I would like to call this meeting of the Robbinsdale Area School Board to order. Today is Monday, November 17th, 2025. We are in this boardroom at the education service center and um I would like to start with the land acknowledgement. We acknowledge that the Robbinsdale area schools is located on the homelands of the Ojiway and Dakota and Ojiway people. We recognize the painful history of genocide and forced assimilation of the indigenous inhabitants of this land. We honor and respect the many indigenous peoples who live on and hold sacred these lands. And we stand with members of these nations to fight injustice in all of its forms. We uphold the preservation of Dakota and Ajiway languages, landbased education, and tribal sovereignty. And now, will the clerk please call the role? >> With pleasure. Uh, Director Basset >> here. Director Bowman Marks herself present. Uh, Chair Evans Becker, >> I am here. >> Director Hillbrand >> here. >> Director Long >> here. >> Director W >> here. >> And Dr. Stalo >> here. >> Thank you. We are all here. Um it is time for us to approve the agenda. Do I have a move to approve the agenda? >> So moved. >> Moved by Director Wuto. Second. Seconded by Director Long. All in favor, please say I. >> I. >> Oppose. Say nay. We have an agenda. Okay. The next thing up is the consent agenda. Items on the consent agenda are routine in nature and are act enacted with one motion unless there's an item that a board member would like to have pulled and then we would vote on that one separately. Um items on tonight's uh consent agenda are the uh monthly professional development report, meeting minutes, uh the bimonthly dispersements report, the business office monthly contract report, community ed monthly contract report, dispersements, um monthly budget to actual personnel reports for licensed and unlicensed staff. Do I have a move to approve the consent agenda? >> So moved. >> Moved by Director Hillenbrand. >> Second. >> Seconded by Director Basset. Seeing no hands up for questions, um we will vote on this with a roll call vote. So, um let's take the roll call vote to approve the uh consent agenda. >> Great. Thank you. Uh Director Basset, >> yes. >> Director Bowman Marks, yes. Uh director, uh Chair Evans Becker, >> yes. >> Director Hillbrand, >> yes. >> Director Long, >> yes. >> And Director W, >> yes. >> Right, we have approved our consent agenda. Now we're moving on to item number five, unfinished business. Um, this is an action item on the annual comprehensive financial report, the ACUER. Uh, CFO, CFO Hoisel, would you take it from here, please? >> Certainly. Thank you, Chair Evans Becker. Uh, Superintendent Stallow, schoolboard members, at the November 3rd uh, schoolboard meeting, our auditors were here to provide an overview of the audit experience, if you will. They highlighted uh, information of, you know, comparables and where maybe our our costs are increasing or decreasing. What you should have received since that time uh, is a full report. Uh, it looks like this of the entirety of our audit. I believe it is also online [clears throat] as well for anybody who has um interest in reviewing those pages. The one question that I wanted to confirm that came up from director long at the November 3rd meeting was why was there a difference or it actually went a savings in expenditures? We had less expenditures in the 2425 fiscal year compared to the 2324. And I did confirm that in 2324 monies were used to buy equipment. So those expenses were higher in 2324 than they were in 2425. It wasn't necessarily an uh day-to-day operational cost. Beyond that, I have not received any questions from board members, but I'm certainly happy to uh try to address any as we sit here tonight. If not, I would request adoption of our annual audit which is required by November 30th of the uh calendar year. >> I don't see any hands up. Do I have a motion to approve >> the 2025 effort? >> Did you ask for a question to was there? >> I'm I'm Well, usually we have a motion before we do go with a question. >> I understand. I'm asking for a motion to approve it. I'll move approve. Move approval. >> Move approval by director Bowman. Is there a second to approve it? >> I'll second. Second by director Hillbrand. Uh, Director Bass, do you have a question? >> I do. >> So, one of the things I'm wondering is that um we we do have this executive summary. Did you have any intention of touching on any of these items or not? Because at the meeting that they came, they said they were going to finalize it. I wasn't that meeting. I've been a little hazy from missing a meeting, but but they did say they were going to finalize it. it wasn't quite finalized when they were here presenting when I was here and so there were some questions that got raised and I see that some have been addressed. >> So, >> uh yes, so as it relates to the executive governance summary and maybe I'm misunderstanding a little bit. I had believed that they were waiting for uh an interpretation that cuz typically with the government shutdown how they uh bundle if you will our information was the question was was that still allowable or not and if it wasn't going to be allowable and again they were their answer their questions were going out into never neverland because of the government shutdown um they would have separated it wasn't complete because they would have separated those components of the audit uh presented them individually. It would be our regular audit and then our single audit and so everything is presented its entirety. I'm I'm assuming that it was uh the government had said go forth and we'll change whatever declaration of the standard moving forward. Specifically to the executive uh governance summary, our answers have uh not changed. There was a material audit adjustment which we got cited for and which is essentially the auditors saying that they're making uh journal entries or adjustments that are significant enough that should probably be done [clears throat] within the confines of our district administration agrees with that and as we work to shore up our processes and get ahead of schedule of the audit schedule those audit adjustments should naturally be happening. So, we don't disagree with the finding and we believe that we can and will do better because now again we're, you know, in prior years we were kind of behind the game as far as the timing of the audit and then trying to catch up and and every year we make progress. Um, the next component were there was a few regarding the student activity accounts with the deficit balance and the student activity purpose summary. Uh, again, those are at site levels. Typically, we're not necessarily, at least from central, we're not watching what individual student activity accounts do because at the sites, money es and flows. Uh, but we will continue to work with our sites to make sure that processes and procedures are in place and kind of hold firm um to the fact that they can't that this information that the purpose summary is is enforced and as are going deficit spending through the course of the year. Sometimes it's just a timing of payment. Um, and then I believe those were our findings and other than typically the standard internal controls and I any other questions I'm happy to address. But I think as we work to be better, we will be better. >> Absolutely. Well, thank you for for those responses and and I guess I would only say and to our treasurer um and to you because you've been kind of managing our finance advisory council since we've kind of suspended things down the road. I know they've got their hands full now, but um as the board thinks about and maybe through the committee or however uh how what do we do when we get this? How do we look at it and what can we do better or different ourselves as a board in terms of our role, you know? So that really my questions go to that and so I'll kind of yield to for the future the treasur to take you know think about it and see what she comes up with. >> Seeing no other hands up we will vote. This is a roll call vote and the vote is on uh the motion to approve the fiscal year 25 effort which is which stands for annual comprehensive financial report. >> Ready. >> Ready. >> Great. Director Basset, [snorts] >> yes. >> Director Bowman votes yes. Chair Evans Becker, >> yes. >> Director Hillbrand, >> yes. >> Director Long, >> yes. >> And Director Wuto, >> yes. >> Unanimous. >> All right, then. We have approved it. Let's move on to new business. And um we have a resolution to accept donations. And our donations are over $9,000 this time. Um, does someone want to move to accept the donations so we can do that officially? Director Bowman, >> I'll move to accept the donations. >> Thank you. Seconded by Director Basset. No hands are up. Let's do a roll call vote to accept those donations. >> Great. Thank you. Uh, Director Basset, >> yes. >> Director Bowman votes yes. Chair Evans Becker, >> yes. >> Director Hillbrand, >> yes. >> Director Long, >> yes. >> Director Wuto, >> yes. >> Unanimous. >> 6. We are accepting those donations and saying thank you to everyone who donated. All right. Number seven, policy. Uh policy committee does not have a report, but we do have the second read for several policies. Director Ut, is there anything we need to know? >> Uh no new updates. >> No new updates. Okay. So, it's policy uh 210, 211, 305, 5:15, and 709 that we are needing to approve tonight. We have a motion moved by Director Bowman. Second, >> seconded by Director Wuto. >> Seeing no hands, we did have this at our last meeting for the first read. Um, this is a voice vote rather than a roll call vote. And so all in favor of approving policy 210, 211, 305, 515, and 709, please say I. >> I. Oppose say nay. >> We have our policies updated for those policies. All right, moving on to number eight, administrative report. Superintendent Stalo. >> Thank you very much and good evening, Chair Evans Becker, school board directors. Uh those of you who are in the room and our viewing public at Robbinsdale Area Schools, our mission is to inspire and educate all learners to reach their unique potential and to positively contribute to their community. Our collective work is focused on that mission. And tonight I'd like to share some of the work in which we have been engaged in the priority theme of academic achievement. Last Monday 445 of our students from across the district came together at orchestra hall for our annual fall music festival and it was absolutely remarkable. The theme this year was light and our students truly brought that theme to life through their performances. We were honored to have guest conductor Manny Lauraniano lead our assemblies. our ensembles, I'm sorry. Uh he brings a high level of artistry and professionalism, and our students rose to meet that expectation on every piece that they performed. Our concert featured an impressive array of groups, including choirs from both Cooper and Armstrong, the symphonic wind ensembles, and symphony orchestras, and the Robbinsdale Elementary all district choir. Bringing these groups together in such a premier performance space is a beautiful celebration of our students. Uh countless hours of dedication and their love of music. The festival also highlights um is one of the highlights of the year. It shows the strength of our music programs, the expertise of our teachers and the incredible talent of our students. We're proud of how they represented their schools and our district on Minnesota's most uh one of Minnesota's most iconic stages. In the priority theme of academic achievement, I'm also pleased to share that two Plymouth Middle School students have been selected for the Midwestern Region ACDA grades 6 through nine soprano and alto honor choir. This is an incredibly competitive opportunity bringing together top student vocalists from 10 Midwestern states. Violet and Cecilia will perform on February 28th at the ACDA regional conference in Milwaukee representing both the school and our district. We're proud of their accomplishments um and grateful for the music educators who helped them prepare for this honor. In the realm of the strategic theme of community engagement, last Friday on November 14th, Meadow Lake and Northport joined schools from across the country in recognizing Ruby Bridges Walk to School Day, a day that encourages students to reflect on courage, inclusion, and the ongoing work of creating welcoming school communities. Students began the day with a virtual reading of I am Ruby Bridges during the morning announcements. And throughout [snorts] the classroom, students decorated shoe prints and wrote about how they can walk in courage in their own lives. These reflective activities sparked age appropriate conversations about standing up to racism, bullying, and exclusion. Students and staff wore purple to show unity and to honor Ruby's legacy. Each grade level also participated in a scheduled walk around the exterior of the school following a route similar to the one Ruby wrote walked as a first grader. The event connected directly to Meadow Lake's secondstep focus on growth mindset, reinforcing the importance of empathy, kindness, and taking positive action. It was a meaningful day for students and a strong example of how our schools weave cultural learning and social emotional development into daily experiences. Our kindergarten information fair is coming up on Saturday, November 22nd. That's this Saturday at Fair Crystal School. This event is one of our most important opportunities to connect with incoming families as we grow enrollment. To promote the fair, we have mailed postcards to all kindergarten eligible families in the district and to families within a onemile radius just outside our borders, inviting them to attend. The event showcases the exceptional learning experiences, supportive community, and comprehensive services Robbinsdale Area Schools offers every child. Families will meet school leaders and staff enjoy fun activities and gather in important information. Our goal is to create a warm, welcoming experience that builds confidence and excitement as families prepare to join Robinsdale. In the district priority of collaboration and partnerships, our American Indian Education program is preparing to host its annual round dance in honor of Native American Heritage Month. This event will take place this Friday, November 21st, from 5:30 to 8 at Robbinsdale Middle School. The Round Dance is a joyful and meaningful cultural gathering that brings together students, families, and community members um for an evening of song, dance, and shared connection. It's one of the most cherished cultural celebrations and it reflects the values of our community um the values of community, belonging, and partnership that are central to our district. This year, we're pleased to partner with Edina Public Schools to host this event, strengthening collaboration across districts and expanding opportunities for native students and families. Last week, Neil Elementary hosted a visit from state representative Mike Fryberg during the Ready Set Smile Dental Clinic. He visited his visit underscored the meaningful work happening in our fullervice community schools and the strong partnership supporting student well-being. The partnership has grown tremendously. When Ready Set Smile offered clinics in just two schools um and served fewer than 20 students, this year alone, the program has already served 237 students across six elementary schools, providing preventive dental care that many families might otherwise go without. It's a great example of how our community schools model uh continues to expand access to essential services and support the whole child. On Wednesday, November 12th, Son Elementary welcomed Crunch from the Minnesota Timberwolves for a special literacy event with kindergarten through 2 grade students. Crunch shared his favorite story and talked with students about why he loves reading, bringing a fun and energetic message about the importance of books. Every student went home with a free book, a card autographed by Crunch, and a goodie bag from the Timberwolves education station. In the priority theme of staff investment and impact, earlier this month, two of our adventure club supervisors, um Shan Jang from RSI and Melissa Hansen from C presented at the Minnesota Community Education Association state conference. Their sessions focused on how adventure club and early adventures strengthen meaningful relationships with students and families. Their presentation was a wonderful example of the thoughtful relationship centered work happening in our before and after school programs. That is what I have this evening. We have a lot going on and uh lots of amazing celebrations across the district. Thank you very much. >> Thank you. All right. The next thing in the administrative reports is the language access plan. Um you want to introduce that? >> Yes, I'd be happy to. as uh Tony Buon, director of student services, and Beth Temper, director of achievement and integration, make their way to the podium. Um they're going to uh provide a little bit more uh explanation of what this is. We wanted to give you um some background today and then we'll seek approval uh I believe at the December 1st uh board meeting. So with that, I'll hand it over to Tony. Thank you. >> Good evening, Chair Evans Becker, members of the board, and superintendent Stalo. I'm Tony Bdon, director of student services. Beth Terber, director of achievement and integration. >> So we are here to talk to you about Robbinsdale Area Schools language access plan. The purpose of the plan is to ensure that Robbinsdale Area Schools provides timely, meaningful, and equitable access to information and services for families and stakeholders who prefer to communicate in languages other than English. It's designed to remove language barriers and empower all families to engage in their child's education. Some of the highlights of our plan include identifying language needs, how language assistance services are provided such as interpreters and translation services, our staff roles and responsibilities, training and capacity in our building. So staff understanding their roles and this also includes professional development, two-way communication structures such as parent advisory groups, affinity groups, translated surveys and forms and monitoring and the evaluation of our language access plan on a yearly basis. So reviewing data, our interpreter use and taking family feedback. This is the first time this plan has been required and it's here for your review tonight. After your approval, it will be added to the website. Questions for us? >> Do you have any questions about this? >> I don't Oh, director VHO, >> I do. So, are the interpreters going to be in person or >> Yes, we have interpreters that come in person. We have them virtually. We have them by phone. Um, and we have them come to home visits. So each school um has a form that they fill out and they request what um mode of venue that they would prefer the interpreters. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Any other questions at this time? >> Okay, then we will be prepared to vote at our next meeting on this plan. >> Thank you. >> Did you have a question? >> Yeah, I just I'm sorry. I >> just get away, didn't you? >> Kind of digesting all this. Um, quick question about, so this is for pre-planned kind of things and for, um, uh, you know, written communication. Just curious about communication when, um, a parent comes into the school. Um, maybe they come into the school and their kid didn't get off the bus and they're saying, "Oh, my kid didn't get off the bus, but they're not speaking English." you know, how, you know, is that part of the plan or how do schools access, not that I need an answer specifically, but is that part of the plan is my question. >> That's not specifically called out in the plan, but we do have supports for that. For example, we have language line staff that are available that speak languages. Um, >> and then my other question just had to do with um I can't think of the correct word, but simplified English. you know, have we trained staff on using um you know, clear, concise, and simplified English instead of um more complex English when we're using when we're creating forms and putting out um information to families. >> I would need to come back to you with that. I don't have the exact answer for that. >> Okay, >> thank you, >> Dr. Basset. >> Um is there an interface? We have actually some uh some of our own team. I think they work uh under uh Miss Ter's uh guidance uh that actually uh work with some of our affinity groups. And so is there any interface with those staff and this initiative? >> Absolutely. Um [clears throat] it's critical that we work within our family and community engagement team and they have a role with um this plan specifically. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. Seeing no more questions. Thank you very much and we'll see you at our next meeting probably. All right. Sadly, that's the end of our agenda. So, I would take a motion to adjurnn. Moved by director Bowman, seconded by director. >> All in favor, please say I. >> I. Say nay. >> We are adjourned for the business meeting, but stay tuned because the study session comes up next. Um, can we start that like in five minutes? Did that work for everybody? >> Okay, we Thank you. Uh, we're adjourned. We'll be back in five minutes for our study session. >> Student approved, too. >> I know, right? >> Student approved. Okie dokie. We're back. >> They're back. >> Thank you everybody. We're back. Um, if you are holding signs, remember you can't block the view of anybody behind you with your signs. Okay. So, this is the beginning of the board study session. And generally when we have a study session, the board introduces themselves and the people at the table introduce themselves and then the people in the room introduce themselves. But we're not going to do that. We'll just have the board and the people on the front tables just so you know who we all are and then we'll get right to it. So I'm greet Evans Becker, board chair. We'll go this way. >> Caroline Long, vice chair. >> Aviva Hillenbrand, treasurer. >> Renee Bowman, clerk. >> Kristen Hohheisel, chief financial officer. Amy over executive director human resources >> Nick >> Becky Rodier senior director of teaching and learning >> Bob McDall assistant superintendent >> and Wuto school board >> Helen Basset school board >> Terry Stella superintendent right that's that's good uh introduction and purp uh we did that purpose and agenda Do you take that? >> Sure, I can. The purpose of study sessions is to have an opportunity uh for board members um to discuss and gain information that they need um in order to make the best possible decisions uh at the board table. And tonight we'll be doing some work around the school board uh vacancy that we have and then we'll continue working through um our statutory operating debt plan uh focusing on site consolidation this evening. Okie dokie. So the next thing on our agenda is the district governance and policy department and that is our school board director vacancy update. So to update everyone, we had 17 people file as candidates for to fill the position that has been vacated. And so what's happened so far is all of the board directors have gotten all of their applications blind, just A through Q. And we rated all of their answers one to five. And now what we have is a list of the scores of the candidates. We are going to discuss how many and which ones we are going to be interviewing. The interviewing will be on Thursday. When we have decided who we're going to interview, [clears throat] um, Director Long, Vice Chair, and I will find out who they are with with their phone numbers. We will recess. Well, first we'll recess. We will recess the meeting for about 10 minutes while director Long and I call everybody before we announce to the public who they are. Then after that we'll go on for the um operational and oversight direction. So Thursday then Thursday from starting at six o'clock we're going to be interviewing the candidates and we will interview all of the candidates at the same time it will be public and so uh they'll all answer question number one answer question number two answer question number three and then we will decide our top candidate and offer that person the position of school board director that person will start uh at the first meeting in January so that's how it goes all right so directors first thing Could you take a look at the scoring summary and um if you have a thought about how many I know last time most of people said three maybe four. Um see what your feelings are now that you see the numbers. [clears throat] >> Oh and the numbers are up there. >> Hey. So what are what are we thinking? >> Do you want to >> I think the top four. >> You think the top four? Um, any other thoughts? You think the top four? >> I had >> You thinking the top four? >> Circle. >> Director Hillbrand, what are you thinking? Top four, top six? >> Three or four? I >> three or four. Okay. Um, director WHO thoughts? >> Um, three or four for me as well. >> Okay. All right. So, that would be that one. 108, 115, 119. Isn't there another one over 100? Oh, there it is. >> 108. >> Okay. So, could I This is a study session, but we are allowed to have motions in the study session. So, to make it official, could someone move that we interview the top four? Director Bowman, >> I'll move approval that we interview the top four. >> Okay. Is there a second? >> Second. >> Seconded by Seconded by Director Wuto. Move by Director Bowman that we interview the top four people. Um, all in favor, please say I. >> I. I >> Jose nay. >> Okay. Um I'm going to declare a recess chair. >> Yes. >> Before So you mentioned interviewing on Thursday. What What time is that? >> We are interviewing. It starts at 6, doesn't it? Um Molly. >> Yes. >> 6 o'clock. It starts on Thursday. >> Okay. >> And it goes until we have a person. All right. I'm going to declare a recess and hopefully it won't take more than 10 minutes. We are in recess. I'll beat you in a Okay, we're back. And once again, we had 17 people apply for this and we could we are only going to be interviewing four, but we thank everyone who applied for their interest and I want to remind everybody that uh candidates can file this summer for the four openings that are going to be on the board. So, um, having said that, I would like to let you know who we are going to be interviewing on Thursday at six, starting at six o'clock. [snorts] We are going to be interviewing Richard Bintesen, Cheryl Holm Hansen, Brian Half, and Lenny Kaufman. So, that's Thursday the 20th starting at 6. Those are our candidates. Before we move on to the next thing on the agenda, uh board members, the questions that we're asking the people are private because we don't want the whole world to know what we're going to be asking them. But one of the questions is about board norms. And these are the norms that the five five of us were at the meeting um voted put together last summer. And so I I'm going to ask a question involving norms. And I just want like nods that this will be okay. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes and not yes. Okay, we have five out of six going yes. So we're [clears throat] going to go we will go with that. Do you have a different set that you want to use? >> Um the ones that are already posted online >> be good. >> Okay. So if we can find them online, would you be willing to use those two or those? I I not sure what the what what that means. >> You pull them up. >> So, are you saying [snorts] there is a different norms online? Is that what >> that's what you're saying? And I said just pull them up. >> Okay. >> Pull them up. >> It's going to take a minute cuz for whatever reason my computer shut down. >> Oh, yeah. Mine just did a reset, too. >> Okay. >> Anything might be. >> So, either way, we'll have a Norm's question. It'll either be these or the ones online and I can live with that. Do I have nods for if if they are located online? We'll do that. Not uh director Bowman. >> Yes. No, you're fine. Uh Director Basset. >> Oh. Uh so that will not be the totality of the questions is related to the norms, will it? >> Oh, no. >> Well, good. >> That would be a very short interview process. >> Skills. >> That would be a very short interview. >> Bowman. My only comment was that uh this was approved by five board members and if we really do uphold the notion that we speak as one after we've done the vote, I I would hope that we would just go with the ones that we most recently voted on because I don't know how old the ones are online. So >> that would be my only p from a governance perspective. These are the ones that we approved. And to come back to the table and and ask for us to switch it around is uh >> Oh, you know what? They're the same. >> It should be the same. >> They're the same >> for all the details. >> Um yeah, we'll speak with one voice. We will recognize a single official voice of the board. We'll be clear and stay true to the role of the board. Um we will build trusting and respectful relationships with staff and fellow board members. We'll be on time and prepared for the meetings and ground our decisions in what is best for all children. We will maintain the confidentiality of privileged information including statements made in executive sessions. We will recognize the necessity for professional growth and development as a board and as individuals commit to regular training and increase to increase our experience. I think they're pretty much the same just in a different order. >> Similar. Yeah, >> they're okay fine. I can live with that. >> I like the children part. >> Okay. I can I [clears throat] can live with that. Can anybody >> Well, it still doesn't answer my point, but go ahead. >> I agree. But it it if we can all agree, then we'll do that. All right, we'll do that. And there will be other questions. All right, that moves us to the operational performance oversight and organizational direction. Take it away, Superintendent Stalo. >> Thank you very much. Uh good evening again board members and our community members at Robinsdale Area Schools. Um tonight as we continue to move through the early stages of phase one of the statutory operating debt plan and facility recommendation um I'll begin by setting just a little bit of context. Uh we'll review where we have been, share some additional information um through questions that board members asked as well as input that we got from community members um as we work toward a bar decision to approve for publication site consolidation this evening. So, the pictures of the students on this slide serve as a reminder that this entire process has been focused on um how we work to create a better school district now and into the future for our students. As we engage in this really complex work, um I want to share what's been written on my whiteboard in my office for over a year. In quotes, it says to build and transform forward to create the district of love, inclusion, joy, and excellence. And in getting to know this community over the past 16 months, it's been clear to me that others share this vision. So, [snorts] in part, that's the journey that we're on. And while we're making some important decisions right now, or while we were over a year ago around budgets, we're in the midst right now of making some short-term decisions on our way to some longer term decisions. And this is the timeline. Actually, Bob, if you go back one, please. This is the timeline that we've shown numerous times um since the end of September. and you can see where we are um the meetings in front of us yet toward that decision making around the statutory operating debt plan. Um as we begin tonight um I want to just clarify a few things. Uh we have been incredibly transparent about our current short-term timelines [snorts] as you can see on the slides. Additionally, we've communicated multiple times that we're in the early stages of phase one in the process. We need to complete the statutory operating debt plan and reduce the footprint through initial building closures, consolidation, and reconfiguration. That's where we are. And we've got five phases of this plan to continue to work through. So, we're at one step right now between now and January. and then we'll move on to the next steps. I want to thank those of you who have sent emails to the school board and administration and I want to acknowledge uh that how we're all experiencing the realities of our current uh school district is dependent on our experiences and the and the current decisions that are being made. There's nothing easy right now for anyone about where we are as a school district. I want to thank board members and the public for your questions. Your questions have helped us focus and dig and look at every possible factor that we can through this process as we bring forward recommendations to you tonight. [snorts] These are the first of decisions for our schools facilities and programming for this year. As you recall, we went through some difficult months of decision-m last year as we worked to significantly reduce our budget. But because of the timing of knowing about that budget deficit, we chose last year not to consolidate and close schools. Although I don't think I've met a person in the district that hasn't said that we are absolutely operating too many schools. We can't sustain the number of schools that we're currently operating. We are in statutory operating debt. And we have to make some really unpopular and difficult decisions to move us not just to a better place financially, but to also make sure that we're working to improve our schools. The gravity of the decisions that we're making tonight are real, and I know it feels like the end for some. I certainly know the pain and loss of closing buildings and consolidating schools. I'd like to offer another perspective. Tonight's also a beginning, a beginning of rolling up our sleeves and doing the work that we know we must do for our current and future students. A beginning of decisions that will help us gain efficiencies, opportunities, and the alignment of resources that will better support and serve our students for the long run. I've loved the emails that we've received. I've admired those who have been willing to speak at listening time and I've embraced many conversations asking questions about where we are. Um, all pointing right to the positives of our schools. Our schools are filled with brilliant students, caring adults, and communities and families who support them across the country. It seems that no matter how critical people are of public education, they love their schools. And that's what I want for every single one of our students, our staff, and our family members. I also want to remind you all, we are in statutory operating debt. We are one of only a handful of school districts across the state in this kind of financial crisis. We simply do not have the option to do nothing. CFO Ho Hohisel last meeting shared with us a chart that shows what happens down the road if we do nothing. In addition to the financial crisis, we have facilities that have tremendous deferred maintenance needs and in are need are in need of updates to support safety, security, and student learning. In addition, as a district, we are far from where we want to be in terms of academic success that we want for each and every one of our students. Also, our reputation and the stories told about us by others outside of our district and by some inside the district needs to be improved by ensuring that we are telling our own story and improving our district as a whole. The journey we're on was predictable when I said yes to this position 16 months ago. The data all pointed to the need to review programming and academics in order to figure out how best to support all students learning at high levels. The fiscal instability was clear and the need to reduce the budget was obvious due to declining enrollment over many many years. It was obvious we needed to rightsize our district and not oper operate so many schools. We have old facilities that have many needs that need to be updated. All [snorts] of this is needed in order for Robbinsdale Area Schools to be the choice district for our residents and to be a destination district for others. So, we decided in order to improve, we needed to cocreate the future of Robbinsdale Area Schools with our community. And that's how we spent last year. We established [snorts] a vision team where 155 people applied, 46 joined that team that represented every demographic and uh geography of the district. We conducted a community survey, held community meetings, staff meetings, student meetings, focus groups. We held popup events in the district in various locations across the district. [snorts] All told, we had over 17,000 people engaged in this process. The vision team met for eight months. Their task was to study our [clears throat] academic programming, to have some input on how we measure success in our district, to review enrollment assumptions, demographic um studying, and to rightsize the district, give recommendations for how many schools should operate, and to assess our building and facility needs. Through study, research, data review, members of the vision team were asked to make recommendations that would help us with our budget, with our facilities, and with our achievement challenges and set a vision forward that we could create the school district that our students want, need, and deserve. The team shared these recommendations with the board on September 23rd. I want to be very, very clear. The vision team did not make any recommendations in terms of what buildings to close. That's the job of the administration, not the job of the vision team. And I've gotten some questions about that. So, I want to be really clear on that. Um, they helped identify their perspective of how many buildings, but not what buildings. We've communicated all parts of this process on our website in regular updates to the staff and families and we most recently sent out a postcard to all of our residents making sure that people again understood where we are are at this point in the process and some of those important dates. So we haven't been able to get to the vision part of this yet. As you saw in the timeline, we have some decisions right now to make to get us to January, to get us to submit a SOD plan, and then we'll continue working through with our community um all of the vision recommendations uh to determine um what that looks like. However, as I said, we first have to do the job that's at at hand tonight. So, just as a reminder um of uh the work that we've done since September with both those short and long-term timelines and recommendation for site consolidation. Um I just want to remind you of the the buildings right now impacted in those recommendations. Son, Lake View, Neil, Northport, Noble, RMS, SMS, and High View. We recognize and value the communities, the traditions at each school and the years of community building and care and commitment that it takes from all members of a community in order for culture to be created. It's also important to remember that it's always about the people, not the building. We will work with whatever sites are consolidated to help establish and provide opportunities for new identities, new culture, new systems um to be set um as we work to support all of our sites moving forward. [clears throat] So, with that, I'm going to hand it over to uh Dr. McDow. Review again some of the work that we've been through as we get to where we currently are. Um and then we'll look forward board members uh to questions that you have um as we discuss the options at hand. >> Thanks Bob. >> Thank you. [clears throat] So I'm going to start just with reviewing uh things that you've seen before um and starting with this slide because it is complex and it's clunky as you've been experiencing. Um we've definitely have hit the phase of the pond to shrinking effect and all that comes with it and is justifiable that it does. Um everything that is part of a recommendation has a trade-off. Everything. We can make different decisions but each decision has a trade-off for the the short term and for the long term. and everything regardless of what decisions are made again are going to have impacts to students, staff, communities, all all of it. And so I put this slide up just as a reminder to that as we begin the discussion is there there is no perfect answer to this. However, it does present the ability for possibilities and opportunities as we move into the longer term. We've shown this slide several times because this slide we come back to administratively when we're making decisions when we're looking at different options is really where do we get the balance between efficiency and effectiveness and equity. It can't be one over the other. It's really about balance. And the same is with regard to making a decision that is most desirable of the decisions available. what's feasible and what's sustainable over time. In this case, what's sustainable regardless of whether there's a ultimate referendum at some point or or not. We've shared with you that along the way administratively, we've used a guiding change to help keep us centered um on what do we what are we anticipating we're going to do? What does that look like? is it still within the sandbox we've created uh to give us some of that direction and something to come back to. And then we've shared that for us to make sense of how to get to this, we really have to look at both primary decision points and secondary decision points. And what does that mean? All in all, here's a summary. We we began with those re-imagine 2030 recommendations. We've provided an administrative timeline and process for not only statutory operating debt but also the longerterm phasing timeline. U does not yet have specifics to it because every domino creates another set of dominoes. We talked about that about a month ago is we we all know that that we want to know the exact end and at this point we're playing back to things that we don't know to be the case. We we don't know if there's going to be a referendum. That changes things at that point in time. Um so we can only get so far and then we have to reevaluate and then we have to reevaluate and re-evaluate. We've shared the guiding change, primary and secondary decision points. We've shared considerations and information for the arrival at initial options that we shared. We've shared limitations that affect the scope for available decisions for next year. We've also provided rationale and initial recommendations. We've provided additional reduction options and financial rationale for those. and we've provided additional answers and requested information from the school board as we move through this process. You'll remember back in October, we presented a set of general recommendations. This holds true today. Administratively, we believe that we need to work to get to an elementary footprint of buildings to five to six non-magnet elementary schools. We believe we need to reduce middle school to one to two non-magnet middle schools. We believe we need to close Robinsdale Middle School. We need to close this ESC building and consolidate. We need to relocate the community ed office spaces with Crystal Learning Center and run out that lease. That has not changed. We also presented specific recommendations in November. Those recommendations were to close Robinsdale Middle School and move S uh move students to Sandberg, to close Lake View Elementary School and repurpose that building. To close Sonos Elementary School and consolidate with Neil, close this educational service center and move it to Lake View Elementary. move High View and Robbinsdale Virtual Academy to Lake View and relocate community education office spaces to the Crystal Learning Center. In addition to the recommendations, we provided specifics around each one of those moves. So, this slide again was shared on 113 and provided the rationale for why we're making the recommendation for Robbinsdale Middle School. We did the same thing for High View and Robbinsdale Virtual Academy on 113. The same thing for the Educational Services Center, this building, the same thing for the community education offices, the same thing for Lake View Elementary. And then we spent a significant amount of time on the South Central elementary schools. That is because it was a bigger process. Superintendent Stalo talked about the fact that it's an impact to more than just a singular school. Um we're this isn't a conversation about one or two elementary schools being affected. It affects multiple schools. When we start talking about consolidation, not just the buildings that are closed, the students move. Staff has to go through a process of staffing that impacts staff. Administration has to go through a process of staffing. It impacts administration. We have transportation. We have boundaries. All of that. So, it's much more than a singular impact to a singular school. We were asked to dig in further to the Sonos and Neil consol consolidation conversation. And so, that's what we did. The board had several questions. The community had several questions to the board. forwarded them to us. So as an administrative team, we started back at the beginning. We started looking through everything to answer the questions at that time that were being presented to us. The board had asked for clarification on specifics of the differences of the two buildings and that's what you see up on the slide right now. Both Sonos and Neil are within one classroom of one another. They also each have small rooms in their buildings. Sonison has six of them. Neil has five. These are rooms that aren't big enough to be a classroom, but they could be for something else. They could be office space different than the main office. We also looked at kindergarten classrooms. The kindergarten classrooms at Neil are significantly larger. There's three designated in each building. We will need a combination of four classrooms for kindergarten. The difference between the classrooms at the two buildings is that Neil's three ba three kindergarten classrooms also have bathrooms. We looked at the media center. Sonison has a a little bit larger media center. We looked at the cafeteria. Neil ends up having a larger cafeteria space. The kitchen at Neil is quite a bit larger. And in talking with the food service, nutrition services is better suited to uh provide food service for 500 plus kids. We looked at the gym space because there were questions about the gym space and even with the divider wall at Neil. The gym spaces are comparable in size. Sonos does have a multi-purpose room. It's currently being used for adventure club. Neil uses two two classrooms for the comparable space. Neil also has one classroom that supplies early all day adventure club. Has its own entrance to the building off of the main parking lot. There is a stage at Son, however, it is really small, but there is a stage. Son does have two sets of private bathrooms. We took the 10-year facility condition assessment, and you'll see the totality of that there. What we talked about with condition last time was really focused on those one, two, and threeyear uh what was that going to look like? However, in looking at all of it, unlike Robindale Middle School, neither school is in catastrophic position. The acreage is almost exactly the same for both buildings. When we look at routed uh students routed for transportation, you can see there's roughly a 20 student difference. the walk zone. Uh Neil has more students in the walk zone. They're relatively close in location and the overall square footage is a difference of about 3,000 square ft. So if we put that into narrative form, Neil houses the early adventure all day programming. It has a separate entrance directly off the main parking lot. The kindergarten classrooms