all right we're going to call the September 5th 2024 Planning Commission meeting to order we'll take roll call commissioner Lind here commissioner hargreeves here and commissioner brummond is here absent is um commissioner kazaki and commissioner Yang I'd like to invite anyone who would like to stand up and join us in the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge allegiance to the plag of the United States of America and to the for it stands one nation God indivisible with liberty and justice for all all right and with that we are going to see we if staff has any amendments that they want to make to the agenda we had contemplated one but I don't see the applicant so I think at this point in time we'll just leave the agenda as it's set for tonight unless anyone else has an amendment they'd like to propose correct Madam chair staff do not have any amendments at this time okay so I will entertain a motion to approve tonight's agenda can I get a motion I'll second or I'll make the motion perfect and I'll second all those in favor say I I I anyone opposed okay and at this point in time what we're going to do next is uh open the floor for open Forum open forum is an opportunity to be heard not debate any issue that is not on tonight's agenda um those who are not recognized by the or by the chair should refrain from commenting interrupting a speaker at the podium conducting conversations with other members of the audience or just creating a disruption or distraction um this will be enforced throughout the meeting uh so those who do not abide by the rules of decorum will be asked to leave and we want everyone to participate so that's just why we review that uh comments tonight are limited to in-person participants speakers are requested to fill out a card before the start of the meeting um for Natalie to call you up to the podium I don't believe we have any cards for open Forum um however we would if anyone has something that they want to talk about that's not on the agenda let us know otherwise we will move from open uh Forum into uh last meetings minute so I don't see anyone making the podium so we'll just make that move does anyone have any comments or questions regarding the meeting minutes from the August first Planning Commission meeting it all checked out I'll uh make a motion to approve and I will second that motion all those in favor say I I I anyone opposed I don't think I need to say that if we're all saying okay so then we're going to move on to the new business for tonight and both uh items are an opportunity for public comment so we'll just review again that public comments are going to be limited to inperson comments and uh if you have the opportunity to fill out a card prior to the St of the meeting that'd be great but if not we will still allow you to approach the podium um just state your name and address and then proceed with any questions what we usually do is we'll take all of the questions and then once the public comment opportunity is done that's when we'll um answer the questions um either from staff or the applicant so tonight's first um public hearing item is the dominal site plan the conditional youth permit and the variance which is City file 24-18 and I think we'll start with the staff report from Dwight if I'm correct right correct yeah thank you madam chair uh yeah the first item tonight is for the the Domino's application uh just a quick overview of the request itself uh the applicant is requesting approval of a site plan and conditional use permit to develop and operate a drive-thru walkout only Domino's Pizza Restaurant uh and due to some site constraints the applicant is also requesting a variance approval uh from the minimum building and parking setbacks uh the drive-through Lane location sign standards and the minimum parking uh Dimensions uh so background on the site itself the site is located on the corner of County Road 50 and County Road 10 more specifically uh 20115 and 201 121 County Road 10 uh formerly the 1050 Club in the corpin meat locker uh part of the application also included a lot consolidation to um combine the two lots together uh a lot consolidation of this type can be approved administratively so that will not be part of tonight's discussion uh some context on the site uh the site is zoned neighborhood commercial or C1 and that's marked as orange on the the map to the right there uh and the surrounding properties to the north east and south are also zoned uh neighborhood commercial and then the property to the West is the uh City Park which is uh zoned public in public institutional uh the N the natural characteristics of the site uh there are no significant features that were identified within the 240 comprehensive plan uh and you know portions of both Parcels are located within the shorel over District uh for uh the zoning districts uh before we get into the actual analysis of the application just a quick overview of the city's discreption uh in reviewing these applications a site plan and conditional use permit if uh The Proposal complies with the zoning ordinance then the city must approve both the site plan and conditional use permit um but the city does have a bit more discretion as far as the variance goes this is because the applicant uh has the burden of proof or has to provide the burden of proof and demonstrate that the hardships for the variants have been met uh in order for the city to approve that um so going into the actual analysis itself uh the proposed uh well starting with the uh area requirements in the C1 District the proposed conditions of of uh the site do comply with most of these area requirements uh with the exception of the uh set back from the front major roadways uh the the applicant is requesting approval of a variance for this and and I'll touch on that a little bit more later on in the staff report uh the Building architecture itself is a little unique because it's um kind of an Express dominoes which means that there is no customer entry to the building it's uh purely through a drive-thru or a walk up window um the building materials include uh the coal colored Stone pre-finished lap siding metal accents around the pickup Windows uh black fiber siding and uh vinyl siding all of these materials do comply with the uh zoning ordinance with uh just a quick note on the metal accents uh the code does allow for those to be uh on the on the building so long as they don't exceed 20% of the wall coverage and um both or on all sides it does not exceed that 20% so that complies with the zoning standards uh the parking and drive aisle uh for a restaurant of this size requires at least uh eight parking stalls and the acent is showing uh 13 parking stalls uh so that that meets the minimum standards um and the majority of these parking stalls are angled at 60 degrees which come with a a very specific set of Dimensions that um the plans provided do not comply with so that's also going to be part of the the variance request that's uh that'll be discussed later on as well um the as far as access to the site there is a a single access point on County Road 50 it it was pointed out earlier today that there was a typo within the staff report that that uh said County Road 10 but that was supposed to be County Road 50 the access is only on County Road 50 and there's no access access um from 10 uh this would uh this would remove the two existing access points on County Road 10 and County Road 50 as well as uh removing some of the on street parking on County Road 10 in favor of off street parking uh the lighting itself uh the city code requires a maximum glare of one foot candle at the property line um the photometric plan provided by the applic um does not comply with this but uh a condition of approval um has been added to the draft resolution that would require the applicant to um revise those plans and and just bring the that glare down to meet that standard um there's an additional um standard for maximum height of freestanding light fixtures um and that the maximum height of that is uh not to exceed the roof line which is 20 feet uh and have a cut off angle 90 degrees or less uh the applicant did not specify either