for e e I will start the regular meeting for uh Tuesday November 12th stand for the pledge to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation God indivisible with liy and justice for all sounds like we get a little bit of an echo um need a motion in a sec well motion a second for the agenda a motion I'll second okay discussion all those in favor say I I all those opposed say no motion carries four to zero uh consent I need a motion in a second I'll make a motion I'll second discussion go ahead if you I don't have anything to are you serious yes I know cool that must mean everything's in order anybody else if there isn't I didn't find it all right good to go um okay we got a motion second all those in favor say I I motion all those oppos say no motion carries 4 to zero for consent open Forum we have anybody here for open come on forward Limited to 3 minutes for non-agenda items state your name and address no council action will be taken and items will be referred back to staff Grover 1132 L over by Dean Mana so I'm here to remind you guys again that uh Tom Dean's DCM development does not need another gas station convenience star and uh uh they don't need to build it right next to all the houses that have wells there and remember there are already four soon to be five gas stations within a 5 mile radius of this location four of them sell groceries there's one by the elementary school one by Target one by the trailer park one on 113th that's kish's they're just a gas station they do not sell groceries there and they soon to be one over on 94 a person's car doesn't even get get warmed up before you get there when you why would you think that the south end of town needs six gas stations and the north north end of town doesn't even have one this if the city needs a gas station convenience store anywhere it's on the north end of town by the old village all they have in the Old Village is a bar and a liquor store they can't get their groceries there I suppose they could get take out food but that's where one needs to be planned and according to the poll you paid for a significant number of residents don't even go up to the north end of town they don't even go to the Heritage days so there there's just nothing there if they need some help up there and um Mr Dean talked about putting a daycare center in there but kitty corner across the street there's already a dayc care center it's at the church and they're always advertising that they have positions open for for uh student enrollment also I've talked to the pollution control agency and the State Board of Health they've advise me that there are very stringent rules regarding building and operating a gas station next to a private well if you think five gas stations is just not enough for the city and that we just have to have one more down there in the south end of town then you need to make sure that those rules are followed stringently and by the way ever since that housing development went in south of Dean's Manor and now they're working north of Dean's Manor our neighborhood has had terrible water problems all summer long during the drought we've had water problems in our neighborhood so I think you need to look into that before you let them start building house houses and gas stations and daycare centers and whatever else thanks thank you thank you Keith Grover 11320 Fernbrook Lane um I'm not going to uh go through the same things my wife did but I want to Echo everything she just told you I feel the exact same way um the one other issue I want to bring up is the runoff water that comes from the addition that we've already um uh primar almost all built out the one that's be Southwest of The Manor South of 113th um the water from the runoff water storm water from that area I believe is all supposed to go into the two holding ponds that they have behind Dean's Country Manor and then it goes across underneath 121 or Fernbrook Lane runs along Fernbrook up to 112 then goes east along 112th for a couple hundred feet and then it goes under 112 North and then it runs along 112th again going east and then it goes across private property which would be Hillary mcallen's property that water run off there um lot of that field has always been there there's always been some if you had heavy rains out there that didn't soak into the the beans or the corns or whatever was out there some water did come across there in heavy rains but when the rains weren't coming there was no water that came across there it stopped this year during the drought years or drought months that water never stopped running through that ditch and there's something different there and there's way more water coming off from that property now than what there did what there was when it was agricultural either we didn't do the holding ponds right or my total understanding of that whole system is wrong but it's way different than what it used to be we were able to get the county to come out and clean the ditch along 121 over to 112 we thought that's what they were all going to do but when were talking to them there that they decided that they were going to clean along 112 to all the way over to our Culvert in Dayton so they cleaned with using County money I'm not sure if if their bosses know they did that or not but they cleaned all the way up to our cult that goes under 112 and goes north so they save Dayton a whole bunch of money by cleaning that ditch out I think Dayton needs to clean the ditch out that runs on the other side because that's the bottleneck of the water if you go down there now it's still running though it's rained a little bit lately but it's never quit it runs down and then it's got a bottleneck where it goes under our Culver it's under 112 it needs the ditch along 112th on the North side which is Dayton's right away that ditch needs to be cleaned out at least over to the point where it runs north across private property and then I don't know I guess it'd be the private land owners nickel to clean it out on his property but the least we could do is clean out Dayton's ditch beings the county did two3 but we should be able to do the other third that's all I have thanks guys thank you thank you anybody else I'll give it to you when I'm done oh sure okay cuz I have to have it to read no problem Kathy powers 11461 for Brooklyn and um I I'm not going to say the same things that the Grovers did because I've said it before and it's on record and so I think we've made our point there um the other thing uh the first thing I want to talk about is when I was at the Planning Commission the last Planning Commission I think um we all kind of agreed that we need to have an overall good Transportation plan meaning good roads to get in and out of you know where the um get it in and out of Dayton or to get in and out of the new developments and that type typ of thing and I based on what I heard I don't think we have a overall good plan for that so and I think the Planning Commission realized that and they were going to uh maybe perhaps do something and Dennis you can say something about that if you want um the other thing I just want to know with the DCM project when is the final plan going to come to surface um cuz I I keep looking and I don't see anything and I thought we were already did two concept plans and I thought that that would be the next step would be the final plan or maybe I next step is preliminary but we we don't know I don't we don't have anything yet probably February February that's probably that's the best gas R because I've been told that there's going to be Machinery there in March um I'll digging in the fields in March so that's why I was wondering when is this last final plan going to come to fruition because I think we still haven't seen the final and the other thing I have with the the DCM project there you know it's always been under Agricultural and I've tried to look this up under on the internet but I was not successful when that changed I don't know when that zoning changed and did do we as residents get a vote in this when they go from agricultural to residential and then commercial do we get a vote in this or is this just behind the scenes and it's the it comes to the council it'll be done as part of the preliminary plat to rezone it it'll get a rezoning request so it's not rezoned yet no no okay so okay so that's just is residential because I thought it was all agricultural it probably is it is today okay and so and you know there's a part there that they want to have commercial and I'm totally against that and I understand and I've talked to some of the residents in Dayton specific spefically in the Sundance area and they would they don't want this gas station okay but what they want is a convenience store but they want the convenience store closer to them maybe closer to Sundance so I think people ought to be thinking about not necessarily having that commercial part that everybody talks about there maybe it should be someplace else [Music] and I think that's all I have today thank you thank you anybody else ahead up hi Lee Holquist 11471 firm Brook Lane and my property is Right adjacent to the DCM project um I guess first complaint is or comment is drainage I don't see anything being done for drainage so far except one of the planning committee commission member said he we can put in a holding Pond and hope that's where the water goes and hope isn't exactly how I want to be running my uh Sump System so so I I hope you guys have a plan serious plan for drainage rather than just CU all all of my property is downhill from every bit of that property it lower an elevation so uh I hope you address the traffic and infrastructure CU took me a couple minutes to get out of my driveway it's kind of weird took me a couple minutes to get out of my driveway this morning and and it has a couple times this week just to go walking down at Elm Creek and there's no way to walk to Elm Creek without taking life in your hands uh concerned about the noise especially concerned about the noise because it looks like they can work 10 they'll be working 75 ft or less from my back door and from my front door in fact for that matter um they can start at like like what 7 7: a.m. to 8:00 at night is that what it is 7 to 7 okay so they can work 12 hours a day and only 10 hours on weekends is that it nine to eight to four eight to four on oh so only eight hours on weekends that's correct right and you know I kind of like to use my backyard during those hours so I think it'd be nice if I could do that too but um you know I understand they have things to do but there's there seems to be no schedule for this it's just whenever they feel like running equipment there for whatever need is they'll just be running equipment and I the one that has to deal with it which brings me to the other side is the cost of this thing what is this project going to cost the residents that are already here um you know you guys are just going to say we're going to assess you and you're going to pay the developer to run a sewer line up to your house we're going to run an assessment in we're going to buy what is it a water shut off valve and that's all of this is before we even hooked water across my property line so I I just doesn't