What's up? Should we wait a couple minutes? Brian It's coming. >> I think it was just like in the corner. They're like, "Hey, back. >> I want a backpack. Sure. I want a backpack, too." >> So, are they just Are they at the desk? All right, we are live rolling in a little bit late here. Um, I'm going to call to order the August 12, 2025 Lakeville area school board meeting. Um, yeah, if everyone will join me, stand and join me for the pledge of >> allegiance. Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> All right. Uh, if we can do roll call starting on my right, >> Amber Cameron, >> Brett Nicholson, >> Paul Carbone, >> I am Matt Swanson, >> Michael Bowman, >> Kim Baker, Carly Anderson, >> I am Brian Thompson. >> All right, board. Are there any modifications or amendments to the agenda? If there are none, I'd entertain a motion to >> Sorry. >> Oh, sorry. >> Um, I might ask for one item to be added. Um I'm not sure because I mean there's no other place for us to discuss it and because we don't have working sessions I I would just like to bring it to the board. Um it would be related to uh board operations. >> Sure. I'll second it. >> Thank you. >> All right. Any discussion? >> Is this something about something cool or what's this? >> Yeah. I mean what do you mean by board operations? >> Yeah. just just our meeting schedule. >> Okay. >> Meeting schedule. >> Okay. >> All right. If there's no further discussion, all in favor of adding um board operations to uh I guess it' be board. Yeah. Under 6E. >> Sure. >> All in favor say I. >> I. Any opposed? >> All right. It is added. >> I thank you for that. We have no surprises at the table, but I did not have time to email the chair. So, thank you. I appreciate that. >> Uh, any other amendments, additions, or revisions to the agenda? >> If there are none, I would entertain a motion to to approve the agenda as amended or with that 6E amendment. >> Yeah, I'll put a motion forward to approve. >> All right, there being a first. Is there a second? >> Second. >> All right. First by Director Carbone, second by Director Nicholson. All in favor of approving the agenda as amended, say I. >> I. Any opposed? All right, it's approved. I will hand it off to you, Superintendent Bowman. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. Uh, good news. Got a couple things I want to address. So, first of all, I want to say thank you to all of our staff who work very diligently over the summer to ensure that district operations continue. Our school environments are safe and clean. New students are enrolled and staff and students have the devices, supplies, and information that they need to start the school year off correctly and ready. Lakeville area schools leadership and staff are hard at work behind the scenes preparing for our teachers. Today, we were excited to welcome over a 100 new teachers to our district as they begin their new higher orientation. Over the next several days, these educators will learn about our district's mission, values, instructional practices, and resources to help them thrive in their new roles. And I'll just uh add a little point there. I got an opportunity to talk to both uh our elementary group and our secondary group. Uh Chair Swanson was with us as well. And um I don't know, I'd characterize it as very positive and upbeat. >> Yeah, definitely. That was a good event. >> Yeah. I also want to extend my congratulations to the 53 newly tenured teachers in Lakeville area schools. This is a significant professional milestone and an affirmation of our teachers dedication, skill, and commitment to our students and community. Again, congratulations to those teachers tenured. If you want to read more about the amazing things happening in our district, please go to isd194.orgnews. And that concludes my good news, Mr. Chair. >> All right. Thank you, Superintendent Bowman. Uh, no one has signed up for public comment, so I don't know if that >> Yeah, correct. No one wants to chat with us, so we will move on from that and consider approval of the consent agenda. any items that um any board member members want to remove from the consent agenda? If there are none, I'd entertain a motion to approve the consent agenda. >> All right. There's a motion by Director Cameron. Is there a second? >> Second. >> Seconded by Director Nicholson. All in favor of approval of the consent agenda say I. I. >> Any opposed? It is approved. Uh jumping down to reports. Uh Mr. reporter, we'll call on you for the sports and activities festival update. >> Steve, I think I clearly you oranged us on the way in. Thank you for that. >> You're welcome. Actually, I was going to wear my very bright orange sports festival shirt, but over the past five and a half years, somehow mysteriously shrunk. So, uh, so I'll save you all that. But what we do have here, and let me start start over a little bit again, Mr. Chair, members of the board, Superintendent Bowman, members of the senior staff, thank you for having me here this evening. My name is Steve Porter. I'm the director of community education, but I'm actually here speaking on behalf of a district-wide uh effort called the activities and sports festival. So, again, thank you for having me here this evening. Uh we're going to be talking about the activities and sports festival, but what it was, what we're looking out for the future as well. Uh what I did pass out is a nice little reusable bag that we had used at past activities and sports festivals to help uh families kind of gather items, memorabilia or anything that specifically was handed out. So these aren't new. These are repurposed. So and orange, very orange. So again, it's been five and a half years since we actually had the activities and sports festival. Some of you may re may have been there, may remember it. Some of you is like, I don't know what you're talking about. And that's why we labeled this presentation reintroducing the activities and sports festival. So, let's start off by going back a little bit about what exactly is it. So, a brief history is that uh mid2010s we were hearing a variety of needs in the community and the district. Number one, a lot of our community groups were saying, "We're having a hard time connecting with the families in the district." Um, a lot of the methods they were using weren't necessarily as effective. Um, a lot of our district events were really, um, changing a little bit of the focus so that they were really focusing on the K12 school day and weren't able to partner with the community organizations the way that we would like, but for good reason. and they were really focusing on what was happening during the school day. Also, for safety and security reasons, some of the access that community groups had for students and families just really weren't practical anymore. And so, we are trying to develop other ways that community groups could interact with our families. But still, the community groups saying, "Hey, we're we're being challenged here a little bit. Can you know what are some other ways that we can, you know, get in front of families?" The second reason, excuse me, is our own uh district activities, programs, and services. We're saying we want to also have more visibility with our families, especially families that are either new to the district, young families, or that we've seen as historically um underrepresented in our programs. And then third reason is that we heard from district administration and the school board at the time saying we really want new ways to develop our community connectedness, interact with the community and demonstrate the the ways that our district brings value to the community definitely during the school day but also beyond the school day in the areas of activities um sports and educational opportunities. So with that in 2018 um we started talking about uh at that time um Superintendent Bowman and I started talking about developing what would become the activities and sports festival with those kind of things in mind about developing that community connectedness providing an opportunity for the community and our local organizations and district groups to come together and then also provide that highlight of the great things that are happening in the Lakeville area around activities ities, sports, and educational opportunities. All right, make sure I'm still tracking with the slides here. Okay, there we go. So, in 2018, we launched the activities and sports festival. So, it was midFebruary, it was at Kenwood Trail Middle School. Um, we had a wide variety of activities, sports, we had entertainment, we had DJ, we had events in the auditorium, we had open swim, um, food trucks and a variety of things. First time out, we thought, hey, this would be fantastic if we got 500 people, maybe 30 vendors. And true to form for Lakeville, we overachieved. We got 1,400 folks coming through the doors and 45 vendors. When I say vendors, that can be anything from a district group, a sports organization, local community group, um, park and Lakeville park and wreck, um, whole wide variety. But then when I say vendors, that's what I mean. So that was fantastic out of the gate. We felt really good about that. And each year we did surveys of not only participants, but our vendors to say, how did this work for you? What went well? What didn't go well? And how can we improve for the next year? So over the course of the next two years, uh, we offered it again. So 2019, we had a few less people, but I'll explain that in a minute, but more vendors. So it really was picking up the the, uh, the interest and people knowing that this was very effective for their local community group. Uh part of the reason why we believe that we had fewer people is the night before we had a really big snowstorm come through and so it was a little bit treacherous to get around and we also lost a lot of parking space uh because of all the snow. So unfortunately we think some people may have just kind of driven through and driven on. So 2020 then we did have a few more people. We had less vendors but we were more selective on the type of vendors we had and responsive to the feedback that our vendors wanted more space. So we had a more selective group but we gave them more space. Also that year was the big polar vortex happening right then and so we also heard that some of the families had decided yeah not sure if I'm going to go out with my family today. Uh but they didn't miss out. It was a great time. So all three years were very successful by all of our measures and the feedback that we received. So February 2020 less than a month before March 2020 when everything kind of shut down. And so the next two years we had thought about do we come back? Do we can can we come back and because of either restrictions or just health concerns we decide those next two years just not a good idea until we can actually do this safely in an effective way in an engaging way. So we did skip a couple years there and then come 2023 when we were saying okay is this the right time is this not also for our district we did connect with district administration at that time they said well not quite yet we're going to put this on hold so that kind of brings us to almost a current and I'll get to that in a second but it's easy for me to kind of just talk here but it it it doesn't really paint the picture about what is this thing how engaging is it what is does that energy feel like? And so very fortunately, our communications department at the time did an absolutely fantastic video um of the 2020 activities and sports festival in preparation to promote it for 2021. So with that, um go and take a peek and see if you can find our secret cameo person in this video. Wa! [Music] [Music] [Music] Yay! [Music] Oh [Music] my god. [Music] So hopefully that gives you a flavor. Um, our school board at the time had a a lot of fun greeting folks. Our kids and families had a great time. We had a good time putting it on on it. Just energy was just simply contagious. But I think uh as much as the kids had a great time, I think Superintendent Bowman had a good time going on around and visiting with folks too. So it it was it was great. So come forward here this past fall. uh Superintendent Bowman came back in said, "How's the festival going?" kind of explained the history and kind of where we were at. He said, 'Well, do do those needs still exist? Do we need to revisit this? And so, we chatted and we talked to a few other folks and said, "Yep, you know, we were able to reaffirm that we're still hearing from community groups that there is that desire. We're hearing from internally in the district that want to get our activities and programs and services out in front of folks and also heard from district leadership that there is an interest in developing or redeveloping that community connectness and just having the opportunity to engage and demonstrate value. So, uh, what are we looking at is we're looking at again what is that way to bring that community together in a meaningful way with our not only the district but also local nonprofit, uh, community groups and in a way that promotes activities, athletics, and educational opportunities. So, how well looking back and looking at our evaluations, the formula we had worked barring weather. So, if we can guarantee weather, we'll even be doing better. But, uh, we want something, an event that again is bringing the community and nonprofit groups and district groups together, something that is highly engaging. If you'll notice from the video, it wasn't a typical expo with people sitting behind tables handing out brochures. Every single one of those areas had something that was engaging, interactive for a wide variety of age groups. So that is key and essential uh for the festival. It's accessible. It is free. It is you can come a wide variety of times for the event. And for anybody that language is a barrier, we also provided interpreter services again trying to get some of the folks who may have been historically underrepresentative in our activities. And then uh it is also familyfriendly. So again uh entertainment and for all a wide variety of activities for different age groups. We have food there. We have um the mascots as well and we also have mother's room and by necessity we also have a missing child's uh center as well. So, so when this is a key question and something that we've kind of gone back and forth on for a few different uh pretty much every year is essentially what would we hear heard from the community groups is we would really like to see this offered two times per year. this a um this kind of late summer, early fall time and then mid- winter because the late summer, early fall would really help for promoting fall and winter programming and then the winter obviously for spring and summer. When we surveyed our groups then we found out yes people would be very interested and able to come for the winter time but August September it was a little bit more questionable. Um, also if you think about what are your families doing right now, there is a lot going on. There's vacation, there's school prep, there's state fair, there's county fair. Um, there's just a lot to compete for attention. But probably the biggest reason is internally as a school district, we just do not have the resources to offer something right here and now because either um, you know, much summer, we have some folks that aren't aren't working in the school district. they are either those that are working are oftentimes running summer programs and then as you know August is a big time that we're our main focus is launching the school year successfully. So figured that August September really would be a challenging time. So we are focusing our attention back on the mid- winter February time frame. So where location location location just like real estate that's a big deal for events. We want to make sure that something that's centrally located, easy for people to access. Um hopefully centrally located in the district. Ample parking, easy parking, especially families coming in. You'll see uh from there you saw a lot of um strollers, etc. Uh lots of indoor space for those vendors, hopefully a big cafeteria, big gym. Also complimentary spaces that we might be able to use for different activities like a pool or an auditorium or food service. And also being mindful of although it's not mandatory we just have it in a neutral space. We thought as we're growing the program having something that was mindful of that kind of north south panther cougar identity might be helpful to kind of again engage in the entire community. Also, if we're looking at a winter time frame, if you know our schools, you know that they are busy, busy, busy all through winter. And so, we need to reserve something, kind of carve something out if we're going to do this uh for this year. So, wrapping things up, what we are proposing is uh reintroducing the activities and sports festival for this upcoming year to serve those three needs. uh you know reaffirm those goals similar to the past run the