[0:28] for [0:58] e [1:28] e [1:58] e [2:28] e e [3:27] here we go well good evening everybody and welcome [3:33] to the Adina city council meeting it is Wednesday August 7th 2024 uh I think our uh communications [3:40] director director Jennifer benro has told everybody about how we're running this uh our meetings on a hybrid basis [3:46] people are tuned in remotely uh you know on a virtual basis and can call in in different forms and [3:53] Fashions uh when the time comes and uh there's a there's a public hearing tonight and also Community comment [3:59] couple OPP unities to participate in the meeting and um I think on the screen if [4:04] we can get up on the screen that information uh that would be helpful uh if you want to call in the [4:11] community comment comes up particularly quick in the meeting so make sure that you have this information uh at hand [4:17] we'll get it back on the screen here but if you can write it down now and you're listening in remotely and want to speak to the council about a matter of concern [4:24] to you or participate in that public hearing uh we want to make sure that you have that opportunity so having provided [4:30] this information uh I'm now going to call the meeting to order and I'm going to ask our clerk Sharon Allison to call [4:36] the role clerk Allison council member Agy here council member Jackson here council member Pierce here council [4:42] member rer here mayor hin here next is the Pledge of [4:49] Allegiance of aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the [4:54] Republic for which it stands one nation under God invisible with liy and justice [5:02] for all thank you folks and we've got a meeting agenda [5:09] that's been published uh in advance of the meeting of course so the public can see it and our council members can see [5:15] it is there anyone that wishes to U modify the meeting agenda any former fashion staff standpoint city council [5:21] standpoint is there a motion to approve the meeting meeting agenda as published so moved second M Jackson moves member [5:27] Pier seconds the adoption of the meeting agenda is published uh any further discussion all those in favor of [5:33] adopting the meeting agenda is published say I I I pose carried the meeting agenda is approved and now we are back [5:40] at Community comment um and uh we're going to first talk to [5:45] folks in the uh in the council chambers and so if you're uh at home and want to [5:51] get those numbers in front of you we can put them on the screen right now they're coming up in front of you uh but let's [5:57] go first to community comment by any of our fellow residents that wish to address the Council on a matter of [6:03] concern to them that's not on the agenda this evening or otherwise scheduled for a future public hearing and uh welcome [6:10] welcome my name is Ralph siker I live at 4311 cornelus Circle good evening council members and [6:17] residents of Adina I'm here tonight to talk about Tiff increment [6:24] financing which as it's being used in a Dina is no more than a gift [6:30] a gift to developers in the June 19th 2024 Star [6:38] Tribune and in that article a quote associated with mayor hland regarding [6:43] the Macy's site this is one of the best pieces of property in town let me repeat that this [6:52] is one of the best pieces of property in town yet the city manager and the mayor [6:58] can't move fast enough enough to have residents shoulder the $22 million of [7:03] improvements to this site that's $1,000 for every household in a [7:09] Dina improvements like public art which already exists improvements like a bike [7:16] path that already exists the developers Representative Patrick Brahma of Enclave was also [7:23] quoted in that article saying the project would not be financially feasible without Tiff I say the [7:29] developer should should restructure the project after the Uproar of the deed tax [7:36] this past December you'd have thought the city had learned its lesson about bringing forward a tax on residents [7:42] without a public hearing yet on August 25th during the HRA meeting staff asked [7:47] for the approval of a preliminary letter of intent to gift the developer Enclave [7:53] some $22 million a position supported by the mayor but thankfully not supported by [8:00] members R Risser and members Pierce residents of [8:08] AD take this into account as you make your decision this [8:16] fall interesting approach Mr [8:23] ziker David Frankl 4510 l f drivea uh as you're all aware apparently the citizens [8:30] of AD residents are facing a pretty high Mill Levy increase next year probably [8:35] double digits it's an election year I'm not quite sure how that's this is getting pushed through but the reason [8:41] I'm speaking as you're all aware there's a hurricane sitting off the east coast of the United States hurricane Debbie in [8:49] California there's the fourth largest forest fire the uh Library no it's [8:54] called the park fire uh those fires are forcing up everybody's insurance rates [8:59] home insurance rates I just got a call from my insurance agent last week starting this month my total combined [9:06] home vehicle insurance rates are going up $44,000 a year and I have a modest [9:13] sized house when you talk about missing and a the missing middle affordable housing this is going to be part of [9:20] people not be able to afford a house this is being played out already in Florida and California where the middle [9:26] class is being forced out of their homes because of High insurance rates we're [9:31] going to start seeing that here in Minnesota and probably here in ID as well the other issue is as Ralph pointed [9:39] to with Tiff uh the two major Tiff projects that have been built with Tiff [9:46] money the parking garage over at uh nor over at Pentagon Park was essentially [9:52] just being used for an apartment parking on the lower level but the other issue is the bridge over here pedestrian [9:58] bridge Grand View which is closed uh there's been no update on what's going [10:04] on with the US Department of Justice inquiry as to ADA compliance with that structure that inquiry started in uh [10:13] February I believe and there was recently a structural inspection of the bridge of the ramp it attaches to and [10:20] there's been nothing on that as well uh since they're both attached it'd be nice to know what the status of that [10:27] inspection is and if that's been for for to the United States Department of Justice also like to know why there is [10:33] no record anywhere on a City website about that investigation Federal agency investigating city of viina and you've [10:39] done an excellent job of wiping that off the city website I would think and for [10:45] transparency the city should put a web page up of what's going on with that [10:50] what the US Department of Justice is doing thank [10:56] you anyone else to address the Council on a matter of [11:02] concern to [11:10] them okay Janie Weston 6136 Brookview Avenue I am back to [11:17] trees um I have as some of you know two very large Bur Oak trees in my front [11:24] yard my neighbor has three very large oak trees in her front yard [11:30] we just had our trees treated for two-lined Chestnut borer which is [11:36] quickly killing many many oak trees in [11:43] Idina um one place that I have noticed just driving by and walking through the [11:50] um uh park roson park by the City swimming pool has oak trees dying [11:59] um it costs a lot of money to have these beautiful oak trees taken [12:07] down one way the city can save itself a considerable amount of money is to have [12:15] these trees treated for instance these are the [12:22] numbers um a 28 in diameter Burr Oak [12:27] cost 200 $52 there's tax also but $252 to treat it for 2 years that lasts [12:38] for 2 years that may be the only treatment it will ever need it will be [12:44] re-evaluated free of charge in 2 years the cost to take down that same tree [12:52] would probably cost me $3 to $4,000 now the city has a number of big [13:01] beautiful bur Oaks on City Parkland and Boulevard [13:07] property it would behoove the city to treat these trees have them evaluated by [13:15] a knowledgeable arborist have them treated and it may save the city [13:23] thousands and thousands of dollars this is only purely econom omics and it also [13:30] helps keep our tree canopy beautiful our trees alive and it then also does not [13:39] allow these insects to spread to private homeowners trees you might have a lot of [13:46] very angry homeowners whose trees get infected or [13:51] Infested by City owned trees so this is a no-brainer to me save some money thank [13:58] you miss that was a good information to get from you thank [14:04] you we'll uh make our arborous may know all about it but we'll make sure that we [14:10] check good evening good evening name is Steve Brown I live a 5528 Halifax [14:17] Lane uh I think many of you are aware that last night was National Night Out [14:22] and that is a night when many neighborhoods hold block parties we were hosting a block party last evening [14:30] um and my wife organized a visit by the Adina Police [14:39] Department my purpose tonight is to commend and thank the Adina Police [14:47] Department I couldn't have been more impressed we had three officers show up [14:56] they were friendly they were courteous they were refresh and they were truly interested in [15:02] engaging with all of us they showed up at six the party was [15:08] supposed to start at six as you know people drift into these block parties so [15:14] they had to wait they waited patiently they talked to the few folks that were there more people showed up they talked [15:21] to those folks they passed out cards they gave out all of the things that [15:26] they make available for all the kids to play with they were [15:34] terrific they also uh we had requested a drone demonstration and they did a [15:40] fabulous job demonstrating this drone technology if you haven't seen it it is [15:45] really impressive and incredible uh they had their drone 189 ft in the air and [15:51] they could zoom down and show individual people standing at our block party [15:59] talking to a [16:05] neighbor they were very impressive and I want to thank them again for that it was really great I do [16:13] want to mention that we've done this for a number of years and we've always had somebody from the City come out the fire [16:19] department the public works department are equally impressive so thank you to [16:26] all those folks thank you so much Mr [16:35] Brown anyone else in the audience let me turn now to [16:40] director benro see if we have anybody online who wishes to uh speak to the Council on a matter of concern to them I [16:46] do not have anyone on the line tonight okay very good uh in in terms of [16:51] National Night Out I think all of us will probably talk about that later on Mr Brown you kind of primed a pump on that conversation I think most of us [16:58] were at 400 or 5 last night and uh had police officers with us or fire department personnel and in many [17:05] different neighborhoods and it was really the weather couldn't have been better for a a wonderful night out uh [17:12] that had National implications so we'll talk about that a little bit later in the meeting uh let me turn now to our [17:19] city manager who will address whether there were any Community comments at the last city council meeting that he needs [17:25] to address at this particular point in time and incidentally for these comments that were made this evening we'll have [17:31] responses on the city website by the end of the week uh and then we'll follow up [17:36] with manag Neil at the next council meeting who will give a summary of what was uh provided for information uh on [17:43] the on the website so manager Neil thank you your honor we did have three questions uh posed at our last meeting [17:50] the first one was when is the school district notified of of proposed uh projects in a Dina uh they are propos [17:57] they are they informed when there's a compant