seem fair I think the city should be paying that you guys are forcing me to spend that much money it's not even touching my property so I think the city could make some concessions on how you're spending my money um I think that's all I really want to say right now but I I really wish the council and the Planning Commission would consider the residents already live here instead of just you know um I mean the reality is the developer doesn't live here so anyway that's all I got thank you Jason they're not going to be required to hook up I don't think hope I'm required to pay for it I still get an assessment for it correct I don't think so I don't know the city doesn't have any plans to assess for it but I don't know what the negotiations with the developer are oh the developer said he's not paying for it um so so anyway it looks like I have to pay at least for uh up to the shut off bill for water we have to pay the the developer to run the sewer line correct that's how I understand it now I don't think you'll get hooked for any of it I don't think so he hooked up if you yeah I want I want to make sure it's clear so the developer yeah so the developer is not planning on running anything currently with with the development if the individuals on Fernbrook want that service that's when they would be assessed so way we're going to have to pay for it because you're not going to be able to sell your house without hook no you can sell a house without cook sell it yep no I want to make a clarification on that because I come on up come on up for the um I just want to make a little clarification on that because we've met a couple times about this and I think Dean is going to put in the water piece of it I mean you know that trench that goes in but he's not going to pay for the sewer line and that's where the six residents were going to have to cough up the money to pay for that sewer line and that was either all in or all out so it's he's not going to pull either one of them unless all six residents want that water or sewer but the what we're going to have to pay for is the sewer not the water um yep think yeah the developer again conversation we've had with the developer so far doesn't mean that they won't change but currently the developer says is planning on not extending Services currently to those six homes correct unless the six homes want it then he will use his cost to then put it in but then the residents would have to split that cost six ways to put that water that's if they want it they not they not required you're not paying right oh that's correct yeah correct except I mean we all have to split the cost of it it can't be five of us splitting the cost and the six get it for free correct corre so it's either all six or not at all yeah you could pull it individually but then you're going to do it at later on down the road not currently so the only reason that we're the Developers looking at doing this is cuz economies of scale it's easier to do it for six people and then spread out the cost versus doing it for each individual person because say an individual in the middle wants it and first person doesn't want it then the water line can't go through their house or through their lawn unless they have you know rights to the other property if that makes sense you know I'm not an engineer or anything but it seems to me that um you would have to put that water and sewer to get from point A to point B to point C and so on so even putting it in the back of us you're going to have to do that anyway so I mean I just don't understand how Dean can specifically say we six residents have to pay for that because I think he's going to have to do that anyway if he's going to want to develop well the pipe will be close to your close to your property and if you want to hook up to it from there then it's on you if you don't want hook up I know yeah so yeah part of the development there's a row of houses behind the homes that are on firm Brook currently and so on the other side of that is a road those utilities will run through that road that side on that side of the homes so there will be no utilities accessible for the individual six individual homes on Fernbrook because it'll be on the opposite side of those other homes they would a so they need a separate line to get to there because there's no reason for that line to be put in but if they don't want it then it's not going to be there that is correct correct that's what I'm trying to get yep that is correct but what I'm trying to get at is is if an engineer looked at the big picture M he should look at all lnes and he should make it um for all of us in the city that are there today and I believe Dean should pay for it that's my opinion thank you all right thank you any but okay I forgot to mention one thing about this gas station convenience store thing it's being built right next to a big holding Pond which right now I do not have a lot of faith in those holding ponds because we are inundated with water from holding ponds um every time it rains every time it snows anytime there's any precipitation everything from that parking lot from that is going to end up getting washed into this holding Pond the pollutants the garbage everything so my question is what happens to these pollutants after they get washed into the holding fond first first off which Mara what you got to understand is the so-called gas station you keep talking about it's not there it's just an idea I know it's going to but that's that's why I'm I'm bringing up all these things now because it's not a good idea okay okay thank you uh anybody online um so if you wanted to speak in if you can use okay staff consultant Council updates SEC good evening mayor members of council I don't have any updates for you tonight so thank you very much Amy um I got nothing tonight Marty I have a couple um on the well for Rehab um the mobilization has been delayed by trout um for a week and they were meant to be in on the 11th they're now going to be there on the 19th they had an equipment failure on one of their other jobs to a piece of equipment they need um the parts are going to be with them tomorrow and it's going to take them a couple of days to get it installed so it's going to delay it a week currently we're pumping 250,000 gallons a day which is you know way down from the million plus that we were pumping a day with the irrigation so um are we even running well too yeah we're just running well too oh oh okay yeah that's only well that we have oh that's true yeah yeah so have the other one on it's not it's not the most comfortable situation but yeah we you know hopefully we can get this done fairly quickly and when trout gets in there they they the the rehab is going to take how long they are scheduled for two months to be in there um I think that's a little on the excessive side but it's better to be planning for that then you know then plan less and let's say well to fails Champlain at this point can they support us I think well Champlain will support us I think without the irrigation that's going to make a huge difference because with the irrigation they were only able to support us so with 35 homes I believe um in the past in the past we have run um their system U to supply ours successfully but um I'm not 100% sure how much that is with the development that's occurred in that in the interim time there so hopefully um I will I can talk with Champlain to see what their production rate is but I would imagine they can spare yeah yeah do we expect the pump back around that in that same time frame yeah the pump is ready to go back in okay so if that's another plan B there if we need to put it back in we can get it back in pretty quick so that's already sitting on the Shelf ready to come out I would rather not do that but if we get to that situation is an option right okay um the old Public Works shop cleanup um that's going to be starting on the 19th with the hazardous material packed and removed um the res residual Fuel and oils removed from the diesel fuel tank and the waste oil tank uh the following week tentatively is scheduled for the fuel tank removal and the waste oil tank removal so hopefully by the end of uh November that should all be cleaned up um I want to talk a little bit about um uh couple of items of equipment that we've got in the CIP for purchase for next year I'd like to try and order them this year um to get an invoice um in January we won't be actually purchasing it we' just be placing the order the reason being that there's a a strong likelihood that there's going to be a 5% increase on those equipment costs at the seller of the new year um so the Cat loader was one of the piece of equipment and the Toro grounds M Mo was the other piece of equipment um so I'd like to get those ordered up and ahead of time I think we're talking about the long-term plan we we are talking see what survives so I do have a bullet point on that on my on notes but we there we have reduced the cost on that Lotus significantly down to you know a saving of $66,000 on that and then the tour Rose down by $20,000 as well so um we did did uh save a bunch of money on those but if you want yeah talk to talk about that later that's fine um and that's all I have Chief no report for me Chief and John no Jason got good good I got my piece later I'm good I'm good sweet all right all right item J uh so we have resolution 6224 uh the numbers stay the same um so there is no changes to report and that's just accepting the need a motion in a second I'll make a motion a second any discussion all those in favor say I I I I all those opposed say no motion carries 4 to zero item K good evening mayor members of council third quarter report for you if you have any questions please stop me as we go through best to address them beforehand um so want to talk about general fund cash balances we look at this graph every single time every single quarterly report nothing abnormal or unnormal for the last two years I know that it does show negative at second quarter I did mention that at the last quarter um report but I want to make sure that's noted because of the fact that we have an increased amount of expenditures and didn't start off with a full 40% fund balance at the end of the year we ended up having to go negative in that fund temporarily we got our first half tax settlement in July and as you can see this this steepness of that um graph is not the same as it was in the first half and that's because we got the actual funding for the operations um so it's anticipated that it goes down about that rate and then again in December we'll have the final um second half taxes that come in so um overall exactly as we had expected um the other two years that you would have saw which is 21 and 22 on this graph had some abnormal activity that you typically wouldn't see and the reason for that is based on building permit activity in those years so those numbers were kind of artificially inflated not because of the fact that we didn't get the money in but because of the building permits were keeping up the typical operations whereas these last two years we've had almost exactly 200 building permits which is what we're budgeting for every year so any questions on the general cash