Okay, everybody ready? Here we go. Well, good evening everybody. Uh, welcome to the Adana City Council meeting. It is Tuesday, November 18th, 2025. It is 700 p.m. and um, Director Bener was good enough to tell you that we're doing these meetings in a hybrid fashion. Uh, people are watching us online. We're going to let them participate. We've got a couple of different opportunities for that tonight. One is in community comment which comes up early in the agenda. If somebody wants to talk to the council about something that's of a concern to them that's not on the agenda tonight or otherwise scheduled for a future public hearing, they're welcome to come forward and express those concerns. You have three minutes. Uh and then uh also we've got a couple of public hearings with us uh that we're going to handle tonight as well. uh and um so then you're welcome to testify on those public hearings uh in addition to the community comment uh with things that are unrelated to other matters on the agenda. So having provided that information, I'm going to ask our clerk Sharon Allison to call the role. >> Council member Agnu >> here. Council member Jackson >> here. >> Council member Pierce >> here. >> Council member Risser >> here. >> Mayor Hublin >> here. Next is the pledge of allegiance. I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thanks everybody. And uh we've got a form of meeting agenda in front of us. Is there anyone on the council from a staff standpoint who wishes to modify the agenda in any form or fashion? Is there a motion to approve the meeting agenda as published? >> So moved. >> I second. >> Member Jackson moves. Member Agnu seconds the adoption of the meeting agenda is published. Any further discussion? All those in favor of adopting the meeting agenda is published say I. >> I. Opposed? Carried. The meeting agenda is adopted. Uh we have something to work from this through this meeting this evening. Uh and next we are at community comment. So uh folks uh we're going to take uh residents in the audience first. Uh, and we've got some people with us that are residents that are familiar with the process and uh, one of them has stepped up to the microphone and uh, we'll he'll have three minutes and he's going to give us his name and address and he's a good role model to follow and what to do >> and I won't give you >> and he knows he knows how to manage the clock. Very good. Welcome. >> Good evening, mayor, council members. My name is Ralph Zickert in light >> and your address, Mr. Zickert. >> No, no, we're not doing >> Oh, yeah. Okay. Thank you. >> No need to tell you the address. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, got it. >> In light of what has proven to be an unviable and at worst misrepresented plan, I'd like to call the city council to task. On October 30th, while acting as members of the HR, you took the cowardly action to indefinitely table the decision to use $17 million of city tax dollars to fund a parking garage at the old US bank site. A parking garage whose primary benefit would be for the proposed pie in the sky private office building. And the developer didn't even have the courtesy to show up for the meeting. unviable. In June of 2022, the developer enticed the city to commit $22 million of future property taxes to fund a $250 million development. Three and a half years later, less than 2% of the promised investment has been delivered. All that has been accomplished is for one a one forone replacement of the previous US Bank branch office. Meanwhile, 701 France Avenue has a tarp covered fence shrouding the now barren site from view. Look no further south than 7235 France Avenue, the eastern entrance to the proposed $20 million tunnel under France, a site that continues to be owned by Macy's. Yet another stalled development and more evidence that the city council continues to chase projects that do not bear free market scrutiny. Misrepresented the US Bank site developer continues to dangle the carrot of a future trophy office building. Given our winter climate, I'm not sure how anyone can call an office building as trophy when it relies on remote parking. So from the start, the development as proposed will not and should not be viewed as a trophy office building. As the council has been quick to point out, words matter. And this and in this case, tabled does not mean rejected. How in good conscience can the council not draw a line in the sand and say no? This is not about tableabling or kicking the can down the road. How in today's environment of a double-digit property tax levy, a 15% increase in storm water rates on top of the $1 million already being added to utility bills for street repair. Can you not soundly reject borrowing $17 million on behalf of a development that has shown absolutely zero backing? Why did Why did you just kick the can down the road and table the decision to next year? Why is it so hard to say no to the gift of tiff? Thank >> Thank you, Mr. Zickert. Anyone else? >> Good evening. >> Good evening. My name is Dan Nye. I live on Peaceale without giving the specific address. >> That's fine, Dan. Um, I'm speaking to the need for the mayor and city council to present a referendum to the voters of Edina to amend the language of the city code to allow for the recall of the mayor and city council members before their full terms have uh expired. The mayor and city council are elected supposedly on a nonpartisan basis. Yet, it turns out Edina elected officials are extreme leftists hiding in nonpartisan clothing. Instead of staying in their nonpartisan lane of public safety, roads, and parks, our current mayor and city council are impos imposing their leftist views on all of us. There needs to be a method for the citizens of Edina to check this extreme behavior of our elected officials. If the mayor and city council stayed in their lane of public safety road and parks, no one would care about their leftist ideology. But because of their hidden agenda, most EDIA voters don't know the mayor and city council members think that they can even subvert the US Constitution without recourse. And again, there has to be a mechanism to uh block this behavior, present a referendum to the voters to allow for your recall. Thank you. and I would encourage you to stick around for the entire meeting tonight. >> Lori Gros, I sent an email to all of the council about a week ago and I didn't get any response. So, I'm trying in person now and see what happens. It was about the Grand View site, the city public works that we own. A developer has been chosen by the council/HA and the purchase price that he suggested was $4 million. And was he requesting any tiff or any financial assistance? No. Now the council has already said they're going to transfer the ownership of the property from the HR to the city council. That way when the sale is consummated the money that's achieved from received from the sale will go to the city into the general fund. I agree with that. The question I had for the council and still have, what are you going to do with the increment? That project sits within a tiff district, an existing tiff district. The developer is not asking for any tiff and no financial assistance. So according to state law, any increment which is the increase in the property taxes will stay into the tiff district. Now the starting the base tax for that piece of property is zero because it's cityowned. So from day one dollar one all of that money will go into the tiff district. Now you have the option of changing the property lines on that district to carve out the development at Grand View. So those future property taxes would go to the city and not to the H slush fund. Now, we just had a work session that I attended upstairs and they're looking for money. They're trying to keep that levy under control. Are you going to carve out this district? I went I see I'm on yellow. I'll talk fast. I went to the August walk with the mayor and another resident said to the mayor, "Oh, gee, this is really great. now we'll get property taxes to help offset our property taxes from that uh tiff district. And the mayor and I said, "No, that's not going to happen." And the mayor said, "Well, maybe perhaps we have to adjust those uh property lines for the tiff district." So, are you going to do that? Are you going to let the taxpayers get the increment? Are you going to put it into the slush fund for something else to be spent on? Thank you. >> Thank you, Miss Gross. >> Hi, good evening. My name is Art Boland. I'm a resident of Edina. I live on Warden Avenue. Um, I'm here on behalf of the Edina Hockey Association. I'm lucky enough to be the president of that organization. We've got more than 1,200 skaters with that. If you just assume of average family size and you assume their grandparents and everybody else lives nearby, that's probably 10% of the Dina population that we're talking about when you start multiplying it out. We've been dealing with the additions and the renovations to the Braar facility. We're incredibly appreciative of the fact that all of you have spent a lot of time thinking about it and working on it and the city staff has been too. In the last couple of weeks, we've had had one of the four rinks at Braar go down. That's been incredible disruption for us. Here's why I'm here. There's really multiple pieces. We have an incredible, almost insatiable need for ICE. We spend more than $2 million a year directly back to the city. Even on top of that, we spend roughly one and a half to two million more at other facilities nearby Edina. We thought there were going to be five rinks after the renovation. There's going to be four. I get it. money doesn't go as far in 2025 as when the referendum was passed in 2021. But I'm hopeful I'm anxious and I'm hopeful that ultimately the city partners with Edina Hockey to be able to get us the sort of ice that's needed. We have a cherished tradition of hockey in Edina and there are there are there's plenty of money for us to be able to spend more money on ice in Edina to help fund the sort of public project that'd be terrific for all Edina residents. And yet we're not sure if that me need need is going to be met. Plus, I'm anxious because I know that ultimately money isn't the only thing. We can't get it entirely from our constituents within the Adana Hockey Association. I'm anxious because I know that other organizations are starting to think about maybe there are other ways to fund raise. We would like to be a part of the pull tab discussion ultimately that's going to happen before this council. It's more than 10% of your constituency. And I'm hopeful that ultimately the ordinance that may be passed if we pass one in Edina allows for equitable treatment. That is give Edina Hockey an opportunity to be involved with that conversation because ultimately if we get those dollars, those dollars come right back to the city of Edina. Thank you. >> Thanks Mr. Borland. And I think manager Neil and I as you Mr. boiling before as you're leaving here. Uh >> three minutes were up so I didn't know what >> Yeah. When man when manager Neil sometimes we can answer a question in time. Sometimes we need a little bit more time. >> It's a lot like being in court. They have these at uh the US Supreme Court too. >> You Yeah, you're you're familiar with that based on the way you make a living. Um when uh manager Neil and I were at the meeting with the with the hockey association a couple months ago now I think we left thinking we got to figure out a way to get a fifth rink and we're so we're cognizant of that challenge and trying to figure it out >> in briefly if I mayor Hofflin we had a meeting recently in the last 10 days or so and there's additional ideas that the city staff is sharing with us which are terrific and really what I'm trying to say is we're here. We're a huge constituents block and we're willing to try to figure out ways to partner with the city to be able to meet that need and make something great for Adina. A long time from now, I'll be gone. I'd like the rinks to be there. >> Yeah. Thanks, Mr. Bo. Well said and well understood. Good evening, Janie Weston. Let me set my kitchen timer. Three minutes. It just started. At the last meeting a month ago, basically a month ago, I came to give my opinion and comments at a public hearing. I had three minutes at uh let's see, that was if anyone wants to go back and review that meeting, it's at 1 hour and 39 minutes into the meeting. A minute and a half into that, I was interrupted. Cut off in mids sentence. It threw me off. I had not asked a question which would have elicited a response. Um, but I was interrupted. I'm just going to call this person interrupter number one. I was corrected, erroneously corrected on something that I had said and a previous part of the meeting was referred to, information given, but how that was related was not accurate. I was told that um when when an interrupter number two was asked to con you know concur here that there was a loan being repaid in regarding to what I had commented earlier in the meeting and that loan had never been identified what it was for. I went back and I checked. I looked at the video of the meeting. I transcribed the whole thing. I didn't know that that's what it was referring to. And for all anyone could have known, the next thing that I was going to say if I hadn't been interrupted was to ask a question. Is that loan being repaid? I didn't get a chance to say that. I don't appreciate it. That was three minutes of my time and that's all I get is three minutes. If someone wants to make a comment regarding my comments, they can wait to the end of my three minutes. If you were in my fourth my sister's fourth grade class when she was a teacher, you would have been told, "Put your finger up. Hold that thought until I'm done speaking and then you will be able to speak. This is just decent courtesy. It was very disruptive. It was not appreciated. It wasn't okay. So, I have my three minutes. I get to say what I want. Oops. I'm done. And I'm not asking for an apology. I'm just making a point. Thank you. >> Thank you, Miss West. >> David Frankle. Uh, I wasn't going to talk about this until the last hour came up. Uh, tonight I received two texts from Midina residents. One said she was moving within a year because of the property taxes going up. The other one told me that a large group of Edina residents on a private Facebook page, all they've been talking about is property taxes going up. It's a problem and needs to be addressed. To the gentleman's point earlier from the Dina Hockey Association, the only communication about the South Rink being down is from the Dina Hockey Association. There is nothing on the internet or the city's websites about what's going on at the South Rink. The Dino Hockey Association said a compressor broke, but there's a rental refrigeration unit in the back of the South Rink, leading me to believe they brought in a whole unit, a chiller, compressor, the whole nine yards to bring that rink up. And I have no idea what's going on there. But I'd estimate that rink loses about $10,000 a week in lost revenue. And I can tell you, bringing in a rental unit, the electrical costs for that are going to be skyhigh. It's going to be an added cost to that rink. tied into that gentleman also talked about pull tabs as you're well aware our the municipal liquor stores contribute substantial amount of money the Dina Park systems most of that goes to Braar Arena that's been going down dramatically in the third quarter results just came in on sales that went down 16% from last year's quarter that's less money to the Adina park system is there a plan what's going to go on with the Adina park system. Everything I'm talking about tonight, I sent emails to the city council with more detail. The city Braar Arena already loses a substantial amount of money. And the things I'm talking about is making that arena lose even more with less revenue from the municipal liquor stores and from losing revenue from South Rink being down. Veterans Day. My understanding is the city of Vina had two holidays for Veterans Day. There's a photo I emailed to staff and the city council. There was a sign outside the city front door, city hall front door saying Veterans Day holiday is November 11th or 10th and 11th, excuse me. I don't know why the city employees got two days off and why it was called a holiday. The city council by state statute has to declare and approve any new city holidays. That was never done. The city cannot go around violating city and state statutes on various issues like this. It was similar to the city council meeting that was canceled a couple weeks ago because there didn't realize until the last minute there were school board elections or referendums in other school districts that overlap Edina. City staff need a calendar that shows all the various holidays and elections so they can appropriately set up times for meetings and not have these surprises. And if you're going to invent reasons to take a holiday, they should be well defined and approved by the city council. These soft holiday that evidently turned up in a calendar that was approved last year. I have no idea what that is or soft close, excuse me. Soft clos is used in financial circuits circles to indicate closing the books to take a look at what's going on before the final books are closed. There is no such thing as a soft close for a holiday. Again, if you want to make things up, get them approved. >> Mr. Frank, >> thank you. I'm done. >> Yeah. Anyone else wish to speak to the council on a matter of concern to them? Okay. Do we have anybody online? No sir. >> Okay. Um, as I mentioned earlier, sometimes we can deal with some of these questions uh in real time. Sometimes staff needs more time to address them and they usually address them that same week uh on the website by Friday and then we deal with them on the at the following city council meeting. Uh, with regard to the Veterans Day issue, I think we could probably deal with that issue right now. We we had several people call me I had several people call me asking me well was was Monday a holiday in addition to Tuesday the Veterans Day being a holiday at city hall. How how can we do that? So I think you can well well explain it manager Neil. >> A soft close and the way that we use that term is when we have the opportunity to close in between two other days of work uh that are a holiday or a weekend or something like that. that gives uh that gives folks who want the opportunity to have an extended three or 4 day weekend. We do not call that a a holiday. It it is not paid. So if if employees are taking advantage of that extra day, they have to take paid leave or they work. uh it gives them a time to come in and work on on long projects uh in a way that they can apply themselves in in a way that better than a better than an average workday. So that's what that is. Um >> so on Monday they either worked or they took a paid vacation day, >> right? >> Okay. But it gave them a chance for a 4-day weekend if they wanted to take a paid vacation day. >> All right. Thank you. You had something else you were going to say? >> I was just going to run down the questions and responses from last time. Um, Mr. Nounorf here yet? Is he here? No. Okay. I was just thinking about concern raised by Lori Gros. >> I think that one we would we definitely want to have more time on. >> To me, to me, it struck me as being akin to uh Nolan Mains took a p piece of public property, turned it into a tax generating piece of property, and it was where the county set the new tax levy or the taxable value that was key. But I that's as much as I can remember. >> We'll take just a couple. >> It's not you're not working from zero. I know that. >> Right. >> Okay. Um go ahead. On the other answers to questions that were raised at the prior council meeting, >> right on October 22nd. Uh we had one question about will the city host a meeting to discuss the lighting uh in the Grand View Square development. Uh yeah, a number of staff uh Mr. Milner and I, Mr. Newondorf and uh uh Nicole Gorman uh from the senior center went over and did a kind of a neighborhood meeting with uh the with the Grand View Square group on Wednesday, November 5th. Learned a little bit more about what's happening in their building and on their property and also talked about lighting at that meeting. Uh second question was, will France Avenue crossing uh underpass uh be ADA compliant? Uh our response is yes. If plans and specs are are plans and specifications are developed, uh they will be required to meet ADA requirements. We don't have a of a direction from council to prepare plans and specs yet for that project. Uh the third question was what data supports the idea that France Avenue intersection uh where the crossing underpass is dangerous? Uh we've we've received um complaints from from residents who who try to navigate across who try to walk across uh France. Uh we can see those at the Better Together Adina uh project page as well. Uh finally, when will the city consider changes to its tree protection ordinance? Uh staff anticipates bringing ideas to the council uh for the ordinance changes at the at the first quarter of 2026. >> That's what we have >> that generate any questions from council members. Okay. One other thing I thought >> Oh, yeah. Member. Sorry. >> Thank you. I know that we do have um the one resident in particular that's looking for a variance like what direction do we give that resident on waiting or coming back or or how do we address that issue? >> We've shared this information with that resident. >> Okay. Does that timing still like >> we actually don't have a proposal from the resident yet either. So that that part of it we still need to get. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Uh, and then with regard to the matter Mr. Zickert raised, as I recall, that matter was tabled because the developer couldn't be available, >> right? >> So, we tabled it to a a future date and time so we could have that discussion. >> That's right. >> All right. Still here. >> Mayor Hufflin, we do have someone else who's wondering if she can still speak. >> Sure. >> Thank you. Good evening everyone. I'm Helena McNeel. I am a resident of Edina. I live in a spacial lane. And um I'm here today to urge you to go further than the what the amendment today around um enforcing gun violence or um gun protections. >> No ma'am, we can't have you talk about that tonight because it's on the agenda. So you can't in public comment. You can only speak. You weren't here earlier, I don't think. So, if public comment is designed to handle matters that aren't on the agenda that evening or scheduled for a future public hearing, and the reason you can't speak on it tonight is because it's not a public hearing. We're not taking testimony about gun violence. It's just a council discussion on this matter. So, I can't permit you to go forward with your thoughts on gun violence. >> Understood. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Um, let's move on then uh to the consent agenda. I think member Risser wanted to remove item 6.6 for a quick discussion. Does anyone else on the council wish to remove an item from the consent agenda? >> All right. Is there a motion to approve all the items on the consent agenda in a single motion with the exception of item 6.6? >> So moved. I second. >> Member Jackson moves. Member seconds the adoption of the items on the consent agenda and a single motion with the exception of item 6.6. Any further discussion? All those in favor of adoption of the items on the consent agenda except for 6.6 say I. >> I. I. >> Opposed. >> Point of clarification, Mr. Mayor. Did we remove 6.25 already? Yes. We're tableabling that one tonight. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So, we've got uh everybody in favor there. We get an I vote on that. All right. And nays. All right. Uh the items on the consent agenda are approved with the exception of item 6.6. We're going to turn to that now which is the traffic safety report of August 1st, 2025. >> Did we vote? >> All those Yeah, I thought we did. >> Oh, I missed it. >> All those in favor of adop of adoption of the items on the consent agenda with the exception of item 6.6 say I. >> I. >> I. >> Okay. >> Opposed? >> Sorry about that. >> Mayor, I I just wanted to clarify if possible. So >> yeah, >> on the agenda I have there is an item 6.25. >> It's crossed out, but I don't know that there was any formal >> motion to table that remove it from the agenda. So >> that what you were referring to, Clerk Ellison? >> Yes, Mr. Mayor. That's one. >> What did you want to do with that one? >> Table it for a future meeting. >> Okay. All right. Let me restate the motion. Uh all those in favor of tableabling item 6.25 and uh removing item 6.6 from the agenda for discussion this evening. Uh do we have a motion to that effect? >> So moved. >> All right. >> I second. >> Member second that. All right. The motion and the second involves adoption of all the items on the consent agenda with the exception of 6.6 which we're going to talk about momentarily and the uh tableabling of item 6.25 25 which was stricken on the on the um agenda. Nonetheless, we'll table that to a future time. Any further discussion? All those in favor of adoption of the consent agenda as stated say I. >> I. >> I. Opposed. Carried. >> Um now back to item 6.6, which is the traffic safety report of October 1st, 2025. And I'll turn to member Risser. >> Briefly, it's item B1. We did receive a email from a resident who was concerned about safety along Interlock Boulevard. I did talk to director Milner u in the data that is presented there were 17 crashes and the speed is 38.3 miles per hour. Director Milner has a statement to make about future meetings on this issue. >> Yeah, I think the speed limit in general. So a couple years ago we had changed the speed limit. Our transportation folks are reviewing the data and crunching numbers and we'll have a full report back for the entire council on what the changes and the impacts are on those speed limit changes from a few years ago and we can also discuss why we didn't change interlocking at that time and have and continue this conversation at that time. >> Thank you. I just wanted that resident to know. >> Right. You care to move the item? >> I so moved. >> All right. We got a motion on adoption of the traffic safety report of October 1st, 2025, which is item 6.6 on the consent agenda. Is there a second? >> Second. >> All right, we got a second by member Pierce. Uh, any further discussion? All those in favor of adoption of the traffic safety report of October 1, 2025, say I. >> I. >> I. Opposed. Carried. The traffic safety report of October 1, 2025 is adopted. And we tabled 6.25. And that takes us to the uh special recognitions and presentations portion of the agenda. We've got a couple of proclamations this evening to read. Uh and one seems particularly appropriate for the conversation tonight. It's uh kindness week worldwide. November 8th through the 15, 2025. Whereas kindness is a universal expression that brings out the best in others and ourselves with overwhelmingly positive implications for health, well-being, and peace. Whereas kindness is the heartbeat of the world that like a life vest keeps us afloat and helps us to stay connected to others which reduces feelings of anxiety, depression and isolation. And whereas thinking about kindness and behaving kindly has powerfully positive impacts on our happiness, optimism and selfworth by building a stronger sense of community and care. And whereas kindness begins within and self-kindness reminds us to extend the same patience, compassion, and care to ourselves that we so readily offer to others. And whereas acts of kindness inspire others to pay it forward in meaningful ways, causing unstoppable positive ripple effects that can be felt throughout the entire community. And whereas kindness is humanity's greatest asset, kindness is a choice that should be intentionally encouraged, recognized, rewarded, and celebrated to achieve more of it in the great city of the of Edina, Minnesota. Now, therefore, in conjunction with World Kindness Day, the city council of the city of Edina hereby recognizes that the week of November 8th through the 15, 2025 has been designated as Kindness Week worldwide in collaboration with International Kindness Reset. During this time, individuals, families, schools, businesses, faith-based and service organizations, and all community constituents, and ecosystems are encouraged to personify the theme, see the good, be the good, go the extra mile for kindness in various ways limited only by the bounds of the imagination and creativity. Through this proclamation and broad community action call to action, we are challenged to perform kind acts big and small and subsequently pay it forward for the collective betterment of one another and for the greater good. Is there a motion to adopt the proclamation with regard to designating November 8th through the 15th, 2025 as kindness week worldwide in the city of Vina? >> So moved. >> Second. Member Jackson moves member Pierce seconds the adoption of the proclamation as read involving kindness week worldwide. Any further discussion. All those in favor of adoption of the proclamation say I. >> I. >> I. Opposed. Carried. The proclamation is adopted. We have um Amy Spangler with us this evening. Where's Amy? >> There she is. Yeah. Uh Adina resident and co-founder of International Kindness Reset. I'm going to um hand this down to you. >> Okay. And uh >> Oh yeah. Okay. Photo >> photos are great. >> We can all we should all come down for World Kindness Week. >> Oh, sure thing. >> You want to get the whole audience to stand up for So, thank you so much um for this uh to accept this proclamation on behalf of Kevin Smith and Kindness Worldwide, which is a Pennsylvania based um nonprofit who is spreading kindness throughout our nation, one city and state at a time. And when I heard that Mayor Havland as well as our governor Walls um both um uh are providing the proclamations for this uh really warmed my heart. Good evening. My name is Amy Spangler. I'm a retired school principal and the co-founder and co-executive director of International Kindness Reset, which is an Adina charity. My co-founder, Tatiana Serina Spadey, and I are really grateful to partner with kindness worldwide to raise awareness of kindness in Edina. As we all know, kindness is sorely needed in our country right now. kindness actions such as expressing gratitude, showing compassion and concern. Even noticing, including, and encouraging, and advocating for others is not just a nice thing to do. It's essential for all humanity. Kindness has a profound impact on the human brain. Serotonin, dopamine, and oxytocin all release when we are kind. And not only when we are kind, but when we witness kindness or even imagine it. Being kind actually enhances feelings of trust and social belonging, helping to reduce feelings of isolation, which is the new epidemic of our society while f also fostering a strong sense of community. Did you know that being consistently kind throughout your life actually has long lasting benefits such as reducing your anxiety and depression and making you live a longer and more well-balanced life? There are three types of kindness. One are those um random acts of kindness like the uh I see the good in you cards which I handed out to all of you. I hope you hand them out to people. or these cit these kindness citations which um police officers can h hand out when they see kind things happening in the community um and going to um kindness worldwide.org org, you can get more ideas for um random acts of kindness. But a lot of organizations and people are like, "Okay, that was great, but how can we actually bring kindness into our community so it's sustainable and it's there all the time?" And that's where my organization comes into play. Um we um help with those next steps to sustain habits of kindness within a community or an organization. We have a prek12 curriculum called connect with kindness that's being used worldwide as well as in the United States. And we just published the book that I gave each of you tonight. It's on Amazon called connect with kindness at home for families. And what it does is it increases um uh kindness through intention and mindful activities that are sustained over time. Families with and without kids and even with grown kids are using this resource and everyone has that has reported to us says it's promoting deeper bonds and higher levels of communication in their family which is something I know we're all looking for. And um the third type of kindness is really about um self-kindness which is embedded into the curriculum as well as the family guide. But this is the main focus of another resource we have called the mindfully kind pocket guide designed to elevate mindfulness and intentionality in workplaces with adults. Um so they can um do more self kindness at work. Um it's a self-study process that kindness organiza that organizations do if they want to become a kindness organization. So, if anyone happens to have questions or comments to me about kindness in Edina, um it's kindnessreset@gmail.com. Email any questions or ideas that you have and thank you again for this presentation. It's really my honor to represent um Kevin Smith and kindness worldwide as well as my organization kind international kindness reset. >> Yeah, Mangler, thanks for being here. And hold on just a moment here. I want to see if anybody on the council has a comment or a question for you. And uh as you were as you were speaking and as I was reading that proclamation, uh I was a beneficiary of a random act of kindness today, I was in a meeting here late in the morning and I thought, well, uh it got to be towards noon, I had to in order to get a couple of light bulbs at Jur's Hardware and I thought, well, I'll just go in Jerry's grocery store and and grab some soup to go back to the office. So, I've got the little thing of soup and I'm standing in line. And I'm standing behind a construction worker who's got all of his car heart gear on and and he's eating his food as he's waiting in line to pay for it because he's hungry. And so a young guy and uh I said uh where are you working? He said, "Oh, we're putting in new sidewalks up by um I think up by Methodist Hospital on Brookside." And so we're talking away and and uh I said, "What's your name?" Blake, he said. And I said, "Well, I'm Jim." And uh and I said, "Well, good luck with everything up there on the job." I said, "Where do you live?" He said, "I up in White Bear Lake." And I said, "I live here." And uh he gets up to pay for his meal. And he says, "I'll buy that guy's lunch, too." >> So he bought my uh soup, you know, and which was that random act of kindness just from that little conversation. >> Yeah. >> With this young guy at the at the at the counter. >> I'm sure it made you feel great. And tomorrow when you do >> maybe feel guilty actually I'm trying to figure out how am I gonna >> how am I gonna find that guy and and pay him back or >> maybe somebody in the audience I can pay it forward to you know absolutely >> next time you see me hit me up for a free can >> container soup juries. >> Thank you for sharing that. That was a dopamine boost for all of us. So thank you. >> All right. Thanks Amy. All right we got another proclamation in front of us here. Um, and this is coming up towards the end of the month and isn't it nice that the bridge project is done now so that we can get around a little bit easier. Uh, the proclamation is involving small business Saturday and I see Rebecca Sasonson back there. November 29, 2025. Uh, whereas there are more than 2400 businesses located in the city of Vina and according to the United States Census over 96% of the firms with paid employees in Hippen County are classified as small business. And whereas small businesses are located in each of Edina's commercial districts, including 44th in France, 50th in France, 70th in Cahill, Cahill Business Industrial Park, Grand View, Lincoln Drive, Greater Southillale, Pentagon Park, Washington Avenue, and Wooddale, Valley View. And whereas according to the United States Small Business Administration, small businesses account for twothirds of the nation's employment growth. And whereas 79% of consumers surveyed in the 2021 consumer insight survey understand the importance of supporting small businesses located in a community. And whereas for many local residents, the Thanksgiving holiday kicks off a season of gathering, dining, shopping, and experiencing arts and culture. Consumers know that supporting small independently owned businesses has a positive social uh economic and environmental impact. And whereas the SBA as well as other public and private organizations across the county country recognize and promote the Saturday after Thanksgiving as Small Business Saturday. And whereas the city of Vina celebrates our local small businesses and recognizes the vital contributions these businesses make to our local economy and to the overall health and vibrancy of the community. Now therefore be it resolved that the city council of vid city of vina does hereby proclaim November 29th 2025 as small business Saturday in the city of vina and urges the residents and guests of our community to support small businesses and merchants located in each of commercial districts on this day and throughout the year. Is there a motion to adopt the proclamation as stated? >> So moved. I second. >> All right. Member Jackson moves. Member Agnu seconds the adoption of the proclamation involving Small Business Saturday designated November 29, 2025 as Small Business Saturday. Any further discussion? All those in favor of adoption of the proclamation say I. >> I. >> I. Opposed. Carried. The proclamation is adopted. I think uh Miss Sorenson, you want to come up and uh your team come up. I'll hand you the proclamation and you're sure welcome to make some remarks. We may want to have a photo taken when we're done. I'll let you make your remarks first and then the council will come down and have a photo with you. >> Welcome, >> Rebecca Sorenson, the 50th and France business association director. Thank you so much for this proclamation. I accept this gratefully on behalf of the 125 businesses at 50th in France. We are so excited for Small Business Saturday. Invite everybody here to join us on November 29th. We'll have an entire day of activities and we'll have a tree lighting at 5:00 pm with the mistle tones. Later in the season, we'll also do a manora lighting. And throughout the whole holiday season, you'll find so many events for families, for pets, for everybody um to come to our downtown and celebrate these amazing independent businesses. We are buoied by the reopening of the ramps. Thank you for doing that before the holiday season. We're so grateful. Uh we have new restaurants. We have uh businesses brimming with gifts and there's new optimism in the district. So this is wonderful. I'll take this back to them. I want to introduce you to Joyce Joseph Rutder of Vbront. A wonderful example of a small business that has persevered through construction and challenges of being an independent small business and let him to say a few words. >> Yeah, welcome Joseph. >> Thank you. Greetings all. Uh, we love hearing stories and up at 50th and all small businesses, you're usually working with somebody who knows product really well because they own the place and they buy it and uh, you should go there and talk to them about those things. Uh, in our community, we're supporting all of the things that we do together, those celebrations with family, those marking of moments in uh, life cycles together. And we're so happy to be here to support the community. So, thank you. >> Yeah, thanks for being here. All right. You want a quick photo? Everybody come down and we'll take a photo. What was the mayor of Saturday? Continuing on in this portion of the agenda, um, our golf course, uh, Bremar Golf Course received a tremendous award from the, uh, from Minnesota Golf Association and they're here this evening along with our some of our staff and, uh, invite them to come forward. John Maize is here, the executive director of the Minnesota Golf Association. And um this was we got a chance to work with him on the adaptive golf tournament that was held at Braar this summer and uh this was a great hire that they made when they brought John in to Minnesota. And uh so pleased to have him here and and thanks for thinking of having us done at Braar. You guys stand over there. Oh, you got the >> gonna show that show it off. Show off the hardware. >> John, welcome. >> Thank you, Mayor. Can I say a handful of words here to showcase Braar? >> Yep. >> Great. Uh, mayor, council members, uh, and all guests. Good evening. My name is John Mays. I am the executive director of the Minnesota Golf Association, and it's an honor to be here with you tonight. The MJ's mission is to serve and support more than 500 golf courses and 600,000 golfers across the great state of Minnesota. And each year, we recognize one club that exemplifies what makes golf so strong in our state. This year, we are proud to announce that Braar Golf Course has been selected as the MGA member club of the year. Braar stands apart as a leader not only in course excellence and community engagement but in advancing the future of golf in our state. It is very much the birthplace of adaptive golf in Minnesota and last year just in September proudly hosted the inaugural Minnesota Adaptive Open. A landmark championship that showcased the skill and determination of athletes competing across eight different physical and cognitive impairment categories. setting a new standard for accessibility in golf. Braar embodies everything our mission stands for, access, inclusion, innovation, and community. And I want to emphasize how meaningful it is as well that the MGA offices are located right here in Edina. We are proud of that fact. Being part of this community makes celebrating this uh great achievement with Braar and their staff that much more meaningful. On behalf of the Minnesota Golf Association, congratulations to the city of Edina, the entire Braar team, every golfer who calls Braar home. This recognition is very welld deserved. Thank you. >> Thanks, John. Joe, you want to you want to say anything, Joe, and your introduce your team? This is Joe Boud, our general manager of Braar. >> Thank you for having me here tonight. Uh this is an exciting award for Braar and the city of Adina. Uh we've been doing a lot of things over the last 10 years at the golf operation and it's you know come to the the tip of the iceberg where we basically showed what uh this golf course can do and we are extremely proud of this uh award. Um it we have tonight uh Mary Waldridge, she's our assistant general manager. Tommy Kohler, he's our director of golf. And we have Jeff Mold who's our superintendent here tonight. Um and all of us are super proud of this award. And we want to share with city council because you started this whole process for us. So very appreciative of that and uh we're just very thankful that we have a a great golf operation, a great team within the city of Adina. So thank you very much. >> Very good. Let's come down and get a picture. Any up here? video. You want to queue it up? >> Do we have time? >> Yeah. >> We do have a video that we'd like to queue up just to show you a little bit about the adaptive open that we hosted in September. A young guy who lost his hat was the overall winner. This side golfer, he's a he's a national champion and lost use of his lower limbs in a ski accident. We're going to get this running right. It's worth at this milestone for our state. is a powerful reminder of what golf can and should be. It's a game where every single person feels as though they belong. This event represents a shared commitment to accessibility, equality, and opportunity. Golf is at its best when it reflects the values that we hold clubs. Community, respect, perseverance, and joy. This championship embodies all of those values and it shows that Minnesota is ready to lead by example. Go. Yes. Thanks. Thanks. Oh. Show your daughter how much you love her with this beautiful gift. It says, "To my daughter." >> Yeah. Thanks, Braar Crew. Thanks. It was great. It was and and uh we'll be back next year for for round two. Next fall 2026, we'll be hosting again. So, thanks thanks for all the great work you did there. And thank you, John, for being here this evening. All right. Um we're continuing the sports theme in a way and and the Ed Fund theme, the kids in need theme. Uh our next item on this portion of the agenda, I think we'll all find really interesting. Uh it's something that the Aden Education Fund has been working on for a while with in conjunction with some of the uh residents in our community and elsewhere. U anybody ever been to Bunnies? No. Yeah. You know, the pull tabs and everything else they do over there, that charitable gambling. Uh we're being asked to consider that in Edina. And so tonight we're going to have a little presentation by um Kathy Rendleman who is the executive director of the United Education Fund. Uh and some other folks invite you to come forward. >> Good evening. Council members, city administration, thank you for having us here. Oh, >> there. That's better. And >> now I'm on the mic, so I'll start over for you. Good evening. Um, Mayor Hlin, council members, city administration. My name is Kathy Rendleman. I appreciate you having us here. Um, what a great evening. Um and a great introduction for us being here tonight as we've talked about kindness and specifically um kindness in our city and bringing kindness to all of our city members. Specifically um we're going to talk a little bit tonight about our youth um and about small businesses and what we can do to help our small businesses and our businesses in our community in general and then also about our city and what we can do to help our city with some funding needs. Um, I think we kind of bring this all together when we bring our presentation to you tonight. Um, so you really teed it up well for us. So, thank you for doing that. Tonight, we're here to talk about what we call charitable gaming. Um, and our two groups have come together as the Adina Education Fund and the Adina Athletic Boosters to tell you more about something that we believe the city of Adina has been missing out on. So, um, we're here tonight to talk about the Adina Public Schools and something that we think that we could really benefit from. Our two groups cover all 10 Edina public school buildings. Um, as you know, the Adana Public Schools has 8,700 students. We serve 5,600 families and 1600 staff members. Between our two nonprofit organizations, we serve all of those people. Um the Edina public schools is the number two um employer in Edina and between our two organizations we cover all 10 buildings, every classroom, all clubs, all activities and every school affiliated sport between the two of us. I'm going to speak a little bit about my organization, the United Education Fund. We are um a granting organization to all schools from early learning all the way through grade 12. I work with every single student in the building and every single staff member. Our programming works with literacy, steam, and mental health and we've done a lot of work with all of you. Um, with your help, we've done a lot of huge grants between the city and um, Edana public schools. Our work with literacy and the training that we've done with your help with the ARPA grant has been outstanding. So, I thank you for your help in that work along with your mental health grant that you did with us for the last um few years ago was outstanding when we brought therapists into our building. So, I really appreciate your help and your partnership that we've done between the city and the schools on that work. We also happen to do a lot of work with our services. Um the ED fund acts as a fiscal sponsor for all of our clubs and activities that anything that touches or helps with any of our students. We also work with all of our PTOs. Um, we act as the sponsor for any of our senior scholarships and we act as the Adina Alumni Association in case we didn't have anything else to do. >> Good evening. >> Good evening, Mr. Mayor. Council members, >> thank you. My name is Kurt Lang, resident of Edina. Um, I represent the Adina Athletic Booster Club. Actually, we represent the Adina Athletic Booster Club. Um, this journey started for me about four years ago when I joined the booster club. I had twin boys that went into high school, started playing sports. I got involved, got a part of the booster club, thought I would see how well funded eina sports are. Surprisingly, not as well funded as I thought they were. Um, no slight to the city, the district. People are doing their best. Budgets are tight. Um, I was under sort of the conception I think a lot of people have that there's a lot of money in Dina athletics. The booster club supports all 34 of the MHSL teams. So, our club represents all of the high school sports teams or helps support all of the high school sports teams I should say. What I noticed right away as part of that club was that we were missing a big part of the revenue stream that the cities around us have that generally all of the other cities in the state have maybe all of them and that is the ptap revenue. We just don't have it. So, we don't have access to the kind of money to be competitive that the other cities around us have. So it became kind of my mission then to see if we couldn't get charitable gaming to be part of the DDA athletic booster club. That's where I went Bob who's got a lot of expertise in this area a lot of background in this area and that's where we partnered up with the Dina ed fund because we are also looking at this is how could we do the most good I don't think we in some ways we can be talking about very large dollars and it doesn't necessarily need to all go to sports. It seems to us it could go to all of the youth and that's why we formed this group to bring hopefully pabsina and fund all students across the board. >> Good evening. I'm Bob Mohawk. I live in the Highlands neighborhood. As Kurt said, uh over 1100 nonprofits in the state of Minnesota use charitable gaming to um drive revenue. This is just a partial list of what some of those funds can be used for. Every activity that the ED fund uses as well as the athletic boosters is covered under those charitable gaming ordinances. What a lot of people don't know is that Minnesota is the largest charitable gaming state in the country generating over $2.3 billion last year. Uh tax contributions of 193 million in 2023. uh pole tabs are represent the largest portion of that revenue that's generated with 96% of that that money. Uh as Kurt said, if we look at the cities in the metro area that don't allow pull tabs, we're a lonely little island uh in the middle of the cities there. We are the only ones uh where you can't do this. And if you dive into the the data, you learn that sports associations um are some of the largest organizations and beneficiaries of charitable gaming. Uh in fact, 10 of the top 20 organizations last year were sports associations. Um all of whom which we compete against without those dollars. Uh this is just a look at the sports organizations that we compete against. And uh it's it's coincidental that uh the Braar folks were on the agenda tonight as well because we know the Red River Kitchen loses business to bunnies as the mayor pointed out um on a lot of those uh those uh competitive nights. They go to bunnies to play pull tabs. So we have businesses losing money and effectively funding our competition. Adina has an ordinance that is restrictive that it doesn't explicitly say pull tabs are not allowed but the number