call to order the November 12, 2025 meeting of the Lakeville Area Schools. If everyone will please rise with me for the pledge of >> allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. We'll start with a roll call from my right. >> Amber Cameron. >> Paul Carbone. >> I'm Matt Swanson. >> Michael Bowman. >> Carly Anderson. >> Ryan Thompson. >> All right. Are there any requested changes to the agenda? If there are none, I'd entertain a motion to approve the agenda as drafted. >> Right. There's first by Director Cameron. Is there a second? >> I'll second. Being a first and a second motion to approve the agenda. All in favor say I. >> I. >> I. >> Any opposed? It is approved. Superintendent Bowman. The good news. >> Thank you. Um, first of all, I would like to say thank you to our voters. Thank you to many of you in the room that voted for our November 4th capital projects levy that was renewed for 10 years with a 69% success rate. >> Sure. [applause] as I've been uh sharing everywhere I can go all four 194 and I'm very very happy uh that we were able to uh move forward with this and I think it was a great team effort from all quarters of the district and beyond and so thank you. Uh I think the results show that the entire community here in Lakeville uh is committed to educational excellence and I couldn't be more grateful. Uh together I think we're ensuring that our students are equipped to succeed from now on through and past graduation. But I think uh it's better and more profoundly shared with everybody. I got a short video uh where we have folks that wanted to express their gratitude. So, if I could ask for your indulgence and if we could cue up a video. >> Thank you. >> Thank you for your support in voting yes. >> This levy funds the equipment we use in our STEM [music] classes. Thank you for helping us explore. Thank you for keeping our schools safe with upto-date [music] technology. This levy renewal is a direct investment in our future. Thank you for ensuring we have the career and technical education equipment that prepares us for college and the workforce. >> Thank you. [screaming] >> Thank you, Lakeville. >> Your support helps make sure our school is secure and all our student devices keep running smoothly. We're so thankful. >> We love using our technology to learn new things. We appreciate your support. Thank you. >> Thank you parents. Thank you. >> The funds from this love you renewal mean we [music] can continue using the most upto-date secure technology in our classrooms. Thank you for giving us the best tools to succeed. [music] >> Thank you. We appreciate your support. >> You're helping us prepare for college careers and beyond. Thank you for [music] helping us maintain our schools and power our futures. Like I said, they can say it way better than I ever can, but don't you just love that? We got to love that, right? Okay. [applause] Community Education Appreciation Week is November 10th through the 14th and we want to say that we are so very proud to celebrate our community community education staff for their lifelong dedication to learning and community connection. From early child care programs to adult enrichment and youth activities, they play a key and essential role in supporting our students, our families, and residents across our district. Thank you to each and every one of you who support and work in our community education uh program. We appreciate you and please keep up the good and hard work. Lakeville South girls volleyball team claims another state championship. Yeah, [applause] I'm going to go a little off script here uh and just say uh I'll tell you the details in a minute, but um winning a state championship is a big deal no matter what discipline that's in. But I will tell you, um this program is in rarified air for sure because they did it backto back two state championships and uh they set the bar very high. Um, Lakeville South High School girls volleyball team claimed the class 4A state championship. They defeated our neighbor Prior Lake 3 to nothing. So, they blanked them on Saturday, November 8th at Grand Casino Arena. Um, that's Excel Energy. I didn't know that till a few about two weeks ago. I was like, "Oh, okay." Um, does anybody here remember when it was a St. Paul Center? Anybody? Okay. Uh this marks their second consecutive state title. Congratulations on an incredible season. Go Lakeville South girls volleyball team. Lakeville seniors reach for the stars at Honeywell Leadership Challenge Academy on October 5th through the 10th. Lakeville South High School seniors Lillian Lounsbach and Lauren Filstrom along with Lakeville North senior Jennifer Wiltz recently had the opportunity to attend the Honeywell Leadership Challenge Academy held in the US Space and Rocket Center in Huntsville, Alabama. The week-long immersive leadership and STEM experience challenges students from around the world with workshops, model rocket building and coding and simulated astronaut experiences. So congratulations to our senior students who did that outstanding opportunity for them. [applause] And that concludes uh good news, Mr. Chair. >> All right. Thank you, Superintendent Bowman. Uh there is no one signed up for public comment this week. So we'll hop past that. Um move on to consideration approval of the consent agenda. I do have one note or reminder for the board. Um Director Cameron I believe explained this last week but we are going through on the policy committee uh an audit MSBA audit that was performed and using that as a guide to review and update our policies. Uh there are four policies that are on the consent agenda today. uh they're put on the consent agenda um as a first reading and for approval because only minor changes were made were made to each of these. I think it's changing board of education to school board and then including some new um citations or references cross references at the bottom of it. Uh we did not review them. The policy committee did not review them for the substance of the actual policies. Um once we complete the audit, we'll go back and and do that again. So, uh, just just for a little FYI because usually they're not on the consent agenda for a first reading, but that's why these ones are. So, with that, anyone like to remove anything from the consent agenda, or is there a motion to approve approve the consent agenda? >> A motion to approve. >> All right. There is a motion to approve it by Director Anderson. Is there a second? >> I'll second it. There's a >> second by Director Carbone. Any discussion? Director Thompson. Yeah, I I just want to clarify again based on what you shared about these four different policies that we are going to approve which is 402, 412, 601 and 603. And so you know the 402 and 412 seem reasonable. Again, obviously we did not we didn't make any changes to the content of the existing policies. There are some cross references that needed to be updated so that uh anyone who reads the policy uh has the ability to see uh you know the other policies that are related from uh to ensure that there's consistency and then also that um from a [clears throat] legal point of view an individual has the holistic picture of that policy and all the various various components that are associated with that. But policy 601 and 603 are two very very big important policies. And so while I want to be uh uh you know respectful of how we go through this process and ensuring that all of our per policies are current and have the the appropriate cross references, policy 601 is our school district curriculum and instructional goals and and and then 603 is how we how curriculum is developed. And so those are really big items. And so my hope is that we get to those uh together fairly soon. And so as a community member uh when they come back to these policies, they'll see the revision date of today. Uh but they won't understand the whole context of like, hey, like is there anything we're going to change or does the board at at this time agree with everything within that policy? So I just want to make sure that we're clear. This is primarily a vote for the minor changes, the cross references, and then the board is making a commitment to come back to 601 and 603 uh to further review. >> That's my understanding as well. Any other comments, Dr. Carbone? >> Yeah, I would just like to uh reinforce with uh what Director Thompson's saying. Um when you look at we have a reasonably new teaching and learning leader. Uh we have facilities that um Lucas, if I'm quoting you correctly, uh we're not looking at how many students we can fit in a building, but we need to look at what kinds of learning do we want to make possible. So you have a new TNL, you have that with facilities going forward, and these two, I agree, Brian, are extremely important because the three of those things are interrelated. And and if we don't have direction here for everybody, I I think we're uh we're missing uh we're creating a void. >> Any other comments? All right. With that, uh all in favor of approval of the consent agenda, um as drafted, say I. >> I. >> I. Any opposed? It is approved. On to our reports and discussions. Mr. Yoho. Yeah, I brought my Gatorade. Maybe a long one. So, we'll see. Can we go to the next slide? >> You might have the clicker right there in front. >> Oh, I have the clicker. Okay. Oh, see. Here we go. I just got to >> do the clicker. Okay. So, uh good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. director or chair Swanson, fellow directors, superintendent, uh Lucas Yoho here, executive director of operations. I'm going to provide you a brief on our facilities vision 2035 strategy. Um fortunately, you won't have to hear me the entire time. I will have Arte Artemis from World Architects here as well. And then I also have um Shelby from Ellers's financial advisory group to kind of help me with this brief. I also have in the group today our secondary principles and other key directors uh to listen in and support uh this brief. Okay. So here's the agenda for today. Really what we're doing is is we're going to have two major components to this brief to this strategy. one to give you the facts uh that inform both this strategy uh and the recommendations that you'll see towards the end of the brief tonight. We're not looking for any decisions. No decisions will be asked uh during this brief, but merely to receive the information, ask questions, and kind of absorb the material. And I'll kind of go over the detailed timeline uh here in a few slides. Okay. Okay. So, what we are asked to do here as a staff is develop a facility strategy for the next 10 years. I think that's important. Uh we're going to solve try and solve some immediate problems. But as you see some of the other things throughout the brief, just have uh a reminder that it's really encompasses the next 10 years as you see some of the items that we recommend um uh during this uh brief. And at the end of the day, uh, what we're really doing is trying to provide you, the school board, uh, and the community with the information required to make informed decisions about the future of, uh, facilities across the district. So, this group wasn't me. I am just the talking head, of course. Uh, it really consisted of, you know, 10 plus community members from across the district, uh, from, you know, secondary schools and and other community leaders. So, a great cross-section of our community to provide good input uh into one this strategy and then formulating the recommendations. We also had school leaders involved. So, our primarily our secondary school leaders, early education, ALC all providing experienced uh input uh one into the strategy into the recommendations you see here and then of course the district staff also participated in that. So really across six weeks, five meetings, a full house here in the oak room deliberating over the strategy and how best to uh set conditions for the future of the district in terms of facilities. Uh and then we also did various tours and walkabouts uh about the district to kind of get a firsthand uh understanding of the problem sets uh in our different buildings. So that was good and informative for our group. >> [clears throat and cough] >> Okay. So, just kind of to start off, this is obviously you know this is our all for 194 vision uh uh for the district uh and what we do. I would draw your attention to the second paragraph there. Safe, respectful, engaging, rigorous and collaborative learning environments. Part of that is our facilities. Uh so we took that to heart. uh when we see that uh and then also so when you look at our facilities vision is really nested into that uh and as a you know we use this statement uh to make sure that our facilities our strategy our recommendations if you will kind of align with not only the Lakeville area schools vision but also kind of the vision we have for the future of our facilities. Okay. So um at some point we are going to ask you for some decisions. Uh the first time that I would ask you for that we'll come on 9 December. What we would like is for you to concur with the facilities vision 2035 strategy uh and then approve phase one projects for execution. Those are solving uh those immediate problems that uh we've identified and made recommendations for. Uh so once you do that in some shape form or fashion that really informs um some decisions or approvals on 16 December uh really the MDE review and comment application. So that basically takes your uh nine December decisions formalizes that into an application uh for review by the MDE. Uh and we need to have that in before uh 23 December. Uh and then obviously if we're going to do projects that will require money uh and then you know adopt that resolution for May 12th. So you know doing a decision of some s shape form or fashion on 9 December kind of formalize what we need to put into those applications and then we'll approve that. We will ask for that approval as well uh on 16th December and that'll set conditions for um that submission on the 23rd of December and then follow on activities. So again, no decisions needed tonight. Okay. So as you kind of we I walk you through this brief again. I talked about a couple things we're going to do. We're going to set conditions, give you facts, the foundation of why we are here, and really, you know, what the what information we use to inform uh our recommendations for you, the school board. Uh so, as you go through this brief, three things I'd like you to keep in mind that the district community is growing, not only Lakeville, but all the other communities that we serve are also growing in some shape, form or fashion. And then of course you know that lends to increased enrollment uh and then we need to respond with that with appropriate infrastructure. We also know that great infrastructure needs to be modern, efficient and effect and effective so that we can you know help our students um and our staff get those expected learning outcomes uh that we desire here in our district. And then lastly, we can recognize or we have recognized our infra infrastructure is aging. Uh, but I will say it's in pretty good shape, but it does always need a continuous hand and help. Uh, it'll require modernization and expansion to meet the needs and expectations of our community. Okay. All right. Okay. So, planning timeline. So, this really I just kind of want to walk you through uh really the first four years of of critical steps and actions that we need to take. We're there at uh November 11th right here. right here today. Correction, nove or November 12th. Um, and so we're going to give you this brief uh, you know, request any additional information you need from us. Uh, so that you can come back on November 25th at the next board meeting. I will be up here again hopefully with uh, more precise information that you need to help you make an informed decision. Uh, so I would expect, you know, some some RFIs coming out of tonight and then through the next week. uh and then the staff can work on that so we can help you make an informed decision. Come on the 9th of November. Kind of in the interim, we're going to have Morris Leatherman do a community survey, much of what we did like last year. Uh and they also have some of these recommendations and this strategy to kind of you know uh ask the community what their thoughts are that and that'll be part of the information that you can use to make a decision. Come n no nine December. Morris Southern will come online in December and they will uh brief that community uh survey to you and then at that point we would ask for uh a vote on those requested decisions again 16 December review and comment application and so once we do that you know in terms of we'll you know we made a planning assumption here that you will approve that in some shape form or fashion that'll lead to a bond referendum vote in May of 26 that's the next available bond referendum or voting time that we can execute. Uh that will lead then once that's approved uh we will break ground in April of 27. In the interim we'll design spec bid those phase one projects. Breaking ground earliest is is April 27 uh to do that. And then again 17 months uh templated to have any initial uh middle school expansion efforts. Again, this is all assuming that it's been approved uh on August 2028 to kind of meet those those needs. So, very broad a little broad here in the outer years. Uh but that if you kind of focus on, you know, breaking ground in April of 2017 is really kind of critical because it takes that long to to make what we think are the right uh improvements uh for our middle schools, which you all know is our kind of our our media problem. Okay. [clears throat] All right. Okay. So, you know, when we talk about facilities growth planning, decision criteria, really what we mean is how do we know we need to grow or improve our facilities, but really four things come to mind and kind of help guide us into kind of making that decision and going into a planning process. Projected enrollment growth. you know, we have an increasing population both in the community and then with our students. Uh if we see our facilities conditions uh you know, decreasing, then we will need to do increased maintenance for that. If we have any changes in our learning models or outcomes, they need to support teaching and learning. For example, I know a few years ago we did some some improvements to our STEM spaces because we had some changes there and some modifications. So that's was kind of a cue for us to go through this process. Uh and then lastly, if we have any community needs and desires, uh so we take that community input and that'll kind of really really cue us to kind of go through this planning process. And as you know, projected enrollment growth is increasing. Uh we know our facilities uh always need some help. And so that's kind of kind of drove us to this uh process that you see here. Okay. All right. So common definition. So as we kind of talk in the next series of slides, I wanted to make sure we had some alignment on some common definitions. Uh so when we talk about capacity, when you hear the word capacity, we're talking about the number of students we can put into a building based on square footage and standard class size. So based on leadership from our training and learning on the district side, our principles and our key leaders in the schools, 32 is that number as it pertains to middle schools. Okay. So when we determine capacity for our middle schools, we use 32 as the number as part of that calculus uh to get to a final number uh for each of our middle schools. When we talk about occupancy, talk about number of