fund balance I know you've seen it over time so it's not like it's a huge change but hearing none income statement nothing really crazy to show here um we'll talk about the taxes again that's 1.3 million under and the reason for that is we don't get those second half taxes until December I don't anticipate any major changes from those taxes come in so um the only major changes that we do see are maybe delinquents so somebody doesn't pay their utility or their tax bill um but typically those aren't as common as they were back in covid times a couple years ago um multiple Lems over budget mostly based on development and fees paid um finds and fitures are way down um and that's based on court fees uh number four we received a roadway access so Maple Grove um and Dayton have a jpa for the um neighborhood attached to Sundance Woods on the south side of town that's on the north side of mle Grove in order to provide Public Works essentially Services there and they pay us um yearly for that but they do pay us a one-time fee when they hook up new houses and that fee goes to pay for any new equipment or anything else that's needed in the in the area for just general fund operations of Public Works um so that is the payment we got from mle Grove this year that is the extension of that development on the North side in that py new new new py development that you see um so that extended actually into Sundance greens so that's what the payment's for number five we paid a bill for the entire year obviously that's um we're going to be 861 over budget I don't even I think it's based on the number of calls or something that they get so they charges like a dollar per call or something I don't know it's nevertheless it's close six and seven that's based on just activity we've seen we've seen a lot of engineering preliminary projects this year so a lot of people calling in hey what do we do with this what do we do with that have to have engineering look at it based on water sewer capacity so that's like development looks come in or they want to come in I'll use the cubes as an example we have to say Okay how much water can they Supply how much sewer they can they Supply and that takes time from engineering and that can't be put back to a project because the project never comes to fruition so um those costs just get absorbed in the general fund um there's also other projects we have we have a ton of other projects related to Road products that we did this year parking lot all of those costs go into that engineering as well um just for the general time number seven we've had a lot more code enforcement complaints this year most certainly and so that's spent a lot more legal time legal consultation time so good or bad that it is what it is and then number eight the fire suppression as you can see that's significantly under budget which is a good job by the chief but also the fact that we budgeted for higher wages based on the fact that we thought we could use those State dollars to pay for wages we weren't able to do that for the state they wouldn't release us the fire state aid so the actual number that we have for for expenditures is $100,000 higher than what you see there the reason for that is because that's what we got in for fire state aid so that has to be cut to the Fire Relief based on their pension so um it's still under budget but it should be a little closer than what it shows right now overall the you know if you look at just in general fund variances or actual through $994,000 quote unquote under you know we have um expenses are higher than revenues is actually a really good spot to be for this time of the year being that we will see roughly A2 to2 half million check from the taxes in December so with three more months left it's actually a really good spot to be at any questions on the general fund overall this is the main operations fund so lots of ins and outs what was the increase for number seven um that's based on Code Enforcement complaints but I meant how much was it oh it's $26,000 over budget okay so it's over budget for the year um I will say that there was much more code enforcement complaints over the summer months when people out and about what was the bulk of that what is the bulk of that yeah the quote enforcement issues and don't tell me long grass no um can be anything but a lot of them are what long grass par park trailers yeah park trailers on grass not right accesses um okay so SC most of it's public nuisance like um visual public nuisances people don't like the way property looks or whatever else those are public those are technically Code Enforcement issue I don't know um most of the time Hayden de most of them so you mean we'll get a complaint go investigate and find and sometimes they come up to we have to go through legal or something we'll ask a question like hey should we enforce this should we not know as in not and should enforce it but is there any legal things we need to worry about here and the concerns that we have with this um and we've also used legal for a lot more so they wrote um our new DA so we have a new DA template this year that we've never had before so actually had a review of legal on a lot of the agreements we put together this year which we didn't typically have in the past okay um staff was putting those together which probably wasn't the best option but we've used a lot more legal consultation this year and that's okay hopefully we'll save the city long term with a lot of things do we see that continuing just not the heavy stuff no how we budgeted for 25 we budgeted for a higher number in 25 just based on what we see for development agreements that will come in um as expected just because of you know the economy or or land owners or whatever we anticipate them to be more development agreements but nothing of this nature that would be onetime huge cost also we're will continue to be um well under budget it's not big dollars I guess but in fines and forfeitures yep which I think is traffic enforcement correct well not all but are we do we have the patrol officer online now that is dedicated to that not yet so that's based on an absence in the police department from a military leave yeah we have one on military leave and then um we have two we had two on fto and one didn't make it so we're just we're still one short y so this will probably not correct Itself by the end of the year it will not having having new officers is good you get the longevity and they get new new blood here but they also don't they're fto program for six months so they basically Shadow with somebody yep for six months that just ties up two officers essentially every single time you you have them out again good training but it's just one of the downsides of it any other questions you said overall we're we're trending really well um interest has been really good for us which is good and planning on investing that longer term as well and um State AIDS have come in higher than we anticipated as well which is which is great police a Aid fire state aid U Municipal state aid for roadway maintenance and public works all those all come in over budget which is a dollars we can utilize for operations so that's $185,000 over our budget through the year any other questions okay overall we're in good shape so that's good to go or good to know um cash balances by fund nothing major to report here know we had some purchases out of some um new funds which is the fire and police um Public Safety Aid um number four is related to the Tiff fund that that'll come back this year in um 2025 I should say um not a whole lot of differences to discuss I mean storm water fund is below but that's based on you know based on operations and we also cover that bond which everyone knows about um first 75 homes connection fees go to pay for the bond instead of the tax levy so that's why major change happen is storm water nothing really crazy or anything really dramatic but I'll here to stand for questions if we have any any I'm glad you fixed your column heading thanks to the right here thanks formula messed up on when I put it in Exel so I don't know how you catch one every time I promise it'll happen which just fine um water sales uh water sales water expenditures um water fund overall everything seems very healthy in this fund um have a little higher on Professional Services we've had to use a little more engineering this year on on water fund stuff and also water projects and then repair and maintenance is much higher that's based on some of the pump stuff we've had to do but any major changes or anything else that we have any questions on overall on the water fund overall the water fund is trending in the right direction we're covering dep covering some of depreciation with sales you will see two more billing Cycles the next time you see this graph or the next time you see this fund so um think about it right now typically do six a year we've gotten four through this billing cycle and we'll have two more after this billing cycle in order to finish out the year which one just happened recently as in today but it didn't happen in Q3 and then one will happen in January 1 or January 5th or whatever somewhere in that time any questions overall with the water fund um we did get in that the big change you'll see is the dollars in the miscellaneous fund um that is related to the state Grant we got 1.75 million that we got in from the state aid related to the W hit treatment plan oh okay that's what the big change is there speaking of which mhm I was is there any changes on that U we are just in the waiting period whatever yep um American conservation American culture of historical preservation or something like that I don't remember exact terms ACP is what they call it um waiting for that and finalizing those things we have um an email from HUD as of today which said submit all your stuff so we can start reviewing it so hopefully they can review at the same time yeah HP is trying to double up as much as we can and get that project back up and rolling but essentially we have all the robber stamps just try to get them all finalized and put them on the paper so we're still within that 15-day period that um it's 30 days I was misspoken 15 days for that though say they accepted it now 30 days to review it I'll fight on days 45 days nonetheless that's ridiculous time our contract place is ready to step in or they still working on there okay yeah we've had conversations with them we haven't provided a deadline or a date cuz we don't know when that will be but they are ready to go whenever we're ready to go and I'm hoping that it's sooner rather than later yep sewer um overall again fairly healthy nothing major to change here um miscellaneous we got some I don't remember what those miscellaneous dollars were that came in um I don't even remember what they are they're probably related to development or something like that but nothing major said $71,000 isn't huge in a you know $1.4 million budget but it is something overall like said the main thing is that we're covering depreciation with sales and then also if we have any additional dollars that come in for connection fees we're covering those as well um the depreciation went up significantly again this is all