of days that you can actually participate makes it un unusable and Adina Weisetta and Minnotonka were actually the three kind of last organizations to adopt this. Minnotonka adopted it an ordinance in 2024 expanding the use of charitable gaming and Weisetta also in 2024 changed And so our ask for the council is to consider um at a minimum providing an exemption to organizations that uh like the the way that we've come together as the ad fund and the boosters to support the Adina community uh as an exemption to that or to repeal and replace the ordinance that would open up charitable gaming um in the broadest sense. We have interested venues uh some of which I mentioned uh Rayar Arena. We have other uh bars and restaurants that we've spoken to that would eagerly jump in to participate. Um as you know those venues and businesses can actually generate revenue from rent that the charities pay to participate that you create new jobs by employing the people that do it. And obviously the the extra people in those venues generates even more revenue for those businesses. Um, and it's an actual opportunity for the city as a lot of people have talked about, lots of taxes are going up. The city, and we'd actually encourage it, can uh assign a 3% tax to the uh to the net proceeds from any of the charitable gaming activities. Um, and so we would encourage that. So, we think as as Kathy and Kurt said, it's a win for all stakeholders. It would obviously help generate a lot of money for our uh organizations and any other nonprofits and like the hockey association that could participate that in the city. It's potential tax revenue for the city, incremental revenue for the business and ident residents. I know everyone benefits from the great school system that we have here for property value and everything else. >> Yeah, thanks Bob. Um, ready for some questions from council members? Colleagues, any questions at this point in time? >> Um, have you as you look at these other ordinances that were recently passed both in Minnetonka and Weisetta, uh, do you have a preferred model that you'd like to see or you know, I know St. Louis Park's probably been around forever. >> Yeah, many of them have. I think the one thing that we would love is that uh in other cities have these kind of provisions which would be if if you allow charitable gaming to occur in Adina that it has to be to the benefit of nonprofit organizations whose every dollar supports the city of Adina. Um, and whether that was an open, you know, book to to all nonprofits or, you know, we like our combination because we affect every student in >> Adina. Kathy, thoughts on that on a model ordinance? Have you seen one somewhere that you like or is that a hybrid? >> No, I think that's up to the council members what they want to write. Um, but I agree that it just has to be restricted to nonprofits. Um, it it's not easy to jump in. Um, so I mean it's you have to be organized to do so and I think that um we've got our ducks in a row. That's I can tell you >> we're ready to go. >> Could you speak a little bit? I think we sort of instinctually know we saw your numbers around you know what is being raised for athletics and other communities. Speak to the needs that you're seeing from the Adina Ed fund standpoint and and even speak on behalf of maybe Adina Give and Go. Yeah, you know, I'm you know, we can act, I'm happy you brought up an organization like Edana Give and Go or Edana Band or um Edana Robotics or whatever that is. You know, we can act as a fiscal sponsor um on behalf of Edina Education Fund for any of those groups. Um when if we were to bring in extra funding um first of all, it would alleviate some pain for any of our our current donors um on on an annual basis. Okay. If we had extra funding, what could that go for? It could go to fund additional money for um you know, any of our large projects that we currently don't have funding for. It could go to student clubs. You know, what could we could we fund at the high school? Um could we give kids a small amount of money towards student clubs? Could we give um funding to any of our fiscally sponsored groups? Could we put money into the alumni association and build that out more because we currently are a grassroots organization that desperately needs funding. Could we have an alumni mentorship program that Edana High School currently doesn't have? Um, there are so many possibilities for funding. Even if we made $100,000, that would make a huge difference. $100,000 extra in one year, that would be outstanding for a group, an organization like ours. And what if we got $100,000 for the ad fund and then gave $50,000 to XYZ corp, you know, organization that we help support and spread that wealth across all of the fiscally sponsored groups that we work with. I mean, that would be incredible. I mean, even the small amount of money that we could bring in between our two organizations and, you know, that's a huge benefit for our nonprofits. >> Good question. Yeah. Council member Agnu, >> thank you. Um I'm curious if you have any data on um the income or social social situation for people in our community that play bull taps. >> We haven't seen any there isn't published data about who actually what's the um e demographics or economic basis of who actually participates in pull tabs from adina. >> Okay. Is there do you know if there's any information on that like broader in the state that we could tap into? >> We could look into that. Absolutely. >> Thank you. >> Questions member Russer and then I'll go to >> the map you showed. Um two of them really resonated with me. The one where Edina is all alone. Um and then the map that showed all of the other uh cities where you could raise money charitable gambling and the amounts that they were able to do. And I I feel like you've made you have a very compelling case and to me it seems the most logical course of action is to work on that ordinance. Um instead of carving out an exception and I'm just wondering if that I see you all nodding. Um but that's basically the only those are the only comments I have. Thank you for all the work. >> Andrew Neil, what would be the next steps? >> Thank you, your honor. Uh yes, in fact uh the staff has had some uh chance to talk uh with with Miss Allison and and Attorney Kendall. Uh we also agree uh with with the path that Council Member Risser was going down that it's much preferable to replace to to replace the ordinance than it is just to offer exemptions to it. You know, we we got to be this little island because past councils didn't support uh going with a charitable gaming atmosphere here. If this council wants to go that direction, we just want some kind of direction from you before we start putting some resources, legal and and administrative resources into putting this together. Uh it's not difficult to put it together. It can be done in a fairly short period of time, but if you want us to do that, uh we're we're happy to do it. >> Council member Jackson. >> Yes. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Well, I I guess I'm a little confused on the designation that it would be would it be if you had it for nonprofits. Could the hockey association also participate in it? Um and and is that in the ordinances that we could look at from Weisetta and Minnotonka? Yeah, if if the ordinance was changed, any nonprofit that qualifies by the Minnesota Gambling Control Board's definition that, you know, they have to be member organizations and it's a very highly regulated tool, which is part of why we partnered because >> yeah, >> we uh the athletic boosters is set up to comply. I believe the Adina Hockey Association would as well and I know Braar is interested in actually bringing it in there as well. So it wouldn't prohibit. Ideally, all of those organizations would participate and create more opportunity for Dina. >> Okay, great. Because I I appreciate that you guys are organized and ready to go and and I'm really glad you came forward with this. I just want to make sure that we can um to latecomers who say that would work well for my organization um have the opportunity if they're qualified. So, thank you very much. I think the beauty with our organization is that we do cover a ton of organizations that aren't capable of doing it themselves. >> Um, which is why we have tried to come together and be organized. So, because we represent many organizations that can't do it. >> Council member Pierce has a question for you or comment. >> Thanks, uh, Mr. Mayor. Um um earlier you talked about um different organizations that could receive funding. Um, and so I think when I the first time I looked at this, like I was thinking, well, this is hockey, football, you know, the major sports, and you had some good examples of how there are other organizations that don't have funding that this could greatly benefit as well. And so, if you could give a few of those examples, that'd be awesome. >> Sure. So the AD education fund is the fiscal sponsor for example um to the currently 110 um clubs and activities at Edon High School. Just to give you an example that includes Girls United. It's a club at Edana High. I'm just going to call that one out as an example. Doesn't mean that that's a special one. Actually I think it's really special but it's a club at Edana High School that's a bunch of girls that get together um and do wonderful things. they have no funding for them um to raise funds. They're looking at each other and pulling their pocketbooks together. Okay. Um there's also a um there's, you know, a a bad mitten team, right? The bad mitten team is by no way going to raise money like the hockey team is. There's a softball team. There's the boys swim team, which by the way has how many state titles? Um, I don't know if it's as many as hockey, but it's darn close. Okay. Um, they don't have nearly the amount of money that our hockey team or our football team does, but the athletic boosters covers them just the same. Right. So, the beauty that you have with our two groups is that I cover all the clubs and activities. They cover every single sport. So, you're getting that coverage that you don't typically have. I cover the um Cornelia first Lego robotics team. Okay, which is awesome. Wouldn't it be cool if I could give them $100 so they could buy cookies at their meetings? Come on. I >> I would add to that. I as Kurt said, the athletic boosters literally funds all the basic needs for the uh for every high school sport at the high school. and um and also funds large projects that would ordinarily come out of the school's budget. So, a $40,000 gymnastics floor or a new scoreboard in the community center. All of those things also get funded by the boosters that again touch lots of athletes. And as we all know, the need for scholarships that athletes that the families can't afford to pay the fees to the school or the participation um costs that come with sports. it's a $300 fee to play basketball at Adina um in addition to the $150 you pay to to the school. And so the the need for scholarships across all of the activities we support is continuing to grow and this incremental funding would would help all of that. >> Yeah. Good. I think that uh yeah, thanks for the presentation and um I think we'll take it up. I think is is the council want to have a separate discussion about this or you want to direct manager Neil to go ahead and start looking at a draft ordinance we can take a look at >> anything we prepare is obviously got to come back to the council a couple of times. So >> yeah, I think is people comfortable asking the staff to go ahead and start looking at a draft ordinance and >> and uh I was just thinking of as you were talking about um being this island of uh lack of charitable gambling activity and made me think of years gone by where we were the only place you could get a drink and he diner was at one of the country clubs, you know, and nobody could figure out why we didn't have a good restaurant in town. Uh so that's all been fixed over time and this maybe is its time too fix this too. So thanks for coming in with the idea. Appreciate you guys giving it this kind of thought that you have. It's important. >> Okay. All right. That completes that portion of the agenda. Uh we've got a couple of public hearing matters this evening that we're going to address and um Harry Teague has the first matter and it's um actually something that we've approved before and we need to think about what we're going to guess kind of bolster what we did before reinforce what we did before. So Director Teague, go ahead. >> Yes. Thank you, Mayor, members of council. This is a request by uh Enclave Companies. It's to replplat the old Macy's furniture store site. As the mayor mentioned, this is a project that was approved back in 2024. In Edina, subdivisions or plats need to be filed with Henipin County within one year of of city council approval. That has not occurred. So, the plat has expired. In Edina site plans are good for two years. So, the project that was approved, the site is still in good standing, but the plat has expired. So that's the action uh that the that is requested of the council is to uh approve the prelim preliminary plat for this project. There have been no changes uh to the previous plat that was approved. As you may recall the easements for the public space, those public areas, those all are dedicated when the project is built. So they're they're not shown on the platin similar to the the previous approvals, but they are required per the PUD and the TIFF agreement. So the uh the planning commission made a recommendation for approval on a unanimous vote. The condition for park dedication still stands. Uh the action tonight is actually to uh hold the public hearing, then close the public hearing at noon on November 23rd, and then continue action to your December 2nd uh city council meeting. Uh Patrick Brahma is here from Enclave Properties to answer any questions that you may have. And with that, I'll turn it back to the city council. >> Yeah. Thanks, Director Teague. Uh as I recall, they're scheduled for closing on the property with Macy's in sometime in December. >> Yes, it would be after the city council action on December 2nd. So, they are planning to move ahead with the project. So, they would close on the on the purchase of the property, file the plat, and then they have until it's middle of next summer for those to at least pull a building permit before those site plans expire. >> Okay. Mr. Brahma here. >> He's also >> Oh, there he is. May I think we should have him confirm that be important information to the council. Could you hear that question I posited to director Teague? >> Go ahead and identify yourself first. >> Good evening, mayor, members of the city council. My name is Patrick Brahma, uh 16660 South Highway, St. Louis Park with Enclave. >> And um uh the question I asked Mr. Teague was uh what you were scheduled to close with Macy's in December. I just wanted to get affirmation on that from you directly >> confirmed. Yes. December is the scheduled closing. Yes. >> This the date in specific date in December. >> December 12th at at this point in time. >> Okay. All right. Other questions for Mr. Brahma at this point in time. >> Remember >> actually I have a question for director Teague. um the sequence of and well okay I have done some additional digging into our subdivision policy as well as recommendations from the League of Minnesota cities and as I look at section 32-72 item number six it appears that um in the application all public ways within the plat whether existing at the time of the platting or being dedicated by the plat shall be dep depicted on the plat together with the name and sufficient mathematical data to locate the position and width of the public way. And I don't know if we could get the image of the site plan um projected so we could take a look at that but um the prominade the east west extension of it is not shown on the plot. also as I try to determine the ADA access um and I would I do have some questions about that. I am not sure that the um area where that ADA access is um planned to happen is on the plat as well and we do need to have that be public space uh because it is accessing it's my understanding we need that because it is accessing the prominade extension. Uh yes, it is not platted as a public street and that's the reason it's not shown on the plat. If we were to plat that as a public street for the city to maintain, we would have specific um street specifications to build a road that we could uh plow through. These will be easements established after it's constructed, not necessarily meeting city street standards. These these will be dedicated to the public for its use. However, it's the developer's responsibility, the property owner, to maintain that space. So, they're not dedicating public right of way specifically and that's why it's not shown on the plan. >> League of Minnesota cities also recommends that public areas including trails, walkways, and parks be included um when land is subdivided. And again, could we get the image of the site plan? >> Yes, I I can call that up. But again, these aren't public parks. >> If it was a public park that was to be maintained by the city, that would be shown on the plant. But again, these are public spaces that are maintained uh by the property owner. >> It may be splitting the Okay, that's good to know. Um when we talked about the prominade extension, there was a lot of dialogue about these being areas that people would be able to access. And so I think between now we do have time to look into this, but uh there was talk about people even being able to protest and the prominade u go there, be there, and so I'm I am concerned about that. I'm also concerned, you know, as you go through the proposed underpass, you are um faced with a large set of stairs um and you can see that the Grand Proomenade entry to the plaza, the ADA route. If someone could explain how that happens, that would be very helpful. And I don't know if someone could use the cursor to explain how the ADA path is going to happen. That would be fantastic. Council member Risser, thank you for the question. We are reviewing uh anything to do with the underpass is still under consideration. Um you can see here on their plans, they note the ADA route. There was always a discussion and it's still discussion if the underpass gets built that the ADA route would go this way and then get on this new trail and tie into the uh Nimal Creek Regional Trail. >> How does the ADA route lead to the Prominade extension? >> We haven't investigated that interface between their project and a potential underpass. We would of course review PROWAG for the rightaway public access agreement and the building code and see which rules would govern for this space and what would be needed based on ADA guidance. >> So just to be clear, it doesn't go there. It appears when I look at the ADA route, it looks like it's going through where there's seating um outside of the buildings and I just am confused about that. >> Yep. And that would be a building department manages the ADA access near the building. So that is a building department. They would make sure that is compliant when they build the structure and pull those permits for the project. >> Okay. On the site plan, it does say public plaza and gathering space. Uh and in language in the League of Minnesota Cities, it says public areas. So, I would like further clarification um by the time we get to the vote about why um we do not need to follow um or why these standards don't apply because it it appears there's a couple different definitions of public. Those are the only comments that I have. Thank you. >> Thanks, >> Mr. Kendall. Any observations on that? Well, mayor, I think there was a discussion on this project and and some other projects that um these were not going to be dedicated city streets on the plat. They were going to be privately owned areas that the developers would agree to execute a public easement with the city for the public to use. So, um that's a it's it's a different way to establish a public use. It's not dedication of public easements on the plat as is common. It's a more unusual approach of having the developer execute a private easement which allows them flexibility to sometimes make it different, smaller than a public street would have to be. There's standards for public streets and public sidewalks and other things that they have to be wide enough to be plowed and um other standards that apply. And this allows the developer some flexibility to deviate from those standards. So the city's not required to do this, but it's a choice that the city has made on a couple of developments. >> The property continues to be privately owned with the public easement. >> Correct. >> And hence hence the crafting of the plat the way it is. >> Right. It won't be shown on the plat because it's not a public easement in the sense that it's dedicated on the plat. It's a different animal that the developer and the city have agreed to and that it gives the city less rights to use the space, but it still gives the the public some rights um as dedicated or as specified in the easement agreement with the private property owner. >> Council member Jackson. >> So, I'm thinking of what the public would know about this piece of property. So, in a hundred years, somebody buys it um and they said, "Why do we have to maintain these streets?" What is the difference between looking at the plat to see what you know people have access to or looking at the easement? What would what would a buyer in a 100 years from now see to know that this space was dedicated to the public? >> Well, a buyer would see there'll be an easement agreement that will be recorded on the title to the property. It just won't be shown the public space won't be shown on the plat, but it will still be recorded on the title to the property. >> Okay. So it's it's perfectly findable. It just is through a different route than through the plat. >> Correct. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Other questions for Director Teague at this point in time for Mr. Brahma? All right. This is a public hearing matter. Is there anyone in the audience that wishes to uh comment regarding uh the proposed approval of this preliminary plat uh I am here to request your no vote to subdivide this parcel. This project does not capture the unique features of this site. It covers the site with hardscape and will create a heat island due to a lack of green space. Thousands of hours of staff time have been spent on this project for an investor group that has yet to purchase this property. Wouldn't it be great for residents if even half of that same amount of staff time was spent on reducing the cost of Edina government to reduce the levy? Thank you. Anyone else in the audience wish to testify regarding this matter? Hi, I'm the other half, Lori Gros. Uh, before you consider subdivision, what I would like to see, I'd like to see number one, Enclave own the property, and number two, obtain financing for their project. I don't think the taxpayers want to see another US bank site where you end up with a cleared piece of land that's a dirt field that has a blue fence around it as I refer to it as I see it as lipstick on a pig. I think that they need to get their financing first. Plus, I don't think it's the wisest for the council to be subdividing some of the large parcels that we have left. This is a prime piece of real estate. You subdivide it. In the future, if the developer can get his project built, then he can sell it off piece by piece if he wants to. If you've got a large piece of property, you're going to have more options of what you're going to see on there. But don't approve this. The guy doesn't have the money yet for it, and he doesn't have the financing. And how many years has it been at the US bank site? And you're going to pay for this proposed tunnel with tiff from the Macy's site plus the site across the street 7200 and 7250 France. That's taking away future property taxes for the next 25 years. So taxpayers, if you think you're seeing big levies now, hold on. It's going to get bigger yet because if there isn't money to pay for city operations, taxpayers are going to be paying it. Thank you. >> Thank you, Miss Coats. >> Anyone else? >> Janie Weston again. Um, just a quick comment regarding the ADA accessibility. if the tunnel does happen and if the project does move forward. Um since this would be um not city land where the ADA route uh that was just pointed out with the cursor on the map put up on the screen here. Um, can the city have a requirement written into some legal document requiring that in the middle of the winter when snow removal needs to happen um if that's on the private property of the owner um somehow can that be guaranteed that snow is cleared and done properly for full accessibility for someone say in a wheelchair. Um if that snow just sits there, they're not going anywhere. So, thank you. >> Anyone else? Do >> we have anybody online that wishes to testify? Okay. All right. Um I'll go to the audience one more time before we deal with this matter. All right. So, the recommendation from staff on this matter is that we um close the public uh hearing at noon on November 23rd and continue the action to the December 2nd city council meeting. That lets uh people continue to offer up some thoughts that may be important for the council to consider at the December 2nd meeting. Is there a motion to close the public hearing at noon uh on November 23rd in this matter and continue it to action on December 2nd? >> So moved. >> Second. >> Member Jackson moves. Member Pier seconds the uh motion to close the public hearing at noon on November 23rd and continue the action to the December 2nd city council meeting regarding this proposed uh subdivision at 7235 France Avenue and the reissuance of the plant. Any further discussion? All those in favor of adoption of the motion as stated say I. >> I opposed carried. Motion's adopted and approved and um and we will take this matter up on December 2nd. Thank you Mr. Rama for being here. And then we have one other public hearing matter. Uh this is something that we see from time to time and u our finance director Ptow has this matter and we've got a few presenters here as well. >> Good evening again, mayor and council member. Um, tonight we have in front of you a request to open and hold a public hearing for the purpose of host appro approval for revenue bond issuance by the city of Oakdale to finance uh to refinance and approve oak metals in Oakdale, Minnesota, as well as fund deferred maintenance and upgrades at York Gardens in Edina. Uh the total bond that the city of Oakdale will be taking for this matter is up to 25 million. 