students in the school, also known as enrollment. Okay, I kind of use occupancy because that's a building type term. So we also know from an industry standard uh industry benchmark [clears throat] if you will 85% occupancy is considered full. Okay. So when you start to see a building get to about 85% that's when our principles will start to feel the effects our teachers will start to feel the effects of having a school that that's that that is that full. Okay. Those spaces start to not be able to use as designed. Uh we can use one easy example, High View Elementary. Uh it is very full and we're not using those spaces at design. So 85% is really kind of where we start to feel the effects of that. So given all of that really what we did is we targeted you know our initial occupancy at approximately 80% of capacity. Okay. So when we are looking at spaces and we see a space that needs to get bigger well how much bigger does it need to get? Well when we have we say our initial occupancy needs to be be about 80% of the capacity of the building normally historically and you'll see this for our middle school specifically 80 to 85% is kind of where we normally have operated in the past decade. It's it's it's been the sweet spot, if you will. And so we kind of target 80% that gives us 5% room for growth, you know, so as we see unexpected enrollment uh in our different schools, that kind of gives us uh the ability to absorb some of that. All right. So, the other thing we did is we looked at school facility design criteria. What are the things that are going to inform us how we want our spaces to look? Um, I'm going to kind of just highlight a couple here. Again, I talked about the 80% space. Uh, we know that we want to make sure that we account for all our learning programs, whether it be STEM, special education, uh, our special programs, things like that. that we want to make sure that we're accounting for all them to the greatest extents possible. Kind of lends to a little bit of equity and fairness there. Want to make sure that our learning models are also accounted for how our teachers use those spaces and the best practices with that. We want to make sure our designs are are energy efficient, they're modern, and then also expandable, right? Because as you know, our enrollment may grow, we want to have the ability to quickly add on to those buildings whenever possible. Century Middle School is a good example of that. thought it was designed that way. So, you could add something to the end of that building fairly easily. The space is there. Uh we also know that we want uh uh our common spaces to be designed to accommodate school capacity. So, that's kind of a best [clears throat] practice getting out of the classrooms a little bit into those flexible learning spaces. Not all our schools have that, especially some of our middle schools. So, we want to expand that and make sure it's equitable among those middle schools, for example. Uh and then of course lastly but uh definitely not on the bottom is our fiscal responsibility. Um so we want to make sure that we are taking account you know the fiscal aspects of how we design our buildings and and making sure we're being good stewards of our resources uh that were given to us by the community. All right. All right. So some general facts here. Um, again, I'm not going to read through each of those, but we do know that the economy has slowed a little bit, but we are still growing here in Lakeville, and I'm going to show you some more detailed data uh that in a in a few slides. Uh, we know that there is a continuing need for early education opportunities kind of as I looked into past uh, you know, strategy efforts uh, you know, in years past, that's always seems to be a common trend is early education need. when we talk with our community members and they've given input, early education needs uh are definitely prevalent. I'll show some more detailed slides. Our our early education center currently has a waiting list. So all the indicators are there that we need additional early education opportunities. Uh same thing, we have a growing need for special education programming. A lot of our spaces are not really designed per se for special education. So whenever we can uh do that, we want to we want to make sure that those spaces are accommodating. We know that a activities and athletic programming is is highly valued here in the community. So what are we doing to make sure that that is accounted for? And then lastly uh and importantly is growth of infrastructure takes approximately three years to execute at a minimum just between your design, your planning, referendums, etc. So when you're going to make a decision, you're not going to feel the effects of that for three years. And I think we kind of demonstrated that in the beginning at the planning timeline. All right. So those [clears throat] some general facts there. Okay. So let's talk about facility maintenance uh and your facility condition index. So that is essentially you take the cost of everything to repair and replace all the deficient components whether it be carpet, uh, HVAC systems, parking lots, etc., etc. All those things need to be repaired and they need to be replaced on a what we call an industry standard timeline, right? We do get things that can last longer. our maintenance team. Shout out to the maintenance team. They do a great job extending the life of all of our equipment, but eventually we got to get it replaced, right? And then you divide that by the total cost of your replacement value of the facilities. It's kind of an industry standard uh ratio there. Um currently we're at 5.5% uh districtwide on our FCI. [snorts] Uh we made it a district standard of 6%. uh and then in the industry usually think you're looking pretty good at anything less than 10%. Okay, so we are doing well here but that is because we spend approximately $18 million a year in annual maintenance and upkeep, also known as the LTFM. Uh but also also knowing that it is a constant u it's a constant chase to keep up with that. And so what we've identified here is $85 million in high and urgent deferred maintenance over the next 10 years. So that's not necessarily right now because everything's based on replacement timelines and sometimes we can extend those timelines through good maintenance, preventative maintenance. Then we also know that delaying replacement increases risk for unexpected failure. And so we just got to kind of account for that and be judicious. But when we talk about factually here, high and urgent is $85 million. That figure will come important uh as we get down to the recommendations uh in a few slides. All right. So, we'll talk about early education, a growing need here. I know you got a great brief from Molly uh a few weeks ago. So, I just attempted to consolidate that uh down to a few pertinent uh facts here. Bottom line, they're really at 963 right now, but the takeaway is they're going to continue to grow through programming um and sort. And so, you'll see them probably grow, you know, towards 1100 by the end of the year. And we currently have 110 students on the waiting list. really an indicator that the need is there and this has been pretty consistent um over the years. Uh and that will also keep in mind that'll also kind of help inform our recommendation in terms of a potential new uh early education center. And then lastly, uh the click the building itself will undergo 4.5 million in maintenance and improvements uh this summer. again really to get after a lot of the heavy maintenance mechanical stuff in the background and then while we're in there we'll do some facelift to that facility as well. Okay. Okay. Um so pathways again current capacity uh is 75 students just based on the resources that we have available to us. uh currently at 48 students. Uh however, that tends to grow over the year as we get as um Margaret gets enrollments uh from the other schools. So, we don't per we purposely don't fill it up uh to start with uh because we know we're going to get some candidates in there to to attend that school. Ideal capacity given our current uh resources is 120. So she feels that she could you know given some additional facility space she could she could you know support 120 students. Uh key here and what I'd like to point out is that we are kind of teaching and learning is working to develop a refined strategy and vision for pathways. Um really we want that strategy and vision to come first and then facilities will uh support that right and then in terms of how do we wanna you know what what additional resource or what additional curriculum do we want to put in there how many students do we want to serve some things like that. So once teaching and learning kind of figures out what that vision and strategy looks like with Margaret then we can kind of really get precise in terms of what that facility might look like in the future. Okay. And as you all know, that is located currently in the basement of KTMS Kenwood Trail. Not really uh super ideal there. Margaret and her team does a great job with that uh making it work. Uh but of course, you know, not ideal. Um currently disconnected from those ideal resources. You know, some a lot of the STEM stuff, physical education spaces, you know, they don't have their own cafeteria, things of that nature. Uh a little bit disconnected. And then talking with the team, you know, high school is really kind of optimal solution to share resources. Would you like a its own facility? Yes, of course, that might be great, but you know, we also want to be good stewards of our resources. Um, and so kind of connecting it to a high school seems to be a common trend and and good solution uh perhaps for us. Okay. Okay. Safety and security. All right. So bottom line uh our schools are safe and secure. Um we built a highly robust safety and security infrastructure. Uh you know 2019 to 22 great system works well. So as we've used the system you know we kind of identify some new needs out there that could be cameras, card readers uh of sort. Uh and so we have these newly identified needs. However, you know, that bond is is currently been exhausted and so uh we have that uh problem, you know, in front of us. We do have an evolution of threats that require continuous improvements and then you know our existing systems continue to age so they're they're five six years old and so that will require some life cycle replacement across the next 10 years. So as you see that recommendation really we want to we want to you know fill those newly identified needs from our principles and our administrators. Uh we want to make sure that we're doing life cycle replacements and then any new technology that comes up. Uh you know, we you know, we're always out looking for new technology to to kind of help us make our our schools uh more safe and secure. And so that's kind of when you see that recommendation, just remember it's over 10 years and really to kind of help maintain uh and at the same time, you know, improve our safety and security uh apparatus. All right. Okay. So, um, here is leased property. I know this was brought up, uh, as a a request for some information. So, there is the property that is currently leased that affects our district office, this space here, community education, and then our maintenance facilities. Uh, so currently at 51,000 square feet. We did some analysis with the team over a couple working group sessions. you know, a as we look at our needs across the next 10 years and with the increased enrollment, the expansion, you know, of the district, we're going to need an additional 44,000 square feet for office space, community ed, and then maintenance. And then here, you know, looking at that 44,000, it looks like a double. You know, technically it's it's almost doubled there, but a lot of that space will be maintenance, uh, storage, maintenance facility types is a lot lower cost. So, that takes a bulk of that 44,000 square ft. I can tell you factually that we are out of space here at the district office. Uh so you know in terms of workstations getting the right number of workstations now and then also what we think we'll need across the next 10 years. Storage is always a problem for um our district office as well. Son, did you have a question? >> I did. Is this the annual rent for these different spaces? >> It is. >> And I assume it escalates every year. >> Yes. >> Okay. [sighs and gasps] >> Can I ask a question? >> Yep. Yeah. And Bill might you might be the person. I'm not sure. I feel like I heard at one point that lease spaces maybe not all of them are levied but um in perpetuity. >> True statement >> levied in perpetuity >> for a long time. >> Not all of these spaces are eligible for lease levy. Lease levy is only eligible to be used on classroom space. So for example our office our do space here. lease levy. That's just a direct general fun. >> Okay. >> So, just to clarify, what space would be eligible under the lease levy? >> The other spaces here. Um, well, the maintenance facility is not, but the community education is eligible for lease levy and along with this the classrooms across the hall that are part of community ed, they're also elig eligible for lease levy. >> Thanks, Bill. Okay. >> All right. So, we talk about enrollment projections here. So, as of 16 October, this is our current enrollment and what we project out in the out years. So, this model really is a combination that represents the best estimate possible with the available data. Douglas has combined a couple different models that have been the most accurate given uh the time period, right? And so as you look at 12,110, that's where we are right now. That's obviously very accurate because those are the kids that are in the classroom. So we know that. And as we go out into the out years, they become less and less accurate just because the variables are are are uncontrollable by us, right? So we don't know who is going to move into or out of uh the district space. Uh so becomes a challenge in the out years. Uh Douglas has done a good job using historical data and he is very very accurate in the near term but then as you get into the outy years it just becomes wider. So think of that more of a cone uh and less of a line uh as you get into the outy years. And it's something that he monitors uh I would say on the regular uh to make sure that we are accurate. And then what we also did uh for this effort is brought in a third party demographer and she did some data analysis currently still doing some data analysis but uh her her feedback aligns with this uh chart here. So, um, do using a thirdparty demographer to do that. Plus, uh, Douglas's models gives us a very accurate in the near-term prediction of where [snorts] our, um, enrollment will be. Okay. All right. So, now I'm going to kind of just break it down here by uh, by elementary and then secondary. So this really represents kind of the you know next level down of the line that you just saw. Um [clears throat] and then also knowing that you know just making remembering that this is the consolidated capacity and occupancy of all the schools at this level. We do know that across uh different schools are going to be at a different occupancy rate some higher extremely higher than others. Uh but I just wanted to provide a sense of where we are as a district and then how that will trend uh over time and you can see that our elementary uh capacity uh is pretty good right now. Um you know we do have some concentration problems that we're going to address in the near term uh future future project future presentation. Uh but overall uh elementary capacity is satisfactory at this point in time. [clears throat] Okay did that. Okay middle school. So this is become more and more a problem. We all know that green is good, red is bad, and amber is somewhere in between. I apologize why the colors came out red here, or the numbers. It should just be black. So, no, I think that's just a transition error. But at any rate, you can see here where we are 2025 to 26 and we're we're, you know, as a district, we're we're at that 85%, you know, mark, a little higher, and we continue to trend up. Uh we know that as we get into the fall of 2028 will be um you know the the high water mark if you will in terms of enrollment uh and then it'll kind of level off uh in the outy years with those out years of course again just like the consolidated model being a little bit less accurate but it's something that we continually monitor uh yeartoyear uh to make sure that we have good awareness of that. I put in there just as we you know I wanted you to kind of get a sense proposed design and build period you know if we were to do something uh you know kind of we're here at the fall of 2025 and then it's going to take three years um total from now so that you know the first time we would see something is about fall of of 2028. Okay. All right. So, high school um still green here, but as you see in the out years, so really starting 29 uh and 2030, we're getting into that red area. And really, when you look at that, you know, we saw previous slide in middle school a surge. That surge is going to follow itself through. They are fourth graders now and they will be ninth graders in 2030. So, that's kind of where you see that bump up. You also see uh some of that is from mig just your standard modeling uh migration. So you'll see some increases there. Again this is in the outy years. This is five years away. So you know accuracy is what it is and as we kind of continue to monitor this you know that number may shrink or or it may grow. Uh and then we just want to be able to be postured to respond to that and not respond too soon and obviously not too late. So right at the right time so we have the most accurate data and we can meet the needs at the right time you know. So in this case really that decision point comes about the fall of 2027 uh is really when we want to start looking at that and making kind of some future decisions about potentially you know high school expansion. And again the number may not be four you know 4321. It may be 45 or 4,000. Maybe we don't need to do anything. So really, can we wait to make any decisions? If we can wait, let's wait. Let's not build too soon or do something prematurely when we have the opportunity to do that. Okay. All right. So, what I did here is I just kind of took the a consolidated look at the last three slides. So, if you look in 2035, that would be the average number of students per school. So, you can just get a sense. Elementary looks as it is stands today will be fine. Uh but our middle schools and our high schools by 2035 if we don't take any action it's going to be a problem as the data we know today. Okay. All right. Okay. So that kind of brings us to the conclusion of kind of the facts around the district and the enrollment projections you know and so it's like well how do we know that those that data is is accurate? Okay. or it's you know uh we know that because when we start looking at population projections you know in all the cities and townships that that are part of the district we see there if you see the percent increase down there at the bottom our population is growing okay and that's where it's projected to grow out um in the out years. So, our population is growing. That matches with our projection for our student uh enrollment projections that are growing. Okay. And then does that equal housing? Right. And we also know that, you know, if you move into the district, you need a house. And we also know from, you know, good historical data that new houses equals new students. You know, some