are significantly larger and have bathrooms. While an additional room is needed, Neil operates has operated four kindergarten classrooms before. And that fourth room is set up for kindergarten while it's a smaller room right next to the bathrooms. The main parking lot at Neil is more conducive to increase traffic patterns. Uh both schools have traffic that flows through the front of the building and off to the side of the building. uh both have two different places that they receive busing for general ed and for special education. Again, when we look at the cafeteria and gym space, Neil provides for a larger space, better flow, adaptable space, and it has the ability to lock the doors to the cafeteria. The kitchen at Neil is better suited for handling those increased number of students due to the update space and the line flow. And the recommendation to close Sonos affords us the opportunity and ability to balance boundaries if we would so choose on the west side of 169. The conditions of the building continue to be a primary consideration of the leadership team. However, as I said, neither building is in catastrophic jeopardy of failure and therefore it really just becomes a decision of expense over time. The rationale you see on the screen right now is not changed. It's the [clears throat] same rationale. All of what we've presented as recommendations adhere to the guiding change document. They're the best we have to balance efficiency, effectiveness, and equity. They're the most desirable of the options and feasible. The moves are sustainable regardless of whether we have a subsequent ref bond referendum or not. They minimize the disruption across the district. They allow for special education needs. They allow for early learning adventure programming needs. They provide opportunities for future referendum and the opportunity for reimagine 2030 options. They allow for a more efficient use of existing buildings and they mitigate the number of potential students leaving the district. We believe due to school closure. The moves balance the need for the statutory operating debt plan resizing and potential of the reimagined 2030 plan. They also support approximately $2.5 million of the first year of the statutory operating debt plan. Therefore, our administrative recommendation is unchanged. We recommend the board approve for publication the board's consideration to reduce the district's overall building footprint and align facility use with enrollment and program needs by repurposing Lake View Elementary School as a new central campus for district programs and administrative offices. Closing Robindale Middle School, closing the educational service center, closing Sonos Elementary School. As far as next steps would be, depending upon what the board chooses to do tonight, our publication notice would go out and run November 27th through December 4th. We would hold at the board's will an additional listening session different than the hearing. That's part of the December 8th meeting. We would then have the public hearing and schoolboard vote on December 15th. As far as additional statutory operating debt reductions and the submission plan, simultaneously we would continue with the initial reduction decisions impacting registration and programming particularly for our secondary schools. Doing that November 24th in a week already. Additional recommendations and decisions November 24th, December 1st. and then final recommendations and decisions for that initial statutory operating debt planning document December 8th and January 5th. And with that, I'll turn it over to Superintendent Stalo and board for questions uh for the team. >> And board members, I know that we tried to incorporate some of the questions that you had asked into this presentation. um some of them as recent as today we got uh responses back to you but are happy to um take additional questions or if you would like more information about anything that we've already um provided some responses to. >> Okay. So, Director Bowman, >> just a this is a quick question, I hope. Uh, in repurposing Lake View or the schools that are mentioned on here, where are they going to where will the students where would the students end up? So, the right where would they end up? So the the secondary students, so Robinsville Middle School, the students would move to Sanberg Middle School. The students from Lake View Elementary for the most part would go to Noble. There might be some that would need to go to Northport. That would depend upon final boundaries, final transportation. We do have the um consideration of highway 100 and where a exact families live. Students from Sonos would go to Neil and that would be that move. So the consolidation would take place uh in the Neil building. >> Okay. Thank you, >> Dr. Basset. Well, one of my questions, and thank you for responding, superintendent, uh, had to do with whether all of Neil could fit into Noble and, uh, you want to maybe respond to that publicly here? >> Yes. If if no other, and I'm looking to, uh, my colleague, but, if no other students were being moved into Noble, we believe it would be very tight. Uh, but I think they could fit. Bob, am I right on that? So the answer to the question, it depends and it depends upon what other programming we put into buildings. So it's not just a matter of moving general education students, but our elementaryaries also house a significant number of center-based programs in them. And so part of the whole uh movement is going to be how many of the center-based programs are we able to put into each one of our elementary schools while we move them. So, um technically the answer is yes, but the classrooms we we only have so many classrooms as you saw on the screen and so um depending upon what that actually looks like would depend upon how many center-based classrooms we'd be able to house in the building as well. >> Well, thank you so much. Um I guess I would say that one of the parameters that um the board has been operating from based on guidance from the administration is that uh in this round of um decision-m we weren't really addressing programming. That's not something we were contemplating. That was the directive. So, um, the fact of the matter is is that, uh, the placement appro and and and I I'll go further and say this really when it comes to needing to close buildings, the need is there. And of course, the initial directive was not to look at programming, you know, but to really look at how many do we need to close. And I think that um that's one of the reasons when I saw the recommendation from the reimagining committee, I could understand that because that's something that we've talked about tenatively here at the board table. I mean, you know, and and with others. So, we know we need to close buildings. So, in terms of um that that's understandable programs can be lifted and moved anywhere because we have facility. That's not a that's not the that's you know that's not the end of the world. The programming, which alludes to what you just said, can be lifted up and can be placed where the will of our community is. with the expertise that we have from our administration, with the input that we have from the cities that are partners to us, with all of those factors. And really, quite frankly, we really haven't really addressed that because we weren't that wasn't part of our charge is to talk about programming. So, we've not done that. So, uh for me, um I am just stating that for the record. So if Neil can fit wholesale into Noble and Noble has less of the um physical requirements for repair based on the data that we have and far as I can decipher because I've got a number of different charts that is the case that there's fewer need for repairs at Noble than some of the other buildings. And I just want to make sure that's a that's an accurate statement before I go further. So I don't know if that's you and I I saw Miss Mullen earlier and she's she's around here somewhere. Uh but maybe even the you know some others may know the answer to that question but I think that that's understandable. Uh I think our public has made it very you know made some good uh comments with regard to splitting the children. They've made some very very strong and good arguments for that. And if we can fit a whole other building into one that can accommodate those children so that we don't do that split, it enables us to decide then in the the next phase of whatever what kind of programming is necessary to accommodate the kinds of things that you just talked about because I think that this board and community, as far as I know, is very sensitive to the needs of special education. We've been for years and that's not changed. And so uh I think that for me it's one step at a time but the same values that we have expressed are values that are real for me. So, if we can pick those programs up and set them someplace, that would be what I would prefer. And, uh, that's what I'm advocating for because based on what you've told us, it's possible, you know, and so, um, makes sense to to to really time to talk about it in that way. Still leaves a facility offline. For the life of me, I can't understand how come we we don't have New Herbal Learning Center involved in this. They have a very low census. I I don't even understand that. And I've asked that question two or three times because if it's closing facilities to get to the number we need and we care about these students, then I think that should be on the on the agenda as well. New Hope Learning Center, I think, has one of the lowest censuses of all the data I saw and I'd like to have that verified. I think it was like 227 or something like that, you know, and so um and I'm not going to quibble numbers right now. I think that, you know, I really appreciate all the work that's been done pulling together all this information. I really really do. and all the work that you've done and your colleagues and all that hard work, you know, but it's important work. I'm not telling you anything you don't know, but the bottom line is that we've gotten some things wrong fiscally in this district for some decades. And so going another step down the road to do something else that uh we are clearly hearing is going to cause unnecessary when we have capacity. If we didn't have buildings, it'd be another story. We have them. New Hope Elementary does not hold this the the student body that either of these schools do that we're talking about closing. So we got New Hope. If Neil goes to Noval, you've got Neil. This can close. There are issues relating to this ESC that cost I don't know it cost a lot of money and the fact is is that there we haven't even had a chance to talk about the fact that what are we going to do with the land that there's problems with this site if we abandon it we've got a s well whatever they call it super site with some problems right now it's serving its purpose so to move is not something that I support. I'll just say it right right now. I don't support that. Say right here, you know, and some of the other things because and some of the things I've already said. So, I'm just, you know, kind of being transparent about this uh because I think this is our opportunity. The recommendations that I think made sense is recommendation number one. The other recommendation is recommendation number two. Um, you know, recommendation number five sounds feasible. I'm sorry. So, I'm sorry, Director Williams. You know, it's just a have a little humor so I can calm myself down, you know, but um [snorts] so the majority of the recommendations that are on this list, I understand. And then we have time. And the other thing is that we haven't even heard from we haven't even had a public hearing. I MEAN [applause] [applause] >> and it's a requirement of the state that you have a public hearing when you talk about closing a school. >> We're talking about closing multiple schools. >> We have public hearings. Can we can we respond to Can we respond to some of this? Sure. >> And and first of all, if we could go, Bob, we go to the timeline that says exactly when the public hearing is. >> Thank you. >> And we've been talking about this exact same timeline for weeks. Nothing has changed. The public hearing has been set for December 15th. We've added or are recommending to the board >> that we add an additional December 8th listening time. >> Okay. I think that let's let's unravel some of this. Let's start with the New Hope Learning Center first of all, which is not an elementary school. >> Correct. Used to be >> um Wait, wait, wait. Audience, >> it's not how it's currently being housed in the programming. So, Bob and Anthony, if you'd please share some information. Yeah, just a couple things on I mean again I'm going to go back to I'm going to go back to this this slide right here. Here's where we are, right? We're in the middle of this. >> Mhm. >> There's a couple things just to unpack what you shared director pass. We have been looking at programming. There's multiple programs at New Hope Learning Center if we stick with that building, right? It's not just one program in that building uh to take care of. It's multiple. Um it is not an elementary school like our other elementary schools. That is not the case. It's not being looked at in the same manner because of that right now. With regard to the the other statements around Noble and Neil and cost, it is true that Noble from a facility condition assessment is less in need than the other buildings. However, again, from a programming standpoint, if we [snorts] were to move Neil into Noble, that would push that building at about 504 students current day. The capacity of that building, Noble, is about 542 students. >> That is not inclusive of special education. I would make an argument that in our current state of operation, we do not just pick up our special education kids and place them into another building when we can help it. We keep them with their peer students. That is not what the plan includes would be to move one of our buildings and then move all the centerbased students out of that building into someplace else. That is not part of the recommendation. >> A question for him. >> Um did you want to speak before respond just uh add a little bit about the new hope learning center as uh Dr. Dr. Mal already talked to it does house multiple it does house uh multiple programs early learning programs um most specifically um obviously early learning early childhood family education early childhood special education um majority of those programs um are funded through either special ed or through uh community through fund 4 um so there's not the same level of uh you wouldn't get any staffing efficiency [clears throat] by closing the New Hope Learning Learning Center because it's not they're not general ed staff a majority of Um, also the building itself operates um outside of just the early learning center. It operates as an additional space for Cooper athletics um to host practices. So, so to be it just has different it has additional [clears throat] impacts just to close the building and it does not get you the staffing efficiency that the other decisions will get you. >> Thank you, >> director. Uh thank you both for your re responses and and and thank you also uh director or sup assistant superintendent uh McDonald for um your comments related to um the fact that there has been some looking at programming. Well, I mean I suspected there was but there was none that we talked about together with the board. So you we we all believe that you're over here working hard in this building. So I just assume that you're talking about some of those things. the board has not been party to those conversations. So perhaps that could have even preceded the some of the comments I made tonight about programming had I had we had let me just and I'm not saying this is this is not personal. This is just my opportunity to express the things that concern me. That's it. we listen to your presentation and and so I think um with regard to the um public hearing thank you superintendent because you and I did discuss adding and and we haven't voted but we did discuss adding an additional one because there was not one on the 8th it was on the 15th so um because we are moving toward trying to make some decisions to tonight I mean and that's been a kind of a moving target for me you know and I I admit to being really kind of ill the last couple of weeks. I'm not as on top of things, but uh I so I appreciate adding that and and as I said a few minutes ago, none nothing that's been said has changed my mind until we hear from the public. I feel very reluctant to uh accept recommendations wholesale. And I've talked about some of those things that make sense that I'm on board with. You know, they're global. we have more to do but it's you know just like you're taking incremental steps as a board director I'm just doing the same thing and we haven't talked about programming so Dr. McDow, will you please go back one more slide or maybe it's the actually the other direction. So on this chart, which again the board has seen since September, you can see where the places of programming are and they don't happen in longcale programming doesn't happen in the highlighted area that we currently are. However, the the programming that we have talked about is center-based programming. But you can see later on in the phase approaches where we'll be talking um about long range programming and and plans for the school district. So again, that's something that's been shared with the board and community uh since September. [snorts] >> Um I'm going to give somebody else another turn a turn. We'll just put you back on the list. Okay. All right. Director Long. >> Okay. Um I have a couple questions, so I'm going to ask a few and then I'll probably put myself back on the list. Okay. So one of them I am wondering about when you were talking about the kindergarten classrooms at the two different sites. Is it a requirement that kindergarten classrooms have bathroom inside the classroom or No. >> No. No. >> No. The kinder classrooms are generally larger than other classrooms though. >> Okay. >> It's not required. No. >> And then what will be the cost of repurposing Lake View? say more about what you mean >> because in your uh plan you said that you wanted to repurpose Lake View. So I'm wondering what the cost that will be to repurpose Lake View. >> So there'll be in order to repurpose any building there will be costs associated with moving whatever gets moved into that building. There'll be costs associated with moving if Sonos were to close and consolidate to Neil. There'll be costs associated with moving the ESC to Lake View in this case. What those specific costs are are dependent upon exactly what it is we are able to afford quite frankly at that point in time and what can be utilized in terms of deferred maintenance long-term facility maintenance dollars. More detailed I'd have to turn it over to CFO Hisel for specifics. specific. I don't know if this is on. I know I have to be close. Thank you. Um, what would need to happen immediately? Uh, moving larger adults, High View high school age children would have to be the the restrooms. Those would need to be adjusted. Um, as far as the fixtures within the restrooms, >> you keep going in and out. >> Oh, I'm trying not to. Okay, I won't move my head. um the fixtures in the restrooms would need to be altered because uh they would be designed for uh younger students and that's not what would be in that building anymore. Beyond that, as far as an educational space for High View and RVA uh on a floor, I don't know that there would need much more adjusting adjustment because again, it is an educational space already. It's just the fixtures designed in the bathroom don't suit the age of the population that we would be educating. Um on the other floor which would house the enrollment center and other elements of ESC. Um haven't done a walkth through. It would be where can you put cubicles? There might be a few walls that need to be added to create offices. Um that has not been costed out. Um and again to Dr. McDow's point, we, you know, you there's there isn't um an inordinate amount of resources to to accommodate a different design. So, you would do your best to try to minimize essentially again walls or office spaces along with the plumbing fixtures. So, then too, if we are moving people from this building to another, will we be like how will that move be happening? Will we be renting movers to move people? Will there be a cost associated with that? Will staff just be expected to do that on their own dime? What what will that look like? Will we be providing boxes that will be some of the cost in moving so that people can pack their things and then unpack them? >> Yes, we would be providing boxes and and um supplies that would be needed to make the move. uh depending on what buildings you're talking about. If you are talking about having to move uh students out of one educational space and into another, again, that's very timerestrictive. We don't the summer um and and I'm sure we can all appreciate it on a cold day, the summer isn't as long as we'd all like to believe it to be. Um and so that move would have to happen relatively quickly. So, we would need to uh hire outside assistance to help probably get things moved, like the actual physical movement of um items from point A to point B. That that's going to exist regardless of who's going where. Um this building isn't quite as time-sensitive and probably would be more staggered because we're not based on an academic calendar. And so as soon as buildings free up um you would we would start again we wouldn't necessarily want the enrollment center to be moved in August or September. That's a hightraic timeline. So it's either we if they can't move before then they're going to be going after that timeline. And so the staggered move would then allow us um to do some more work internally with our staff. But when it's a really tight timeline, yes, we're going to need help on moving days. >> Okay. And then my last question and then I'll put my name back on the list. Um, a soil study. So on some of the buildings that we are going to be possibly selling, has there been a soil study done on them? I've heard that this site that we're on right now that possibly the land is contaminated um so that might prevent a selling of this land for different usage. I have not been privy to any conversation about any land selling. As a matter of fact, internally I I was asked that question um from a different group and in absence of board conversation and direction moving forward. Right now, our our uh main objective I in part is to just start the phasing process and achieve some financial efficiencies that we can get as it relates to the SOD plan. As far as the future of any particular site and whether we are uh keeping it or selling it, that is for future board discussion. >> Director Hillbrand. Yeah, I just wanted to go back to some of the things that Director Basset said because I was a little lost and a little confused. Um, talked about multiple plans and I just wanted to clarify a little bit and try to follow because we were presented with two initial plans and both of them had either Lake View or Noble both Noble I believe uh being closed. Those were the two two options and both would have been split. there was no option that did not involve a school being split because I asked if [clears throat] there was any possibility of an option where a school didn't have to be split and that I was told that there really wasn't an option where a school would not be split. And I just want to be really clear and transparent because facts matter and this is a really really difficult conversation. No matter what, somebody's school is going to be closed. Somebody is going to be hurt by this process. Teachers, families, students, community members, nobody wants to see their school closed. Nobody here wants to be voting on a school being closed. So, I want to