14 million of this will be allocated to York Gardens. Um and again the city of Oakdale will be the issuer of this. Um it's required by Minnesota state law that as the project of York is in the city of Edina, the host city has to give host approval. Therefore, we are here tonight for you to host a uh public hearing and then uh to ultimately approve uh give host approval for this matter. And like you stated tonight, I also have with me Jenny Bolton from Katak Rock, the legal council for the city of Oakdale. She's here and available for any questions as you may have. And I think we also have Todd Willlette, the chief financial officer from Ebenezer Society, who City of Oakdale is taking the U bond out for in the audience. >> Sure. Yeah. Thanks for that. Any questions for our finance director at this point in time? I'm going to bring uh Miss uh Miss Bolton up here from Coutac Rock. Mr. Willlet, you could come up too. I think I think it'll be helpful for for you to explain. >> It's a it's a bit of a curiosity for those of us that haven't been through this before and this council has, but nonetheless, I think for the people in the audience and that may be watching, it's good to kind of walk through what you're what what are you doing here when this is primarily going on over in Oakdale and you're the city attorney in Oakdale and you're the chief financial officer for uh for Ebenezer. So, okay, go ahead. >> Good evening, mayor and council members. I'm Jenny Bolton from QEC Rock. Uh we are bond council for the city of Oakdale which is the proposed issuer for the financing for this uh project. Uh the project consists of two facilities. One is in Oakdale and one is in Edina. Um and uh it is efficient for the borrower to combine the financing for both of those projects. Um and ultimately it's under an umbrella that will allow for other um Ebenezer Society projects to be combined under um the same financing structure. Tax exempt bonds are um a a program that is offered through the the federal tax law that allows um borrowers to borrow at a lower in lower interest cost because investors don't pay income taxes on those taxexempt bonds. Um and that um specific mechanism for financing is available only to certain entities including governmental entities for governmental purpose bonds and for nonprofit entities um like Ebenezer Society. They are a 50 501c3 organization charitable organization. Uh so it's a limited uh availability tool and um there are certain procedures that are required under federal tax law in order to use that tool. you need a uh local government or a government entity to issue the bonds. And when that the the project is located outside of the jurisdiction of that um government entity, then the jurisdiction of uh the location of the project also needs to approve the financing and that is what you're being asked to consider tonight. Um and in order to um go through the approval process, it requires a public hearing. Um and so um that is uh part of what's being asked tonight as well. Hi, M. Bolton. Thank you for that. And just to follow up, uh, this is an issuance from the city of Oakdale, >> correct? >> And, uh, there's no risk to the city of Adina or its taxpayers. >> That's correct. >> And no credit rating impact for the city of Adina. >> That's also correct. Yes. >> Okay. All right. Uh, questions for Miss Bolton. Mr. Willlet, anything you want to add? We see you. I mean, we haven't seen you for a while, I don't think, but uh Evan Ezer has done some good work in Edina and we appreciate your investment in Edina. >> Yeah, thanks Mr. Mayor. Um, yeah, I don't have a lot more to say on the technicalities, but thanks for having us and as you know, we have uh been at this location for 15 plus years. Our corporate headquarters, we moved in 2020 over uh into our new corporate headquarters in Edina. We moved from Minneapolis here. We've enjoyed it. We've worked well with the city. So, um I can field any questions if you have them, but >> yeah. What do you plan to do over on York >> at the facility? >> So, refinancing. So, it's taking out, you know, we had uh issued uh a bank issuance right now that needs to be refinanced, but we are investing in an an additional million dollars um taking out at this location to do some property improvements, you know, wall, you know, walls, paint, flooring, different things that just cosmetic stuff that, you know, the building's 15 years old now, so needing to do to keep uh current with the current uh folks that want to live in in that building. >> Okay, good. Any questions for Miss Bolton or Mr. vote at this point in time or ptow. Yeah. Okay. Stand by folks. I'm going to open this up for public testimony. This is something we're going to try to deal with this evening. Is there anyone in the audience who wishes to testify regarding this matter? >> Okay. Seeing no one coming forward. Do we have anybody online? >> I do not have anyone online, but because there is a a brief delay in the broadcast, I would recommend we wait about a minute before moving on. My clock shows that it's 8:46. I'll come back to you at 8:47 or when I have a caller, whichever's first. >> Right. Thank you. It is now 8:47 and I still don't have a caller, so I think it's safe for you to move forward with the agenda. >> All right. Thanks, Director Benerdon. Uh the motion that's been uh suggested by staff is that we move to approve the resolution 2025-103 which would authorize the issuance of revenue bonds by the city of Oakdale, Minnesota for the benefit of Ebenezer York Assisted Living LLC. Is there a motion to that effect? >> I think we need to close the public hearing first. >> We That's a good thought. Yeah, thank you for that. All right. Uh we're gonna Yeah, that's exactly right. Um, you think I would have remembered that by now? All right. Um, so we've uh we've got nobody testifying uh that wants to testify online. We've had testimony in public chambers here. Is there a motion to close the public hearing in this matter? >> So moved. >> A second. >> We got a motion and second. Motion by member Jackson, second by uh member Agnu to close the public hearing in this matter. Any further discussion? All those in favor of closing the public hearing in this matter say I. I. >> I. Opposed. Carried. Thanks for that. >> Uh, and then we've got the motion itself, uh, the motion to approve resolution 2025-103 authorizing the issuance of revenue bonds by the city of Oakdale, Minnesota for the benefit of Ebenezer York Assisted Living LLC. Is there a motion to that effect? >> So moved. >> Second. Uh, member Pierce moves, member Jackson seconds the adoption of the motion as stated, which would be adopting resolution 2025-103, which would authorize the issuance of revenue bonds by the city of Oakdale, Minnesota for the benefit of Ebenez or York Assisted Living LLC. Any further discussion? All those in favor of adoption of the motion of stated say I. >> I. >> I. Opposed, carried. The motion's approved and adopted. All right. Thank you. That concludes the public hearing. Yeah. Thanks for being here this evening. And that concludes the public hearing portion of the agenda this evening. We're going to move on now to reports and recommendations. And the first matter we have there is uh comes every meeting. I think we've got all these generous uh people and and uh entities in Edina that want to donate to the city of Edina. We've got to approve those donations and we have to do it by supermajority uh based on state law. And so resolution 2025-11 uh would accept donations on behalf of the city of Vidina from a variety of sources. Is there a motion to adopt resolution 2025-11? >> So moved. I second. >> Jackson moves. Member Ragnu seconds the adoption of resolution 2025-11 which would accept donations on behalf of the city of Adina. Any further discussion? All those in favor of adoption of resolution 2025-11 say I. >> I. >> I. Opposed. Carried. Resolution 2025-111 accepting donations on behalf of the city of Edina is adopted and approved. And uh this reporting period we have uh several donations to the Adina Arts Center uh Mrs. John Ferrell, Janet Stevens, Michael Thomas, Priscilla Barat, John and Carol and Clay all uh with respect to a memorial for Monica Sullivan. So thank you all those generous donors. their names will be posted on the city website uh for people to see. We really are appreciative of your contributions in memory of Monica Sullivan. Um next we are going to go to um a sketch plan review. And for those of you in the audience um that don't know what that means, uh we've got companies that come in that think about doing a particular kind of land use project in the city of Vina and instead of going through the effort of filing for preliminary approval and spending a bunch of money and coming in front of the planning commission and city council and finding out it wasn't such a good idea after all, they can come to us for sketch plan review in advance and and get our feedback and then they can go back and decide whether they want to come forward at some subsequent time with an application for approval. So, tonight we have uh a sketch plan review over off 169 in Bren Road, which is uh uh the Lincoln Drive area, and there's a proposal from a convenience store operator uh called Quick Trips. We've all probably stopped at a quick trips in some particular town or in the metro and they're thinking about the potential location at uh that 169 and Bren Road location generally and I'll turn it down to director Teague to uh set the stage for this conversation. >> Yes. Thank you, mayor, members of council. Uh so this is in an area where you recall that we just completed a small area plan, the Lincoln and Londereerry uh small area plan. The proposal here tonight is to tear down the existing office building on that site. It's about 22,000 ft² and then build this 9,000 square foot quickrip store. There would be 10 fueling stations. There would be no car wash and they would like to be open 24 hours. Access would be utilized off there's an existing uh access off Lincoln. It's a shared driveway with the property owner to the north sidewalk along Lincoln and London. and there's a patio space kind of on the west side of the lot. There's a number of variances that would be required as part of a formal application. Those have been listed in the staff report. And as with all of our formal applications, a parking study and traffic study would need to be done um to be included in that formal request. Um in addition to the variances, a reszoning would be required to PCD4. that's that would allow uh the use on the site. Um as I mentioned, this is uh in in that small area plan uh district and the land use descriptions for that small area plan uh reads in general small to moderate scale commercial residential or mixeduse buildings serving primarily the adjacent neighborhoods. That was the main issue that the planning commission had in their review as they believe this is more uh regionally focused with traffic off of 169. So they would they they um talked about uh either eliminating the gas pumps just having the convenience store significantly reducing the number of pumps. Uh so with that I will introduce Dean George of Quickrip and he is going to walk you through the project and um talk a little bit about Quick Trip. >> All right Mr. George welcome. >> Thank you Mr. Mayor. So as Carrie said I am here on behalf of QuickRip. Um, we are proposing or feeling out ideas for putting up a what are we call a generation 3 convenience store which is our newest convenience store in our fleet. It's 9100 ft and we are hoping to accommodate 20 vehicles at a time with our 10 fueling stations. Um, a little bit about us. Have you guys seen this presentation? Did you guys take a look at the planning minutes? So, I don't need to redo this entire thing. We can skip right to the site plan, I suppose. So, this is the site plan. Um, main access off Lincoln Drive shared with the existing office building to the north. Pumps would be orientated facing the north, stores facing the north, one entrance in and out. Um, two drive separated by those squiggly lines you see there are our storm water pond. So, we do ponding on site and the hashed area is our buried underground storage tank. So, where our gas gets dumped. So, delivery loading zone is on the east side of the building, parking on the west side of the building, dumpster enclosure to the rear. One of the major selling points, uh, excuse me, not selling points, comment points that the planning commission had was maybe we can flip the orientation of the building to get the loading zone on the other side, get the parking on the east side towards the residence and maybe put some patio space and some bike racks on that side, create a little more green space, a little more kind of welcoming neighborhood feel on that portion. We would love your feedback. Um, I think big goal for this site. I wouldn't put this um here just because 169 is there. That was kind of the feedback we got from the planning commission. This prototype, this size, this number of fueling stations goes into a lot of locations where there's a lot less traffic. This is kind of our standard build, our standard footprint site. Primary reason why there's so many gas pumps is most of the time during AM PM peak hours. So, AM drive, PM drive. You guys are probably all guilty of it. I'm guilty of it as well. You gas up, you leave your car at the pump for a good four or five minutes, run inside, come back out and grab it. So, there is a lot of congestion on site under the fueling islands if you are leaving your car there. We do understand it is a primary place that people do park. So, that's that's one of the main reasons why we have so much fueling space. It did come up, can we downsize it? We would look into downsizing it if that's the direction you guys urge us to go. But, as you said, Mr. Mayor feedback here is critical. We've only had this site under contract for a little over 6 weeks. Um Carrie urged us to get a concept plan together for if you guys would be supportive in general of this concept in this location, which is why we're here. We haven't spent a lot of due diligence on what we need to do to get this buildable. We don't know what the specific variances required would be. Um so we would love to hear from your thoughts and feelings. I can answer any questions you guys might have about us as a company, about this site specifically. Uh we can keep this open if you guys want. >> Does that cursor work on the computer? So you can Yeah. Good. Why don't you Why don't you walk us through you're let's say you're coming north on 169 and and you get off >> on London Derry. How do you get into the station and where how do you get to the pump? So just kind of walk us through what you'd do if you were a consumer. >> So you're sitting on the offramp right here on London Dairy. Um you make a right, you come to a probably a three-way four-way stop here. You make a left up Lincoln Drive. You get to your drive access here. Most people are going to enter into this first driveway, pull right into the pumps, and then they're going to circulate either to the store if they're not getting gas or they're they're going to fuel up and they're going to circulate out this way, or they're going to depending on which pump they use, they're probably going to do this maneuver to get back to the exit. >> Okay. Um, did anybody at the planning commission talk to you about the fact that if you if you came out of the facility and turned left, you'd be going up into a neighborhood that could take you north and out back out at 169 later on and that uh there might be some consideration about a that kind of traffic potentially going up into that neighborhood. >> Uh, that wasn't a comment, but we can certainly see that that concern. We can probably hopefully mitigate that with on-site signage saying 169 back to the right. We've done that at other locations to help flow traffic back to where they came from. >> Okay. Um, another concern that I saw in some emails was you're open 24 hours. Um, talk talk to us a little bit about the lighting and and the the potential splash effect, I'll call it, into the into the neighborhood that's to the east. So, as part of our full civil design, which we may or may or may not move forward with depending on feedback and what we can live with, um you'll get a full phototric plan. In that full phototric plan, it will highlight that all of our exterior lighting is downcast and LED so as to mitigate all off-site impacts. Um you'll also have about onetenth of a foot candle at the property line, which really shows that there's not a whole lot of light pollution offsite. >> Okay, let me go to my colleagues and see if someone wants to start out. member Egno, you want to >> Sure. Thank you. Uh, thank you so much for coming in tonight. I'm going to start out with one question and I don't know if this is directed to you or maybe um city staff, but uh I think for other sites we that have been um gas stations previously, we've had to do additional mitigation to that site. Can So can you speak to if 20, 30 years down those the road this site were no longer a gas station, is there any kind of remediation to the site for cleanup or anything that would need to be done for it to be repurposed >> after the the use has been on the site? Yeah. So, you're right. Um, we think of the the Keys uh site over on Vernon. There was some pollution from the tanks from that gas station that had to be remediated. So, if the use changes hands, yes, before any other use would go on to the site. There would have to be studies done to make sure there's no pollution and if there is, they would have to clean it up. And before title transfers, we are responsible for pulling the tanks out of the ground, which is probably is a big So before that happens, we have to get a all clear from the MPCA that those tanks have been removed. Um, a little bit about the tank drop, those tank drop holes are dug and they're double lined with concrete as as mandated by the MPCA. Um, there is spill alarm and overfill alarm and it's also vapor mitigation. So, we do our best um in this day and age to comply with every MPCA standard and then ongoing maintenance is a requirement of the EPA. So, it's a pretty heavily regulated industry at this particular point in time. >> Okay. Thank you. And I think that it was a it was a discussion point um at the planning commission about whether or not you were going to have any electric charging sites there. Did you go back and consider that or would that be a future consideration? >> So, it's a future consideration, but we can certainly plan for it on the next iteration of the site plan design if we should move forward with it. Um we have a lot of of sites in our fleet now that are being our EV rollout. Um so, it's something that we are doing um in a relatively small scale. I'm not going to say every site's going to have one. We're doing it kind of strategically where it makes sense. If it's something this community wants, we can get added to the plan. >> Okay. Um so I'll just say I'll give feedback as well um as we're going through this. Um overall, I don't think that what this site needs is such a large scale gas station. Um, I don't like the fact necessarily that it's 24 hours and thinking about the the continual cycle of traffic that we would experience there. Um, but at the same time, I really appreciate your desire to invest into the community and invest into this site in particular. And so I've just been noodling on really since that conversation with the planning commission whether this could be a really fun opportunity for quick trip to think about the like convenience store and gas station of the future. Um more leaning towards electric charging. So, what if this were a completely electric charging station, much smaller footprint, still get that convenience store factor to it, um, but create more of that community connection because I I think that that was a lot of the concern, too. It was pretty large. It wasn't as walkable, um, right off the highway, but then think about, and I know that you were talking about doing this already, but a lot of community engagement to understand what is it that they want. I know we had talked about in the small area plan potentially something like a grocery store. I know people like the idea of some of the graband-go components. Um and so there could be a really unique way for Quick Trip to kind of lead the way into what electric charging stations of the future could look like. Um and I know that that's something that I personally would have more of an appetite to invest in. Um, but just kind of your typical quick trip and convenience store isn't something that I I see being on this site. Um, but I I could look at some other kind of creative modern, you know, thinking of just like reinvisioning what a quick trip looks like for kind of eco-friendly electric focus. Um, so that's my that's my thought. >> Thank you, >> Member Pierce. Uh, thanks Mr. Mayor. I probably won't be as encouraging as my colleague. Um I just wasn't excited about it. Um so I I'm not sure it's the right fit um for the area. And what I really have to force myself to do, it would be great to have another business there, another um property owner, more taxes, right? More uh services for the community. All that would be great. Um, but I don't think I would would weigh some of the the variances that you would need. Um, and then when I look at the community priorities from the small area plan, this doesn't quite fit. Um, and so I don't think I would would be in favor of it. Um, and I I really would just encourage you if you're interested in in being there and and being a business owner, maybe talking to the neighbors and figure out what might be a good fit for that area. Um, I'm I don't have any suggestions to give you. Um, so that's what I meant by I'm probably not going to be as encouraging, but I appreciate you coming in. >> Thank you. Member Jackson. >> Yes. