. Okay. Sketch plots are not my favorite thing to read. And what's the what's the uh orange? I can't read that. Oh, no. That's the the yellow is the existing driveway and the orange is the new driveway proposed to because there's a house at the end of that. Oh, I see. Is there any sidewalk in there on one side of the road? It's just the one side. Just the one side. Mhm. We okay with that? I mean, my street only has sidewalk on one side. So, okay. There's really no main trail that goes through here, the connect. So, um, and you said, Amanda, you said there was a sidewalk right across the street at the end of the development. Yeah, you can drive, you can see it's right in front of these h like these houses in gray right across the road. There's also a sidewalk on their side of the road. Okay. I think that it seems like that park that exists in Chan's probably going to be their park and it's I'd take the I'd recommend that we take the fee or the fee in lie of bee in l do we need to you need a recommendation that's just a a general consensus your consensus for that yes yes yeah all right I was just double checking yeah there's If if if you go back, there's a like a the sidewalk dead ends right here in this top right corner, but then around the loop on the inside, there's also another sidewalk in this neighborhood. So, all right. Any other comments regarding this particular proposal? All right. No. All right. Next, we've got the sketch plat for the um second edition for the shores of Marsh Lake. And so for this one, it is approximately three uh 5.38 acres. Uh six single family homes are um a part of this in total. Five of them are new. One is being um included into this addition. Um there's no parks included in this submitt. Um there is an extension of one sidewalk being proposed and there are no trails submitted with this um particular sketch plot. So for this one, the nearest park locations um the first one um which is very nearby is the shores of um Marsh Lake. Um this one is not a city operated park. It is operated by the HOA. Um, and so it is not an official city park, but um, it is accessible to residents in that area. Um, so it is operated by that HOA, but it is walkable um, very close by. Um, the other city operated parks, um, would be Lakeside Estates Park. Um, this one I would not consider as walkable because there are no, um, walking paths to get to it. Um, and then same goes with uh, Wasman Lake Preserve. They are both very close. Um, but you would likely have to drive for safety reasons. That's not true. There's sidewalk to get there. If you cross over Marsh Lake Road, also down here. So, you can't get to it from Marsh Lake, but if you go over on Lakeside, follow that along over to Woods Drive, you get there via sidewalk. It's about 610 of a mile. All right. So, I stand correct. So, it's partially walkable and it's just unclear as to if these six additional homes are going to be welcomed into the HOA to use this playground. Chair and committee members, thanks for having me back. Um, so this was always anticipated to become part of the development when they went through the development process the first time around. They did what was called a ghost plat. So they planned for these future homes to come in, but they weren't moving forward with them at that time. So now they're coming back. Uh, these were always anticipated to become part of the development and use the park that's out there. Okay. Okay. If we look at County Road 43 uh and this uh second edition butts up to that uh and we think about trails and further development out farther on Church Lake Road there. Uh is there room for a trail in back of that development? That would be a connection sometime along County Road 4. Yeah, right. Isn't that out by Wasserman then? Yeah. So, the area that they're showing in purple there, um they're actually giving giving that area to Carver County because it's a county road. Uh so that when the county road gets upgraded in the future, they'll likely have some sort of trail with it at the Marsh Lake Road and 43 intersection. Okay. Great. I think that's important and it's I mean this is our opportunity too to you know what we don't want to have happen is we don't want to have a trail going out there and then have this stretch with nothing on it. So, um, now's our opportunity if we want the developer to do it or we can wait till the county develops the road. And I think that's, you know, I look at and I look at Marsh Lake Road there and I think that was a missed opportunity a few years ago and I know people on this committee were pushing for that to have a trail and and the decision was made not to at that time. again I think with a thought that at some point in time the county will develop that and they can put the trail in then which um is understandable but I don't know how soon that would happen. Is there any discussion at that at this time? I don't have any insight on that unfortunately. Um I'm guessing the reason that it was not required with shores the first time is we don't want to put something in and then tear it out you know in a few years if the county decides they want to take Marsh Lake Road. So with the on county road 43, are we comfortable as a committee to, you know, wait for that to be developed by the county or do we want to recommend that the developer put something in there or we don't care? I is that I feel like the development of 43 is a long ways off. So to put it to put a little trail out to nothing is right. So as long as we as long as we're comfortable knowing that we aren't going to, you know, that 20 years from now that the people sitting in these chairs are confronted with a trail gap of, you know, a quarter mile on a busy road. um is the only concern I have. But I I guess maybe our recommendation will be maybe let's wait for the county to develop it. But our recommendation to the city council or um would be to make sure that when that happens that not that we want to push for a trail there because that road right now there's a gap on that road. That's a busy road. I've It's a really busy road. There's no shoulder on that road. I've rented my bike out there and I've My wife and I were trying to drive through a ditch so we weren't on that road for trying to get to another area. It is not safe and you definitely would not take little kids on that or you shouldn't or it would be very dangerous anyway. So, and that these folks have