day is going to be in session. You ready in the back there? >> Yep. >> Okay. 7:30. What is our date? Uh December 16th, 2025. You're call to order. Approval of agenda. >> I'll make a motion. >> I'll second the motion. All >> in favor? I. >> All opposed? Motion carries. >> I'm sorry. Who Who first >> Dave your side? >> Dave and Sean. Okay. >> Hey, sound guy. I can really hear it this morning. Way to go, sound guy. >> Yeah, it's turned up. >> Anybody want to add anything to this agenda before we jump in? I know that we were going to talk quickly about >> the new business. >> Any new business? >> Yeah. under um excuse me uh uh tax levies and interest re relating to to the uh discussion of last week >> on which part of last week? >> The um uh the money that the city is going to uh put forward for the triangle and then the interest on that money >> future revenues >> f right. >> Okay. Okay. So that would be >> quick discussion. We got to get him out here. He's got a doctor's appointment today. >> So that would be an addendum in addition to the change to the agenda. >> I'm sorry. >> That would be a change to the agenda. So I need the motion Dave and Sean to agree to change the agenda. >> I'll make a motion. Is that a >> and I'll second it. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I. All opposed. >> Let's see here. Consent agenda approval of minutes. All right. So, who is, where, and what? And uh we all approve the consent agenda. >> We need a motion, a second. >> We need a motion. >> I'll motion to approve the consent agenda. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I. >> All opposed. Consent agenda carries. John, before we get started, I want to make sure that we get our emails straightened out. If someone wants to contact you, what is your average turnaround rate to make sure they get responded? Typically within a day. >> Within a day. >> Yeah. >> Okay. I just want to make >> in case. Yeah. Just in case you're off or something. >> I want to make sure everybody gets heard and just in case we're working with timesensitive material that we we get a response. >> Sure. >> Something. Hey, hi. How are you? Bye. Whatever. That make sense? >> Yep. >> Okay. Open form. Is there anybody online this morning? Because we got such a full house. >> There's nobody online. >> Come on, Hayden. Can you call in just once for us? >> Can you act like >> Hello, this is the EDA call. >> Thanks, Aiden. >> Someone cares. >> Old business damage to ban boxes. Uh, let's talk about item C. We're going to have that real quick call conversation. >> Skip A and B. >> We're just going to skip A and B for now. Uh, yes. No, a sidewalk village. We had to cut talk about that one. Any any traction there? Uh we're out of ran out of the season about a month ago. So it'll be in the spring or 2026 I should say. >> You called somebody >> uh public works. >> Oh >> yeah. >> So they are planning on repairing. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Scott, you want to add anything on that? >> Marty was going to get some quotes on what it it's going to take, but we'll see it. I I know we can't do it now. >> Yeah. So make sure we got things in place. lent property D. >> Um, I AG has said that there's a lot of interest in the property, but we've got no offers yet. >> Interest. >> Yep. >> Okay. Robinson tax forfeit property. >> I was just going to ask quick, do you know what type of people are interested? Like what kind of interest? >> Mostly realtors. >> Mostly realtors. It actually Okay. >> I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing. >> Uh, it could be either one. >> Well, at least we're getting some interest. >> Yeah. >> Mhm. >> I'm sorry. Did we were E Rob Robinson Street tax for property? >> Yes. Uh, so just going back from the beginning a little bit. This is a tax forfeiture property. It was conveyed from Henipin County to the city. Uh, at the November council meeting, the the council uh provided this to the EDA. Uh we're waiting on confirmation from Henipin County that the property is in the EDA's name before we put it on the market. Um so last month we at last month's EDA meeting the EDA agreed on a price. Um so there's essentially nothing to do right now but wait. >> Same with the Dayton Parkway forfeiture. um similar. So, uh the city provide or city council provided the EDA a $300,000 loan to as kind of a gap measure uh to purchase the property. We sent over a check to Henipin County and similar in Robinson, we're waiting from confirmation from Henipin County that it's changed into the EDA's name. Uh so once it does that we'll plat the property um make sure that we have right away in storm water pondage and then the rest of and then the remaining property would be able to be marketed. So and we have had a lot of interest in this property. We've had interest in this property for several years >> that is also listed with the IIA guys or it's going to be >> it will be okay. I was going to ask that question. On all of these properties once it's signed off on or is IDA going to put up a for sale sign on the property? >> They will. Okay. Not the city. >> Not the city. >> Okay. >> I think it's kind of gig. >> Okay. And they know that. >> Oh, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. >> You were going to say something, did you? >> Anybody else on F? >> No. Moving on. Item G, Balsson Lane signage. >> Okay. Uh so this came up started with the October uh EDA meeting where the EDA suggested that we have a a sign on either end the north and south end of Balsam. Uh we reached out to different sign vendors had one that responded and provided this uh drawing with a quote of uh 90 $98,000 depending if it had real brick or fake brick. Um the EDA had asked for this last month had asked for two concepts. one uh that followed the sign ordinance and the other one that had name plates for all the businesses on Balsam. Um I don't have a plan for the second one, but the sign vendors did say that it would add 22 ft onto the height of the sign um and recommended against it simply that it would be too much information for uh drivers to to recognize individual name plates. That sign looks pretty pretty awesome. >> I would hope so. For >> don't get cheap now, man. We've been fighting this for five how many eight years now. >> Is that a Is that digital? >> Yes. >> Obviously. >> I like that. >> Mhm. >> You guys like that? So, it's it would replace the existing Rainree sign. Um, with Rainree having a gas station there, there's uh we can also put in uh the gas price signs above uh well either above or below the Dayton city of Dayton sign. So it would add some height to the sign. >> So it would like double as a welcome to the city of Dayton. And >> that's the intent. >> Okay. Um you know what the P photo at the right this is on a a schematic drawing from um Dayton Parkway and Territorial um when the city did branding and I don't remember what year it was we adopted kind of a branding sign or gateway sign >> five years ago. >> So the intent is that um all the gateway signs in Dayton would look similar to this. >> Um you know the sign at the right does not include a digital sign. So >> right, >> uh, you know, question for the EDA is, do you want to kind of keep the same sign design as much as practical? And this would be a much larger sign than what uh is shown in either one of these. >> Could the top part of that sign be fashioned as the same as that? >> Yeah. >> Same. So the kind of Yeah. To me it's not as much the size as it is the you know you want to keep with the same theme I guess but the size I mean you I think what was always discussed is that the different entrances to or whatever to Dayton may have different size signs like I didn't I always thought I then the discussion was that you know we're not going to be able to put up I don't know what that sign down in the bottom right costs but it was >> 56 6. >> How much? >> 56. >> 56. Oh, that's >> cheaper than I thought. But I I mean, the idea was we weren't going to spend the same amount at every place, you know, like some of them might be >> the same theme, but lesser. >> I really like that. So, what's our direction today for staff? >> Uh, well, we we don't have money in the budget to buy this sign. So, to me, it's holding off on this. If there's something you'd like to change, if you you know, for instance, if you want to keep the same top on the the right side and apply that to the the new side, we can get a new drawing on it. But then otherwise, it's just waiting until we can afford it. >> You know, I I took some time to look at the sign in front of your place, Scott, and uh and of course, that sign only is associated with businesses near buildings. >> Yep. >> That's correct. So, it's not >> Rainree Dental, it's not Hutner, it's not whatever. And >> in my mind, that that's part of the the goal is to uh have signage that promotes Balsam Lane Business District or whatever we want to call it. >> Is that a double side sign? >> Yes. >> So, it's digital both sides. >> Yes. >> Awesome. And that's 90K one side, not two sides. Correct. >> I mean, one end not both ends. Yes. >> So that's >> and that includes installation and electric >> one a single sign. >> Single sign. Okay. >> Is that all in include electric in in >> um I I have to look at the quote. I I believe so. >> Okay. And >> well, I shouldn't say that it's not including like if there needs to be electric run to the site, then that would not include that like that. >> It's going to be more of a figure it out on >> is that then electric bill on the on the property owner then >> um if it's if the property owner get provides an easement to the city, we're paying for that bill. >> Like we're paying for everything. >> Who who would be in charge of the content of that site? Um, if it's the city sign, it would be the city >> city. So, Rainree could use that sign to promote its own businesses within. >> Yeah. I mean, I think the idea is that it would be available for any business on Balsam. >> Well, we talked about a buyback if we had if we could break that in segments and the businesses on Balsam would rent spots from it. >> Yeah. >> And that way we can alleviate that from the tax role and put it back into uh private business. >> Sure. So we can do that as a digital sign. If we did just name plates, it's going to be too big. >> You guys like that the buyback? >> I think it makes sense. >> Yes. >> Nobody gets advertising marketing for everybody. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I don't like the idea of of uh putting extending it up and putting gas prices over it. They've already got another sign. Yeah. >> Shows gas prices. I think this should be stand on its own. I agree with that. >> I mean maybe uh this was a really going back a little bit question, but what are we what would we like what would the city like this area to be called? Is it like Balsam Lake Business Park or is it or you know what or is it cuz everyone right now it's Green Tree Plaza, right? I mean that's kind of what or the other thing a lot of people used to say is PDQ. I think it was a PDQ. >> Yeah, that we still referred to as a PDQ often. >> Yeah. >> But I mean, is there cuz I think it it's somewhat important to kind of try to identify the area as if you're going to sign it. And >> but we're we're like jumping way ahead here. Let's nod our head on the sign and then we'll call it something. >> Okay. Well, I mean, as long as we're all stacking hands on >> I think it's a great sign. Yeah. >> Kudos. That's what it should have been years ago. Because if you saw digital, we can just dump that in later. >> Well, sure. You >> Jack, I think what you're referring to, let's say if this is a Balsam business district of having including that language on the sign. >> Is that right? >> Potentially. Yeah. >> On the top one or on the digital? >> On the Could be. >> Oh, you could do it digital. I mean, it's fine to do digital. I don't I mean I think it's just to me it's one of those things is that then when people start seeing that they're going to >> reference it that way and then they know their business is there. >> I think it would help the businesses a lot to have some kind of common >> name and recognition. >> Name recognition. >> People will say they're going down to Balsam instead of going down to PDQ >> or Rainree Plaza or whatever, you know. Um, do you want to use the the same shape on the right and apply that to the left? >> Say that again. >> So, the same uh I'm going to say the curvature of the sign. So, you take the >> the existing uh gateway sign on on uh uh Dayton Parkway has a curvature. Do you want to apply that to the new sign? >> To me, tomato. I don't have preference either way. >> Okay. Yeah, I think if it if the city council uh deems it important, I think like I agree with Tim, then it's fine. >> You want to match the swoop? >> Yep. >> Well, what if we change what if we change uh monikers in the city? Then >> the shape would still be the same. >> Okay. >> The shape of the sign. >> Yeah. That to me, I don't It don't matter to me, guys. >> Uh I like >> Yeah. Match swoop. >> I guess we're on page for that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. cuz for me it doesn't matter. Heck, I'm just ecstatic that we're already talking about a sign. >> Mhm. >> Eight years to this point and we still >> still got to pay for it. >> Well, there's that. >> Yeah. >> Maybe we get a loan from Councilman Salonic on this one. >> I mean, do you need to approach the businesses in this and ask about your you know, I think your point about them >> potentially paying that >> Yeah. port over. >> Yeah, I think that's a good next step is to go to the businesses with the concept and talk to them and and and >> you know, we can kind of calculate what it would be over X years. You know, each business would be X amount to put it up there. >> I guess you'd have your name rotating on there probably. >> Imagine what the difference is. You got 8 foot and if each one's two foot, it's only four foot per section and still have a time and clock. You have to see what it works out. Yeah, that's just just an example. I suspect >> it's it's 8 foot. >> I going to work on that for next month. But >> okay, >> these are weather rated oily screens in the bid. >> Uh I believe so. I mean, this is an outside sign. >> Light compensated so that the neighbors don't get all lit up. >> Yep. >> God, that really looks good. Who was this? My guy or your guy? >> Uh sign art. They're based out of Wisconsin. Nice job. As far as the brick, fake or not, what do you guys feel on that? You care? >> Durability is the main issue. >> If the if the fake bricks is as durable as the big, you know, real brick, I'd go fake. >> Mhm. >> Makes any difference. You can't tell. >> Is that the fake brick? Oh, I see what it is. >> Cuz I I can just give you an example. uh on Hemlock coming into our development. Uh there was a a big brick sign on a on a um base, concrete base that said Wildwood Springs. And the city didn't provide any backup monies for maintenance on the sign. So the guy that lives there just tore it down >> cuz it was falling apart. >> Falling apart. That was fake brick. >> Yeah. No, no, that was real brick. So >> where's your point? >> Who's in construction that >> but the durability because you know there was a sign with real >> well there's income coming on this sign so it's not like it's just stopping >> right. >> So so whether we got to divert income from >> does anyone have any idea on fake brick versus real brick on >> every house has fake on my building and it's it's literally stone. >> Yeah. >> It's just surface stone. >> Yeah. I mean, I you see that you can't tell the damn difference on it between the real and the fake. The first hits, it ain't going to matter anyway. >> Yeah, >> I would say the the stone is just fine. >> Yeah, false stone. I would agree. >> Probably easy to fix, too. >> I think the faux stone is is fine. And it seems like $8,000 is a pretty big premium for that amount of space or that amount of brick. So, I would >> I guess we're on page with the fake stuff. >> Sure. Yep. Or Fox F AUX. >> All right. Then as far as logic sense goes, we're uh we're on page with that as a group. We just got to fund it. And how do we start this process with the businesses? And do we start this process? >> Um I can talk to the businesses unless there's a a preference unless the EDA has a preference. Again, I I've got to work out, okay, how you know, if it's a $90,000 PL sign plus whatever the electrical is going to cost. Let's just say it's 100,000. Um, what how much are businesses willing to pay and how long is it going to take the EDA to pay this off? >> Yeah, >> I think that's a big question. What's the life of a sign? >> 10 years. >> Sure. >> Ra the Ray tree sign's been up there for much longer than 10 years. >> We rubber over there. >> I think I think that was pick a number, >> right? There might be a lifetime on >> I didn't know if the city had a standard depreciation for >> um No, >> our signs have been up for 40 years. >> Yeah. Okay. >> Yeah, >> they've been dep >> I would guess digital's less, but yeah. >> Well, and then maintenance the elementary school sign has been there for >> lightning takes out too. We got to worry about lightning on those things, right? >> For sure. Would you have in your side of the woods over there? Would you have liked something like this in your area? Um, no. But it's different though. It's not I mean there's three businesses in there and it's not retail. It's Yeah. So it didn't It's different. I think for this for Balsam I think it's spectacular idea just because I think you know it might bring in businesses that say hey I don't know. Nobody knows how I get here now. They know. So >> once we start this ball rolling I mean there's other places in town going to start following this. Well, we already have one and it's good. >> So, I mean, just doing the the quick math, depending on how many businesses buy into this, it's probably going to be between three $300 and $500 a year. >> Absolutely. >> Scott,300 to500 a year for business. >> I would think that. So, yeah, you're going to get some play on that. Yeah. >> Would you spend it? >> Probably not. >> I don't Yeah, I don't know. >> So, what do we got? How many businesses there are? >> Uh, I've counted 27. >> 27. >> So, I'm just assuming 30. I'm just rounding it up to 30. >> H. Okay. >> So, 30 times 500. >> 15,000. >> A lot of businesses in there. >> Yeah. >> Our payback on ROI is uh what? 9 years. >> If at 500 we don't Well, if all 30 participated, we don't need $500. >> Right. >> Right. >> So, but I can do the math on it for next month. Let's and let's get a form set up so we can get it sent to the neighbors >> and say, "Hey, this is happening." >> Well, I still have to get the easement from uh Rainree. So, they they verbally they've said that they would be open to it. >> How do we work that? Send them a letter and say, "Hey, we're ready to do this." >> Uh, no. It's a legal agreement of >> purchasing an ease. In other words, this is not going to be in the median there at the little flower garden. This would be a >> replacement carton ra. >> Do we need counseling on this one then? She needs to drop a agreement. >> Oh yeah. >> Yeah. >> And the south side. Am I thinking that right? Southside the other side. Um >> need permission from the land owner. >> North corner. >> North be the north north and west. North and east. >> No, I'm at the other side of malls. So >> you're down by where your side is. >> Oh >> yeah. So is there a space down there to put it? Uh, >> no. >> I mean, maybe on the uh east side. >> And we're okay. We're okay with just the one side. >> No, we want both sides. If we're going to do this, let's do this, right? >> That's why I'm asking the question, >> you know, I mean, >> both sides are both the sign. >> So, both sides, you're talking 100 200 grand. >> This would be your property. >> No, I know that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, yeah. Then 200,000 in signs, >> right? Well, I would think that'd be pretty good for your tenants. >> I don't have any I don't have any retail. I'm 100% wholesale. 