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So, um, we got a an email from the neighbor to the north, the realators association, and they're very worried about the traffic on the driveway. So, that is a a very real impediment that you might be facing um having this as a gas station. So, I just wanted to alert you to that. >> Uh, going forward, >> I have to say I really like the idea of this being a 21st century fueling uh thing. That's That's exciting. This is a food desert. This is my neighborhood and there is like nothing to go pick up. And I went over I went down 212 to Quick Trip. They've got bread. They've got bananas. They've got onions. They've got milk and ice cream. Frozen pizza. It's a graband-go grocery store with a with fueling. And we don't have any lots that are big enough for a grocery store. But if this is going to be the this will be the most retail part of the whole London Dair area and if we were expecting people to uh build homes or to build offices going to the north, this is the lights are going out. Um this to me is something that would make that a very usable area and and I am concerned about it being a grocery desert. So I I'm glad that you've come forward. Uh, we've talked about the small area plan and they did it at length at the planning commission and the small area plan says a convenience store with housing over it. Well, I've only seen that in the very most dense parts of Los Angeles and Chicago and New York. So, when they say, "What is a small area plan?" say, "Well, they're looking at something super urban." So, I think what you've got in terms of a convenience store is much more what the neighborhood could handle. I am worried about the 24 hours. Um, we there's I don't know what the sign the sign that I saw down is it Chanhassen where you're one is on 212. Um, it was small and modest. It was not high. It wasn't visible from the road really almost. It was it was just off the ground. What kind of a sign would you have there? >> So, we're still looking into the sign ordinance to figure out what is allowable in the PCD4 zoning. Um, the Chanhasson location you're referencing has what we're calling a a ground monument sign, which is probably only 8 ft in height. It's got a rotating messenger board. It's got a brick base on it. Traffic's alerted to that site by DOT billboard signage. So, you kind of drive up 212, you hit, you know, quick trip a half mile up. That's that's how that site is generally serviced by signage. >> Um, we would probably undergo a sign study here if we're moving forward to figure out how high is high enough to be visible from 169. And if the answer is you just can't be seen before you have to get off the exit, um, maybe that's all we rely on is DOT signage plus a ground monument sign. But for now, I think the maximum allowable in the PCD4 is maybe 15 feet and we're proposing it on the very west property line right here. Um, but if you if that can't be seen from either side before you get off the from uh 169, there's probably not a lot of value in that sign. So, we're still exploring signage. >> Okay. So, the sign could be the element that makes it either neighborhood facing or outward facing. So, consider that. Um I this is right on a bike a regional bike trail that's heavily used. So um I envision this as a place where bikers would stop get a Gatorade or something to drink. So I would want to make it very accessible from the sidewalk and from the bike trail. So and it's this this funny piece of land with its dips and hills and everything. But I would want to be very aware of the fact that lots of bikers go through there. Um that will be if there's a place for refueling. There really isn't anything on the trail for a long time till you get up to Hopkins. Um so think about, you know, incorporating that into your design and lots of bike racks. I also see this as a place where neighborhood kids can go have an outing, right? And they go out and when I was little, that was a big right of passage. You walked to the Quick Trip and got a candy bar and that was your big then. So there are lots of kids in our neighborhood and so you'd want to make it very very safe for bikers and small ch small children but kids who are independent to be able to get there safely on foot or on their bikes. Um so thinking about if you want to incorporate incorporate that into the neighborhood there would is a need in that spot for that type of accessibility. Um let's see. Uh, I will just warn you, the neighbors don't want any change. So, when you're talking to the neighborhood, the no reasonzoning signs were in earnest. They didn't want to reszone it at all. Um, so it's always any kind of change, there will be resistance. Um, with that though, I think if we do want to see this area, um, develop and change, having some groceries and some, you know, to- go food. Uh, I was really impressed with the variety at your store and I think that would be a benefit for the neighborhood. >> Council member Jackson, thank you for that commentary. That's fantastic feedback. I really appreciate it. >> Okay. Thanks, >> Council Member Richer. Um the one well there's a couple comments that I have but that mound along Lincoln Drive you know how the ground sort of comes up and you've got all those trees really does function as a buffer and if there's any way that can be maintained I think that would be really great and I don't know if I'm asking the impossible but you know it's it is something and with the last proposal that was something that really stuck in my mind. >> I don't think that's the impossible. I think flipping the orientation of the site to get the loading on the other side >> allows you to slide the site a little farther to the west and hopefully maintain. So, there's a big grain ch a big grade change there, which is probably one of the biggest factors. Um, if you slide the site as far to the west as you're able to, there probably is an ability to preserve some of those trees, >> right? And the mount because it just it is a kind of a barrier and it is appreciated. Um, I've been looking online at your restaurants and um, there's one, the Hearty Platter Cafe that is at the Quick Trip in Banduel, Wisconsin, build as the secret diner. And so I'm wondering how many more restaurants because I it is a thing now. And you know, I'm thinking that could be another benefit if you, you know, secret diner. >> The the secret diners, the restaurants are no longer our model. Most of the Hardy platter cafes were installed in inside of our larger truck stops off most interstates to provide truckers a place to sit down and eat while they were waiting out their their mandated stop time. So that that's why those are in. Okay. >> We don't install them on any of our small prototype stores. Um, we probably don't even build them in our large format truck stores anymore. So, it's a much older concept. >> So, no hardy platter. >> I don't think so. No. >> Oh, shoot. Okay. Uh, that was my other, you know, idea. So, um, that's all I've got. >> Well, thanks for being here. I I don't think we knew where you were from. You don't have to tell us your specific address, but >> uh I live on the east side of Adina is my my home address. So, quick trip out of Lacrosse, Wisconsin. They have me out in this metro market. >> This is your territory. >> Well, I've only been employed at Quaker for 9 years. I lived in Adana for 11. So, when I started, it's been my mission to get a store in this community >> so I can stop driving to Shannon for my gasoline. >> Yeah. >> I will also mention that I uh we did a grand opening ribbon cutting ceremony at two new stores in Morehead. So, best luck to the boys on Friday night. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Go Hornets. Um that's an interesting way to start this conversation. Um, so, uh, could you talk a little bit more about the retail aspects of it? I was kind of intrigued by member Jackson's comments because I think we've all stopped at Quick Trips, uh, stopped frequently at the one in in St. Peter on the way down to Sou Falls to see a daughter. And so, that's a pretty good size store. >> So, you have like you have your own bakery in there or you do some cooking or what what else do you have besides groceries? I >> We have fulls size kitchen in every store. We also have commissary operations, bakery operations, dairy operations down at our support center in Lacrosse. So we have a 60 acre 60 acre campus in Lacrosse where we we prepare all of our fresh baked goods, all of our dairy comes, we process it all ourselves. Um there's a full-size kitchen, so all your prepared food gets made in the back. All of our fried chicken is breaded back there, fried back there. All of our pizzas cooked back there, burgers, chicken sandwiches, everything, you name it, it's it's prepared in the back of the store fresh every day. So there's not a whole lot of fresh flash frozen product. That's not to say that everything's fresh, but we we really do have have evolved into the fresh food graband go space. That's really kind of what the industry has morphed into over the past 30 years. Our hot food our hot food program was rolled out in 2001 and it's really expanded in the last 6 or eight years. Um evolving from, you know, just candy bars and chips to stuff you can eat at all hours of the day. So, it's a priority for us to have f hot prepared food ready at all times for our guests. >> All right. It's a pretty impressive operation down on lacrosse kind of the the dairy production and the bakery production. It's it's state-of-the-art down there. >> Okay. All right. I mean, the reason I asked the question as a followup to remember Jackson uh whose neighborhood this is my my first instinct was that this was a potentially good use for this site. It's a tired old office building. We looked at housing over there. Uh folks didn't like that idea. We went to the small area plan, but still the location here for something like what you're offering is is pretty intriguing. I thought member Agny was on to something that was really important here and that is that in addition to uh petroleum products. I mean you're not going to get away from uh dispensing fuel. It's just the reality of our our time. But there are some convenience stores that are putting in level three chargers uh one or two of them next in a in a in a strategic location next to the buildings. And then you you're capturing customers that way too because I stop at one in Alexandria at a Circle K and they got me for like 20 minutes, you know. So instead of 10 minutes to gas up your car and go to the bathroom and get out of there, I I got to go roam around in the store and and figure out what to do or read the paper or something while you you charge. So, I I think you need to be thinking pretty hard about some, you know, some level three charging in in conjunction with uh the the petroleum pumps that you're going to be having there or you would have if it was approved. There's uh as member PICE points out, there's quite a few variances to deal with. Um we'd have to address them as they come along. But from a from a sort of fundamental standpoint, the only thing I I think we'll we could solve the lighting issue. The 24-hour a day issue doesn't affect me because the the lighting I don't think it'll push traffic into the neighborhood, but I would be cautious about especially daytime traffic getting pushed into the neighborhood to the east with a lefthand turn out of there. And I I got to think about that a little bit. and uh your idea was at least one uh way to potentially deal with part of it, but um uh overall I thought I thought it was it was worth a further look, a harder look. So that's where I am. >> Well, I appreciate all the comments. We'll um we'll make some slight design tweaks to this particular sketch plan and we'll get it back in front of What are next steps? Do you vision Carrie? The next steps would be a formal application uh for reszoning all the variances and the site plan review. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> All right. Thank you, Mr. Mr. George. >> Thank you very much. >> Appreciate you being here. >> All right. We've got a couple of matters remaining on the agenda. one. Many of our friends and neighbors are here to talk about um we're going to kind of walk through this and oh, there were quite a few people interested in the quick trips, I guess. Wow. Yeah, that's good. They're interested. Um, so this whole conversation around gun violence started as a result of what happened on August 27th, 2025. And I'm going to I'm going to talk a little bit about how we got to where we are and I'm going to turn it over to manager Neil and then we're going to turn it to our city attorney that we asked to do some work and I thought a month or six weeks ago member Agnu really framed it up well when we had our conversation and then we thought about looking at three different issues and we'll talk about that in a minute. So, I think we were all, I guess, shattered is a good word by what happened at Annunciation on August 27th and our our council passed a resolution after giving us some thought because we know there are people on both sides of this issue. Um, people that are ardent Second Amendment defenders, um, people that are concerned about gun violence and gun violence is the number one killer of kids in our country now. um wondering why in other countries they got mental illness too, but people aren't getting killed the way they're getting killed here with uh automatic weapons. And so this council had a good conversation about it and we tried to think about what are the things that we were hearing people on both sides of the issue were concerned about and and of course if you're you know not this isn't a blanket sort of statement but we we heard that uh it's it's it's a mental illness issue and so we tried to address that in in the proclamation that the resolution that we passed uh and I think it would be probably in the proclamation we'd send to the legislature that we tried to deal with addressing some of these issues from a mental health standpoint, but then we also talked about dealing from a from a weaponry standpoint uh in our resolution. So, we talked about, you know, the uh the military style automatic weapon, um the ghost guns, the 3D printed guns, the high capacity magazines. some of the things that we thought were important to think about in terms of prohibiting the sale and possession of those assault weapons and high-capacity magazines. And and and this conversation took place uh in the in in the face of understanding that the law wasn't really on our side, you know. I mean, the law is city regulations of firearms, ammunition, or components are expressly prohibited under state law. We understand that, but it still beg the question uh of of a conversation because this isn't the only this isn't the only law that in our history of our country that probably needed to be addressed and probably needed to be changed. I mean look in what was it 1917 women couldn't vote until 1914 17 think maybe they could vote 1919 they could finally vote somewhere in that era. I think my mother was born into a time when she couldn't vote. Um, separate but equal, segregation laws, interracial marriage, gay marriage. You know, a lot of things have changed now from a legal standpoint. So, we we found ourselves talking about that and and member came up with this based on our conversation thought, well, let's approach this from three standpoints. Let's look at a potential ordinance uh that might deal with this similar to what St. Paul was working on at the time and we knew that it was contingent in nature. Uh and we were I think thinking the same thing and I should have been a little bit more articulate myself understanding that uh we weren't going to pass anything that our police department couldn't legally enforce or that was something that would make their conduct illegal. So when you think about the state law banning cities from prohibiting cities from uh regulating firearms or ammunition, we had that in the back of our head. Personally, I didn't articulate that as well as I should have. So uh we nonetheless asked our city attorney to take a look at what was possible from an ordinance standpoint and we talked about some safe storage issues that we thought might be helpful. And then we talked about um um a proclamation or a resolution or proclamation that we would send to the legislature and then go over there with people that were like-minded to try to help any way we could uh was at least a thought I think that all of us had uh because it's going to take some lifting over there. And then I can tell you that as mayors have had this conversation uh in the region um and I think it came from Governor Walls was uh because there are folks on both sides of this issue. Uh maybe it's it's it's an issue that's that should be appropriately handled by constitutional amendment. Let people vote. Let let everybody in our state vote on this and decide whether or not some of these automatic weapons ought to be banned. So, with that backgrounding of looking at those three things, what what what could we do? What would a what would a a gun safety ordinance look like? Uh, and what could a resolution look like? Uh, we asked our city attorney to take a look at it. I'm going to turn it over now to Manager Neil and then we're going to have Dave Kendall, our city attorney, tell us what his view of the world is from a legal standpoint and what some of the issues are that we need to be thinking about. Manager Neil. >> Thank you, your honor. Members of council, uh yes, just a quick uh background look. Uh at our October 22nd meeting, there was a discussion of the council on this on this particular issue. You asked us to draft an ordinance um kind of modeled after the St. Paul ordinance and so I gave that direction to Mr. Kendall and he has worked on that and he has produced the uh the ordinance that's in front of you tonight that was in the packet tonight. Um, unfortunately, uh, we're at a at a at a position where we can offer this resolution or excuse me, offer this ordinance to you, but we can't endorse it, uh, because of the, uh, uninforcable nature that in our in our belief, uh, of the ordinance, uh, particularly, uh, because it is preempted by state statute. Um, so I wanted to tell you that we're concerned about it from a staff standpoint. Uh we talked a little bit about uh putting our police in the right uh in the right positions uh always and and we have some some concerns about the position this might put our police in to enforce an ordinance like this one. So I have asked uh the city attorney uh Mr. Kendall to uh go into a little bit more detail about about his concerns and and we're happy to answer questions from the council. >> Thank you. Manager Neil. >> Mayor, I have uh drafted this ordinance per your instructions. Uh it's based off the St. Paul ordinance. Um there is a variation in terms of the effective date. Um the St. Paul ordinance basically says that it'll be effective if and when state preeemption is repealed. There's a number of different state statutes that potentially implicate preeemption. And so there's an argument that maybe that language is not could it could be vague is not clear enough. Um the effective date in this ordinance that I've crafted for Edina basically says that it'll be effective only if the city issues a resolution certifying that preeemption has been lifted and at that point it will be effective. So that should eliminate the the vagueness issue. It should be clear to everyone in the city when the ordinance will be enforced and that will be only after the city council issues a resolution certifying that. U so by that I've tried to craft it in such a way that uh I hope it would withstand legal challenge. Um but it should be I think clear acknowledged that uh it would not be enforced until that time. So, I wouldn't want it to provide, you know, any kind of false sense of security or misleading uh aspect to the public that this would be enforced immediately because uh it would not be. And that the reason for that is not to put the police into a position of trying to enforce a a law that an ordinance that's preempted by state statute. you know, if they were required to do that, I mean, potentially you'd be they'd be exposed to liability for wrongful arrest, wrongful search and seizure, uh, false imprisonment, you know, things like that, confiscation of property illegally. Uh, so unless and until state law is changed on that point, I I don't think the council is in a good position to direct the police to enforce an ordinance that would require them to do those things. So that's the reason for the effective date. Um I hope that effective date would make it um able to withstand legal challenge. So if the council should choose to go forward and pass it, I'd be happy to defend it on that basis. I think it is defensible on that basis. Um so uh you know, as your attorney, I cannot recommend that you pass an ordinance that is expressly preempted by state statute. But should you choose to do so, I'd be happy to defend it and I hope it would be defensible. >> All right. Thank you. Questions from council members for Neil or David Kendall thoughts. Member Agnu. >> Thank you. And thank you for preparing this. Um, I think my first question and you you kind of already spoke to it, but this this does more or less I know that there's a little bit of a differentiation in the effectiveness, but this more or less mirrors what St. Paul is doing. Is that correct? >> That is correct. >> Okay. And I think that they just voted was it last week recently to approve theirs. So, this is something that has already kind of been adopted by another city in in Minnesota. >> St. Paul did adopt it and then um they were subject to a lawsuit immediately after that. >> Okay. Do you know the state of that >> the lawsuit? >> Yeah. >> I don't I the answer from St. Paul is not due yet and I don't know um I don't think anything has happened since it's been filed. >> Okay. Thank you. Um I do I do think one there's a lot of conversation that we can have on that in and of itself of whether um just kind of where our comfort lies. I know I I think based on the way that you've prepared this and the fact that there is the effective date um and looking at what St. Paul is doing like this is still something that I am supportive of. Um and I think I would just look for some of that future collaboration of like if we're potentially partnering with St. Paul um to to continue pushing this forward. And I also think it's worth us dis discussing whether we pull out the safe storage into a separate ordinance so that we can feel very very confident that we can improve something today that goes into effect us whatever it is 30 days or whenever we usually have things go into effect because I do believe that is not something that's preempted and that's action that we could take immediately. Um so that is something I want us to talk about um as a city and then I think we should also talk about what does it mean to continue taking things forward. Um I think for me like joining forces with St. Paul and saying that this is important to us and and putting an ordinance in place is a part of that journey. Um but there's more that needs to happen at the state level as well. And so it's just let's talk together about how we want to continue championing that. >> Thank you, member. Yes, Council Member Pierce. >> Uh thanks, Mr. Mayor. I um I so I I didn't think that this is what we were doing. And so maybe my notes are just wrong. Um, and so I agree with the um, comments from member Agnu, but I want to I'll say it this way just to cut through what I consider the noise to be. Essentially, we have an ordinance that is passive and does nothing. And so that's how I interpret this. Um, and the reason it does nothing is because of all the reasons that you gave, right? Um, and so, you know, on one side, thanks for that. Um, but I I what I thought we were going to do or I thought we're going to do two things. One, the uh St. Paul ordinance um has items in that are not defensible, right? Or not allowed because of the exemption, right? But there are lots of things we can do. And so I kind of thought in my mind we would actually have probably two ordinances. One would be things that we could do. Member Agnu mentioned one um banning firearms discharge in residential districts. Uh regulating discharges in parks, trails. Um establishing safe discharge zones. U so not around schools, things like that. Um increasing penalties for reckless or unsafe discharge. um requiring permits and safety plans for any organized events involving uh firing arms, so discharging. Um and then the storage one that um member Agnu mentioned. So, I think there are lots of things that we could do in an ordinance that could that don't put police at risk that we can um we can as a city enforce. And if written in the right way, it discourages firearm use within the city. Now, it doesn't go as far as all the other things we talked about um that are in the St. Paul ordinance. Okay. So, I was looking for us to have an ordinance that we list all the things we could do, draft them in c in such a way that is restrictive to make the point. And to me, the point is this. We want to do more and and for me this to me would be right in the preamble of the ordinance. We want to do more but the state you won't allow us to. So this is what we're going to do and this is why we think it's important and we control that then this second ordinance. This is all the stuff that we would do and it's probably written the same way that you have it. uh we don't have the authority to do this and so until it's s such a time that the state gets its act together this other ordinance we don't have the control in this space but we draft it we draft it um and then and my envision when I and and I chose the word passive uh purposefully like I like I would love to see us have like a public hearing, right, on the one that is not defensible to allow people to come in and talk about it. Similar to to um mayor and the governor saying, "Well, maybe we should let people vote on it." Well, we can't actually do that, but we could have a public hearing. And I would love to have the people that are sending me emails about the right to to to bear their arms. I would love to have them stand up at the podium and say, "Yeah, I want to have my gun." Understand all these other issues, but me having an assault weapon is more important than that. I would love for somebody to stand up here and say that. given give creating the space in the democracy to have the conversation. And we have the two ordinances. The one we approve that has all things that we can defense and um and then the other we can still approve it, but we can say, you know, we're not going to enforce this until the state gets their act together. But we will have had a open forum. It's not going to be a debate. But in my mind, I think this was before um member Agneu and member wrestler I think it was, it might not have been, but we had um a uh sketch plan and I can't remember which which project this was, but we had two lines. people were for, people were against, and they just rolled through and had their three minutes. Um, so that's what I would like to see us do. And to me, that is not passive at all. I think it accomplishes something, right? At least we get something um to um not just make the point that we want stronger ordinances, stronger gun law, stronger uh control in that space. We actually have something we can do. That's what I'd like to see us consider. >> Thank you. Make sure that Council Member Jackson. >> Yes. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So, I've been having lots of conversations on this. Um, one of the questions I have for you, Mr. Kendall, is if other cities, we've got St. Paul has passed their ordinance. We have an ordinance. If other cities follow us and pass very similar or identical ordinances and we all get sued, is it possible to consolidate those cases into one and then we would share the cost of the lawsuit? I don't know if the courts, it would depend. I don't know. Um, a lot of these would probably be filed in the county where the city is located. So, obviously the one in for St. Paul has been filed in Ramsey County. The one for Edina will presumably be filed in Henipin County. Um, sometimes courts do certify, you know, group litigation. I don't know at what point the courts would agree to that. There are some differences now at least between the ordinance that we've created and the ordinance that St. Paul created. So that might be a basis not to allow um you know that type of class or certified litigation. It wouldn't be class action but certified group litigation. Um and also you know so far aside from St. Paul no other city has has passed an ordinance. There has been discussion about certain individuals from from certain cities who have expressed support for, you know, a gun violence prevention efforts. Uh I've not seen any other city in Minnesota aside from St. Paul that has actually passed an ordinance at this point. Well, the person who gave me this idea said Edina is the leader and we were on indoor smoking and a lot of the smoking laws that were changed because of the the efforts here in this chamber and this person well actually was Senator Latz I was talking to who is my senator and also chair of the judici judiciary and he urged us to do to send the strongest message we could possibly send from his perspective that we have four legislators, two representatives, two senators that represent Edina, and they are all strong advocates for doing something at the legislature. And he asked us to give him as much as we could to support that effort um at the state level. And one of the things he suggested was consolidating, you know, if if our neighboring if we pass the ordinance and our neighboring cities are then emboldened or you know encouraged to do the same. They see us do it, they do it, maybe we could consolidate it and the cost wouldn't be so heavy on just Edina. >> Yeah. I I I don't know. Unless if if a number of different cities passed an ordinance and lawsuits resulted and the numbers became sufficient, maybe the court would consider it or maybe there'd be barriers to that. I hadn't really thought through that question and and if there if the ordinances were significantly different, it might not be possible to combine the litigation because there might be enough differences that the it couldn't be feasible to rule on the same issues in the same lawsuit. So, >> okay. Thank you. Those are my questions. Member, >> I am wondering if we could get that um statement, the coalition statement that mayors signed on to projected on the screen so people can actually take a look at that because I think there's some confusion regarding that. >> Uh no, I don't think so. >> No, not ours. But um I the link >> Oh, there was some mayors that signed on St. Paul. And because I think this is encouraging people to think that there are all these municipalities um where we've had mayors issue statements about the importance of curbing gun violence of taking action and that's being interpreted as all these municipalities are going to pass an ordinance banning assault weapons and bump stocks and all of that. And I think that's not really the case. And when you read the very thoughtful statements by those leaders and it is all mayors except for one council person um it doesn't appear that they're saying we're going to pass an ordinance and I have to say there are and I am the process person and I get very concerned about that and what we're being asked to do is to take an action that is outside of um our purview as city council people. But the other thing is what we've done, you know, and I I want to thank Attorney Kendall for writing that ordinance. I want to thank my fellow council members for engaging in the dialogue about this, but how much time is going to pass before the state might remove that preeemption? You know, that could be years. And so we're going to have an ordinance and we're going to have to go through I would think we would go through a public hearing to get the ordinance um as part of the process to get it passed and then it would sit and wait and you know who knows what changes we would want to make to it by the time the preeemption is removed. Um and we would have to go through the process to amend it to get those changes. And I just feel like we need to pause and recognize, hey, we wrote an ordinance. What if we acknowledge that as significant? We also wrote a resolution. We did that immediately after um the shooting at enunciation, the shootings. It was horrible going through that. And I think it would u make sense to kind of say we're teed up. That's a big deal. All right. And we've got that. The other thing is I'm hearing differing views from individuals who are associated with mom's demand action. One noted that it was so critical to make our voices heard and demand sensible gun laws at both the state and national level, banning assault weapons, large capacity magazines, and ghost guns. However, I'm not sure what passing legislation at the city level will do other than invite a potentially expensive legal challenge. And that is something that I I take to heart. Um what is and I I have engaged in a lot of activist um action. What is the path forward that is the most logical for us to take? Okay. So, um, here is the document that started all of this and you know, I think maybe it's worth reading today. The city of St. Paul u, this is the one that has the people who signed on to it, right? Or is that not that is not the one that we need? Um, okay. >> It's at the bottom second to last paragraph. >> Uh, okay. But it it had statements from other council members. Okay. Um Okay. You know what that it's okay. But let's go back to where we were. Um today the city of St. Paul adopted a comprehensive gun violence prevention ordinance. Um, this bold step strengthens the city's ability to address illegal and dangerous firearm activity contingent upon lawmakers lifting the state preeemption. Um, St. Paul stands ready to act on day one when the state lifts preeemption. This ordinance represents a collective effort by local leaders taking a long overdue step to protect our children, families, and neighbors. Too many have suffered the unimaginable while others debated. It's time for state leaders to meet us in this moment of urgency and safeguard the future of our children, the future our children deserve. Um, when I read the other document, it was not other leaders from cities agreeing to adopt an ordinance. it was other leaders who were making statements and all those statements are incredibly thoughtful um but they don't say we are going to adopt an ordinance so here is the link um and this is from October 14th um you know so the document okay the group specifically ly urged lawmakers to repeal the prevention laws that prevent cities and counties from regulating firearms, ammunition, and related components. Okay, that was the ask. Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Fry said these laws. Yes. Okay. Um, local governments must have the power to act when certain state lawmakers won't. And Minneapolis is ready to move our feet and lead with stronger gun reform measures. The coalition includes city officials from St. Paul, Minneapolis, Bloomington, Brooklyn Center, Burnsville, all of these cities. Um, the coal uh uh the press conference is one of several calling for action. Okay. Uh following the August 27th mass shooting at Annunciation Catholic School in Minneapolis that injured 26 students, three adults, and killed 8-year-old Fletcher Merkel and 10-year-old Harper Moy. Um, if the state refuses to act, um, local government must be allowed to act. Um, you read the statements from leaders, the mayor of Bloomington. It's not hyperbole. It's not hyperbole to say we face a clear and present danger from weapons of war on our streets, in our schools, and in our places of worship. And we're doing far too little to stop it. Urgency is paramount now. We can't allow this call to action get to get lost in the endless news cycles. They're not. I don't think Bloomington is moving forward with an ordinance. I could be wrong. Um the mayor of Brooklyn Center in Minnesota, we lost children in churches and neighbors on porches, futures. And still, we're told to wait, to mourn, to hope someone else will fix it. We're not just witnesses. We're architects. We're the ones who shape the future and the frame. We're the ones who decide whether our laws reflect love, whether our policies protect people, whether our silence becomes action. This is our moment to shift the frame from reaction to prevention, from despair to determination, and from thoughts and prayers to votes and bills. Let us write laws that honor life. Um, it's open to interpretation. Um, public safety is of paramount importance to my city. I'm here today because I think that taking action to limit the types of guns available to the general public makes cities safer. These limits are not contrary to the protections provided by the second amendment of the US Constitution. Um, the mayor of Richfield. I'm a retired educator who taught in Richfield for 30 years. When I began my teaching career, the school safety drills consisted of what to do if there was a tornado or a severe storm or a fire evacuation. All that changed in 1999 with Coline. At the time, we told the students that statistically schools were the safest place you could be, and we hoped that this one-time horrific event would never again happen. Um, educators and parents can no longer say that our childrens deserve better. Now, I don't know. I mean, it's possible. Every single city is drafting an ordinance. But to me, when I'm reading the statements, these are people who are trying, municipal leaders trying to move the needle forward in a way that is possible. And if I have misinterpreted those, I apologize. But to me, in my role as a city council person, I do need to listen to our attorney, to the city manager, consider the police, and also I really do think we've got this ordinance. It's ready to go when the preeemption happens, but we don't need to take the additional step to have it um passed into law. How are we going to be the most effective that we can be? And my colleagues may disagree with me. >> Probably. >> Thank you, member. Yeah. Okay. Appreciate your thoughts. Yeah. I'm going to go back to council member Pierce has a few thoughts. >> Thanks, uh, Mr. Mayor. I So, I I get where you're coming from. Um, but as I sit here, I love the way the mayor started. And you know, I have to say I believe back in I don't know 1957, there's a bunch of council meetings where in the south, I'm from Alabama. I was born in 1969 where they were saying, "Yeah, black people shouldn't vote for all these reasons." And there was somebody who said, "Yep, law doesn't really protect them. Um, we got all these Jim Crow laws, and so we're not going to do anything. We're going to wait for the federal government to pass the civil rights law of 1965, which was done, but it started back in the 50s. And so I like I'm I am glad that somebody back then said, "Nah, we're going to keep moving forward and we're going to let the law catch up to where morally we think we should be." Yes. >> And so, and so what I don't understand, um, and so I I kind of want to just repeat what I was thinking because I don't think anything I suggested is actually against what you're saying. Member Risser, I think we should draft an ordinance that is the strongest ordinance that we can enact as a city. And I went through a list of five or six things that could be in there. And we can enact that. There's no way we will get sued. Those are things that are within our right to enact as a city. I we should do that. That is not what was in the St. Paul ordinance, right? Those things are not in that, right? And then we do that. Then we do a resolution that says, man, we would love to do more because we know it's the right thing to do. And if we could and if there were no state preeemption, these are all the things that we as a city would resolve to do. But we know we can't do that. And then have a public hearing to let people come in and react to that. And it just creates space for our city to be like member Jackson is saying, try to take a leading posture. Um, and I think that that would be healthy and I don't think it puts anybody at risk. We're not going to get sued by it. We're not going to have a huge litigation expense. Is there expense to what I just said? Yeah, there is. But I I just don't understand why that what's the harm in that >> and I want to say what before you go on I I I was I missed something at the very beginning of my comments and what I should have said was remember this is an environment here and you all know this that live here this is a chambers that is kind of sacrosan in the sense that this is a place where is that not only kindness prevailing But civility prevails. And so when director Benerro said at the beginning, please don't be clapping or cheering or jeering. Uh even though this is an extraordinarily emotional issue, I think if we there are people in this room that don't share the same opinion, but they're they're they live in our town, too. So let's just be cognizant of that and try to not be reactive to some of the things that might get set up here that are important to you. Thank you, >> Mayor. Can I just make a comment here? >> Yeah. >> Um, so state law does allow cities to regulate discharge of firearms in cities and discharge of firearms is currently prohibited in Edina. So that's there is an ordinance already in existence on that point. >> So one question I had for you was >> can I respond to that? >> Go ahead. You keep rolling. >> But so you only spoke about one thing. So I'm not an attorney. What I'm asking you to do is to go figure out all the things that we have within our control to do. Like that's your job. I don't know all those things. I gave you one example, right? And so that's what I I don't I don't want the comeback to be, well, we already have that. I want the comeback to be okay, got it. Let me go see what else we can >> statutoily we can >> enact and bring that back. That's what I'm asking for. >> Member Rouser, >> I want to say member Pierce, what you just proposed I can certainly get behind. Okay. And that is very different than the ordinance was that was prepared for tonight. Okay. And I see um and that would be something I I would want to offer, you know, in terms of process. I think it would make sense for us to have a community event where we were engaged, you know, and and that vision you have of having people being able to speak about what they are concerned about and that could be an event where we were getting ideas from the community about possible legislation. I kind of do not want to send our city attorney off on a research. Um I mean I think we kind of need to >> Well, no, but I mean like to say I suppose we we could, but I think we also need input from the community about you know throughout the nation. What are all the other things that it could be kind of a um >> That's fair. >> Yeah. you know, not just only on attorney Kendall. Um, but I think what we're proposing um has a lot of merit and potential, but so hopefully everyone is clear on where I am right now. Thank you, >> mayor. I can answer the question now mostly. >> So, statute 471.633 633 says a government subdivision may regulate the discharge of firearms. Basically, aside from that, other firearm regulations by municipalities are prohibited. So, >> are we are we out of luck on safe storage because of Hiller? >> Safe storage. There's currently a a Minnesota statute on negligent storage in the 609 section. It's a crime. Uh, and aside from that, I think safe negligent storage is preempted by state law. >> We could we could parrot or mirror state law if we wanted to, but >> correct. >> The state statute also says that local regulation subdivision may adopt regulations identical to state law. So you could adopt the same negligent storage provisions in an ordinance that have been adopted in state statute. >> Yeah. So St. Paul gets Were you Did you have something else you wanted to >> No, no, no. Fine. That's Yeah. >> Okay. So, uh St. Paul crafted something they thought was going to be uh defensible, I'll put it that way. And uh we have a lot of confidence in you and you've tried to distinguish our potential ordinance in a different way from St. Paul. So what distinguishes us our potential ordinance from the St. Paul ordinance in the way you've drafted it that you think provides any level of additional protection? >> Uh mainly the effective date. So there's potential vagueness around the effective date of the St. Paul ordinance. Someone could allege that they're not sure what their rights are and when they're allowed to carry prohibited weapons in St. when they're not because it could be reasonable minds could differ on when state preeemption has been lifted because state preeemption exists in a number of different statutes. So that's the main difference. There is a you know safe storage or negligent storage provision in the United ordinance that's identical to the one in the St. Paul ordinance. I think that's preempted so it couldn't be enacted immediately. >> Manager Neil, have you you've talked to the League of Minnesota Cities about this? I mean, sometimes when someone's not happy with a decision that we make, they sue us and we've got insurance coverage for that. What's what's the situation there? situation there is that we have uh we have received such a letter from the Minnesota Gun Owners Caucus I believe they are called and uh saying that if we adopt the ordinance they will file suit and they did do that in St. Paul. St. Paul is self-insured. They have in-house legal so they they will absorb this kind of work and do it on their own presumably. Uh we are part of the League of Minnesota Cities Insurance Trust. That's what covers our defense when we get sued in certain cases. Uh we have sought I have sought out u an advisory opinion from them to see if they would defend us in this case. Um I got back a little bit of a vague uh response that says, you know, we can't tell you that unless we know exactly what what the lawsuit is challenging. Um and but they pres they encouraged us to encouraged you as a council to go forward with adoption um if you think this is important for the community and then they will make their decision uh outside of that if we if we do get uh served with a lawsuit. So they did not give us a clear path about whether they would or would not defend. Mayor, I I can just answer one other question. Um, so I I read and saw the statements from various individual city council members or mayors, you know, in support of gun violence prevention or gun control. So, I called around or searched on the internet and investigated to the best of my ability to see uh, you know, if any of those cities listed, and there's a number in the list, had passed a an ordinance. I did not find any that had passed an ordinance. I know West St. Paul has passed a resolution. Ezina has already passed a resolution. Um I did not find any of those cities that had passed an ordinance. >> Um I can say that member Risser's instincts were right because I've talked to the mayor of Bloomington and he said they're not going to they're not going to do anything right now. No. >> Um, not that that affects our decision- making. >> We >> No, only to the to member Jackson's question about would it be possible to band together? Um, first of all, I don't know. And second of all, so far, no one else has passed an ordinance that would put him in a position to band together with Edina. What about um council members? What about uh council member Pierce's Oh, I'll go to member Agno first and I'll ask about council member Pierce's idea. >> I didn't mean to interrupt you. >> No, I was going to wait in line. Thank you. Um >> so I just want to like explicitly ask I think you said this at the beginning. um the ordinance that we have in front of us today that you presented to your best legal advice and ability. Do you think us approving it would be illegal? >> No, because the effective date is delayed until such time as it would not be illegal. >> Okay. Thank you. >> And the consequence of that is that we would win a lawsuit. The consequence is I think yeah >> the lawsuit would be defensible. It would not be an automatic win for the plaintiffs. >> I would certainly hope to win the lawsuit, but I can't predict the outcome. >> Yeah. >> What about member Pierce's idea of having a I'll call it a town hall forum or a public hearing where people get to come and express their opinions on this issue. We've already had some express the opinion that wait a minute now you're spending my you're not going to have a defense from the League of Minnesota cities. You're spending my money. I mean I've had quite a few emails like that. You know you got no right to spend taxpayer money that way. Um we make decisions on spending all the time. It's part of our job. But nonetheless it was a point well taken. Um, in what you were so were you thinking more of a public hearing sort of setting like we've had in the past or would you think were you thinking more of a town hall forum where people can just come and express their thoughts? >> Yeah, I um so I'm I'm trying not to be frustrated, but I I used to be able to just wipe that off like this and then I look fine, but the older I get, that doesn't work. I um it just feels like we're not going to do anything. And so it's easier for us to say, "Well, sorry, we can't do that because because because because that's right, that's comfortable, right? I I can go home tonight and I'll, you know, be fine in the morning." But what I'm trying to do is urge us to be creative. I'm trying to urge you to be creative and help us figure something out that will at a minimum help create some momentum. And remember Rissa is right. I mean, it could take 10 years to make any change at all. But one thing that we know for a fact, when there's a school shooting, there's a period of time where everybody is, oh my goodness, you know, hopes and prayers. It's horrible. We tie the ribbons. We write the resolutions, right? We have the press conferences. And then every day we get further from that, people move on. And I am trying to come up with a way that we don't just move on. That that's all I'm trying to do. So hopefully I haven't offended anybody tonight. I'm just trying to come up with something that helps us not move on and to create some kind of momentum. So to your question, um I the originally when I thought about it, it was having something to react to and doing a a public hearing like we did tonight. I wasn't necessarily thinking like a a town hall. And the reason I was thinking that is because we scheduled it on a day we're going to be here anyway. It's on the agenda just like everything else. So it's not an additional expense. And the gravy to me if we were to do that is if some other city got wind of it, you know, um the Sun Current heard that we were doing it or something. It just helps kind of create some momentum. And who knows, maybe St. Louis Park, their city hall, their city council meeting, maybe they'll do one. Um, that's all I'm trying to to do. So, that's how I was originally thinking. I wasn't thinking of a town hall. >> I just wanted to understand, yeah, the the the depth of your thoughts on it because I didn't want to >> um if that was really important to you, I didn't want to say, well, it's let's not kick the can down the road and do that. >> Yeah. No, I appreciate that. And >> so, I just wanted to understand that better. I think there's some good arguments in there about um opinions. Yeah. Member Jackson. So I think you know Coline happened when my youngest daughter was a baby. She's now 27. And I think frustration is a mild word for what a lot of people in this room are feeling. Certainly a mild word for what I'm feeling. And I really feel that we have to do something different. And you know this is an opportunity to do something different. We have a resolution. We've lobbied at the capital. We've written letters to our legislature. We have to do something that's different. I love your idea of a public hearing. Um I'd like to bring this ordinance and have a public hearing on it. I I'm uncomfortable with us, the five of us, making a decision based on emails that we got. I would love to have a public hearing and have the public face have their chance to come up and talk. We we had someone come forward today who wanted to talk, right, and is is having to sit quietly. But I would love to hear from you guys. I would love to hear from the public before I made a decision on this, but I there aren't any more ways to do this. I we've looked at the seven ways to Sunday and I want to do something um because I'm tired of living in fear. I'm tired of my children, you know, living their entire lives in fear of being shot. And you know, we could be shot. Someone could come in at the door with an automatic rep weapon and before the police could react, many people would be dead. It's what the reality we live in. And I don't want to live in that reality anymore. This is something that we can do. But I like the idea of having a public hearing before we do it. Um I I think that then it's more the voice of the community and not just our opinions. >> Member. >> Okay. Um, first off, member Pierce, you have challenged me and I think in a really good way and I'm thinking about different ways uh groups try to push the ball forward and this weekend was World Day of Remembrance for victims of road traffic and um families have come together trying to address this. It it's an international event now. We were at the cap. It was the sixth year that Minnesota organized it and my sister started that. I continued it and now Minnesota Safety Council has taken over and it's very gratifying. But every year there is a specific message. So this year was safe speeds save lives. What if we tried to get a program and involved other cities, you know, and this would have to be on a volunteer basis. I would, you know, want to participate as well. But, you know, there was a goal every year um so that we kept this issue of gun violence at the forefront, you know, and I I don't know what actions we could take, but you know, I'm just trying to brainstorm here. What about a gun buyback program one year? Um what about you know and there there could be like every year you plan for it and you have an event and you have something where it stays in people's minds and then you know the legislature might start paying more attention you know but what can we do meaningfully consistently um to explore how to reduce gun violence and I I think there's there is a lot of potential and there is something you know we is in the metro area and looking at that list of all the leaders who wrote statements what they have said just kind of trying to get that movement happening so >> thank you member >> I think I mean