be really clear and transparent and and the the facts matter. So, I just want to be really clear. I am not happy that any school is going to be closed nor that a school has to be split, but those were the options we are presented with. Either way, a school is going to be split. So, I just want to be really clear that nobody is happy with this, but those are the options we are presented with. And so, there as far as I know, there were only two options presented because you talked about option number five. I just want to be really clear. I I'm not following what you were talking about. Okay. >> So, I I if so that's as far as I understand from the materials I have. So, I just want to be clear about that, that that's what we were presented with, unless I misunderstood something or someone else can give me other information that I missed. Okay? So, I just wanted to be really transparent about that, that there were only those two options that we're presented with having to do with buildings, building size, all the different pieces that you guys heard about. We I don't need to reiterate that. So, I just I want to be really clear that that's that's what was on the table. So that that was really it because I just want to make and I wanted to put out there that nobody here I and I I think it's okay to speak for everybody in this case that nobody here administration school board is relishing this conversation or this decision. So I just want to put that out there for everyone because this is not a a happy choice for any of us and I I really feel for everybody sitting out here because nobody wants to be in your position. [clears throat] >> Thank you. Um I'm going to bump director Wuto in because Director Basset and Director Long have already spoken. So Director Wuto. >> Yeah, thank you. Um so my question uh for assistant superintendent on the last page. Um a little concern about timelines, right? Because I noticed that during the last meeting the proposal was to have this discussion today so that we can get to publication by November. What options do we have if the board fails to give you a clear direction today as far as those timelines go? >> What we shared at the last board meeting um shared again is it pushes it simply pushes the final ability to make a decision back. And the reason I asked that, I also with some of the other board members think community input is very important to making these final decisions or at least setting a clear path or some kind of a path to go forward. So should the board decide that today is not the day I want to make sure that we have other options that we can discuss that will not throw this timeline off. The most significant piece out there right now is going to be with secondary schools first. Uh delay in secondary school decision is going to impact staffing first. Um that said, delay in any decision making is going to impact administration, building administration and building staff's ability to know where their next assignment is, what the future is for them, as well as for us to articulate the boundary process and where students and families would be going potentially for the 26 27 here. Lastly, it all depends upon how much we want to crunch the last 3 weeks of uh January because we do have to have the statutory operating debt plan done. Unfortunately, like we've shared a couple times, the the timeline here is really designed around this publication process, which is what holds us up because it has to run for two publication processes. So, it it's no more complex than if you miss this Thursday's publication, then you're off a week, which pushes you back a week. I think we had this conversation at the last meeting that the soonest we'd be able to hold the public hearing would be December 22nd if we missed this next round of publication. That's just the reality of it. The we're into winter break into winter break at that point. Um and so I mean the board can decide I mean ultimately the board can decide what you want to do. That's part of our recommendation is the timeline because we're backing into registration process, staffing process, all the things that go along with that. Um, so that that's the reason for the timeline. >> Thank you. >> Did you have a follow-up, Director Wood? Are you good? >> Okay. >> Okay. Then we'll we'll go to Director Basset. >> Yep. And uh I'm glad you asked that question, Director Hillbrand, because you heard me wrong. I didn't say five anything. Uh what I did say was that we have had uh uh some parents come to us and we ourselves have discussed splitting schools. That was the focus of my comments because we've heard in this room a number of comments about not wanting to split children. That was my point. I didn't say five options because I don't the word five didn't come out of my mouth. So I'm glad you asked that question because you heard it wrong, you know. And so um but and having said that I still feel the same way just as many parents have said to us about splitting schools which all of my comments had to go with then can Neil fit into Noble. I red, you know, kept my comments to that. Uh, and so, uh, thank you for asking that question so I could clarify that what I said was correct because I was asking questions in my mind and, uh, reflecting back on some of the things that I've heard in this room, you know, and so um, that's I want to opportunity to do that. But back to this question of u well, I think that um, the questions that I have have been have been answered. I think uh I appreciate uh director Woodo asking that question because if we move it back we move it back. We're have a meeting that's coming up. Uh and uh thank you again superintendent for um maybe moving that up and uh as we sit here right now I mean we control our calendar. We can decide to come and have a hearing. We're not tied to the 8th. We could do something sooner. So I'm just saying I mean we have flexibility. So it's not the end of the world if we push it back and have it later and hear from our public and and do those kinds of things. we can do it, you know, and so um not the end of the world. >> Thank you. Director Helen Brand, did you have >> Oh, sorry. Director Long. >> Yeah. So, I'm wondering about So, the hearings is are the hearings attached to school closures or are the hearings attached to the SOD process? Which are the hearings attached to? >> School closure. Okay. So we have to have the hearings if for school closure but we don't need to have those hearings for the SOD part of it. That is correct unless school closure is not a comp that is correct but it's school closure has been proposed as part as an element to the SOD process. >> Good question. >> And so to clarify um in order to have the hearing we have to have a motion to close some of the schools. You don't just have the hearing and then have the motion. Then there there's two motions. This one and the one that happens later. >> Correct. [clears throat] So what is being what would be worked on tonight or whatever night is chosen for the publication? You have to identify the buildings that are being considered for closure. And to do that then you post in the newspaper. It runs 2 weeks. You need 7 days after the last public posting before you start the official hearing process. So it needs to be identified in that publication the buildings that are being considered for closure or I would in their current form in you know whether it be a a a change in some some sort that is what is needed for publication. It can't just be we're considering closing schools. You need to name >> name name >> name. >> Then we have the hearing and people go, "Oh, wait a second. Let's change our mind." Then what happens? >> If if you were to change your mind on a on a particular building that wasn't identified in that publication, you would start the process over again for the next building. You would then say and and you know, pick a building that hasn't been named. And if that came up at a hearing and the board said, "Let's consider that," we would then go the two weeks of publication with the seven days after the final publication and then have a hearing about that. It does not change. >> Sorry, director Long, take it. >> And we started playing basketball. I was trying to play tennis here. >> It's your turn. >> So, I'm wondering then, too. So, we know that school closures are a part of they've been combined into our SOD plan. So, hypothetically speaking, could you have an SOD plan where you don't include school closures? >> Hypothetically speaking, yes, you could. And then what would that plan look like to help remedy some of the issues that people might be having with their budgets at the school? Hypothetically, >> I I I can't give a hypothetical because I've said all along you I don't believe you can cut your way out of this without building closures. And that's what I was going to suggest is if we are not getting cost savings in this district. Again, I've not met anyone who has said that we're not operating too many buildings. It's just that much more money that we're going to have to reduce from staffing. um and transportation and programming um all the other things that once we start doing that we're also going to hear from our community. [snorts] >> So if can I kind of put in a a um just a sandbox around the last couple thoughts. So for the for the hearing well first of all and you and Director Basset you've brought it up there there are still different options out there. Remember our recommended option is all grounded in all of this stuff. It's us taking the time to go through all the detail and say what's the best option we think of the options that we have. The [snorts] reality is we're operating four buildings that are at 280 or less students right now. That's that is a a reason for consolidating buildings to begin with. Um because you gain efficiencies in that. That said, as a board you you definitely could decide a different building. You could say, you know what, that's what that's why the answer, director Basset, is could you fit this building into this building? If there is capacity, you technically could. What would we do as an administration? We would say, all right, we're going to figure out how to make this work. If that's the direction of the board, >> the reason that I say all that is back to CFO wholeheisel's comment. You could as a board list four schools on the publication as a this school or this school or this school. And then you could have the next four weeks of input from whatever from whomever from wherever. You could have the listening session on the ETH and the hearing still there and get the input you're desiring to get. Our recommendation as an administrative recommendation is is not going to change it. That's not going to change at this point. But you as a board get to say, "Yeah, we hear you, but this is what we want." I mean, that really, right? That's the difference. You get to vote. We can only present the recommendation based on the information that we can piece together >> to get at >> Director Basset what you were saying before is to try to make sure we're doing stuff in a manner that keeps us as efficient and effective >> and pays attention to equity as best as we can. So anyway, I hope that explains it a little bit, but you could you could modify You could modify the administrative recommendation that we have in the slide and you could add another building and put the word ore in there and you've notified the public that that's what you're considering and then you can make a decision when you vote. >> Dr. Long, are you do you need to wrap up your line of questioning before I call on somebody else? Um, >> yeah, go ahead. Call on somebody else so I can regroup my calls now because there's been too many interruptions and then I put my Yeah, I have my name back up. >> Roger Hill and Brand. >> Okay. Well, just a few things to point out. One is we're running into timeline for school registration process, I assume. So, that's another reason to know what schools we're going to be operating next year, right? Because I don't know exactly when that is, but that's got to be coming up pretty quick, right? Um uh and yeah, school closures have to be part of the plan. We can't keep kicking this can down the road. Um we're running too many schools. We've got too much overhead. I, you know, as a responsible board, we we can't keep pushing the problem down the road. And so we have to figure this out. And we also um specifically didn't want to have the hearing on December 22nd um because we didn't think a lot of people would be around to um show up for the hearing. And that's why we wanted to have the the vote tonight so we could put the um information in the newspaper and have the hearing um whatever the date is on that um so that we wouldn't have to have it on the 22nd when a lot of people would be out of town. So I just wanted to remind everyone of that. So yes, we can push it back a week, but we were deliberate last time we met in not wanting to do that. So I just wanted to remind everyone about that. So um so I think that we we need to make some sort of move tonight to get something in the newspaper because of those reasons. Um that's a nice um elegant solution to put maybe some oras in there. But um but I do think we need to put something out there so that we can continue to move the process forward. Um whatever that might be, whatever that might look like. >> Uh Director Basset, >> you call me. >> Did you have an your name is on the list? Are you >> Well, yes. Um so thank you uh director try to figure out assistant superintendent. Sorry, five five names that go through my mind. But anyway, I thank you for your response which really showed your sensitivity to the fact that there's nobody up here who said I don't that I have heard who said we don't need to close buildings. That's not nobody's saying that, you know. So, we're all we all recognize that which is the reason why I said I think we one and two or whatever. Fine. So, it's more than an elegant solution because I just don't want to have a public hearing just to have a public hearing. Uh, I believe in some things that I've talked about here tonight and hearing from the public matters to me and um, having something presented to me about uh, the programming and some of those kinds of things is different from us being in the conversation about it. And I know there are number of conversations that you of administration have had. I I would hope you're having them. We rely on you to be having them. So I I expect that you're doing your work. You know, that's your work. my work is different and so um I appreciate that this um option to maybe say or so that we are moving forward. I'm not necessarily into slowing things down. I appreciate the superintendent adding an additional hearing on that. Um, I am very committed to the kinds of things that I'm thinking about with regard to the facilities and I've said a little bit of it, but I still have more, you know, I have more thinking to do, you know, and um I'm not going to apologize [clears throat] for that. This is a decision that will resonate in this community for decades, for decades. They're also tied to the property tax. And I think from the leather report what we understood is that of the sampling that he did probably about 80% of the people who live in this community and remember it's 100,000 plus 80% of them don't have kids in school have not been following this don't know what's going on. That's reality. So the 80% may be a little off here or there, you know, it could be 70% now. It could be 85 90, you know, that moves a little bit and I don't study that stuff, you know, every day. But the [snorts] fact of the matter is that most people don't know about it and it does impact their taxes and we're in a tax climate and tax environment right now where people's property taxes are going up. If we land on any kind of a solution where we need to have support from our public, then I think they they deserve to know what's going on. Uh they they do have a stake in it. You know, we love our parents. We see them all the time. So the parents and students, you know, that's up most in our mind. But the same constituents that we have as board directors. That's the same constituents that all of our local cities have. We share those constituents. Those are the people who pay the bills. And so, uh, they deserve to have a hearing. I think we should be having it. And, uh, in and in the meantime, every time I look up, you know, the superintendent has been very great about answering any questions. We always have a bunch of questions. I mean, there still questions coming forward because we haven't had a, you know, maybe, you know, if we' had more lead time. We got the first kind of here, get get involved here after we heard the reimagine report, which, you know, I was happy to hear. They I thought they did a good job. They were very, you know, uh, respectful and passionate. Um, and some of the things they talked about reinforced some things. I believe we need to close some schools. So, that was fine. We got that September 23rd. We have two board meetings a month. And then the superintendent kind of guided us to put a few more on the on the rolls. So, we have a few more than we normally would have. That is not a lot of time to write a ship, you know, and so um you know, so I'm not apologetic that we're talking about moving it back for, you know, having another hearing and moving back a week. So, okay, it's that important. [clears throat] >> I just want to for the public record. This decision is a step toward writing the ship. >> Yeah, I know. But but I just want to publicly say >> we have a lot of very very difficult decisions in front of us to write this ship when you're in statutory operating debt. >> I agree. >> So it is a step toward that >> of you know for year one I think what we've said is about $2.5 million of at least eight that we're going to have to reduce in this single year which then will probably be that much more again. We'll we'll be getting those figures to y'all soon in terms of what that's what that looks like to climb our way out of statutory operating. [snorts] >> Director Bowman, you haven't had a chance yet. I'm bumping you up. >> Thanks. [clears throat] I think I'm ready. Um, thank you, Director Helen Bran, for talking about the fact that none of us want to be here doing this. And I just want to stress that. Um I also want to really summarize it by saying when it comes to the timeline of it, the statutory operating deficit put us in this place. So uh we have kicked the can a very long time in this school district and you know today is the day of reckoning. Unfortunately today is the day that accounts have to start being balanced in this district. So, a couple of my concerns is uh as we talk about postponing anything, I'm concerned about um uh is postponing the pain really going to make a difference? And when we have two different other sets of schools sitting here in our audience, are we going to try to make promises to them while we continue to paint ourselves into a corner? That's the that's the issue that we have here. um uh is depending upon the audience, do we uh slow things down and then by the time we get done with it, we decide we're not closing anything and we just give it all to the state. uh uh promises of being able to do anything other than to make actionoriented decisions to me are empty promises and they're sort of lies and I you know don't want to take our we cannot take afford to take our uh economic stand right now uh for granted. It is the reality of where we're at. [gasps] So, I'm concerned that we're just a whole bunch of more empty promises and we'll see what we can do. I I fully understand that when all of this is over with, probably none of us will be able to show our face in public. But, um, you know, that is the price that I'm willing to pay to make sure that this time around, and I'm not talking specifically of any school, but in the decision-making process of this, I want to make sure that there's going to be a future to Robbinsdale. and we're school district and that we're not going to just give it over to the state because we couldn't make a decision or we wanted to postpone decisions or we didn't like the information that we were being given or [gasps] a whole bunch of other reasons. The re we have so many realities here. Our buildings are at half capacity. How do you function at half capacity? You don't have a nurse full-time. How about that? You don't have music programs, right? You don't have choir programs, right? So, our kids in this district are already suffering from the half capacity that's going on in many of our buildings and it's unfair right now. Where we are at is very unfair to the students we have in this district. And um it's rare that this old bird puts her hope and faith in anybody or anything at my age. Uh which is the only time you'll ever hear me bring it up. Uh uh but having done the homework, having read through the documents, having read through the volumes of work, the hearing that we had um staff going into buildings many times, making sure that what they were measuring and what they were looking at, the due diligence for me has been done. And I don't want to do any of it. I don't want to make any of these votes, but I'm a grown-up that says we got to fix this mess and we got to fix it now by the deadlines that we're in. So, um I know that we're going to be having public hearings. There's a concern from me as a board member that knows that, you know, I've read the emails. I've seen the pain. I know how much it hurts. Um but I also know on the other hand, we have kids that are hurting because they don't have enough because we don't have full capacity buildings where we're fully funding things. So, um I welcome hearing from the public. Um but I don't know that it really changes the reality and I'm really concerned that if we kind of have this sort of denial sense of maybe we can do something, you know, uh that it ends up being empty promises and lies uh from me to the community and and I just don't want to be part of that. Truth hurts. It hurts. It's ugly. Um, but I really want to thank the administration for the for the due diligence of the work that's been done around uh uh the discussion here this evening. I have never seen this district provide as much management and administrative data and I've been watching the district for 30 years. I've never seen this kind of data come out to the public and come out to board members. So I I don't have a problem with the information that's given us. I don't have a problem with the uh assignment at hand. My biggest problem is the human collateral that comes down with having to make decisions to clean up uh past ills. So, um I would be a proponent for continuing on with the schedule that we voted for, uh the timeline that we voted for, and uh pull the band-aid off and move things forward because if we continue to stay here, are we going to have any time to talk about programming and do all of the other stuff? Because for me, it comes down to these are buildings. what goes on in those buildings becomes what's paramount, I think, to the achievement of the kids. And if you know, I don't want to minimize it. It's sort of like somebody coming to my neighborhood and saying, "But that house of yours is just a building. That house has my heart and soul in it." And I know that that's what's happening in every single one of our buildings. But the reality is is I don't have a magic wand to change that. We have to fix it. And uh I'll just summarize by saying that I that uh I do believe that we will be able to fix it for the students of this district. It'll serve this district for the next 20 to 30 to maybe 50 years. Our school district hasn't seen anything major occur except for I think modular scheduling when I was at at Armstrong in 1970. Um, so as much as I know there is pain, it's sort of like being ill and being cured, you you have a future you can look forward to. So, um, if that sort of allows anyone to get a sense of where I'm