99.98% wholesale. >> But you still got deliveries. You still got trucks coming in and out. You got your home office of stuff. >> That's his fault if he can't find me. I mean, I think the one thing particularly when you get to 200,000, I think you're we're going to have a >> Is there a justification when you spent 56,000 for the main sign coming into Dayton, you're spending 200,000 on >> this area? I mean, it's just an optic thing. I guess >> you want to throttle it. >> Didn't the uh the city the uh the freeway side and that company didn't want to bid on it, huh? Uh, I don't I don't know who that company was. So, I probably There were five sign five companies I contacted. I don't know if that was one of them >> that did the uh freeway sign. >> Yeah, that's not that long ago. >> Well, now that we have like a plan here, >> I can send this to my sign guy as well and say, "Hey, look, we're doing this." And see if we can knock some numbers down on this. >> That make sense to you? >> All right. Well, as far as today goes, I think we're on page. You have some direction with that? >> Yep. Uh we're doing one sign. It you it'll with the fake brick. Um we'll we'll adjust the top of it so it represents the more closely represents the gateway sign that we have on uh Dayton Parkway. And I'll put some numbers together of what it would cost to what it might cost for uh businesses to rent space annually. >> What are we going to charge the Dayton guys for their sign on there? >> Is there more traffic? Hey, nobody rides for free around here. >> Probably I would say there's probably the north end, I would guess, just because residential. >> So, it would make sense to put a bigger sign on the north side and potentially smaller sign on the south side. >> You're definitely getting a lot more road traffic on this side than the other side. >> Okay. >> The other side's I would guess it's a eighth of the traffic, isn't it? >> Well, I don't know. That school thing spins it up pretty good in the morning. >> Yeah, that's all really. You got like 15 20,000 cars a day going down river. I mean it's a lot. >> That's a lot. >> Well, there's no doubt it's going to be a good win on that side and we have been fighting for that for a long time. >> So, how about the property >> just east of of the uh Rainree Plaza there that's for sale. Yes, >> that's the one that has the >> uh >> just curious if if this has to take into account is there going to be a retail center there is >> um there there's a proposal for an assisted living facility. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> And they would have their own probably have their own sign. I'm just curious if it was a, you know, if something has to, you know, or either property west of of Rainree, you know, is there going to be commercial going into there? >> There might. >> Well, there's still an opportunity for us to put another name on the sign. Yeah, >> it just divides the total for the rest of us. >> Okay, moving on. Six. New business. Sign ordinance. John, tell me again why we're playing this one. >> Uh, you asked to put it on the agenda if there was any interest in amending the sign code. >> Now, if we remember back in a couple of days ago, >> okay, eight pages, >> we played this game and it went up to uh planning and planning played a different game and then council had a 30 60 whatever some page game. >> Yeah. I mean, I think the original site ordinance went from a couple pages about 30 pages, didn't it? Last time we did this, >> I was looking from direction from the mayor. Uh, and we missed calls last night to see if he wanted us to play this game again. And that's why it's I think it's on the agenda. So, at this point, if he calls the ball, do we want to play a game heavy or light on this one or do we just want to go back to our original one we made how many years ago? Got to be five years ago now. >> I'm sorry. Catch me up, would you? What? What are you talking about? >> When we when we had the sign ordinance, you want to do it. This sign ordinance used to be about 40 pages. >> Yeah. And >> and I think we're down to eight now. >> 15. >> 15 is it? Y. >> And our goal would be to get it over less. >> We had we had four pages of of signs. I >> I'm all for changing the sign. >> Okay. Because yours was one of the reasons why I pushed on that. >> Yeah. I I get it. >> Okay. >> I still don't have a sign up because I can't whatever. But it's fine. >> Yeah. Restricted. >> Okay. So, back to what you were saying. Uhoh. No, I wanted two. >> Dennis's theory is when I was talking to him is businesses know what they need to have and who are we to get in their way other than laser signs in the air. They're >> gambling. the two obviously opposing forces is like, you know, the business wants to let people know that they're there >> and of course the city's responsibility, I guess, is to make sure it's not too obnoxious. And so it's it's a tough >> tough balancing act, you know, but it there's um >> I wouldn't say we make it easy on people, but it's uh you know, I I understand the other side of it as well, like you know, you can't have people blinded by a light or whatever the case may be, right? >> So I I don't know. I I it it seemed like when we went back at this I think our goal the first time was to make this a bit more businessfriendly. >> I'm not sure that was the outcome. >> Well, I mean the argument is we're here and you know I had to I had to work within the you know par. So I mean like the real I wasn't going anywhere because the sign ordinance was was whack. I yeah, I think it's something that you're probably not going to like pull up roots and leave, but it does, you know, does make things maybe a little more difficult for people as you know. >> So, what I'm hearing is we should work with the one we made then and see if it still fits today. A light a light grab. >> Which then? >> What was the date of that? It was about five years ago. >> 1864. >> Home looked at it, wasn't it? for five years. >> I think that preceded me. >> Yes, I think so. >> Well, the the premise, like you said, was to make it very straightforward, simple. We took sign ordinances from all over the country. We brought them here and we says, "Okay, this makes sense." We made a really nice presentation and then planning got it and it exploded from there. >> That'll happen again. >> That's why I wanted Dennis's guidance on this before we button pulled this trigger. >> So, question for the EDA. So you had the sign ordinance in the packet. What do you want to change? >> I think from my standpoint, I think that the sign ordinance should be businessfriendly. For instance, you know, I came back through Dayton Parkway and notice the quick trip sign. You're on 94. You can see there's a Quick Trip right there. I just drove got back from Wisconsin. I went through Woodbury and Woodbury uh appears they don't want any signs. So it says quick trip off here, but I I had no idea where it was. >> Mhm. >> So I mean I think think the signs are for business. We want to make sure that that our sign ordinances is business friendly. >> So next month we want to put this for a light discussion. Everybody have a chance to read through the sign ordinance. Well, I was going to say I think we need to review the existing side ordinance to I have no idea what's in it. I don't I can't even voice an opinion. >> You agree with that? >> Yeah, I I've read it and I don't you know I'm not running a business so I don't know which parts are >> you know are problematic um with it but I would be more in favor of revising the one we have than >> starting over. >> Starting over again because I think then then you're talking about a yearong process. Yeah, let's not do that again. I mean, what I ran into were really some gaps that weren't addressed, I think, in the in the sign ordinance. We all have different, you know, >> cuz there's different things like I'm agricultural, so agricultural really wasn't addressed for businesses, you know, so that was a whole different deal. So, >> I have no problem with signs. I mean, that sign that's on uh 169 there in Champlain >> where they sell advertising, >> that big tall one. >> Yeah. Yeah, I think it's so I think it's awesome. >> The digital billboard. >> Yeah. >> Yep. >> I mean that