of these items so um a condition of approval uh also requires the applicant to provide more details on that and make sure that it complies with those standards uh the Landscaping requirements for this site uh requires a minimum of 15 overstory trees uh and the applicant is proposing 18 um but no more than 33% of these trees can be of the same species um the applicants plans do show four different species in total but they don't uh specify the quantity of each species so they will need to um make sure that they specify those quantities before the the council meeting uh and as for the understory shrubs uh the code requires 25 understory shrubs and the applicant is showing 31 on the plans um but the species of shrubs that they're showing uh have a have a height of 12 to 15 inches and the required height uh for shrubs in this area would be three to four feet so um those will also need to be replaced with a species that meets that height standard uh as far as signs go uh the appan has provided two options for signs on the site uh one that is allowed by code U which is option one which is a one wall sign that covers no more than 10% of the primary building phase and one free standing sign with a maximum height of 16 feet uh and a maximum sign copy area of 64 feet um the applicant is requesting a variance uh from these standards and that would be option two uh which is uh um would be zero freestanding signs uh and then two uh 44.5 square foot wall signs on both the North and the South side of the building and then one uh 1576 square feet wall sign uh on that front East like the Eastern facade facing the intersection there um this the second option uh does not comply with uh the CD code and would require approval of a variance um so as far as as far as the site plan goes staff finds that uh with the conditions that have been mentioned throughout the report the the site plan um has met the requirements and staff recommends approval of the site plan um and for the conditional use permit there are um standard standards found in the zoning ordinance for all conditional use permits and then there's additional standards found uh in section 106.0 60 uh for drive-through specifically um and staff has found that all of these standards have been met in um they recommend we recommend approval of the conditional use permit as well um so these ones get a little wordy here but going into the variance requests uh the first variance request is to reduce the structural setback uh of from the county roads uh which the current requirement is 100 feet from both County Roads and the applicant is requesting a setback of 30 feet and 50 feet as well as a minimum parking and driving Drive aisle setback five feet um and the the code requires 100 feet for both of those as well um at you know during our analysis staff found that at its widest point the site itself is 198 feet wide so this does create a conflict between these two uh setbacks and starts to overlap on one another um and staff finds that the variant standards for this have been met but we just uh recommend that a condition of approval will be that the minimum setbacks um must meet what's shown on the plan and can't be um reduced less than that uh the drive-through Lane uh code requires that drive-throughs uh well code does not allow drive-throughs to be located on a side of the building that faces a public street but uh the uniqueness of this site uh the applicant is requesting that they um be allowed to install a drive-thru uh along County Road 50 um and the site is unique in that it two of its three sides do face a public road uh and the only side that doesn't face a public road um if you were to place a a drive-thru there then it creates a different conflict with the screening standards as the uh as V vehicle headlights would be shining out onto the road through the access point and you can't screen it at that at that spot so staff finds that the variant standards for this requests have also been met um and we just would add that a condition of approval be added that headlights from the drive-thru uh drop through L screen from the public right away um the third variance request is for wall signage um the applicant is requesting additional wall signage in MO of a free standing sign um the code itself allows for just a single wall sign and one freestanding sign in the C1 District but with the shape of the site and its proximity to two County Roads uh it's difficult to find a suitable location for freting sign that isn't within uh the site visibility triangle um and staff finds that the varying standards for this have also been met and recommend that a condition of approval uh be added that um future monuments free saing signs not be added uh to the site if this is approved um and then lastly the minimum parking diens ions for parking stalls that are angle at 60 de uh the applicant is requesting that uh the parking stalls have uh a 9 foot width a 20 foot 21 foot line length uh and a minimum drive a of 13 feet in certain portions of of the um parking lot um and again the the shape and size of of the site make it difficult to comply with with these standards while also um having the building itself on the site and complying with the minimum number of parking spots so uh staff finds that the varying standards for this have also been met uh with a condition of approval that um these Dimensions um that are shown in the plans um do not aren't modified from what's actually shown in the plans uh so uh staff recommends that at this point you would open the public hearing take testimony and we also recommend approval of uh the draft resolution for the site plan the conditional use permit and the variances as presented thank you D at this time um no one filled out a comment card but we'd still like to give you the opportunity after seeing the staff report if you have questions or comments that you would like to make regarding the Domino site plan you're welcome to approach the podium and just state your name and address um for the record so there's anybody who would like to do that we'll take those comments or questions first and we do just ask that you keep it limited to about five minutes just so that we can keep the meeting uh going this evening okay I look directly at this from my townhouse okay one moment oh sorry no it's okay Marist is my name my address is 20139 78th Place thank you so much all right go ahead um in addition to the constant motorcycles that go by and the constant trucks that go by I'm very concerned that when I look out and even though you have these tall trees that I'm going to see those lights from those cars constantly in my window and also the noise of the car and in the winter the you know you're going to be uh well I guess winter doesn't make any difference lights are lights um and I'm also concerned about the size of the sign on the building I wish it was smaller I think it should be on the building rather than a freestanding thing sitting right out on the Roe that doesn't S nice to me but if we could have a smaller one dominoes is such a huge thing I think people would immediately recognize what the sign is um so that's my big concern is the noise and the lights as all those people and that will be till at least one o00 on the weekends as well I was talking to the Domino's gentlemen before the the meeting those are my big concerns and I know we made all these variances to that lot it is an interesting lot and it is an ISO right now so um but those are my concerns thank you so much we will make sure that they are are addressed is there anybody else who had comments or questions that they wanted to make before we hear from the applicant no just remember to state your name and address for the record sure thank you rason 19235 Ral path B I guess just a couple quick questions um if we doing the setback required is there going to be any kind of screening I guess I haven't seen the plan but some kind of I don't know head or something that kind of screen it off a little bit from the road or is it just boom a building right there oh go ahead with all your questions because we will make sure that we address them before we we'll have a a discussion