types of houses will equal more students than others. But nonetheless, you know, do we still see growth on the housing permit side? Yes, we do. You can see the actuals out there. And then you can see where, you know, we did some projections. U our our city doesn't really do a lot of projecting. So Douglas had to do this just based on the historical data. Uh I know 2025 412 is a little high. We're going to come in under that. I think it's going to be somewhere between two and 300, but we're still growing. Okay. Okay. And that that projection was pretty accurate um if you will uh with no other really good data sources. So again, here we are seeing an uptick in housing permits and I'm going to show you another slide to kind of reinforce that as well. Okay. And here are market conditions for Lakeville. Um I know this is kind of hard to see. Um but you can see the average cost of the house for Lakeville up there at the top. Home sold uh year to date. Uh, and then you know how long they've been on the market. Uh, so not very long. Um, and then you can see where Lakeville is growing significantly. Elco, it's a smaller community, but it is growing. And I'm going to show you another slide to kind of rein reinforce that as well in terms of the future. [clears throat] Okay. So, future housing development map. This is this is really key here. Uh you can see I have listed here 10 known housing developments. So we went out and we talked to the city planners in both Oakland New Market and Lakeville. They're our biggest representative uh cities, if you will, and and really just asked them, hey, what's out there? What is coming down uh in terms of building? Uh very positive news from Elco New Market. They're very excited. They are doing a lot of development down there. When you look at, you know, what do you need to kind of grow a city, there's really kind of four things you need. You need utilities. So, what we call the Musa line, a lot of folks that that'll perk some ears. You need utilities. Uh you need buyers. So, that's developers. So, you know, for example, Elanoo Market, they have the utilities in place. They have developers down there. We know that. We see that because they're actually building down there. And then our city planners can also confirm that they are buying land uh and and splitting that land up to develop it at some point. And then that land is is being sold by the the sellers. Uh generally wasn't the case uh a couple years ago. Uh a lot of our land owners were unwilling to sell at a reasonable rate. That has seemed to have since adjusted and so you'll see a lot of land being sold to a lot of uh developers out there. Uh and then lastly, what we probably don't have is a good economy that's going to spurn people to want to buy uh new houses and move south. But all the conditions are ripe down there in the southwest of our district. Uh and we'll continue to monitor that and and kind of adjust that as we see uh that develop. You have a question, sir? >> No. Oh, okay. Uh and then of course up to the northeast uh we have the same thing going on. Uh okay. We talked to Lakeville City planners. uh they pointed out these developments. Uh there's probably a few more out there in terms of land acquisitions. They don't quite have uh the Musa in place where they want it to be. Um and so that's kind of they're kind of missing that aspect. So if you look at Lenn's Spirit down there in the southwest, no Musa there yet, but they are actively planning to uh develop that land. up in the northeast there's still a little gap in the Musa but you can go outside HVE and you see houses actively being built right you know and so uh that that area is growing in the northeast as well uh so those are the two areas again another data point that kind of shows you the community is growing uh new houses equal new students um and that will kind of it kind of validates our you know enrollment projections And lastly, we'll continue to, you know, engage regularly with our city planners to make sure that that is remains accurate. Okay. Okay. Lastly, kind of another data point that you'll need to make decisions is a community survey. So, we kind of time the community survey from November 15th to December 1st. this brief is out there now uh in the community. Um the levy has passed so we got some support there. Uh so we're going to go ahead now and you know go out to the community and conduct that survey. Uh really just looking to assess public's awareness of facility needs. Uh we'll use some of the data here to kind of uh query the community to kind of get a sense of where they are uh with supporting you know an improvement and expansion of our facilities and then Morris Leatherman will be here on the 9th of December to present that to you uh to help you kind of inform your decision making. All right. Oh, I got to run the clutter here. Okay, facility advisory group purpose. And now we're going to start getting into the recommendation. So I gave you a lot of facts. I know there's still a couple more facts out there. That's going to be with Ellers, but I like saved that the best for last. Um, but the civility facilities advisory group purpose really to get input from the community for the district facility needs for the next 10 years. So they did a phenomenal job coming together. Uh again, various members um you know at various times, a couple consistent um community members, well quite a few actually. Uh they put in over 10 hours of their time to come and work through this process with us and provide some great insights into what they see in um their schools and what they would like to also see. not just with, you know, I've kind of, you know, talking about middle schools a lot, but we also taught districtwide and over the next 10 years. Uh, and they came to a pretty they came to a consensus on the the recommended list. I'm going to present that to you as they p as they so I did not switch the list around or anything like that. What they put down is number two is what it is here. So, just so you have that kind of perspective. uh again it's their recommendation kind of based on their uh knowledge and input you know and their needs and desires as well. Okay. So, all right. So, here it is. Okay. So, this is what we came to. So, how we work through this, we really did not talk cost at all. I did not want to have cost color the needs that the community uh thought was important. I wanted to know what was important subject of cost. I think that helped out a lot and and kind of really got into the needs of where the community uh wanted to go. [clears throat] I did reserve number one uh as middle school capacity uh because that's a mustdo. But past that, that's their list right there. Okay. Um so middle school capacity and equity among schools includes updated furniture. We're going to go through that in detail. I'm going to leave that to Artemis uh because she's a professional there. uh they thought the group thought physical safety and security improvements were very important based on that staff uh analysis that came to about $6 million over 10 years uh to make sure that we have the resources to ensure that our buildings remain safe and secure uh with the latest uh technology we talked about I talked about FCI upfront again number three making sure that our facilities are safe secure and warm um again over 10 years $85 million. That's not going to be part of the proposed bond referendum, but Ellers is going to kind of talk you through that a little bit and then Bill can talk you through that as well. But that's where we project would really help us keep that FCI down to where it needs to be. Lowers our risk for unexpected failure. And then in addition to, you know, the monies we spend every year now that'll help us with, you know, remodeling and upkeep and update of our our buildings across the district. Uh number four um was an early early learning center. So you know another an additional uh click if you will standalone facility. You know uh Molly did a great job working with Artemis in terms of hey what do we think that that initial footprint should look like 19 classrooms estimated at 620. And that's really historically kind of where we started off previously. And then obviously as we expanded the need or the need we kind of expanded Cle I think most of you have walked through uh that former elementary school. They use all the space uh for curriculum and and so you know kind of looking at that and how can we you know be good stewards of the resources we can make it expandable. uh we kind of have some land that we can use now. That's probably a good start point uh in terms of early uh childhood education. And that, you know, uh figure there is roughly $38 million. And then we said, hey, you know, furniture is obviously important. Our principles and all our building leaders furniture you wouldn't think is an issue, but it is an issue. we baked um the furniture into the middle school uh project and so kind of to get equity there. You know, let's uh let's spend an extra $8 million to get level set all of our elementary schools and and early childhood education uh for that. And we went through in detail to each school, each classroom, and that's the figure we came up with. We're working on high school stadium upgrades. So that seems to be a trend across, you know, all of our efforts here and has yet to be realized. Uh, but it continues to be an issue, a need from the community. Bathrooms really and concessions is what we're looking at. It's a bit more complicated. I didn't think bathrooms and concessions were uh a large lift, but apparently they are. Uh, and so Artemis and her team are working through that diligently. Uh, we'll have an updated number for you on the 25th of November uh for you. And then lastly on the performing arts center. So this one came in uh at the bottom, but I think it's important to recognize here, you know, this equity effort um to make sure that all of our middle schools and then all of our uh I'll just call it uh activities groups have a spot, another spot where they can and do that. And that's kind of a performing arts center uh standalone that we put in the district. They thought that was important as well uh in this initial phase. Okay, director Cameron. >> Oh, has a question. Um, a question on how was this list created in the sense um were these like options given to the committee or did they surface all these themselves and if so like what data was used to >> the data have you seen up to the point up to this point was the data that they saw? >> Okay. This is just wishes from their own experience >> and you know I presented a lot the staff presented all the data you've just seen as issues and concerns and hey is this something we think we need to address in the community yes or no and then we kind of went through really I want to say three you know iterations of deliberation on where this should be great discussion um and this is kind of where it landed and and I don't even think we I think high school the performing arts center for uh was kind of a I'll just call it a a new ad because I looked back in previous you know uh strategy efforts and and to see what we kind of talked about previously uh that I don't recall it being one. So we did have uh open discussion about what they thought should be in there. >> Okay. >> And you'll see some of that too in our middle school expansion recommendation. And then did we as a district match these with like our district priorities and our district metric goals >> to say like we we can only there's finite money, right? And we have we have goals. Do these align with the goals that we're trying to achieve? I >> I think they do. Okay. >> Um I absolutely think they do. We did not I deliberately did not put the cost in there until like the very last so once they decided on the list and I said I'd put the cost in there so they could see that. Um, and that will really, you know, kind of what I think is, uh, where the school board comes into play in terms of resources, like, okay, um, you know, Morris Leman's going to come back in the 9th of December. They're going to say, hey, this is where we think the tax tolerance of our community is, what they think we they they would support. It's going to be a number. Um, and then I think that's where you come in as a school board and say, "Okay, that's the number is going to be here. I'll do some additions and I'll draw the line and then we can we can bump that to the next phase or he said I don't want none of that. This is what we need it needs to be. But this is a recommendation uh from our our task force validated by our principles concurred by our principles especially as it pertains to the middle school. Uh we had the activities director in there special education uh all the groups in there represented in some shape form or fashion. Uh and this is what we came to. >> Okay. Director Thompson. >> Yeah, I I appreciate you uh having uh leading this facility advisory group. Um and I guess I'm kind of torn because you've got a list of of recommendations from 10 individuals. You've got um I'd love to see if there's a list that's different from what does the district want versus what does the community want. And so and is there an overlap or are they or is it the same? And then lastly, the survey that we're planning on doing, I think, did I read it correctly that we've got to make a decision on December 9th and then we're going to get the results on December 9th. >> Yep. >> Okay. And then also the kind of questions that the survey is going to ask. Will it be asking questions related to this is what phase one recommendation is, but what is like what do what kind of questions will be asked? Do you know? >> It'll be very similar to the 2024 survey. If you remember that to answer your question directly, yes, it will include some of these things. It'll include tax impact, tax tolerance, and what the where the community feels with that. So, it'll look a lot like the 2024 survey. [clears throat] >> Does that answer your question, sir? >> Well, for for the second one, yes. But the first question was around the facility advisory group. So this is uh this phase one recommendation is uh reviewed, agreed upon, blessed, approved by the district in addition to these individual. >> Yes, because the district staff was all part of that advisory group as well to include the principles. >> And just so everyone's clear, I mean there is a statutory requirement that you go through this process and engage the community and get do this kind of a practice. Correct. >> Uh I don't know if it's is it statutory? Yes, it is statutory. Yeah. So, I mean to both Director Cameron and Director Thompson's questions, were there other items that aren't on this list that the staff brought up? Teachers, principles? >> Yes. So, I got another slide. >> Okay. >> Um, so here is how we did phase two and phase three recommendations. This is the com. So, this is the complete list. Um, and so when you look at phase two and how it it almost naturally came out this way in terms of of how we bucketed these things, they they recognized and and we've demonstrated that kind of the middle school was the immediate need based on all the data you previously saw and based on their own experiences. And then when we started looking at high schools, we really didn't address, we know we'll need to address high school capacity in some fashion, but they also talked about, well, where is where do we do Lakeville Pathways Academy and and you know, that initially was in phase one, right? And then some of the other things were in phase one. But what they recognized and and you know the the principles the high school principles brought up was like hey let's let's do this all together and so we don't have for example you know building continuously at the high schools in some shape form or fashion over many many years. Let's bucketed this so we can kind of do it in chunks and we could minimize the impact to learning uh in those particular spaces. So, this kind of got bucketed into, you know, what I'll just I call the the second phase. Uh, and then the third phase, relocate lease spaces. Uh, we didn't get a lot of love there. Um, but that's where it came out in the third phase. And, you know, and then talking about how we are being good stewards of resources and making sure we do what we need, uh, versus, uh, kind of, you know, trying to do everything at one time. Does that answer your question, sir? >> Yeah. I'm Does this encompass everything that was brought up? >> Yes. >> Okay. Don, >> director Thompson. >> So So this is my first reaction by looking at this phase one, two, and three. So this is I appreciate the the comments, the feedback that folks have shared in this advisory group. I I guess I guess my question is more of where when does the board provide input on what we think also is the the direction that we want our district our district to go for the next you know 10 10 years or so. I mean when we think about the the uh the profile of a graduate things have changed so dramatically over the past like two three years with the advancement of AI and technology and so I I'm just in 10 years I don't even know what these students are going to need to know or or or learn and I just think of the the facility design concepts uh from 1990s to 2000s to whatever it may be. Is that the same concept that we need to look uh use as we think about what this future vision is or do we need to revamp what that looks like because then that may play a part in what our facilities design ought to be like for the future. And so I understand the immediate need for the middle school expansion, but for all the other components that are on this list, uh, you know, the first thing that comes off the top of my head is just from a from a tech center for Lakeville, do we do we want to consider a designated technology center uh for trades, for for STEM, for AI technology training? like like our kids, they've got to make we've got to make sure that beyond just education, they've like are we are we positioning our district's uh curriculum in a way so that uh you know they've got a right pathway forward, but then then the buildings and the facilities need to be designed around that future student in 10 years. So I that's just my two cents right now, but I just want to make sure that we have a chance and I don't know when that when it's the appropriate form to talk about what do we want to see on this list as well in addition to what we're seeing from uh advisory from the advisory group and from the administration. >> Director Anderson. >> Yeah, I do want to be thoughtful of the fact that you still have more to present. >> Yes. >> But I got all night and I got the Gatorade. So I'll I'll be up here. >> We're all ready for the long haul. Um I think I am having some immediate reactions. Um and I want to think about this from the lens of how do we be strategic across everyone um in terms of what the priorities for the district are overall. Um, and so the phase I mean I I'm with Director Thompson in that there's a obviously a very immediate need with the middle schools and we've [clears throat] been hearing time and again about early childhood and so that makes sense that there's an immediate need there and it does feel like the um Pathways was never a great option. Well, I shouldn't say never. It was it was the best option we had at the time that we had it and so I can see where that would be more of a priority. Um phase two to me is very much wants otherwise and kind of um perpetuates this idea that people have in Lakeville that when we go or in our district when we when they say things like our schools are so