that way you you have you can sell advertising. >> Should have been down about 300 yards cuz I I'm watching it and almost ran the red light there. >> Read it. >> Yeah. I mean it's there. You see? Wow. You know. >> Yeah. That's Mayor Boington. He was a mayor back in the early 90s. His sign and the council at that time approved the signature. Either way, we should read the sign. Table us for next month. Let's have a discussion on us. We're all on page one. >> All right. >> Are you uh uh going to send us a packet of the uh sign ordinance? >> Um it already did. >> Or did Okay. >> Yeah. So, it all included for the next month. >> All right. >> John, did that include the most recent amendments? >> Um it did not. >> So, it's just what's on the website. >> Send it back out to you guys. >> Okay. because there was a there was an amendment when Quick Trip went through previously in early 2025 related to an increase height for monument signs from 8T to 16 ft. So there was a little bit of flexibility that was already offered um earlier this year. So >> Sure. >> We'll update that and send that back to you. >> Well, what would you keep this new business for next time or it would be old business? >> It's up to you. >> Let's make it a new business code as a function because when we spring comes hitting and we can start funding this sign. I want to I don't want to wait. You got a lead time on that install? >> No. >> Okay. >> It it it'll take some time because we've got to go through the legal process of acquiring an easement and then we still have to come up with the money to pay for it. >> Okay. >> All right. >> I'm sorry. On the quick trip, was that a conditional use change on the or the whole sign was the whole was it amended? The ordinance was amended from 8 feet to 16 feet. >> It was kind of a two-parter. The ordinance as a whole was amended, but this came through a variance request for that large pylon sign that's 80 ft tall on the Okay. >> So, it was the variance was kind of the driver of it. And then, um, through conversation with the city council, it kind of came to the understanding that, you know, if they want a taller monument sign, those are more appealing than pylon signs in general. Let's offer a little bit more flexibility in that regard. So, >> h, >> that sign is a similar argument, but whatever. >> 80 ft though. You you just said that 80, right? Correct. >> Let's do that on both. Right. >> The issue was the southbound I'll call it southbound traffic on 94 >> to be to be able to see that from up the road because obviously going >> northwest you can see it from a mile away and >> bridges in the way. >> Plus, they got the billboard on the other side of the road that now says Quick Drip. Yeah. So, you're not going to miss it when you're leaving town, but >> I think they're trying to mostly catch people coming into town >> and very busy. >> Very, very busy. So, >> well, and I think to me, and I I'd have to go back through and read the sign ordinance, but within give it a distance, 300 ft of an interstate, our sign ordinance should be different, I think, than the >> Oh, for sure. >> And I don't remember if it's laid out that way or not. I don't think it is. And so you kind of got this weird pylon sign ordinance 16 ft, but you know, I mean, that could be anywhere in the city versus, >> you know, you need obviously taller along the highway. It just there's things like that that are just like this is asinine. >> We had that we had the conversation. >> I think we had it the last time. It's like, you know, within >> I don't know what the distance is. 500 ft of the highway, 300 ft, 200 feet, what whatever the amount is. is they need different signage. >> It's a totally different use than something that in another part of the city. >> There are many cities with freeway frontage that have a an established district that uh include properties that are give a little bit more allowance for that reason. >> I mean to me it's if we're going to look at the sign thing, which I think we should, we ought to really be looking at it by where the hell is it at in the city >> and not because it's just so different, you know? >> And we did that. I quite remember that. We're not going to put a pylon on balls and we're not going to put a ball over RDO, >> right? I mean, you I mean, an 80 foot sign on Balsam would be ridiculous, but an 80 >> an 80 foot sign for you guys. >> I want you to see when you get up in the morning, >> right? You know, you want the people over at Lazy Days Campers and Ramsay to be able to see the Boston Lane sign. >> Yeah. There you go. >> Well, you can dang near there see theirs over there. >> You can see theirs, can you? Yeah, I think we can see. >> Okay, we got it. >> Okay, >> we're moving on. >> Minnesota bonding request rail spur. Go, John. >> Uh, so this is a request, Tim, that you had asked to put put this on the agenda. Um, there's assumptions here of of a feasibility study. It would the numbers I've got is between 10 and 30,000. So, I just put 20,000 on there. Um, 3 million for railroad spur. Again, that that's kind of an educated guess. and really $8 to $20 million for a transload facility. So the question of, you know, how do how does the EDA get $8 million? Um, >> that's my question. >> That's just the feasibility study. >> Uh, 20,000. >> Oh, okay. But the eight eight whatever million is the actual building of the Transl facility. >> Where' the three 8 million come from? uh that came from uh an an engineering consultant. >> Well, here's some background on this for you guys. We were to have a meeting yesterday and meet with these guys when we couldn't do it because someone had to change the schedule. And I think before we start getting wrapped up in what all this is, we should have that meeting so we have better information for you. That's my opinion. And John, you were in on that and we couldn't get it done. So, I I want you guys to know what's going on up to to the minute, what's happening. >> Yeah. As far as the money, you're going to need participation from all the parties involved, and you don't know what those numbers are. So, how do you talk about it? >> Yeah, there's no conversation. >> What's the participation? What businesses are stepping up saying, >> right, >> they'll put money up to have this facility? >> Well, we we don't have any businesses that are willing to put money up. We have two that are are wanting this facility or would use it. >> Well, >> well, of course they want it if it's there for free. >> Yeah. I mean, >> and I mean, >> you're not building it if nobody pays for it, >> right? >> I brought this up last time we discussed there's a big difference between a transload facility and a railroad spur. And and I I in my view point of this uh we haven't uh uh separated those two. Uh transload facility is a big facility. You're going to have a lot of semis coming in. You're going to have to have a lot of space, you know, multiple rail lines, you know, whatever. And versus a railroad spur that just brings >> railroad cars to to the facility. And I I still think there in my mind anyway there there is no differential between it. We're still talking about a transload facility. And if if the EDA thinks that the transload facility is what we should be focusing on, then that's fine. I don't see that, you know, from from Chemstone and uh King King, you know. Now, I don't know if Sure. King would love that. They go two miles and they, you know, they can offload and unload containers like crazy. Sure, they would instead of hauling in the Fidley or or wherever the the nearest one is. Um, however, if they had a railroad spur, maybe they could do their own. >> Mhm. >> You know, be able to load their containers onto a a flat flatbed car and then, you know, once twice twice a week a train comes up and picks picks up. But a train is going to come, you know, and pick up, you know, one or two cars unless it's got other business along that route. Mhm. >> So, um that that's my only comment is that I think we're talking in my mind two different things. >> Sure. >> Yep. >> So, >> is there anybody who wants to join in on the conversation when we have it? >> I mean, yeah, if I'm available in >> available. >> Okay. Let's make sure that next invitation is out to everybody who wants to join in. >> Okay. to who are you having it with just seven stone and RDO and a company that BNSF put us in contact with? >> Yeah. So really what I'll do is reach out to >> that does these kind of things or >> BNSF gave us a list right? >> Yes. >> And he picked one off list and they said here contact one of these people these companies and go from there. So we have the ear of BNSF now. >> Okay. >> So the company that they're pointing you to is like someone that would do like the fees of >> Nobody works with them. Yeah. >> Right. Would probably do the feasibility and in my mind this wouldn't be a this would be a private enterprise, >> right? >> Facility. >> Dave, >> one of the things that this will work if if and you have interest in my opinion from some of the big players, FedEx, Graco, some of the other players in Rogers there that are close. >> Yeah. >> I mean, if those big players have interest, then it may work. If you don't get interest from those big players, I think you're going to have a hard time. >> We don't have interest. So, >> do you talk to all the Rogers people? >> Um, I shouldn't say I haven't talked to all the Rogers people. We've talked to Graco and some of the other ones in