related to those new assets that we got from Vel opers that we didn't add before so I'm not overall too concerned about the sewer fund and the reason being is we don't have any treatment so the the main costs that come from sewer funds is treatment costs we don't have that we have to pay my Council don't get me wrong but um there's no any typical major surprises that happen it could be a pump or a lift station go down or something but nothing right dramatic does going to say everything that's tied to like a lift station comes from here as well Y correct that's correct but they're typically not huge you know might feet I don't even know what a pump is 50 Grand or something which in the grand scheme of things is pretty minimal yeah yeah any major comments on sewer fund overall pretty unexciting which is probably the best kind of report to get fairly unexciting so we have Q3 again everything looks good to go Q4 um department heads and myself are always talking about where we're at to budget wise and trying to keep all as much as we can at budget or below just based on what we saw last year so we don't want to repeat last year and everything is looking everything looks really well okay everything's trending in the right direction overall um I can't really control the revenues and where those come from but I can we can control the expenditures as much as we possibly can some of them are going to be baked in no matter what salaries and yeah insurance and everything else but those oneoff things we try to limit this year so far we've done pretty good all right any questions okay I don't need any action or anything I just need basically the presentation is your acceptance thank you very much IEM M long-term plan long-term plan discussion I don't have a whole lot I don't have actually anything on the PowerPoint because I provided you guys the new updated long-term plan based on conversations that happened at the last council meeting um no major changes in any of the funds the only ones that had a major change was those um city hall and fire station getting pushed from 2028 to 2031 again we it's in the longterm plan so we got pushed out a few more years talk about it later on but if you guys want to talk about anything else I'm here for questions and comments again I want to make sure that this long-term plan is good to go and wrapped up um we'll have our final budget discussion at the next council meeting um and the reason for that is to again separate those two things because they are related but they're not um the same exact thing and by splitting those up it's easier for me to handle questions and answers and whatever else as best that can but we staff and I are ready for questions if you have any but again started whatever fund you want to 401 and back CH bit goad I might as well fire out there I've got all kinds of questions here I would just cave out one more thing you just talk just make sure you mention a fund or whatever fund you're talking about so oh I've got the expense I guess I didn't write down that's fine I only wrote One Fund down so can't wait um Marty in uh in your uh comment about the equipment that you want to purchase correct me if I'm wrong Zach uh when the 16% was approved I thought we were talking about 460k for those items that you were looking at and those items are the mower loader truck and stump grinder and I thought we were talking about 460k there but if you look at the plan it's 562 so I don't know if we change those numbers or if we haven't done anything about it but those one two three those four items are 562 Grand on on the sheet mhm so what have we done different as far as you're saying that you're saving 35,000 on the loader it's still 330,000 bucks yeah is it cheaper than that is it sorry is it cheaper than the 330,000 you got listed no that 330,000 is the price that we came well 333 um with the price that we came up with the full spec we changed some of the things out of there to take it down from the 400 I believe it was 450 originally on there with the snow blower we took the snow blower out of there and we Respec some of the equipment down to $333,000 um that is the bottom line price we could go to a loader smaller than that because it wouldn't have the snow plowing capacity that we need um uh for the streets that we're doing with that so that is the lowest price that I can get a piece of equipment that is going to function for our purpose and we're looking at a brand new one we're not looking at we looked at some of the used ones um and because we get such a discount for buying new you're already you know 25% below the the retail price so you're buying something that's four years old for the same price that we can get today and quite often they're not spec the right way for snow plowing because a lot of these go to U dirt movers uh and contractors are only using them for that purpose so we would have to Respec them and buy a plow and stuff like that for it as well and the snow tires and all that kind of stuff to get it to the spec that we need so we did look do a lot of looking around on those those vehicles um but it really is a difficult thing to find one of those out there that is low mileage that will do the the thing that we need it to do I guess my point is I think we were at 460 is what we were is what we budgeted in that 16% but we're spending 562 so the numbers don't J yeah I think I think what happened is we changed some dollars around between which departments we were spending them I don't remember what the other departments were at all I remember is that we brought the total cost down we said okay if we had up this one this one and this one and all of them together here's what we get which I think was like 950 or something and we came as close as we could I'm pretty sure that was I don't you'll have to go back cuz I don't remember the conversation but and I could be totally wrong here but I'm pretty sure it was out up all the numbers get a number and then in that six in that and then I remember in the 16% we added 180,000 ,000 of additional dollars just in case to be able to pull back if needed that was what the with the 16% included I don't have a problem with the mower I mean I can see that the loader is the only one and only mainly because I I had given you two used ones that had like 140 hours on them and they were 230 100,000 cheaper than the 33 but they may not have the right tires or whatever I mean I don't know none of that I'm just yeah that's the problem with buying the used stuff you got to take what's on it yeah and then you got to you repurpose it to your needs mhm um if we go to uh the Steven and I'm only mainly mainly I'm focusing on 25 and 26 yep that's kind what I'm at everything else is it's immaterial it's it can except one item that I chuckled about today that I found on you well it has it's been on here the whole time so I make sure know nothing changed I think it's funnier than ever but whatever uh in Stevens Park 2025 we're looking at 750 and what are we getting for that so since um we are retooling from 2024 to be doing the production in 20125 um I think that that money will move over to the master plan and once we got that figured out what the new step is going to be so what we're going to expend in 2025 I believe Zack is what we were supposed to spend in 24 in so we haven't really identified what those numbers are in for 2026 I I believe or 2025 I believe that is just a a placeholder at this time okay 750,000 is the placeholder but so far what's been discussed and can be amended but has been discussed is I think it's the park pavilion additional parking as a possibility additional Trail work some benches I believe there was an amp theater expansion yep and I feel like there's one more thing I'm missing but I can't think of it and then in 2026 we're throwing another million bucks at that thing that was the plan where I'm going here is I'd like to get that that that whole process sped up before I die I'd like to see more at Stevens Park and uh if we go to 2027 clo Park's got 250 Grand on there for for a brand new structure oh that's a different fund yep different fund yep yep but but I don't to me I'd rather put the money in Stevens and and not clo I mean the the building that we have there clo is it'll certainly suffice for the next 10 years yeah staff talked about that we said we could push to at least 2029 so we moved it out to9 different I don't mind spending the money I want to speed up Stevens Park so that the residents got something they can use sure is my point uh 2024 and 2025 we have two shelters for Rivers Ben Park and mcne Park I don't think either one of them had been built yet no um so where is that money going to go then this that money came from that money comes from cdaa okay so those dollars have to be put towards the cdaa um field for their whatever it might be so I know we did dugouts this year um batting cages or something that we talked about it so shows 24 probably actually won't be used we probably should just push it out to 25 cuz those aren't going to get done this year I think the bank the dugouts are going to be complet the be um the bank cages are going to be put installed next year I believe um we're waiting for some Grant separate from the that's why we're talking about shelters River Rivers Benz Park used by CDA and so is mcneel Park so that's why shade and shelter are there that it's just a separate fund but those always come from CDA raed based on rentals of the facilities yeah and so those are used specifically for putting back into Dollars used by CDA or items used by CDA that's why they're in there and and we've got 3.6 million in uh the Water Trail but we're not doing that unless we get grant money correct uh because I don't I don't want an idea where we're we're going to go ahead and spend $2 million and we're going to wait for somebody to reimburse that money I mean I will not support that we have got grant funding for the initial part of this um stuff for DNR and the LC Stevens part I think the bigger part there was uh the good in Park area I think that was where the the bigger number was four um that would be working with threee riverse Park District in there as well so the the phase one of the water Trails construction is the first half which will be the end end spot will be at LC Stevens that's the grant paid for by $750,000 of um federal dollars $100,000 of grant money from National Park Service so that's um $ 850,000 and then the remaining um $650,000 is going to come from the DNR related to the front half of that water Trails which is on in the stor Village related to the um the landing there Landing there to put that in that's where the 1.6 million comes from we don't have all that money yet we do we do okay well we don't have it like technically as of today we don't have it in the bank but we're we're supposed to get we have all of them earmarked and granted and good to go with yep yeah so the second half though the 2 million is what we're trying to push for for th's Park District to do correct yes yeah that's why it's on the plan cuz if we don't have it in the plan at all through Park District will not support it correct they will not acknowledge it uh the the 410 fund uh police depart police department