pretty and we have all these issues underneath. And so I'm not super excited to hear about some of these things that I think are more wants when we have the potential to potentially or the potential to let's say do something big and change uh class sizes, reduce class sizes, which would be um a big way to get us moving toward our goals of the metrics like in terms of improving how our students are doing. And so are there ways that we can do multiple multiple things like the pathways early childhood um a different I mean if we were to reduce class sizes for instance would we need more space than we're even talking about? So I think my concern is if we go for a bond like depending on what that information that we get from the survey um we might have our community saying yes this is how much we're willing to tolerate tax-wise I don't think to me that means we put it all in then facilities like we have to be thinking about potentially an operating levy or something else that would maybe meet needs across departments. >> Absolutely. Director Baker. [clears throat] >> Uh, so I I agree with uh what Director Anderson stated as far as equity goes. Um, when I think about the budget cuts that we made sitting at this table uh not more than two years ago, um, we were talking about the different departments that lost um, staffing. Uh, some of those were LEAF staff. Uh some of those were um cuts within uh just our departments in general and I think about the LEAF staff provided tutoring within our buildings and those are things that we haven't brought back yet. Um and that's important for student development too. So across departments I I hear you on that too. Um when I think about trying to make those cuts as equitable as possible, we did the best we could at the time with having to make $7 million worth of cuts. Uh but when I think about um equity within our students, um our ALC campus gave up their entire building to give the district $1 million to to to uh help with those budget cuts. And um when I see that we are upgrading stadiums and bathrooms and performing arts centers and we have a whole student population that is in the basement of a building, um I find that hard to swallow. I um also I I think about, you know, um and I know I asked this at one of the facilities meetings, like what could we use that space for in Kenwood that um that our current ALC students sit in? Um and I was given the answer, we don't really want to use that space because it's not really good for student use, but yet we're leaving students there. Um I I think that speaks to something that that then that shouldn't happen. like then that should be a higher priority than putting it off to phase two. And one of the things that several members of the of this board during those budget cuts stated was that um when we made that cut for the ALC campus and and they lost their building that it would not be put on the back burner again because this will be at least the third time that it's been bumped out five years. Um, granted they were in a building before, but again on our long-term facility plan seven years ago, it got bumped out five years again and now we're doing it again. Um, so I just want to think about that when we're trying to prioritize what the needs are here with also like equity across departments, thinking not just buildings, but also thinking about the things that we cut before and bringing back some things that would make a more high quality education for our students. uh like the French classes that were cut at the middle and middle level, sign language classes, like there were lots of curricular things that were cut too. Um so anyway, I I voiced the same concerns as they do, but we'll let you go on with your presentation. >> Okay, >> just one, >> Director Thompson. >> And just one last comment and uh I think we have to be [snorts] uh mindful that these are probably two different funding sources like adding French is going to warrant an operating levy. So we need more resources for that or funding for that. Uh this is a bond where we can build something. And so so when we think about building something, what is that something that's going to be the most impactful for our students for academic achievement or just you know uh lifelong readiness and you know whether it be I'm I'm just I'm a huge fan of having a tech center like whether it be a corporate office where you've got a floor dedicated for you know pathways a floor dedicated for STEM a floor dedicated for technology district office can sit there I I don't know but these are like we I think we need to have conversations like that and and I appreciate this as something to react to. Uh but we have to think of what kind of infrastructure building needs do we need uh for the next 10 years and and but but before we get there we probably need to think about where do we where do we want what do we want our students to learn what do we need them to be prepared for and then do we have the infrastructure for them to learn that in that place so go ahead >> can I just add one thing I mean I think that's what these are recommendations but I mean if we want to prioritize something else and bring it up to phase one We can do that. I think we're going to have multiple meetings after this one. Um, and then we'll have the RFI like how much does it cost? What are our options for pulling the ALC up now versus in three years or >> you know some multi-purpose space that we can use um for a tech center or whatever it is. And maybe that's part of a different project. But yeah, again it so if you guys have questions we'll hammer him at the end and so he come back with more information. I wait baited anticipation. Um so but I to answer your question directors um I will we got a staff recommendation and kind of a timeline a lot to what you speak about and kind of where we think some of our our decisions should be. So I think that'll help kind of shape your future discussions for timing uh again and prioritization. But I wanted to be um transparent. the advisory group worked pretty hard on this and so it was my uh I gave them my word I would put that list in front of you uh without changing it and so that's what I did. Um but I appreciate those comments. Um, okay. So, now what we're going to do, if there's nothing else from me, I'm going to bring up Artemis here, uh, to come up and she's going to talk through really kind of dig a little bit into the capacity for you so we kind of understand how you got to those numbers, uh, just a little bit more. Um, and then she's going to go through the middle school options that we developed to really solve the immediate need and the mustdo. So that's where we focused our effort. And again, this wasn't Artemis doing it on her own. Uh it was several walkabouts through the middle schools with our staff um and our you know from special ed staff uh to principles and then we did a walkabout with um our advisory committee uh with the middle schools and then you know she presented some options and and it was moving the Lego box blocks around to to make sure that it was equitable, fair and you know got the thumbs up from our principles uh in terms of a feasible course of action. And so we're going to let her go and I'm going to be quiet and drink my Gatorade because I need it. >> That's right. I brought I brought my own water. >> You can run the clicker if you want or you want me to run the clicker? >> I I got it. Thank you. >> I brought my own water source. So there we go. It's my turn now. Thank you for having me. My name is Artemis once again and I'm going to dive into just a little bit deeper that priority one which was identified by a severe need by the district of capacity. So the um and equity between the existing middle schools. Um so identifying what those needs were both from a capacity standpoint but also through our walkabouts as Lucas said uh the needs that are um relevant between those uh between all middle schools. So let's keep going. I'm going to dive into specifics for capacity. So capacity is the ability of a school facility to house K12 students and it quantifies how many students can exist within that school and sets a standard for functioning that school to to have anticipated programs. So a change of space can change that capacity. So if you if you have a general classroom for example and you change it that holds 32 students in this example and you have the need for a special education resource room um the number of students for a special education resource room is lower and so if you switch uh flip the use of that classroom you also change the capacity of your school um room assignments vary from year to year capacity changes from year to year, but an average number of students is fundamental component to that calculation and has a large impact. Um, as Lucas had reviewed, 32 students per classroom is the average that we have been utilizing to calculate capacity for the district. Um, we're going to go through uh how capacity has been calculated with very simple diagrams. We'll start with elementary school just because it is easier to understand and then we'll move into the uh middle school capacity. So here you can see a four room elementary school. It has two classrooms that um elementary school students right in the way that they function within an elementary school will either exist within that classroom or they travel to a special either art or music. And so where we have dots are where we calculate student capacity. So two classrooms and two specials is a 25 students times that two classrooms is a stu 50 student capacity for a four room schoolhouse. Now if we move into a four room schoolhouse for a middle school model um classrooms are utilized a little bit different. They are scheduled in this case students are scheduled in a middle school model in Lakeville. So they have each classroom has six periods of each day that it is occupied by students and two periods where it is a a study session for teachers. um four classrooms so will be utilized six of eight periods times that 32 students per classroom is 128 gross capacity but however because that room is only being utilized six out of the eight periods that is 75%. So then you multiply that by a 75% efficiency factor for a total of 96 students net capacity. Um we take this method and apply it to your full middle schools. So each each classroom or each teaching station essentially that is 32 students receives a DOT. Um any classroom that does not is not utilized to its fullest capacity has is an open dot. It's an open classroom available for students to go into. And then student uh center-based special education programs typically have students that are housed within those um classrooms for uh pretty much a full day and um but have a lower capacity. So average uh capacity or four center-based special education programs is 10 students and there are two in in century middle school which is the example here there are two center-based classrooms. So each one of the middle schools trends just above a thousand students. So Century is 1,071, Kenwood is 1,054 students and Maguire Middle School is 1,086 students. Any questions up to this point? All right, great. So, uh, Lucas had shown a an a line graph that of the same information, but it is the uh capacity of your schools, uh, middle schools. This is all three middle schools. Um of 3211 is showing the historical percentage full for the middle schools between 2007 and 2024 ve kind of varying between 80 and 85% full. That is how how the middle schools have been occupied for the last 15 years. Um now there is a an enrollment uh increase uh that has been felt in your fourth grade class and we are starting to bump up against that 90% 85% 90% full that starts to create some uh issues in the way that buildings are utilized. So the projected enrollment numbers that we are utilizing here are the highest most uh conservative uh numbers from the third party uh uh dem demographer. So just an FYI. All right. So now that we have admired the problem, understood what our capacity of our middle schools are, we in order to get that number that 90% back down to that 80% capa uh capacity full that is the goal for the district. Um about s space for about 650 students needs to be added to the schools. So there are because we have a team model or middle school model we have to work with these blocks of students. So in a middle school model it's based on teaching a core teaching classes. Um and that is five stations times the 30 32 students and 75% is 120 student block. And so ideally you are working um with your capacity of 120 student block. Um then you would have your sixth, seventh, and eighth grades plus the wheels, the specials, arts, facts, STEM, and special ed classrooms. Um four, fifth, sixth, and or sixth, seventh, and eighth grades, excuse me. The required wheel stations is additional stations would be six. um you would have uh 15 teaching stations required for a 21 additional teaching stations if you were to add a full grade to any one of the middle schools. So the there have been uh identified two options for by the um by the task force that I have am presenting to you today to consider that [clears throat] address uh in a fiscal way uh the both the capacity and equitable and appropriate teaching station in investments at the middle schools. Option one is to create a split team uh addition onto Century Middle School that would have a house that would be sixth and seventh, a second house of seventh and eighth plus the associated special or wheel classrooms and investments for equity. Kenwood Trail would not need any capacity additions or we are not proposing any capacity additions because it is in the center um of the district from a location standpoint. So me many of the uh developments in the district were at the north uh east of the district and the southwest of the district. That is why Century and Maguire were selected for capacity additions where Kenwood um has only been selected for those equity >> [clears throat] >> uh investments. Uh that same addition for capacity would be added onto Meuire with split team and wheels for a ad of 672 which is about a right size for um the necessary students to get to that 80 85% capacity full. >> Just ask just to make sure I'm very clear. So we're not proposing on option one to add any classroom space at Kenwood. no capacity classroom space. So there are classrooms added but it is only to create equity. All right, sounds good. So to dive a little bit deeper into the how that might look on Century Middle uh all three middle schools actually the needs addressed would be the capacity. So the large classrooms classroom addition on the north east of the site would address that capacity. the with capacity, you need to address additional cafeteria and core spaces um like the cafeteria and kitchen expansions that we're showing as well as uh the wheels. So, FIAD, additional locker rooms for the additional students, music, art, Spanish, and STEM. And then any additional administration spaces that would be required for the additional students. Um, this would also include uh uh center-based DCD programs uh that needed to have appropriate teaching spaces and proper access to toileting. So, right now um these programs suffer from either having to um borrow a group toilet if you're on the main level or on the upper level, travel through um couple spaces to access an appropriate toilet. that would be resolved within this plan and then uh updated furniture as well. That is the second level at Kenwood Middle School. Kenwood Trail Middle School. Again, the these would all be equitybased investments. So right now the gymnasium they only have one gymnasium and four classes at one time can be taught in that gymn gymnasium which creates safety issues. Um and so we are proposing an additional two-station gym to help address that deficiency. Um there are the kitchen and servery is particularly deficient and can only accommodate two serving lines within their actual servery. Um where they need to accommodate four um and so we are proposing an addition and remodel of their existing servery and then locker rooms to address uh existing locker deficiency. So they don't have a enough lockers. Um, Kim, to your point, if the ALC moved out, it would be a great place to place lockers, but in this plan, uh, we've left that flexibility. All right. And then resolution of small teaching spaces as well. So, the existing fax room is taught in a very small space. Their DCD centerbased classroom is deficient in space as well as their media arts. And so, space would be provided for those programs. and then parking to address city ordinance parking count deficiencies um and creating additional tennis courts to create equity between the middle schools and then updated furniture. So this is the main and upper level additions too. And then at Meuire we would again be adding capacity. So large uh classroom addition would be addressing the capacity. The cafeteria and kitchen expansion. So the cafeteria in Meuire is is bound by other classrooms. We would be proposing expanding into the existing metal shop to expand that cafeteria out and then replacing the metal shop kind of across the hallway from the wood shop with an addition. [clears throat] There are also quite a few of small classrooms within Meuire. And so the south classroom additions would be not for new capacity but actually to accommodate the loss of capacity within that uh remodels of the existing classrooms where we would take three classrooms that would be very small make them into two uh adequate classrooms but that would you would be losing capacity um through that and then um as I'm sure all of you know it's a challenging site so investing in additional parking to uh address city ordinance parking count deficiencies, but also to um understand and split up your bus uh traffic from parent traffic for JFK and try and and resolve some of the traffic uh deficiencies and site um safety issues on this site. And then updated furniture All right. And that would be a two classroom add two two floor classroom edition as well. Any questions on option one? >> Yes. >> So that >> with option one at 80% capacity obviously two medals are going to be a lot higher in student enrollment. What approximately what are those numbers or did I miss that slide? the Yep. If we go back, >> right? >> Yep. That's right. >> But then Kenwood would be >> about a 1400. You'll have two,400. >> That's max capacity, right? >> Max. >> So, I'm curious what the 80%. I mean, I guess I can do the math in my head, but what is And then Kenwood was would be at 80% as well. >> And Kenwood would as Okay. >> Yep. [clears throat] >> All right. So, we'll move on to option two. So the difference between option one and option two really is that capac is how much capacity you are um accommodating for the future within the middle schools. So in this option we are proposing a full sixth seventh and eighth grade edition to century middle school in lie of the two house editions that were split grades. Um and then just this [clears throat] the same addition of the split grade uh level additions onto uh Maguire. The investments in Kenwood would not change. This would give you an additional 6 840 student capacity. So just a little bit more a little bit more um flexibility in accommodating future enrollment. Uh as you can see in this diagram, nothing has changed except for the size of the classroom addition on the norththeast. All right. So this kind of gets to your question, Amber. The option number one for the lower capacity builds the capacity range for the next 10 years to be between 78 and 84% building capacity. So that