Amendment or when they have property that fit within the the buffer [18:04] uh that is required by city code so that they they have that kind of of of land [18:10] owner status that any private land owner does so they're informed in that way uh [18:15] the second question was is the school district notified when tax increment financing is proposed the answer is yes [18:22] uh there's a Minnesota state statutes requires the city to notify other taxing [18:27] bodies including the school district s that are involved and we have a long history of complying with with the law [18:33] in that regard uh final question was can the city can the can the school district [18:39] provide feedback on tax and current financing proposals uh yes they can and [18:45] uh they don't often do that uh but they can do that uh I will also tell you that [18:51] um these questions kind of inspired staff to meet with our financial advisers at Ellers uh they are in the [18:58] latter St stages of preparing a pretty informative presentation on cities uh [19:04] schools and tax incret financing that they will deliver at your HRA meeting [19:09] next Thursday morning thank you uh anything further [19:16] from Council Members based on the comments of our city manager all right very good uh let's move on to the uh [19:23] consent agenda and uh is there anyone on the council that wishes to remove an item from the consent agenda um item [19:30] 61 6.1 6.1 yes thank you uh other than 6.1 which are the proposed minutes of [19:37] the uh the draft minutes of the July 16 2024 city council meeting regular and [19:42] work session is there anyone else that wishes to remove an item from the consent agenda with the exception of item 6.1 is [19:49] there a motion to adopt the balance of the consent agenda items in the single motion so moved I second member Jackson [19:55] moves member U seconds the adoption of the items on the consent agend uh in a single motion with the exception [20:01] of item 6.1 any further discussion all those in favor of adoption of the motion of stated say I I I oppose carried all [20:09] the items on the consent agenda with the exception of 6.1 are adopted and now [20:14] let's turn to those minutes uh that um uh member rer wanted toh discuss and [20:20] I'll get those up online um just as background I know um in the past we've talked about how it's not really [20:26] appropriate to bring up minutes during a meeting I did request changes um but the [20:32] changes that I wanted I did not see this is item number eight see the sketch plan [20:38] for 6016 Vernon Avenue and um one of my biggest concerns is that it's possibly [20:45] to have that entrance off of Vernon does not follow our code and in the minutes it's noted that the city engineer [20:52] clarified that curb cuts on Vernon are managed by henpen County not city code I'm not debating that I know that's true [20:59] but in our city code um chapter 24 Article 4 division 2 item 7 uh it says [21:05] clearly that when properties adjoin more than one street driveway shall be restricted if possible to the street [21:11] with a lower volume of traffic and then there's additional restrictions that apply to Lots in the R1 and R2 district [21:19] and um I really think this is relevant enough that it should be in the minutes [21:24] and so that's why I'm bringing it up and my understanding is also that if minutes are approved D you cannot go back and [21:30] open them up and make amendments so that is why I am bringing this forward all right well we'll assume [21:36] you're bringing it forward as an informational item because what the minutes are quoting is a quote from our [21:41] city engineer and uh since he did not provide that information I think you're you're saying you're want to provide it [21:48] on an informational basis after the fact no I'm not um I am saying that I raised [21:53] that information at our meeting last time I think it is highly relevant that [21:58] we that having that entrance could violate city code and I made that point [22:04] and I think that that is a valid thing and people may disagree with me on that and that is fine but I wanted to pull [22:10] this out and highlight that um and I can you know vote against this you all can [22:15] vote for it but I I do think it is a relevant thing that we might be violating code with these projects that [22:22] come off of Vernon just looking at other [22:31] um portions of the minutes that deal with any potential comments by council members and and I'm not seeing [22:39] any um so the manner in which the minutes [22:44] are taken uh is meant to be I think we talked about this meant to be a summary uh not a [22:50] Verbatim uh action not a retim effort U I think the uh tape itself is [22:57] the uh official record but nonetheless um if you want to make a motion to amend [23:03] those minutes to include that information and and craft it for me so I know where to suggest it be placed we [23:09] can have a conversation about it I would be I would be happy to do [23:17] that just want to make sure we have the timing down so would we vote on this at our next [23:22] meeting yeah we can hold them I mean there's no there's no urgency to adopting the minut of U of the meeting [23:30] of July this was the regular city council meeting minutes the session minutes you had no problem with those [23:36] memb sir I had the work session minutes I have no [23:42] problems with the work session so it's the uh city council member u city council meeting minutes so the regular [23:48] meeting that you right correct making your comments about okay uh well let's [23:54] maybe entertain a motion to adopt the work session minutes for July 162 24 and [23:59] hold over the city council uh regular meeting minutes for our next meeting so [24:04] move a second mov member U seconds the motion is dated any further conversation on that motion all those in favor of [24:11] adoption of that motion say I I I opposed carried uh we hereby adopt the minutes of the work session on July 16 [24:18] 2024 and we defer and postpone a decision on the July 16 2024 city [24:24] council regular meeting minutes until the next regular meeting of the city council [24:32] um all right now we are on to um that portion of the agenda which tonight only [24:38] has one item involved and this is a special recognitions and presentations portion of the [24:44] agenda and we've we know we've all been uh subjected to I think as residents and [24:50] council members the work that's going on outside City Hall here uh but uh our uh [24:57] director of engineering Chad M and Lindsay Lawrence who's here the project manager from tkda is going to [25:02] bring us up to speed on the Vernon Avenue and Highway 100 interchange project that uh that we're working on as [25:09] well and preparing for so thank you mayor thanks for the introduction yeah work you referen is really a city [25:15] project right now outside City Hall with 50th Street going on it's so different project but preparing for this big [25:21] interchange project so I wanted to welcome Lindsay Lawrence with tkda she's been managing a great team of Engineers [25:27] and architects inst structal engineers and storm water professionals and lots of other people and they've done a lot [25:33] of work for us on this project so uh we'll go through and give you guys an update she'll run through schedule and [25:38] then I'll end with some funding comments and get some direction from you so again I wanted to make sure [25:44] we understand how we got to this point right the project goals these were the goals we laid out at the start of the project to improve safety and Mobility [25:50] for all users create those new separated pedestrian routes improve traffic operations consolidate those Highway 100 [25:57] access points and improve that connectivity between residential and Commercial areas of the district limit [26:02] those construction impacts and we're doing that by uh combining the city and the county projects and doing it in one year and then enhance the economic [26:09] viability with that improved access so how did we get there so in 2018 henen County had a vir a bridge the [26:17] Vernon Avenue Bridge that needed some work it was ready for replacement they received Regional solicitation funding [26:23] so during design when TK be began the design and lindsy and her team began the design of that we learned that they had [26:29] to raise that bridge quite a bit over the rail and that the improvements had to extend to Highway 100 Bridge um I was [26:36] concerned about that because with Federal funding you can't touch stuff for 20 plus years so we would lose an opportunity to really have the vision of [26:42] the district the Grand View District if we didn't potentially get some Regional funding and federal funding ourselves so [26:48] in 21 and 22 we applied and we're successful on getting $4.2 million to do [26:54] uh a project and if you remember we originally wanted to do a Divergent diamond and interchange and reuse that [27:00] bridge and this was the concept and we had some struggles getting our partners to uh accept that kind of project there [27:06] with mot henen County um and it was kind of a unique thing within an urban area to put on this site but we could reuse [27:12] the bridge that was a huge cost savings we ended up and and we had talked about this and the council approved we went to [27:18] the tight Diamond interchange more of a your typical interchange you see just right up the road on excelia Boulevard [27:23] but that requires a full Bridge replacement so that's where we are that's what uh we are moving forward [27:29] with for constructing next year this does open up space for fire station number three or an expanded Municipal [27:35] campus I think that's important to keep in mind and we'll talk a little bit more about that with the funding but I'll [27:40] hand it over to Lindsay to talk about schedule here as we work through all the different approvals that we had to get to to get to this point and then I'll [27:46] talk on funding after that thanks Chad uh so as Chad mentioned in December 2022 [27:52] we uh found out that the city got Federal funding um at that point we have we 90% complete with our plans for the [27:59] county portion of the project and therefore we started a compatibility analysis which really just um analyzed [28:07] how these two projects were going to come together and they overlapped so we needed to figure out the impacts of the [28:13] city's project if you will to the County's project and so we did that and realized that we could combine these [28:19] projects and um just be more efficient with them with the funding and so with that though we needed to um get henan [28:26] County um their fed Federal funding program extension for a year so we did that in February and that really allowed [28:33] us to combine both projects and move forward um between February and April [28:38] and May we went through that Alternatives analysis like Chad described and ultimately came up with a tight Diamond interchange concept and [28:46] from there and through the summer of 23 um we did our engineering all work and [28:52] came up with a layout that was eventually approved by mindat in September during those couple months [28:58] after September we were feverishly working on our 6% plans um through uh [29:03] and submitted in November um and at that time uh well I guess December and [29:09] January we submitted our bridge plans over a railroad um to with the railroad [29:14] for their review and to start the agreement process with them um shortly thereafter in February we submitted the [29:21] 90% plans for um the entire project and then ultimately the 100% plans um to [29:27] midot in May of 2024 um henip County was leading the acquisition of title and possession um [29:34] for um those Parcels that were impacted by the project and then go ahead Chad um [29:40] in Late July um we were we got authorization for federal funding which [29:45] basically means um we checked all the boxes um for all those requirements to [29:51] receive