coming at from this, the information's been voluous. It's been overwhelming. Um, so I I don't at all think that we've been cheated on information. So, um I I think we should just stick to our timeline and uh move forward and and help our communities with the grieving that needs to be done to be here for our communities and then move forward to a brighter future. >> I'm going to slip in the superintendent and then director. Um, I just want to also just let the board know, you know, our job is to bring recommendations forward. Our job is to give you whatever information you need in order to make some really difficult decisions. So, I think it's also really important right now that we know what additional information you want because I I think what we don't want to do is get to December 15th and you say, um, no, we don't want this, but we don't have other options vetted or talked about or shared with you. So, I just I I think in fairness to the process, um, if this isn't right now a recommendation that you support, and again, Dr. McDall's right. Our job is to bring recommendations. Your job is to vote on those. Um, we just need to know what else we should be exploring and vetting and getting information to you. Uh because I think our recommendation that I worry um that I don't think we can compromise on, I'm confident we can't compromise on it. What are the two elementaryaries that need to be closed this year that are currently serving as elementary schools and a middle school? So again, if it's not the current recommendation that's in front of you, we just need to know what else you want us to bring forward to you. >> Director executive director. >> Thank you. So I just want to answer two questions. One uh director Hillbrand brought up and the other one director Wuto brought up. Um yes, registrations. So as in as far as staffing um that's my area registrations will start in January for secondary which is going to involve staffing and those it those pieces that are going to start to roll out. With that being said we have to have a staffing timeline agreed upon by February 1st. that staffing timeline is going to have another layer added to it due to building consolidation. So because we are consolidating buildings, we are going to have another piece to the staffing component that will also have to fall in line prior to the pools that are already in the teacher contract. So whatever decisions are made around consolidated buildings, then we have to put that staffing process in place and have that timeline agreed upon by February 1st. I will let you know that Dr. McDow and I have already started conversations around what that process will look like um and have had conversations. So we are in the flow of things. So know that we we are working behind the scenes on things. Um but we do need to have a plan in print and ready to roll by February 1st. >> Director Wood. >> Yeah, that was timely. I was going to ask what the timelines will impact staffing as well. So thank you for answering that. >> Did you have any other comment? >> No. >> Okay. >> Is Dr. Oh, did director >> I would just like to throw in one more timeline as it relates to Minnesota statute. There is an uh enrollment options that where we accept enrollment options to January 15th. The first cutoff is January 15th and you have to notify families within 30 days. Um we would again depending on timelines it's just another thing that happens in January. you know, we can wait list, but that's something else that's going on in that time as well is is uh options for enrollment. >> Not though that would be like parent option or open enrollment. >> Open enrollment. Well, it would be currently it's parent option and open enrollment, but the statute is specific to open enrollment. >> Okay. Director Long. So, I would like to know too if we put together because it it makes it really messy that we've kind of combined these two different things kind of together for our SOD plan. Um, and so then it makes it hard to kind of decipher it out. And I feel like there were a lot of options that could have been put on the table that weren't put on the table. And I don't know if maybe some of those would have teased themselves out had this come to the school board earlier than it did. I feel like there's just this really big time crunch now that you've got that we've been put in as schoolboard members, you know, for this. But kind of so could there be a possibility of the SOD plan uh where we are talking about uh there will be school closures to come. The answer, the simplest answer is yes. Um the way the SOD plan is going to work is you have a fiveyear um window of planning of which by the end of that you need to be out of statutory operating debt. [snorts] And so the timing of when things happen is up to the board on which you want them to happen. the end the end result has to be you are out of debt in five years. What I would uh recommend and you will as we get into the financial components deeper with the SOD plan, the longer you wait to make reductions, the harder it is to make reductions because the expenses compound. um no different than anything else. If you if you don't do it in year one, it's double the cost by year two and it continues down that path. So why the recommendation of at least $8 million is in front of the board is then it makes future years less challenging in the number in the dollar amount that you need to meet to get out of sod. The board again can explore all of the options. That is I'm just saying it's it becomes more challenging the more you defer because those based on that slide you can see how quickly it can it can go into a land that's unreoverable. Yeah. So then for me to kind of add on to that. So, you know, I have done a lot of talking to other school boards and other districts um kind of looking at, you know, how they're going about uh their process of, you know, like even Hopkins, you know, Hopkins for a while was in SOD. um looking at Edina that was preparing you know for going getting close to this route and still I'm still very concerned about the data that we had where as enrollment decreased and we laid off teachers admin continued to increase and we didn't address that first. That's very concerning to me that we would harm our children before we think about letting go people who don't directly work with them. That part is very concerning to me. It's also very concerning to me that there were payraises of 25,000 plus whatever that happened um that weren't there was supposed to be an MOAU that was supposed to come to the board and it didn't come to the board. And that for me leaves me feeling confused. If we are 21 million in the hole, why are we giving people those kinds of payraises and bonuses? That leaves me really confused too in all of this. I, you know, and I've expressed it several times before, this is too crunched for me to make that decision. We're hearing it from our community. We've heard from one group of city council members um their concern about this. I would really like to have [clears throat] an opportunity as school board members to more further discuss the schools that we would like to close or the school closures that we would like to make. And I would like more of an opportunity for our community to have some input and say into what those school closures would look like and what they would be and how it would feel best for their babies because that's really what this is about. Their babies are the ones that in generate the income that we have here to spend. And I as a school board member feel like I'm not doing my fiduciary duties if I'm not going to st sit up here and speak up for people's babies and speak up for a school district that is more cognizant of what we are giving to our budget to our babies versus what we are giving to our higherups. >> [applause] >> Superintendent Stalo. >> Um, I would offer that tonight's the night. Talk about other options that the board would like to what other buildings would you like to close and so that we can give the information. You said that you wanted an opportunity for the board to talk about what buildings you'd like to close. That was a question I asked several minutes ago. What are the oper other options you want us to look at? This is a board decision. We are just saying two elementaryaries in a middle school from our expertise needs to close in order for us to have 2.5 of the million of the 8 million that we need for this year because if we do nothing that's what happens. Chair Evans Becker, just point of clarification. We aren't 20 million or $21 million in the whole, as stated in both the audit, the approved audit tonight and on that slide, we are at 11 million uh deficit, not 20 or 21 of what I just back to again, I just don't want misinformation out there. >> Thank you. Um, [clears throat] >> Dr. Basset. >> Yep. Thank you. Um, so in in the spirit of what else would we want to I think I posed my question. If Neil were to move wholesale over to Noble, then uh I really appreciate uh Director McDonald mentioning the needs of special education because this is really one of the few times we actually as a board have come to the conversation about programming and uh and so and we're not going to go real deep tonight, you know, uh but uh I do think that I'd like for the administration to you know, you said that you you know would go back and take a look and see what would you need to do with regard to special education. I think that's fair and I guess I would ask you to do that. Um and the other thing is that I think director Wuto's suggestion about and I'm not sure who suggested I think I heard it from him but I don't know about this whole or but what goes to what uh director Hohiselo said which is that um you know the bottom line is that some flexibility naming some schools and I and I do agree with director long that having all of this compressed at times separated at times compressed again at times and the timeline itself uh has been very constraining. training and uh and so um it is what it is but uh it's worth noting I think the process should have started much sooner you know and uh so that we we weren't in this and so to have us talk about we don't want to have a meeting on and I apologize I wasn't here for that meeting I appreciate that you know the 22nd was a date that directors talked about and makes sense to me that directors would talk about it uh so I wasn't here I was ill but the bottom line to the whole thing is that if it's an inconven convenient date. It's an inconvenient date uh because we still have to make the decisions [clears throat] when we could have been meeting sooner and talking about these things. It wasn't scheduled. So, um it is what it is. And so, if we can get more information about special education, and not only that, I would say that that there probably are some implications for special education in any configuration you're talking about right now. I I imagine there's some. So, I don't even know what those are for the for the buildings that have been proposed. So, if we could have maybe kind of a look at what it means around the special education for what's being proposed for each one of these buildings, that would really be helpful. And and the one comment I'll say about it, well maybe not, but I think I'm hopefully it will be uh you know uh is that had we come to this conversation and just talked about the need to close buildings and had that been pure meaning that we know we're going to close buildings and we'll talk about programming later and everything is on the table. No exemption for magnets or anything else. We have buildings all over this district. Had it been we're going to talk about the need to close buildings, everything's on the table. We're We've made the constraints ourselves. And that wasn't a decision that I've made. That was a decision that was made. You know, I I have, you know, I mean, I I appreciate the administration. I try to work with the administration, but that doesn't mean I'm going to hang up my brain and not talk about the things that, you know, concern me. We should have said buildings and left it at that. And if we're going to truly say programming later, it should have been like that. It really wasn't. If you say we're not going to talk, when I say we, I'm just saying if we, we, they, who, I'm really not pointing a finger. I'm saying that was what was put out there. And that's not something this board voted on. When we're going to close buildings, we're going to close buildings. We have buildings all across this district. We have plenty of space. Too much. Everything's off the table because I said it before and I'll say it again. If you need to pick up a program that's someplace else because we think there's value in the program, I've never spoken against some of the programs in our district. I care about them. I've been caring about them for over 20 years. But if we're going to close programs, you don't there's no sacred cows. It's all on the table. You talk about the buildings that you have and the capacity that you have and you have another conversation to talk about programming. I don't know that there's a person on this board and I can't I don't I'm trying to speak for him. I'm saying I'm guessing I don't think anybody would be against for example some of our magnet programs. I care about them deeply. But I wouldn't have just took that off the table right off the top because it set up the those halves and halves not. It set up a lot of dissension right out the gate. Can I respond to that? >> So, was that okay? >> Yeah. >> So, again, administratively, the job is to bring recommendations based on what we know to be true. >> Sure. >> I'm I'm hoping that the tenor of the comments aren't such that are pitting administration against the school board. um because that's starting to sound like that a little bit. And a couple things to that point why I'm there is back up to September. Mhm. >> We kicked this off in September >> since the recommendations, options, whatever you want to call them, the information, the weekly information that we give to Superintendent Stallow because of the questions that come from the board and we complete those. And I know that Superintendent Stalo sends them out. Not once from the board have we gotten one back that said, you know what, I don't like that. Why don't you include take magnets off the table and tell us what that looks like? So I I have to just speak back to the comment you made, Director Basset, that that that's not a fair statement towards us as administration. And it and it could have easily we could easily sit here and say if that's what you wanted, then we've asked what more information do you need every step of the way? And again, happy to do whatever. Lastly, I just want to address the special ed programming. I'm not referring to changing programming. All I am simply referring to is when we move students from building to building, we have to count account account for where we move other programs. So, it's not programming differently. That's not what we're talking about. We're talking about the core programming stays the core programming. It just moves or needs to be located someplace else. Okay. I put you on the list. >> You're on the list. >> Well, am I next though? >> No, you're not. >> Oh, okay. Well, I just wanted to respond to it, but Okay, >> you'll have a turn, but we have other people in line. >> Dr. Bowman. >> Yeah. Um, thank you Bob for your comments cuz that was [clears throat] what I I was thinking is that all of this stuff could have been brought forth and put on the table and if we really wanted to do a more extensive look at what various school boards are doing, that's something that this board could have done, but we didn't. And that concerns me um because uh I >> I did >> I really know we could bring a lot of things and throw it down on this table. Um but the reality of it is is it wouldn't have as much validity for me because [clears throat] it's bits and pieces of information that haven't been gathered in a in a planned sort of a way. So when we so when we throw things out like one school district is doing this versus another school district is doing that. I would want to make sure that the whole thing is apples to apples. I just want to state that upfront. Um, and and I also uh really want to say uh that we got here via the pathway in my personal opinion over the years because I've been in this community forever due to micromanaging by by the board. when is the information that we take from administration valid and reasonable versus uh board members who haven't been as immersed in the information as our uh leadership team has been immersed and and that really concerns me because um I I don't know exactly how many hours has been put into pulling all this information together all the facts and figures and datas and 2.4 four square million feet of property looked at. Um, but I put a lot of stock in the information that they've given us and and we also were told always bring forth our questions and so it's rather surprising that now we're down to the final hour and everyone's got to well not everyone but all the different ideas and again I would take us back to so if we go to for two other elementary schools and those two elementary schools send their constituencies here what's the promise we're going to make for them? What are we going to tell them? Okay, well, we can't really close your school because you're here and we don't want to offend you. I mean, I'm going to just really lean on the thing that we are the adults in the room that are here to vote on something that we have been working on for longer than a year and a half. It's been for the three years that I've been on this board and then it was for the two years prior to that from a community perspective when we saw things being done that just didn't seem to be sustainable over time. So uh um I appreciate the data. I'm going to stand by the data. I'm concerned about micromanaging. I'm concerned about bringing stuff to the final hour that we all people jump on board. But is it sustainable? Does it make sense? Does it work with all the rest of the uh pieces of data that were brought forth? And I will stand on my I'll conclude with this and that is anything anything we promise to one group, we better be prepared to promise to all of all of the groups. So, if we're going to sit here tonight and make promises to these groups that we're not closing these buildings because we got a better idea, that's not the truth. And I'm worried about what we would promise the next group that walks in here. So, I would hope that we could be and I I just want what I have to say to settle right there. I don't need anyone to really respond to it, but that's where I come from at this point. >> Thank you. Um, Director Hillbrand. Yeah, I I guess I want to point out too that I think the parameters under which these plans were developed had to do with underutilized schools and like magnets or don't like magnets. And I've certainly given my opinion on on how magnets draw away parents and involve parents from our public schools. I have my issues with magnet schools. I also think they have great qualities, but they're not underutilized, right? They're not our small schools. So, we were talking about underutilized schools and the schools with the highest repair costs uh in the in the short-term and long-term, right? Those were the parameters used to develop this plan. And so, um and then also the safe and secure um entrances and things like that. So, those are the parameters used to develop this plan and that was made pretty clear to us. Now, if we wanted to use different parameters, that might be something else. But these were the parameters used to develop the plan in terms of what buildings were then considered. Um, and then with that lens, this plan makes sense. Now, if we needed to use a different lens, I think, you know, that's a whole another ball game that we should have talked about a long time ago. And I'm really not one for like this is where we are today. I I don't like going back and re reviewing the past or re-imagining the past or relegating the past. Also, I just want to say that the reason that we talked about not having the the hearing on December 22nd was not about us, but that would be inconvenient for the public because that is during winter break and for parents and staff. That would be a hard time. Um, I'm totally open. I'll be here on the 22nd if you guys want to be here on the 22nd. But that was because we thought it would be hard for families, for parents, and for staff to come. Um, and so finally, I just I just want to say that um my recommendation would to publish the plan as presented um so that we can have a hearing on it, hear what have the listening session, have the hearing, and figure out how we can move forward. So that's >> Thank you. >> my two cents. Thank you. Director WH. >> Uh thank you. I want to start by saying that yes, we started looking at this process through a different lens. Um that should not prevent us if we decide that wait a minute I think we have forgotten something that we haven't touched yet to go back and look at that. That that should be a possibility. Um with that said, I know that yes, we did keep the magnet schools out of the discussion. I want to believe somewhere the administration has considered that in their decision-m maybe not with the proposals that they are bringing forward but I will hope that on that whiteboard when they were looking at what makes more sense magnets probably at some point came into that discussion. Yes, what we have in front of us is your best choice. Is there any way to present to the board, even if he's via email, what factors you considered with the magnet programs before our final votes? >> I I can speak to a bit of that right now. >> Sure. >> So, if you I know that it's easy to pit magnets versus non-magnet, right? It's easy to do that. But if we look simply from a capacity standpoint in our buildings, if we look at RSI, there is no other elementary school that that building can be moved into in its current state. You would have to change that programming because it has 700 plus students in that program. We do not have another building other than one of our middle schools that can house that. So whether it's a magnet or not a magnet, that would be the the decision to make. You'd have to split kids up if it was a non-magnet. If you look at C, C is I believe um a capacity of 4 459 469 somewhere somewhere in there. They're I think it's 468 469 >> 471 currently >> and they are at 471 currently. So again, that building's full whether it's a magnet or not a magnet. That that one doesn't change. Fair Pilgrim has a little bit of room, but it also houses community education right now. So, in my mind, since you asked the question, it really isn't about do you or don't you do magnets. What changes with the magnet conversation has to do with boundaries. If the board decides they don't want to have magnet schools, then everybody in the district goes back to whatever their home school would be and it's a boundary conversation for every elementary student in the district. That's the difference if you enter magnets into the conversation right now. Nothing more, nothing less. It's boundaries. Everybody goes back to their home school and they are boundaried from there. And then the board will have to decide do you want to continue to allow interd district transfers because that will set up another process. And then what leads then to that is the transportation conversation. >> So I hope that gives a little bit of insight as to whether or not we have regardless of what the board has asked us to do consider magnets. The reason for our recommendation and the original parameters was because in our estimation given the short timeline because I don't disagree with you on the timeline. It it we're we're moving fast but we got it handled as far as planning and preparation goes and all the stuff that we have in works. However, the reason that the parameters are the way that they are is we believe administratively, whether the board wants to or not, that's a big ask to do the entire district boundaries, the entire district inner district transfers, the entire district transportation >> in one year. Okay. >> And that will be if the board doesn't direct us right now to change the path that we're on, that will be a conversation that we engage in as soon as we get this plan submitted. And if the board does provide direction that they want us to do something differently, provide it tonight, please. >> I just have >> Director Wood, you have a followup. >> Just a followup quick. I know during one of our work sessions I did request for the heat map for all our schools without taking into consideration the magnet programs right they were also involved in that heat map. Now does will that map direct you otherwise to reconsider what schools you propose to close if not just based on the first two factors that we were considering. So the simple answer to that is no. And it was a part of our, if I'm understanding the question correctly, it was part of the reason for our recommendation. You'll remember in the [snorts] um October 20th presentation, we had a slide that spoke to the three elementary schools, their capture area, and the attendance, the available attendance in there. And the schools that we have listed, Sonnis and Neil and uh Lake View, all had less than 50% of their potential capture rate. And when I looked back specific to Lake View today, as an example, there are um Thank you. There are in the attendance area for Lake View, as an example, 467 potential students. 