festival similar to the past with some tweaks from what we've gotten from feedback from past festivals and since then we've a few tricks up our sleeves or ideas that we might want to tweak a little bit and then um similar successful framework we have a date reserve for Saturday February 21st 2026 so putting that out here now so that we can also start advertising not only to our community but also our community groups so that they have the opportunity to think it through and then apply to possibly be part of the festival and then fortunately Kenwood Trail Middle School which has been successful in the past is available on that date and that is has checks all those boxes for our location uh requirements. So with that, um, pleased to have announced their reintroduction, but we'd be happy to stand for any questions. >> So I, for one, am thrilled to hear this, Steve. You know, I'm a huge fan of the sports and activities festival. Um, I attended every single year, as did my children. Um, my boys participated with the Boy Scout groups, and they were in those stands. Sometimes they had archery, sometimes they had fishing. You can fish indoors, just so you know, I saw it and it happened. Um I participated with the special ed advisory council and we found it to be an event where we could really connect with families. Um many don't understand that with special education there's confidentiality laws. So it makes it kind of difficult for us to contact families and to let them know that these things are available within the district. So we had the greatest time connecting with families. We were well aware that we needed to have an activity with our thing. Um, for the last the last one that happened in 2020, we made sensory bottles. So, they gave us the booth by the water fountain. My hands like I had blisters on my hands by the end of the day from like screwing the lids off the bottles and letting the kids like load all the things in and make the sensory bottles and we hot glued them shut so that they wouldn't open in the car on the way home. Um, it was one of the best events I found that that our district did. Um, positive interaction with family. I absolutely loved it. So, I am so excited to see this come back. I'm glad for your leadership and leading this event and and bringing all the people together and I appreciate the thoughtfulness on how you've created it and and made it open to certain organizations. Um, I'm just thrilled to see this back in Lakeville. >> Thank you. I was worried about indoor archery as well, you know, when that came up too, but they do it in inflatable kind of velcro way and it was fantastic. So, thank you, >> Director Anderson. >> Yeah, I just want to say this sounds like a really great event. and I haven't been before, but sounds amazing. I just want to thank you for your attention to detail with regard to accessibility piece. I think that's super important. We're bringing a lot of different kinds of people together in our community, which is a great aim. So, thank you. >> Yeah. And thank you. And to be clear is that it's um I'm happy to serve as, you know, a district-wide kind of facilitator for this event is that, you know, in order to make this happen, it really does take uh cooperation, support, not only for all the departments in the district, but also that support from all the buildings as well. So, I'm happy to lead a very talented team that puts this together, but thank you, >> Director Thompson. >> So, I'm going to share some comments and and hopefully not to be discouraging for folks who want to move this forward, but I do have questions. I mean, if if this because if we're bringing in vendors >> and and maybe I need to clarify and ask like what kind of what kind of vendors are coming? Are we are we talking about the Lakeville Soccer Club? Are we talking about the Lakeville Basketball Association and the high school I mean and the hockey association and archery and all that stuff? And if that's the case, those are those are profit or nonprofit entities outside the school district. And and so I'm I'm I'm hesitant on the Lakeville area schools needing to be the one to sponsor this kind of event that they sound like these are businesses and it should be something that should be led by the city and or maybe the chamber, but I'm I but if we're having activities and sports festivals, uh like wouldn't we want to be promoting all of the activities and pro and programs that the school is offering? I I just I don't know the cost of this stuff. I don't know if it's a net neutral. We're using our facilities. So, I'm just throwing out that I get the intent, but is it within with is it within the purview of the school district to be hosting this this kind of event? That's all. >> There are school sponsored events there. Um, one of the things that my kids really enjoyed was the STEM presentations that were by our students within the STEM programs. Um, we also, like I said, the special advisory council that's run from the district that was there. Um I think that one time we had Special Olympics as an out most of the outside entities were like Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts that are in associated with some of our different buildings, but the majority of the things were just activities and events that go on within our buildings and and some of it were clubs and organizations that students have. Um but a lot of it was just things that you don't hear about because when do we do that? Like at the beginning of the school year, the high schools have an activities thing that they host and kids can go around and see the different activities. But this showed the activities that were E12, like things that were happening in early childhood all the way up through 12th grade. So, I thought that was what really made this event stand out because as a parent, like I get minimal feedback from my elementary kid about I'm interested in this or I'm interested in that. I don't know what's going on. I'm not there all day. I'm working. Right? So, this put like everything in one spot so that we could go around and kind of shop for the different activities that my kids were interested in. They tried some things out. they were able to see what they were successful at, what they found fun. Um, I think that was what I took from it. Steve, I mean, you can talk better, but >> yeah. Uh, just for clarification for um there were district sponsored groups throughout the whole system. There were advisory councils, there were uh high school activities, there were high school sports, there were community things, student nutrition was there, our equity department was involved as well. That's kind of the district side. We also had other governmental partners that were there. Lakeville Park and Wreck has always been a part. The library sometimes has been a part. But when you're talking about um truly community organizations, that's why we kind of narrowed down that uh selection criteria essentially has to be local, has to be nonprofit, and has to be groups that are uh oriented on um activities, sports, or educational opportunities for youth. Now we have we do have people that are like for-profit businesses that that approach us or want to be a part of it and for them we have sponsorship opportunities but ma but not necessarily participating as what we call vendors. So I know the word vendors can kind of bring uh other thoughts as well. >> Is this costneutral as in like there's no cost to it to it? I mean, we're charging or other organizations a fee to be a part of it, which costs which pays for the the the rental of the of the venue and then and headcount of our staff to be there. >> It is not costneutral, but we do charge for groups and we do try and offset some of that by sponsorships. um to be very upfront since it's been 5 and a half years since we have offered this. We're kind of starting again uh from I say from scratch but from um kind of lower level for being able to charge just because people haven't seen this a lot. There's been a lot of turnover in associations. So there is a cost to that. I've been working with uh director as well to kind of look at those costs and how do we minimize those as well. >> Do do you have an estimate on what the cost is for the event? Yeah. So in 20 I'm sorry 2020 overall for the district it was right around $7,000. We with other costs other changes looking that it may be closer to 10,000 this year but we do believe that we can bring that down again overall for costs. Uh just being very mindful of how we're contracting for different things or what we're able to bring in internally. So we're taking a very close look at that as well. So part of that is, you know, the portion that comes from the community education budget. I'm just saying only from my perspective. I can't speak from anybody else. I do look at that as essentially a marketing expense and know, you know, for how we're able to get our activities, programs, and services out in front of the community. >> And I'd just like to add that we fit it within the approved budget by the school board. We don't go outside of that to fund this. Uh the return on investment with goodwill and opportunities for our kids at $7 to $8,000 is I think well worth it. >> Director Anderson, >> sorry I know I was highlight that too. Sorry. >> I was just going to highlight exactly what you said that I'm sure that this money comes back to the community department in terms of people engaging in activities and those kinds of things. So and I know sorry Amber's Ben. >> Go ahead. Director Cameron. Yeah, I was just going to say that um my family attended I think two of the years and we had a a great time too. So, thank you for sponsoring it. I remember the robotics being really um a popular place. Um I think I agree that I'm supportive of the event. I'm excited about it. I think the research between having kids be involved, sorry, this mask is annoying, involved with um uh extracurricular activities is really important, right, for their academic success. So, I support our ability to promote these opportunities for our students. Maybe along the lines of Director Thompson, I think just something to keep in mind, and I'm sure you you are, is that because it's a Lakeville Area Schools event, branded as such and run, I would just want to make sure that the external organizations that we're bringing in are vetted in a way that um in in the issue of like liability concerns or um things along those lines that we're not we're we're making sure the external groups are at a standard by which we would want children participating in those. And so I think that's an important thing to to keep in mind running a running and inviting external vendors. >> Yeah. Well taken. I know we do require the certificate of insurance just like we do for any other district facility use for uh these groups. >> No further questions. Thank you. Appreciate Steve. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right. Moving on. 6B, the um survey review. Miss Olsen, >> I was not notified. I was supposed to bring swag, so you'll have to excuse me. Um uh good evening, Chair Swanson, Superintendent Bowman, schoolboard members, and community members. I'm Grace Olsen, the uh communications director, and I'm here to share the results of our annual student, staff, and um family surveys, also known as the daily desired experience surveys. Um the desired daily experiences were developed during our strategic planning process and we went through a process of asking our students, staff and families to describe to us what would it look like to you if the strategic plan was being implemented successfully. Um so narrative descriptions were compiled by most common themes into the desired daily experiences um that now make up part of our district's strategic plan. uh 2425 school year was the second year we surveyed based on this set of questions aligned to the um desired daily experiences. Not the second year we surveyed ever, but with this specific set of questions and surveys were distributed in the early spring. Um, you can see the full set of desired daily experiences for students, families, and staff as well as the questions that we ask students by their grade range. Um, on the link that's provided on the slide deck there. Um, this is qualitative data about the sentiment and perception of our students, families, and staff. So, it's important to us because if you look at our mission and vision, a major component of what we're working for in this district is related to the experiences that all of the individuals in our schools have with us. Um, the information is collected and used alongside many other both qualitative and quantitative data points to add context because we know when students and staff are in safe and engaging environments, learning outcomes improve. So to the results for our students, we had approximately 65% of students who participated this past year, which is about a hundred more than we had the previous school year. All three categories of DDE or desired daily experiences um improved with the highest increases being at the secondary level. We also ask our stu our secondary students grades 6 through 12. >> Yep. >> Sorry, I'm not controlling it. Can you go back to the previous slide? So, >> which I don't know if this is common, but I great numbers elementary uh and and obviously at 92 to 76% and then as kids get older when they get into middle school than at like especially in the middle question, the second question, that's a big that seems like a big drop in middle school like 14% where my school my school is is an environment where I can I can explore my interests, engage socially and support my basic needs. And and so I'm slightly biased. I have a six a fifth grader going into sixth grade. Uh and and when I think about the classroom options that they can select from, if we've got the wheel program, which is 7 to eight weeks of what is it? doing STEM and media and digital arts, which is good because they get a little bit of something here and there. But we've got like massive equipments of wood shop that like can't fully be used because 7 to 8 weeks is not enough time for kids to learn the safety protocols and actually like widow wood or whatever whatever they do in in in that space. But it is interesting. Do you know why it dropped 14% from from fifth grade to sixth grade? And then also my classes are relevant and engaging and prepare me for my future. Another 15% drop and and so obviously we you know I don't mind I anticipate it dropping a little bit as we get into nth grade because they're teenagers and they think they can they know everything but it is alarming of that drop from fifth grade to elementary. So do you do we know why? I mean do are there verbatens? >> No. So we can um not necessarily extrapolate the why from this data. It's based on a range. So agree to disagree. Um the most of the questions are um we I think maybe your question can be impartial answered by the next slide which is the two open-ended questions that we ask. >> Grace, if I may before go ahead, go ahead and I'll go next. Um, so just going off of what Brian said, I had looked at some of the differences in data and they had drop off too. And what I what stuck out stuck out to me was question one where it says, "My school is a safe place where I can be myself without fear of being judged, bullied, or harassed. K through two, we're at 92.5% and then by third grade it's dropping to 76.8 and then it stays down and goes down further for the rest of the grades. So after second grade, our students are are not I mean there's that much of a drop where they're feeling like they're being bullied or harassed. And then I I go back to how are we implementing our bullying policy? And um is it successful within our schools? Because those numbers would tell me no. That we're only successful in K1 and two and that to me is sad that kids do not feel safe. >> Yeah. >> Could I just make a clarification too? Um I just want to be clear that these um exact statements are not what is asked of students. There's several questions within each of the desired daily experiences categories that are asked that compile to that one just for clarification. So >> this is the desired daily experiences and questions are um created they were created in com um collaboration with principles and staff at the district office um to be appropriate for the grade level. Um so the questions for kindergarten look a lot different than the questions for our high school students but it all combines to be within this desired daily experiences these three. >> Yeah. That's Paul. Dr. Carbone. >> Yeah, thank you. Um, Grace, the the last one, my classes are relevant and engaging and prepare me for my future. I I'm going to guess that in K through 2 grade. Um, they're not quite sure what they're going to be when they grow up. So, I'll I'll pass on that. >> They might be the most sure of they may be the most sure, but be a fireman, you know, or a teacher. >> Fireman. Yeah. Or a teacher. Um, that being said, the thing that's a little concerning