those federal funds for this project um and over the last month or two we've been trying to get agency [29:56] agreements between the city county and mindat and then of course cpkc uh rail [30:02] um and there's been some challenges there and so we're working through those but uh it has caused some delays um [30:09] about a month if you see those crossed out um months there so we're hoping to have the aggreement with the railroad [30:15] here by the end of August or at the latest middle of September and at that time we'll be allowed to advertise for [30:21] bids and then 3 weeks later open those bids um and review those and hopefully [30:27] award for contract cont ract in November um and by November 15th we hope um [30:34] actually will be allowed to start construction if we have a uh awarded a contract and uh that would begin with uh [30:41] tree removals and whatnot for the project but we do not plan to uh close the road until January and then it'll be [30:49] closed until November 25 um unless the contractor gets moving quickly uh or um [30:56] can open it sooner um I do expect the following spring of 26 that uh there [31:01] will be some close out items that they'll have to do just because it's Minnesota um there might be some uh Turf [31:07] establishment and whatnot that following spring but it will be completely buttoned up by 26 and I'll just offer that the city is [31:14] holding the entire contract you know we merged the project we took it over and we're going to hold and ask for Award of [31:19] a very large contract here in in November based on the schedule so if we get into the funding so this is the cost [31:25] estimates as of basically today if you know once we got through all the approvals and all the plans um in the [31:31] bottom me just get a pointer here so the total cost of the project [31:39] with engineering indirect and everything else is $27.4 million so total project [31:44] costs we can see between the two agencies we have 11.2 of federal funding part of the project between City County [31:50] and State uh 16.2 million are needed and then I broke it down by the three different agencies so henan county has [31:58] 11.7 million into the project we have 15.5 that we're responsible for and [32:04] mind's putting in 300,000 of capital funding on this project and I circled the 11.2 because that's the number we [32:11] got 4.2 of federal funding we need to come up with 11.2 million so then I go back and just give [32:18] you a snapshot in time so in May of 2023 the cost estimate at that time was for our portion was 11.6 it's gone up almost [32:25] $4 million and the reasons for that are um storm treatment systems and requirements by The Watershed have [32:31] changed since we started this analysis two to three years ago there's been two overhead signs that mot's requiring as [32:37] part of the project we got to take the signs off Eden Avenue Bridge and the Vernon Avenue Bridge one's uh completely [32:43] overhead one's a can levered we have cost participation policies between the agencies that have triggered some cost [32:49] increases and then just updating all the cost estimates this was nearly a year and a half ago and now we have better cost estimates and just know the actual [32:56] cost uh for construction so now we're in that June 2024 cost estimate and we're [33:01] at that 11.2 number again we haven't opened bids yet so we're hoping for good bids we think there's an opportunity [33:07] we've been seeing some good bids and we hopefully to see some reduction in these costs so I put unknown yet on what we [33:12] actually are going to come back here in November to to ask for and what our share will be if I look at that blue circle the 7.4 million so in May of 2023 [33:20] if you call that's about the time I came in front of you and gave you an update um at the time we had $2.1 million from [33:26] our Municipal state a account that that does the 40 mies of our Municipal state aid streets like 70th Street 50th [33:34] interlocking that we use to reconstruct those and we use a majority of that for reconstruction and I've stated many [33:39] times that that's a challenging uh fund to use because it's we don't get enough money that we need to keep up with that [33:46] at the time we we did a capital funding request for 5.3 million remember we did the tour over here at the historic [33:51] buildings for a bonding Bill well we all know that the bonding Bill did not happen in may we had $2 million in there [33:57] for this project but it didn't get passed so we didn't get that our backup at the time was using more state aid [34:03] funds or other grants so far we haven't got out of the grants and then I'll speak to a little bit of the MSA stuff [34:09] as a backup here in the next table so these are the June 2024 [34:14] estimates and again you see this is that 11.2 that we're responsible for the green circle I had earlier and then I [34:21] just laid out some options and possible bookmarks here for options so option one is are we going maybe we do all MS say [34:27] and we borrow ahead many years on our fund we do the 7.4 that we had originally planned and all this almost 4 [34:34] million that'd be 11.2 million out of our state aid account as a city engineer and have to manage streets I'm concerned [34:40] about going that far and then we could go the other Direction Where We bond for it and we consider this uh cost to [34:45] acquire that land because we're opening up that space for the municipal campus or the fire station number three so it [34:51] could be that could be covered there and then I said well there is other sources we can come up with that we can control [34:56] right now so options three and four alternate sources we could bring in some sewer water and storm sewer funds we [35:03] have those utilities on the project that's not an issue and we've reviewed kind of our numbers and we think we could go up to about 900,000 for that we [35:11] have PX fund we're doing a lot of big wide sidewalks and we're doing Street lighting so we could bring in some electrical operating budget and pack [35:17] fund for 400,000 uh Centennial Lakes Tiff is a real flexible a district and [35:22] that could be used here for some public improvements and working with Bill neindorf and we were estimated about 250,000 could come from there and then I [35:29] think the biggest thing that we really got to thank our mot Partners if you notice on the slide earlier they contributed 300,000 Capital they really [35:35] couldn't come to the table for Capital but they're providing about four staff members just to manage all of [35:41] construction they're going to be our construction they're going to have two inspectors surveying construction testing a project manager we're going to [35:47] hire Lindsay and her team to be the uh owner rep and the communications person but they're really covering it and we're [35:53] estimating that uh in kind donation for services at about 700,00 ,000 so that [35:58] was great and then we do have one Grant request still in for up to a million dollars we'll know more probably by the [36:05] time the award happens I think is is that we don't know if we'll get a million we'll take anything it could be [36:10] 100,000 up to a million we'll see how the other applications went in and then I just note the state bonding you know that's a discussion if next year isn't [36:17] typically a bonding bill but if they do we were going to continue to try to get money through that that cycle so when I [36:23] looked at those alternate sources now we're down a little less in 1 6 million to we have to come up with so could be [36:30] state aid and again I'm I'm concerned with our state aid account and it could be debt uh considered for fire station [36:37] land or we could do more on the debt side somewhere between these numbers or and help this 7.4 number so um any [36:45] questions on this table I guess I just want to stop there and see if there's any questions on possible options and [36:50] then my overall question I guess stay stay there for a second yeah let's find out they got any questions I think [36:56] member Jackson has some Others May and I do so let's start with member Jackson and move on to member U member Pierce [37:03] yes thank you Mr Mayor so my question is first of all thank you for all of this I [37:08] this is something I've wanted for over 20 years so getting this close is super exciting but I want to ask you about the [37:16] land what is the status of that land where the clo Leaf is now is and the [37:23] discussions with mindat about it yep we had preliminary discussions with the RightWay office they know our intent [37:30] that we'd like it basically just handed to the city for public purposes we would not hand it to a developer or any of [37:36] that sort um and the negotiations are still going they will not do that until the Project's done and the land's [37:41] available okay so we'll have preliminary discussions and keep having those but we won't have a formal agreement until [37:47] after that land becomes available after so when we're looking at bonding for the [37:53] fire station and the cost of land you've talked with Ellers and and um uh jayen [37:59] grin about the legality of of doing that right that that's within the possible uh [38:04] we can we've talked with Finance group and we've talked with uh a few other internal staff but we can my next slide [38:10] is a question what do you need from us when we come back with the award and if you need that kind of information we can bring that back yeah I I'd really like [38:15] to know how our funding and the menot land and everything melds together so [38:21] and and what what the options and risks are soal you got a comment on that yeah [38:27] I I just to say that uh I was part of a couple of of different calls that that [38:32] um uh director Milner was part of as well and there was some really some some positive reception to this idea right [38:39] that that this land could be used for this purpose in the future if we do ultimately get control of that land and [38:47] and do proceed with a fire station development at that side at that site we'll do the same thing we just did a [38:53] couple of years ago with fire station number two and go through a public process uh we'll bring to you with [39:00] zoning questions financing questions building questions all the same kinds of process will still follow all right [39:07] thanks for that any follow on there well that that [39:13] actually makes this much more difficult because if we have to pay to build the [39:18] bridge and then we DET can determine if we have the land after that and we're counting on $1.6 million of bonding for [39:27] fire station land it's kind of the cart before the horse that's that's my question I'm just trying to make a [39:33] connection that this bonding could be considered because in the other fire station it was a $15 million purchase we [39:39] could take that out and just say we're just paying for the project with $1.6 million of debt okay that simp I was [39:45] just trying to make a little Connection getting land much cheaper than a previous right okay wonderful thank you [39:51] yeah member Pierce member egno has decided to pass um [39:58] so I think my question is tangental to the that train of thought um of the [40:05] option um so options three and four um you highlighted um the creativity there [40:13] and so one thing just thanks for the creativity and trying to figure out uh how to close that Gap um so my question [40:22] is of what you have here what's your confidence [40:28] factor that the number that you have is something that we'll be able to deliver [40:33] on so take water sanitaries uh storm sewer utilities [40:39] 900,000 100% confidence Factor so if you could just go through those and yep and [40:45] just let us know how confident you are that we'll we'll be able to do that and if you're not prepared to do that we can [40:51] certainly bring that back yeah no I I can do most of those right now so all four of these alternates that's % [40:57] confidence