and Public Work signs and then this is all signs in the city and I I think this is absolutely asinine that we're we're talking about $810,000 in signs over the next 5 years well I'm not sure what we're smoking here that's based on that's based on The Branding exercise you guys did it was a branding exercise tied in with the the signage um um uh project that we completed that identifies all the signage throughout the city and what goes where and there's a full map and inventory of you know all the signs that we have designed and the uses um and the idea and the direction that we've had in the past is they want to phase this in um and so that's why it's in there the way it is I mean it was to give the the city a total branded look so everybody knows they're in Dayton um that type of thing so is to have a cohesive look throughout the city we we had talked a little bit though about finding another option to I think the the lowest price was was it 30k per sign or yes well yeah for the bigger sign for the yeah well I thought that was the bottom we had a range of but the the whole signage um package is from just uh TR signs you with an arrow and some you information on there to the you to the big illuminated sign that we have at the Parkway um so and there are various different signages that you know they're all a different level of cost and sophistication so you can go from a straight wood sign to a uh a sign with the limestone cladd in and uh yeah ornamental gardening around them landscaping around them so there's a whole whole range of things so I mean I think that what we were looking at doing is getting some prices for those various different bigger signs um so we can have an opportunity to understand what we're we're getting for our money yeah I I think part of the problem I had last time and maybe this Scott's alluding to this but the sign in front of the activity center just kind of boggled in my mind the cost and so we said no because we didn't have a cheaper option M mhm and that's I think that's kind of the direction that at least I'd like to see us go as that um what we need Super options for some of these locations and we can get you know um I need to reach out to a couple of sign well at least one sign company to get them to just spec some prices up course so we got some kind of an idea what the costs are going to be okay so this is I don't know if we all these numbers are just a shot in the dark these are shot well yeah these are shot the dark of okay we'll get as many signs done as this ABS asinine to spend 34 of signs are not cheap for sure and I think it's very important that we have some sort of consistent branding as a city because then you know where you're at and you know what you're following because if you go down a path to swirl on all of them and then that'll be your consistency sure but you had to swirl on it that adds th000 bucks or whatever it is and um I don't know if we want to have different to me the look of the sign is what knows that you have this as a city item of the amount of calls we get complaining about the the dead tree over there but that's because we don't have an option right now correct just B that was Bas every time I see it I think we could spend a very small amount of money and perfect that sign but it's still a wood sign um but the next option up is 30k give us something sh that is yeah we we'll see what we can do with we're trying to follow that branding exercise that was done and whether that maybe we just need to redo the whole branding exercise just going to be a lot that's a lot of dollars to put back into toothpaste stuff into what we've already well and then and then we've already started the process with the big sign at the Parkway as well so we kind of invested in this project already right but at least with that one you know you replace the the the the sign phase yep um and and if we went to look that direction I'm I can't tell you how many complaints I get about the toothpaste and I'm not kidding people think it is butt ugly you didn't know it was toothpaste until I said it looked like toothpaste no I pretty much looked at it first day like I think I think we need to do is as as a staff and a coun no I think it's a good question but I want to make sure that we're on the same page because I agree obviously we're not on the same page if you're talking about how much the science cost and we're like well that's what you approve so and not by you guys but as in the council before you approved it and now we have to okay either keep moving forward and that means we're vested yeah you know I don't want to get and I'm you use this as far out example of I don't want to get to a size of Maple Grove or whatever champ we go Noe we're going to redo the whole signs and now we have a different sign once you kind of stick with the logo as you're growing it's like that's your identity or you're changing everything which is fine too it's just it's money it's work again every time you do it it's work again got i' rather I'd rather get it right now and fix one big sign and all the rest of them follow versus yeah I I think and this is not the first time this has come up the problem is it seems like we've got bigger fish to fry but I really yeah I really would like to see us look at that why don't you think we we brought back a sign this year and that's the reason why is because no I get it I believe we spent 56 on the one on The Interchange something like that and right now we're looking at a $40,000 sign for public works that's 20,000 too much and that might well be the case I mean like I said there's all different kinds of signs in the in the handbook there that you know we can get prices on those and maybe one of those is more appropriate for that location all right I'm just done here uh and these are these are mythical things if they actually even happen the 2026 we're looking at a $3.5 million expense for 117th East French Lake Road for some road work I mean that's that's only if the develop only if it happens yep but it's still in there still in there yep uh same deal on 113th that's only if them people agreed for the assessment or the council moves forward with the project yep one of the two y uh in 2026 I've got about a 100 about 200k on some surveys uh do survey Diamond Lake vegetation deal Grass Lake storm water model yep that's just to keep Jason busy right you got it cuz he's not busy he's you got it I wish that was the case no those are all based on the Watershed requests and so Watershed SL grants we're going to pay for a majority of those we get it that's what that you got I can add on those briefly so those are all projects that are identified and past studies that you've done and past surface water management plans that have been done by the city and in conjunction with the Watershed we put them on here because the first box on the grant applications is is this identified on your long-term plan okay so we can check yes we have these projects on there to be honest if we don't acquire funding for them we just keep pushing them out right so we don't do them without funding um that being said a few of these just to knowe we do we have secured funding for so we are planning on moving forward a few of these as long as we get the funding that's fine I have no issue with it and the same same on the 2026 we're already planning on a $9 million water water tower and treatment facility for well one that's only if we get the money right that's all based on grants yep we might we might have to move forward so the only one we would have to move forward with that we probably should look at sooner and later is the water tower just based on the fact there is no additional storage down there so if one of the W goes out or something or if we have a fire in that area knock on wood we have no fire suppression besides the tanker that's there so we might have to look at that as uh you know a higher priority but doesn't mean we're going to go out and spend that was what 2.3 million and we still have to identify a project a spot for that thing so and I'm really going out on a limb here sure but this just I just about split a gut when I seen this thing an armored vehicle for 2034 are we kidding I'm surprised you haven't they didn't see that until now huh was that at the beginning of the year we put that on there just for a laugh right no it's cuz we will need an armored vehicle probably in 2034 it has to be on it should be on the 10-year plan Chief can mention to it but almost every Department that's larger than us has an armored vehicle so why better expert here uh Burnsville example um that's a pretty big city way way bigger than here um anything like that if you have access to one um it's for the safety of the office officers is what it is and by 2034 we're going to need one here or at 2034 for sure we'll see let's say it's mostly for hostage situations or those type of situations for protection for the officers well I kind of chuckled we got a a a water uh park for 2030 and then we got an armored vehicle for 2034 just whatever it's a long ways out there all your comments are all in different funds so it's like it's it's hard to I know it's hard to explain that oh this money means this and this money means that in the same year because they're totally different funding sources or uses of money now I know the council can move money and transfer money any which way possible which is true but the idea is to have each individual fund or business is what we like to call them that each individual one should stay in that same thing if you have three businesses that you own yourself personally you're not going to switch money between all three of them or different expenditures based on wherever which one has money because the IRS is going to look at you and go what the heck are you doing yeah um and we try to do our best as a city now we don't get the IRS on our but to do that but we really try to keep the funds in the right buckets and try to plan out a long-term plan that it's going to work so the ones like I want to talk about are Park dedication dollars like the LC Stevens one if we want to speed that up fantastic staff's all for it including myself I'm all for that we got to put more money in there than having Park dedication dollars put in there by homes because there's just not enough money to put in there for home new homes each new home puts 40 500 bucks in there need a lot of new homes for a million dollars worth the work so that's it's just all those buckets and funds are just so siloed as as as we probably should or try to as best um it just costs every single thing costs money and then you try to get move money from here to here and then you end up being short of that other fund and then or moving money back and oh I get it I mean I I get your I get your question I would like to see a whether or not Stevens is the right place for it I'm not saying that but in in 2026 I'd like to see the playground and a water park if that's the spot for it and those two items I think they'll cost 750 Grand I mean your 450 is way off base I think for for the water park well for a water splash pad yeah because uh I don't know St Michael built theirs for 206 but that was about three years ago four years ago and