is when you go all the way out to the end of that and you look at 2425, in essence, what that says is four out of 10 kids don't think that the classes are relevant for their success leaving the school district. >> So my question is if you know to me that that brings questions about the curriculum that brings qu that brings a lot of questions. So, are there answers in the slides to come or do we need to dig deeper? >> Um, I do not have answers necessarily to those large questions for you today. I have some key goals that we have specifically around the survey. Um, but I as your communications director um am not necessarily equipped to answer that question today. >> I think that's the work of this greater team here. I do think, you know, as a board, um, we should know if four out of 10 kids don't think the curriculum's getting where they need to go and if there and if that's even a relevant statement, you know, I don't know, but we need to look at the data. >> Director Cameron, >> um, yeah, thanks. A couple of things that this makes me think about and I need to look at the actual questions, I think. Thank you for sharing that. I will do that. Um because one of my questions was the the the phrases that are up here right now are assessing too many things for like a if you're going to do survey design, you don't ask three things in one question, right? Like >> correct. >> How can I explore my interests, engage socially, and support my basic needs? Those are three separate things being evaluated. And I know what I'm hearing from you is you're taking those questions and then working them up towards like a general um area of the student daily experience. So, I'd be curious to look at like broken down how are students answering these things. I do think it's positive that um while I think the numbers are too low in some fields, especially upper grades, I'm glad to see all of them have improved. I mean, maybe we want them more of course, but but they are going up. So, that that's good to see. I'd love to see um in the last like five years, what does the trajectory look like? And maybe on the dashboard when we get that created, we can see that. Um the other thing is like this is our students reporting their experience and that's very valid and important data. I know especially for the last one students aren't always the best um at knowing what's going to prepare them for their future necessarily like they don't maybe understand why math is important. Um but um so I appreciate getting their perspective and we need to balance that with like the skills that we know businesses and industry are asking them which might not match up with students think are important. And then um I'd be curious to know like how do these numbers compare with some of our peer districts? Um so are we on par even though I know the numbers are low in some categories or are we an anomaly um in any of these? >> Yeah, >> I agree. Yeah, I think what we do have to take it with a grain of salt because you're asking kids who I mean my middle schooler and soon to be high schooler uh who'd rather play in the NFL someday than worry about math classes or science classes or English classes. Um yeah, my grade low. I would be curious as to how he responded on a number of these these questions, but >> but I do think the first question is is somewhat I mean is is a pretty good indication. I mean, do they feel safe in their schools? And I do agree with you that being judged or being bullied or harassed or there could it could be three different questions or so forth. But it is I mean when you get into mil by high school these kids know the difference between being judged or bullied or high or or harassed. So if if you know four out of 10 kids think that they don't feel safe in their in their school impacts their ability to learn and so if I don't know so good to know that the results but then I think the next step would be what are we going to do next? What are what's the action plan? and who's responsible for that? Do you need funding for that or additional resources? Uh what are you going to go after in that respect? But if that's not within your department, but we'll I'll wait for the next presentation of here's the action plan from the results, but these are the results. >> Okay. Are we ready for the open-ended student questions? >> Sure. >> Yeah. I think Grace is going to give us the answers to all the questions, right, Carneck? >> All right. We're ready for the next slide. Thank you. Okay. So, we asked our secondary students um two open-ended questions and then synthesized their answers into the top most common themes which you see here. So, their answers show that our students value friendships and social connections and the ability to have time to connect. Our students value having positive relationships with teachers and school staff, especially those who understand their needs, make learning fun, um and show genuine interest. Our students value flexibility in their learning options such as online and PSO classes um as well as different ways of learning like going on field trips or doing creative projects or other engaging activities. Our students also value the feelings of positivity and welcome that a majority of them experience in our schools. um the same things that they value about their school experience um were also primarily the things that they said they wanted more of. Um so more choice, more autonomy, more relevance in learning, more time to build social connections and they indicated there's also some room for improvement around created creating an inclusive and supportive environment. All right, now for our family results. So this year we had about three times as many parents and caregivers fill out this survey. Um or I should say in the 2425 school year we had three times as many as in the previous school year. Um but that still only came out to about 14% of all of our parents. Um however like with our students we have more favorable responses um for each of the categories of desired daily experiences from families. Director Baker, >> just a note on that. Um I I tend to find that people only fill out surveys when they're upset. So I I like to hear the fact that we had a lot of positive results because I know when I get the receipt and and I've had a bad experience at a store, I fill out the survey. So I'm glad to see that families that have had positive experiences are filling that out, too. >> Director Nicholson, >> so you said 14 >> You said 14%. Uh how many of the students participated in it? >> It was 65%. >> 65%. Okay. >> Just five 5% the initial year on 23 24 >> for parents. >> I don't have that number with me today. >> Dr. Thompson. >> No, >> if that's the math that's probably right. Sorry. >> I think this is interesting. I mean because when you think about uh you know uh my child has adequate time and support for a meaningful No, I'm sorry. Not that one. I think it was the second one. Innovation and teaching and variety of courses. You know, that has a higher percentage than the students thinking that they have a variety of of of of options. So, going back to what director Cameron, I think you might have said, like these are kids, they have a different perspective. Uh, but ultimately a as a school board, our job is to make sure that the parents who have children here feel that their the education that they are getting sets their child up for success. And so when I look at the two metrics, while I I I appreciate the school, the student body one, but the family one is also where I think where we've got to make sure that the value of the education system that we are providing to them that their tax paying dollars are going towards has value or or has positive results and you know from the innovation one I mean four out of 10 doesn't think we've got the right programs available for uh kids to be successful or individual learning. needs are met. And so those are things that we've got to think about. And and so I don't have the answer, but but but I look at the two different metrics and it's it's good to know that we've got some sort of data element to be able to go back to and say, "All right, is the needle moving? What do we need to do with our curriculum? What do we need to do with um program options?" Whether it be more AI, less AI, I don't know, something like that. But we definitely need like that 66% number seems I think we can do better. Director Nicholson, I'll go after you. >> 14%. Is that a statistically valid amount of people to actually weigh in on this though if it's only 14% of our parents and guardians and caregivers? I mean, >> can we can we clarify something? I know like in the um like in a university environment, for instance, evaluations, you have to comp like you are on your last day of class and you have to complete it before. So, much higher rate of student involvement here versus parents. So, how are we trying to get this get people to complete this? I guess >> so. For students, it's um in their class period, but it is optional. Um and so we provide the surveys and then the teachers are the ones who administer it and make sure there's time for it. Um for families, it's through our mass communication platforms. Um this the past couple of years we've been using Google Forms and simply sending reminders. Um I'm kind of skipping ahead here, but um this year we have a new communications platform that will actually allow us to embed the survey within an email so you don't have to click through to a different link. Um and then we will be able to send reminders to only those who haven't filled it out yet. Um, so we can be a little bit more targeted in responding. >> Well, you can set it up where like you got to do the survey before you can see your trimester grades or maybe your semester grades. >> Some I don't know what the something to incentivize it at the student level. And then yeah, like you're saying the accessibility for parents just making it more readily available. I think good move on that. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Because 14% is very low. Yeah. aren't >> hopefully we're not using these metrics if we're only getting 14% to make any sort of policy decisions. But go ahead. >> All right. So, for the family open-ended questions, we asked two questions um that are the same questions that we also ask in our communitywide survey um that we shared earlier in the spring. Um, so and that helps us be able to compare kind of the perceptions of our community as a whole, which you may remember 60% of our community does not have students currently in our schools. And we can compare that to um the families who are in our schools um more regularly. Um the things our families said they liked most are exceptional teachers and staff, safe and supportive environment, and academic and extracurricular opportunities. Um, this matched pretty closely with what our community said were the top things they liked, um, which were highquality student, uh, high-quality teachers, excuse me, the variety of opportunities for students, and highquality academics. When asked about the most serious issues facing Lakeville area schools in their perspective, families shared concerns about transparency and decision-making processes at the board level, concerns about budget cuts and staff turnover, as well as desire for more mental health resources for students, more behavioral support, and academic interventions or extensions. Um, the top three things our community said they were concerned about is lack of funding, large class sizes, and of course, high taxes. Okay, now to our staff. Um, for the 2425 survey, our staff response rate also went up by about a 100 staff members. That response rate was 45%. Um and again the responses were more positive in each category in the 2425 school year than in the previous year. All right. So our key takeaways um across the board our students staff and families responses indicate we have improved and >> isn't there a slide for what the teachers like and what they don't like? >> We did not ask open-ended questions for >> why wouldn't we do that? um we had tried that previously and hadn't found adequate questions in our mind that got to the root of the desired daily experiences. So that has been a conversation as to what those questions could look like um but hadn't been determined. >> But so but then you wouldn't know what levers to change if you don't ask them what they want changed, >> right? I mean I work I mean at my company we do employee surveys twice a year that expla that has multiple questions about your your manager the department that you work in and the organization as a whole and then lots of openended questions to say what do you want different what do you want to change how do we improve things blah blah blah so when we're making changes or want to make changes we don't know if that's what they're looking for so I think my strong recommendation to like add that and and again you're going to have biases you're going to have folks that uh that may not be as favorable to the district and there you'll see more more of a you know a number of vet a number of responses from them but you should be able to see common themes out of that and because if you get a small percentage that are upset about a particular topic chances are the other 80% are going to be upset about that topic but chose not to respond back. So that that's a huge missson. Yeah, I just I I do also want to point out like a 45% staff involvement rate, right? And so I'm even just thinking in my organization, we have teams competing for who's doing the all employee survey. Um and so it's like we're all trying to reach 75%. And you get a weekly update where everybody is. I mean, this isn't a huge hospital, so it's like I'm not trying to critique the thing. I just wonder how we can I I want to be careful of like what we would find from some of this information when it's a smaller percentage of participation and what we do about that because we're not hearing in that case from 55% of staff. >> I understand but but if it but if it impacts 25% out of the 100 people that replied back there's a chance there's a pro there's a higher probability that someone like that that's that's an area you know but if we don't have that information you're flying blind and that's a waste of time and a waste of money. Director Baker, >> can I ask a question on how the information is collected? >> So, anytime you have like a staff survey and maybe you are bringing up sensitive information related to your employer, um how is this information connected like an anonymously or can it be tied back to that person? Like how is the information collected so that a staff member feels safe enough to complete the survey that things are not tied back to them so that they can be honest? >> Yes, it is anonymous. Georgia Cameron. >> Um, that might have answered my question, but do we have the ability to to break down within like the staff survey how many teachers, how many EAs, how many custodial took it or do we not know that level of detail? >> So, we have it by um building that they're in. Okay. >> And then we have it by a little bit more of a general role. Um, so it's uh I believe the questions are I work directly with students. I work primarily with other staff. I work primarily with families. >> Okay. >> And then I know this is not for the staff questions but for the others the qualitative are we coding this information or is it just like to what extent is this actually being eval like done proper evaluation to assess the outcomes? Does that make sense? Like is someone taking all the qualitative and coding it to see how many responses and what ones rose to the top or >> Yes, there's a team of people who review all of the responses and then put it together for the rest of um the broader team to review. >> Yeah, >> Director Thompson. >> I find it fascinating that we don't have this information. So So again, my recommendation is that either we pass a resolution or you guys move forward in that direction. And I mean at where we where we work at like my manager knows all the answers and all the responses. If it's less than five people in that department then the number is anonymous but my manager would know if people think that he or she is not doing well. >> And then my department knows at at a department level and and every year we do you know you have you have an an employee experience survey and a net promoter scores. You got eye perceptions. There are literally hundreds of companies that do this and they do it well. And so I understand our staff are teachers, but again, they're still employees of our organization. And so like this isn't this isn't complicated. Like I'm I'm surprised that we don't have this. And so again, I like that I don't know. Are we do I do we need to make a motion or that's maybe that's another for another discussion. >> Well, Director Thompson, I'll say this if I may. Um loud and clear and I will take corrective action. It's my shortfall, not anybody else's in this matter. Um, we can and will uh find the right device to