in Dayton. Um, they don't have they don't need rail. >> And let's just stay on the Transload facility. Has the uh I don't know if the EDA has, but has there been a site chosen where that could be? >> Um yes. >> Versus a rail spur goes into um Chemstone. >> Yes. and or a rail spur goes across the road into King versus a standalone facility or would that be >> it'd be on some property. >> Yeah, I mean there's a lot of space between the old co-op and all the way, you know, down through there. But if you wanted to, I mean, you'll do like a transload facility if you're looking at an actually different different location. But I think there's some more ground work to put in place before we get all >> So, we'll keep this on the agenda for next month. >> Okay. They're going to be 6C now. You added this to the section. Uh, Super D, why don't you go ahead and throw your thoughts? You had some questions. Well, after our meeting last last month, I've been thinking about this and I still find it unusual uh that the city would charge us interest and yes, it was explained last last meeting very distinctly that that would be charged at the time of the sale of the property. So, you know, and I I I find that very interesting because the EDA is working very hard to bring back uh bring those properties into it uh income producing taxable um property. >> Mhm. and uh especially the triangle that that that we are talking about on Dayton Parkway, you know, we're talking, you know, within 5 years maybe a $10 million facility and that which to me would bring in a lot of income for the city of Dayton. Uh when we were discussing this about six, seven months ago, one of the council members said, "Well, why don't we wait 20 years?" Well, we get it for nothing. Well, that's fine. But, uh, the uh, you know, the tax revenues, if we can if we can work this deal out as the EDA and get this thing taken care of within the next 2 to 5 years, you know, all of a sudden that's significant. So, okay, we'll pay the interest. I think that's fine. However, uh the EDA then should have a portion of that levy um uh as a a funding, you know, mechanism for us. I go through Dayton and I see the uh is it Laro? >> Okay. Move the house. I think he's got it on Foundation. Looks really good. We've taken a a house that the EDA negotiated with uh the park and turned it into a another incomeroucing property versus um you know the three rivers could have just sold it and demolished it and and did what they want. Not not that that's >> so get your brass tax tell. So the EDA should any of those properties we should get a get funded by those revenues for 5 10 years maybe. So let's say the city of take this property if we get this done in 5 years you know for the next 5 to 10 years the EDA should get a portion of that levy >> of the property tax property tax not levy but property tax. >> Yeah. or >> yeah, >> you know, a portion of that >> because without the EDA, you know, so and again I I found it kind of interesting that the council would charge us interest and that's been explained. Understand that. So in retrospect then the EDA should reap the benefits from this instead of always having to worry about well if we want to do this that's fine but then we're going to have to pay interest on it. >> Sure. So I the EDA can't I should say the city or the EDA can't separate you know tax revenue from a certain property and give it from you know the city of the EDA. What you can do is ask for more money on the EDA levy. So right now for 20 2025 it was zero. For 2026 it's $25,000. Question for the EDA is how much do you want for a levy for 2027 and what do you want to do with it? >> Well, you're talking he's talking about it for sure and you're talking about a maybe. >> We we ask where this ain't an ask if we set this up or you we have his way. It's an automatic. There is no >> I I don't believe we can do that legally. So I guess the equivalent though is you know I'm making up numbers. Let's say that that we we're able to sell the triangle property and generates a million dollars in property taxes. >> What you're wanting to do is make sure that million dollars comes to the EDA >> or a portion of that. >> Not not all of it. >> Not all of it, but a portion of it. >> So, you have to take the the city council would have to consider not maybe increasing their levies as much and allowing the EDA to increase theirs more. Well, what what it would be the city is still going to have the same whatever levy they want. EDA has a separate levy. >> Yeah. >> Well, no. EDA does have a separate. >> Well, no, I I understand. >> That's not what he's proposing. It's >> Well, conceptual, right? >> It is. Okay. So, let's say we get a $10 million tax bill on this. >> Whatever the number is, >> the EDA should >> 5 million. Half >> get half a million dollars of that. So 5 million half million. >> I think it's a question for our legal council of whether that's legal or not. >> Can the city >> basically take a portion of the property tax on these properties and provide it to >> or or say okay this property is now generating tax income uh >> automatic levy of >> automatic levy of $100,000 for the EDA and where's that going to be funded by the extra property tax on this facility. So it's not a hit on the citizens. >> It's not a hit on the citizens. >> Their taxes will go down or will stay the same and >> it it's similar to like we have tax increment financing. It's in concept it's the same but we're taking the in the additional taxes generated from this property and providing it to the EDA versus providing it to the development >> because at today we have four properties or four involvements. the um Laro, the Robinson property, the land property, and the triangle. So, we got four, you know, we've had four things that are generating income for the city >> that will Yeah. Or will. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> You know, so >> yeah. >> Well, you know, you got a heck of a point. Let's talk to the council here and see what their thoughts are on it. I, you know, I', I've never thought about it this way before, so takes a second for things to soak in. I guess my head's kind of thick, but, you know, I I'm not immediately opposed to it. I think it's an interesting concept because the EDA is adding value to the city. And should the EDA get, you know, some a taste of the deal, so to speak, for having done the done the work to get to get that? And I guess the the first question that has to be answered is is that is that legal? Can cities >> do that in that way? Cut up >> added tax value. I mean there's already a mechanism with the EDA having a levy. the you know the challenge is that the levy gets set by the council not the EDA because if I I'll just go out on a limb and say that the this group would whatever the legal limit is for the EDA to levy is what what the EDA would likely levy at this point and >> would you go above that though let's say we have you can't go above there's a limit there's a statute that defines what that number then his point when's when's the ceiling Yeah. And well, they're they're two different things. One already exists today, right? And I completely agree that, you know, we've been underfunding the EDA. I think the the logic from the council as a group has been, well, the EDA is not doing anything, so what do they need the money for? Right? That's why it went away. It's that's changed since then, right? Now there now there's a lot of action going on. there's actual things that add value to the city um happening and will continue to happen and so should the EDA's levy be more in line with what that activity supports certainly I'm a yes on that but you know this is a different way of looking at it making it something more um you know some some cut of the deal and I think that's a question for the lawyer to start with but I think it's worth looking at further >> an earned performer We want to earn this performance out on ourselves. >> I sure what the words are, but >> I understand. So the bottom line like what we're talking about is not legal, but the end result is going to be the same. It's just how we get there. So you're you're wanting the EDA is wanting to um capture the increment incremental tax value of properties that the EDA is involved with in developing. >> Yes. >> Or a portion of that. >> A portion of it. So yeah, >> I think there's two ways you can do it. One may or may not be legal, which I think we have to ask the council. The question is, is there a way for the city council to actually take a portion of the tax dollar, property tax dollars for those properties and provide it to the EDA? If that's not legal, then the other option is calculating that and and asking the city council to allow the levy increase for the EDA that's equal to >> Sure. that portion that makes whatever that is >> because that already exists that could be >> because that exist there's a there's a mechanism I don't know if that mechanism is enough because you might find out that the >> portion would be actually larger than what you're >> legally allowed to do in the in the levy. >> Yeah, you'd have to have a a limit on I mean you can't go above the legally limit of the levy >> and that can all be set up. I mean, no matter how you look at it, to John's point, you're either leving money directly or you're taking a piece. I mean, >> right. >> Either way, either way, you're taking tax dollars and funding the EDA. I mean, >> Mhm. >> It's the same. >> Well, we're taking tax dollars and charging interest on it, too. >> I think a lot of it is about having our >> the funds available so we can do future projects, future things. Exactly. build a sign where we have the money there >> to do it, right? So, we need money to be able to grow >> because Dayton is a I think is a in a real critical crossroads right now with uh with the Dayton Parkway, the River Crossing. Um you know, the opportunities, you know, if you take a look at Champlain for instance, at Mississippi Crossing, you know, the uh they got that new restaurant. >> Yep. and and it's my understanding that um that there was some help from their ADA in doing that. >> So, quite a bit of help. I'm not and I'm not saying that we want to do that, but I'm also saying I don't think if we went to the council and said we want to do uh um a 1.3 million deal to put a uh you know to upgrade deans for instance or something, you know, that that's not going to fly. >> Well, we all understand your concept. I think we should reach out to our attorney and have that conversation quickly. >> Not not a $8,000 bill. We understand the concept behind this. Everybody on on that page, >> EDA chair and members of the EDA on >> we have a special guest today. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Finally have one in our audience >> trying to trying to help you guys out as much as possible. So I can answer the question legally because I already know the answer for you. Um you cannot individually levy each property based on who you want the dollars to go to. That's not legal to do. Um so I can't take this piece of property and say this portion goes to the EDA, this portion goes to the city. Um so that's not legal. You can take dollars and put them towards the EDA. like basically calculate it. How much dollars is it going for? How much percentage is the EDA want to get or think that the city council believes that the EDA should get? Um, and that's up for debate between the EDA and the council. That's not up for staff to talk about and discuss with, but be able to answer any questions. And then that portion then would go on the tax le for the following year. So then it wouldn't be based on just this property though. That would be then one sliver of everybody's property in town. So, how taxes, you can't take an individual property and do taxes on it unless you're doing a tiff district or a tax abatement district. Then only those dollars go back to that individual company or individual property owner, whatever that may be. And those are set up at the county level as a tiff or a tax abatement. Um, but the EDA will never be considered a tiff or a tax abatement because it's technically part of the city as an operation of the city. So, that's not able to be done. Um, so that'll answer your question before we even have to go to legal. I can answer the question for you. >> I believe is that I'm getting this. His point is if it's good for the goose, it's good for the gander. If we're going to pay interest on money, why don't we get that money? Am I close on that? >> Yes. >> Sure. Yeah. That's up for the council to to discuss and talk about and whatever else. And that's not for me to tell. I'm just here to tell you here's how it works in taxes for >> how it's done is >> sort of immaterial. It's because we have our hands tied. However, like I said, >> you're willing to charge us interest. Yeah, we work for the city, we're generating new income, then that we should be rewarded for that because I think there's a lot of things that the EDA in the future, you know, it we're we got a lot of work to do. >> Yeah. So, there is a limit as well. The limit is 0.01813% 0 01813% of the entire tax market value of the entire city of Dayton is the limit for the EDA to levy that dollar amount right now is >> I'm going to say something like 300ome thousand currently I think is the total limit something like that um but it's a percentage a very very small percentage of the entire market value not the tax capacity which are commonly misconstrued the market value is actual cost of something so it's like you know a building cost a million dollars That's market value is a million dollars. The tax capacity on that is only a h 100red grand or take it back be $10,000 at one at 1%. So, um trying to get like $10,000 would be the number. So, >> well, I think the intent is to get the conversation started. >> Yep. I understand. I just wanted to make sure I can answer questions that I can address right away versus having a follow email. But if we can have the conversation, how we do it, you know, with council is you could basically say, okay, we want, you know, I don't know what whatever percentage of the tax property tax revenue from these properties that adds up to $150,000 that equals half of what we can levy, as an example. And so then I mean in essence you could not even impact the the citizens because >> we already made it. Yeah. >> You know like you're not so because what the reason the city council is not funding the EDA I mean we all know the reason is because they don't want the tax increase to go up for the citizens. And so they're saying okay we got to keep this down. One place we can make sure that we don't have to add to is the >> that's not necessarily true for me. Yeah, I don't for me and and I'm the probably the strongest one on the council that has has been limiting the uh the revenue EDA revenue or I did not want to tax the resident for EDA to get money to do nothing. >> Yeah. >> And that's what has been happening until now. >> Okay. But >> now that we've got something started, it's a whole new conversation. and all of a sudden if we get some traction going and get something to happen, then you have a new conver conversation. Now, does that mean that while I'm on council, I'm I'm willing just because we can do 350,000 bucks. I'm not going to give you that kind of money and and charge the resident about three and a half% for that for it actually be closer to 4%. Well, and I mean I think because I was part of it and the whole reason for having any levy at all before that was to have some money to be able to do something with. I mean it's it's hard. You start an organization you have nothing to do anything with. What what do you do? >> That did happen. >> What do you do? And so you got to somehow build a a war chest of some kind of money. I mean you don't want to overt tax the people. But to me, it was also the there was a general direction within the city council to try to keep uh to try to continue to lower the tax rate for the citizens as we grew. And so I think that all fed into the discussion, you know, and and I I'm for that as well. I'm a citizen. I would like to keep the tax rate as low as I possibly can. And that's why I think in this particular conversation, you could actually do both and not necessarily increase the overall rate. >> But if it's under the same model, what stops future council to say, "Well, EDA is not doing enough. We're going to cut them again and we already have this. We make this agreement." What stops them from chopping the new one? Nothing. >> No. >> Nothing. >> I'll be I'll be honest with you, Chair. There's not a single thing in government that can't be redone after for a previous council. So that's one thing about government that everyone needs to be aware of, residents and all is that one thing that's done now can be reversed, undone, redone, made more restrictive, less restrictive with the following council, the following 6 months, whatever may have you. So there's nothing that you can do. Even if you wanted to pass a resolution, >> I mean, there is quite literally nothing you can do to say that would stop a future council from cutting that funding from you. Unless that triangle was split, we we had not illegally, but unless that was split and was already in our tax, >> wouldn't matter if it's in your name or not, doesn't matter cuz it's all in the big pot of money. Yeah, you got it. It's in the big big portion. So, um, >> interesting concept. Very interesting concept. >> So, could we start by defining what the benefit has? I mean, I think in the end, I I get the you could ask for the limit and whatever, but to me, what you want to do is try to show the value of what's actually been happening. >> And and I haven't heard anything today that would define I mean, I know that there's been a lot of activity and I'm pretty excited to be part of that. Um, but it' be certainly good to be able to define both the economic benefit of what it is that we've been like the Lucero property is a great example. um just so you can start showing okay well the EDA is doing something this is what it looks like the reality is the more you fund it the more it might produce based on the trajectory it's it's got so I think from this point defining what that is is probably the start >> because rather because we don't even know what we're asking for if I mean it's it's kind of silly to say not be silly is the wrong word but it's I think it's I think we're too early to say this is what we deserve. Um, look what we've, you know, without saying look what we've done. >> I would agree with that. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> I think that's certainly strengthens the argument for the levy piece of it is to to track, you know, how did we as a committee add value, right? What is >> what are the future tax revenues? How much housing did we provide? I mean, everything that ties it back to whatever our >> our purpose is, >> right? So that use that that house as an example. So now it it's going to be completed and sold and and there will be property tax revenue generated off of that property that you know for the most part didn't exist before. Right? So that's the value that the EDA has added to the city. And I think you you bundle those up as as we continue to >> I think you got >> do things to say, >> you know, we brought this much new tax revenue into the city and for us to continue doing that, then we need to be funded at X level, right? >> You know, the the philosophy from the council's standpoint for the the last several years, first of all, we wanted to reduce taxes because we were way out of whack with all our neighbors, right? In the last couple of years now, we've said keep it flat. Now, that doesn't mean that there's not more money coming in because the city is growing, right? The that tax rate is based on the total tax value. I get I'll get the stuff mixed up at some point, but the the amount of taxable value this the city has. We have tried to keep that tax rate the same. But in the meantime, what did the the budget that we just passed increased the total budget by 900,000 over last year, somewhere in that ballpark? >> Yeah, I remember the percent. It's 7 something%. I can't remember the exact dollar amount, but it's 7% over. >> So my point is with exactly the same tax rate, there's close to a million dollars more money available, >> right? And only $25,000 of that is going to the EDA. I think you can argue it differently. You know, that the EDA deserves a bigger slice of that. And this this helps make that argument to say here's where we've added value. This is what partly why the city is getting more money, why there's more tax value. and you know so I think if we can't do what you were suggesting legally then you know then this is the argument that that goes to the council to say this this is what we've done this is why we want more because we're going to continue to do that >> yeah that makes sense >> one of the questions I have when the city council makes a budget you know or buy something there's a 10-year plan to it and we have about a two-month plan so one of the things I want the EDA to think of when we start working on the budget for 2027 is what do you want to view. That's different. >> When does the EDA become self-budgeted? >> When we have 8 million in there, 2 million, 5 million, when do we not? >> It depends on how much you EDA is going to spend. >> Yeah. >> I I have no problem with if this group saw funds by moving product and property, but you know, our main goal is not to create or make money, but to spur growth and and >> eventually something's going to come back to us. But your main source of money is the levy unless you make it from properties or whatever. But >> does that direction clear for you? I mean, do you have an idea? >> Um, >> muddy water. >> EDA wants more money. >> Well, I think to start though, and maybe I'm wrong, but I don't I want to know what the benefit I want to see the benefit, you know? I want to see a summary. So you you do a nice job when you do the agenda of tying, you know, what the agenda has to do with what our objectives are as an ADA. >> I think defining what the actual subject I'm sorry rather objective value of that by number would be good to see. >> So this is how much tax revenue that has increased based on the activities of the EDA. This is how much housing has, you know, improved. >> Sure. So there's kind of two parts to that answer. one is the projects that the EDA has has had direct involvement with it and then the overall involvement of the city. So I mean there's development development that's happening with or without the EDA and there's benefit to that everyone is getting with that. >> Um for EDA projects I mean it it's much more limited um you know the triangle piece I mean you know that we haven't put it up for sale yet. It's going to sell. It's going to be developed. It's going to be years before there's revenue that's recouped from that. Um, you know, the the Robinson Street and and the Lucero project is probably going to be faster than that. Uh, the Lent property is going to probably be slower. Um, but those are small comp in comparison to what's going on elsewhere in the city. So, we're right now we're working on an office building for Graco. That's going to be huge. >> Yeah. And the EDA has had some involvement with, you know, as long as well as some of the other commissions and especially the council, but you most of the work was from Graco. >> Yeah, >> we'll take part of that one. >> Yeah. >> And just send the check over EDA. >> Well, we get it. We know what you're doing. You guys are busy. >> Yep. >> We got it. Like I said, it's just a concept of of you know, with the ED having a budget now, we don't have to go to the city council every every time we sneeze and need 25,000 to do something. >> Put up a sign >> to put up right to improve the the economic development of Dayton >> and yet build value like John says, what's what's our where's our report card? >> Sure. >> Make sense? >> Yeah. Cuz like I said that uh one council member said, "Well, we can wait 20 years for this property." Well, and then get it for nothing. Well, >> question opportunity. Lots of lost opportunity >> from the Well, the proceeds from the Oh, we purchased the property from Three Rivers and then resold it. That differential went to EDA. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> True of the other properties about 50k. Yeah. So I mean that there's there's a source of revenue >> but we paid >> and the other sources are levy which we need to ask for. I mean city council still got to prove it but we can ask for it and I think we can justify increasing the levy by saying you know we need more budget to do things but we're also adding value and we can demonstrate as you're saying what that value is. It may be small at first, but you know, like even the the property that Lero purchased, I mean, it's going to be whatever it is, whatever the city's portion of that property tax is, $500 a year, >> forever, >> starting probably in 27, I guess, or eight, whichever year. >> Depends on what it when you actually decide. But >> I think we netted what, five, six grand by the time we paid attorney fees on that deal. >> I I don't remember. It wasn't a win, but it was a get your feet wet. Here's how this works. >> Yeah. >> But it's at least a source of revenue. You better >> Well, for the city forever. Those are taxes. That's not That's not ever going away. >> Yeah. >> All right. We want to move forward. >> Yep. >> Staff update seven. >> Who's doing that? Uh Hayden. >> Uh nope. I've got it. So, uh, first, um, in looking at, uh, EDA terms there, at some point in history, we made an error on, uh, numbers at the last council meeting, the council passed a resolution correcting the the expiration of EDA term. So, on the right, this is what what it is currently or what it is now. So, uh, Chair Heter's term expires, uh, the end of this year. um he was reappointed to another six-year term. So, we'll have a swearing in in January. Uh for the other commissioners, this will be um your expiration. Any questions? >> Okay. Uh calendar. So, we're we're trying to start a a new um I don't know, probably a better thing of adopting a an annual calendar at the beginning of the year versus um as we go. Uh so that as the EDA knows, uh this the commission meets on the third Tuesday of the month at 7:30 a.m. I'm assuming there'd be no changes with that. Uh there's no conflicts that I'm aware of. So, or the council and and the other commissions do have conflicts on a few dates uh intersecting with holidays for for instance. Um nothing ever happens on the third Tuesday. >> It's why we picked it. >> Yeah. >> Hey, I'm not nothing. >> Okay. Yeah. I don't I don't foresee a change with this. It works. We're business. We're back to work, you know. >> Yeah. So, we're good with that. uh love local. I received notice that we Henipin County did approve a grant for the EDA. Uh we had asked for $50,000. This back in November, I believe it was. Um so this is a grant uh to the EDA which would then give a grant to uh local businesses for um improvements to building facade. So uh for instance, you know, windows, door, signage, um that type of thing. You said did not did did or didn't. >> We did get it. >> We did get it. We got part of we asked for 50. We got 30,000. >> So, um >> we're going to have some applicants coming in asking for this basically. >> How much that sign? >> Great. >> Uh so the stipulations that it's a one to one I should say it's at least a matching grant. Uh the grant would be to businesses between5 and $15,000. Um, lots of more detail that we still have to work out, but that'll be a a winter project for us. >> Is this just a one-time grant, I assume? >> Uh, annual. So, this is 2026. >> So, we'll apply again. >> We'd have to apply every year. >> Okay. >> Well, we might as well get some of that county tax money back. >> Jeez, >> that's a whole another discussion. >> Imagine what happens when you say we want us to see for county. Yeah. Um, also it not quite a grant, but so an award from uh Minnesota Department of Revenue since we've passed uh surpassed 10,000 population. Uh we we uh qualify for funds for the uh local and statewide affordable housing or LAA for short. uh $73,000 for uh emergency rental assistance, financial