I I'm okay with the idea of if we want to have a public hearing and continue the conversation um I'm supportive of the ordinance that we have in front of us right now. Um, but I'm definitely open to that. But I think, you know, I'm not saying let's not continue the dialogue and let's not continue the conversation in other ways. But I also don't think that we're at the state in this problem in the United States of not knowing how to solve the problem. Right? I think we know that there are measures that we can take around um banning assault life rifles, these ghost guns like the there is kind of a format of looking at what other countries are doing that don't have the same problem, right? And so I hear you and I I think it's yes and we need to I think do both. Thanks, member. Member Eggnu, I got to say I was really disappointed in the president that came at the beginning uh and seemed to think that it was a leftist agenda to care about the fact that death by gun is the biggest killer of kids in our country. Seven, seven a day getting killed by gun violence. I don't see where that's anything but a humanistic sort of agenda. Uh to care about the greatest asset we have in our country is our kids. Got to rely on them to take care of all of us and make our country successful. If we're killing seven a day through gun violence, something's wrong. So, um, but the idea of having a chance to have a public hearing where all voices are heard and all voices matter is a good one. And and with the legislature not in session, you know, and uh there us having a little bit of time to act uh but moving forward to do something. Um I that's something I'm comfortable with too. So um but I do think that your point is well taken that in the in the interim we can certainly look at uh what are the things that we can do >> and and if it if it parrots or mimics state law and negligent gun storage that's okay with me. I mean we we we have ordinances that mimic state law uh for other reasons. So you could come with that idea of what are the things that we could do. Then we have a public hearing on potentially doing something about this gun ordinance that Mr. Kendall's drafted. And then I think we still need to think about I'm looking at our resolution here that we passed on September 17th 16th um and thinking that this needs to be structured at the end a little bit differently in terms of the uh the action step because I think there is some consideration to be given around this whole idea of a lobbying the state legislature for a constitutional amendment and let the whole state vote on how they feel about this issue that is uh so polarizing. So, um, maybe that's a good next step for us is to think about giving an adequate amount of time, lead time, month from now, having a maybe before the end of the year, having a public hearing conjunction with one of our council meetings on this proposed form of gun ordinance because I think it is so significant that people in our town should have a right to be heard on it. Or even if you're not from our town and you want to be heard on it, we're willing to listen. um and then have direct Mr. Kendall come back with some ideas on what we could what we could pass more safely in in um reading your memo. Uh I I like hearing that you had more confidence in what I saw in your memo which is good. Um but um those are the those are thoughts for me for now. Remember Jackson? Well, I hesitate to bring this up, but there is one more thing that we can do and um I talked briefly with uh manager Neil about this and we have a gun training facility in our city. We don't own it outright. We're a part of a membership, but the p public is able to come and shoot um automatic rifles at this facility. and I'd like to at least explore the idea of changing public access um to to bringing assault rifles into our town. Um and I don't know what what's what's possible with that. Um, so at the public safety training facility, there's a gun range and there are public hours where you can come and you can shoot and you can shoot pistols and you can shoot some what are considered automatic rifles, but not necessarily all automatic rifles because it blows through the wall if it's too strong. But one of the one of the opponents um Yeah, I know. One of the opponents to this um was from out of town. I said, "Well, you're you don't live in Edin. You're not my constituent." And he said, "Yes, but I have the right I I do come shoot in your town, and so you would be infringing on my right to use my gun." And you know, that's something that there isn't a right to go golf at Braar. You know, we can shut down the golf course. there isn't a right to come and have public hours at this facility. Now, there's a legal document that says that that's part of it and and that's a part of the the usage. We don't control it 100%. But I'd like to at least explore what would happen if we tried to unwind that um so that no one would have a reason if they didn't live here to bring a gun into our an automatic rifle into our town. So, um, so that's something I'd like to explore. Um, and see we then it also pulls other cities into it because we're in partnership with other cities. So, that's that's yet another idea. >> Okay. So, >> so I >> sufficient direction. >> Well, here here's what >> Go back through it again. >> Here's what I think I heard. >> All right. I think you've u you've asked us to be more creative in terms of looking at sort of outside uh the area the parameters that we've previously looked at more than just the St. Paul ordinance. Uh we so we can start doing that. You want me to find some some uh meeting where we can host uh a public a public hearing on the issue in this in this room. So it's televised, recorded, etc. Uh we'll do that. will look start looking out into the future of our calendars here. And do you want a I can't tell if you want uh another sample ordinance to be prepared in advance of that public hearing or do you want to wait until you hear what the public has to say and then draft an ordinance? >> I think on what we've got >> Oh, no. I think he means um yeah, the public hearing would be in the ordinance that he's crafted. >> Got it. Yeah. What we're also saying, what we're also saying is what can we safely pass? >> Yeah. >> That we don't where we where it wouldn't be a public hearing necessarily involved. >> We're going to tell you if we don't think it's possible. So, we we'll have to be we'll be honest with you. >> State law, the safe storage, >> uh whatever else, what whatever you had on your list. >> Yeah. I I'm just trying just being crystal clear. There are things that are possible. That's all I'm I'm not asking you to do something that is not possible. >> Um that's all I'm just when you said that you're going to come back and tell us if something's not possible. >> You shouldn't do that. You should bring something back that's possible because that's what that's all I'm saying. And there are things in the state statute that are possible for us to adopt as a city. We can write that in an ordinance. >> That's all I'm saying. I'm not saying make up stuff. You know, >> it's it's possible to adopt anything that mirrors state statute. >> Anything's possible. I'm just >> Well, no. Not is not possible. Anything is >> the statute says that it's possible to mirror state statute. >> Yeah. >> And we would not normally come back to you and say this is already state statute. Let's do it too. Let's double up at the city level. But I think that's what you're asking for. And if that's what you're and that's what you're asking for, we can do that. We wouldn't I'm just telling you we wouldn't normally do that. >> I got you. Okay. Yeah. I'm happy to meet with you guys and show you what I'm what's in my head. Okay. So, what I think he was getting at was, is there something that you would guarantee wasn't challengeable? I don't think he will as a lawyer. No, >> but he should >> because we're we're following state statute. I like I don't know how many ways to say this. I'm not asking us to do something that doesn't right. If there are things in there that you're going to make up, then okay. But what I am saying is not asking you to do that. Right. So >> I understand where you're coming from. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> All right. Very good. Well, if you want to stick around and hear about the South Hill 2 spending plans, you're sure welcome to do that. >> Thanks for coming tonight. >> I think so. Yeah. James. >> So when you have your meeting >> Yeah. >> I got you. Thank you. you waiting for me to call on you? >> Yes. >> Okay. All right. Yeah. Our last item of the evening is uh embodied in resolution 2025-101 as a proposed form of resolution which would amend the spending plan for the salt 2 Pentagon park and 7th and Kill taxing over financing districts and Bill Nundorf our economic development manager has this and will tell us what he thinks we should be doing. >> Yes, thank you. Good evening. This is an action item. Uh this is resolution 2025-101. Uh and it does pertain to the proposed modification of the spending plan. Uh this uh topic has been discussed in September. We met as an as a housing and redevelopment authority uh entity and and spoke about it uh at that point. Then we came back and held a public hearing in October um and delayed action uh on that item until this evening. So, we're looking for your uh approval this this evening. Um, I'll go through very briefly uh the the topic in the proposal. Um, and I will call attention to the additional information I'm providing in response to your questions that you raised at the public hearing back in October. Um, so this uh current spending plan was adopted by the city in 2021 and that was in response to special state legislation that was approved as we were uh all struggling through the pandemic. Earlier this year in June of 2025, the state legislator state legislature modified that language and so this proposal that we recommend uh reflects these new modifications to that state law. And in essence, there's uh three potential options that you have in front of you this evening. Um uh you may choose to extend the deadline of this program by one year. That's one of the options given by the state. You may also uh uh extend the deadline and include the additional interest earnings that have been accumulating on that money over the last couple years. Uh or you may choose to do nothing and reject that and keep the program as is. Um so those are the three options in front of you this this evening. This original spending plan uh pertains to the use of uh unobligated tax increment financing dollars. So these are property taxes that were paid and collected in the city of Adina that were with withheld in three different tax increment financing accounts. Uh all total there was about $9.5 million uh of monies that were available. um in the original spending plan. The recommendation this evening is to keep that original budget of 9.5 and then increase it by the interest earnings that is now allowed under the new state law. These dollars are tax increment dollars and so we as we talk about a lot uh there's a lot of state statute and lot of uh legislation about the use of tiff. All of those rules still apply to these funds. So, uh, these dollars can specifically be used for private development and to a limited degree some public development, um, public improvements that, uh, build new buildings or rehab existing buildings. Uh, and in the process, you have to create jobs, whether they're permanent jobs or temporary construction jobs. Uh, these dollars cannot be used for staff, they cannot be used for operations, they cannot be used for equipment. All those same rules that apply to tax increment still apply here. Back in October, I presented a brief overview of some of the projects we've funded to date. I'm not going to review all of those, but we've uh worked on business investments, uh rental apartment uh investments, and some public infrastructure improvements related to those projects. Also in October I provided this chart uh which is very small if you look at it on your screen but it's an accounting um uh of the expenditures to date and when I say to date uh this was prepared I believe in October 18th so it's about a month old at this point um but at that time and still this evening there's about $950,000 uh that we originally put in the spending plan that will probably not be spent by the end of this year. Um, so those are the dollars where potentially if you choose to extend this program by according to the new state law by one year, we would have an additional years to invest those dollars. Um, let's see. Uh, also in October, I provided a a brief overview of the outcome if you chose not to do this. uh if you chose to keep the program as it is and let it expire at the end of this year. Based on your questions, I went a little bit deeper into that uh into that alternate. Um so I had mentioned that there's about $950,000 of monies that have not been dispersed to date. They've not been paid out. Um and then there's also about $775,000 of interest earnings that have also not been uh pledged or paid to any project. So, uh, we did some additional research, uh, and some number crunching on this. Again, we're using rounding estimates, um, not getting down to the penny or the dollar. Um, but if, if we did not, uh, extend the program, uh, there would be some dollars left, um, over a million in that range. approximately $757,000 of that would have to go and be returned into the Pentagon Park District because there are obligations there and those dollars could not be returned um to the county. Uh about $278,000 would be returned to the 70th and Cahill account. Uh and then that would be a decision for a future day. You could either choose to leave those dollars in that account or turn them over to the to Henipin County. And then also there's about $690,000 uh that originated from the Southdale TIFF account that would be returned there. And again, if we choose to do that, another decision for the future, you could either keep those dollars in that account to support affordable housing, that's the other eligible use, or you could choose to turn the dollars over to Henipin County. So on the right side of the screen, kind of summing that up, uh there's between 690 and $968,000 available today and they'll still be available at the end of this year. Um we could choose to turn those over to Henipin County. Um and about a third of those dollars would eventually come back to the to Adina. uh a third would would be retained by the county and a third would eventually make their way to the state. Um so in raw numbers uh if we did choose to let the program terminate at the end of this year uh it would take several months or or longer than that but eventually the city would realize between 230,000 and 320,000 in dollars back to the city general fund. Um so that's that is the option there. Um our recommendation on behalf of staff remains the same as it was uh a month ago and that is to uh take advantage of this new new state law and extend the program by one year uh to invest in Adina. These are property taxes collected here, paid here. Uh it's my strong recommendation that we keep those dollars in the city rather than turn them over to the county or the state. Um so our recommendation is the same as as it was. Um I did modify the wording a little bit in in the recommendation. Uh and that is we do recommend that the amended spending plan be adopted to both extend the deadline by the one year that I mentioned and to include the interest earnings uh as allowed by the state law. Uh so that's at a high level. That is where we were and that's still where we are. I'm happy to answer any questions. Yes, Council Member Pierce. Thanks, Mr. Mayor. Can you go back to slide eight, please? Sir, >> sounds easy, doesn't it? >> I thought you would have been there by now. Um, so I I just got confused when you were doing this. Um, so the the approximate 757,000 I was interpreting some of this is that it it has to remain in the district and then you were saying or if you wanted to give some of it back to the county. So I was only thinking we had one decision, one option I guess. So can you just explain that again? >> Sure. Sure. And this is a a deeper dive than I went into in the October meeting. You had asked for additional information. So this is this is it. Um uh if we choose to terminate the program this year, there is at least $950,000 available plus the interest earnings that are still sitting out there. Um these dollars originated from three different tiff districts. If we terminate and there's leftover money, by law, they have to be returned to the place that they began. So about 757,000 would have to be returned into the Pentagon Park Fund. That would not be turned back to the county. Um about 278,000 would go back to the 70th and Cahill, also known as the Wooddale uh TIFF account. um if they go back into that account at a future date, you could decide whether or not to keep those dollars or to turn them over. Uh usually that's a conversation we have with the HA at the beginning of each year, January or February of of every year. Staff looks at the balance, looks at the options, and and provides briefings and recommendations. Well, that's how you get the 690, >> correct? >> From the the 950 plus the interest, >> correct? >> Okay. >> Okay. And then where I got confused is the between 690 and 968 could be returned. So where's the 968? So that's if you add the 278 that originated from 70th in Cahill and add that on to the 690 from Southdale 2, that's how you come up with the 968 >> if we decided to return the 278 to the county, but we could leave it in the district. >> Correct. >> Okay, got it. Thank you. >> Questions? Yes, member Risser. Um, >> and then we could also return the 775,000 in interest to the county, too. Um, we'd have to take a deeper dive into that. Some of those dollars came from each of the three tiff districts, Pentagon, 70th, and Southdale. So, we would use the same logic. Some of them would go back to each district. Um, the ones that were in South Dale, and 70th, if you chose, you could turn them back. I don't know that precise amount. We'd have to >> do a much deeper dive. Can you go to the slide that um early on that was about how the um spark funds can be used? Okay. I think it was the Okay, right there. um at our I I have since we approved the Heroes Down payment assistant program, I have been hearing from residents and I have concerns that I didn't raise during that process um because TIFF funds which are normally used um for construction like what is listed here went into a down payment assistance program. And I'm wondering is it possible for the spark funds to be used that way as well? >> Uh, no. Because those funds are responsive to specific state statute. >> You're not allowed to mix and match. You've got to follow the the the linear options there. So, the monies that were contributed to Spark follow the Spark statutes. um the dollars that were um directed towards the affordable housing follow a different set of statutes. >> Okay. Thank you, >> Council Member Eggno. >> All right. I'm also going to ask us to go back to slide eight. Uh my question on slide eight. Um you've laid out here kind of what happens to the money if we don't approve this. Um so thank you for that. I would assume that if we approved it and we elected to not invest in any additional projects but still um met our obligations on the pledges that we had that a year from now we would have a very similar choice in front of us where we could pay them back to the TIFF funds or we could return them to Henipin County. Is that correct? >> Uh that that is correct. I I believe at the end of next year um you know at least the way the legislation is written the funds will expire next year no matter what whether we invest them or not. So if there are any left leftover dollars we would have the same conversation what to do with those dollars. >> Okay. Thank you. And I I think that that's that's probably why I'm most supportive of this. I think it um one allows us to close out on the commitments that we've made to some of these projects. Um and that's really important to me because we've made that commitment as a city and I don't want to pull back on that. Um and I am really excited about some of the projects that we've invested in, right? You think about the Dina Theater, um the crepe place, the honestly the the music venue. I'm like I think I've been asking you like where where are we at on that? like that's that's going to be really cool. Um, and so it's been great that we have had this as an option to us as a city to invest in some really neat projects. I like the idea of continuing this because I also know that the gap that we have of the unpledged dollars plus the interest, we will continue to have discussions as a city council if any of those projects come to fruition and we can make an assessment. Is this a project that we think is is valuable to our community? um if a year from now we don't have anything that's really sparked that same interest um then we can decide to turn the funds back right and I I like giving us that that ability um to have some really great projects come forward we can continue to support them or we can choose not to but at the end of the day I still want to ensure that we're we're not going back on our pledges that we have made to small businesses within the community. Thank you. >> Thanks Council Member Agnu. Uh, Council Member Jackson. >> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So, I'm a big believer in talking about the why. Why? So, tell us, and you you alluded to this, but why was Spark created during the pandemic. >> So, the initial state legislation was created uh strictly to create jobs and to attract private investment. Uh back in 2021, there was a lot of projects that thought were moving forward and they were all paused and shelved. Uh here in Adina, the the biggest project that suffered that fate was the um was the hotel at Pentagon Village. They were ready to pick up their building permit and chose not to because all the hotels were closed. Um that industry has still not recovered. Um so the the the goal is still the same to deploy these dollars to attract new private investment to increase our tax base and to create jobs in the process. >> So one of the things that I've always sensed about this is was limited time and it so it changed the use that we could put to use these dollars for. So, we had the dollars and state law changed what were limited use dollars into more general use for construction and job creation. Is that a fair summary? >> That's very accurate. >> Okay. So, in the public hearing, we had someone say, well, the economy might be going down. Can you in your, you know, if unemployment does skyrocket and the economy stalls, can you envision that small businesses would come forward and say, "Hey, if you could just give us the money to make the backdoor ADA accessible like the crepe restaurant." Um, that's the type of thing we would be what the this is exactly designed to use for. Correct. >> That's correct. And I and I am in conversation with several small businesses that are at that situation. They would like to move forward, but they have a gap. The gap is relatively small, but to them it's enormous and it's pausing their projects. So, there are additional small businesses that if we do extend the program, I do expect to be back before you, actually before the HA with uh proposals um to help get those projects moving. And it's part of our mission in the as the city council to worry about the economy in our city and to make sure that there are we can boost and support jobs when it's feasible. >> Correct. That's correct. Not unusual for a city to do this. >> It's Yeah, definitely not unusual. Um in Adina um we haven't done it that often. Um, but you don't have a once in a-lifetime pandemic happen in your lifetime very often either. >> Yeah. So, these were limited use dollars. They went into a pot that had a more a different use specifically for economic development, getting getting these businesses a little boost where they needed it. And then it would go back into this limited use if we uh when it's and when it expires, whether it expires at the end of this year or at the end of next year, it does it isn't just cash on hand that that can be moved around. It has to go back into this limited use, these three limited use pots. Correct. >> That's correct. So, what I would like to hear is if we approve this, I'd like to get regular updates from you on um on what what our possibilities are and reporting and then maybe by July or so start the process of unwinding. Um I don't think we should separate the interest from the principal because then you're like, well, what which you know it it gathers interest after we've separated it and what is what do we do with that interest? it's not worth the time and effort to do that. Um, but I do want to see a path for unwinding this so that in December of 2026, we're not having the same conversation and I want to see this is where the money's going goes back into the pots or it goes back to the county to be redistributed and and have the um path already cleared and already understood so that we can just say, "Okay, we're closing Spark at the end of 2026." and not drag it out for for time after that. So that's my recommendation. >> Can you go back to the image that showed all the projects? >> Um you just went past it. Um the the chart I mean I'm sorry. Um, one of the things that really concerns me about both TIFF and Spark is there are no public hearings. And um, when I look at these projects, there are some that I remain concerned about. the Adina Innovation Lab. Um I remain concerned about the impact of that process of moving to the new office space on Metro Boulevard and what that you know how that influenced the explor explorina our visitors bureau and so that that still