I know for a fact they built it for 206 I can talk to seagull who just redid theirs and I can see how much they SP spent I think they redid theirs last year or two years ago they already had one previously yep and then they redid it and if just to redoing it costs 250,000 bucks there's no way we're getting one for 250 brand new well then we better talk to same well mean you could also have no features in it too you just have a bunch of water sticking out about the ground two Fountain possibility too St Michaels is a pretty nice water park they also did it at the perfect time I would say I don't think they could better timing well maybe they're smarter than we are I would there's a lot of people smarter than it was anything else so anyway all right I'm done you guys go ahead and fire away I'm good you got stuff oh sure okay oh sure um I don't know because it's a ways out there there's some there's some things I think we ought to look at that are sort of uh contingent on our timing with the Fire Station 3 and U and so since we moved that I think we need to to look at a couple of those other um fire related things and see if our timing is right on those or if those need to shift along with the along with the fire station um okay let me see here um in fund 405 on page 95 of our packet U braver and trails uh phase true for the park is slated I think that's too soon uh we've got a million dollars in there for next year and then um for those further phases it just doesn't seem to me like that uh development is going to be far enough along for us to to finalize that immediately and it seems like most of these things we've been doing a planning year and then an implementation year yep uh and there's no gap between the the million and the 200,000 that we've got so my suggestion would be to bump that out at least a year Cil like to do that we can do them simult year after year it just would be could be different contract yeah I just don't know you know are we going to even own all the land yet um there's two sections of that that we we will own we currently own two sections which is Phase One um we will likely own a third and possibly a fourth so we would likely owned depending on H with DCM Farms that would be the southeast Corner we should have that one taken care of or move forward but the other one I'm not sure of when Sundance um Golf Course is going to get redeveloped I believe they've already started that Redevelopment process with the 11th edition of Sundance greens which made the culdesac um onto the golf course but I don't know if he's doing the rest of it either is is are these numbers consistent then with our 7525 um yes okay well that's just my suggestion it seems like that's coming too soon since there's couple of fuzzy pieces around that seem like it jumps to gun a little bit early that's yeah we can move it out like I said I think the reason I kept it in there is because it was originally intended to be in 24 and we're just trying to get that project done but we can mostly move to 27 after the coun just the right just the phase two piece of it hearing uh no comments so we'll move in okay all right another one that I have a question about is that uh every year we put $50,000 into this is in I'm sorry um fund 408 page 99 in our packet uh we put $50,000 in for easement acquisition for West Mississippi Regional Trail um Three Rivers has shown us that they're just going to buy everything that comes up for sale along the River Road so I don't know why we need any money for easements I mean I think the original thinking was we would if we wanted to get out ahead of them a bit on on some of this but they seem to be a bit ahead of us on it and so I don't know to me it doesn't seem like we need to put any more money into that we haven't spent any we've been collecting it for several years I don't know why we need to add to that when we're not really using it in there like I said they're they're the first buyer that seems to show up for anything that goes up for sale um so that's just a thought is that we could eliminate that the council like to do that yeah I agree yep what else would it be used for other than just a trail connection it's just literally the trail that we've been talking about on D River Road for the longest time right yes L yeah I agree with Dave they're just beating us to the punch every time they're going to do it no matter what so it it stops in 26 for whatever reason I don't know why ask question that's all we'll remove it yeah it just clutters it up and it's it's not like we we can move the money somewhere else I mean I just don't feel like 50,000 is going to cut it anyways I mean see what they're yeah sure okay um it curious more than anything on that same fund we've got a money for Trail on North Diamond Lake Road and I'm not sure where well not entirely clear to me what that one accomplishes is it just segment or are we connecting some things that make it make something more usable so that is the that that trail part is the missing link between connecting River Hills development Cypress Cove and ion Gardens to um Elm Creek Park yeah so I Gardens comes up to the I think that I don't even know what the road is that crosses right there at North Diamond Lake Road where you're headed to ion Gardens birkshire maybe that sounds birkshire birkshire um right there would be the connection Point there's a trail that goes to there so you can go anywhere in that neighborhood um all the way over to Riverwalk and that states through the neighborhood but you can't get from there to Pine View Meadows there's a missing Gap in the trail there MH so if you were to walk you'd have to walk along the road as noted we probably won't have anybody do that me you can't again and then you'd have an on Street Trail on Vinewood there's that's a technically on street trail cuz there's not a lot of traffic down that road and it's wide enough we could make an AUA Lane like we did in dearwood yep essentially just payt a line and that costs next to nothing and that'll get them over to through that that gets you that gets you into Pine View Meadows development and then P Pine View Mets you take the trail that we just did along Pine View down to the conrete so that's the missing segment okay so it connects those segments together yes we shifted the um dayon of Road section that we're going to do with trail that had been identified by the parks commission based on on um the County's plan to redo dayon River Road in a few years so we switched that and said we're not going to move forward with that project we'll switch it North Diamond Lake Road um we had planned on actually being at that corner but after further review it makes um about zero sense to make a pedestrian cross at that corner because there's not a safe Crossing um at the corner of North Diamond Lake when it actually goes into Vinewood right there it would just be a straight across and right on North diamond or on the Vinewood it's a very dangerous corner there so picking somebody cross right there makes makes no sense and likely not going to get approved by the county so and we don't even know if they get approved of the county with a birkshire Crossing yet we're still working on that Jason I think we emailed them last week or even maybe even it's been more than once but that's basically the missing second did we figure out if we have the right away on the south side we don't oh so that 900 is a complete swag mhm we took the money essentially allocated for the trail on the DAT of Road and just shifted it I think it was the same amount of funding they bought a million dollars the trail the actual Trail only has to be from birkshire to vine so it's not like it's that long yeah it's not very far but we have right away to get so we have right away in the north side but then you can't get across the road so makes not a whole lot of sense to put the trail down that well sure you can get across the road it's about a third of a mile looks like correct yeah said it's not that far of a trail so actually constructing the trail is it we don't need to make it to 3 Park District standard so it doesn't have to be 10t wide corre XX we' make it what is it 8et wide for most 8et wide for most Trails just so we can plow with a flow say just a pave well if you put the road on the South Side you still got to cross the road at some point but you cross it intersection with the intersection which is a perpendicular crossing that's further away from the intersection of the road and yeah but if you cross it right there at Vinewood you're crossing right on that curve I mean cars are only going to be going 2530 down that corner I'll pass it off to Jason he's the one who told me we shouldn't go there well we would still need to acquire right away at least on one property looks like on the North side but yeah on the South Side that's one two three four maybe five property six y seven which is why it's been a slow moving process that's so that's another conversation yeah correct I don't see us spending that money next year or the year after let's be positive about it see it's going to go really well I would think realistically so that's why it's been identified otherwise there's not really a lot of trails that are being added because most of them are being added along Dayton River Road with the projects in 28 and 29 and 30 whatever the county will do them okay um I think that's actually all I had Scott covered some of what I had questions about and I think let's go back and I want to is anybody else any comments otherwise I want to address Scott's comments that he had there the only other one the only one I got and I think that's just more conversation is the $5 million in Stevens for 2028 I mean we don't even know what we're planning there so that'll be back from the master plan that we do that's just another conversation at some point you got it yep I agree um so we still don't have any idea about funding for the training facility right not at the moment and right now that's on the 2026 MH that I guess I'm I'm thinking that that should be almost moved out until we know we have funding [Applause] or I would agree um Ian we can always Pull It in if we get funding but I we don't even have a facility to put it at yet well that would be to pay for the facility the funding would or property I should say so by having it in 26 and the reason wasn't 25 it moved it to 26 cuz even if we have it in there's no way going to happen in 25 just based on yeah there's a load of answers why it's not well um but the reason why we put it in 26 is to show it's still a priority for the city so that we because we provide the long-term plan to the and typically we go for bonding dollars is what we have them do with the state just because it's um we've had pretty good success with it and our reps have been fairly good with us so we've um we got the cash bonding last time and we were also so close to getting a bonding Bill the last session so wouldn't have been for the training facility but it would have been for other things um by having it in 2026 we Le show it's a priority if we keep pushing it out it doesn't show as much of as a priority not saying you can't move it out I'm just saying it's not as much of a priority to us so we're