lands you within the same operating range that you have operated within the last 15 years, but it is it's still pushing up against that 80 85% capacity. Option two leaves a little bit more space, right? It's between 75 and 80% building capacity. um which is below that that 80% of uh kind of general average that we're trying to hit um but also [clears throat] leaves a little bit more room for enrollment projections and expansion. >> Director Thompson. >> Yeah. Yeah. Uh, when I'm looking at the middle school projections for the next 10 years, it it looks like we're only I don't want to say only, but there seems to be kind of a bump that goes up to two to about 250ish or students. Yeah. >> Uh, but it really just kind of stays stagnant for the next 10 years thereafter. Now, again, we don't know. There's more growth coming. There's more whatever. But what we c what we do know is that we've got 250 more students coming in no matter what. That's not an option. Like, they're coming. And so we've got to decide um how do we accommodate those 250 additional students uh and and then whatever fluctuates over the next couple uh the next few years. Uh what is the cost for option one and option two? And I and I just look at option one and we're sitting at 80% capacity. Uh obviously we're much higher right now today. So we have a little bit of give. Uh and then obviously going to option two gives us much more protection in potential growth over the next 10 years. But if the cost for option two is close to the cost of a new building, like does it make sense because we've got so many kids that that are probably going to be coming from the southwest of Lakeville. Uh and we've got kids that are probably at Elco New Market that we could potentially draw back to our community. There's uh are we are we solving this with a band-aid or do we really need to think about does a new building make sense? Now again, this this is shooting from the hip. There's a lot more we've got to talk through, but what is the cost for option one and option two? And what's the cost of a new building? >> Okay, so option one, I think, is like at 130. I got a slide on this and option three or two is 139. So you're talking about a nine and change difference between the two options. Now, if you want to talk about a fourth middle school, the fourth middle school you're going to talk at $136 million, but that does not in include so 1367 for a new building, just the school, a generic, 1100 person, 100 student school. You got to buy land at probably about seven million because you need 60 acres to do that. Now that just gets you,00 more students in your in the district for capacity. It does not solve any of the equity issues in the other three [clears throat] schools. A big point of contention with the advisory group was making sure that we are equitable to the greatest extent possible amongst the three uh middle schools. And that's also part of our design criteria. If you want to do it all, we can do that. And so then you add another 53 million in equity costs just just equity things, not capacity in the three middle schools. And then, you know, I forgot to add on the land. Land is actually you got to add additional 8 million for development. So you're looking in excess of 28 million just to solve priority number one. Um, so it does solve your problem. What I would offer to you, sir, is when we look at long-term, we truly don't know. And you made a great observation in terms of the southwest of of southwest of our district. We don't truly know if we burn a lot of our tax tolerance on $28 million. Now, that takes away a little bit of flexibility in the out years because now we're going to have to bond again for another school that would probably be close to probably two uh probably close to $200 million. So, >> Lucas, Lucas, >> Yes, sir. >> You got to get to the mic. >> Oh, sorry. So, I would um So, now you Okay. So, so the answer to that is certainly u but we don't really know what's going on in the southwest of so it could be a k a new elementary school it could be a k8 so I want to create as much flexibility in the future and I'll talk about decision points kind of towards the end to your point solve the problem now and things like that and so uh the short answer is we looked at that but given how it would probably remove some of our flexibility ility with the community. We want to reserve that and then when we do need to make a decision about expanding, we can make the right type of building in the right location. Is it the southwest? Is the northeast? I don't know that. But it's probably going to be one of those two locations. And I think if we had wait on something like that, we'd probably garner a little bit more support from our community knowing we're being good stewards of our resources and making the decision when we need to make the decision. Building just enough capacity. These two options in my mind based on the data we know now will solve our middle school problem in the greater I'll call it the Lakeville area. And then as Elco New Market potentially grows, for example, then maybe there's something there. but we don't need to make that decision. We don't need to um use community funds at this point until we have better fidelity with our data. So that's kind of where you know my thought process is and the thought process with the staff and I'll go over a little bit more kind of towards the end uh of the presentation. >> You have another question? >> Yeah, I think it's just more of an OB just more of a statement of like yeah I get that and I and that totally make it. So, thank you for sharing the numbers 160 plus 53 million and and we can kind of talk through that 53 million as well because I I'm a big believer that every middle school should be the same as any other middle school. Like McDonald's is a McDonald's is McDonald's. Uh but uh uh the more I think about this, it's like we're I feel a little rushed. Uh I'm getting this presentation. I got to make a decision by December 9th for forund pretty much $150 million. And so that that's kind of where I'm sitting at right now. Um I I'm hesitant on and I'm hesitant with you guys like is this is this something where uh because I think I saw on on uh Yisetta past like $500 million in in a bond for like like setting the direction for their school district and and that they're adding a new elementary school, middle school, high school, XYZ. Now again, we've got tax tolerance that we've got to consider. I we still need to look at the numbers and so forth, but is it is it worth time exploring? What would be the big bang? Like here's everything and we're set for the next 10 years from an infrastructure point of view or are we going to peacemail these things incrementally uh knowing that um you know our our community has generally a point of view on how much they want to spend. Uh, and so, all right, that's where my head's at right now, but I'll I'll let you go ahead and continue. Thank you. >> Yeah, I mean, I appreciate that because it would I mean, a new middle school would solve some of the equity issues, too, and then provide opportunities for smaller class sizes. Granted, additional costs come along with that as well. >> Yeah. And then we do have the the question of are we going to continue to grow um because we don't want to run into a situation where we have too many buildings and not enough students. But Director Anderson, >> can I just ask a clarifying question? I do we want to let you get done, but so sorry to interrupt you again, but um with this so it does seem like the first model is not or the first option is not really addressing the problem if we experience some unexpected growth like has happened with how we had to build another elementary school, right? So um in terms of the second option with so 500 students would go to Century and 300 would go to Maguire >> and so how does that work with our feeder system in terms of who goes do all those 500 students go to North >> Okay. Do you want me to I don't know, sir. I'm >> Oh, sorry. I'm just >> Are we creating more of a split in the middle in century now or like what does this mean for a feeder system? >> So, once you make a decision on how you want to build capacity, then that will be that'll inform the attendance area um planning effort. >> Have to do boundary changes in >> addition to whatever we're doing now, >> right? So it it'll make a difference if it's, you know, 300 versus 500. It'll absolutely make it and I don't know what that is now. And so we're going to start doing that, but that's kind of where we're, you know, that's why they're kind of at the middle school level. They're this effort is loosely tied to the attendance areas for the middle school. Once you determine where you're you want your capacity, then I will we will make recommendations to adjust the attendance areas. >> That would mean Sentry would have 15. So it would kind of be the flip of right like century would become >> all all three could be going to different schools. You're like this is you're a Lakeville student. >> Okay. >> Director Baker and then Director Cameron. >> So I was um I'm a couple slides ahead of of you. Okay. I just wanted to um I I agree that um I feel like we've we've been very cautious in how we've done things over the years so that we're only asking for what we need from our community so that they don't have this big way that a size um tax ask right now to just meet the needs of where we're at. So, I understand what you're saying. Um, but I also know that there's a tax toler tax tolerance with that and also um just thinking about um in in uh conjunction with the levies that we already have that will need to be renewed and keeping that in mind that the timeline for when we ask for this and then if we have to come back and ask for like an operating levy to open the building and and different things like that. There's also other levies that we'll have to either renew as a board or go to the community and ask them to renew because otherwise that's going to bounce us down again. So, that's something to keep in mind. My question was um specifically to Superintendent Bowman because I know that you attend um some of the city council meetings and uh work with the city a little bit more closely on some of those um proposals for for building. Um when I looked at the slides like some of them were for sure like approved and then there were a bunch that were still um proposed that had not been approved yet. Um is there do you have any thoughts about those like is or do you think those are going to go through? Because I I think like our city council and our school district should be working in conjunction whereas we can go back to the city and say, "Hey, cool it because we can't even afford to to keep continue to build schools to keep up with the amount of houses that are being being built." Like I I think that's we're all a part of the same community and we need to be working together and I do know that Superintendent Bowman does spend a lot of time. So I'm just curious, Superintendent, what your thoughts are around that. Yeah. So, I do work with Justin Miller, our city administrator. Um, there is the Lakeville Thrive 2040 uh land use plan. Um, and that is a a document that uh lays out what the city's intentions are uh with regard to growth in in Lakeville. So, I do have our staff and Lucas and team uh are plugged into the planners at uh both the city of Lakeville and Elco New Market. Um you did see some charts in here. Um that was done in partnership. Uh obviously they're giving us information uh that we we need. Uh I I think the biggest driver of accelerant to uh growth that is not already charted here is economic upturn. Um and I I say that because that's what I have witnessed uh in my 20 years living in Lakeville uh and looking back a little bit of history in the 90s. That seems to be the driver. Um they are doing all the condition setting that Lucas shared with regard to permitting. Uh we know that the growth points are northeast and southwest. Uh all of that is derived from uh being in touch with and and tied to city and city planners on what they're intending to do. Um, so we are as tied into that as we possibly can be. uh and making sure that we're looking at enrollment as granularly as we possibly can because and I think director Thompson's uh question is a is probably a strategic and phil philosophical question about how does this school board as a governance entity want to approach the growth that we don't get to drive as a as a school board or as a superintendent. I don't get to drive it, but I better be looking at it and planning deep. Uh, and to me, that's a 10-year look. Um, so that is what we're doing and trying to do that with as much fidelity as we can and be as anticipatory as possible. I think the other thing that has to happen as we move forward here is we can't we have to look at this this situation in a iterative fashion. Um, and I'm trying to reestablish this 10-year uh look so that we can get into either quarterly or semianual reviews of our data and our look at this so that you don't have to feel rushed. Um, but this is as fast as I could go um given coming back here in October. So, um, you know, I I think this probably should have been in front of the board two years, maybe two and a half years ago. So, I'll just leave it at that. Um, from from my perspective, those connections and partnerships are uh are deep and um if people in the community want to go look at what the city is doing, Lakeville Thrive 2040 land use plan is uh what I would recommend you look at. >> Uh just one point of clarification. So December 16th is the last date that we'd our last meeting that we could approve this. So, uh, Director Cameron, did you still have a comment? >> Um, [clears throat] musing off of what what you were talking about, Director Thompson and thinking back to when I was on the facilities and finance committees, um, we did do this two years ago and we were ready with a plan [laughter] and so we're kind of like restarting and we're behind the eightball for sure. Um, I share the frustration of being rushed and also that we're behind and I know we can't make up for lost time. Um, but I I see a pattern in 194 of being really reactive rather than big thinking, big planning. And so I want to make sure whatever decision is made on this and many other things like teaching and learning, reducing class sizes that I understand they're from different pots of money, right? Technically, but from the community it's one pot, right? It's our it's our it's our personal finances and so what is the tax tolerance and what are all the needs and what are the things that our board most cares about and I feel like we set that with our metrics plan. This isn't part of it really. I mean it's related of course but we have not talked about how to finance the things that we really care about that we want to drive. Um and so I'm cognizant of that with the tax tolerance. So I'm really curious to see what the survey says. I'm also curious to hear from our communications department and a PR team about going for two levies in one academic year. This is typically not a community that is [laughter] um is interested in passing levies at a high rate, right? We're at like a 50% rate over the last 20 years. And so I think a failed levy would be a huge mistake. And so I really want to interrogate that to make sure we're making good choices um in putting things um out to the community and in and the timeline that we do that in. So that's kind of some of my thoughts, but related to like the feeder system and I was able to tour um Century with um Chair Swanson last week, I think it was. And um Principal Baky made a great point that you know at Century there's this like strong feeling of panther no right panther panther pride. Sorry, my kids aren't that that level yet. Panther pride and then likewise at Meguire the strong cougar pride and the value that that has for students is really high. The challenge, right, is that we have a third metal that that students aren't experiencing that. And I agree with you, Director Thompson, Lakeville's Lakeville, but that's not actually how we've designed our schools at the moment. And so with option two, would it be possible to create more of a feeder where all North students are at Century and then Kenwood would be smaller as we've already talked about and Meuire would be then maybe a tad smaller to really honor what the facilities task force years ago said and the board said was a priority was this feeder system. I don't know if that's possible. that's something I want to think about as we talk about expansion. >> So the short answer is I don't know because we haven't discussed that yet. Again, I think a lot of it depends on really the options and then where we think you know the our students are going to land in terms of where they where they live versus where the attendance boundaries [snorts] are. I I would offer I think that it becomes as we grow it becomes increasingly problematic to have, you know, a feeder system and then making sure that you have equitable schools, you know, that are at the right size um in a growing community because we will continue to grow. I think I've demonstrated that clearly. And so, you know, we may have to consider that that feeder system is just not feasible anymore. I don't know that for sure because I haven't done that analysis. We're going to start doing that. Um, and we'll present that to you soon >> cuz I mean just for clarific because that's a 500 per grade. That's 2,000 at high school then. >> It's just a thought. >> Okay. Yeah. And I'm curious like at at the task force, were there Kenwood potential Kenwood or Kenwood parents? Because I feel like the facilities group years ago that I was on under the previous superintendent, it was clear that that was a huge issue for parents and it would be a key driver in passing a levy was figuring out the current model um >> right >> differently. So, >> well, >> can we hear from the principal? Like, I would >> Can you comment on that? Like, is that something that >> I hate to put you on the spot? >> That's you. >> That's you. We're talking about Kenwood. >> Kenwood. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Come on down. >> The water's warm. >> Repeat the question. Well, I think the question is um >> we know you and your team do a fabulous job of making Kenwood a place for all and knowing that kids are going to go to north or south right from Kenwood and I fully respect that my kids will be on that trajectory. Yes. So, however, I think there is strong community interest and given conversation with with um principal Baky last week, th the schools that are run by um those gentlemen are able to like cultivate this pride right all the way through up until high school whereas you have this split identity >> and in an ideal world like would we have a feeder system >> rather than split. >> I would not change what I have. >> Okay. And I don't I think and I have a couple staff here that they would say the same. Um it's what makes Kenwood unique and we embrace it and we have our own identity and we have our own culture and we have our Lakeville pride. Um it's pretty cool when the seniors walk through the building and they see each other and you have the Cougars and the Panthers and they're still friends and they're congratulating each other and giving each other high fives and things like that. It's pretty awesome. they still remain friends, but also we live in a time where kids struggle and there are times when our students and we talk as principles need to be able to transfer schools and have a fresh start and things like that and it is really helpful to be the split school because there are times when Kenwood is an option because of that because it doesn't matter whether you're coming from Century or Maguire because we feed both high schools and so there's an opportunity there. Um, so it it's unique. We embrace it. We love it. And I think it's really good for Lakeville to have one school that's like that. And our elementarymentaries are also um mixed, right? We have that. So, I'm I'm okay with it. And then I don't have to change any logos or anything like that, which I've told Lucas a lot. So, um, yes, I I embrace it. We embrace it at Kenwood. And yeah, >> that's really helpful. I think Mr. Dmstrand at Lake Marian says two kitties, one city. So, uh, Director Anderson, did you have a comment? >> Yeah, I do want to acknowledge um kind of what Director Cameron said earlier about I think one of the things that I'm struggling with and I don't know about the two beside me, but we went through meetings with a very different plan. And so, and that would have been kind of put into effect in time for these fourth graders. And so that's part of this is just adjusting to something totally different and trying to r so when you have one group saying this should be the plan and another group saying this should be the plan it is trying to figure out what the right path for our community is and I just I [clears throat] want to one thing we talk about with this tax tolerance piece I know it's critical and I know it's important and I also have seen our community it's like the survey data matters for sure and I think the levy outcomes are like a flip of the coin depending on what we present to our community. And I would say tax tolerance matters and really what matters is going in with strategy about what our community is going to vote in favor of or not. And so all I hear in the community is what people are expecting with the middle school with with there being another. That's that's not everybody. That's just who kind of talks to me. And so that's where I would love to see us develop something that's big and bold and asking for really what we need for long term um and in a way that's going to sell it to get the votes. And I I care about the tax tolerance survey. And I also think like we need to take if we're going to if we're going to create metrics that are similar the goals are similar to Weisetta, we need to start acting like Weisetta as a community. And our board needs to >> our board needs to get behind that if we're going to build something here that's similar. >> That would be my two cents. [snorts] >> Director Thompson. >> Uh agreed. Yep. Maybe maybe we have to consider >> I can agree on that. >> Maybe maybe we can shoot for one high school. Maybe we call it Lakeville United campus. It's this massive compromise. >> Oh my gosh. >> It's for another day. Lucas, you >> So, so my my my students go to Kenwood and and I I think it was probably the best experience that they've had to be able to have friends uh at both high schools and and I think it really fosters uh they're part of the Lakeville community while we have two different high schools. Like my son's best friends are from Lakeville North and and and uh and he had [clears throat] to go to prom. He get to go he went to prom twice, one here and there. So, but but it's like the you you have that it is I I agree you want it's nice to have that hey we go to north and we go to south but having that split schools like we're part of the Lakeville community and I'm going to have friends at both locations and it just gives them access to go wherever and and again if you've got to switch to different schools maybe you you have friendships at both locations. Uh but but yes, I I am in favor of that and and and again, how do we teach our kids to be resilient if they don't go through resilient things and this is one of those things where like it's part of life like you just you just go to a school and this is where you're zone to go and sometimes it changes. Um what I would like to ask is uh you know what the appetite is on the board for if a decision isn't made by December uh and it's not on a May May ballot and during May ballots I believe the turnout isn't as high compared to a general election. uh does it make sense to have this on a November election where you've got the broader population to decide this is where we want to go. This is how much I want to spend and then we as a team decide do we want to put the whole thing there and say fundamentally this is what where where we think the district should go in the next 10 years or do we offer a small piece now again this is a six-month delay from May >> month yeah from May to to November it's a six-month delay Oh, but we can't but you can't do a bond in November. >> Do you want to come? >> Okay. >> Yes. >> Well, you could have the bond. The question is, can you meet the timeline uh you know, meet all the statutory requirements? And Superintendent Bowman is thinking it would be questionable. >> That timeline would not allow an opening uh for the fall of 28 to accommodate those kids. And and then I get a well I do have another question but >> I'll I'll I'll hold it. >> No, I mean it is at the six month it would be a six-month delay if the timeline allows if if we can meet the deadlines and the requirements but but again it's we we are bumping up against 250 kids. We are bumping up against 95% capacity in the next three years and it takes three years roughly to build something. >> The the the long pole in the tent is the construction timeline to make it happen. >> Can't do that. You can't even start probably in the winter for those kind of things >> like the ear between the time the bond we have the money let's say the time it takes to spec build design all that it's going to take some time and then the first opportunity to build will be April of 27 and then it takes se it's going to take him all of 17 months and a couple prayers to get the the capacity open. But is that just one company or is that three that we can use and have them all be done at the same time? I mean, does it really take three years? >> Yes, you will get them all done, but you can't wait any longer than that. >> I I understand that, but does it take But if we're using just one vendor and it takes them three years, can you take use three vendors and have it done in a year? >> No, I'm just I'm just wondering. I mean, if time is an issue, >> right? Well, because it has to do with the school year when you're you're building your stuff outside, you know, in the summer and then you're you're building all the the inside stuff during the summertime and then you're building all the outside stuff during like the winter. So, it it also has to do with accommodating the school being like open and using the school. So, that's also the limiting factor with the construction. So, you can you can use 20 vendors. We still need to keep the schools open. we can't disrupt the schools. Then we got winter to contend with. Um and so the the earliest, you know, or the latest we can go is is that April of 27. So it's just that's really the long pole in the tent outside of the bond timeline, right? Um >> okay. So you good, sir? We good? Okay. So, uh, before I bring up Shelby and Ellers, this is kind of a proposed really operational timeline, uh, to you, sir, Director Thompson, kind of talking the mustd dos, if you will, between 25 and 28. I'll talk in terms of when do we need to make decisions after Ellers comes up, but then phase two after that. So starting to address that, you know, if you remember back to the high school propos or potential build time that starts kind of that process starts in the fall of 27. Uh and making sure, you know, if we need to do that, we're making that decision around that time. And then phase three, is there anything else to include potential school expansions, um, new schools, etc.? you know, because as you get out to that 10th year, you know, your fidelity in terms of needs, it gets a little little gray. Uh, [clears throat] so this is kind of how we see this being, you know, blocked. And when we get to the staff recommendation and kind of where we think, you know, the board should go, I think that'll kind of illuminate that and kind of answer some of your questions. I want to bring up Shelby with Ellers. She's going to talk uh the finance piece with you. She she we when she developed her data, if you will, she needed a number for a bond, right? >> So based on what the advisory >> microphone did, how much all that cost. Sorry, >> I was given space. My bad. Okay. >> Yeah, I know. Uh, and so I should probably stand over here, but anyway, so we picked a number of $250 million as a bond as a representative example for you and Shelby, so she can kind of explain that when the board decides what the list is, if any list, and it will be a number, and then so you can kind of gauge, all right, well, if we go all in, it's going to be more than this 250. If we go with the recommendation as I'll explain it to you, it's going to be about 250 give or take. Um, or you could go zero and then the answer is zero. So, it's kind of all So, I picked that middle point uh for Shelby just so she can kind of explain how this is all going to work and sequence. So, please show I hope I did you justice. >> Yes. All right. I'll pull this down so I can speak into it. Um, thanks for having me tonight. I made a million notes because you guys pretty much uh touched on everything that um that could come up during this conversation. So, please feel free to ask more as we go. Um so, this is where we're starting. Um it is your capital plan. And so I guess even though you look um maybe not as often as you think you you should at your um expansion or and your overall facilities plan, you do look at your long-term facilities maintenance plan every year. That is a requirement by MDE to um uh account for your long-term facilities maintenance projects over a 10-year term. And Lakeville has been doing that for a number of years. and you've uh put uh paid for those projects uh through a mixture of bonds and levies. You could levy each year um just for the cash for those projects, but you would have to complete all those projects in that fiscal year. And it never really works that way for the um for the uh reasons that Lucas had pointed out. You have a summer construction season and that happens to straddle a fiscal year. So, uh, by issuing bonds, you allow, uh, yourself as a board to mitigate tax impact over time, uh, and then you also allow that bond to be able to straddle that f that summer construction season. And so, um, overall, we are issuing, uh, um, about, uh, $20 million every other year in bonds. Uh, and you have about $20 million of projects each year. Those bonds then cover about half of the projects each year. Um, this plan overall then looks at all of your existing debt. Um, and it is just your capital plan. So you had uh the recognition to know that you have to also um levy from a different kind of pool or a different revenue source the operating um but it is one set of taxpayers. And so this chart overall represents about a little less than half of your overall levy. A lot of your operations is through state aid. your um finance or your um ma maintenance of your assets is primarily a function of your tax base. So, a little bit about what we're tracking overall. Your existing debt is made up of school building bonds um and previous facilities maintenance bonds. Those black bars in there are your capital leases. So, we talked a little bit earlier about the um the leases, the operating leases that the district has that they're accessing, you're accessing for um operating leases, the lease levy. Um you also have a couple uh three capital leases. So, those were additions to that's the gym addition to Meuire and some um uh additions to elementary schools and that black bar extends with those financings out through 2036. Uh the facilities maintenance projects then um are a mix of those green bars the um uh the bonds and then the green dotted bars which is the general fund or just the cash each year. So, um, so overall, as your existing debt gets paid off, we're we're planning for either a drop down or what we could also think of as just your overall capacity um to um bring on additional debt without a severe tax impact to your community in terms of your capital plan. uh and what that encompasses overall. This is just like what you've approved uh in spring of this year for your LTFM plan made up of deferred maintenance and uh health and safety that you have to do on an annual basis. So, our process then is to take what your expenditures are each year to um put that into our debt plan and make sure that we have a nice mix of uh bonds and uh cash to keep your tax impact or tax uh level while still not um sort of overly relying on a bond issuance. Of course, you pay interest with a bond issuance. Um and so we're just trying to make sure we pay as much for these project in in cash uh so as not to um overly burden the taxpayers overall. So uh then you know looking forward into a potential May election the assignment was to see to what extent we could fit in 250 uh million dollars of additional borrowing. And that that really for the district really comes in the form of any additional facilities maintenance or uh for projects that can't be done through board approval needing to go to the voters. So it's all again one tax base, one capital plan, but really what that mix is going to look like. Um and I think the point here in getting to this while we don't have exact numbers and that's the iterative process that we enter into now with getting the tax tolerance of the community finding what the exact projects are that you want to move forward is can we fit everything into your capital plan and what levers can we f pull to further mitigate the tax impact. [snorts] A couple of those things include looking at your facilities maintenance projects and turning some of what we thought could be cash at the time into borrowing as as we shift that and you can see the green bars really lowering in maybe that mid 2030 range uh to um lower the cash component to bring on some additional debt. That's one lever. The other lever then is to um go to the voters for an approved amount and then spread that out over time. So when the voters give you authority to issue debt for a projects, uh you could issue that all at once or you could spread that out and phase that. And the um the benefit of that is if you issue $250 million right now, you may not need that last let's say 70 million until 2031. um and you'd be paying interest on it and asking your taxpayers to pay interest on that right away in 26. That doesn't or excuse me in 27. That doesn't always make the most sense. Um and so we then look and marry the construction schedule or the draw schedule with the bond issuance in a lot of the same ways we do that for um facilities maintenance bonds and spread that out over time. And so for the same tax impact, you're able to sort of pay off principle on that immediately issued debt while still maintaining that authority >> and the [clears throat] overall concept to and this is what many of the districts are doing for any number um any size voter approval. Um, but to understand and be able to communicate to the community that that one authority and issuing it over a series of time is not meaning that you're going to raise those taxes. It's going to stay level. We're going to do that once as you seek voter approval and maintain that tax rate over time. even though we're going to break it up into a number of issuances. The other um number of uh sort of overall lever that we would pull in this is the time period by which we are going to extend the debt. And so the last several Yep. >> Director Thompson. >> Yeah. I I'm looking at this graph. >> I'm looking at this graph and I just make want to make sure I'm understanding this is that the voter approved bonds uh is going to bring our debt from 24 million to about 28. So about a 20% increase from what we currently have always historically had. Is that how I'm reading this? >> So the how I should be reading this >> the x or excuse me the y ais is the tax rate. So this is not the levy. >> Got it. Okay. that's imposed. It's the tax rate. So, it would be a one-time increase in the tax rate >> for the next 25 years. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Uh so, that then leads me to um the time period over which a school district can issue debt is 30 years. Uh the last few facilities maintenance bonds have uh been much shorter than that. And that historically is where we've wanted to keep the district at. Um, the last one was 11 years. Previous to that, it was a seven-year bond. So, keeping those bonds nice and short, again, mitigating the tax impact overall by keeping that short. So, the other way to do that then is finding that um good mix of how long those voter approved bonds can be. You know, when you get out to 30 years, that may make sense overall to spread that, but you're also going to be paying more interest. So really trying to find that nice mix of mitigating the tax impact while not um bringing the burden on over the period of time. And again um you know we've talked a lot about the growth that's coming into the community over time. So you can think about that taxpayer in 2045 paying for the facilities that they are currently that they're currently using at that time. Right? It's not all on the um the community as it exists today. >> Director Thompson. >> And this 250 is just for phase one or is this phase one and two and three? Just one. I mean, >> so so really the 250 was meant as an exercise >> to determine if we could fit everything in given where you want to maintain your long-term facilities maintenance plan. Um and then two, the other thing that we did um in going from where we had your facil um facilities maintenance plan plan that was adopted this summer to now is we've extended those um those black bars. So really just creating that conservative capacity over the long term to make some potential short-term inclusions into the plan without taking up that tax capacity. So it it it doesn't tie I would say overall to any set of plans. It was can we fit it and do we still have enough levers determine based on what you may determine you need. So the the second step to this overall was your as your facilities grow over time and um we've talked a little bit about maybe being behind on some of those projects is can we add um some facilities maintenance projects go each year going from about 20 million each year on average to closer to about 29 million if we just added that much in. And I'm not again defining the projects, but I'm just adding that much capacity into the plan. Can we make it fit? And [snorts] again, you know, you can see the difference that we're going to have to bump up that tax impact a little bit more. We're going to have to stretch out those green bars and um bond a little bit longer than an um than originally anticipated and extends out the plan overall. I think we extended the yellow bar another year. So, um, think about each of those bonds in 2628 for the voter approval being issued for what [clears throat] was maybe 20 years is now maybe 21 or 22 years. Um, again, are we pulling the correct levers to say we're mitigating the t tax impact at the same time as we're creating um uh or matching the needs? And I think, you know, as we go from where we were um this summer overall in these stepdowns to where what could look like in terms of a potential election addressing a lot of the needs, we've lost some of those step downs