is something that I am very much thinking about with the setting apartments we granted 4.8 86 million of spark on top of an existing tiff district. And the whole point of tiff is that it's supposed to be um the butt for it's supposed to make the project possible, but we granted a huge addition of public financing to that. And so I am concerned about that as well. And as I'm thinking about the remaining funds, thinking about things residents said, you know, CO is passed, we should turn this money back. I understand what member Jackson is saying. It it does make sense, but the specific program was for COVID. Um, and I am concerned about, okay, so how are we going to allocate the remaining money? And I I hope it doesn't go to uh entities that have already received tiff financing because I think spark for me spark on top of tiff is really problematic. So I I want to say that um and that's all I've got. So when you when you look at this list of projects there, I I take it there are some things in here or there are theoretically projects that uh you we might otherwise have to uh assess for as opposed to just using funds that are available. >> Oh, sure. If um if these funds were not available, Dina certainly could go the other direction and increase our levy and yeah provide support that way. Um historically we have not done that, but that's always a potential option. There's some >> But that's the beauty of hanging on to this money so that if there are projects that come along that we might otherwise have to levy for, we don't have to do it because they're qualifying projects under Spark. >> That's correct. And I think the biggest example is the the new roadway um on 77th Street that related to the Finch. That roadway serves the Finch development, but it will also be the new public road into the Fred Richards Park. >> Right. >> So that was a $2 million expense to build that. Uh rather than a adding that to the tax levy, we had the developer build it and we're reimbursing him. So that's a great example of that. >> Yeah. So we've got almost a million dollars sitting there that we to member Agno's point we can flexibly hang on to for a year and and and use it how we deem appropriate any diner for qualifying projects some of which might otherwise require a levy. We just don't know. >> I like that I like the flexibility appears. Thanks Mr. Mayor. So I, you know, originally I was being very pragmatic and was not in support of this just for a couple of reasons, but mostly because it was in CO. And then when I looked at the project list, um, everything was pledged except the one where we had the partial payment. And so I was kind of interpreting that to mean that there aren't other projects in the queue. And so that was actually one of my questions. Are there current projects that we're evaluating that we would use this funding for? >> Uh yes, there are. So there's one project that's in the queue. We've already pledged for it and that's the enclave development on the old Macy's furniture site. >> Yeah. We've pledged to use spark to a limited degree instead of providing tiff dollars for that. Um so the use of spark would actually reduce the tiff contribution. Um so that one has already been pledged. Um >> maybe that what is the definition of pledged? >> We the city or the h has entered into a legally binding contract. If the developer does a b and c we will use spark to do xyz. Okay. So, that project is not moving forward or it's the pace of it is slower. >> The right it's off to a slower start. So, they had hoped it to close on the land already >> and they had um uh but they weren't able to. >> Let me ask a question though. And so all I was asking though is if we've pledged it, but they don't get to a point where we would actually pay them until after the end of December, then we would have to use other funds to meet that pledge or can we earmark these funds? >> Yeah, that's a a good question. So, uh, when staff works with our legal adviserss, we make sure that we don't put the city in a pickle. So, um, if the developer meets their obligation, um, uh, they would be entitled to be reimbursed with a spark if they fail to meet it or if they meet it past the deadline. >> Yeah. >> They get nothing. >> Well, they get nothing, right? Okay. >> Right. So, we would we would not put the city in a position where they get funding and we don't have monies available. >> Okay. >> All right. So two things I when Agnu said we should honor our obligations like that's part of like our peers motto is that we have to honor our commitments. If we say we're going to do something, we have to do it. And so I appreciate that. Um so if we had have if we had committed funds to a project. I would want to make sure that we ensure that we can meet that obligation. It looks like we've done that ex with the exception of maybe Enclave in the way that you described it, >> but it looks like we've done that. There aren't other projects that we've in the queue that we've committed >> that we would assess and >> correct. There there are other there are other projects lined up to get in the queue depending on whether or not we extend the program. >> Oh, >> but we haven't entered into legally binding contracts yet. We've only had conversations. >> Okay. All right. So, that was one thing. And then the other thing was um what um mayor said that is making me think about whether I would support it or not. If we could, and this is kind of a question, well, I got two questions. One is if we were actually able to use these dollars for projects that would that would typically require funding coming out of the general levy. Like if that was a requirement of projects like I might I would be excited about that if that were the case. That has not been the case before, but if we were to to say that, that would be interesting to me. >> I think it might be interesting to our attorneys as well. I'm not sure if state law allows that. Um, >> have an attorney. Ask the question again. So, I Well, go ahead. Um, the way I would phrase that is, uh, Attorney Kendall, can the city create a program intended for private development that requires them to build a public >> No expense. >> Oh, no. No, no. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Throw it back to you to rephrase it. >> Yeah. I was just was just simply saying how I'll say it differently. If we had projects that we wanted to fund as a city that would typically require us to levy for, if we could use these spark funds instead, I would be excited about that. And so you were saying, well, our attorney might want to react to that from a legality perspective. Your your notion is that could we could we define the use of spark funds in a way where we'd only use them for projects that would otherwise be funded by the general levy. >> Yes, that sounds like an attorney. Say that. >> Yes. >> Not bad for 1052. >> So I can tell you a couple of the projects we funded uh the 2 million investment in the finch. We knew that we were going to build the park. We knew we needed a main entrance and we know we knew that they needed funding. So that was uh staff used our judgment to put that proposal together. We did something similar at the Adina Theater. Um uh some of the spark went to fund the rehab of the theater and to get that restored in the front facade that had such a uh branding importance to the community as an identity. But also that same year we ha I forgot what year that was and where you were uh council member. Um we also had an emergency closure of the south ramp, the south parking garage if you recall. There was some critical repairs that needed to be made to keep that operational. >> Yeah. >> Um that would have come from somewhere probably an emergency city budget. I'm not certain. It was not a budgeted expense. >> Yeah. We wrapped Spark to make sure that we could fix the garage at the same time that we repaired the the theater. So staff certainly keeps that in mind, but I I don't know if we can guarantee that's the only way we could use it, but we certainly would use our best judgment to achieve that goal. >> Well, I would be excited, Manager Neil, if there was some way we could say, "Yeah, we we've done these investments." Um, I guess if there's a few in the queue, fine. But if we could use these funds to help with the work session conversation we just had around budget, I would be excited about that. And that Yeah. Um, and then my second I forgot what my second one was. >> Remember Russer? Yeah, maybe you should come back to you. I before the meeting requested that u manager Newandorf have information about u the heroes program because I was thinking spark could be used in a similar way and I noticed that director Hawinson is still hanging out here and I feel badly about that and um perhaps she's here to answer that question and so I don't know if we could go on a little tangent and um my concern concern is how can TIFF money be used for this program? Is that why you're still here? >> Okay. I'm sorry. >> Oh, yeah. >> I feel very badly about that. >> Can spark funds be used for the heroes program? >> Well, we found out they can't, but she's here because I thought they could because some of them are from Southdale, too. And since she's still here, could she explain >> what's no longer relevant to this discussion, but the reason why she's hanging out here? >> Well, you don't need to do this to honor me. Um so yes, spark money was not used for the heroes program because it's not an eligible use. Um selfale tiff there went to spark and it went to through another legislative action to a fund that was solely to be used for affordable housing. So um there I can name the state statute that makes this allowed. if you could quote from the statute because my big concern is that tiff every single time we've used it, it's been for construction. Um it has not been for a program that would support down payment assistance to existing um buildings. And so I'm hung up on that and I don't understand how TIFF can be used that way. So the the state statute that allowed the funds to be pulled for affordable ownership is Minnesota state statute section 4691 173 subdivision 2D and it's to assist with owner occupied housing as authorized in section 469 173 subdivision 2D5. So now section another. So that's what created the fund. Now what authorizes it to be used for the down payment assistance program. So that's created the fund to be put for affordable housing ownership. What the statute that authorizes it to be used for the down payment assistance is section 469 1761 subdivision 2 which requires that for owner occupied residential property 95% of the housing units must be initially purchased and occupied by individuals whose family income is less than or equal to the income requirements for qualified mortgage bond projects under section 143F of the Internal Revenue Code. So it governs the income of the buyers, the heroes program. That's why when I presented the heroes program to get approved, I said these are the income limits per state statute per the funding sources. These are the caps of the incomes that can be served was to satisfy that state statute. It does not matter on the price of the home. What what limits the price of the home is not state statute but the income of the household. So an income at a a household at a restricted income cannot afford cannot qualify for a mortgage that exceeds their limits. I appreciate that, but that's not answering my question because my question is, how can TIFF dollars be used to provide down payment assistance >> through section 469 1.1761 subdivision 2. That's an allowable use of those TI funds. >> Okay. I didn't hear the part that said TIFF funds could be used to provide down payment. I heard the qualifications for income level and other things. >> Well, that that is this the a section that is regarding TIFF, excuse me. And so we went to due to some residential concerns, we did go to the office of the state auditor and they said, "What state statute did you use to justify this program?" And we mentioned these statutes and he said, "Okay." So he said it was an appropriate use. >> Yep. The satis the state auditor satisfied. >> Okay. >> Jason Nord, the tip district director at the office of the state auditor >> ba based on these statutes. >> Um maybe I just I still don't get it totally but thank you. I will go read those statutes more. >> Yeah. No, I mean, and so before getting that program approved, um it was vetted and discussed with the um attorney and our financial adviser to make sure that this was an eligible use of those funds and this was confirmed by the state auditor. >> Thank you. >> Any other questions for Mr. Nundorf? >> All right. The >> You had a few. >> Oh, okay. Is there a motion to approve resolution 2025-101 amending the spending plan for the South Hill 2 Pentagon Park and 70th and Cahill tax and government financing districts as recommended by staff? >> So moved. >> Second. >> Braggy moves. Member Jackson seconds the motion as stated to approve resolution 2025-101. Further discussion. Yes. >> But that's the the question I had on how we can use those funds. How do we resolve that the budget? Can we use these funds to >> for in for infrastructure that's related to like well the best example is the the Finch infrastructure, right? >> But I think you're saying that there's no way we could we can earmark them for that. We couldn't say we will only use them for projects that would otherwise be would impact the general levy. My understanding of the of the legislation >> is that the project has to originate as a privately funded project. >> So, for example, the Finch started off as a private apartment building >> that needed a new driveway. Um, and then we jump on on that, but the private piece needs to come first. >> Got it. Thank you. >> Okay. Any further discussion? All those in favor of adoption of the motion is resolution In favor of adoption of resolution 2025-101, say I. >> I. >> I. Opposed. >> Carried. 32. Motion's approved. Resolution 2025-101 is approved. All right. Uh, I don't think we've got any correspondence that's come in. Clerk Allison, I don't you would have you would have been waving it in the air if we had some important. Uh, manager comments. >> Thank you, your honor. Uh, just a two quick comments. One, just to reference the board and commission interview and selection process u memo that's in that's in my section of the packet. Um, it's going to look a lot look and feel a lot like previous years in terms of how we conduct the interviews and in small interview teams. Um that process is going to start here in just a couple of weeks and uh we'll we'll then be open until uh January. So look for that and the dates of the interview the the the interviews and the u selection process meetings are also scheduled as well and MJ has been working on that. Okay. The second item for me is just to give you a a quick explanation of what happened on election day. Um what happened on election day for us was this was the first election day in 50some years that uh clerk Allison's been working elections here in in Adina that we haven't had we haven't had a a odd year election because the schools have switched to to pre have switched to even we've always been on even uh normally in in the past in the past we have always had an we've always had an election on even and odd number years. So, it was never really a question about whether we could have a meeting or not because every year was election year. This year, we didn't have an election within the corporate limits of the city. And it was been it had been our interpretation of the law that said you can't have a meeting on an election day if an election is occurring in your city. We did not interpret that to understand that that folks who vote in the Richfield schools and Hopkins schools, they vote in those school district races in those two cities. Actually, we don't have any balloting that's going on in in in our city. Um, however, we we had a chance to talk with legal adviserss and they advised us that even though those elections weren't occurring in our city, we should recognize that we had residents who were who were uh participating in elections on that day. So, that's where the decision came from to close the close the meeting. We didn't want to put anything at risk uh as if it were approved in a in an improper council meeting. So, that's what happened. Uh, going forward, uh, we'll indicate election day, whether it's an odd year or even year, uh, on all of our calendars when we bring them to council for approval. >> Very good. Questions for manager Neil? >> Thanks. >> All right, Council Member Agno, you want to lead us off on comments? >> I don't have any tonight. Thank you. Member Pierce. >> I don't have any comments either. >> Okay. Member Jackson. >> Well, I see the invitation to what I was going to reference on your on your pile. I went to uh the new opening of the new exhibit at the Edina Historical Society from farm to city on Friday night. It's very nicely done and I enjoyed it. I want to say thank you to them. Yesterday I want to ride along with our uh firefighters down at new station number two. So I want to thank Josh and Brady, Nick and Austin for being my host. I had a very interesting time and uh uh always have appreciated the work that they do, but it has been uh elevated from that experience. So thanks. >> Thanks member Risser. I do have something. Um, and I've been working on this. I meant to read it at our last meeting, but it was cancelled. Um, it's been an honor to represent Edina residents on city council, and I am looking forward to serving next year. I've done my utmost to adhere to the code of conduct ethics for council members. Per the code, I strive to prepare for issues at hand. It's part of informed decisionmaking. It is necessary to fulfill my oath of office to serve to the best of my abilities and for me it's necessary to determine what a good investment of tax dollars is. The section role of council staff and commissions includes we are all part of a team committed to the residents of Edina both today and in the future. These are very general goals. How individuals interpret them as well as how they interpret code, state statute, and federal standards varies. For me, um there have been cases where I feel I haven't been prepared adequately. I know it is not staff's responsibility to provide all of the information, but frequently I fear or I feel that there are critical elements that are missing. Um I'm also concerned about how information is conveyed to other governing bodies. It's my understanding the legislative tax committee was not informed about the additional 4.86 86 million um of spark funds when they were asked to pass special legislation allowing Edina to extend the 7200 7250 France tiff district. I do know the tax committee was not informed the 70th and France tiff district needs the city to take on the risk of building the parking ramp to jumpstart development. At the August 19th council meeting, I was told the tax committee did not receive this information because it was not within their purview. Again, different views. Um, I feel differently. I believe state lawmakers need to know about that. I also believe I should have known about that the city having to assume park ramp construction risk before I approved the legislative agenda. U, we're talking about the Grand View Pedestrian Bridge. We're working with the DOJ to address ADA requirements. Um, I went back and I reviewed meetings. At the June 24th, 2021 HR meeting, commissioners approved dedicating 2 million in TIFF to that project. There existed at that time three safeways to get across the tracks. Vernon Avenue, Eden Avenue, and Gus Young Lane. These weren't discussed, but the project was to encourage use of the parking ramp. There was no mention of weight capacity limitations, no mention that the ramp is not ADA compliant, and that future development was necessary to complete the project. Um, I'm concerned about the spark loan to the Chamber of Commerce to renovate office space at 7201 Metro Boulevard for the Adina Innovation Lab, a for-profit BC Corp. This involved moving our visitor bureau explore Dina from Edinburghough. In the original agreement, Explore Dina covered 25% of the rent in this new space. Explore Dina is funded through the lodging tax governed by the state. 95% must go to marketing and promoting the city or town as a tourist or convention center. At the April 10th HR meeting, I asked whether Explore Edina was ex assisting in paying back the Edina Innovation Lab loan. I was told we can't directly use lodging tax in the repayment of the loan. So, we have made a slight shift in resources. Rent and salaries are the biggest expenses. There's more abundant budget in Explore Dina. Explore Dina is paying 60% of the rent and salaries. This allows the chamber to create a fund for repaying back the loan. Again, differing opinions, but more dialogue about this allocation of resources is needed and I should not have to ask for this information. When I ran for office, I knew I would have to do additional research in addition to the packet. Again, staff cannot provide everything. Um, I was concerned and remain concerned about three purely residential projects built on commercially zoned land in the Wooddale Valley View neighborhood. Uh, before they were built, language existed in our code preventing this. No part of any dwelling unit shall be located in a basement or on the first story of a building in the PCD1 or PCD2 subd district. This was in special requirements. Now, that language is also under conditional uses. One unit in the townhouse development has a legal buildable area that appears to be a tenth the size of its actual footprint. Uh setback variances were huge. I'm concerned about the resulting safety because the driveways are so close to the sidewalk. I knew I would have to engage in additional research to make informed decisions before I ran. Um but I feel too often basic information is missing. When I think about pursuing a second term, I realize I won't be able to take the oath of office to serve to the best of my abilities. Um, I'm not getting what I need to do that out of respect for the citizens I represent. I will not be seeking another term. Um, I've enjoyed and I we will continue to be together until December of 2026. So, um, thank you. >> Thank you for that. Um, okay. For me, uh, I guess we could put up that remember Jackson mentioned the, uh, exhibit grand opening over at the Udan Historical Society, the U Edina from farm to city. It made me think of, uh, Frank Carterell when I was over there on Friday night with Council Member Jackson. It was a nice event and I've got some really interesting things to see over there. It's not a real expansive exhibit, but it's got some really wonderful things. I don't know where they even found some of that material that's that's uh from another era. And it's great that it was around and and displayable. Uh so we uh last Thursday the Rotaries had Veterans Day in Edina. And then uh at 4:00 on Thursday afternoon, we had the funeral service for Frank Carterell. And uh I think many folks in Indiana don't know who he was. Um he can't really claim that his ancestors came to America on the Mayflower, but he could state with historical accuracy that his great-grandfather Roberts was a signatory on the new charter for the village of United in the late 1800s when we left Richfield Township. And in uh 1951, he was in the Adina, the first graduating class from Edina High School. >> And there were still six of them, seven of them around this summer with that got together and had a nice meal together. And I stopped by there to say hi to him at Edina Country Club. Uh but he essentially grew up and stayed in Edina his entire life except for the military. And he was a surveyor. I think he he and his dad probably surveyed uh most of Edina and Eden Prairie, a lot of it anyway. in streets that will forever uh be here. I think Lois Lane, Robert's Place, Wyman Avenue, Amy Drive, Sun Road, names that he gave those streets. And I dare to think that there's probably a nook or cranny, not a nook or cranny in that he didn't uh know something about. Uh in fact, his son told me they were driving by Morningside Church one time and his son said, "Oh, there's no elevator in that church." She said, "Oh, yeah. There's an elevator in there." And they told him right where it was. Um, and he spent 67 years in the United Rotary. He helped start the United Historical Society. Uh, he helped start the Fourth of July parade and he helped build our Veterans Memorial. Uh, so he was quite a guy and uh he'll be he'll be missed. 93 a long rich life and uh he was happy to the end. And uh his son called me on a Sunday night. he was up in Methodist Hospital and said, "Hey, dad would like to see the mayor. Can you come up?" And so Larry and I went up there to see him on a Sunday night and and it wasn't weaker so later that he passed away. So it was good to see him before he uh before he departed. So So Frank, yeah, here's to you. Thanks for all the Thanks for being a great resident, a great husband, great father, all the things that are important. Thanks very much. And that's it for me. um tab tomorrow and I'm going to try to get uh uh them to come over from the Southwest LRT quarter management office to give us an update. It's 90% complete now. They're just in that testing phase. They'll be doing that this whole year 2026. Still got some construction to do in Minneapolis, but it's um it's pretty much done everywhere else. So, uh, anybody else have anything for the good of the order? >> Okay. Is there a motion to adjurnn? >> So, move second. >> We got a a lot of a lot of enthusiasm around adjouring here. I mean, I don't know who to attribute it to. Well, any Okay, let's move >> Pierce and Agnu. >> There you go. >> All right, we'll give Jackson and Pierce or reverse, whatever you want. All those in favor of German say I. >> I opposed. Carried. >> Stand adjourned.