support, affordable housing, emergency shelters in similar projects. So there's a question what does all that mean? Um similarly, we'll work on that for 2026. The intent is that this would be whether it's a loan or a grant for um people that that need money for housing. Yeah, we're covering Laha, the neighboring city right now. >> Yes, in Champlain. Well, >> most cities around us. >> What's the point under the bullet points? Minnesota revenue estimates $40 cost burden per household. >> Yeah. So, the state estimates that there are 540 households that are struggling financially in >> Oh, okay. um where this $73,000 could could go towards >> existing >> existing indeed. >> Does this fall under >> these are how these can go to personal like people you know their household >> um it could or it could go to uh like a repair business. So for an example of um your furnace goes out and you can't afford to replace it. Um the EDA could pay the the vendor for installing a new furnace. Gotcha. It's >> like an assistance. >> My question is on the last statement, the city council directed EDA to create a program and I'm not so sure why that's a function of the EDA. >> The EDA serves as the housing redevelopment authority or >> Okay. We are the H EDA. >> All right. We've created one, don't we? >> Yes. >> All right then. We're good to go. Who needs a fire? >> It seems like a great program. >> It it it is, you know, and how do we advertise this and get it out there now? >> Well, >> who needs this? I mean, because soon as they open that floodgate, everybody's going to >> I think we need to have like a >> either a discussion, workshop, whatever to just kind of generate a >> I agree. >> Like what do we actually what kind of program would you put out there and then who do you communicate it to? An application program on the website or >> Well, there there are a lot of details we have to work out still. >> Yeah, sure. income. >> I I'm sure that I mean >> administration, >> you know, we're not the city or the state of Minnesota that just wants to give money to everybody, >> you know. >> Sorry. >> So, wouldn't it a next step can be since most of us don't know anything about LAA? >> Yeah. >> Um some kind of presentation on on what this is and how it works and then we can figure out from there how we want to implement it. who comes in and does that for us. Who can we ask? >> Uh, well, it's going to start with me and then it it's going to depend on what questions the EDA has and then we'll bring in, you know, probably anyone someone from Henipin County or neighboring cities to talk about their program. >> Is this annual? >> Um, the the amount changes, but essentially it's because we've passed 10,000 in population >> based on population or something. Okay. >> Each year. >> Yep. >> I think so. We don't create a program and then it goes away. We create a program and it's continues to be funded. >> The amount will change and qualifying projects may change, >> right? >> Okay. We should look over yonder and see how they're doing it because they got a burn system. Okay. >> What else? Yan staff updates. >> Uh let's see. So, today is the last day for the winter coat drive. Um, officially it expired on on Sunday or Sunday, Monday, but um, we're delivering codes uh, this afternoon. There's 30 that have been donated so far. And if anyone's watching this or for EDA members, you can drop those off at the uh, any donated codes to the police department. It'll be delivered to the Salvation Army. >> Yeah. I don't believe Tony has his box Salvation Army out on this parking lot anymore. Mhm. >> I think they took that away because it was getting >> they're breaking into it and stealing stuff out of it. That would have happened. >> Well, that and just dumping junk there. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He Tony just kind of went I'm done with this. >> Yep. >> I can't blame him. I don't want that in my parking lot either. >> So, I think this is our only avenue now. >> That's that's been gone for a few years. >> Years, I >> believe. So, I suppose I didn't see I didn't have my car show this year. >> Yeah. >> Okay, >> cool. EDA member updates. Well, I've got more uh play place plays every Tuesday morning. Uh Dice and Domino on second and Wednesday afternoons. Um social worker drop in is available anyone from the public on third Wednesdays 3 to 5:00 p.m. at uh the police department. Uh this Thursday, so I mentioned this last month, this is pretty important. Uh this coming Thursday 11:00 a.m. to 1 pm is the Elvate Henipin thriving Thursday. Uh the county will provide two uh business consultants. One on business strategy and the second on legal. Uh we have five uh businesses that are are registered to attend this. Um EDA members are encouraged to attend just to to watch and and learn more about it. >> Are the five from Dayton or >> I don't know. >> Okay. You don't know. >> Um I'm going to guess not. So this is open to any business any small business in Henipin County. >> Uh it's not limited to Dayton. >> Uh similarly it the county has these meetings every month. Somewhere in the county uh for Dayton businesses is free to to attend any of these. It doesn't have to be hosted by Dayton. It can be hosted. I think last month it was hosted by New Hope. >> I do plan on being there. Does anybody else want to join me? >> I've got it on my calendar. >> Okay. I can't make >> everyone should I put it on everybody's calendar. >> Yeah, I have a have to take my wife in for eye surgery on that day. So, >> no worries. We got you covered. But you know this this sort of makes me think about does the EDA have a list of of emails of all our businesses in town >> where we could have you know >> we've done the police one for the keyholder >> um >> in the past. >> Yes. Yes. I mean, that is where I I get most of my information, but they they do not have a list of all the businesses. >> Um, >> well, they probably 80% or 90% but the key holder stuff, >> I would imagine. But no homebased businesses. >> Yeah, the home base wouldn't be in there, but I think most of the others would because we have to update that every year. All the businesses have to update every year like who your person is. >> Should we obtain a copy of that for each of us so we can have a hands-on I mean, >> we should this this should have been promoted to all the businesses >> in in Dayton. >> Yeah. The the list of what the police department and the fire department is collecting is a different purpose than what the EDA would have. Like what we want to do is >> or I shouldn't say what the police and fire is if if there's a fire alarm that's going off on 2 am, who are they going to call? It's not necessarily the person that's going to attend this. um you know who's going to to respond the quickest and notify their insurance company and so on. >> The this purpose would be is just to stay in >> in touch with the date businesses to create a >> create a um >> database >> relationship and a database between the EDA and and all of the business for sure. I think what you do have on I agree with you. It's not the same contact person. It's just the business name, you know, like, okay, these are the businesses that we have at least for emergency. >> We've had this before. We've had that list. >> Yeah. Tina Tina provided one >> way long ago and we haven't had one since. >> No, I mean there's obviously new businesses, but >> Right. new guys. Um, similar slide to what was shown last year. This was from a Dayton business of what their experience was in participating with Elevate Henipin. Um, so this was uh Karen Fafang and I apologize I'm probably mispronouncing that but uh from being agile agile consulting overall it was a good experience for them and they recommended Elevate Henipin to others. >> Is our legal team going to be at the Elevate? I forgot to ask. cost money, >> not if they're volunteering their services in Henipin. >> Oh, uh, from Henipin County. I I'm sorry. I thought you were talking about the EDA attorney. >> Yeah. >> Uh, no, that that'd be funding from the EDA that would pay for that versus Henipin. So, this is an attorney. That's And I should add, so what by participating in Elevate Henipin, you qualify for, I believe it's up to 25 hours of consulting time. Um, so if that's legal consulting time, you know, that that's from an attorney that's provided by an approved vendor by Henipin County. Um, the benefit to that attorney for volunteering time is that it's going to lead to billable hours later on by the same company. So, it's nothing related to the EDA attorney. >> Gotcha. And the next meeting will be January 20th. Yeah, a little after. All right. Anybody got anything before we pull a pin? >> Um maybe just a couple notes on the to the city. The stoplight at the um exit on 94 >> is broken. Truck ran over it. >> Oh. >> Um going kind of northbound on 94 onto Dayton Parkway. >> Okay. >> Um so that's been broken and maybe they already know about it, but nothing's been done. Um, also the lights on that bridge, the walkway lights, um, are are hanging down. They need to be addressed. >> Okay. >> So, they're they're like these, uh, you know, >> glowing lights along the path. >> Oh, those lights >> and they're cracked and broken. >> Um, it looks really not good. >> Okay. >> So, >> thank you. >> January 20th is our next meeting. 7:30 a.m. Looking for a motion to adjurnn. >> I'll make a motion. We have a motion. Second. >> I second the motion. >> All in favor? I >> motion carries.