do that. Um, historically we've had different uh survey mechanisms that um have gone through iterations of um scrutiny. We've had the the last one that I recall was Panorama in the preceding. >> Yeah. So, I I just want to make sure that um we partner in making sure that we get the device that is going to get at what you're talking uh to specifically if that's helpful. I can also share um that again because the questions are more broken down than the categories you're seeing here. It does ask things like you know I'm supported by my leader at the building that I'm at and I'm supported by the district level. Things like that that when combined can get to some of what you're talking about. Okay. All right. So key takeaways. Um again we saw across the board improvement um in our ability to meet the desired daily experiences. We see that elementary students experience a high level of engagement um which then decreases as they get older. Um, we see that families feel well informed and they are also seeking more innovative and individualized learning options and across the board staff who responded provided high rates of positive feedback. Um our future goals for our annual desired daily experiences survey include increasing survey participation as we've talked about um ensuring that the survey results can be put into an infinite campus data visualization and um continuing of course to increase the overall percentage of favorable responses. Um but overall we are really pleased to see that we had increases in participation and in favorable responses. So we are on the right trajectory. >> Director Thompson. >> Hey, and just so you know, campus infinite campus has a survey designer where you can create a survey I mean surveys and send them out to students and parents and and staff. And so it it's everything's there. >> So thank you, Grace. Appreciate it. Board member reports anyone. Um I know Bowman mentioned it earlier or superintendent Bowman did. I was at the new hire orientation this morning uh on the elementary side. At least they did introductions of all the new staff uh explain their positions and I was very surprised to see I mean I would say probably at least half of the new hires are special ed related. So that was very encouraging uh >> given the fact that we've struggled to find those in the past. So >> what's up >> director Anderson since you brought it up. >> Sure. Uh we had a stakeholder session tonight. Um, and it was just uh me and Chair Swanson, superintendent, but uh one of our students came in and spoke about Project ADOM, which um basically is u well there's new legislation around um trying to prevent sudden cardiac arrest. Um and so it sounds like our schools are in a good place with all of this, but um this project, Adam, is something we're going to look into. So, she brought up a really good um just kind of comprehensive plan for making sure that our students are safe from a cardiac standpoint. So, she was very brave and we appreciated her participation. >> Very impressive. Lakeville South soon to be senior. >> Lakeville South. >> I was going to say we we kind of were like, "Oh, Lakeville South," but >> we didn't hold it against her though. Yeah. >> Anyone else? Uh Superintendent Bowman, anything to report? >> Uh couple things again. And I just want to congratulate uh all of our teachers who achieved tenure. Uh I think that's a big deal and I uh appreciate their contribution to our school system. Uh the other thing I want to uh share beyond just the opportunity for us to uh welcome our our new teachers uh our new teacher cohort. Um just so you're aware they there's a series of things uh today they went through um quite a bit of uh introductory stuff uh related to teaching and learning primarily. tomorrow they'll be engaged with safety and security u internal protocols within their schools all the all the essential things that uh you need to be prepared with uh so that your first day is um beyond just the challenge of young people looking at you and expecting you to lead the way uh the everyday requirements that we have. So that was that was uh that will continue to be a a good opportunity for our um our new uh staff. And then as uh the chair pointed out, I we've made a concerted effort around special education and our needs there. Um you know, those will continue to evolve. We're extremely committed to uh rebuilding our special education uh program. um executive director Michelle Humphrey's done a lot of work Alexia as well over the summer. Uh and you could see maybe the fruits of that labor, but more importantly is going to be uh performance and how we do in the classroom and how well we're able to uh help our special education teachers with case loads and those challenges that uh have have uh been going on in our district. So, we're on the right trail. a lot more work to do and I appreciate the opportunity to just share that. Thank you. >> All right. Uh, director Baker discussion on board operation meeting schedules. >> Sure. Thank you so much. Um, I wanted to bring this to the collective board because I feel like um, you know, perception is is truth and how our actions um are how we're perceived by our community. uh the actions that we do within every day at the board table, we're judged by that on where our priorities lie. Um so this this one thing that I wanted to bring as a collective board because I want the community to see that we as a board see this as a priority. So I that's why I wanted to bring it to the whole board. Um my question is related to 917 meetings. And the the reason I bring this up is because it doesn't happen very frequently, but sometimes those meetings occur on the same night as a Lakeville schoolboard meeting. And so then I'm coming to the meeting late because here's the deal. Um that 917 serves our more vulnerable, our most vulnerable student population. And I refuse to leave that meeting early to come to this meeting because they deserve my time. I was appointed by this district and that board to sit there and be the representative for our district. And so I see that as something that I take very seriously. I'm very passionate about it and I'm not going to leave that meeting early and and cheat those students and that sta those staff that are on that district from my time and my attention to those matters. So that's where I sit with that, right? And so then when I come late to this meeting because I'm saying my time is important there, then it also kind of sends the perception that my time is not important on this board because it doesn't matter that I miss that time because I'm there. That's a perception. I'm not saying that anybody believes that. I'm just saying that that's a perception. And so my ask for this board is that we collectively say that when there are times that those meetings coincide that we will adjust our Lakeville meeting time so that those students and that staff those staff get the attention that they deserve um when those meetings occur. When when is this 9 what time is does the 917 meetings begin and when do they normally historically like generally what's the trend of when they end? >> So the 917 meetings happen at um in Rosemount at the DCTC campus. Um they start at 4:30 and we go backtoback. So, we start with our working session and we go over all of the topics and information that we're going to be discussing at the regular meeting. And then as soon as we finish the discussion for the working session, then we go right into a regular session and vote on all of those. So, generally, I would say we we start at 4:30. We get out between 6:45 or 7. Um, just depending on the topics that we're that we're, you know, discussing. Um, and then I have to drive clear from Rosemount to make it over here. So given the traffic, it's about a 30-minute drive for me. >> Got it. >> And the last meeting um we were also doing at a close session because we as that is a full functioning board um we're in the middle of the superintendent evaluation process. So I'm not going to leave the superintendent evaluation process either because that's really important that I'm there to provide feedback for um the superintendent. So there there's that too. like it's there's just lots of perceptions with that and and I just want to make sure that um we're honoring what's going on there. >> And just for context, so we've had two conflicts. Is that correct? So it doesn't happen often, but >> Director Kerbone, >> yeah, I I know you're mentioning perspectives, but has someone or a group of people mentioned things to you about being late? I'm I'm curious if if people are >> actually um the 917 board has struggled with this. Um so as a board what they did is they collectively went through and they said that we would only get paid for the meetings that we're attending. So they had to go and adjust the board members pay for how we're attending meetings because attendance can be so sporadic and poor because most of the other boards don't acknowledge the fact that it's important for the 917 members to attend those meetings. So, I'm asking that we say, you know what, we respect what's going on with 917. We respect that student population and that staff, and we want our board member to be there. >> Yeah. And and I don't think anybody's asking you to leave. I I mean, I want to be clear about that. I don't >> Nobody's asking I would >> and that's fine, but I don't think anybody's asking you to leave. That being said, I I also think, correct me if I'm wrong, but most of the agenda is um waited towards the end if if there are any votes or or any real discussions going on. So my question would be if >> for our meetings, >> I'm sorry, >> for our meetings. >> For our meetings, >> for our meetings, yes, for our meetings, most of the >> the discussion points and the voting is is more towards the end of the meeting. So, I would ask Chair Swanson if if we've had in those two situations or those two dates if we've had any agenda conflicts where um uh Director Baker wasn't allowed to come and be part of those discussions. >> Yeah, I don't think we got to any votes or voting issues at that point, but I get what you're saying. Um >> No, but there were things that we discussed that I wanted to be able to >> make comments about and I wasn't here for that. So then I get I didn't get to do it. >> Director Cameron, >> um thanks for bringing this up. Um Director Baker, my feeling as a board member is that you've been elected to serve on this board first and foremost and that this board has appointed you to serve on 917 and it's directly related to this board's service and so we should accommodate both that these should not be in conflict with one another. they compliment rather. Um I know we've made we've moved meeting times because some people wanted to have family dinner. So while I think that's important, >> let's move it to Tuesday. I mean Wednesday. So I'm saying I I support either starting later on those days where we have a conflict or since we know the meeting schedules well in advance, could we stagger them so that you know those two that we had, could we have met last week for example for Lakeville to not conflict with a 9:17 meeting? like we would have the opportunity to to change our schedule too because I agree like you've been you've been elected to have a voice on this board and you should be present if you're able to for the entire agenda. >> Director Anderson, >> I just say I agree. I really appreciate that you're serving in that capacity. So I want to make sure we're supportive of you as well. And I don't think even if it's even if we're talking about things that aren't part of a vote, your voice should still be represented. So I guess I'm just wondering um what what do you think would work? So as part of our 917 meeting, every time we get together, we go around and we do board member reports about what's going on in our district. And I would love nothing more than to go back and say, "My school board said that my attendance here is important. I'm I've know that we've had issues with attendance of uh people with their boards and the on on this board specifically having to leave meetings early and everything, but my school board came back and said, "You know what? We're not going to do that." Because I I really feel like we need to lead by example. And when we do something that that's putting forth like like something like this, it may seem simple, but I feel like the other districts will see that um and will respond to that. Um I I just think it's sad that it's been so much of a problem that we had to uh change the way that board members are paid for their attendance, which granted it isn't a lot. I'm not saying it's a lot, but um just because we've had this much of an issue with people leaving and and having to go to their other board meetings. So um I think you know, we're given the schedule in advance. We know when those meetings occur. They set them um at the organizational meeting in January and then they provide Kim with the schedule for the year. So we already know when 917's meeting. They only meet once a month. they always meet the first Tuesday of the month. Um, so we already know that that's going to happen. Um, I so I think it makes it really easy to accommodate uh the the time difference there so that at least if we're doing it, we can stagger our meetings so they happen on a different time. I I hate to ask people to meet later because I know that's difficult for um the executive staff members that stay for our meetings here. Um but I do feel like we can um alter our meeting schedule enough to accommodate it. Director Thompson, >> as a board during the organizational meetings on Mon in January, we get to dictate when we want to meet and what time we want to meet. And so I know historically for Lakeville, it sounds like we've always had our meetings on Tuesdays. And I think last year or maybe earlier this year, we we thought moving to, you know, to have them have them start at seven and and then some people wanted to get home early and so so and that too. No. Uh, but I have Yeah, I mean I'm I'm open. I don't I don't have anything going on on Wednesdays. I mean, if you want to move to Wednesdays, let's move on to Wednesdays. But I do agree if you could be there. The last thing I mean, if you could be there and be present there and not feel rushed to leave, whether we can adjust our schedule or our board meetings on Tuesdays or move them all together, I'll defer to you guys. >> Yeah, >> I'm fine. >> Can do most school districts meet on Tuesday nights or No. As far as the 917 participants, >> most school districts meet on Mondays. Um, just for the members that are participating on that board, there are some that meet on Tuesdays. The reason that Lakeville has never met on a Monday is because the city councils meet on Monday and um, we wanted to leave that day open for board members that wanted to attend city council meetings. >> Do we have any Kim? Do we have any conflicts the rest of the year with 917? >> We have November 11th and December 9th. >> So, they're not always the first Tuesday then. usually are. >> Okay. >> Is is there a way for us to adjust our schedule where we're not adjusting the time, but we're adjusting different Tuesdays so that we because I also want to be respectful of our executive cabinet's time and um staff who come and other people who come. So, can we just try to make sure >> whatever they have, we're not meeting that Tuesday? >> Yeah, I'm >> because we meet twice a month. >> Yeah. And it's just it's the schedule that's been posted and I can't remember are we first and third or second and fourth, >> second and fourth. So they're not the first on the 9th and 11th because that'd be the second Tuesday of those months, >> right? So typically when they um adjust like that, it's um because of another conflict like an election. Um so you have to watch those times too because we're not allowed to meet during election times. >> I would assume there's something with that. I don't know. >> Yeah. All right. >> All right. There's no Kim, what do you think? >> So, Kim, >> might be easier because of the amount of evening things that we do have on people schedules. This is just my opinion. Sticking with the date, but starting at seven, so you can get there. Generally, your meetings are on schedule to end at 6:45. >> Yeah. I mean I I think the concern just from the from the chair and we've talked about this you know internally in our planning meetings is the the current length of our meetings and the thought of pushing it back to seven and for the staff um yeah again ideally we're not always meeting for three hours but uh >> but I mean we also could talk about that as a board and say um I do feel like some of our meetings are too long and I think a lot of us share that. Um, I would say after hour three or four, I'm kind of shut down as far as uh processing goes and I I just don't know if I can process any more information. So then my question would be, is there a way that we can manage the agenda so that when we know there's a topic that's going to require a lot of discussion, there's not four items that we need to discuss that night. There's maybe only one or two. Um, so that we can space those out. Now, sometimes there's going to be issues with timing um because some topics need to be uh discussed at a at an earlier date. I would suggest then let's add another meeting in there somewhere so that we don't have to sit here for five hours because again like I said I feel like the longer it is the fruitfulness of that discussion kind of withers away. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Kim Kim Ellson um is there any reason on those two dates that you mentioned that we just can't and chair Swanson I'd ask you this question too that we just don't bump uh the this school board meeting a week before or a week after leave everything the same and just adjust the dates I mean it's only two dates for the next six months I think right >> yeah I mean >> yeah we'd have to we'd have to cancel the meeting technically and then just call a special meeting >> because I think they're already scheduled But yeah, it wouldn't be it's I mean it's workable, isn't it? Doing it that way. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> This was only three days. >> And if I could anticipate how long some of our discussions would take on any individual topic, um yeah, >> you as the chair shut him down just >> I'd be pretty scopeful. >> I'm available Wednesdays. So, >> no, Brian's going to show up on Wednesdays, so we'll we'll stay on Tuesdays. All right. Um let's move along. uh board goals and superintendent goals. Back at it. Um I asked Director Homegrren to since we're I believe we're moving on to finances to touch on those metrics uh to provide us some recommended metrics that he would propose that we follow along with or like to see on our data dashboard. Uh yes, when we talk about uh finances and and thinking about what does the board need to know, what does the community need to know? Um the things that Jack and I have been working on um really we feel it gives you a good picture of what's going on and it's similar to what some of the presentations we've given lately. We've done a a quarterly a good quarterly um update with you. So number one is looking at the monthly spend versus our budget and always looking at a three-year period so we can truly compare what's going on with our budget um over a period of time instead of just today, right? And to really um normalize it by using a percentage. That way each year we can actually compare instead of a dollar amount because dollar amounts are always going to go up in in the next year and the next year just because of inflation, right? So that's number one. I I think that uh we need to continue to uh put that out. Of course, number two is our unassigned fund balance. Where where is that going? Is it changing? Is it getting worse? We need to know those things, right? Um so something um along that line when we look at probably a quarterly um during the year. Uh thirdly, to look at an overall percentage of all of our funds put together. Look at our whole school district as a whole, not just our not just our general fund. Um so that would be the the third that we would uh look at. And then there's some other um smaller pieces really looking at our budget um against our actuals at the end of the year. How close were we? Were we way off? I mean, we're within a percent, 2%. What is that? Are we doing a good job actually doing that? Putting that budget together. Are we hitting those um expectations, right? Um um then again talking about budget and variances, really looking at our original budget and looking at our revised budget. again, is that in line? Is there big changes from where we started the year? And if there is, there needs to be reasons for that. And we need to be able to discuss that and present that to the school board. Um, there's some smaller things. Um, don't know if the board wants to look at all those types of things, but you know, look at our procedures. Are we hitting our procedures timely? Are we getting our work done on time? Um, and is it is it giving us the information that we want? So um those are the things we really have um come up with. And one other thing is look at our audit audit finding. Do we have audit findings? If we if we do what what happened why those types of things and really dig down in and find out why those things are happening. >> Bill, when you say are we getting our work done on time and what are you relating or >> refus office not not the board. I'm sorry. >> No, no, no. I I didn't take it that way. We we have we have timelines we put together >> um to get our work done and you know as another measure are we getting our work done on time um do we have enough staff whatever to really look at those things and make sure that we're getting our work done um correctly and on time. >> Director Thompson. >> Yeah, I I think those first three metrics sound good to me. uh in regards to getting the work done. Uh I feel I I believe I recall that last year there was some um uh payment or uh pay cycle uh discrepancies and that like we didn't get paid some kids or not kids but some teachers not teachers the staff didn't get paid for for a particular day or took a week or something of that nature and I don't know if that happened twice twice and so I think of that as like oh we had a workers workers comp issue at at a manufacturing plant like how many days can we go but like those things in my mind should like we should we shouldn't even be having those discussions like like making sure our staff get paid period is like it's like like table stakes like you like to run a business you just do that and so um I don't know all the reasoning behind why those two scenarios occurred within our tenure uh but having uh ontime payments would be a metric we probably want to capture but if it doesn't happen often then then maybe we don't but we don't want it happening at all in the first place and so having the checks and governance in place to monitor that I I don't know I don't know if that's a metric that you guys are interested in or not >> that was two times right >> yeah it happened twice so it's not very often so it's not really a true metric to say hey is the stat is the health of our my district doing well but that is like when we talk about our processes I would view as that that would be a really big one for the finance department if you want to expand on that. I don't know. >> Well, I guess first I want to talk about the situation you're talking about there. There was only one time that we had a a problem with the file that went to the um Federal Reserve. Okay. And most of the most of our employees were paid on time and but we had a percentage of people who were paid one day late because of a file um scheduled to the to the Federal Reserve. So, it did happen. Has not happened since. That was quite a while. That's over a year ago at this point. Um, and I think since I've been here, that's the only time it's ever happened. But we found out what happened. We took care of it and it's not, you know, it's not going on anymore. >> Do do you mean I guess when you're talking about kind of the timeliness of your work or that kind of thing, it's more kind of how you're updating us with regard to the budget, the preliminary budget and the revised budget and the final? Like is that what you mean or what do you mean >> when you were talking about kind of making sure we're getting >> I mean I think a good measure I mean when I mean if the board's not interested in that measure that's fine. I'm just looking at the budget, you know, and when we get to the end of the year, is that budget within a very close like a 1% 2% from what actually happened. Very >> that gives us it gives us a good measure of whether we're doing a good job budgeting. >> Mhm. >> Right. >> But you're but you're capturing that monthly anyways. I mean that was the first budget propo the the first metric you're proposing. So we should be able to see so that at the end of the year we're not surprised. We are seeing the monthly and the three-month trend. But >> well, >> yeah, assuming you're assuming that it's going to be consistent throughout the school year, though. And I think >> obligations come as we spend money or our buildings spend money, right? We allocate the dollars towards to our buildings and they don't always spend the same every year, right? They might change what they spend in the first month compared to the second depending on what kind of needs they have at the time. So >> really to look at the end of the year, say, are we within 2%. I mean, most auditors are going to tell you you need to be within 2% of that budget to be doing a good job. And so, I think that's just one measure we should consider. Um, I mean, we we're going to look at it internally no matter what, but I don't know if it's something that the board is interested in. >> I think it's a good metric. I mean, we we should know if we're budgeting correctly. It's a good it's a good barometer for whether or not we're planning and forecasting appropriately. I think it's a great thing to look at. We we definitely need to know if the things that we are putting in place at the beginning of the year saying we are going to spend X on whatever Y on whatever salaries overtime contractor cost etc if we are planning appropriately. So I think it's a great measure for how well the district is integrating its planning process across all the departments. So I say absolutely >> director Thompson. >> Yeah. So, so I've got three additional metrics that I like to add on top of this in the financial side. The first one is I feel like um I want to know the number of infractions like the number of people not following the rules. So, for example, using pecards and if they're not following the rules, I want to know how many times that happens. Uh so that things are in line or not in line. Does that make sense? >> Is this a financial thing though? >> It's a fin it's a financial Yeah, it's financial hygiene. making sure that our district is following the rules that finance has in place. And so if you if finance feels that it's not following the process, I want I want that flaked because then we know how often our organization and the number of folks within uh that are are um uh are following the financial rules and so that we as a district district have can see that. Or am I mistaken? I mean, is that not is that is that not an important one for for us to see? Brian, are you saying like if somebody is claiming an improper reimbursement claim or something? >> Claiming improper or not using the district credit card within the rules of our operations like the because we should have limited infractions. I right or am I mistaken? >> How often does that happen? >> How often does that happen? >> Not not very often. >> Okay. >> Um lots of times, you know, if we do have a new PECARD user and there's a problem, you know, when they first get it, I mean, it's immediately repaired. They're educated and we don't have any other problems. And I can't think of right now the last time that we've had an infraction on any of our PE cards. >> But Bill, you're a >> I mean, you're auditing that, right? I mean, obviously we look at that. I mean, that's obvious. >> Being in finance, you've got to keep your eyes on that all the time, I'm sure. So, um, so I go ahead, Brian. >> I would like a percentage. So, I want to know the number of percentages that credit cards are being used or invoices or PE cards or whatever are being used are meeting our district guidelines. And then that number should be I'm making it up 99%. And if it drops to 94 or 93, obviously there's an alarm, but like that would be a good metric to know. Well, and I think what Bill is saying that it it's I mean it's probably 99 to 100% if you don't remember the last time it's been an issue. >> You know, again, I think if it's if it is a habitual problem that we're running into, >> let's take that offline because I I have conflicting information. So, I just want to make sure because because I because I think we've got >> um I think about dashboard. You know, what we want to look at what's going to be actually >> I've got two more, but director Cameron's got some hot ones, too. Maybe more of a managerial level. >> Yeah, >> that's what I'm thinking too, you know, >> as an echo the same thing. Like I I think that should be um something that's monitored, of course. Do I think it should be on a public dashboard? No, I don't think that level of detail is what what this is about. >> Number two. >> All right. The second one I have is that I want to see the average salary cost of FTEES teachers, uh FTEES admin, and FTE's non-admin. That's what I want to see as a metric >> on a dashboard. >> On a dashboard, right? Because then what you end up doing is that you can see what our average cost is for our for our resources and then as a as a board then you can decide if that number is acceptable or not acceptable. >> Is that even going to fluctuate over the course of the year? >> Yeah, because as I mean I'm going to use the teachers as a the teachers compensation as a as a as an example. We have an entry- level teacher that makes 50 $51,000 and then we've got uh individuals that are in the MA60 step 16 or something making $97,000. And so when you've got a distribution mix that may not be uh uh equal amongst the the the span, you're going to have a higher spend in staffing costs. And so as a board, I think it's important for us to be able to recognize and know what is our average spend for FTE teachers, non-teers, and admin. >> I go, Carly, >> neighbor. Oh, go ahead. >> I I was just going to say I feel like um when we're talking I don't know that this is a dashboard kind of thing again, just because I feel like there isn't going to be a ton of variability across the year. And I usually think we're talking about those things when we're approaching negotiation season where we get updates on all of that information. >> It's not it's a hiring practice you guys. This is that impacts uh your financial metrics. So if you end up hiring uh an over percentage of your staff in the higher end that's going to have a higher labor labor cost. I'm not saying there's not I guess what I'm saying is I don't know that we need a monthly like and I don't even know that we've talked about with this dashboard what we're going to get from kind of a more regular cadence kind of update versus a yearly update like you're saying you want that kind of information on a monthly basis. >> Well, we end up having new staff that join every month and so throughout the course of the year and obviously the biggest uptick will generally occur usually around maybe March or April when we have new staff that join and maybe when they start in in Septemberish or so. But I think as a district or as a board, you should be able to know that if your average FTE cost is $85,000, I'm not making a number up. Uh if but if the average median is 75, isn't is it isn't it prudent for the board to know that you're spending $10,000 more and is that the best utilization of our resources and finances? >> Well, can I just say a couple quick things? So, we have a collective bargaining process that um has has that structure in it. We have an annual budget uh process that tells us what our limits are with regard to what the board approves for revenue expenditures. Um if that's what we're driving at, um I I guess I got to think through how you do that into a dashboard when you have a collective borrowing process that we have to be we have to do in good faith. So um that makes the alignment a little bit more difficult. Um you know you're also talking about that that pay scale is developed based on u educational qualifications and certifications. Again I think it belongs in the collective bargaining process and in good faith we have to honor that um that process first and foremost. >> Let me can I rebut that before before I jump in? >> Yeah. And we're going to Amber. >> I'm sorry. Go ahead. >> So, so if you run an organization, if you run a business and you've got 20 indiv 20 FTEES, >> you want to know what your average compensation is for is for that FTEES, whether you're going to have um entry level, mid-level, or more experienced. And so if we're not going to monitor that dollar number, you know, then then then we're not doing our role as stewards of the dollars that our community is giving us. I understand there is there's legal there's there's negotiation components and I get that. I'm not saying that we need to uh uh tell people that they have to make less or whatever may be. I am asking for a metric that says of all the staff that we have that are uh teachers, non-teers and admin, what is the average and that's it. And so if I run a business again and have 20 20 FTEES, if that average is too high and and I get like, you know, 15 of them that are making, you know, $150,000 or $100,000, like that that's just good business. I I don't know why we wouldn't want to know the average price. And that is his job. I would