after this so we'll make sure we address the questions and then the other one is I do agree on science eyes I think everybody nowadays you Google you don't look around for Science and try to find a business you just get your phone out and you go nearest piece of place but I think being minimized sign I think it's a little classier for the city as a whole I I just don't think Mass signs for needed okay thank you so much we appreciate all of the input anyone else no pressure we just want to give you the opportunity can I go and comment onite we are I believe we close the public hearing first and then we will um allow you the opportunity to speak before the discussion um so at this point in time if everyone has uh who wants to has approached the podium then I will make a motion to close the public hearing do I have a second go ahead I second all right all those in favor stay I I okay so now if you would like an opportunity sir um to this is the applicant and so then he can address some of the questions or concerns that have come up yeah Eric s Domin Pizza um can we pull up those renderings for the signage real quick sure we know which one yeah okay go to the option one first yeah so on option one and this is where we're going for variance on reducing actually the signage op option one only allowed us signage on one side of the building and then of course we wanted to get the maximum of the signings that we could so that's where it made it this big um and what we wanted to do is go VAR with the city and get rid of the poll sign and basically allow us to reduce the side size of the sign on this side and allow us to put it on the other sides too get visibility all three sides so if it'll the variance to get rid of the P sign and allows to use that square on it if you want to go option two it brings it from that big down down to that big and that is just to clarify the the signage that will face County Road 10 yes then that's that's one that faces County Road 10 so we're going to go from big down the smaller to allow us to get signage on 50 as well can we ask questions which the signage on 50 would be the top and then the signage facing that intersection andir no the the building is 20 ft tall close Okay usually we do uh keep the discussion just to the applicant right now no I appreciate it and then any specific questions that you have that aren't answered after the meeting you can feel free to email um and we can make sure that you have a chance and also the renderings and everything are available in the three- ring binder that's out in the um foyer right there but if there's something specific um it's available online we can ask answer those direct questions from Natalie as well so please feel free to reach out if you have specific questions yeah no I appreciate that we are going from a big one to smaller ones um because getting bze that's exactly thank you I I do appreciate that is there anything else that you wanted to I mean you you had a great narrative already in the packet so if you wanted to address the commission with anything otherwise we we did get to read both the cup um request as well as the variance request that you submitted so we've had so much back and forth on this um I guess one other question SL comment when on the the headlights from this um lady over here are we able to move around trees to maybe help her out as far as maybe condensed trees in her Corner if she has those uh concerns I think that we can definitely touch on it in the discussion and we'll see if anything is a possibility um so we'll make sure that we we talk about that Landscaping thank you so much and we made if anyone on the discussion or the commission has questions for you we may Circle back as well um otherwise at this point in time what we will do is um go ahead and open it up for any sort of deliberation or questions or comments that the Commissioners have and is there anybody who wants to go first are we able to ask questions to the applicant during this process okay oh I however you guys want me to do it you want to be formal or informal for the minutes it's best to be to here yeah the one question that I did have if you don't mind is that it wasn't explicitly stated in the packet but will there be delivery to like from this location because it just indicated that it was for pickup and takeout and so that's why I just wanted to clarify will there be delivery like delivery pizza delivery from this location every other Dom I didn't want to assume and it just wasn't it wasn't pick up through the drive-thru pickup window or a walk up pickup but then we'll have normal delivery drivers like every other dollar okay that was a question I had about you guys feel free to fire away to build on that will there be GrubHub Uber Eats third party application deliveries third party all of our drivers are in house perect is thinking about that from aaff stood by model from day one once all those third party aggregators came out we do not employ any of them they're all all of our drivers or our team members would be controlling sure you don't see that changing in the future just from a traffic flow perspective it adds a lot of vehicles okay um one of the question actually I can add on that so believe it or not we have expanded into uh it's not Uber e one of the third party but what happens is if you place an order on and I'm going to say but it's not on one of the other apps our delivery drivers are the ones that actually take that order you're just using it as a platform we're using it as a platform to gain more order yeah perfect thank you um one of the the conditions was to reduce the glare now I don't know enough about this in commercial development but how do you does that reduction of glare impact the variance being requested on the lighting is that how it's accommodated we we do have an updated qu metrics that has reduced that down to the standard so there shouldn't be a variance for lighting there's a variance to the sign but I don't think that's what was causing to blare it was just exterior lighting kind of locations I see basically gotcha thank you dumb question but learning as we go here okay um maybe this is more for staff so this commercial District neighborhood commercial guided commercial do we have like design ideals for this area in the future as far as consistent look feel walkability anything in regards to you know these businesses being able to be close together just wondering if there's any sort of vision we have for that I can speak to it any to it feel free but um yeah and this site itself is in the Southeast District um and the southeast District portion of the zoning ordinance has specific design standards for the downtown core and then the downtown area itself but the site to my to my understanding correct me if I'm wrong but the site is outside of both of those so that it only has to comply with just the Standard Building standards uh in the zoning ordinance nothing specific as far as like a uniform look or feel to the southeast District because it's it's west of that Southeast District of the downtown are Southeast overall but um there really aren't a lot of architectural standards outside of the downtown core which is where that mixed used walkable area is envisioned I do believe if I'm understanding correctly the evolution of the application there was an effort to have a walking path between the city park to Dominoes yes question what our plans is our anticipation is that there will be a city or county sidewalk along 10 there from the ball fields towards us and so we are planning or our intentions is to put a sidewalk up to 10 with the anticipation that there will be a sidewalk to connect to the ball field eventually I think it's super important because when I read this I was thinking okay I'm a 13year old 12-y old kid I asked my parents for probably $30 to buy a pizza nowadays to go walk up from the ball field after my game and go get a pizza and there's cars everywhere and it's cement and what am I doing where that's where we had future planned ahead or not even future planned we see the vision of what's going to happen with the ball fields and the developing of that area that