access. They don't have access necessarily to a city park right there, but they do have their own HOA area, and that's a pretty big area. It's actually I've driven out there. It is. It's a pretty nice area. So, um, is there any entry to Marsh Lake there, or is it way too tiny? I know we've tried to find like new entry for water points. Looks pretty tight, but not anywhere near. And it's kind of like marsh is a good name for that. Okay. Because that's pretty much it's environmental lake probably at the best. Yeah. No way. Not a So then do these dedicated parkland fees though then go to them like adding amenities at this neighborhood HOA playground? It would go to future park development for Yeah. Okay. Cuz it is a nice it is very nice little green space. The the playground equipment out there is similar to um a rainbow playset in someone's backyard. Like so that's what um that little blue dot is. So that's why I ask about like if this funds would go to them putting anything additional into their little HOA playground. No, the park park dedication funds would go to city's future developments and so the HOA uh would operate that one. So any development would be on them for that one unless they turned the parkland over to the city. Okay. So, Wasserman Lake Preserve was, if I recall, is farther out on 43 like a quarter like third of a mile as you have there. 4 miles, but you can get there from the neighborhoods. If you cross over Marsh Lake, you can take the sidewalks all the way over. I walk that area all the time. Yeah, there's there's fast fact. It's very easy to get. Okay. All right. Just got to cross Marsh. Okay. So the question is, are we comfortable with not having any city park facilities real close there? Is there a crosswalk there at Marsh Lake or sign or anything? Is that an option? Um, make the recommendation because I mean if that's going to happen, but I can make the recommendation. Yeah, cuz if if like I'm looking and to Mary's point, if if if this little neighborhood is just having to cross over Marsh Lake and then they get access to Lakeside Drive and can go to Lakeside Estates Park and then go through the back trails to Waserman. Um if there was any sort of signage or road marking for like a pedestrian crossing there. That's a county road though, right? Yeah, it is. Oh, it makes it a little more difficult. Oh, yeah, it does. You know, the the the nice area that they do have there, maybe, you know, maybe they need to do their own thing. You know, you hate to hate to put that on a HOA, but I mean, if enough people in the HOA want something, they can fund it. We can take the dollars. uh dollars for other park projects. Other thoughts? I presume when they had the development of the initial phase one of the Marshall Lake development, that was their choice to build that in as opposed to like build in the HOA owned and run park as opposed to making that space available for the city like other developments. That's a good question. I would assume they wanted it instead of giving it to the city for some reason. Yeah, it's always an option to give the parkland over to the city when making these developments. And so, um, some developments make the decision that they want to operate it themselves. I think that's just another consideration, right, as we start thinking about some of the other ones coming down that have taken an opposite approach. So, okay. We I don't hear a lot for developing any park here or probably take the money and use it for something else. Yep. Any consensus on that? Yes. Okay. Thanks. Actually, there was no additional money because that was already included in the original, wasn't it? Didn't I read that in the in the minute or the agenda? That is a good question. And no, there are fees still with these. So, what they did with that ghost plat is that they showed this was going to happen eventually, but they didn't go through all the development process steps. So, that's why you guys are seeing it now. Our plan commission is going to see it again. Our city council is going to see it. And when the city council approves it is when those fees come into place. Thank you. Is there a sidewalk that they've got in the new one? In the new one, there is an extension of the sidewalk. Okay. All right. Anything else on that? If not, any other business that anyone would like to discuss? I was wondering if we could get an update on the ice compressor at the Victoria Rec Center. I saw that on the city council um minutes and I thought it'd be good to get the um this committee updated to what's happening at the rec center with regards to the ice. Yes. So um the city council did approve of the Eastrink ice compressor being replaced and so uh the ice uh on that east has been removed and so right now it is operating um still being utilized by some camps and things like that as a concrete indoor space. Um but that is um the situation that we're in until they get it replaced. And so they are starting to do the initial phasing of that particular project. And so um they are getting the specs and starting to remove some of the old equipment from that area. They will be doing a concrete pad um on the exterior because the new compressors sit outside the buildings versus inside. Um and so they're getting ready to um create that. it'll be just on the outside in a space that was otherwise also unutilized. Um and so that we'll get ready to go outside. Um it is anticipated that this project will take um the summer and so we are still thinking that um the project will be done in time for regular hockey um to start um in the school year. Uh and so the Eastern Compressor will be replaced over the summer. um we'll still be able to utilize the space as an indoor location for some um programs and things like that. In the meantime, the walking track is still open and accessible. Um and we should get that new um compressor installed and replaced just in time. Thank you. We've had a lot of complaints about the ice quality um through some of our surveys and such. So having this new compressor will go a long ways to mitigating some of the complaints about the quality of ice at our ice rink. So I thought it was important that this committee know that that was in getting done this summer. Yeah, that's fabulous. Anything else relative to the cause? If not, a motion would be in order to adjurnn. So moved. Second. Second. All those in favor signify by saying I. I. I. Meetings adjourn.