can do that then there's the you know this discussion up here is the other the 4.2 million uh Federal that's [41:05] guaranteed you know that's there so it's just our share of of you know it's anywhere between 1.6 and you know 9 [41:12] million there that we got to decide how much of our state aid account do we want to use and borrow a head on okay okay [41:18] thank you member rer and this relates to what um member Jackson was asking about I [41:26] have heard somewhere outse there is a really old map that indicates who owns [41:32] the area where we have the entrance and exit Loops that are going to be removed [41:37] and um I am wondering if we could get a copy of that I was told it was really [41:44] hard to get a hold of and I've never seen it but it my understanding is that part of this land is owned by the city [41:50] of Edina part of its own by mot but if we could just have a document that [41:56] clarified who owns all of that land yeah we have it it's been not owned I thought [42:01] the same thing I saw some old easements that showed that might have been city of V that's not it's not it's totally mind [42:07] it's been confirmed by various uh mind. RightWay staff and when Bill was working on the legal descriptions for the [42:13] historic property okay confirmed confirmed it so it's mindat property but if if you could just send that that [42:18] would be fantastic thank you y I want to go back to the funding [42:24] because I think uh our collect Ive goal here would be not to borrow any money if we could [42:30] possibly avoid it so um I'm thinking uh let's go back to the legislature with a [42:35] bonding request and and we may know you know by February or March if we're going to get that bonding request done and it [42:43] wasn't that we were turned down last time it just there was no bonding Bill exactly and then secondly uh I'm looking [42:50] at you know you had the map up of the project um or the layout the diagram the [42:57] tight Diamond interchange we've got some non-motorized movement capability there that we built in so that people could [43:03] get safely back and forth across the bridge whether it's on bike or or their [43:08] pedestrians and so that brings to mind that new fund that we have that the legislature created last year which is [43:15] that active Transportation fund and that's going to be running through the tab as part of the regional [43:22] solicitation and I I think that would be something we'd want to go back on and ask for uh funding for from the active [43:30] Transportation fund it's about 25 million EUR coming to the region and that will be scored on a competitive [43:36] basis but I I would think this project would score very highly and that might be another potential source of revenue [43:42] for us as opposed to borrowing ahead on our uh Municipal state aid source of [43:49] funds so couple of ideas there thank you and then when I I was think as you were as you were giving the presentation um [43:56] you and uh Miss Lawrence and we were looking at the the PowerPoint page that had the uh [44:03] projected 11mon closure of 50th Street uh I couldn't help but think about uh 169 when they redid the bridge [44:10] out there and we decided to just tell mot to accelerate it and get it done in one year instead of two years uh but one [44:18] of the things I think they did was they built the bridges remote and then they brought in the decks at least the decks [44:25] maybe they built the structure for the Bridges and they brought in the decks as I recall uh that were remotely [44:31] constructed so that the you had some acceleration on the on the overall construction time so to the extent we [44:38] can encourage anything like that I don't know if these types of bridges would be conducive for remote con remote [44:44] construction uh the way it's designed right now it's not no it has to be built in place well you'd have to design it to [44:51] be built that way um and right now it is not um but it is um relatively quick uh [44:58] bridge to construct I know 11 months is a long time for you guys but they are pre-cast beams that will be placed uh [45:04] over 100 that speeds up a lot of things and then what has to be taken into account is the foundation so there's [45:12] going to be pile driving um and then you just got to cure the concrete um for everything to be safe for um public to [45:19] yeah but I know as your overall strategy you you you know people have to move back and forth between West Edina and [45:25] East Edina so you'll have some alternative routes that hopefully work better than what we got right now yeah [45:30] and Lindsay's team has met with contractors what can we do to compress the schedule what's going to help you build this faster just like those beams [45:36] are built off site they're Brad in so we've had those conversations with contractors to try to shrink it as much [45:42] as possible because we want to get this one done and then get out of here we've had enough construction have you had any [45:47] conversations internally about uh you know talking to mot about getting these Bridges remotely constructed or does [45:53] that raise the cost it raises the cost cost significantly signant yeah okay [45:59] understood all right anything else that caus anything for anybody all right so I guess yeah I'm hearing what we'll bring [46:05] back an analysis uh after the bids are open and have some ideas and then um we don't need to know the the debt question [46:12] or the MSA question because a lot of these funds are available right away so it's more towards the end of the project but we want to make you aware of it [46:17] you're having more budget discussions and CIP discussions this year so appreciate the opportunity to give you an update thank you very good thank you [46:25] m Lawrence thanks for being with us this evening thank you for your [46:33] time all right uh that concludes that portion of the agenda the special presentations and recognitions portion [46:40] and we've got one public hearing matter this evening and director Teague has this and this has been through the Planning Commission uh and came through [46:48] with a unanimous vote of approval of of the Planning Commission um and it's the [46:53] um preliminary site plan review and zoning ordinance Amendment proposed for 7200 France and director Teague has the [47:00] matter and then we're going to have a presentation by the uh applicant and um [47:05] we're going to have a public hearing on the matter and and I think staff is suggesting that we keep the public input [47:11] aspect of it open until Sunday August 11 and then we take action on it at the next city council meeting on August 20th [47:17] so I'll turn with that I'll said I'll turn to director Teague that's correct thank you mayor members of the council [47:24] this is a project that we've been we've entertained probably six seven different [47:29] development projects over the last 10 years uh two puds have been approved [47:36] over the last five years or so I'll run through a little bit of that history here as as we get into it currently the [47:44] site is vacant the two Office Buildings and there was a parking ramp on the site [47:49] um have been removed so the site's located on the west side of France it's guided in our comprehensive plan for [47:56] office and residential use it's this light pink area within the comprehensive plan um [48:04] this area on the west side of France is defined as a transition zone a transition from higher density in [48:12] between France and York to a little bit more moderate density as it transitions [48:18] into the single family neighborhoods to the West this was considered as part of [48:24] each of those PUD rezonings that that took place on the site 2019 and [48:30] 2022 and 23 so the site is zoned planned unit [48:35] development it's our planned unit development 16 originally zoned that way [48:40] in 2019 and then a new uh project was approved in [48:46] 2023 so this on the screen is the current PUD that was approved for the [48:53] site and public hearings held in 22 and final approval in [48:59] 2023 so what that included for phase one was construction of [49:06] 124,000 Ft office with a coffee shop below as part of that first phase all of [49:12] the Landscaping that you see was to be installed there's an infiltration Basin [49:18] right here that was to be constructed the site sits low and a lot of the adjacent properties drains to the site [49:25] so they're they're taking care care of of water within this area and they received a final sight [49:33] plan for that phase one phase two was the site that we're considering today it [49:40] was just approved as part of the overall development plan for there was some restrictions within the Pud that set the [49:47] height at 72 feet um first floor elevation at 16 ft when the traffic [49:54] study was done for that PUD it was contemplated for 150 units of housing [50:00] along with 10,000 square ft of retail on the first level um there was talk of a hotel at [50:07] that time or Hospitality but that was not included in the original traffic study that was [50:14] done so here's a look at the Pud that was approved again here's the 124,000 [50:20] square foot office building you can see the the drainage area and there's a [50:25] series of uh sidewalks in and around it the north south um vehicular bike [50:34] trail and pedestrian north south through the site as well as The Pedestrian um Trail East West [50:43] through so to back up again and give a little bit more of that history that [50:49] 2019 original PUD that I mentioned um this is a look at that development that [50:56] was approved but never built it was to include about 299 apartment units in two buildings and [51:04] 30,000 square ft of retail and office on the first levels of those buildings it [51:10] did set up that north south connection through the site as well as the East [51:16] West Connection there was also to be 10 town home units and this was part of [51:22] that transition into the neighborhood with the higher building along France [51:27] and then stepping down as it transitions to the West that project was never built [51:35] um so in 2022 the current applicant the applicant before us this evening came in [51:41] with a sketch plan to consider what what I had just went through with the the Pud [51:46] that exists for the site public hearings were held in September and October of 22 [51:53] and in in February of 23 that final resoning was granted to amend that [52:00] overall development plan in March of March and April of 23 [52:08] they did come forward again with a sketch plan proposal to consider the hotel reason they came back with the [52:15] sketch plan was that traffic study didn't include what the impacts would be for a hotel so they wanted to get a [52:22] reading of the Planning Commission and Council for um [52:27] constructing that hotel they chose not to pursue that and so now our before the [52:33] city C well let me back up again so the processes that have gone through in the [52:39] last five years we've essentially gone through this PUD process two times 2018 [52:46] 2019 with public hearings held at Planning Commission and city council with that revised plan in [52:53] 2022 again public hearings held Planning Commission City council with this current plan we're [53:01] really looking at a site plan review so we're over here where the Planning Commission held the public hearing City [53:07] council's now holding the public hearing the difference from a standard site plan [53:13] is that they do have to come back for a final approval so tonight is a preliminary approval and first reading [53:20] of that amended zoning ordinance so here's a look at the site [53:25] again current vacant and the proposal is to construct 153 unit six-story apartment that Phils [53:33] still fits within that 72 ft uh height limitation 10% of the units would be for [53:40] affordable housing within the project and they've eliminated the 10,000 square ft of [53:47] retail so I'll just quickly move through