I hope that the city is going to put a sidewalk along 10 there which then would tie right into our our sidewalk that leads to Happ is there I mean that requires Great collaboration I appreciate that is there I I couldn't really tell if there's a sidewalk built into this regard less of if that's developed or not no not along the highway it just stops at their property right it's through it's to the pickup window already but it would stop at that go I don't know what pack you have there's spots where they can walk from the building from the ballark once they get into the proper just as little kids like to guide them is what I'm thinking about making it obvious of where they should walk yes yeah currently we would do build in the time frame our sidewalk would end property sure of course of course does anybody have specific more specific questions for the applicant otherwise let's let him take a seat I think I do you do do go ahead go ahead no please no no you go ah um a question about hours so is this going to go late night um midnight on Sunday through Thursday would be midnight and then Friday and Saturday 1 a.m. okay um I think that's the last question I had or the applicant yeah for sure do you have questions specifically for question for both the applicant and the city let's start with the ones for the applicant and then we can let him take a seat and then go linear oh they're linear all right go for it first of all um what is this is for staff what is the dimension for the the drive in from that point to the corner what is the minimum requirement required by the city where you have the Ingress egress for cars to the corner I think he's asking for stacking no no I'm I'm when you're out on what access on County Road 50 yeah what is what is the dis so we don't have any ility to make that call to it's the county road so the location shown is what the county has pre-approved okay wanted do know and when it comes to building um materials in that last two sentences it says and vinyl sing around the cooler is VY signing Allowed by the city VY sighting can be allowed um by the zoning administrator um and we didn't see a problem with it so yeah because it's not mentioned sure so yeah so it's you guys are okay with it then yeah currently proposed if there's an issue with it that could be part of the Planning Commission discussion but the city Adit the zoning administrator which is me has the ability to approve it okay we're just trying to seal the cooler a little better so when when okay that's fine but I would like to just uh if you we do have not so much with the cup but with the variances right so if you wanted to have that as a part of our discussion that that is a material you would like to see changed I would just say come back to that during the discussion portion if that's something that um is a little like uh thorn in your shoe okay not a big deal but I just want to um with respect to the lighting are are we going to allow 30 foot tall light fixtures or are they 20 foot tall so the maximum that they could be is either 30 feet or to the roof line whichever is less and the roof line is only 20 feet so the maximum they could go so will be 20 feet yeah well I don't know how tall they're actually planning but yeah actually the the updated photometrics I believe shows that 18 and a half or 19 it's blow one okay oh on page nine under item C there's a misspelling that says non including but non limited thank you for the comment I'll make sure that's addressed in the with the other the stacking are there do you ever see the stacking getting more than what's what's allowed what you're currently showing we currently operate I'd say probably about 30 to 40 of of our restaurants that have pickup Windows um the maximum we ever see even during a peak supper Russ of you know 56 or 7:00 is three cards in that in that particular plan because it's not an ordering kiosk it's not like you pull up talk box you have to order ahead of time um so we've trained our team members that if somebody does pull up to the window and their food isn't ready we ask them to go and park in the parking lot and we'll bring it out to them because we don't want to stop the FL of traffic we want that traffic to basically keep going all day as fast as possible um because that makes business run better the quicker the better okay and I do like the comments about signage and I I do appreciate what you showed because I did notice that as I was looking at the the plans that it did get smaller yeah and that that was kind of the whole purpose of it is you know the the basic or ordinance say okay only one side or one sign on the front of your building which said you allow x amount of signage but then if we got rid of that pole sign we could use that square footage on the building on all three sides which then would reduce everything down and I think it gives it a more caseable look yeah I I think the option two would be my desired option and that's it I feel free to do you have another I do I'm sorry would there be consideration of this grassy patch like adding a um sorry they're in the triang the Triangular grassy patch in the middle you mean the portion right where 10 and 50 are yying is that correct no no oh right in front of the building north of the building there's a triangle piece of I can I see oh in in the yeah between the crosswalks kind of looks like a yes golf leg yep okay putting a picnic table I'm game I mean people are going to be this is a community area for us so people to be able to take their pizza and eat it before it gets cold would be question the staff is that green space required by you guys um I think if you were to change that to an impervious surface I don't believe that that would tip the impervious surface limit for the site um yeah we'd have to we'd have to look into it further I to be honest little areas of green space like that is maintenance in my life y if you guys are okay with us making it a concrete p with picnic tables I'm all for that because that means less maintenance I I don't know I'm just thinking about you know coming from the park they don't have a car they're trying to eat pizza before in between games where do they sit and they're going to be on the road you know 100% agree so if we're allowed to make that a concrete patio with tables I'm totally on board with that I don't know something to explore um crap what was my last one well and we can continue to have discussion just a reminder for commission that this is just to ask the applicant specific questions so then we can let him sit down and then we can begin to have any discussions between us and staff okay last one it's also just okay sorry go ahead promise it's my last one um the variance for the parking stalls minimum of eight you're proposing 13 does reducing that number help you to meet the requirements I don't believe it's going to address the drive aisle or the length of the stall prop the only thing it would potentially address is the width which is like only address right which is like 133 to be fair we confirmed that the dimensions they're showing are still with would still allow for a functional parking lot and they do the city standards are above and beyond what is typically required not by a lot but by a little bit so we do have a little bit of room to allow for smaller stalls and still we have plenty of space to allow for parking thank you thanks you can take yeah awesome thank you so much um okay uh why don't we start with parking um okay well first can take it in chunks because there are two things that we need to make a recommendation on tonight and the first is the um approval or denial of the cup and the site plan to allow the development of the Domino's drive-thru the second is to address all of the variances that are being requested so again the conditional use permit uh just as a reminder because it's helpful for me uh is there only so it's not because it's not an allowed use in the commercial District it's so that we can in uh have different standards if we are allowing like if with a cup we can hold the applicant to different standards so the request for a cup doesn't mean that it's not drive-throughs or this