agree. But that's also our job to govern that or provide uh governance to say, "Hey, what is that metric?" And so, >> can I can I just expand on what you're saying and maybe see if this is more in line with what could be on a dashboard? So, one of the things that we do with our academic scores and with um the finances that we spend is we always compare it to other districts and we're looking at what other districts are doing and what their academic scores are and what our budget is. could we do something like based on overall positions within the district? So, we're saying like here's the, you know, the average salary for given the districts in our area, for a teacher, for a superintendent, for um a finance director or whatever. So, that way we know like, and I'm just throwing a number out here. I'm not saying anything that like the finance director that makes like 150,000 is similar compared to these other districts that we always look at to how much they're paying their finance director so that we're also like justifying the amount of money that we're spending on the people within our district. >> We'd have to have a total compensation. I think one of the challenges we've talked about is the salary doesn't fully address the compensation >> when you're comparing district to district. >> Yeah. Right. It would be an average. So before we get too far, Director Cameron, >> um I guess Director Thompson, what I'm trying to think of like is I agree that monitoring this is important. To what end are we going to use that information? And I would argue that in the budget we are monitoring that at a macro level and that is the role of the board. So we know for all of those um employee groups that you mentioned, what are we spending annually? And so we could look at that rate over, you know, the last however many years you want to go back. And I think we have to keep in mind that hiring will fluctuate many many years by building. So like when Lakeville South opened, you had a lot of teachers hired earlier in the schedule and now all those teacher have matured and they're at the farther end, right? So, like I don't really see the point of going down to the employee level, but I do want to look at the macro level and making sure that we stay within the budget parameters that the board has said um and that we were within that 1 to 2%. And I feel like we have been. So, >> I'm just trying to think of what levers you're going to pull. So, say it goes from $83,000 average to 85. Are we going to give a resolution or a directive to HR? You can't hire anybody over step, whatever. Are we going to are we going to get to that level? I mean, is that what we're we're >> like, are we getting to that sort of >> well, I mean, >> tactical level? >> Well, did it before. >> I I understand, but we we made $7 million budget cut. So, yeah, you're going to put a lot of things in place in that situation. That that's a little bit different than giving management autonomy to, you know, allow them to manage within the budget that we just approved. So, I I I'm I'm just curious to know like what do you really want to do with it? Because if you start seeing >> financial information that you know is getting out of whack a little bit, we can always at any point in time step in, but I guess are are we going to do that if it goes up two grand or >> I think what I don't know what I don't know is um is the >> the efficiency use of taxpayer dollars. That's that's what I don't know. And so what I hear is that we are bringing in staff and staff are coming in at a certain pay range and and and we are we are approving a certain percentage of the budget that would go towards salaries and staffing. And then we want to compare that to what other districts might be doing. And so I am not against seeing what other districts are doing, but as a as a uh as an enterprise, we want to be as efficient as we can with the dollars that we have. Okay. So if other districts are in a certain dollar range, that does not mean that we get to spend or should spend as much as every other district. Okay? So we need to be efficient with dollars. And so if I look at my uh number of employees that I have, if I have a 100 employees, if 60% of or 70% of my employees are making top-end dollar and and only one-third are making uh entry level dollars, that tells me from a staffing allocation perspective, I might be out out of out of uh the mixes might be, you know, not as optimal. And so as a board, it is your responsibility to make sure that your dollars are being spent efficiently. Now, I get that new teachers as they start, they progress and they earn and they have the the right and and they've earned to be in that category. But as new staff come on board, should we be re-calibrating the allocation mix so that we are being efficient with the dollars versus being on the higher end where you spend $300 million on a quarterback and that's why you don't have an offensive line. So this is way this is a way for my point of view as a board to be able to see is our allocation mix there is no right or wrong answer. Is our allocation mix above the the the median salary? And if so, how far? And and then and then what we've committed to as a board saying that we believe that experience and uh uh and and higher step staff is what our district deserves and wants and we think that number is acceptable. But if it's not and we want it lower, does that mean that we can actually bring in more staff because there we're being more efficient with our dollars, which might result in lower class sizes, which might result in newer ideas with with different staff from varying levels coming in. So, this is a metric that I think is something that as a board we'd want to want we want to be able to have visibility to. >> Yeah. But you're talking about like an HR metric. I think I don't even think this is a finance metric. So, we've discussed this though, and Brian, I'm with you on this. I mean, we've discussed this before about, yeah, it's ideal if we had teachers with 20 years of experience all across the board, but we can't afford it. I mean, realistically, I mean, you you have to have a blend otherwise. And then the question is where are we more heavily weighted? We are more heavily weighted on the top side. I is it 60ome percent of our teachers are on the top end of the pay scale. Um, which then prevents us from hiring more teachers. you know, it puts a strain on the budget and it's going to be naturally weighted on the on the top side more because teachers don't just stop working at 16 years of experience, you know, they can go all the way to 35. Um, but yeah, and I I guess my push back on this is I mean this is a metric we can obtain, right? And a goal we could set, but doesn't need to be on the data dashboard, right? is it's because it's not going to change all that frequently, but if it's something that the board is aware of and has as a goal like, hey, we need to be aware of this and tracking this. >> I I I view it as the same as an unassigned fund balance. If your unassigned f fund balance target is 10% of your budget and then if your staffing compensation has to be a >> can't impact this though, >> bill can't impact this. This is not a financial metric. You're asking for the financial component of it. This is an HR function. HR does the hiring. So what you need to talk about, >> but this is a financial number. It's not about an allocation mix. This is a financial number. And then he will work with HR. He's just reporting. >> Then he will work with HR to say your number's too high. Yeah, >> I I think what I'm collectively hearing other than you, Brian, is mo or I don't want to speak for an entire board, but I think everybody is saying this is something we should be aware of, but we don't necessarily need on a dashboard for a regular update like a some of the other metrics that we're talking about as like a monthly update. >> Yeah. I mean, I do think it falls on on HR too as far as goals and parameters or more reasonable. Do you want to put in the HR budget in the HR category? >> I >> I think what you're looking at though is sorry. >> I think what you're more interested in is the hiring mix and are we bringing people in at the top end of the salary range or are we bringing in a healthy mix within that doesn't he doesn't do anything with that. He has no impact on that whatsoever except to report the information that they're making X and this is how much it cost you. It's like that's the HR department or >> whoever's making the hiring decisions. But >> I guess the question is you probably set the parameters on, hey, we can't afford to hire this many more people, >> right? Does it? >> But but it's within a budget. >> But the data is missing like I think what the challenge is is data. I've said this many times like data out of context is a dangerous thing to interpret. So when you are looking strictly at numbers and you don't have the context of that. So even when we're talking about special ed, all the special ed hires that we are really excited about for the district, we might in some ways be paying more because those are harder to fill positions. And so you can't just look at a number when we when you don't have the context surrounding that. And so then I just think the question is, is that really something that we think we need to get the context? How often do we need to get the context for that? And to me, that's more I I would be obviously more open to a quarterly discussion on that, but even a yearly discussion when we're look because most of the hiring is happening at a certain time of the year. And so when we're talking about early spring when um our HR department is hiring, what are the goals that we're trying to reach with that? I don't think that's a regular update. Out of context is going to take time to understand that data. >> Yep. So So I I agree with you. the the context of staffing will play a part in um where where they come in. So with counseling, with special education, I'm not limiting individuals in in those respective categories to be uh to to fall within the market range. What I'm suggesting what I'm suggesting is that as a board, we ought to know what our staffing metric is in total in in the salary compensation. Now, I agree it doesn't need to be updated monthly monthly. If we want to do it annually, so be it. That's no different from having the unassigned fund balance percentage at the end of the month. But as a as a board, you should be able to look at a dashboard quickly and say, uh, do I have do I have staffing that is compensated? Do I have a mix of staff? Do I have more experienced staffing or do I have less experienced staffing? And you can you can identify that by looking at a dashboard that tells you the health of your district. And so if you want to run blind and not know what you're compensating for your staff and just say it's going to as long as all my staff is within this bud budget, that that's up to you guys. That that's not how I would run my business. I would want to know what my staff compensation ranges. I >> and I don't I don't disagree with you. I guess I'm I'm curious to know how the average salary for teachers on a dashboard is going to impact our decision- making. What are we going to do if it's $83,000 month one and it goes to 85? Oh no, what are we going to do? Like go fire them. Like we can't. Are you going to say, "Oh, the next five teachers need to come in at, you know, BA plus." >> Let's ask that question. You've got 20 employees and they all get paid and of the 20 employees, 15 of them uh let let's say you've got a range of employees. I get it. >> And they make $50 to $100,000. >> Right. Right. And then if 15 of them are making $90,000, is that is that how you want to run your business? >> I again I mean again I think we're talking about Yeah, you can I mean if you want to track it like I I don't care if you put it on there. I just don't know what we're going to get out of it. I think what you want what you're really driving towards is you want to know the HR onboarding process when we're talking about people we bring on board. Are we extending offers to a healthy mix of individuals within the salary range? That's what I think you really are getting at. And if it if if you can somehow represent that. >> Yeah. >> So, Bill, so let's talk through this. If a if a >> if an open wreck comes through the t through the doors, do you tell the hiring manager a range that they need to be in or do they get to hire whatever they want to hire? We what we do is uh we give our our hiring guidance and um and you've said this out loud, Director Thompson, that it's dissatisfying that we would operate within a macro budget parameter. So, uh but that is what we do. We're not flying blind. We're looking at what the needs are, uh personnel needs are in each school. Um we do that based on class size and elementary. It's a little less um sharp and secondary because we don't have class- size GA gu guidelines and those combined with the collective bargaining agreement drive what our hiring u parameters are going to be. Um and we we have to uh operate within within that uh design. >> So, but here's the question. Do we give the hiring managers a budget saying you cannot like this is your budget or do they get to select the candidate that they want and then we have to accept that candidate at the price that they come in. >> The answer to your question is no. We do not give them a a number target. What we give them is um a with within the operational guidelines. Elementary is class size. We allow them to hire um based on their determination that they use a hiring team to select best fit for that school. >> So there is no financial budget other than >> there is a financial budget. it. We are operating within a a budget that you have approved for the school year. And so it's it we're not just doing this willy-nilly, but to your point of do we I I'm trying to be as direct as possible. Do we give our hiring managers at the schools a number? The answer is no. If you're asking dollars, if you're asking a number in terms of the number of people, teachers, types, etc., yes, we do that. >> So, sober, >> I'm sorry. Go ahead. >> Yeah, good. >> Um, I think I think this is a good conversation. It seems like a couple things. One is that the question is where do our teach where do the current staff, if we're talking teachers, fall in the salary schedule, we know that information. We know exactly how many are in each cell. Correct. Right. Okay. >> So maybe a question before we like talk about how to represent this ever on a dashboard and I agree with you director Nicholson is maybe we could look at the last year have a report from HR to say over the past year what has the hiring looked like. When I look at like today's number or uh staffing that we approved it looks like a really balanced mix between VA and MA. No one's at the high end. So I feel like in our meetings we've highlighted when hires have happened at the high end of the schedule but we have neglected to talk about the overwhelming who are not hired at that. And so I think we could look at a year an annual report of this but to have it on a I don't think this needs to be a dashboard conversation at this moment. So that'd be my recommendation. >> Yeah I that's a good point. I mean, you could look at I mean, it's the same thing as the average, but you could look at what is the actual allocation of our staffing between the different metrics. Um, and again, it's it's not it's not out of line to say, "Hey, do we just do we set a cap? We're not hiring over step seven." You know, I mean, you guys the board has done it before. I know the excuse was, well, we had to cut a budget, but we're always operating, you know, in a very constrained financial situation, um, where other areas could use resources where we could use more. >> Has the board done this before where they >> did it. >> You did it. >> Yeah, you did it. >> You did it. >> We did it. >> Oh, yeah. We did it. >> Yeah. So, Director Thompson said, "My question for you is, are you only looking at this for the teachers as far as the >> that's for the average salary of FTEES for teachers, non-teers, and non-admin?" >> Okay. >> So, that so that so you've got all three buckets. So, that you you have you have a >> Why wouldn't you look at admin, too? >> Well, when I think of nadmin, I think of executive staff or whatever like Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yep. >> But but but again, this is this is a metric that >> All right. Uh, >> nobody wants right now. >> Well, no, no, no, no, no. It's it's a question of do you want to be tracking? >> Well, the the rhythm could be monthly because we have new staff that come in and then leave and so then that number gets that that number gets refreshed. I mean, we have what 40 vacancies still >> I think it's a bigger question on a policy thing. Do we do we as a board want to set parameters on on new hires? >> You know, because that's really what it gets that's the heart of what it gets to, right? I knew I'm sorry. >> I would