some of the building uh renderings the [53:53] applicant will go through this in a little more detail so here's a look at the building uh from [53:59] the west side of the development again it kind of steps down toward the [54:04] neighborhood the uh ponding area is um seen as that buffer to the neighborhood [54:11] to the west and again is um taking some of that site [54:16] drainage so this request requires a site plan review again preliminary as part of [54:22] the Pud and an ordinance amendment to revise the Pud 16 to include the final [54:29] site plan for phase two and they're also asking for a reduction in the first [54:34] floor ceiling height from 16 feet to 14 ft part of the reasoning of for this is [54:41] when the 16 ft was required it was thought to be commercial on the first level now it's residential so they don't [54:47] need that um extra 2 feet 14 ft is similar to some of the projects like the [54:53] mson green across from City Hall and again it's to fit help fit within that [54:58] 72 overall height limit so looking at our pyramid of discretion this is a site [55:05] plan review where we don't have a lot of discretion the ordinance Amendment for [55:10] that lowering of the first floor height you do have more discretion um with amending of the zoning [55:17] ordinance so quick review of the site plan again it's it is consistent with [55:22] the overall development plan that was approved for the site access to the apartments would come off [55:28] of 72nd Street here and off of the new uh colle connector through the site [55:36] located here um move inss would be interior to the site it's this entrance [55:42] right here where a loading truck would park on the inside and then they could move up uh to the [55:50] apartments there was a revised parking and traffic study done to take a look at [55:55] this specific project it was done by stantech who did the original approvals [56:01] or studies as well they do conclude that the project can be supported by the [56:06] existing roadways and the parking um is also there's adequate parking and does [56:12] meet our city code would mention that you may recall part of the parking for [56:18] the office is to be accommodated underneath the new residential building [56:24] so there would need to be cross access easements between the two as that would be a shared parking uh Ed terhar who did [56:31] the study is not with us this evening but he's been in contact with our city engineer Chad Milner and is up to speed [56:38] and can answer any questions in regard to the the traffic study that was [56:43] done terms of landscaping again it's code compliant um double the amount of [56:49] trees that would normally be required they are maintaining some of those existing trees along the west lot line [56:56] uh to help provide some of that screening so again this is code [57:01] compliant with the existing PUD 16 with the exception of that 14 foot first [57:08] floor ceiling height so primary issue the Planning Commission and and staff considered is [57:15] is this site plan consistent with the overall development plan and is the ordinance Amendment reasonable uh to [57:22] incorporate into the Pud and is that first floor ceiling reasonable uh both staff and the [57:29] Planning Commission are recommending approval the vote at the Planning Commission uh was [57:34] unanimous some of our findings again it's consistent with the overall development plan with the elimination of [57:41] the retail space from the overall development plan the project would generate less traffic to the site again [57:48] the existing roadways and parking would support the project while this isn't a vertical mixed use it is a mixed use [57:55] project with shared parking and consistent with the comprehensive plan 19% of the site interior would be [58:03] dedicated for public space those dedications have already taken place as part of that first phase and when you [58:10] look at the public um easements along 72nd along France and Gallagher it's [58:16] almost 40% of the entire site area and that first floor reduction again is [58:21] consistent with some of our residential projects Meson green is 14 feet and the first level as well as the Eden 100 [58:29] project that was uh recently approved so with that again we're asking that you close the in-person public [58:36] hearing or uh close the in-person public hearing tonight and leave input open [58:42] until Sunday August 11th and then continue action to your next meeting with that I can answer any questions and [58:48] the developer is here to make a presentation as well yeah thanks for that presentation questions for director [58:54] teag yes member Jackson yes thank you Mr Mayor so director Teague if I heard from residents that [59:02] they're a little bit concerned about traffic going West on West 72nd Street [59:07] do we have the discretion to be able to put up uh things to encourage people to go towards France to exit out to go [59:15] wherever people are going I believe you you would have the ability to add that [59:20] condition however it didn't show up in the in the traffic study um staff [59:27] wouldn't um we don't believe that it's necessary Mr Milner might be able to um [59:33] speak more to that issue yeah before the project they estimated about 15% of [59:38] traffic used 72nd to the West when there were Office Buildings and we anticipate about the same volume of cars here um [59:45] there will be some slight increases but I guess we don't see the the need to limit those movements at this time and [59:52] it's something we could add later on if we did see some major changes to the neighborhood okay okay terrific thank [59:58] you member Pierce um I just have one [1:00:03] um um comment um so with the traffic study um it like this kind of feels like [1:00:11] we are compartmentalizing and looking at traffic just for this project and [1:00:18] typically right we would do that right that that seems reasonable but we also now have our [1:00:26] project across the street of um of of a good size right four [1:00:32] buildings and so I like I it feels like we should be stepping back and looking [1:00:37] at traffic with the assumption that if the M's project goes forward and 7200 [1:00:45] goes forward what are the traffic needs in the area and so I I my question is [1:00:53] are we are we doing that uh um and if we are I we don't have to look at it [1:01:00] tonight but I'd like to see that we do so every traffic study has a background [1:01:06] factor and they consider projects around them in this case this one came before you a year and a half ago whenever the [1:01:13] Macy's accounted for the higher density potential on this one in their study and it didn't show any impacts with their [1:01:19] study so that's where we're using some of the data from the Macy study because it included this entire project at even [1:01:24] higher density so we do include okay projects in the area and A5 growth [1:01:29] factor with every study so I I think we should see those results then if um and it I'm sorry but [1:01:38] it says the same results it's not going to impact traffic operations on the network but we can get you that study [1:01:44] all right I you know it it just it makes me uncomfortable I guess um and fair [1:01:52] fair or not you could say well council member you should you should know this uh but it sometimes with these traffic [1:01:58] studies it feels like there's never an issue so we do the [1:02:05] analysis and it just seems like there's rarely or [1:02:10] never an issue and if that's the case um then if we can look at the data and [1:02:16] whatever factors we're using um like I'm reasonable guy if we go through that and [1:02:21] I understand that and I'd be fine with that but sometimes the way we present this it feels like there's just never an [1:02:28] issue with traffic no matter what size project we're putting in place so I can give you an EXA so we can get you the [1:02:34] study from acy's that'll back it up and then I can say one of the other projects done by Mr Carlson there was requirements to add turn Lanes uh 70th [1:02:42] in France so that one did trigger improvements to the road Network because it wasn't at it needed improvements to [1:02:47] support the project so we have have had examples where they were required to do improvements so [1:02:56] okay member U thank you and so I'm looking at page three of resolution [1:03:04] number 2024-25 [1:03:25] -50 yep um so I'm looking specifically on page three um which kind of bullets [1:03:34] out all of our findings and what the proposed project would meet the following goals so that's specifically [1:03:40] where I'm trying to understand when we're then tying back the question of [1:03:46] does this project meet kind of the criteria set forth within the Pud is it [1:03:52] what's defined here within this resolution that we're trying to marry up [1:03:57] yeah so um that criteria is it's it's [1:04:02] what was included in the overall development plan that was so I just threw that in as um you know more [1:04:11] stating that this project is consistent with the comprehensive plan we don't have a lot of discretion as I mentioned [1:04:17] because the overall project has been approved we're really just looking at the site plan for phase two and I think [1:04:26] that's what I'm trying to hone in on of like what am I trying to evaluate is this consistent with and is it the [1:04:32] definition of the findings as a part of this resolution or is it something else that is the definition of this is what [1:04:40] we're consistent with it's really does it meet the existing zoning [1:04:46] ordinance standards for the Pud 16 district and the only exception here is [1:04:54] that first floor in height otherwise it meets our city code [1:04:59] requirements for setbacks height um density parking those [1:05:05] things okay because what I'm trying to understand [1:05:11] is you know we went through this process and we approved it a year and a half ago [1:05:16] now and I know that there have been kind of Market forces that have have caused this to potentially delay and we we've [1:05:23] talked about that separately so it's been a minute right in since the last time that we've looked [1:05:28] at this site in particular and so as I've been reviewing all of these materials it's just been [1:05:35] about me having confusion and I've heard it from people in the community as well of when was that point in time where we [1:05:43] lost some of that that flexibility or when we made the decision of this is what that site would be because you know [1:05:51] we've heard it talked about hotels and I know we considered it being Hotel um but [1:05:56] we never in in my recollection right we never had a proposal for a hotel and [1:06:02] said no we're not doing a hotel right and so it felt like for me you know [1:06:08] there was a lot more definition and a lot more insight that we had to the southern portion of the project and I [1:06:15] remember us having this conversation as a council as well of like it's hard to move forward when we don't have more [1:06:22] visibility into what this Northern portion is going to be and I I find [1:06:28] myself here now all of a sudden being like well we approved it so we're kind of just like locked in and we can give [1:06:34] them 14t or 16 ft but that's really the only flexibility that we have whereas [1:06:40] what I remember being a part of that discussion was you know it might be [1:06:47] something like a hotel that would potentially have Community draw but there might be a restaurant or there [1:06:53] might be a community Gathering location or we might do housing with some type of [1:06:58] retail embedded in it and now the project that's in front of us is just [1:07:04] housing and so that's where I'm just trying to like you know I think there has been confusion from people in the [1:07:10] community about this and I I think that there was even confusion then within the city uh excuse me within the Planning [1:07:15] Commission and so if you could just spend Carrie just