type of business aren't allowed in that area that's I just wanted to review that because that's always helpful for me it's just so that we can maintain different standards so does anyone have anything specifically related to the conditional use permit or the site plan um about just allowing dominoes to go there that we need to discuss um prior to approval denial of otherwise I say let's tackle that issue first I'm fine with it you know I think it's personal opinion too I think a lot of people would hope for like a sitting restaurant in our city because we don't own one um but um the one thought I had looking at this site plan was is there any risk of confusing the drive-thru traffic with traffic going on the other County Road sure I think for me um I would have loved to have seen the county authorize a roundabout before this went in because I think that that because I even just think about when your supplies are being delivered and you have the big trucks coming through um yeah I appreciate that the drive access is on County Road 50 rather than 10 um because County Road 50 has the stop sign both of the county roads are at a speed limit 30 at this point in time but I don't know that anyway so but yes traffic for me is is is basic it's my largest concern just because I think you've got all you've got m& Housing Development on 10 but if they are going to come here and not walk they're going to now be making all these rightand turns from 10 on to 50 and um and there are it's certainly not superbly busy but like right now on the way to the meeting there's like a steady flow of traffic on 10 that's the direction I come and so so um when you couple that with sort of like you know these these ball um ball games or Cricket because Cricket is a huge draw right now in the city park um and so when you couple that with sort of all that time it is the traffic now I don't think that's the applicant's issue uh by any means I just really wish that there would have been something proactively done to solve that why prior to developing out the site um so I don't think that the drive aisle or access will be confused I think it's going to be pretty distinct that it's not the road um and that you'll have to make a turn in so I would say that you know I do think it's going to impact traffic in the area but um but I do think um it was it was hairy to get into the butcher shop before to and try to pull out my concern is I drive a big truck so do a lot of people out here and so my concern with the parking and and sort of navigating that is um was wondering the variance for some of the parking spells is that going to be enough also I was just trying to think turning radius and um you know maybe I'll just use a pickup window but that that was some of my concern with some of the reduction um I yeah I think eventually there's going to be something done to the intersection so not putting a freestanding sign in that corner makes sense why put something up only to have it eventually need to be taken down anyway so I am in favor of the signage um variants um I I'm hesitant about the parking variants I I had the same thought that if we just reduced the total number of parking cells overall couldn't you make them a little wider but if we're Above and Beyond at 10.3 and we can you're sure that those big Yukons and the Ford doues and the and the you know the the uh Expeditions or whatever can get in the parking spots then I gonna take your experience and word uh for it I guess um Madam chair if it helps the width of a Yukon is about 6.75 ft still would have plenty of room on both SI okay thank you that does help I when I it does help yeah it it does because when I drive and kids and I go to I go to high up parking at the back of the parking lot and I'm walking because I don't like to try to mess with the Turning r is not tight on big it is one way too so I think that also helps with um reducing conflicts with the reduced size and right so and I know that this is because remind me the access to the industrial park that is farther down 50 the access to 50 is not going to be a part I know it's not a part of it initially but eventually it will be right I'm so sorry so the access so the industri the poran Farms Industrial Park only has access through Lan right now but eventually it will have an access point onto 50 it would so if that site were to develop as similar to what was proposed the access to 50 would actually be further down so that was part of the the discussion when we spoke with the county in addition to the potential for there to be a future roundabout Y and so the applicant wasn't intentional with their design to leave that triangle alone because that would be all they' have to take or get into for you I designed this property with the anticipation of a okay nice um so the and so the all that was considered that there's this other access points we don't want to because originally the app came in with two accesses on 50 um U and it was there's going to be too much in a row so the county approved one the applicant revised their plans and we were really good sports about it and still making it a workable so okay okay um do you guys have because at this point in time I don't um this is the application that we have before us I hear what you're saying um and so with that in mind I would be in favor of approving or recommending approval of the conditional use permit and the site plan um so I'm willing to make a motion regarding that piece at this point in time which second with the proposed oh we'll get yeah we'll get into the variance I'm sorry this is for no it's okay I'm just doing them separately I don't know that we have to do them separately but okay have to you certainly can okay well since we started down that road let's just do them so all those in favor of approving the condition or recommending approval of conditional use permit and the site plan say I I okay so then we can talk about the variances which is the variance are for the signage the parking and we can in this discussion if we could touch on some of the landscaping and the question of whether or not we can move trees I think that would be helpful if You' like to talk about the um final sightings here would be where we could make any sort of recommendations for additions or changes to am I correct to the um variances I'll just add if you want to make sure that conditions for the variant um are related to the variance of granting so you're the conditions should mitigate the impact of granting the variant um so for example you don't want to say um can't see but an example great example right now but you want to make sure that there's a an Nexis between what you're attaching so regarding the landscaping or the moving of trees that would be related to the setback the building setbacks um that are being approved because of the site constraints because right now it's 100 feet they can get 50 feet with increased Landscaping but there isn't room for increased Landscaping so I think if we want to take a look at the Landscaping plans um and if staff has any thoughts or feelings on moving trees to come together can I just also ask isn't this site a lower grade the elevation is lower on this site than it is in the m& development is it not so just to help with some of that is that that the drive aisle will be lower than um the elevation of the homes across the street correct and then um the the other thing I'll add is part of the condition that Dwight called out in terms of the shrubs need to be a certain height is to help screen headlights from vehicles um they are showing trees they can certainly I don't think staff will be proposed to adding some trees um I think the um it I think really to screen lights you really need something around three to four feet though so really you need shrubs and you need to ensure that those shrubs are going to reach that height at um meet our minimum height requirements at planning and reach that height at maturity so if we look at the building plans which I know you don't have the ability to show up there but I'm on the page and it looks like C uh okay towards the Northeast part of the development there are three deciduous trees that