not going to get us priority funding for that item not say we're going to get it either way I'm just noting it as a as an item of note we can move it to wherever you'd like to it just I think it's still going to be on there as a item of request from the fire department okay um take that feedback with what you will I uh 401 fund do you want to move it do you want I don't want to make sure we State like I don't know you're not going it's not going to give built to until you get funding anyway no correct so I mean it's just another conversation that's though I think the whole idea is is I would prefer you guys don't plan these and all of a sudden three months from now oh yeah we're going to plan this before we talk about it again and and get funding you because generally if it's on here it's happening we will not always we would look at the science look at the science we didn't buy any of them done this is a a bonding year for the state so we would have some idea where we're at in terms of getting funing funding for this I'm not solding the whole training idea yet so I mean we haven't shown that it'll cash flow we don't have we don't have any support from any I show you a cash flow no I don't think you're going to get any Community that's going to say yeah for sure we're going to use it because they don't know what they're going to use so until you get that I'm not going to support it okay sounds good go after 202 but yes we have we will have multiple asks into the bonding bill so what we'll have to do is um St put together all the bonding requests I'll send them off to the Senators and our house Representatives which is Hoffman and to do um but I'll need probably some prioritization from the council if we do hear back from them about which ones do we want to pick from because we likely won't get all of them we'll submit for as much as possible because why would wouldn't we we could reutilize our tax dollars and basically double dip of getting tax dollars from the state that we already submit in as as residents but yeah might have to have some prioritization conversations next year depending on what the bond looks like I I guess I'm I'm kind of with Scott a little bit in that when we have something that we're planning that we we tend to provision for that plans which might make sense because it's on the plan and and yet we know this isn't happening without the funding and that that's my concern so I I get what you're saying that although I don't know you know whether Hoffman or nades are long-term plan I do share it with them yep do you okay um I guess the only other thing I have is if we are if we move that station out where is this lad truck and tender going if we're getting it in 2028 and I'm and I guess I'm asking if we should be pushing that out also Gary already made the comment that it'll fit in this building I understand that but do we have the room yeah mayor members of council um we do have the room for that for both yeah the yeah because we're the one tender or the our current tender that we have now is scheduled to be sold again that's the temporary one over at uh station one so we do have the the room of that capacity so we would take this engine and move it station one and then this we would have the tender and the ladder truck here yeah currently we have a rescue and an engine in this inside this base here so we just put the engine in the rescue in the other half Bay and put the ladder truck in the single Bay and the tender that would go at station one and be swapped out with the tanker that's there so the tanker is going to get sold so that piece of equipment will leave and then the engine tender will be in that spot okay where does the the aerial truck go that goes goes in here yeah so yeah so right now we have in that station there's a tanker an engine and a rescue correct in that in that base at station one um and so what we would do is we would take the tanker out of commission at station one and sell it and then get the engine tender in so those we still have three at station one in station two we only have a rescue and an engine in the St in the base um at all times that's where they're at and so we would just reposition put the Rescue out the back of Station 2 engine out the front probably and then aerial truck in the other bay so we have space for another one cuz we got rid of the one one piece of that we got rid of was the heavy rescue or the the big one with the big giant slides on it truck utility truck that's called okay we got rid of that one in earlier this year yeah earlier yep just no point having a piece of equipment that's going to take more maintenance yeah yeah that's helpful um but also in 2030 we've got a in engine for station three but we're not building that until 31 so that one we'll have to probably talk about that was more of a replacement for fire replacement for engine 21 engine 21 that'll be due for replacement in 30 so my request for that more than likely we come in 2026 for that cost savings it it does say so it doesn't it says for station three y but it should probably be replaced and say replace engine 21 what it should say because engine 21 will be 20 years old at that point okay 2030 we bought that one in 2009 10 uh no 200 so 21 was already replaced no no um we replaced engine 11 um engine 12 is our newer one that we got in 2017 or something all the numbers but I know yeah there was two engines at station one at one point now there's currently only one and we replaced it with that engine tender to combine two pieces of equipment into one piece of equipment for less maintenance mayor members of the council if I could ask a quick question because I was not here as on vacation I'm just looking for some information as it relates to pushing Station 3 out to 2031 I wasn't here to understand or kind of how Council came to that discussion or that decision I think it came in on the survey that uh the residents in the city that are fine with the fire protection that's here I think that's mainly where that conversation came from yeah it was a combination of there's they're satisfied with response times they are the amount of money they want to put forward for a new station wasn't anywhere near what we'd need so um so that's why the three years would get us to the next uh survey or or and then also in 20 by 20129 to 2030 I think it is there's a lot of Tiff money coming in so that it dep I know what you look at for right but people have spent it not spent it depending on which one your version of the plan is I understand I I understand how you guys think but well it just it just is because you can't spend it four four times Everything's Going to paid what the Tiff money is that is correct it's not that much money that's going to be coming in I mean it's a it's a portion so um I think it's about a million bucks it was about a little under a half change in my mind I think it was about half what we would need if we added it all up no I know yeah M 2028 is a bad year well yeah I guess that would be another reason so basically the reason was just to push it off until we he the next survey do so the next surve yeah and I think the conversation have it back and forth and that's fine whatever Yu you pick is it could have INF FL so I'm not too concerned about the year but you know as long as it stays on the longterm plan is is important for City staff and City operations overall um there are lots of changes in things happening and we had uh some money in the budget to start putting way for these for the ladder truck and it sounds like that might go away but we haven't had that discussion yet do we have the next council meeting so we may have to bond for that guy uh would no no no no there was a conversation a while back that you were going to you were going to bank all kinds of money coming up yep I'll share the long I should share that with tonight but I didn't have it ready to go so okay um so basically part of the longterm plan is planning out the rest you know kind of the future years as best I possibly can I'm not a wizard nor am I perfect at forecasting clearly the county isn't either um but the idea would be to try to keep the tax rate within reason and when I say within reason it would go up or down half to a full percent somewhere in there over the next few years based on operations changes and future growth of what we see in the city um to be able to fund that ladder truck in three years time that would mean that the council would have to be okay with keeping the tax rate the same as where it is today what that means is that the taxes wouldn't go up unless your house value goes up that's what the tax rate change means if your house value goes up there's nothing we can do here City we can do what we want but that would be what would happen if you weren't to do that then the tax rate would go down and decrease which people would pay less taxes but then you're going to have to bond for it which then people are going to pay higher taxes for that bond in order to pay for that piece of equipment that makes sense no okay anyway it's another conversation sure all right I know there was a different conversation about 6 months ago about where all that L money was coming from um and for me we get there I wanted to save 600 a year for that latter truck oh it went into operations a great big different idea that it went into operations though yeah finalize up operations yeah that's correct okay MH I'm done Easy Come Easy Go anybody else have any more no no I think I got everything that I had not do we want to make any changes the long-term plan based on comments that I know we made a couple that David made which is fantastic and appreciated I know scottt made a few of them do we want to put more money into parks to be able to do LC Stevens quicker first you got to figure out you got to figure out what you want what what you're going to build yep I don't want just a number there because didn't we task the kind of at the last well at the last me Mee we talked about what our vision was for to that you know obviously that relayed back to the park so I'd imagine they're on it so it should have something yeah they'll be uh master plan RFP that went out already right okay okay we'll get it pulled together more to come yep more to come on that we can have a master plan discussion about what you guys want to see there at LC Stevens long term I did have another question about the tender has a comment next to it saying it's already funded I thought that was just a small portion of that how much how much is funded uh um all of it will be funded by that point the only part that's missing right now is that $475,000 that says replace tanker 11 and it says this will fund engine tender below and that's in 2026 yeah so the only part that's missing is that 475 so where where is the rest of the funding coming from so it came from the sale of engine 11 which was $400,000 wish I had my computer on me that gets you most of the way yeah that gets you most of the way but I have notes on the side of this thing that you can't see on the print up there's four yeah so $400,000 from engine 11 there's 475 funded in 2026 that's $875 we have $100,000 coming from it's from want me to speak here $120,000 from the sale of utility 21 