157 of those choose to attend. That's 33%. That's not an anomaly. That's that's that is the way that it is, right? It's all connected to all the other decisions and what we allow for movement inside of the district. It it the other two schools are rough. They're a little bit higher, but they're less than 50%. >> Right? So, so what that tells us is we have schools in our district where we have plenty of kids that live in that boundary for that school and they choose to go somewhere else inside of our district. That creates a that creates an internal pro. I mean, that's why we're having this conversation. If we if we don't have too many buildings, this isn't a problem. But right now we have too many buildings for the kids. And you the result becomes four buildings sitting at 280 kids or less. >> So we s we have to make system changes to that. And I know it's not what you want to hear. Like I I was I've I have never seen anything like it to be honest. I've been doing this a long time. I've not seen anything like it. But it's a reality. Um, and and we will we will get there. We will get there. We got to get through some hard decisions first, but but we will get there. >> Director Basset. >> Yeah. Uh, I just want to say, and this is mostly to the public because it's been said in this room. um when we started talking about this around uh September 23rd because all up until that point when we got presentations I was sending sending questions to the superintendent then suggestions I've been sending them right along you know I mean I that's what I do and so I've been doing that but uh it takes me a while to contemplate things so if I get it on the 23rd it's going to take me a minute to think about what does this really mean what are the implications having said that October 3rd When we had the the meeting that happened right after that, I found out I had a passing in my family and I went out of town and then I got sick. So even sick, I was sending questions in. So I just wanted to be clear that I didn't wait till the last minute to start coming up with questions. I've been sending questions right along. In fact, one of the early meetings when we started getting uh information from the administration about a variety of things and one of them was about programming. I spoke directly in the meeting in the public about some of the concerns I had about some of the the programming suggestions. So, I mean I I'm not I I'm not one who sits around and don't ask questions. That's not me, you know. And so, I've been doing that. Uh but I also have been one who over the many years has been one who really kind of relied on the administration. I can tell you some of the things that have happened within the last couple of years has me asking more questions and I will never apologize for that. So the same criticisms that might come from the our public about the board about being rubber stamp and all of that. I've never seen myself as a rubber stamp. But what I will say is that I have had great confidence over the many many years and many administrators. When my confidence gets shaken, I'm going to ask questions and I'm not going to apologize to anybody about it. And I want to see data and that's that's what my job is, you know, and so I never apologize for that. And anybody else don't need data, don't ask, you know. So, I just want to make it clear to this public that I've been asking questions since September, October, November, even sick. >> Dr. Long. >> Yeah. So, um I heard Pilgrim Lane is a lease. Is that accurate? >> No. >> No. Is any part of that a lease? >> No. >> No. >> Okay. And then what about uh I've also been hearing that the plan is to sell RMS Armstrong and then use the pro profits for that to upgrade Cooper. As stated earlier in the meeting, there has been no conversation uh [laughter] both with administration and certainly not at the schoolboard level about properties and their future use or potential sale. Other than I will put a caveat of of course we've heard before or I've heard from community members or different things that have come my way that at one point Target was interested in this property. Um, beyond that, there has been no conversation about um I I'll call it well selling any of the properties that we exist at this point. >> Okay. Yeah. And I [clears throat] too would like to also refer to there was an audit report done what was it 2018 2019. I don't believe in that audit report the concern was that the school board had been micromanaging. So people can definitely go through and look at that as a data point. >> Okay. I would like to say that we have gotten lots of information and asked lots of questions and each time I mean I asked a whole bunch of questions about Sonic and Neil just last week and got the whole board got lots of answers. Um and we're going to be looking at underutilized schools. So, there are no more hands up. So, I think we it's time Oh, Superintendent, I >> I just want to be really clear and I'm going to ask the question again. What additional information does the board want? What additional sites do you want to consider closing? We This is the time for that conversation. I do not want to come back in a month and say we didn't have time. We were rushed. We have time. >> Okay. >> So, I What else? What are the two buildings that the board would like to close? And again, to to Dr. McDow's point, this is this cannot be a board versus administration at all. We are on the same team in service to this community. Our job is to provide you recommendations and information and we're happy to do that. So, just please be honest and set us up for success as well. What other buildings? >> Director Basset, I see your hand flapping around. >> Well, I keep putting it down because I don't want to be rude, but uh but I think I said it already, but just for emphasis, let me just say it again. I think that um I the language will close the school. I would like to see an option that includes um Neil moving over to Noble. >> I have a question. >> That means that Neil would be shuttered and I also um would like to see the ESC just stay right here where they are right now. >> So what would be the other elementary school that you would close then? >> Well um I actually have said but I want to think about that some more. I actually have said New Hope Learning Center, >> but that doesn't count. I I I understand that, but I'm just saying to you, I did say that. I think I even said it tonight. And then I've got some feedback about, you know, the kind of that's there. And I'm [snorts] thinking about that, but I did say that >> tonight. You recall that? >> I definitely recall, but I also recall that doesn't help us with our elementary school problem. >> I understand. Well, I don't know that it does because, you know, we're talking about options. One of the options is to close that school, Neil Elementary, and move it to Noble. That's an option, you know, that I'm recommending. And I also believe that New Hope Learning Center, I'm not sure I understand that. I've heard what's been said and I'm contemplating it. I'm not assessing, you know, I'm not I don't want to, you know, kind of call into question, you know, the expert opinions that are here, but I'm, [snorts] you know, I'm still contemplating it. I'm not I haven't ruled it up yet and I've brought it up before so I'm pretty transparent. >> So we have four underutilized elementary schools. We have to close two. >> Dr. Hillbrand. >> Well, I'm just confused. Why would you move Neil to Noble instead of Noble to Neil just because the capacity and size? It doesn't make sense numbers wise. So I'm just curious why that suggestion >> because I really do think that having a school if you know I'm just trying to understand but >> because Neil has so much more comp um you know u and I thought about that I really um >> and a conversation shaped my thinking from that I had with the superintendent having a school in the Souththeast. Yeah. In that part of the city uh I think has value that really that that was a part of my thinking and I think that Sonison and Neil are relatively close together and um you know in terms of how it goes but Neil also was within a good amount of space proximity to Noble and Noble needs Nes work. So that's the answer uh to why I came to that conclusion of what I was thinking about as I was thinking about it. Um because I actually had a conversation with Superintendent Stale about it, you know, because I was thinking about some other things and when we talked about that it makes sense, you know, and of course I'm partial to Noble. Um, but that wasn't why I said I mean I said it because based on information I got from our superintendent about the need and and and I have felt that before in previous conversations when we talked about closing schools. It's important to have geographic balance across this district. That's always been a value to me and so it rem it continues to be one. Lake View is has a value in my mind. Having Noble has a value in my mind. doesn't mean the other ones don't, but I was really thinking about the the and then the centralized thing. So that's that's it. That's the answer. >> Okay. So once again, we have four underutilized elementary schools. Two of them need to close. So pairing them up. Son and Neil are close to each other. Pairing those two to me makes sense. Lake View and Noble are the other two underutilized. So either Lake View goes to Neil or and I mean Noble or Noble could would Noble fit in Lake View. >> No, sorry audience. I'm not talking to you. >> No, it would have to split is what would have to split, right? >> So Lake View can view can house three sections of all the grades. >> Okay. So you you technically again you max out at about 504 students if everything works out perfectly. So you would end up splitting some of Noble most likely is is what would have to be given that you've got other programming that you have to account for location and all that. Uh, Director Long and then Derk Basset. Oh, >> no. No, I don't mean Basset. Sorry. >> No, do I get another? >> No, you don't. Sorry. Director, >> I'm [snorts] wondering about because it does seem concerning to be called Robbinsdale School District and then not have any of the schools here in the Robinsdale city would be there. >> Um, it's just >> Yeah. Um, so I'm just wondering about what could be housed at Robinsdale Middle School. If we if we make that change, could we move Sandberg Middle School over to Robbinsdale Middle School? Could that be a possibility? And if we did, then what could the options be at Sandberg? Because that has a unique setup in it. There could be some some unique possibilities in there if we decide to keep it or not. Would it would that land be more valuable to sell Sandberg? >> Director R. >> Yeah, I was actually just going to go off your question about the splits. When we talk of splits, are we saying split at grade level or can we move two grades to one school and then one grade to the other school? you would you would work across the whole population. It would be it would more likely be a boundary uh decision than it would be uh grades be geographically where they would fit. >> We would we would split based on property lines or whatever the boundary would be because again grades can change, decisions are made different. You can't take household by household um and do that. So, we'd have to draw uh boundary lines of where kids would then be zoned, what what uh buildings they'd be zoned. >> Thank you. >> Uh Director Hillbrand, are you wanting to get on? >> Well, we just had WHO. >> Yeah. So, it's her turn. >> Yeah. Director Hillbrand. >> Oh, okay. Um yeah, Robinsville Middle School, my understanding is the condition is really poor and very expensive. It has to be closed. it can't be um utilized for anything. Um so that has to be off the table. And I think that first of all, I mean, I live in Plymouth. My kids go to Armstrong. It's not And a lot of school districts have the name of I mean there's like what is Rave? It's uh I don't know, it's Rosemont, Apple Valley, you know, Egan. It has all the names, right? And I've [clears throat] lived in Crystal and when we went to Robbinsdale Area Schools, right? It's the name of the district regardless of where you live. It never had the name of where we lived in it. And I think that if the central offices are going to be there, High View is going to be there. Um it's just the way it is right now. It's just where the kids live. And I think it will change over time. Um we're not tearing down Lake View, right? And hopefully things will change. Neighborhoods will turn over and we'll need to use it again just like we had to use Pilgrim Lane again, right? And I know that that was hard for people when it closed, but then it reopened. So I I think that that is I mean, look, if what happened in Rochester when uh Mayo Clinic swooped in and paid to keep the schools open, if Robins the city of Robinsville wants to pay to keep the school open, I'm sure we would accept that donation. But until that happens, th this is the reality that we live in. And I I think that that as much as we want to and we value that we're Robbinsdale, but it's area schools. There are seven cities in our district. We serve kids from all of those cities. And um it's just kind of the way it is right now. And we have to make financially sound decisions based on where the kids are right now. Um, so I guess I don't know if we're moving to do things right now, but I I would, you know, I think we've talked a lot about it. So I'm going to make a proposal. Anybody can amend it. I just like to put something out there so that we have something to move forward with. So I'm going to move that we um put the administrative recommendation into the newspaper for our consideration and public hearing in on whatever the date is December. So this would be to close Robinsdale Middle, >> close Robinsdale Middle, close the ESC and close Sonnison, repurposing Lake View for the new um district um administrative office, moving High View there and and then moving um the other programs as mentioned in the plan. >> Okay, >> you it's been moved, it's been seconded. It's time for any more discussion that you haven't already said. I mean if you have already made your point have something new to add. >> Yes. >> Yeah. So I would just like to say that um way back I think it was in in October I had brought up the question and I didn't really get an answer for it um which director Hill and Brand was talking about is to what extent um you know we've reached out to other government agencies and city councils to see what upfront investment they could be giving us to this and so I never really got an an I never got an answer to that. Um, so that question is kind of still on the table for me. >> I know that you have visited with cities. >> I'm meeting with city managers and legislators. I haven't asked that specific question about what money are you willing to give us to keep schools open. I haven't asked that question and no one's offered. Um, I think there's some sight mitigation uh potentially that we'll continue having conversations with our legislators around >> and taxes are going up in the cities already a lot. Okay, we have a motion and a second on the floor. I don't see any more. Are you okay, Director WHO? >> Yeah, just a final contribution as we move forward to decide. Um I support some of the elements on the recommendation. What I'm struggling to support is the fact that there is a possibility we'll be asking community members for a referendum in few months and there will be one of our seven cities that will be without any school representation at all and that may impact my vote. Just want to say that out loud. >> Won't have an elementary school but it will have a high school. They'll have high view. >> They will have no school. >> They will have high view. >> They will have no schools that are high view. >> They will have high view. High view and our Robinville virtual. There won't be an elementary. >> Okay. Thank you. >> All right. >> But they won't have an elementary. Okay. >> Seeing no more hands. I'm think this has to do with a lot of money. Is this a voice vote? I'm in your roll call vote. >> I have a comment to this question. Okay. >> Dr. Bass. >> Uh yeah. And so um another reason why Neil Pointed Noble was something that I have suggested is because on item number two it they're both listed. So they're both listed for some contemplation. You know, now um you know, elementary building considerations, you know, they're in that. And so um because we're already talking about Neil to Sana Center to Neil that's in the air one or the other was the initial contemplation. My thought was I am not in favor of closing Lake View for the use of the administration. The building is an elementary building. I believe it should be used for elementary children. And if we can move wholesale meals there and they can fit or another configuration which you know the administration may have the better command of that than I then that's what I am suggesting and superintendent asked us anybody else if anybody else has something they can offer it don't they don't have to say anything I'm just offering what I believe in >> and then just to follow up what is the second elementary that you would close >> I'm just dealing with that right now because I think you my concern and I've just expressed my concern and so I will leave to you then administration to go back and what does that do to what you're proposing because I'm just saying Neil to Noble because they can go wholesale and we don't have to split them. I'm opposed to splitting Lake View to go to two different buildings because I really appreciate what has been talked about before what I already believed and then was reinforced by people in the community that it's not ideal to split those elementaryaries if you don't have to. We have buildings that have capacity so we don't have to. So that's, you know, so I'll leave it at that and and um you know, I I have feel um very confident that you all can, you know, address whatever needs to be addressed, but you don't have come back and say it doesn't work and for these reasons. >> I just want to point out um with the High View piece, I know it's not elementary school, it's over 200 kids, 50 There's 2 and what am I at 25? >> So just I just want to put that into the space. I think >> the um there there director Wuto, director Basset, there are other configurations. You could, as I said before, you can you can put an ore in there, right? [snorts] If you know if you if you look at um you if you say so you brought it up, I'm not interested in Lake View. >> I'm not interested in closing Lake View. You can take Sonos and you can push Sonison um up. You can take Neil and you can push Neil over and up to different schools and you get that effect. That's the trade-off. >> That's what I say. >> That's the trade-off. >> And those buildings would be split. >> Those those >> those students in those buildings would go to different places. >> Son, you would close Neil Son would go to Zachary Lane theoretically. and a forest. Neil would go to Lake View and to Noble. That's how you'd have to split it to keep everything else working the way that it works. Everything has a tradeoff. >> Uh but you would you would end up splitting those probably in half roughly. >> Director, >> help us. >> You pass. Okay, then we're up to Director Basset. No, I think you know I mean I heard I think you heard me and I heard your response could you know including my consideration and I've just proposed what I would rather see that means closing deal. >> That's what I'm saying. >> Okay. But we do have a motion on the floor. >> And which we are going to need to vote on as soon as I don't see any more hands. >> Okay. >> And I don't see any more hands. So, do you want to do a roll call or do you want to do >> Oh, but >> I could propose an amendment to add the ore. >> I'd like to >> You want to propose an amendment? >> To add the ore. >> What ore would you like to propose? for so I'm just you know >> the proposing I know but >> so you're so the the the motion is to close RMS Sison and Lake View and you and you want to add in an or >> yes uh and and and not only that if if you're if that if the uh initial motion is to accept all the other recommendations then Um, I would also want to strike the ESC from that list of closures. >> That's not a friendly amendment, so it has to have a second. >> Okay. >> Hearing no second. >> I'll second it and second it. Okay. So, we have an amendment to not close the ESC and have add in an or for Neil. >> Yes. >> All right. I don't see any more. >> Oh, yes. Madam Chair, you can only have one main motion at a time. >> So >> you now have two main motions pending. So the proper procedure is to vote on the first motion and then if there's a they someone wants to come back and try to vote to either reconsider, resend or amend that, that would be the proper procedure, but you can only have one main motion at a time. >> Okay. So the amendment is just too big to be an amendment. It's a motion. >> The first part, >> okay, >> could go. [cough] We we can vote on that as an amendment. I've seen [clears throat] that done with Robert's >> just a minute. >> Oh, hold it. >> So, if you if she took away the part about ESC and added an or is that still >> it's changing the initial motion. So, you're going to have two main motions. You It's not a friendly amendment that the House would accept. The person making the motion hasn't said I would accept that as a friendly amendment to my motion. >> So, it's a separate main motion that would be pending before the body. >> Okay. I'm going to say that I I won't only because it makes it too complex and muddy because it changes the whole well because the ore changes all the other parameters of the plan. So I think let's vote on this if it doesn't pass fine and then we'll vote on the other one or whatever. >> So are you ready to >> I just one clarifying question. >> So now I pull it back. Go ahead and pull the vote. >> So it's time to vote. What we're voting on is the original recommendations. Lake View, Sonos, ESC, >> and RMS >> and RMS. Okay, we'll start with a voice vote and we'll probably end up with a roll call. Okay. All in favor of the motion, please say I. >> I. >> I. >> Oppose, say nay. >> No. >> Okay. Roll call vote. Okay. Director Basset, >> no. >> Hang on a second. Let me get prepared. >> Director Basset, no. Director Bowman