are marked C does anybody you guys see that okay so um because that currently will face if you go back to the map that had the um zoning around the area I don't know if you're able to do that but right now these trees are facing the um the the rest of the what is zoned as commercial and farther back where there are just smaller Landscapes that's where the yeah yeah so oh almost the whole property line faces what will be eventually commercial commercial yeah so there's some I believe some non-conforming houses across the street right now yes um and should those redevelop have to be under commercial standards the m& hes a little B more across directly from the city park okay could I ask a question where the condominium be in respect to this plan right there what you're talking where where do you live starting in the green area that's the m& uh development that that begins I'm speaking for like eight n 10 12 12 of us there rightly looking at property so a thought I had uh ultimately what you're saying is by that point in time the drrive vi like if anything is there they're going to be done so they're going to be coming through uh facing that side because the the stacking is going to happen on the the um South End of the triangle um so right at the front of the property you've just got three trees that are are stacked there um if we wanted to group them towards the back closer to the park and move shrubs there that is a that is a thought um because then the trees would grow taller and potentially provide some screening of the building from the um m& development do you know what I'm saying I mean you could rep possibly idea is repurpose the trees that are in the what I calling the grassy triangle to over there if we're creating a little patio sit down spot because I see trees are in there want the sidewalk there the walking contr they have so you want to make sure that the trees don't conflict with that no it's all it's just putting it in that b area right now there's like an area labeled B and so it would just be saying like right now they have right on that corner there's a coniferous tree if we moved like a deciduous tree or something else back a little farther so it's still within a a reasonable area where the trees are going to grow so as a hearing is it would be a condition of approval for the set back there and that some additional trees be added along 50 or just shifted back no 10 I'm sorry it's okay just shifted back because I heard what you were saying you were saying is there a way to move any of the trees I think there don't need to necessarily be more but you have three that are sort of you guys have some great you're talking like the ones that c yep the three that are just linear right there move them more Northwest right like if you just moved them back a little bit right they're higher elevation than you so in that case the trees would grow higher and serve as a better blocking or screening mechanism and then whatever was where those trees are the Shrubbery or the plants could just come forward move right I would be careful of leading any anything if if everything is queuing and pointing to the east I would be hesitant to take any of that Landscaping away from the East side and that the plan so the I I understand that they're talking about those three trees moving them up and and that's fine but I'm just stay don't leave the stuff that's East because otherwise you're gonna have headlights pointing into that into that and I'm tot yeah no just you see it I'm that's a thought and I wanted to because you had mentioned that after hearing some of the concerns and that seemed like no additional Landscaping is needing let's just maybe um move this the lower to the ground plantings farther to the east move some of the trees with the tallest stren to the back it's a thought right and are we still talking about you know that little triangle that you like so much if you would like to are we do you really want to T make that cement no I I I was just trying to there is fine I just I just want it I don't want people sitting on the curb eating pizza and that's what's going to happen well they can put a little part little little table underneath those trees and it be so pleasant that's great don't Del that stuff one in the morning screaming in yeah so that was another point maybe this is for Council is um I don't know what this type of business and like the hours and the drive up only promoting more trash in the park or any type of loitering or mischief um late at night or if that changes anything in regards to the way that the police are monitoring this area different days nights times I just was curious this business type is more unique than one that closes at 10 p.m for family dinner so I just it's a comment for I don't know if our police department has an opinion or a strategy around it but just a thought it was reviewed by public safety and it didn't have it didn't bring up any concerns that that was okay something that they felt strongly about the discussion was primarily focused on H firefighting for the site and so I believe that's what the public safety memo includes um they and they do have a strategy that they would use for that so but the chief our public safety director did have a chance to review it and that wasn't something that he had brought up but we can certainly for that comment I'm just going to touch on the picnic table I'm not a super big fan um not because I don't want to picnic but um because I think that it is an opportunity to encourage sticking around right and I think the idea is that the if someone is coming from the park take it back to the park I guess that is my thought um on that but um soever you guys hey no it's fair everyone and hey we don't get to say we just make recommendations so we just uh want want to make sure that uh we touch on all of the things sorry if it seems like we're nitpicking that there's obviously lots of thoughts and and opinions about it and um so my only my only concern is I I think having something green is is better yeah than not right I I don't really care about a picnic table sure I just want want the green everyone can disregard my picnic table forget I ever there's not going to be a lot on the W on the south side because that you'll have that drive access so I do it will balance out sort of the impervious surfaces that are on the cell um okay so for variances we have talked about uh signage and it sounds like everybody is in favor you didn't touch on that but are you in favor of the um completely okay all right so we've got we touched on that is there anything that needs to be said regarding the parking or drive aisle setbacks okay and I'm assuming that's what your delivery trucks would use for gaining dropping off to the site as well that drive B our deliveries are house but it is Domino's trucks Doo's deliveries we control the the deliveries um and on specific sites like this we tell them that they have to deliver in a straight truck in tror tra okay all right so then does anybody else that they have anything that they want to talk um about or touch on otherwise materials can we talk about materials let's talk about materials if can I ask the applicant where that vinyl siding is going to be used cooler back an outdoor cooler that's attached to the over the dra the far right building right there yeah how often is that going to be accessed it's accessed from inside oh it is accessed so this is just disguising it from curve view is all we're doing so you don't have a big silver box and you're not concerned about that getting damaged within the next year or so and really looking like poop you see around use Dair queen as an example it's freezer Co but you see them sitting around smaller Dairy clean grills and stuff like that that sits outside some have shielded covered up but a lot of their coolers feers are sit out and they're made for sitting and taking the Sun the weather stuff like that exterior cool system okay yeah I understand I understand you yeah but I'm just thinking about if if the pedestrian traffic more than vehicular traffic I'm just thinking kids getting a little rambunctious and potentially damaging it so that's