so the other truck we sold out of here that was 120 Grand okay and then we have $50,000 of extra tax levy dollars coming in 25 that's planned currently in the budget and then 2026 we have the remaining difference which is 114,000 bucks that's where the dollar came from okay thank you I was having a little trouble making can that jump from three of them basically are yeah sales actually sale of engine 11 came to 427 500 that's what we actually got and then sale of utility 21 is 120 Grand two previous pieces of equipment one budgeted tanker replacement and then 200 it's a total of $164,000 of tax levy paid for the rest anybody got anything else good questions good comments any any any changes we want to make to the long-term plan so I want to make sure this is pretty much finalized um at the next Council mean I can bring up the kind of the I won't say it's a long-term plan but kind of the forecast of what the tax rate would be over the next few years based on all the changes that we're seeing in this long-term plan that are based on funding so bring that to the next council meeting along with discussions with um the final budget discussions for next year's 2025 budget BR to me you to me you really got to figure out when you say uh what the tax rate is going to be M you can't say estimate that for 2028 because the 5 million you have for LC Stevens you don't even know if you're going to spend it so you can't put it in the budget I put it in there as a bond oh okay so I did I did Factor it in but doesn't mean it's the F the 5 million is just an arbitrary number it could be nothing and then changes yeah changes all the tax levy number based on we have the long-term plan I put together forecasted items for not just long-term plan stuff but also operations and changes with operations based on you know guaranteed increases and you know when I say guarantee is going to be salary and benefit stuff it's insurance it's everything that goes up every year for you guys it goes up for the City Gas Utilities all that stuff goes up it's just basically generated into the formula so I'm happy to share that too um at the next C to me in the plan I was going to share tonight butly include it all right are we good I'm good yes item M i' like when you beat me up with a longterm plan so thanks so much item M Ed by Amendment thank you Mr Mayor um in I think it was November of last year the council amended uh a section of the city code uh PR requiring that uh I think if commissioner members Miss more than three or have more than three absences they would be removed from the commission uh recently the Eda has amended or uh has approved to amend the bylaws to make it more discretionary um whether it's a uh an excuse or an unexcused absence so this does leave some discretion to the chair or the Eda president to determine if uh a person who is absent or member that absent has an excused or unexcused absence um which is different than what the council's or the city code is so this a long way of saying um the Eda is requesting an amendment to the bylaws which the city council needs to approve in order to go in effect um From staff's perspective if the council is supportive of this amendment then it should be applicable to all commissions so once again the city code requirements is if you miss more than three meetings in a calendar year you're off that commission uh what the Eda is requesting is some um uh latitude as far as as interpreting if a a commission member Eda member is has an excuse or an unex unexcused still can't proun so right I think we got it we got I got the idea um I I guess I'm I'm okay with the specific spefic instance only because we changed the rules not long ago but I to me if somebody can't meet 25% of the time and in the staff report I I uh part of that language is incorrect so in the staff report mentions if if you um you have to attend 75% so it's or Miss 25% it's three is the magic number so if you miss more than three meetings then you're automatically off the commission a moved meeting or a canceled meeting does not count against you cor correct make sure that that that's clear to that's outside of their control that's outside that's correct yeah I think the intent of it broadly was that if you're going to miss a third of the meetings which essentially what this is then what level of commitment do you really have to that commission or authority and um for me I guess I'll I'll just say I'm not in favor of approving this change I think it should apply to all the commissions yeah I'm not I agree um well sorry you done yeah okay I just I don't know the difference between I know what it is fundamentally but I don't know what we consider that as excused or unexcused if it's just at the discretion of of the president so um that's just casting judgment um there's nothing concrete there for me so I wouldn't I wouldn't approve of this my only comment would be and I agree with what you guys are saying there's 12 meetings a year on all of these commissions to me if you can't make nine of them then you probably shouldn't be there right now and and I find it utterly almost impossible that four of them meetings would be a death in the family or I mean I I don't see a anniversary or anything like that if it falls on that meeting day it's not that big a deal I can see some significant life events really taking somebody out where where I don't as it's written today I I don't see it I I think it deserves a deeper discussion on what we accept as unexcused and excused and then leave of absences that is what it entails something more major like that like it's covering all bases so I want to make sure it's clear I I believe the ordinance isn't automatically removed either I think it's will Beed recommended to Council for removal doesn't mean that they will be removed correct it means that they will be recommended to council for removal and if there are extenuated circumstances circum we can take that into account that's why and that's why it was written that way it was not I believe not just say automatically removed well the the intention is that if it I've got to look at the ordinance again but uh in watching the the uh council meeting from last year the intention was is to remove the sub ability from the council so that was automatic removal was it was automatic talked about okay yep I'm still okay with it taking the Judgment off the chair versus sure you sure I think the whole thing came from an Eda member missed four meetings correct three three was it three three and his next yeah I think you guys um added during that meeting to make sure that staff sent out a reminder email before somethingone was and that did not happen fail to happen and again like I said I we kind of changed rules halfway through the year but now the rules are in place MH build process reg to something a little more for yeah sure I I think I like Dave said if you're missing or Scott somebody if you're missing that many meetings we need to get somebody on there that can hit the meetings sure so I don't motion and a second to deny it I'll motion to deny the language just SE okay I'll second it uh okay we we've hit this before a motion well I guess you don't have to you don't have to do anything if you don't want to I guess right we we I would just say we we're not moving forward with it yeah so no motion right no motion there's no motion I withdraw my second this one always gets me yeah that's why it happened last time I like I don't know just clean but okay I understand it's just a motion to do nothing seems yep didn't pass perfect move on here we go got it thank you thank you um item n good evening mayor and Council um what I'm looking for tonight is uh approval to award the bridge contract for the North Bridge at LC Stevens Park um the item has been approved got for bid we have had the bid opening and we do have a low bid I would like to just discuss um the handout that I put on your uh desk before the meeting uh this was to um in response to a question from the mayor um I did a little bit of research on this to find out um uh exactly why the Box uh the Box CT wouldn't work in this area and it's basically because of the location of that um box at that bridge um it's in the floodway um which is a little different to the um uh the flood plane um so the flood way uh should not have it obstructions installed that would restrict the free flow of flood water um in this case it would be predominantly U uh water from the river being pushed back down the creek when it's at flood stage um this whole area is actually in that um floodway um um we did consult with uh Paul did consult with various uh professionals um uh Engineers the bridge engineers and a uh civil engineer um to figure out what would be the best use of a bridge in that area um and it was unanimous that we should go for a a structure that doesn't impede the water flow there okay any Motion in a second I had a couple couple of questions um not that particular one although I did wonder about that as well okay so thank you for that clarification um there's some pretty wide swings in the yeah in the bidding on some of the items that you know caus me a little bit of concern um structural concrete goes from 32,000 with the low bidder that we're discussing to 123,000 to the high bidder um um yeah you think concrete 44 low bidder 85 high bidder and that it also appears that this contractor vaa um subcontracts all of that work and so I'm a little concerned about the you know their expertise in giving us an accurate bid and that's why we reached out to them and that's why they sent back you they there's a letter in the packet from them um stating which other projects they worked out um Paul did reach out to Igo about the the projects there and they had nothing but good things to say about the contract that they did the work at the price and on time so um I think we did our due diligence there um we did query them about their prices on those specific things and they are definitely comfortable with the prices they put in their bid documentation it just they jumped out at me because there such AIG big difference there and what what are risks for a change order I mean what what kind of categories so we already did the soils right soils are done yep but that was all in the bid package as well so right we kind of covered a lot of that off in the bid pack package it was fairly comprehensive what we're expecting and what they were bidding on was was detailed all right I think of all the projects we have this one's probably the pretty low risk and the reason for it is we always get back solil Corrections yeah we've already done those solar borings so we can say we gave you those we you knew exactly what you were doing and not well we didn't do those well now we you know although poror soils is a very common response back we've done that research for them so they know exactly what's there good which isn't a valid excuse then for poor soils well if it goes south a Aon is going going to have a work with us I'm good I'll make a motion to approve it all right I'll second any more discussion all those in favor say I I all right all is oppos say no motion carries 4 to zero and unless there are objections we will be adjourned we're adjourned e e