another couple of [1:07:20] minutes kind of walking through that component of it um because I I personally am even confused by that and [1:07:27] I don't like being confused when I'm one of the decision makers um so [1:07:32] specifically when and how did we lock ourselves into this situation of not [1:07:37] having much flexibility with the site yeah excellent question so we were first [1:07:43] locked in in 2019 with this [1:07:49] development property owner at that time we set up the zoning ordinance specific for that project so they could have have [1:07:55] built that when the current applic applicant came back with the revision to the Pud [1:08:03] we had complete discretion to say yes or no it's either you build this or we [1:08:09] could have said no to this project so really we were locked into that [1:08:15] decision uh on February 7th of 2023 when we granted final approval of [1:08:22] the zoning ordinance amendment that set up those stand ards for this [1:08:27] project it was tied to a site plan that included construction of this first [1:08:33] building as well as all the improvements around it and basically set up almost [1:08:40] like a form based code this is the outline of what was [1:08:46] approved whether it be housing with retail potentially a hotel they still [1:08:52] had had to come back and get site plan approvals that's where we are this evening but we are locked in by [1:08:58] ordinance the p16 to this project here that I'm [1:09:04] circling thank you so can you give me another example as [1:09:11] the city of V din specifically where we have locked [1:09:17] into I think for lack of a better phrase like a gray box right because you look at the southern site and what we are [1:09:23] locking into was much more well defined right I think we're in agreement of that [1:09:28] are there other examples where we still locked ourselves into a commitment from a PUD perspective [1:09:37] without more visibility into what would be created um I can't think of too many EX [1:09:46] an example where we didn't have a specific development for each phase take [1:09:52] the 70th in France project um there were specific plans approved [1:09:58] for each of those four sites and they did final site plan for all four of them [1:10:05] um one that I could think of would have been and this project didn't happen either but the the avenue on France the [1:10:13] sdale office Center we approved a PUD for specific um specific buildings on [1:10:19] that site the only ones that received final approval were the retail [1:10:26] buildings along France where the Tavern on France um sits those were never [1:10:32] developed but that that's an example somewhat similar to [1:10:38] this okay thank you I I appreciate more of that and I I know that there are [1:10:44] other people that are kind of like oh gosh how did we get this far down um I [1:10:50] mean I I think it's something for us to takee back as a city as well and I don't know [1:10:57] maybe it's cuz it was one of my first City Council meetings too that some of it was new to me but I just I think that [1:11:03] we can bring more visibility into what are we locking ourselves into and where [1:11:08] can we still build in some of that flexibility to ensure that we're able to make a really cohesive decision with the [1:11:15] best information the most complete information that we can and I guess what I'll say is is I understand that we [1:11:22] approved this right so we we're I do feel like we [1:11:28] are legally kind of locked into this um so you know when I'm doing my assessment [1:11:34] I'll be making my decision based off of similar to what the Planning Commission did of like these this is the criteria [1:11:40] that we have and this is what we're we're really held to but I I do just want to challenge us as a city to help [1:11:47] bring more visibility into what is being kind of locked into [1:11:52] for for down for future decisions member rer um I do member um I I want to [1:12:02] Echo the what I heard is sort of frustration um on the part of member U [1:12:08] and I I have been speaking up about how we keep building these purely [1:12:13] residential buildings and it would be very helpful to have a map of a that [1:12:20] showed um all of the space that has turned over to purely residential in [1:12:25] terms of its function um because the zoning map does not clarify that um so [1:12:32] there's that the other thing I would add is that that final vote and this really [1:12:37] is seared In My Memory that February 7th 2023 um that final vote that item was on [1:12:44] the consent agenda and it didn't get pulled it didn't get discussed it was just a consent agenda straight up down [1:12:51] vote and so I think you know we need to take more more care with the final site [1:12:58] approval plans and maybe they should not be on the consent agenda uh just pull [1:13:05] that out the other thing I would like to um comment on is that first floor height [1:13:12] because I know you know for a long time we've been talking about changing that as well as the rules for how much [1:13:19] transparency you have to have um and I really would like to see that get done I [1:13:26] I think at the end of last year in December I made a plug for that to get done uh early in the year um and you [1:13:34] know now it's August so uh you know forcing people to build the higher [1:13:41] ceiling height than they need on the first floor is not good for energy conservation it's just there's so many [1:13:47] things that make it seem illogical and I know we are going through a process with [1:13:52] looking at our zoning but um I thought that was something we could get addressed a little bit more um quickly [1:14:00] so thank you I can respond to that we have been discussing it in work sessions with the Planning Commission they seem [1:14:08] to be leaning more toward wanting to keep that so we haven't come to a consensus we've been working on it and [1:14:14] we still hope to bring you something before the end of the [1:14:19] year member Jackson you this conversation has caused you to have some followup yes thank you so um a couple of [1:14:28] things first of all how does this compare to Pentagon Park South where there was an overall plan that was [1:14:34] approved and then the economy stopped it um is it similar because I remember approving the um we talked about the [1:14:41] hotel and this was a similar pyramid of discretion is this analogous to that or tell me about that yes very much so [1:14:48] thank you for the reminder that was also a PUD where there was an overall development plan and the overall plan [1:14:55] called for two hotels and they changed out one of those hotel [1:15:01] sites for the housing that's now been built and so they went through this similar process to amend the Pud um to [1:15:08] accommodate that new use so the vacant sites that remember there there's the big vacant site close to Highway 100 [1:15:16] where office was contemplated um office Market being what it is not likely to happen so it would [1:15:23] be a similar process here where they would amend the Pud and come back before Planning Commission and city council [1:15:29] okay thank you and then my understanding was we had kind of a vague description [1:15:36] of what would be in this site um and it was vaguely residential and as you [1:15:41] mentioned maybe a restaurant in it and it's been pulled we still have some discretion then within the four corners [1:15:49] of what we wrote so if for instance we found that the step backs weren't [1:15:55] sufficient we could talk about that because that's part of what we'd be approving we don't have to say you know [1:16:02] 100% we have to accept this yay or nay because vaguely [1:16:07] residential at one point we were talking about vaguely a hotel and so it seems to [1:16:13] me that there's some discretion here within what we approved initially um so [1:16:20] um tell me tell me what that level of discretion could possibly be [1:16:27] yeah that that could be difficult in that you know it meets the height requirement it meets the setback [1:16:33] requirements they are stepping back somewhat you'll see that in some of the [1:16:38] the applicants hypothetically they weren't we could ask them it's a yeah something we could have the dialogue if [1:16:44] they're willing to do things like that so it's not we have to accept whatever [1:16:50] comes before us but it fits within what we approve before and so perhaps we [1:16:57] could tweak it if if it didn't work well and I assume you know that's part of the preliminary conversations they would [1:17:03] have had with you but but when it comes to us we don't have to accept 100% of [1:17:08] whatever comes before us if we find that it's not within the overall guidelines [1:17:14] the building itself yeah it the building footprint is [1:17:19] slightly larger than what you see so maybe there's some give and take there [1:17:25] um depends on the extent of I think it would be difficult to take a flower off things like that [1:17:32] yeah but I I'm I'm asking you kind of hypothetically um that we didn't have to [1:17:38] accept 100% of whatever came before us but you've worked with them to get within what the city expects they've [1:17:45] worked with us to get what the city expects so there's some preliminary work [1:17:51] to get something that's within the neighborhood of what the guidelines say and things so it's not a it's it's a [1:17:58] back and forth discussion and if we find that for some reason you overlooked one of one of our [1:18:04] guiding principles we could say no we don't want to do this because you missed this big picture item yeah perhaps there [1:18:12] was certainly give and take between staff and you know as they were developing their plans regarding height [1:18:17] and footprint and some of those things so you can have that discussion with them okay good thank you [1:18:25] uh yes member Pierce and I think I can do a followup too so go ahead okay um [1:18:30] well is your followup on this point I think so it be why you go first yeah um [1:18:36] well that's fine okay I wanted to go back to member AG's Point that's why I [1:18:42] was saying oh okay all right I thought maybe you were on the same point so what I hear member Jackson saying is that [1:18:49] when I look at the compliance table if they had come and said they wanted to be at 40 ft from France Avenue in said 50 [1:18:55] ft it's a little bit similar to the situation where they're asking to be 12T instead of 14 ft in height on the first [1:19:01] floor correct we we would have then had discretion on that that's what you were getting at I think close enough close [1:19:08] enough so if they would have been out of compliance with the city standard it would be something we'd make be making a decision on tonight correct all right [1:19:15] okay I'm going to go I'll come back to me but I'll go back thanks um I so I just wanted to double down on member AG [1:19:24] new's point because I don't think the the perspective I had on um the [1:19:32] confusion around how we come to the traffic um [1:19:38] decision to me that has nothing to do with the developer this is all in from my [1:19:45] perspective the fact that we had a project that we had approved and now [1:19:52] we've got another project in front of us that we have to approve and to member [1:19:57] AG's point it the only difference between the two is like two [1:20:03] feet and so if we've already approved that project with the exception of the [1:20:09] two feet right then I think it's incumbent on us as a city to be able to [1:20:16] articulate all right these are the criterias that we're using um to make [1:20:22] this decision and right whatever that criteria is being clear about that not [1:20:29] only helps us understand what we're agreeing to but it also helps the the [1:20:35] residents really understand um how we got here and what the decision criteria [1:20:40] is um and so I really appreciated uh that point and I just didn't want to [1:20:46] blow by that because we still have we have ample