my only concern but if it gets damaged I would assume that you would replace it well you know and what we have done in other um cities is we've actually I'm going to use a very big term here but essentially it like you would wrap a car or a vehicle we've done a bu wrap on it um geared basically towards the city itself uh with we have a graphic designer just make up something that's approved by the city something that makes it a HomeTown veh um Prim example St Cloud we have one of St Cloud that is on campus scsu and everything around that cooler is geared towards scsu so definitely do that too a m a mural like a mural if that was of interest uh it could be a condition of approval for the setback variant because the building is so close to the RO we want the materials to um be unique and something that thank you for making that connection yeah yeah that that would be yeah that' be very cool I can make that recommendation okay okay so at this point in time it sounds like our discussion has been and so I would entertain a motion to recommend approval of the uh three variants requests for the reduced building and structure setbacks um with the amendment to look into some kind of a vinyl wrap um and then allowing a drive-thru to face a public Street and flexibility uh from the wall sign standards and flexibility from the minimum parking lot Dimension requirements the only other thing that was amended was talking about the uh shuffling of land uh landscape to maybe bring some taller screening to the back so with those two amendments uh I will entertain a motion to approve those variances for second I make the motion all right and I will second and all those in favor say I I anyone oppose thank you so much um you're welcome to stick around otherwise we're going to move into the next um item on our agenda tonight which is the slaba I'm sorry Gideon I'll just going to say your first name because it's easier slaya preliminary plat and variance which is City file 23-29 and we're going to start with the staff report thank you madam chair there we go um second item is the slay preliminary plat in variant and the soan SL as you said is the applicant and request essentially to adjust the shared lot line compor on the uh south portion of the site between two lots 9945 Ebert Road and I'm just realizing that you don't have the I don't think I'm Shing it sorry my computer I got the computer and it does doesn't have this capability so I'm trying to use it my um planner's computer here from adjacent anyway thank you for your patience so 9945 Ebert road is this Northern property and then and it has it's kind of a flag lot here and then we have 9922 9925 eert road which will be proposed lot two um the southern area and we're just going to move the shared lot line essentially uh further west to Square Off both lots and the request does include the preliminary plat in a variance and the variance is to create a lot that does not AB but or have direct access to an improved private drive because once we remove um once we change the lot line here this Northern lot will only have access onto eert Road and we can talk about that further here so both properties were previously ploted as part of eert Edition and the part of that plat there were already existing structures the two existing homes were on a single lot and they were already placed very close to the road so the history behind it is that right of wood was taken to as much as they could to allow for a future s-shaped road and it was known at that time that there was not going to be an upright of way dedicated to make eert Road an improved Street even though it was a public Street and public right away was taken so the it was known back when this was originally platted that um eventually we would have to take right away from this Eastern property east of eer Road in order to truly improve Eber Road uh but access continues remains to be uh directly on eert there has never been access directly onto oakal Drive even though that's where the frontage previously was and then so the preliminary plat again will allow for both lots to be squared off allowing for more usable Spas for proposed lot two and um this space currently goes unused by the property owner for lot one that's our understanding of Staff anyway both Lots meet all minimum dimensional standards of the rural residential district and um there are areas where stacs are allowed as legal non-conformity because the structures predate our zoning ordinances and that there was an additional expansion to the existing house footprint on lot one that was granted as a variant I'm sorry lot two that was granted as a variance in 2022 they had uh they weren't requesting to have an additional setback but there were portions of their front porch that they wanted to wrap around um and so it was an technically an expansion of the portion of the structure that that was subject to the SE that's kind of hard to explain so there was a little bit of a porch that was grandfathered in and they wanted in that setback technically couldn't expand further but the variant allowed them to still abide by that step back that was set but allow for it to expand Southward so they could wrap it around the house so I hope that better explains it um it's hard to see right here but it's it essentially allowed for a bit of a variance right here uh again the setback didn't increase it's just the portion of the footprint that didn't comply with the setback that increased but overall it still stayed um no it the porch moved no closer to the road than it was previously um and again direct access for both Lots will continue to to be provided on Ebert road with this plot the existing well on lot one is located within a established drainage and utility easement uh we believe that that well predates uh even the first subdivision it's a little unclear because the well was not included on the survey that was provided as part of Ebert Edition um the engineering memo does um discuss the well and requires that when the well is replaced it be removed from the drainage and utility ement however removal is not being required at this time it's uh but there will be a condition of approval that a formal encroachment agreement with the city be established and that will protect the lot one's rights as well as have it clearly established that should they ever need to replace the well um it needs to be removed out of the Dage and utility ement uh no landscaping or par education is required since no New Lots are being created and then drainage and utility easements based on the previous lot lines uh that will now conflict with the proposed lot lines must be vacated with the final plat that'll be part of the final plat application so again the variance is from section 94 5.20 subdivision one of our subdivision ordinance which states that all Lots shall but and have direct access to an improved Street or private Drive the proposed plat will remove lot one's Frontage along Oakdale Drive triggering the need for the variance um daff believes the application meets the standards and practical difficulty threshold for a variant the existing location of the structures makes it difficult to obtain and acquire more RightWay from these particular Parcels uh to allow for uh e Road to be improved Street and the locations in relation to e eert Road are not changing as a result of the plat a direct driveway on to Oakdale Drive would not be allowed for either lot it would not meet our engineering or design standards access is not changing nor will there be an increase in traffic or use of e Road as a result of the proposed PL the varant it actually may be fairly temporary in nature because the if the property to the east of Ebert Road does subdivide in the future the road would be improved at that time to meet City street standards um the change in lot lines will will not be visible to the surrounding area this is going to be a change that improves uh their quality of life which with no visible impact to the general public and the variance does not create a conflict with the intent of the zoning ordinance or the comprehensive Clan so with this in mind staff does not propose any