or that capacity uh overall. Um and so again very conservative in nature thinking about where we could be but there are some pressure points here especially you can see those dashed um green dotted bars in 37 to 39 about really lowering that cash component during some times when we needed to pay off a little bit more principal. So, I think [snorts] overall those are strategies that we're going to go back and forth with as you come to a conclusion on what the projects are, as you marry that with the the tax impact uh tolerance or the tax tolerance of the community to put that into your overall long-term capital plan. complete the projects that you have um already on the that just need to get done every year and what you want to get done over time. I think the the last thing I just wanted to point out and where this will come up is and you had pointed this out earlier, Lucas, about that average home value. You have that increasing over time. So, um, and just an overall observation that not only are those values increasing over time, but you're, um, including or adding that number of residential counts over time. So as those come in um we start with a very conservative measure of keeping that constant that tax rate constant over time but as new taxpayers come on to the scene they are offsetting it overall for um for for everyone else. >> Just one second. Uh so are the graphs based on the current or future estimates on taxpayers as well or is that just based on what we have right now? So we have included a 1% growth over time. So a very conservative estimate. I think your last uh last several years probably averages out to about 5% growth in the tax base. >> Okay. Director Thompson. >> Uh I I feel like we've tried our best to keep that tax rate as consistent as we could over the past three years. And and obviously there's there's a jump from 24 to 29. Uh, have you ran any numbers just out of curiosity what of how much money could we have or play with if you kept that at the 25% rate all the way through 2050? That that way the message that I hear is like we're adding two uh the middle school. Yes, I I agree there's an expansion, but we're looking at 250 kids and and I'm having a tough time with and there's a lot more to this that that's included, but $250 million potential worth of stuff uh for the addition of 250 kids for our middle schools. Elementary is staying as is. Uh there's other miscellaneous things that we can discuss around the variability, but if we kept things consistent, I'm just wondering if the messaging would be easier, saying we're keeping the tax rate flat. Uh this is what we've always had and this is the funds that we can work with for whatever next enhancements or improvements we need to do. So that that's just an idea that I'm thinking. >> So the qu Yeah, the question is like have what would it look do we do we have a number if it stayed at 25? Uh, no. We did not run that um on the premise that that there's a number of levers you could pull. Would you um switch all of your uh LTFM for instance into cash or would you do you know do some of that mix as opposed to just overlaying those yellow bars to keep it flat? The the the consistency or the level in the tax impact was what you as a board chose to do. Um, and so this is meant to represent the increase that a voter would would do. So, no, we have not run that option. >> Thank you, Shelby. Thank you, Shelby. >> Oh, okay. All right. So, stay with us. We're almost done. Um, okay. So, let's kind of, you know, we, you know, Director Thompson, you talked a little bit about staff recommendation. Um, I would kind of offer this. We need to approve um a middle school improvement, expansion, if you will. That's a mustdo. There are two options there. You you pointed out some very good um points in terms of one versus the other. I I know it appears that we, you know, are only adding for 250 kids. I think that is true in terms of at in 2028, but as you reach out over the long term to 2035 and beyond, you could see increased growth and we want to make sure that we have the capacity uh to do that. So we just I would just offer that we keep in mind we're thinking you know 10 years out and having the space to do that so we don't you know come into a situation where we have some unexpected growth and then we can't um you know handle that capacity and now we we get into a situation uh that's undesirable for our staff and our students. So have to do uh a middle school of some sorts there. We have two options for you. Uh again, there's probably an infinite number of options, but based on all the work we've done, the facts presented, uh our esteemed advisory group, we feel that these are the two best options, um you know, to present to you as a school board. Uh approve some district-wide items to really ensure the community is represented to the greatest extent possible. Uh we know that we can't get everything all the time. Uh but it was it was certainly noted in the advisory group that you know what about me? I don't have any I don't have any skin in the middle school issue. Uh but I certainly you know all my kids go to the high school stadiums to play. When are we going to do that? And there's lots of community voice over things like that or you know again uh you know the the early childhood center or to your point director Baker ALC is a thing that needs to be rectified and we've kind of you know we've kind of pushed that one down the road a little bit. Uh so there are definitely some things that need to happen immediately. Uh and then to your point, Director Thompson, number three, really hold phase two decisions until we need to do that. Let us uh ensure that we have our enrollment projections, some more accuracy, precision there. Uh let the needs of the district kind of materialize. You really talked uh very good about, you know, vision and strategy, you know, with with some other things. I think that we could meet the immediate need uh and represent the in number one represent the community uh in some items in number two that would that would service a large portion of our our district. Uh and then we you know hold uh on any further you know facilities improvements till we align our visions and our strategies over the long term and then we make that decision. Uh you know is it an additional bond or whatever the case may be. But I think that would uh resonate with our community and I think historically is what we've done is to kind of ask for what we need, make that stated case, demonstrate that with good data and good staff planning, do that and then and then go on to the next phase and and we can wait. Um so that's kind of our recommendation as a staff there. Um, let's go to I got Okay, so again, no decisions are made and to Director Thompson's point, December 9th is 20 days away. Um, I recognize that. Um, we do have the Morris Leman survey that's going to happen uh here in the next couple of weeks, over the next couple of weeks. Uh, and he's going to be prepared to brief that out to us as soon as possible. If I can get it sooner than the 9th, I can certainly read ahead that for you. um November 25th. So between now and and November 25th, we have some time to think critically and deeply about where you all want to go and take the school uh the district. Uh you know, we're prepared as a staff to receive those uh information requests, ideas, clarifying questions, etc. Uh and then we can answer them, you know, on the 25th or sooner if needed. Uh and you guys, you the school board can have this this discussion on the 25th. [clears throat] I will be here and present. Uh and then on the 9th uh or earlier, we can have more SMAN survey results. Uh and then I would ask for a board vote on requested decisions. Again, to uh Chair Swanson's point, there is a little bit of time. Uh but that December 23rd becomes a a hard date to get that done. So, the sooner we have, we do need some time to kind of draft uh that comment and review and the resolution and make sure you can vote on it for all the the formalities uh and requirements that are are needed there. So, those are really the next steps. Um I got one again, there's the decisions we'll request again on December 9th uh and December 16th. I've already talked about those. So, just kind of book in the brief here. So, decision impact, right? So if action is delayed or not approved in December, the bond referendum fails in May, you know, our district staff, our design and construction partners will unable to meet that fall 2028 opening of those critical projects just all the things I previously discussed uh in terms of being able to keep the schools open, the winter weather, uh so on and so forth. Uh so we will not be able to do that to meet that immediate need. And then occupancy at our middle schools will exceed 85% past 2028. Um and we'll continue to grow there. Uh and we'll not be able to meet our expected learning outcomes for both our students and our staff. Um and then uh you know we won't be able to use our learning best practices there. And if you think HVE right now they're at 105% they're definitely using spaces they're not designed for. I know CMS is definitely filling the crunch. um and that will continue to reverberate and is becomes unpleasant. Um and then other infrastructure needs will continue to be unmet. So the problem will not be solved. And so I just want to make sure that that is clear uh for the board. Um and I'm done. >> Two hours. >> Uh not quite, but uh >> any qu subject questions of course. Director Cameron, >> um either an email or at the next meeting, >> it'd be helpful for me to see a calendar of the next 10 years >> of when renewals are coming up. Yep. >> What the when these additional asks would be made, >> you know, I want to I want to think about the sequencing of all of this. And I think our strategy is levy levy levy small amounts. And I worry about levy fatigue. So I just want to think about that. And then ideally is your recommendation that all of the things on the phase one would be lumped together? I know I know you said we could choose. >> That's what the that is with [clears throat] the advisory board and I I think that is appropriate to make sure that there's equity. I think the one uh in my mind I think the one thing is the alternate learning center um because of where it is now. I think the point of why I went into phase two was just the con I'll call it construction fatigue in a high school. If we if we think that we're going to be doing construction in the 28 29 period you know potentially you're looking at a high school that will have construction starting in you know 27 28 and then it' kind of like continue. So that is certainly a factor to consider and maybe it's well worth like okay we'll we'll we'll suffer through that one because it is important to have the AOLC. Uh what I think is important and my recommendation is is that we do the middle school expansion and that we do make sure that we are representing the entire community to the greatest extent possible in terms of you know other improvements and expansions uh across the district. ALC's, early childhood education, performing arts, stadium upgrades. I think that'll resonate well with the community that you as a school board are thinking holistically and long term. And then at the same time knowing that, hey, our vision and strategy for the high schools, whether it be a technical center or something, we can hold on that and let that kind of develop and mature a little bit and then go forward there. So that's kind of what I would offer you. So, with the survey that's being conducted right now, are they asking the community about these particular topics? Because I I I appreciate the task force that I'm also aware it's a very small group of people um and not representative of the community and so >> great that those parents had those ideas and I don't disagree with them, but I don't know if that's how the community feels, >> right? And so he and so yes, so Morris Leman has essentially this list and they are going to query some of that. um to make sure we can get a sense of where the the community is at. >> And then my final question is, are we interrogating our current budget to think about ways in which we can offset potentially some of this um with additional savings? So like for example, I know like the elementary school playgrounds are on a rotation for updates or for renewal or for complete renewal. Can things like that be delayed by all year or you know like how are I'm just thinking about being fiscally responsible and also wanting to have as as many great things in our community as possible and so I think levying bonding more and interrogating our budget should be happening simultaneously. >> I agree. Director Anderson, >> I do just want to ask that I I think the just with what we just talked about with the survey information. Um, one [clears throat] thing I would just ask for in the future is that some of this information come before the board before it goes out to a survey just so that kind of the board is in agreement with the things that are going out to the community and what we're asking them. Does that make sense? >> That makes sense. >> That way when then it comes back and I realize we're in time crunch and so everything's trying to happen, but something to consider for the future. Thank you. >> I have a question for the board more for scheduling issues um relating to this. So, everyone can send Lucas questions on additional information that he can bring back to us on the 25th. Um do we want to meet before then to refine kind of what our thoughts are on this list or would it be more helpful to just add this on to like the December 2nd special meeting where then we have a little bit more information from Lucas and maybe can I don't know if we'd have our results from Morris Leman at that point in time on the second >> that'll I think that'll be tight. I will I will certainly press Mr. Leatherman and he understands the sense of urgency so I will do my best. >> Sure. Because then we potentially have you know four meetings. >> Yeah. >> Before we have to make a decision. >> I I think we should have a discussion and and be able to talk about now that we had a chance to hear the presentation. give you a few days, weeks or week to to kind of digest it, think through, you know, what you want to consider as you move forward. I'm not there's many things on the on that phase one list I'm not aligned on. And so we need to go I I want to be able to talk through that with you guys and say, "Hey, uh I I get option one and I I get option two. Um I I get the need for the middle school. Uh what about can we expand one can we expand one location and and adjust the boundaries to accommodate so that then we can have a longer runway to thought to think more thoughtful around what a larger package might look like. Uh but the yeah I think there would be value in just having a dialogue around this >> meeting before the 25th. >> Yeah. Well 25th of November. >> Yeah that's our next oh that's our next meeting. >> Oh that's like in two weeks. >> Two weeks. >> It's up to you guys. I mean, >> right now I was thinking the 25th, 2nd, then maybe a second, 9th, 16th. I >> I think the more the more we can have conversations around this, I mean, we're about to make a decision on 150 to $250 million >> and we've we spent two hours. That's it. So, >> so you guys are open to another meeting? >> Yeah, >> I I support more discussion. I wish we had the survey results because I think that would that would help inform me a lot but that you can't. So >> yeah, I mean we could really jam them, you know, between whenever we get the survey results. >> Yeah. Even seeing what kind of questions are being asked would help me. >> Yeah. >> Mhm. >> Okay. If we can get that. >> Okay. >> And and I would I would offer that it really I it really helped when we didn't discuss the money aspect. It kind of really helped drive home what was really important. So, but I understand your point about the the survey results. I wish we could have done it sooner. >> Do you guys have any questions? I can't wait for an email to Lucas. >> December 1st will be the last. They're [snorts] going through the 15th to the 1st of December. So, they'd get to us on December 9th or maybe before that. >> I will do my best. >> Okay. All right. Um, why don't we take a little break here? Uh, let's come back at quarter two. Is that too long? That's what I'm done. >> All right, we're going recess. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thanks, Lucas. All right, we are back on and uh moving on to the board policy committee uh report and discussion with the first reading of policy 213 on school board committees. Uh Director Cameron, if you would. >> Great. Um just a little context on this and I mentioned it last meeting um but we our district had the audit from MSBA looking at all of our policies and what came back was that we have 145 um total policies to look at in terms of updates. It will take approximately three years they re they they estimate to get through all of that. Um and they've grouped it into three chunks. So working on mandatory policies first, legal next, and then recommended policies third. Some of them are very like technical updates like the ones we approved in the consent agenda. Some are looking more at um updating content and substance that would require like content experts within the district. Um, and then there are, um, about 35 policies that we don't currently have that MSBA recommends we consider adding to our slate of policies. So, there's a lot of work, um, to do. And so, uh, the policy committee met with Superintendent Bowman and, um, uh, uh, HR director to look at a variety of policies. One of which was policy 213, which is on our schoolboard committees. Um, a lot of the edits that you see in this document are just technical updates, changing um, school board for board of education, etc. However, the one change that the committee would like to discuss is um eliminating on the second page line two and three um the that committees would follow open meeting law. So after consultation with our attorney um they their opinion is that committees so long as they do not um have a quorum of the board and don't have any decision-m authority they're only advisory in nature um don't need to follow open meeting um law in order to allow kind of more fluid free free work to happen. Um so our proposal is that we consider eliminating that. um really considering the amount of work that the board needs to do with all of these policies. Um it'd be so great in this era to be able to co-edit a document like in Google Docs and to um work off of a copy with each other in between meetings and right now that's not allowed um with how open meeting law is um discussed. Also, I think it's important that if there's any substantive changes that there would always be a first and second reading of a policy at this at this table so that the community is informed that there'd be a change. They'd have two opportunities to talk to board members or to come to public comment and address any issues they have with the updates to the um to the policy edits that we're recommending. But this is really about um helping us helping us update our policies in a in an efficient way so that we can get up to compliance, get up to kind of the standards by which we want to operate at. Um and I and and I think the policy committee agreed that if we were able to to work um offline on these things, we'd be able to make progress a lot more quicker. And so that's part of why we're proposing this change. Anything else to add, Brian or Matt? >> Yeah, I just said, if you