say I see our role is really setting the budget for the district, like making sure that we're in agreement with Bill in terms of the budget. We're getting updates on that. Um, we basically have a superintendent who we've charged with making sure that we are operating within that budget. And to me, these are his kinds of he's he's in this situation, his decisions at this point in terms of again out of context. We do not know why the HR department might determine that someone is more deserving of a higher salary or we need that position filled and we're willing to sacrifice that money. And so I just think we're getting into an area that is not within the purview of the board if we're saying unless we're in a constrained situation and that's part of what we decide is >> we're always in a constraint situation. you know, not to >> but we're we're a pol I mean, if you want to say we're a policy board, I mean, that's a policy, right? Are you going to set a policy regarding parameters on on hiring >> there? Then that just to me opens a can of forms for a lot of different >> Well, we we already approve all hires though, right? I mean, every contract comes through this board. So, again, I just don't know if it's a dashboard discussion. Well, I think the dashboard is that let's say if the range is 51 to 97 and then if the average number is coming in at I'm like $90,000 like like and then the board says you know what that number needs to be 85 I'm just making a number up. So then that would be the direction that you give the administration you as you bring in new staff you decide which which one you want to have at a higher compensation rate versus not. I mean, I'm not saying that that there there are some that you have to come at a lower number. What I'm asking for as an aggregate, if we're going to have that much of of of staff, we need to have an appropriate allocation mix. Like, I would never hire I mean, let me rephrase that. I it most businesses don't run a model where where they've got 70% of their staff at the highest compensation model. Generally, I mean, you've got this a really reasonable step as folks move up. But that is my recommendation. And I I think when we get to the HR metrics, having a SE and lane distribution grid is one of the things that we need to put on the dashboard. But I will pause here if there's any more other finance. >> Just can we confirm we wanted we would agree with Bill on the first three items? Percentage of budget spent monthly on assigned fund balance and budget versus actuals. >> Yeah, >> that sounds good. >> And Brian, I think first one maybe nay. Second one, I'm not sure. I mean, we want to know, but I think it's part of a different discussion. Did you have a third one? >> The the third one was that I um it's not for us to really dictate, but it would be good to know the number of students that we have enrolled compared to what we were forecasting. Um it does feel like at times where we yeah, we're like, "Oh, surprise. We didn't get 100 more students than we thought we would." And then >> uh and then part of that, I think, allows us to say, "Hey, we want higher enrollment uh as as a board direction." And that might warrant, well, what are we doing to uh bring in additional higher enrollment? Whether it be accelerating our online program, whether it be asking those that are in homeschool, why are you going to homeschool? Uh we've got over a thousand kids that leave our district that go to other schools and other programs. And I'm not saying we're going to get all them back, but that if I was a business, I would want to know what's my market size, my market opportunity, and am I able to capitalize on that? All of that. >> Yeah. I'm not sure if that's operations or FIN. It's it affects finances clearly, but uh >> it's a numbers. I mean, >> he includes enrollment numbers in the finance packet that he sends to us. So, >> every time. >> Yeah. I I would I would actually I think that would be great to to continue to to just have so that we're seeing the current enrollment versus um the forecasted numbers. I I think that's a good idea. Um, I also appreciate like the work we're doing behind that or any work that's being done behind that to determine why our students are leaving and where are they going? Because then that helps us kind of plan for we we do want enrollment to go up. Um, why are they leaving, where are they going, and how can we keep them here? >> I think it's an even mix from intra district. I think we got about a thousand coming in, but we also have a thousand going out and then and it's like how do we maintain some of that? So, I don't have any more enrollment on the dashboard. >> Yeah, that sounds good. >> All right. Thanks, Bill. >> Yeah. >> HR. >> Oh, any hold on. Anyone else on finance metrics that they'd like to see on the dashboard? >> Nothing. All right. >> Okay. >> Thanks, Bill. >> HR. I don't know. Are students is enrollment more operations? >> I I thought uh >> you may not, but I but I got a few uh HR topics that we could discuss. >> I'm kidding. >> No, >> I mean back to back to the five core categories on Go. >> Do you mind if I say one? I really appreciated that you had Bill come and present some ideas. is I feel feel like it expedated the process and I'm wondering before we jump into a whole new category if like Brenda would be given the same opportunity for the and not to delay like I realize we want to move through this but I really appreciated that strategy here. So, just a thought. >> Yeah. I >> And I do want to let the board know that I I asked Emily um and Michael in our meeting for the categories that you know the the different metrics that we've identified for them to provide our baseline where we're at. Um so we can come back and then set goals based on those um well and a recommendation where we're at where they'd recommend we go. So at some point in the near term we'll deal with that. So, so I think the three remaining categories would be so obviously we got academics, finance, done. The other three is HR metrics, operational metrics, and then student engagement metrics. And those are your five things that I think I would want to see as a as a schoolboard member to say, hey, by looking at them, it tells me the state, you know, how's the state of my schools doing doing. >> What are your thoughts on how how you're going to measure student engagement? uh for student engagement a few samples of that I would consider would be what is the uh the absentee rate and and tardiness uh how many behavioral incidents are occurring and how many P3s uh how many what's the mental health referral rate and utilization uh I'd like to know how many students are participating in co-curricular sports I think that tells me if that I think that's a good one um I'd like to know the dropout rate between grades 9 and uh and then this experience survey like that should be a huge metric to show to see how things are progressing uh between a combination of what the student results are and then the uh the parent results are. So that's that's what I would classify or would like to see in a student engagement. Now there might be more I don't know but those are my initial that I would look to the board or look to the district to come back next week with as uh additional proposals. And to your point, Amber, I'd be fine wrapping up and following up with the district staff on their proposed recommendations moving forward to help. I mean, yeah, we did that, you know, for the first six months on academics and still ended up talking for a couple days on it, but uh it won't guarantee UX expedited, but it might provide some additional direction. And and I guess too as a board we need to discuss what what are really metrics we're following versus things initiatives we want to do or uh just longer range goals. >> So because we do have uh boundary adjustments at some point. I don't know if that's operations >> but but I think we my recommendation as a board is that we've got to get this dashboard done sooner. I mean, this has to be a priority because you don't know how your school is doing if you don't have metrics to know where you're at. And we can't set goals if we don't have these metrics. And so, while we've got academics, we talked about finance, uh, we still need to talk about student engagement, HR, and operations. I don't know what kind of operational metrics would be used like how many IT tickets gets gets completion or what's the service level agreement. So, I'll look to the district to say, >> yeah, >> what kind of uh operational metrics do you want to show? Actually, I wrote one down. The utilization of each school building. >> Yes. >> Like that. That's an operational metric. But if we don't have a dashboard where a school board member, any future new school board members that come in to be able to see where they are at today, they can't govern if they don't know. And so I get that there are other things and boundaries and things that like that we've got to get to, but and maybe we can do that in parallel, but this is like the number one deliverable that the school board ought to do and have. Can I just clarify one thing just to correct myself? I don't think we're going to set goals on every single metric, but having the metrics in order to assess performance is is helpful. I think there should be key categories because I don't know that I asked Emily like, "Hey, give me a goal for every nine of the academic metrics." But, uh, yeah, knowing where we're at and us then as a board being able to decide which ones we're going to set goals on. >> Well, you need a benchmark. So we still we got to figure out where we are first before we can start talking. >> But as far as a recommended here's where we're at now. This is where we should think about being in a year, two years, three years. >> So >> I >> go ahead. I'm sorry. >> I would only add that I I am completely in support of the dashboard and us moving in a metric-based kind of uh solution focused adventure here. I just also think we as a board have to remember what our responsibilities to the district are in some ways in ter in terms of board performance. Um we need to be trained and being school board members. Um we need to have I I would just propose we seriously work on the efficiency of our meetings to respect each other as well as our staff. Um I'm looking at some of our board initiatives here like we have to get a board handbook done. Part of it is learning the process for board members and those kinds of things. Um, and I've said this a number of times, but we are very often our cadence of what we should be doing. And so that is a responsibility of all of us to make sure that we are doing those things as well. So not just focusing on what the district is doing with the metrics, but what the board members are doing to make sure we run efficiently. So that would be my recommendation. Obviously, we haven't talked about board goals. >> Um, I think that's hugely important at this point >> and and I do think I agree with you, Director Anderson, that it's part of what needs to be done, but I think we need to prioritize and I think we re number one priority needs to be to give the school district direction, which is what we've been talking about with metrics and and then developing goals and so forth. And I'm all for giving ourselves directions by, you know, what you're suggesting with the handbook, but I I in fairness to Superintendent Bowman and all the administrators, um, we need to give them something as quickly as we can so that they have some sense of what direction, and I think we've done that to some degree, but to give them some sense of the direction we're asking them to take this school year and beyond. and and and and then I think priority number two is a handbook and and making us functional >> to be I guess I'm to me it's beyond the handbook at this point. We are so behind and it's not this I'm not blaming anyone. I think this is this is our entire board. We've been extremely inefficient and so we haven't reviewed the superintendent. We haven't given the goals in a timely manner. And I'm not this is nobody's fault but all of our faults for being as inefficient as we have been. I think if we increase our efficiency and hopefully with this dashboard that helps us but we haven't given direction in a time direction to the district should have been back in June. Um, and so that's where I'm saying let's improve and get in a cadence where next year we can really do what I think we are supposed to do which is yes be monitoring the these things but really set the goals early do the evaluations so that we can also set the superintendent goals the board goals in a more timely fashion. Like at this point I feel horribly behind. >> We used to do that during a board retreat in the summer and we would take um one day or two days and we would do it in four-hour chunks. Um and and we would just work on this type of thing like the superintendent goals would be one of them and then the next one would be ours. So that way we're providing like these are the goals that we want for him and then this is the rubric that we're going to use to evaluate him so he can start on that because it really should be from July to July. So, we're already a month behind on on really having that roadmap for him on what he needs to be doing to evaluate because we really should be meeting in the fall to update progress from this summer until now. We don't have his goals or any of that in in place yet. So, >> I understand that and I understand we can't put the genie back in the bottle. I understand that totally. But I still think we need to prioritize the activity from this day forward to make sure that we give Superintendent Bowman and his staff. To me, that's priority number one. And and then we need to get to these things. I I'm not suggesting we don't need to do these things because I believe we do, but but we need to make sure we keep focused on priority number one is getting some direction, i.e. goals, metrics, whatever you want to call them, or combination of to Superintendent Bowman. >> You can't you can't give a district or the superintendent direction and goals when you don't even know where we are at when we don't even know where we are today. And so like this should have been something that should have been created 10 years ago. Yeah. That any previous school board who had knowledge of of of an of of how an organization works. You need a dashboard or need to know the metrics of how your how your entity is doing. And so the faster we get this done, the faster we'll get the baseline of these scores and the faster then as a board you can decide which ones are priority. Is it student engagement or is it academics? And then you can we as a board decide what the targets are and then those targets end up becoming your superintendent's goals for the year. And and so like we can't do anything else until we get this done. Amber. >> Um, I'm gonna actually respond to that, too. Um, I agree, Dr. Thompson, about that. However, to be frank, I haven't heard of one metric. Maybe there's one or two that I don't already have the answer to. It's not all pretty sitting in one place. And I think that's what the dashboard is about, but we know we know all these answers about how students are performing, um, what our finances are, what our HR hiring is. I mean, it's just it's it's all over the place. But when I've asked a question about any of these topics, I've gotten the direct answer. So, to say the district hasn't been curating this data, I think is inaccurate. We're just asking it all to exist in a pretty place together, which is fine, but to me, I've said that way back when. I know the answers to all these things. We can we can make goals today, but we've wanted it in a very like digestible manner. And and that's fine. I I'm not opposed to that. What I was also going to say, and you said it earlier too, is there are some things that I feel like we need to be working in parallel with this initiative with like making the data pretty. And that is um and uh Chair Swanson, you mentioned this, but I I think we have a referendum on the ballot. We need to be talking about that significantly and how as a board we're supporting that and getting behind it. Um or or at least helping our community learn about what it's for. we need to be talking about boundaries, right, which we know. And then given the conversation that um I was made aware of at city council, we need to be thinking about long-term bonding and levy needs. And so I'm I'm excited about a pretty dashboard, but I had all the information already. And so let's continue to build that, but let's not forget about these large topics that we need to tackle. >> Director Carbone. >> Yeah. Go ahead, Brit. Did you want to say something? No, I just let's just finish this up then. >> Can something to say? >> Can Can I comment to to this? Um, >> so I agree, Paul, that we can't put the genie back in the bottle and that Carly, yes, Director Anderson, we have um been talking about this for months and and so I I go back