conditions of approval for the variants to be granted but the Planning Commission can propose conditions to mitigate the impact of granting the variant so finally uh we should open the public hearing and take testimony staff recommends approval of the preliminary plot in variance with conditions of approval as outlined in the draft resolution um as always the council not the council the Planning Commission uh can approve the draft resol resolution without changes they can make amendments as desired or they can recommend denial of the draft resolution if the Planning Commission recommends denial of the variant then the commission should also recommend denial the plinary plat because there's no way to accomplish the plinary plat without the variance thank you at this point in time we will uh open the public hearing if there's anybody who wants to approach the podium regarding this application uh please please feel free to do so just state your name and address for the record is my name is Patrick delesie I'm at the 9945 property 9945 V you V the first slide overhead view of two properties this right here um what we're going to do is square this off here um this is a transaction between two neighbors we like our neighbors a lot it is beneficial to both parties and to both long term as well so I mean the development of these two properties is best accomplished by doing this in this present situation we don't use this at all here it's not something that that it's it's just not something we ever Ed we have enough property already and to keep trying track we don't need this over here um and development wise this is a much better situation for them um we never had access to Oakdale one have access to oldale um the e Road situation it's going to be an issue long term for the city because actually with this here you can't see it keeps going up and around there's a number of houses down here on right of the road that are at some point even e Road e Road has to be at some point it's going to end up being I'm sure and I like it or not and people like may we don't want this out here to be the belt nor over here that's here there right now right now either road is what it is which is small Road where both of us get out on it and through the Practical situation um this allows our neighbors to have much better situation for them in terms of their development U allows properties be toel more realistically long term and doesn't pose any kind of um any kind of other problems that might arise something like this I don't think any of their neighbors mind one bit um yeah I mean I don't know what else to say other than I think should be approved because it's basically two neighbors trying to help each other out thank you thank you anybody else who would like that sure thank you I'm Gideon slay I'm at 9925 Ro so not quite two years ago we had a house and it was due to a storm that came through that took power LS down and started started all on fire and at that time we were coming off the backside of Co and we were reported city council what we wanted to do at that time was buy this property and build a brand new house and push it farther back but because of Co at that time they were saying going to take 12 months just to go through the county we don't have 12 months it would be two years to get a house built and so we were forced to basically go back and rebuild what we have and so now we're coming back and trying to um when we were here two years ago you know the city council was like that this all Mak sense and so now we're basically coming back and just trying to square up the lot line because the way it is right now with all this easement that is taken here you know it's the idea I guess back in the 90s was that they would that go on this side and take get all up here you know kind of equal get out you know where is taken here and then taken up here but my understanding is nothing can be done here until something is done with this property or they sell it or you know whatever the deal is but the way my lot is right now it is narrow and it is long and with all the setbacks that we have I have a septic mod that is here um if I was to ever in the future we currently don't have a garage you know let's just say I was ever going to build a garage now I'm up against the 10t set back back here it's a septic m i mean it's almost a lot is almost you can't do anything so by squaring this up it will give us options in the future we ever want to you know build garage or something like that we don't have any plans for that at this time but just just fory use to the problem so that's all I have thank thank you so much is there anybody else if not I will uh enter make a motion to close the public hearing I'll second all those in favor I okay so what we'll do at this point in time is um the only question I have is that V so the reason for the variance is because it sounds like an ordinance was written that was only pertaining to development is that correct so the our sub division orance yeah right that is a typical requirement that the resulting Lots should have either direct access on a private drive or if it's a public Street it should be an approved public Street um from what I can gather back JN eert Edition was created we either didn't have that standard or there may have been a variance granted that's just not clearly documented in the file um but regardless E edition was created um and they could have taken more right of way but then the existing structur would be even closer to the road than they are today and so instead it was determined they would take what could eventually turn into an s-shaped road so I would say the the subdivision standard would apply to um any kind of a plat WEA it's a two lot subdivision um we're just agreeing that it's on there's a pre-existing condition that happen long before they took over the properties and um it really doesn't make sense to require more right of way from them when there's a significant property to the east that if that were to develop it would be much less impactful to take additional right away at that time to allow for eventual Improvement of the street right I I agree I was just confused as to why any sort of subdivision like um I guess but that can be taken offline um would result in an improved streat like are anyway so that that was all thank you for addressing that uh I don't have any other concern and I'm prepared to move forward um but if you guys have discussion points or things you'd like to ask please feel free you know I think it you had to go through some some hoops to make this happen so just want to rec recognize that but all looks good so at this point in time I think um let's go ahead and make a motion to approve the preliminary plant and the variance for the slaya Edition um I will make that motion oh second all those in favor I and no one opposed sorry you had to sit through the whole first one we were gonna switch we gonna switch it and put you first yeah we were going to but then we started and and she didn't want to yeah it didn't make sense but thank and I think it's delightful to see uh to see Neighbors um making making such decisions together so thank you for that and good luck all right then the last thing that we have are anything that staff or Council would want to discuss with the commission or anything the commission has for staff or regarding planning project updates or the city council I have nothing okay so and just to reiterate as we touch on that the commissioner liaison calendar is still on but you will note that it says suggested City Council meetings uh with that being said um commissioner kazaki asked if the packets were still being printed and we clarified that they are not being printed so you will not get a uh a packet delivered if you choose to adhere to the schedule um so just make sure that you are looking um for any necessary information online um otherwise feel free to continue to follow the suggested city council um meeting calendar and if nothing else is on I will uh entertain a motion to adjourn tonight's meeting I'll make that motion to adjourn the meeting I will second all right all those in favor say I iting adjourned