votes yes. D uh Chair Evans Becker, >> yes. >> Director Hillbrand, >> yes. >> Director Long, >> no. >> Director Wuto, >> no. >> Ty, three. >> Okay, the motion is defeated. So, could we simplify things a little bit? I'm going to make a motion to close RMS. >> I'll second that. >> Okay. >> I don't see any hands up. All in favor of closing RMS, please say I. >> I. >> I. Oppose. Say no. >> No. >> RMS will be will be on the list for closure. Okay. Now, um, will some would someone like to move closing ESC? >> I'll move approval of closing ESC. >> I'll second. >> Moved and seconded to close ESC. Seeing no hands, all in favor of closing ESC, please say I. >> I. >> Oh, I No. >> Can we do that again? All f Sorry. All in favor of closing ESC, please say I. >> I. >> I. >> Oppos say no. >> No. >> No. I didn't mean to say. >> Okay. That's a three. That looks like a 33. It was. Yes. >> So that's defeated. Okay. Now let's get to the elementary schools. Closing Lake View and Sonison. >> This is only to publish in the paper. This is not actually voting to close any of these. It's just this is getting us so that we can get to the public hearing. >> I do want to ask my question. >> Okay. And that is since this is not legal or binding to actually the buildings themselves, what is the objection to just approving this and then coming back with other recommendations? Isn't that the cleaner way to Isn't that what I'm hearing that people want done? is I mean we have to have something here and uh you know if we defeat this one down and it goes on a three three thing then we're left kind of without options. I really thought that our plan here, get this put on there, vote on I mean vote on the recommendation to support the recommendation, but there's time to change that recommendation. Correct. Because I'm really nervous. Excuse me. I am really nervous about standing up here at this point and having things just tossed out at us. I had time to review this. I had time to read this. I'm really concerned about talk about moving Neil to Noble when we've already heard that Noble doesn't have the full capacity of what we need to move those kids and yet we talk about we don't want to split this kids from one school but hey it would be okay to split up classes from the other schools. I'm concerned about this entire conversation and I I do not even want to play anymore. I mean do we take the recommendations work forward with them? see if I mean I'm surprised by all the question and recommendations we haven't heard before. So if we put move forth the recommendations we still have time to come back and make adjustments. Is that inaccurate on my part? >> I think that Mick's got a comment and then depending on what he says I may also have one. Madam Chair, I was just going to suggest that motions be phrased that um it's a motion to propose a particular school for closure subject to a public hearing. >> There we go. >> Can we do that one retroactively? >> And can I add one more thing? And maybe I'm wrong on this, Mick. So, so check me on this, but right now we need to put anything in the publication that has the potential of being closed. That's how we still have some options to come forward to. So, we could publish with any possible schools that will be closed on it. That gives us time to bring back to you some of the questions and the additional options to vet out a little bit more. >> So, could we publish and >> but I could be wrong because CFO Hoheisel is getting ready to speak. >> Hi. Um, just just to point you, Dr. You are not incorrect. What I would say though is if a building is being repurposed that l the language in the publication needs to indicate such. So, for example, the administrative recommendation that is on the table would be repurposing Lake View, closing >> uh Robbinsdale Middle so forth or or so if there is any other considerations of repurposing a different building given how all of this changes that could become quite messy. messy. That's my only consideration. Again, we can put in there whatever, but it's different verbiage when you use close versus repurpose. So, if we happen to hypothetically have a motion that said uh subject to after the public hearing, which it should have said for the Robbinsdale motion, um repurpose Lake View and possibly and close Noble or Neil or Son. That would be hypothetically what would go into the public hearing and then we would still have to vote in December. Superintendent, >> could we again I just I don't want us to get in a position where we don't have options to bring to you. Can we say repurpose close the same building depending on what the board decides? So the statute says that you have to provide a statement of the reasons. It can be brought in that that statement of the reason. So a motion for example might be that I move to close school X subject to a public hearing for the following reasons. And that could be for the possibility of repurposing, for the for closure, for resale, for lease, or to to simply say finances, however you want to word that. But you can be very broad in your description of the reasons why. Um, and it could be something as simple as economic reasons uh for the district. The statute just speaks to a statement of the reasons. >> Does that make sense? >> Mhm. Okay. So, do I need to do we need to resend the motion about Robin Stale Middle and clean it up to be what it says or can >> you don't need to resend it. I would clarify it. Just um I think that there can clarify >> based on the full discussion that happened. Madam Chair, I think that there's a clear understanding that there's going to be a public hearing. But if you want to just have a clean record, you would say that proposing the closure of that school subject to a a public hearing for financial reasons or something to that effect. So, we don't have to revote and re bring it up, but we have to just clarify that was the reasoning for the motion or >> I would and you could revote on it if you want a clear record. That'd be the cleanest way. >> We want a clear record. I think we do. Okay. So, >> [clears throat] >> um we don't have to resend. We can just have a new motion. Okay. So to make it, I will move that we close Robinsdale Middle School subject to the a after the public hearing due to um underutilization and yes, >> sorry to interrupt, but I there are items and just for the board as you're thinking about the motion that you can consider enrollment in enrollment is declining and we'll and this is again holistically as a district. So, unless our attorney says you can't do that and you have to be specific to a particular building, um if we can be holistic as a district, I would say declining enrollment that we operate more facilities than our current or projected enrollment needs. Um the condition of the facility >> conditions are outdated uh expensive to maintain and uh potential safety security improvements are insufficient to tackle like there's there's holistic district reasons unless uh >> could we just go with two? >> You can let's just go with >> choose whatever >> um the enrollment. Yes. >> I just wanted to remind everyone that part of the reasons for closing the ESC is that it has over $13 million of of facility needs. >> Exactly. >> So, I just I wanted to put it I I just I'm curious why people are against closing the ESC. Okay. >> Let's take care of the Let's take care of cleaning up Robinsdale Middle School's closure. Okay. So, I move that the board close middle school subject to the public hearing and due to uh the low enrollment and the condition of the facilities. So, that and the cost to renovate. Will that do it, council? [cough] >> That'll do it. >> Um second >> seconded by Director Bowman. All in favor, please say I. I. >> I. Oppose say no. >> No. Okay. So, we are four to two. It car it carries. So, subject to the public hearing, Robin Stale Middle School will still close. Okay. So, getting back to our elementary schools. [snorts] I have a question. Do we have to do something about ESC tonight? >> Well, we already voted on that. >> Well, that was voted down, though. >> Was voted down. >> Yeah. But I I so I just want to understand it c it's actually the most per square foot of any of our buildings. So I'm curious what the objection is like why why do we want to hold on to this building so tightly. >> So I just want to understand why people are against moving out of this building. >> I think for me my no vote is just strictly because I want to understand what other options they will have and where they will be moving to if not to Lake View. >> Okay. >> In case Lake View does not close. Yeah. Uh, >> I can answer that. >> Go ahead. >> We would do the same thing with one of the other elementary schools that closed. >> Um, >> with that said, I may reconsider my vote. >> Okay. Director Basset, >> you want to pass for no? >> I'm still going to vote no. >> Okay. >> Can we reroach the subject or is it >> Okay. So there's no motion on the floor right now, >> but can it be brought up again is the question. >> Well, you see what was defeated was the major motion to accept all of them. So now we're going at them individually. So yes, you can bring it up. Would you like to bring it up? >> Sure. [snorts] I would like to propose or mo move in whatever way is appropriate with the language that was already discussed that >> subject to public hearing. subject to public hearing that the ESC be closed um due to the um large cost of maintenance and repairs. >> I'll second it. >> Moved by Director Hillbrand, seconded by Director Bowman. >> I don't see any hands and so we're going to go to a vote. I see Director Basset. Well, I believe that until we have an opportunity to really uh and and I think I understood from the superintendent or or from um director McDonald that we will have enough other opportunities to actually um I I to have to tell you the truth about it. I want to know about the e I want to know more about the ESC before I say let's close it because I think where it goes matters and um I know that the fiber optics the technology questions the technology has run through this building and the um and all the whole fiber optic system as far as I understand it but because I'm not sure I do understand it I want to have an opportunity to understand it. So, we'll have opportunities to hear more about the ESC and its condition. And I'd like to know more about it, quite frankly. And I think it's serving its purpose right now. And I think that, you know, we're not spending the money right now. It may cost XYZ, but we're not spending the money to do it. And until we have a plan that's going to place this building wherever it needs to go based on what the needs are, I'm not into, you know, I'm just going to be a, you know, I don't I don't agree. I would like to point out that if it was closed, we wouldn't have the expense of operating it and that would be a savings for the district. >> I appreciate what you're saying, uh, Director, um, Evans Becker, but that's my rationale. >> All right, Director Long. >> Well, I just wonder about this room because what was it like what, a year ago, two years ago, that we just upgraded this room to millions and millions of dollars, put these new TVs in, cameras, and everything? Like what's going to be the cost to move that and set that up someplace else? Or can we even would it just be new stuff to set up a boardroom someplace else? What's that cost going to be? Okay, we have a motion on the floor. It's been moved and seconded. No more hands are up. All in favor of closing ESC subject to the public hearing, please say I. >> I. >> I. Oppose say no. >> No. >> Motion carries. Subject to the public hearing, ESC will be closing. Okay. Now we are at the elementary schools. Once again, there are four that are underutilized and we need to close two. [clears throat] So, do you want hypothetically do you want to go >> repurpose close or close or close >> or do you want to go what's the will of the board? We have to make a decision. We can't, as Director Bowman said, kick the can. >> I'd like to suggest repurpose and all close. >> I I'm sorry, I didn't hear that. >> Repurpose and all close. has the option of both. >> Do we say repurpose and or close >> for all four? >> I would state >> I would state you're closing um and one of the reasons is potential reasons is to repurpose the building but I'd state reasons why other reasons you know whether it's financial or otherwise. >> Okay. So we could say close 1 2 3 4 and one of due to the need to repurpose under enrollment cost of facility improvement. >> Okay, I see a nod. Yes. >> So we could say close two buildings blank or blank or blank or blank, right? I just don't want it to look like we're closing four buildings. I just want to be clear with the public that we're closing two among these four. Do you know what I'm saying? >> Is that possible? >> The statute really envisions that you're proposing to close specific buildings and a statement of the reasons, right? >> It doesn't technically I mean you can you do that. Could you propose for subject to a public hearing? >> Yes, I think legally you could do that. That's not what the statute really was intended to do, but I think you could do that. But you'd have to identify the reason for closing each of those four buildings. >> Then in the public hearing, if a certain elementary school shows up in larger force than another one, then >> what happens? I mean, we have the data. We we know >> we know the the thinking behind it. We have the data. We have the logic already. Dr. Basset, >> the fact of the matter is is that we don't all agree. It's as simple as that. It's been proposed by the administration and over there'll be times in the future. Boards don't always accept the administration's recommendations and that is our right. So if other people feel comfortable and want to support it, they can, you know. I mean, then others who don't feel comfortable for whatever reason, they don't have to, you know, and neither one of us should be berating the other. >> Dr. Long, can we do a roll call vote for this one? >> Sure. >> Thank you. >> But we don't have a motion on the floor right now. >> All right. That's my my issue. It's not about disagreeing or agreeing. My issue is that nobody else is putting anything else on the table. happy to vote on anything. And that's why sometimes I'll just throw things out because it's easy to say this is wrong, but nobody's putting anything else out there. Give us a proposal. Which two schools which but I'm not hearing anybody else put anything out there. I'm happy to discuss other proposals, but I'm just hearing this proposal is wrong. Okay. So, give me your proposal. I'm happy to vote on it. Happy to hear it. >> Dr. Basset. Well, um it's my understanding that now we have time. This is just publishing. We haven't taken the final vote. Exactly. >> And so this is just publishing, you know, kind of what the direction of the board is. And I I would say that I did in response to uh our superintendent's question. I said one building. I don't there's no requirement for me to say two. >> So but you didn't motion you didn't move anything. You did there's no motion on the table. That's what I'm saying. Put a motion on the table. Well, if I had wanted to put a motion on the table, I would have done so. >> So, then we're not disagreeing because why are we even discussing it? I wasn't I didn't interfere with what anybody else said. I just spoke to what I said. And so, I mean, really, I did. That is the truth of it. I just said what I I just said what I said. I didn't come back and ask anybody else to explain stuff. >> Yeah. Bent. >> Yeah. I'll move again that we clo that we will put um Lake View and um >> Sonison um just because nobody else has put anything else on the table um that we propose those um subject to there was other things put on the table. >> Nobody moved put any other motion there. No. So, I'm in in absence of any other motions and absence of any other full plans, I am putting out because we need to close at least two, I am putting out a plan and putting out a motion. Happy to hear other people put out plans and motions, but nobody, we're just going in circles. So, I'm putting out a plan and a motion. So, >> subject to public hearing results due to declining enrollment. >> Yep. >> I'll second. >> Okay. It's moved and seconded. director. >> It was my understanding that based on the the language that we all seem to think would work that or that that would be included. That's what I thought we were talking about a few minutes ago. So that's the reason I put forward a motion because I thought well we can live with the or we'll see what happens you know um as far as that's concerned. it's just publishing it, you know. And the other thing too is that one of the things that's been talked about at this table is that people have not put forward um concerns or talked about asked questions or it's the first time people are hearing about some things. I'm just being transparent here today and saying what's on my mind. >> Okay. And I and I did speak to I think that Neil should be over put um clo closed and then um move to Noble. >> I heard you. Okay. But the motion on the floor does not include that. The motion on the floor is currently >> the motion. >> Pardon me. >> Okay. >> Okay. So, >> roll call vote. >> Roll call vote has been requested. To clarify, this is the motion to close Lake View and Sonos with purpose of repurposing or closure. >> Subject to public hearing. >> Ready. >> Ready. Finally. >> Director Basset. >> No. >> Director Bowman votes yes. Chair Evans Becker. >> Yes. >> Director Hillenbrand. >> Yes. >> Director Long, >> no. >> Director Wau, >> no. Motion fails. 33 vote me means the motion fails. If we had a motion to close Lake View, Sonosen or Noble >> Neil, >> not sorry, Neil, other nword. Um would that have any wheels here cuz you wanted to close Neil >> Neil >> and there's some thinking to close Lake View and Sonosen subject to public hearing. Would that work? >> Do you have a suggestion, Director WH? I could consider that. >> Okay, >> I would still vote no. >> Okay, Dr. Long, thoughts on that? >> You mean Basset? >> Sorry. >> Now that has gone beet [laughter] like what is it? >> Yeah, I it's a mental block. All right. I would ask superintendent how would that would that work for the public hearing? What if the proposal to close or repurpose the three? >> So, what we would do is as I'm looking at my team, we would come back because we're back together next Monday for just a study session, right? It was one of the extra dates for the study session. We would come back to you with what potential options could look like given that direction. >> The three with the Okay. And I just would need legal's support in what that means in terms of language because I would also assume within this there has to be consideration for repurposing as well >> cuz I wonder if two of these buildings would be closed and one would be repurposed since we've already closed the ESC. We need to go somewhere. So, I don't know language-wise how that works. >> I think you can always propose to close buildings and state the reasons for closure and you could change and repurpose the building. It's a statement of the reasons for the closure is what the statute says. So if we had just for clarification, if if we had those three schools as potential closings, the rationale for them would be repurposing. >> All three of them? No. >> No. >> Just just trying to figure out how to get around the statute to give the options so we can come back to the board with those options. I think that you should propose to close them, state the reasons for the proposed closure, and then if you decide to repurpose one, you can amend that at a later date >> and that we can do that even though we have to get it. Okay, >> that's you you would hold your hearing and then you could make your decision to to take a different course of action. >> Question. >> And that leaves [clears throat] Noble out of the mix. Just three, right? Unless B. Well, we have four schools that are under >> I know. I just didn't hear your last comment. >> And so if we did the closer repurpose one, two, three, that would just leave Noble out of it or >> Yes, Dr. Basset. So, um, so the the motion and the vote about the ESC, it we still are talking about um approving the plan that that be published. That's all we're doing as we said that about >> ESC. So, that's a subject to public hearing. >> Exactly. But that also allows for time because I mean I stated my reasons. I want to get some more information about the facility itself. a state of reasons. >> Right. So that's >> finished. We got to figure out the elementary schools. >> Okay. >> Do we need a motion? >> Yes. >> All right. I'm going to throw a motion. I'll take a motion. I'll pick a couple of them. Um I move approve. I make a motion uh to close Lake View, Sonic or Neil for reasons of declining enrollment and uh >> and and the additional costs to renovate. >> We say under enrollment instead of declining >> and I don't think you can say or just as a clar to close them and give the reasons for closing them. >> Okay. Lake View, Sonos and Neil to close. The reasons being declining enrollment and the cost of renovation >> uh to the buildings. Is that accurate? >> Sorry. Can you [laughter] >> Sonis and Neil due to an underenrollment and >> cost of renovation? >> Cost of renovation. >> Okay. >> Okay. We have a motion, but we don't have a second. [clears throat and cough] No second. Okay. >> You can second it, Gita. >> I'll [snorts] second it. We can vote on it. >> Okay. >> So, we have to publish it as though we're closing all three of them. So, that's what's going to be out there to the public. I don't feel comfortable with that at all because that's going to send a really >> that's going to cause a mail storm of extra that we don't need [snorts] >> because we can't say or >> right. >> Director Long, >> can I also call for a roll call vote for this motion? >> Yes, of course. >> Thanks. >> We don't even know if the motion is viable. >> Okay. >> It was seconded. Yeah. So, >> all right. So, it has to be voted on >> unless you withdraw it. >> I have one question. If it fails, then where are we at? >> No, just keep trying. >> Yeah, we got all night. We've been here till 3:00 in the morning before. >> All right. Can I >> Yes. Go ahead. >> Superintendent, you mentioned uh next week Monday. So, if this that is before publication starts, right, or no? No, it has to be it it needs to be given to the it the uh paper this Thursday in order to stay on the deadline. >> So, it's not when it's published, it's when it's given to the newspaper for publication. >> Sorry, I didn't hear the question. >> It was publication question go when it would go to the paper? Thursday for the following Thursday. >> Does does clo does saying that we want to close three schools get where we want to be? Not really, does it? I mean, >> as long as it's possibility, that's what we're they're channeling community. There's a possibility these buildings will close. The board has voted this way. Everybody knows we're having the conversation. It's not a secret. I I would like to pull my motion. >> I'll I'll agree to that. >> Pardon? >> I'll agree to that. >> Thank you. >> Motion motion is off the floor. >> So, where are we? >> It sounds to me like the want of the board is to have public input is really what the consternation is about. The question I have and what Superintendent Stalo has asked is to make the decision beyond public input. What more information do you need from us in order to make the decision different than what we've recommended to this point? That's really >> okay. >> What you're struggling with it sounds like. >> Maybe each of us can say what we need in order to make the decision. I have enough information to make a decision. What information does someone else need? >> Yeah, for me I what I would like to consider will be if Lake View is off the table, what other options are possible? And as I stated before, if Lake View was off the table, given the same [snorts] parameters and considerations we have done, we would shift to closing recommending closing Sonos and Neil and moving Sonison, splitting Sonos between Zachary Lane and Forest and splitting Neil between Noble and Lake View. So we would those two schools would close and shift up would be the that would keep us within the same thought process of desirable, sustainable, feasible, equitable, efficient, effective. That's that would be the next if you told us that that at Lake View's off the table, that's what we would come back with as a recommendation. Director Basset, what additional information do you need in order to vote? >> I' I've already asked if if Neil moves to Noble, what are the implications for programming in that building? I asked that question and you you've mentioned it and so I guess for me, I'd rather see it these answers come back in an option. I mean not options but you know in in you know cuz you you were you I got the impression that you were going to look into it and see what would be needed for the special education aspects of it because that's what you raised. So that's why I thought that >> but that would simply be what I stated the location we would have to move special ed more special education rooms being the centerbased rooms out of Noble because you wouldn't have enough space. >> Okay, >> that would >> that would be an implication. >> That would be it. We would decide at a later date based on all the other decisions where exactly that would be. >> And [clears throat] with some of these other closures that we're talking about, is special education movement an issue in any of those or no? >> Is that the only place? >> That's why the the move Sonos and Neil allows us to maintain some ability to keep things moving um more equally across the district. whereas Noble it would have a major impact to that building. >> Okay. Well, the followup I don't quite understand. Well, maybe I'm missing something here because if Sonosan and Neil the discussion has been close one or the other and consolidate those. So, if you consolidate them either direction, there are special education implications. And what you're saying to me is that they could be accommodated within the move. Is is that what I'm understanding from what you just said? >> Two different things. Same same result. Two different things. If you if you consolidate Sonos and Neil, you can't keep all of the centerbased classrooms for both of them and move the kids. So of this and move the the non-centerbased kids. So you would redistribute the center-based rooms where appropriate. That was in the proposal. Um, as part of the move with community education offices, Pilgrim Lane opens up. There's a spot there's a there's place at Zachary Lane right now. It's more manageable in that you don't have to move all of them out of a building. >> Okay. So, to to a certain degree, you will be moving special education in any of those configurations. Correct. More or less. >> Correct. >> That's a more that's a more understandable way to say that >> because that is the reality. And so, that's the kind of, you know, information that's helpful to me. So um you know that same condition is going to exist in other buildings maybe to a lesser or more degree but we don't know that you >> I mean you know as we sit here now and >> the difference would be this if we made the move from Neil to Noble the likelihood of not having centerbased in Noble after the move is very high. >> Okay I I get it. >> That would be the difference. >> Yeah. But even if you do if even if you you're talking now about merging Sonic and Neil. So no there was a contemplation about should Neil close or should Noble I mean should Sonison close that was the conversation you know that they would be combined. >> Correct. >> And if they're combined one of the facilities would be closed. >> Correct. >> So if they're combined then and there are some special education considerations. That was my question. In either of those scenarios, you'll have the same situation of needing to address special education. That was really the what I was trying to make sure that I was understanding. >> You are correct in that statement. The outcome is what is different. I understand that, you know, I mean, and so how many kids we're talking about, what the implications would be, and let me just say this, the fact that we're going to come back to this conversation again, and the fact that the superintendent has said that ask me what you need to so we can go back and we can take a look at it. I'm not one for and I don't think you're doing that but I'm not one for just kind of coming up with something on the spot because I like to look at them look at things through it and I get that sense from you as well but you've been more conversant with this information I have not you've got all the data I don't have it you've been meeting or talking with people about the facilities I've not been in those conversations we've not had a presentation from that nexus group or anybody so we're we're just you know I mean I'm trusting really I'm trusting the administration viewpoint on some of these things and I'm just asking you these questions. So I am asking them because I think that what I understand is there going to be more time before we come back to this conversation again the publishing that needs to happen. I I have to admit at this point we've talked about it so much I'm not sure if we're ready to publish or not. However, you know I mean but I think we kind of know where we're at. So when you have can go back to the drawing board and answer whatever questions that you've gotten. If there are others I don't know I just know what I asked. So I don't know uh what if there's some other things people want to know. >> So chair I need some direction because I I [clears throat] want to be really clear. We we need if we are going to maintain the timeline that's set we have got to have a decision from the board tonight about what gets published. So, however that is written, I just want to be honest that if if we don't have some of the buildings on that potential list, I can bring things back to you, but if it's not published, it's not going to be what we move forward. So, I just want to be really [snorts] clear with what the board is expecting for next Monday night and what's going to be on the publication information that if we keep our timeline needs to go to publication on Thursday. [snorts] So, I just need some direction because I'm not clear based on what your comments just were if there's a belief that you have that we can just bring a whole bunch of more options back next week that don't fulfill what we said in the publication form that we need to get into the papers to abide by the timeline on Thursday. If we're going to abide by that timeline, my first choice is to keep the populations of the school as much together as possible. However, that has been voted down twice tonight. >> I don't know what that means. >> So, if question, >> so I'm wondering, so say we get to we've we voted these schools are going to close, you know, these two schools. Now, we get to public hearing and after public hearing, we've decided as the board that no, now we don't want those schools to close. What happens with that then? >> Then we have to start the process. My understanding is that right? >> Yeah. You either take a vote or you don't >> and if we vote to close some other schools then we have a public hearing after three more weeks and a final vote. >> And I think that again don't I'm not counting days right now. The caution that I would have to the board is we've got to get a statutory operating debt submitted to the state by January. And if $2.5 million of our solution of the statutory operating debt is not out of sight consolidation, um there's going to be incredible difficulty and challenges in finding another million, 1.5, whatever that is. Yeah. >> Hey, what do you need in order to make a decision? >> Um, I wish we had started this process sooner with the board. Um cuz even as we're sitting here talking like more questions are popping into my head and I feel like if we would have started this process sooner with the board that I might be now to a place where I can make but right now there's too many unknowns and it's hard to ask questions about you know when you you don't know what you don't know. And so I'm still in that phase where I don't know what I don't know. And so therefore, I can't say yes, I'm willing to get rid of this and no, I'm not willing to get rid of that. I still want to say, please bring me different options cuz these aren't sitting with me. >> And that's exactly and that's that's what I've been asking all night. What's the additional information that you need? What what are the school I mean so so so again, we need to know if we're going to abide by the timeline that we have in front of us. And and for me, the timeline doesn't work. You know, like I said, I wish we would have been brought into this discussion sooner. As we continue to talk, things keep popping in my head. Well, what about this? Well, what about that? Well, what about And now I have, you know, possibilities. You know, I've gotten a chance to ask some of those possibilities, but some of them flew away for a little while. I know they'll come back at, you know, 4:00 in the morning when I'm trying to sleep, but you know, so like I just wish we would have been included in this discussion sooner than this. Would have, should have, could, you know, and that's always a problem, too. >> Brand, do you need anything in order to make the decision? >> No. This has been very thorough and I appreciate it. >> Dr. Bowman, >> I require no no further um I require no further information. >> Well, we do need to have a motion if we're going to stick to the timeline. >> Pardon me. We don't have a motion on the floor. >> Director Basset, >> in the interest of further information, the only reason I haven't asked this is because I don't think that there's enough time to get the information. And that is one of the things that um it requires us to actually identify a building that cert for certain we're going to close because the land use and what we're going to do with it because quite frankly I think retiring debt is a top priority and in terms of retiring debt if I knew that we were going to be able to sell a property and recover some of that property to pay down some of the debt we have that would be something that I would be interested in knowing. Uh I don't know that there's I don't know if there's time enough for that or not. I don't know. I have no idea. And so that's one reason I haven't proposed it before now. Um and and I you know and and I've been my mind has always been going to the final vote and you know and >> is is there any knowing that twice we have defeated the motion to close Lake View and Sonos is there any appetite in the room to close Sonos and Neil? >> I mean the reason I say no to that is because it means splitting up two schools. Mhm. >> And I'd rather only split up one school. I not that I want any school to split up or any school to close, but the this the other plan involves splitting two schools. And I'd rather minimize the number of kids that are disrupted and split up from their their peers. Um so that's that's the reason why I prefer the the plan that's currently on the table. Director Hut. Yeah, >> chair. I think for me, yes, I will probably have an appetite for that just with my first comment that I made. I believe strongly that if we do close Lake View, the impact goes beyond the students. That will be a community that we will be going back to possibly for a referendum. Um, beyond that, yes, today they don't have the capability to fill our schools, but the residents are now going to live in those buildings forever. To attract new families into those buildings in the future, one of the considerations will be how close am I to a school? Can my kids walk to a school? So when that time comes and we are looking at the future for the city of Robbinsdale, which I don't live in, by the way, it it strikes me funny to say that yes, that decision can be reversed in the future to give them a school, but right now, since I don't have that information, that is what I'm struggling with. I am in full support of the administration, we do need to take an action. We do need to close schools. if the board will consider taking Lake View off the table just for that reason. Yes, other schools will have to be split. Other students may lose their friendships. However, I think looking at the seven dreams that will be a better consideration for me. >> Okay, sir. >> I agree. Sonison and Noble and that didn't go over. Okay. I'm out of suggestions. John, do you have a suggestion? [snorts] I serve at the will of the board. No, I'm kidding. I I think I I I think the robust conversation is exactly getting at the difficulty of the decision um in front of the board. No sitting over there. >> Just telling him to make a motion. >> Give us a motion to vote. >> I want the I want to move a motion for the board to strike out Lakeville out of the discussion and then we can have further discussion on other schools that could be possible. >> A second. >> It's been moved and seconded to take Lake View off the table for school closure at this time. But >> what would be the other school? I'm confused. So it would have to be >> about that later. >> Uh Neil Noble or Sonison? >> RSI. >> So which one? >> We we do have we do have other schools. >> Oh, RSI. >> RSI. >> That's not an underutil. >> Sunny Hollow is not an underutilized school though. >> And that's got the 700 and some kids, >> right? >> I thought I heard second to conversation about that. >> Okay. Yes. >> So the most >> It sounded like to me you were considering Sonos and Neil. >> I was just throwing everything on the table. I I don't want >> I just want to know what we're voting on. That's I just want to understand what we're voting what plan we're voting >> voting on just striking Lake View out of the conversation. >> And I did second that. >> I know. >> And then we can have a discussion on what other schools we could consider if the board so chooses. >> Director [clears throat] Bowman. And then when we get to the next discussions, will we take other schools off and we're not going to make any decisions about closing schools? Because that's my huge fear at this point. And we've heard that our it it messes with our center-based schools which are vital. It uh to our district. Um there I mean we don't we've already decid we we all know that none of us want to close any of these schools. However, that is a school that's not going to be closing. That is a school that is still going to be operational for the Robbinsdale school district within the city of Robbinsdale. And the other thing that I have a really uh difficult time with at this point is throwing all these other options into it that haven't been completely vetted. So, um, to me, my compromise is that all of the schools stay in the same mix as as a discussion for closing or moving. And to take something off the table right now is really premature in the discussion because we haven't talked about we haven't talked about the other things for one thing and and the work that we're doing tonight still does not cement it as being gone. What it does is it gives us the opportunity to complete the paperwork that needs to be completed, bring forth more questions because before we take them off the the the menu, if you will, I want to be really reassured about our about our centerbased schools and I want to be really reassured that we're going to have space in those buildings for the services that we need and that would need to go back to the drawing board. So to drop new names into it now or um sets us back and doesn't allow us to uh provide the proper documentation to to remain compliant uh with documentation. So um I [clears throat] won't be supporting that at all. >> Judge Basset. >> Um so one of the proposals was that Neil move to Sonicet. That's one of the proposals that's out there. I support that. So that means that Neil would close, which I think I've already said. >> So I was a big >> and that's already been vetted or talked about. That's one >> by >> right the the original conversation on the table is the original proposal on the table is Sonison is is Sonison going to Neil >> and and and because of the questions and information we received that talked about the square footage and other kinds of things I think I would think the preferred move would be that Neil moved to Sonison that's That's my motion. But but the motion No, no. The motion on the floor right now is to leave Ne Lake View out of the mix. >> And and I and I seconded that motion. Then the comments we got, well, I didn't go off topic. We had comments from people about that. >> Are we ready to vote? >> Are [snorts] we ready to vote? Roll call. and restate restate the motion. Chair, please. >> Take take Lake View out of the mix. >> Oh, yes. Yes. >> Is that the motion? >> Yes. >> Take Lake View out of the mix for >> Lake View out of the mix. >> Yes. >> Out of the mix for clos for school closures. No, that's not the motion. >> That is the motion. >> That is the motion. I second that that motion. >> Okay. >> So, the motion is to take you off of the mix. >> Off the table. Out of the mix. stable >> for forever into eternity never to come back and visit that or you would make a decision right now for that forever. >> Come on to have a little fun. All right. >> After 10:00, >> I know after 10 o'clock I'm not responsible for myself. Um so to take Lake View out of the mix. So Director Basset, >> yes. >> Director Bowman votes no. Uh, chair Evans Becker gonna pass. Want to think I'm still thinking. >> Oh my god. Director Hillbrand. >> No, I mean I understand. Take Lake View out of the mix. >> Your vote is no. >> Do not take it out of the mix. In the mix. I don't know. >> Thank you. We have a lot of conversation going on at the table while we're trying to do a vote. >> She needs a clarification. She says if we take like view out of the mix, then it's Sonis and Neil. It's either Susan and Neil or Sonis and Noble or no or Neil and >> so is that included in this vote? >> No, it's well it's not included in the motion but it's um >> it will happen next and >> it will be I mean that's what will happen. >> So there's [clears throat] >> Okay, I'm voting no. >> This motion is not about closing any school. >> This is just about not >> it's about about not not closing. It's about No, it's about not closing Leafy. We're taking Lake View off the off the Nick. >> It takes Lake View out of it, which puts the other three into it. So, I voted no. Let's continue the vote. >> Director Long, >> I'm still processing the motion. >> So, you're going to pass for now. >> Director Wuto. >> Yes. >> At this point, the motion does not prevail. >> Wait a minute. But we get to come back to >> is >> No, I don't want to close Lake View. So, take it out. Yes. >> If you don't want to close Lake View, then you vote yes. >> Yes. >> Oh, >> so we have >> What do we have? >> Wait a minute. >> 33. >> Motion fails. Motion does not prevail. We have a brief recess. >> Start ordering pizza. >> We have a brief re No recess. >> Why is it going to get better? >> Well, I could use the restroom. So, >> I think we'll take a bio break. Okay. >> I'm going to give us a recess till 10:10. >> My husband is usually after 10. It's the only way to get roll call, please. >> Yeah. Yeah. No problem. >> Shoot. My finger just opened. They had it glued back together last medical glue. Look at my phone. Medical glue. >> Okie dokie. >> And we're back. Well, I think they should show that. >> All right. I think that's good for a lot of us. >> And I'd like to make a motion that we close all four schools, pursue uh what's the wording >> subject to a public hearing for the reasons of under enrollment, maintenance, >> condition, >> condition of facilities. under enrollment and condition of facilities. That's the motion. I'm not hearing a second at the moment. >> Second. >> Thank you. I heard a second. Okay. >> After the hearing, we will close two. But for now, the motion is to close all four. We have another meeting on Monday. We'll get a lot more information. We'll get data. We'll get a clearer understanding of the ramifications of closing these two or these two or these two. and uh we'll be able to get it into the paper so that we can continue on our timelines. Did you want to say something? >> It's what are the four what are the >> the four are the four under enrolled schools. Lakefield, Noble, Neil, and Son. >> All right, >> I'll second. >> I think it was already second by Great. >> All right, >> I don't see any hands. I would like to call for a roll call vote. Great. Uh, Director Bassid, >> no. >> Pardon? >> No. >> No. >> Director Bowman votes yes. Chair Evans Becker. >> Yes. >> Um, Director Hillbrand. >> I'm going to pass for now. >> Director Long, >> no. >> And Director W. >> Yes. >> Okay. Three, two, >> circle back. Circle back to Director Hillbrand. Oh, director Hillenbrand. >> Um, I'll say yes with reservations, but it's >> fine. >> Okay, >> that does four >> four to >> four to two. That one. >> So, at this time, subject to no pursuant. Is it pursuant? >> Subject to the public hearing. >> Subject public hearing. We will be clo we are are closing four schools due to other enrollment and facil maintenance facility stuff and we know that after the public hearing we'll actually be closing too. Okay. So, the motion carried. >> Moving along. >> Um, discussion regarding additional community listening time on December 8th. I think we should have it. Anybody else think we shouldn't have it? Let's have a motion. >> So, moved. >> Moved by Hill and Brad and seconded by Bowman. All in favor, please say I. >> I. We're having an additional listening time on December 8th. >> So six o'clock regular rules of listening session. >> Yes. >> Here. >> Here we'll have we'll have uh followed by the special study session. Okay. Any questions on that? So we have a listening time and a special study session on the 8th starting at six o'clock. >> All right. board governance. Oh, director, I mean, superintendent Salo. >> Yep. Just want just want clarification. So, for next Monday night, what the board is seeking is answers to the question about Neil fitting into Noble, about what it looks like if just various various options within those four buildings or >> and Noble closed. If Neil and Nova closed, if Lake View and this, I mean, pair them all up. >> I can't promise you that we're going to vet every mathematical option there is of those four buildings. I just simply don't think we have the time. >> So, are you okay if we abide by what we have originally stated as the criteria and bring options forward based on this conversation? >> Sure. that you can only do what you can do and you've done a whole lot. All right, then. Uh, the board will be meeting in on Thursday night for at six o'clock for interviews. Get here a little bit before then. >> Are you going to um send us out the list names along with the alpha uh number that corresponded to their names? I'm just going to send you the names unless you really >> I would like to see I would like to see the letter that corresponds to them also. >> All right. Well, you have you have >> Well, you could just send it in an email. >> B H KM. >> Okay. Wait a minute. Let me get back to my paper. >> She wants a C. >> Okay. >> The names >> E with all the letters. >> Wait. B. Okay. B is Richard Brintesen. >> What was the last name? >> B R Y N T E S O N. >> K. >> H. Cheryl Holm Hansen. H O L M- Hansen. H A N S E N. Cheryl with a C. >> Okay. >> K. Brian Half HF. Hen M. Lenny Kaufman. >> Great. Thank you. All right. Next thing, superintendent relations, community engagement, information items. Do we have anything else? >> No. >> Okay. >> Close the meeting. >> We don't need a move to adjurnn. I'm just closing this meeting. Thank you very much, everybody. >> We're done. >> Thank you. Thanks. Good job. You did a good job.