don't mind, can I add one little piece of context to that? or did you have a question before? >> I have a question because I I think it goes it goes back to what you said when you started that we have 145 that need updated and 35 that we don't even have that we probably should. Um, so my question is how did we get to this point where they're so out of date and because I don't want to see it happen again because it's going to take us three years as you said to update it. And then um is there like someone within the district that's working on these since like we're not here all day? Like I mean I don't know. I guess like I just have questions about that. >> Yeah. >> Provide more context for that. >> Yeah. I mean, and we're looking at the MSBA audit. So, we paid to have MSBA do an audit um of all of our policies. So, it's not that we need to update all of them. Some are, you know, critical updates. Some are just recommended updates, right? And then some are policies that they recommend that we adopt, >> right? But I'm I'm saying like if you follow the process of when you should be reviewing policies and updating them, why why are we so right? because we shouldn't have I mean I would if we've been doing it all along I wouldn't expect 145 to be needing updated. Am I am [clears throat] I wrong? >> I think in in talking with Brenda one of like the the fact that we updated five of four of our policies potentially five tonight is um way more than the board has accomplished in the last couple years. And so I think part of the challenge is like there hasn't been a cadence of a policy committee that's been like actively bringing edits to the table. Um >> but I think this predates this board too. >> Well, I mean we had like two policy committees kind of going for a while where um the district had theirs and they were working on kind of updating and then we had ours that we were going through >> the 200 series and then other ones that we were considering updating. So, um, I don't know what's been done in the past. I guess I'm just thinking like that's I I don't I don't don't think that's acceptable. Like that's that's bad, right? which well and I think that that supports our proposed revision then too because it allows us um I mean we can still plow through make a lot of proposed edits just in a Google doc among the committee members um before we even meet in person and discuss those and then bring those to the board for review and discussion. Um it creates a lot more efficiency there. I did want to note that uh we're removing it removing it from this subsection V or five. Um but it doesn't mean uh and if because if you look back earlier and this is something when we were looking this up I noticed um every committee is required to have a resolution that dictates you know what the purview of the committee is authority of the committee and how long the committee is is going to be established even an ad hoc committee um so every committee we don't have that right now I know director Thompson had raised it earlier this year um and had some proposed resolutions but we haven't approved that and so I think I'd mentioned bringing that up on our uh December 2nd meeting and some proposals there. Um so just because we're removing it from this section five doesn't mean that we can't put it in a resolution that any sort of committee specific committee if the board deems appropriate is required to meet in person or follow up a meeting law. But I think for the policy committee from a practical sense, it makes it it would be a lot more efficient just in the review of all these policies and helping us to at least um make significant headway on the MSBA audit. >> Okay. >> Is is part of this like we're missing because we've been trying to hire for legal legal, right? So, as part of this, like, so I guess maybe what Kim is asking is for some of these edits that don't require any substantive change, would it help to have someone in the >> district >> district who's just looking for these kinds of changes that probably come out every year for policies with regard to like the legal references or like is it because we're kind of missing a person? >> It might it might be part of it, but I don't Yeah. Well, what has the I guess what has the procedure been for the district and board in that collaboration? >> Director Thompson. >> Yeah. Um, >> I don't think we have actually charged the district to look at these policies and be the one to be on point. Uh, I think that the policy, uh, reviews is a board uh, responsibility. And so uh I think over the past years or the past three years it was harder it's hard to go through these because when uh we had to be in person we brought in uh board uh district people uh and then we went through one policy line by line and trying to compare it to MSBA but had to do it in person and then uh and sometimes [snorts] it went it took like two three iterations just to get through one policy before we brought it to uh the the board table. So in regards to why does it take so long is because the way we currently had it set up or the the the current process was very time inensive and uh and and and we had to be present together uh to to go through that and so I think this particular approach allows us to streamline the process uh and it is a board's responsibility to review the policies to organize the policies. Now we can ask the district to say hey we want someone else to be on point and lead all these but at the moment it's falls on our responsibility to go through them. Uh that's how I interpret it and with the update version updated uh in uh content with this policy gives the board flexibility to streamline the process faster do it virtually and we can bring things faster to the board for review which which is where we want to go. Again, all committees, subcommittees, ad hoc committees, um, have to follow this process and or not has to follow this process, but are advisory in nature. And so, we're not approving anything. We're not, you know, making changes to anything. We can make changes, but we're bringing it back to the board for approval. And that and that applies to public engagement. Like, we should be bringing public engagement to the board with these are the things that we want to do. are we aligned with these these events and these activities so that we can we're there and present and so that is kind of the approach that we want to go with this and that and that is going to get us faster uh in in the completion of the 145 that we still need to do. George Cameron, >> I do think in um Carly to your question in talking to other school districts, this is not how it's done. Um often like the general counsel if they're on staff, monitors this process, um facilitates it, brings edits before, consults with district experts to and then the policy committee reviews and updated copy. So, our process from what I'm understanding from other districts is very unique and it puts a lot of work on the board member. Um, I think that's something we can look at. I also don't think our district currently has good systems for annual um what's the word? Annual um surveying of of staff to understand if they're working with policies that should be looked at in the next in the next year or if they have issues. And so in talking to other districts, they have like a multi-layered system to figure out the sequencing of when policies need to be addressed by the policy committee. And I think we're just really rudimentary in how we're running this. Um and [laughter] >> um and I know and I know we're thinking about some of those roles in our district, but right now this is what we got. >> We I I do want to add real quick just to that. So Brenda has been asked essentially if there's something that needs to be reviewed at any specific time of the year to bring that forward and we have reviewed different policies and have I don't know maybe a handful of them um that we're waiting for feedback from the district too before we bre them to the board. So um not all of them that we've reviewed have been uh just the simple updates. Some of them have been a little bit more interesting and need some further feedback from staff. >> Director Carbone. Yeah, Amber, if you know, if the legal opinion gives us a comfort level and the public is going to see the transparency of it and we still have to do the it still has to be presented twice to the board. I mean, why not do this? I I I don't even know why. I mean, why not do it? >> Well, this is reading one. >> Yeah, reading one >> more and then we can vote on it. So, >> yeah, I know. >> Unless there are any requested changes. if anybody has any. >> Why not? >> Director Baker. >> So, um I don't necessarily agree with the interpretation of open meeting law and I do feel like it's if you have three board members on that committee, it's going to be walking a very fine line if any of those board members talk to another board member after leaving that committee about anything that was discussed because then it's four and then it's a serial meeting. So there are [snorts] it's a gray it's a very gray line. It's a very gray line. Um I also feel like for transparency for the public, are you saying that if you do it this way that you're never going to meet that you're just doing it all virtually? That's a question. And then second, if you are still going to meet after doing some of this stuff before, then I don't agree with um the cross out that um notes should not be provided. I think that all committees that are meeting should provide notes on what they're doing when they're meeting in person. >> Director Thompson, >> I think the end results of the edits of the policy will be on the agenda. And so those are the notes. >> I think Kim, we could meet in person, but it wouldn't be required with this edit. The opportunities for that for me, like if we met virtually, they're met most policies require some sort of content expert from the district, right? Whether it's curriculum or um facility use or you know what, you name the topic. And instead of requiring staff to like come to a physical location, we could we could virtually connect with them, just reducing the barriers to to to facilitate these questions. I mean, just scheduling this these meetings alone is is challenging. And so if our goal is to just have like solid policies that that um align with MSBA and align with best practices, I want to get there as fast as possible knowing that we have the this these meetings where the public can see our edits and offer feedback in the event they disagree. And the reality is, I mean, I think in talking to people who have been on policy, maybe one time in in many years have someone attended that meeting. So, and and I get I get what you're saying, but it's not it's not generally something that people attend, but I do want to I do want to make sure that that there's opportunity, of course, to discuss major edits um at our at our board meetings. I don't disagree with the online like I I don't I'm just saying legally it's a very fine line. It's a very fine line and it's a very gray area. Um when I try to think about that from like I said if you talk to one other person you've already broken open meeting law. So >> but that I mean that's anything though too, right? >> I don't know. I I'm aware of it so I don't I don't do it. I'm just saying that it's putting board members in one of those positions. So, right, where you're not in the view of the public, where um things are happening behind the scenes, right? And people already say that things happen too much behind the scenes and they don't see what we're doing. So, I'm just I'm just stating fact like on that. It's it's nothing like Yeah. And if you're going to meet in person, I still feel like I would I would still appreciate notes because then I can go back and read them and you don't have to explain like all the different things that you guys talked about when you came to this conclusion of this policy. Like it just would make things more clear. >> Well, and I do agree like for the notes like for this last meeting, it's literally doing the edits in the in the document because I think the notes are the recommended actions. So, um, we didn't we didn't write down every single conversation we had, right? Because we're not taking we're not taking minutes that way, but it's it's the actions that we're recording. >> Yeah. And those are put then in front of the board for scrutiny, too. And you can ask the committee, well, why are you changing this word or that word? Um I don't know that meeting minutes from a policy committee would be much more than you know reviewed policy 401 402 601 603 and 213 recommended these go on uh consent agenda >> but but this is for all school board committees not just the policy committee. So I want to be clear on that any committee that meets then shouldn't be taking notes and we always take notes. May it may not work for the policy committee, but then this is a policy for all board committees. >> And and that's why I'd say that >> if we're following our existing 213, we should have a resolution which could then dictate that, you know, notes need to be taken or they need to meet in person if we want them to. So I think we can pick that up and make exclusions for certain meetings or certain types of committees where it doesn't make sense. Okay, >> that make sense? Yeah. as long as you're just thinking about more than just one thing. >> Any other comments? Otherwise, that'll be the first reading. Amber, do you have any more thing more to say? Okay. Um, board member reports. Director Anderson. Um, I attended our uh teaching and learning uh meeting this week and that was a lively discussion on AI. That is always a little bit somewhat terrifying to me. But very great discussion and I think um what I loved seeing is our district has a group of people that are really kind of um in charge of moving this issue forward and trying to figure out how to um find a balanced approach with our staff because people are just somewhat different opinion about how we should utilize AI. And so if people Brian and I were just talking about it just a second ago whether this was something being [clears throat] taught in the high schools and there's a lot of thought being put into it how it's going to be used. So I think there's going to be a lot of progress coming over this next year. >> Was the discussion on whether is a teacher resource or a student resource? >> Both. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> I'm sure our students know how to use AI. Well, and so there was a lot there was a lot of really good discussion around how do we um I mean I think our our leadership is being very thoughtful about trying to stay ahead of this while also like it's impossible to stay fully ahead of this given it's all open um open to the public. But I think the the plan there and what a lot of teachers are currently doing in terms of it's a balance of how do we utilize this to help our students grow and also make sure that they're still able to think critically and not overly on it and where's that um kind of good balance. Um, and so it was it was very like I said I I'm also just very impressed by some of our committee members from the community who have various expertise in this issue too. So it was just really good lively discussion and good progress. So good job to director Brovald and team. >> Yeah. >> Director Baker. Um, so the board continues to visit buildings um as engagement opportunities and we had one last week um at Century Middle School. We have two more coming up um for the month of December, one on Thursday, December 4th at uh Crystal Lake Education Center and one on Friday, December 5th at Pathways Academy. Um as always, those are optional for board members to attend. We're just setting things up so you don't have to worry about doing things behind the scenes for that. Um, we do have an engagement session tomorrow with a PTO. Um, and that would be the family connections PTO and that's at 6:30 at Lakeville South. Um, other than that, that's all of my updates. >> One more. Uh, >> oh, >> so the three of us uh last Friday attended the 360 communities gayla. >> Awesome. >> That was an amazing experience. um to see what 360 Communities is doing. And so I would love to see more representation back into our school district, but they raised over $270,000. >> Yes. Pretty awesome. >> This is more of a question for the superintendent. Do we do we have an enterprise co-pilot or Chad GPT version for for our staff? >> No, sir. Director Cameron. Oh, >> he's using Gemini. >> Oh. [laughter] >> Um, yesterday I I attended the gifted advisory committee and that committee is great. Um, there's a lot of district administrators and teachers, parents, and also students on that committee. Um yesterday we learned about twice exceptional students. So these are students who are gifted but also have some sort of learning disability. Um and discuss kind of the unique needs of twice exceptional students, how our district um is servicing those kids, how we might think about expanded services or needs for kids. And um yeah, that was it was it was great. And then there's two more meetings this year. one, we'll be looking at how other districts are um uh servicing gifted kids. And then I'm forgetting the third month, but there's another I'll update you when I go to the the third month. >> Anything else? [snorts] All right. Uh Superintendent Bowman, anything further to report? >> Yeah, just a couple quick things. Uh ju uh I had the opportunity and got invited to Oak Hills to um get interviewed by a student uh on Veterans Day and I think uh as many of you may know uh we could not meet yesterday which is our normal um cadence is to meet on Tuesdays uh because it was Veterans Day. So I just want to um first of all thank OE and um the young lady that interviewed me that was very nice. Um and to all of our our veterans, thank you for your service. Uh tomorrow uh morning we Rotary will be recognizing two more of our students uh for student of the month. I just want to share that with uh with all of you. Thank you. >> Uh before we adjourn everyone good with next week we schedule another meeting to talk about facilities. Um, >> I have a next week you're adding a meeting in. >> That's what the discussion was earlier. Yeah. >> 18th. >> See, I already have a meeting on that day because 9:17 switched their meeting from yesterday because of Veterans Day and so they scheduled it next week, which was an off week for us. So, I already told them I could go. >> How about Wednesday? >> Could we do seven on I mean, could we do 7 p.m. on Tuesday? >> Oh, yeah. It probably be I mean, it's a one topic discussion. Could you make it by 7? >> Technically, but then you you realize I've been in board meetings from 4:30 all the way till when we get out because there's two I mean it's two board meetings back to back. >> As long as we're I mean I just >> I'm out of town on the 19th. >> I'll order. >> Wait, but I can dial >> Buffalo Wild Wings again. >> What about my day is better. >> What about meeting like the second? So, I was already planning on the second. So, that that was my question earlier. >> See, I thought it was just both. Or can we wait until the 2nd after we've had the meeting on the 25th? >> I think we can wait until the second. >> What's that? >> I'm fine to wait. >> I'm fine waiting. >> Okay. And then if we still need more time to discuss, we'll just plan another meeting in December. Jam them in there. All right. I'd entertain a motion to adjurnn. So moved. >> Is there a second? >> Second. >> All right. First and a second. All in favor say I. I. >> Any opposed? >> We're done.