to to to how we started as a board and we've been having these discussions since January and we're really not a whole lot further than we were then. I mean, we have information, but we still I mean, I think the problem here is that we're not efficiently processing this information and having efficient discussions where we're getting things done quickly. So, I agree. We need to get this information to the district. So, I want us to put a timeline on this discussion. Like, we need to have this dashboard and all of the things we want done on it by the end of August or it's we might as well just put it off till next year because at this point, like the district doesn't have time to do anything with it. Um, I I just want I just want to make sure that we do things in a timely manner and I'm I'm agreeing with you, but >> yeah. >> No, I I just want to say with regard to the dashboard, if I can. So, we we have um trying to scroll down here. Um, we've been working on this since the conversation started. Um, I think I shared in in my update to the board kind of the process we've been in here now for a little while. Um and we have um right now on our on our list of of key performance indicators and uh we've broken it down into leading and lagging uh indicators we have 144 um and that's by by looking at some of the things you've shared and then to director Cameron's statement around that the data is there and we're using that data. it's not consolidated in the manner that it would be more efficient and effective uh to the point of uh director Thompson and I think what the board wants. Um so we we will uh I think our next meeting is the 26th. So we'll we'll share based on what we have from the board the uh in the in the variety of areas that we have not just finance but we'll bring the other ones forward and we'll focus attention on that uh and I'm trying to create the dynamic end of this so that we have a quarterly business review that speaks to the uh the different areas that have been brought up and so that's finance HR teaching and learning student engagement and operations. I think that's been articulated multiple times. So we we have been building that uh and working on that for some time now. So I I think maybe we can just accelerate that part of the conversation. But the more strategic conversations are around the issues of of the boundaries. Uh so there's work continuing on that um that we've been doing. The long range facilities plan, vision 2035, what do we look like in 2035 and what are the things financially that are going to impact the school district? Um all these things are we're we're marching through those. have to get them on the agenda for presentation, but there's also all the logistical sides of that that have to be built in and um curated, if you will, and accurate information is brought to the board and to our our public around those those key and essential issues as we're trying to get ready for the start of school. So, we're doing these things. We're doing them as fast as we can. Um we're a lot further along than I think um has been articulated here. And part of the problem is we haven't walked up here and said these are the ones. And we will do that. We will just I will change the agenda with the permission of uh of the board chair and we'll accelerate our effort there to maybe bring forward what we have because we have done a lot of work in this area. >> Georgia Carbon. >> Yeah. Thank you, Superintendent Bowman. I think that's something not to lose track of. Um, if we go back and and in director uh Thompson's defense, uh, we we bring this back to I think it was February when um we saw Fastbridge scores and we saw MCA scores and um, a number of us asked the question, is is this true? Because if it's true, it doesn't look good. And the answer was, you can't really believe those numbers because they're not credible for a number of different reasons. Well, a number of different variables. So, we simply asked, so where's the data? Give us other data so that we can feel comfortable that students are achieving academically. That's how this whole conversation started way back in February. Director Thompson is simply at this point and and thank you Superintendent Bowman because back then I believe it was you and Tracy that said, "Okay, we'll put our arms around this. We'll put this together and bring it out." You know, and I don't remember the exact date, but we'll we'll bring it to you. And and Director Thompson is simply trying to get something. I know we've used the word pretty and and used the word um organized and a number of different words, but the reality is once we're fed all of this from Superintendent Bowman, I I think Tracy's working with you on this. Um it's got to be digestible and that's where uh uh Brian's going. So, I mean, all this makes sense and there's a flow to it even though it seems chaotic. But there is a flow to to getting to this point and getting this point moved forward. >> We're we're try I am trying to help the board or I apologize if I'm being pushy, but I I am trying to get us to a point where we're trying to coh codify these core sections so that when future board members come, they know what to ask for or they know what to look for. Because when we all started and maybe Brett and maybe Matt, you guys or and and Amber and and and Paul, you you may not have known what metrics to ask for or to even look at for HR or for student engagement. For someone who may not be that well knowledgeable in student or or the the education space, they may not know these kind of questions. So by codifying this, by having it in a single location, it allows us to be able to have one snapshot view of where we are, where we're moving to, and then as a board decide, do you feel those metrics or that baseline that where we are today is acceptable for you? And that's it. Like that's that's that's where I'm trying to get get us to. and and if and I I understand boundaries and other components are things that we need to do in parallel, but like we would be doing a disservice if we don't have something like this in place for future board members to not even know where to go and where to begin and where where to look at. And so that that's that's where I'm trying to get to us get us to >> I I don't think I I don't think any of us has ever disagreed with something like this in terms of interpreting data and have having better metrics. I think the point that some of us are trying to make is just we also need we have a lot of catchup on other things we have I would say neglected in the last several months. So, it's not I don't think anybody on this board has been like, I don't want to see a dashboard or I don't want to see metrics. It's just taken us an outrageously long time in my opinion to get to agreement on on this when what I hear from our superintendent is they are going to come forth with what they should be what they should think or what sorry it's getting late. What they think should be on this dashboard. And so I want us to consider that process that that's maybe where we should have started. And wait, >> but but you're disregarding the past six months. I I mean again it's >> you can't say >> I'm not saying what I'm trying to say is I think the inefficiency piece has resulted in us neglecting things we should have been doing. And we can be better with our efficiency. I think there are strategic ways to do that. And we need to we need to catch up on things we should have been doing is my point. I'm not none of us none of us is saying a dashboard shouldn't be present or metrics shouldn't be present. It's more we have responsibilities as a board that we've neglected. >> Yeah. All all the dashboard is is it's giving us a means to track student outcomes efficiently, right? And that's that's the goal for it, right? Um but I I don't think you can say that we've been I mean we've been slow in it to some extent because we had to figure out what's available right now. How is it collected? Is it is it reliable? Um I mean part of the issue and we've talked about this if we're looking for leading and uh indicators versus lagging indicators, you know, can we really rely on that data? You know, it's it's it's all congregated now at the the classroom level that we don't have access to. that's not in in uh infinite campus. But if we want to try track and truly see where you know our holes might be, our weaknesses might be for purposes of allocating resources that we need more data and it needs to be consistent too which is an issue. Um maybe not so much on elementary but more so on secondary. I mean we've we've spent hours you know talking with the district so I don't I don't feel like it's been wasted or necessarily Yeah. Maybe I would have liked some of the answers a lot faster than we got them or some of the proposals. Um, but we've been asking for months, right? Pushing those. >> Three weeks ago, I I sent the board a a dashboard draft with all the metrics from HR, academics, finance, operations, and I've shared that link to you guys. So, when you say we're going too slow, that's on U7 or U6. It's on U6. I've listed the draft and had it ready to go. did it take us to discuss one. >> Well, that right >> I know but >> but three weeks ago three weeks ago I made a motion to approve the nine metrics on the academics and you guys all approved it. So so like what's the delay is that you that the board is not improving. >> Can you just finish this? Like I like is there anything that like that anybody objects to? Cuz like I'm staring at it right now and I'm looking at it going, "Well, the the the step lane, you know, salary distribution grid is exactly what we were just talking about for an hour and a half." I mean, that's what we want. Everybody agrees. We just, >> you know, >> we also just said that it was nice to have Bill come up and talk about what he thinks is is important and we want to give Brenda that opportunity. So like that's >> so the delay is is on >> the delay is on the way we have operated throughout this whole time >> but again you can't you can't say that when weeks ago I asked okay the superintendent has requested we provide our goals and initiatives let's just prioritize we're going to vote and the board said no to that idea. So again, we're going with the consensus of the board, you know, that we're going to discuss all of these issues, right? I mean, we we tried to expedite it. Um, and again, I don't think it's bad discussions to have, right? I I don't and again, if we only focus on academics, I mean, that's our goal, right? Improve student academics and outcomes. Obviously, finance and these other things play a role in that, but that I mean, we could not have a a schoolboard handbook forever, and I'd be fine with it as long as we're getting the academics down. >> So, um, we still don't have schoolboard goals. We provided district initiatives basically. So, we we don't have schoolboard goals. Um, and in the dashboard, I would I would agree with Director Anderson, like I'm not I'm not blaming anybody on how long it's taken, but it's taken this long. And granted, it was just three weeks ago that he sent like kind of like a a model of it, I guess. So, yeah. Did you >> review it? >> Yeah, I did. >> All right. Is do you have anything that you want to say that you don't like on it? Do you Is there pieces that you don't like? So the it's not that I haven't seen the information, it's that >> I'm one person on a board of seven, right? And so I need to listen to his perspective and her perspective and everybody else's perspective until I can look at >> the thing and make a determination on it. Because here's what I feel has been happening. Like sometimes things just come to the board and then I feel like I'm saying things, but there's never a give and take. There's no cooperation. There's no collaboration. and we just go with whatever was presented. That's not good either because like there are other people here that have different perspectives. I think that we have strength in the fact that we all come from different backgrounds. I don't feel that that always happens. >> I understand and so I am not proposing that this has to be rushed the the dashboard has to be rushed through. So I'm fine having the board deliberate on the metrics that that are proposed as well as getting input input from district leaders. But then you need to look at yourself and you're the reason why it's being delayed. >> May I may I make a comment? Um I think the last 20 minutes has been a very cathartic experience for everybody. Um I think a lot of people got things off their chest maybe that they haven't said or wanted to say. But I think we need to bring this back around and I do think we need to get back on on on point. And if if we should end tonight right here and give a directive to HR and some of the other um areas to come next board meeting and do what Bill did and then coales around some of those things and put metrics that Brian's talking about to them. Um I I'm just going to make that as a suggestion. Yeah, we we still do have board goals, too, besides the district goals. Um I know when I requested everyone send in, you know, proposed board goals, I think I have about nine on there. So, I do want to circle back on that. I do think it's I think it'd be good just to end tonight and we'll come back and hit it strong next time. Um >> can I just go >> can I just ask one thing if we are going to have um Brenda come talk about HR? The other category I think we have is student engagement. So I don't know if we want someone from who the Mr. Bowman who you think would be best for that. >> I think we're going to do them all and uh you guys can debate what we bring to you. Um I think that would be at this point the most direct route to getting to our our next steps. I am very concerned about the other strategic issues and and um we have to get to them to everybody's made great points here. Um we're we're we're going to do what Bill did with all the areas and see where we can go with that if that's helpful. >> Can I sorry >> I think for me and Brian I appreciate you putting together the metrics. I mean, I feel like I've communicated like a similar type of plan in the past, right? I think for me, even the five categories that we've mentioned, academic, finance, HR, operations, and now student engagement, those are all Brian Thompson's ideas. We haven't talked about those five categories as a board, and I'm not opposed to the five. However, I remember at a work session, the student exper student engagement was something that superintendent Bowman even said, "Well, let's just stick to the four for now." And now we're all of a sudden back at the five that you have proposed, which is a good conversation to have, right? I'm interested also in how is our what does our community think? How are we measuring that? And we have data that could easily be put into a um dashboard for that. What are our parents thinking? What are our staff thinking? And maybe that's in the HR category, but I feel like the five categories have been decided by one board member and we're advancing a a dashboard because one board member has made this recommendation. And so I'm not opposed to those categories, but I wish it was a a a group conversation. >> I I I listed as a draft in the Excel document, and I'm 100% not opposed to other categories or other components. So I I am not trying to push this is what we need to have, but you need something to react to and here's something for you to react to and you're not reacting to it. >> In my opinion, it's the role of the board chair to present this and say we are going to consider um director Thompson's proposal tonight. What are your reactions to it? I'm not going to advance your proposal if if the board chair isn't interested in talking about it. So I wait for permission to engage in that conversation. Don't wait for >> Yeah. I mean, it's not my my goal to say this is I mean, again, >> yeah, it's fine. And it is a conversation, right? I think um Superintendent Bowman, you know, with the intent of providing some guidance, you know, laid out when we had our round table here, laid out, hey, these are the four areas I see, right? And I think Brian jumped from that and said, "Hey, here are here are some metrics to track." I'm not sure where student engagement. >> It came from a little bit I influence was from you because you that you wanted. So I'm like, "Let's throw throw in student engagement." Now, those are great metrics that we ought to know at at a district level. >> And again, the metrics the metrics don't necessarily need to mean we're going to set a goal on those things, right? Because we can't just set 30 goals for Superintendent Bowman and say go, right? But it doesn't mean that it's not good to track the data and see where we're at. Um because it all correlates to each other. So um yeah, and again with seven people I get everyone has a different idea on how this should be done. >> I make a motion to adjurnn. >> I'll second it. >> All in favor? >> I I Any opposed? >> All right, we're journed.