time to still do that kind of [1:20:53] lay that out this is the CR criteria here is how we ended up here you walked through it but I just think it's it [1:21:00] would be very valuable for us to do that um in a more um visible official way and [1:21:07] including all the other criteria okay thank you for that um [1:21:15] so yeah all of us are are going a bit on memory but um what I recall and this [1:21:22] this is a good slide to have up here when we made that decision [1:21:28] um on October 18th to Grant preliminary approval of their requests what we were [1:21:35] looking at is you you've got two four arrows there I'm looking at the second Arrow from the bottom which points at [1:21:40] the project site so what I recall is that we had 7200 and [1:21:47] 7250 at one time they were owned separately uh this developer was able to [1:21:53] Cobble together the potential ownership of those two properties uh and be able to develop that that whole block in one [1:22:00] Fell Swoop and so then we started looking at well you know we talk about a wff and uh a shared walkway with cars [1:22:08] and pedestrians and we ended up with a a wide walkway that to me is personally [1:22:13] safer than having a werf and and we knew that this water you know this hole in [1:22:19] the ground used to be a a gravel part of a gravel pit operation [1:22:24] was gathering that 7200 property was gathering water from about 10 or 12 adjacent properties and where was the [1:22:31] kind of the fundamental fairness in that so as part of this whole process of putting together the overall Master development plan we created this storm [1:22:39] water management system with that in that corner of the property and and so [1:22:45] my recollection is that yes it is true that we didn't know what was going to go on 7200 but we knew that the choices that [1:22:53] you articulated it was probably going to be one of those things and so in the context of over approving this overall [1:22:59] master plan uh we we we were comfortable enough with what we were doing to make a [1:23:04] decision that indeed we would approve an overall development plan and inherent in [1:23:09] approving an overall development plan is that if that they would be coming back [1:23:15] uh with something for that particular piece of property at 7200 uh because they already had a plan [1:23:20] approv for 7250 uh that it was going to be something we'd have at least in my mind [1:23:25] we'd have limited discretion on in terms of what we could do and so when you think about we're now limited to site [1:23:31] plan approval because we already approved the overall Master development plan that I'm sitting here thinking well [1:23:38] that made sense to me and maybe it was just because I've been around longer than other folks but uh I feel that we [1:23:45] made that decision purposfully even not even though we did not know exactly what was going to go on [1:23:51] 7200 so uh that's just an observation um and then did you say that 40% of the [1:23:59] of the use of these two properties combined is going to be public in nature is that what you said yes it's it's [1:24:06] almost 40% so yeah that includes uh the north south connector [1:24:12] the East West as well as the 50 Foot setback along France the 30 feet here [1:24:19] and there will be the the public sidewalk here within this space so yeah [1:24:24] that's nearly 40% of the entire site okay and one thing I didn't mention is [1:24:30] this project will would accommodate either the The Underpass or the bridge over over France in either scenario [1:24:38] whichever direction the city decides to go on that okay all right I think that's all I've got for now I'd be interested [1:24:43] in seeing what the applicant has to say or hearing what they have to say um so I think you you provided them with some [1:24:51] opportunity to testify here because it is a public hearing and make a present to us uh and I think um if you want to [1:24:58] introduce who's here tonight director Teague from the development team and then I think you told them they [1:25:04] should take about plan about plan on about 15 minutes for making their presentation 15 or so is that correct [1:25:10] that is correct all right okay thank you evening mayor City Ted Carl [1:25:24] 72 7250 Parcels so nice to see all of you tonight um we offer at 6550 York [1:25:31] Avenue which is a Redevelopment site and I just I I think we're going to be far less than 15 minutes tonight out of [1:25:37] respect to the process that we've been through thus far and so we can get to the questions and comments that you may [1:25:43] have and to hear from residents in the community so you know Orion owns and operates uh six different sites in the [1:25:49] city um we took a very thoughtful approach when we laid this out first start and and we acquired the site [1:25:55] November of 2021 and then we um started the entitlement process in 2022 and [1:26:01] maybe R you could have our slide here so we've been through uh six different public presentations in front of this [1:26:06] body excluding any H presentations and we've had four different neighborhood meetings to date so I want you to [1:26:13] understand that as Drew and I both live in the community and our kids are in public school that we take with great pride that we are engaging and no one [1:26:20] should be very surprised when we come forward to this body with a project as we looked with Ari who's a a a multif [1:26:27] family expert um throughout the Twin Cities we took a very thoughtful approach to how do we want to fit within [1:26:33] this PUD and by removing the retail piece our traffic went down [1:26:38] 44% from the projections that were laid out in the original traffic um study [1:26:44] from uh fall of 2022 so that we think was a very thoughtful um way for us to continue to [1:26:51] earn community support we've got a 20 17t buffer from uh between property line [1:26:58] to building so we think that that's an incredible um way to create separation [1:27:03] provide uh thoughtful storm water management not only for our site but beond our site boundaries but we spent a lot of time talking about that when we [1:27:10] went through the Pud um one other thing that's very unique here and compared to what we showed in two previous sketch [1:27:16] plans was that 100% of the parking on 7200 France is hidden from View [1:27:24] so I don't know that there's another project in Idina other than possibly the project that we developed at the lauran [1:27:30] at Sunnyside in France where 100% of the parking is contained within the building I think that's pretty [1:27:36] exceptional um nothing has changed with regard to the activation of the site with pedestrians bike traffic in and out [1:27:44] when we look at the previous PUD from 2019 they maintained a curb cut off of France an additional curb cut we've [1:27:51] removed that that's gone I'd also remind you that we demolished the buildings in Fall of 2022 and they became a nuisance [1:27:58] so we did that as Goodwill before we even started on the entitlement process I think that's important to you know how [1:28:03] we work and interact with the community uh furthermore we're in compliance with the city's affordable [1:28:08] policy on this project um we're looking to do what I'd call sustainable plus and been our team has been in communication [1:28:14] with the city's sustainability sustainability team um as as director Teague talked [1:28:21] about we can accommodate either underpass o or underpass or overpass [1:28:26] which I guess in this case would be a bridge and we've worked to really maintain alignment with the Pud and [1:28:32] we've got 23 different conditions within the resolution that make sure that we do that um furthermore some of the feedback [1:28:38] we talked about when we when we brought a hotel through and sketch plan was there was a lot of concerns around smells noise traffic and a ballroom [1:28:47] function so I think as we think about the neighborhood and how to be good neighbors because we live in our part of the fabric of the community that that [1:28:54] wasn't the right move for this site um lastly you know I while you may be [1:29:01] looking at 7200 today is purely residential I can't think of another project that fits more aligned with what [1:29:07] true mixed use is and while maybe two separate buildings I think if we look at the first floor layout for the project [1:29:14] this talks about a mixed use modern design where the apartments on the north um all the first floor parking contained [1:29:21] Theirs to support the office use with seven units at grade some public fun [1:29:26] excuse me some um common area elements for the apartments including a Lobby and fitness center which will create [1:29:33] activation across the nil Plaza because in the office building to the South we've got our our our common area [1:29:40] elements there so our goal is to provide activation bring life to the site and lastly I think the first floor units [1:29:45] along France Avenue also do that so well um there may be some consternation about [1:29:52] you know what what have we done to keep people informed of this I I frankly believe that we've been forthright in [1:29:57] all of our Communications and have really done a a Yan's job of fitting within the guidelines that we laid out [1:30:03] when we came through this U PUD process a while back so with that Ari um maybe [1:30:09] you want to talk a little bit about some of the design features and the why and then we'll respectfully um answer any [1:30:15] questions you may have that's than you Mr Carlson uh Mr parrots would you introduce yourself and tell us what [1:30:21] company you're with please absolutely my name is Ari parrots and I'm the founder and president of Aton Park development I'm a local multif family development [1:30:27] company thank you um I thought what I would do is maybe spend a couple minutes on some of the feedback that we heard [1:30:34] both at the Planning Commission meeting and in our um neighborhood meetings uh because I think they encapsulate a lot [1:30:40] of the big themes that have already been shared tonight and I'll try my best not to repeat things that Ted already said or that uh director Teague already laid [1:30:46] out so um so eloquently the the whole concept of transition on the site and the focus of the site as a transition [1:30:52] zone was definitely a theme that we heard uh come up over and over again and looking back on the first PUD that was [1:30:59] approved in 2019 which essentially had the same building intensity and density [1:31:04] on this section of the site the 7200 building proper in an additional row of town homes which essentially bisected [1:31:11] where we have the storm water Pond comparing that to what we have right now where we took that density that was on [1:31:17] the stormw pond and basically made it wild and look wild and I'll show that image in a second and then removing the [1:31:24] surface parking that was on the initial um conceptual rendering of how phase two and phase one were going to work [1:31:30] together burying that all in the structure of the building and then Landscaping it we thought really was a a [1:31:36] true reflection of what transition meant right I know that you know there was possibly some interest in kind of having [1:31:42] kind of a only Town Home Development where you'd have you know one or two or three story buildings fronting France [1:31:48] Avenue that was not something that we considered it didn't seem appropriate um for anchoring uh a major intersection on [1:31:54] France and 72nd Street and really being able to flow uh mixed use with the office building on the on the south side [1:32:01] of the site so I wanted to mention that um I'll show just some of the the renderings in larger format so that you [1:32:07] can really understand what this building uh is about and what it's trying to do the fact that we took the retail out of [1:32:13] the building on the first floor you know while some people I think were maybe disappointed in that it gave us the [1:32:19] opportunity to add residences and there's very few maybe any walk out res es that I'm aware of on France Avenue [1:32:25] that could help just generate some pedestrian flow whether or not there's a a pedestrian underpass or Bridge it [1:32:32] helps kind of bring life to this area and it helps activate the denila plaza with all the people who are kind of [1:32:37] coming and going from their um from their day jobs in the office building we've got this concept called a front [1:32:44] porch um which we're really excited about I'll show a couple other images closer up where you can kind of see it [1:32:49] here that also was designed to kind of give people a destination to go to whether they were grabbing a coffee on [1:32:55] the first floor of the 7250 office building and they just wanted a nice place to to sit that has some shade and [1:33:01] and uh an overhang um or whether they live in the building and they just need to get some fresh air or whether they're [1:33:06] in the community and they just need a a place to stop and rest on on a walk um this was a feature that we added kind of [1:33:13] midesign because we felt like the building was missing sort of that focal point that could be a public private uh [1:33:19] connection and and that's this section that you can see here it leads right into our lobby so it's a secure there's [1:33:24] eyes on it it's something that will be maintained and kept clean um and kind of [1:33:30] lets the building then transition to a little bit more quiet with these kind of recesses that you see for the the [1:33:35] individual unit entries here just another view of that um of that front porch how these two buildings um kind of [1:33:43] reflect architectural styles to a certain extent you know we design these to be similar although not identical in [1:33:50] in style you know we've got different floor Heights you know the the office building program is very different from an apartment program so we needed to [1:33:56] make sure that the buildings worked for what was inside um but making sure that all four corners of our buildings had [1:34:02] masonry and kind of strong highquality architecturally significant masonry and glass was was an important feature and [1:34:09] that neither the front on France I shouldn't say front neither the France Avenue facade nor the Western facade was [1:34:15] treated as like the only front and the only back because there's lots of people that are going to be looking at France as the front there's also the Cornelia [1:34:22] neighborhood and others to the West who are going to be looking at that side of the building as the front and so we [1:34:27] really wanted to make sure that no matter what side of the building you were looking at you had something nice to look at so you can kind of see the [1:34:32] masonry which is on either corner on France and then on both of these kind of major anchors uh looking West and then [1:34:39] all of that parking buried right so we've got just some purely conceptual uh [1:34:45] images of ways to kind of decorate that parking garage that you had weren't just looking at a CMU wall you had something [1:34:51] um Artful and more interesting to be able to engage both people who are just driving by in 72 and people who are [1:34:59] walking um and I think I'll I'll pause there I want to make sure we have enough time for [1:35:04] questions and then lastly I would add that existing removed as part of this process [1:35:11] so I think that eyesore is gone so thank you yeah remember rer um you [1:35:20] just walk me through for denil Plaza how the Ada access [1:35:25] works yeah so one of the thing the questions that came out of the Planning Commission was was basically that it was [1:35:32] how do people kind of flow through the site both by foot and also by wheel um [1:35:38] and so we prepared this additional diagram to show how you can get through the through the site through the [1:35:44] existing trail system um and through the the new system the new North South Street and the new um uh sidewalks that [1:35:52] we're adding so this path right here there's a series of [1:35:57] steps right where my cursor is and then there's a Switchback path that you can see kind of zigzagging through the site that you could uh Traverse accessibly I [1:36:06] want to thank you for making that very clear and also I want to thank you for [1:36:11] having scales on your drawings which I used to think was a basic and then [1:36:19] I there were some drawings that did not even have a scale so I I do appreciate both of those things thank [1:36:26] you there questions for the applicants yes member Jackson yes thank you Mr [1:36:32] Mayor so thank you for walking through the architecture I've had some people ask you know why do apartments look the [1:36:37] way they do and it's just remind the public that uh first of all about the [1:36:43] stick construction and and how tall that that how that affects the height and then also just kind of the standards of [1:36:50] having to be Ada accessible and and how that affects the structure of the building sure [1:36:57] um uh well I could probably say simply for the woodf frame construction there's [1:37:02] typical ceiling Heights on residential floors for a build a new construction market rate building you would expect to have at least 9 foot clear ceilings on [1:37:09] the residential floors and then 10 to 14 fet clear for the um first floor where [1:37:16] the lobby is and and you try to bring that into amenity spaces if you can depending on where the location of the amenity spaces are so and then there's [1:37:23] typical depths of the um structure above each floor so that you're essentially locked into those sort of Dimensions you [1:37:30] could certainly push the residential ceiling Heights a little bit higher and we'll often times do that on the [1:37:35] penultimate floor or the top floor or or both um but typically the majority of the floors have that 9 foot clear just [1:37:42] as a feature of their construction okay yeah I'm sorry I think in addition is a relates to code is that fire code often [1:37:50] dictates how these buildings are constructed with um fabcon or or pre-cast first floor and then wood frame [1:37:56] above the wood panels are built off site and buil built in and then secondly the unit design is designed to be stacked so [1:38:03] that we can provide Plumbing rums runs vertically through the building for Water waste um air other things to [1:38:11] create efficiencies within the design of the building good thank you cuz I know people are like well why do Apartments [1:38:18] have that 2020 look you know 2020 to 2024 and and I think a lot of that is structural driven and um I think you've [1:38:25] done a nice job of of differentiating the um the architecture here but then my [1:38:31] second question is um there were some concerns raised the water um storm water [1:38:36] treatment has not changed at all in this project from previous iterations is that correct correct okay so it's the same [1:38:43] storm water as has been the since the beginning or same water treatment yes in [1:38:48] fact the entire um site for all intents and purposes is unchanged [1:38:54] okay terrific all right those are my questions thank you right member Pearson member U thanks Mr Mayor I just had one [1:39:00] question for Mr Carlson um when you were here uh for a previous city council [1:39:07] meeting I asked a question about financing um and so just the same question um then you talked about some [1:39:14] of the um the market lack of stability um so where are we now with respect to [1:39:21] this project from a financing perspective yeah a great question um as as you you may recall we we've um taken [1:39:29] quite a big stake to invest in our city with owning acquiring sites and so um we [1:39:34] are dangerously close to starting the office building at 7250 France and Drew and I have a call tomorrow morning with [1:39:40] our lender to look at the participant banks that may come in to help support that financing effort uh with some [1:39:47] continue uh luck grit and skill we're we're pushing hard for an October 1 start date on that office building which [1:39:53] I think would be uh uh very good for us I think as it relates to the apartment [1:39:59] building that financing Market is starting to come back a little bit and I think that we would hope to start that [1:40:04] building in in late first quarter sometime second quarter of [1:40:11] 2025 U so I I think you were here when we got our update around potentially doing the [1:40:21] underpass um and everything that I'm seeing here in the green space in [1:40:27] between is about bringing people up and so how are you envisioning this tying [1:40:34] into the possibility of an underpass and are people being brought up to be right [1:40:40] back down or how would that potentially work with this project that that's a great question thank you and I'm going [1:40:46] to lean a little bit on director Teague or um um director director Teague or director [1:40:52] Miller to help me with this um our civil team and Landscape team have been full contact with the city's consultant as it [1:40:58] relates to potential underpass so what we've made painstakingly clear is that we need to make maintain connectivity [1:41:05] and activation between the buildings so if that underpass comes out at maybe what we would call our P1 grade there [1:41:12] needs to be connectors at the current today's grade to still have that [1:41:17] activation I don't know if that solves or answer your question but I think I can maybe deflect to director Milner as [1:41:23] it relates to the engineering piece I think we're at a preliminary level yet we got good partners on both sides you [1:41:30] can see kind of the elevation change between these two buildings so if you look on the right hand side it's it's significantly lower and it's kind of [1:41:37] that goes towards France so that would be a potential point where we could connect um those elevations but our [1:41:43] consultant is looking at those elevations has this exact site plan and is working those numbers right [1:41:48] now thank you for that and again it is hard when when one week we have the the [1:41:56] Macy's site project one week we get an update on potentially an underpass and then another week we get this so it is I [1:42:03] understand how it can be hard to tie those components together my major concern is that I know elevation is [1:42:11] complex on this site to begin with right like that's why there is the zigzag for [1:42:16] the ADA compliance because West on the site is very low and [1:42:23] so a lot of it was bringing it up to the France and [1:42:29] so have you considered potentially the need to have two first [1:42:36] floors that are activated for the [1:42:41] underpass level po potentially a pedestrian level and then what would [1:42:47] also potentially be a France Avenue level and how might that play in into [1:42:54] the construction or the thought process on these sites yeah great question very insightful um we have not I mean at at [1:43:01] this point um we are ready to start on 7250 France or nearly ready to start and [1:43:08] um what I can tell you is that we can accommodate the connection but we're not in a position to create any any building [1:43:14] design changes for parking that is currently underground and beneath the building so if somehow The Underpass did [1:43:20] daylight or exposed foundational elements on either building to create [1:43:26] a maybe a garden level if you will below our current grade today I think that's [1:43:31] something we would certainly consider or look at but today that's currently planned to be underground and uh parking [1:43:38] did that answer your question it answered my question but wasn't what I wanted to hear okay well [1:43:45] maybe I could add on for 7200 because 7200 is at a much more much earlier [1:43:50] stage of design than 7250 is um and like 7250 our underground parking is planned [1:43:57] to just be parking because that's the facts that we have in front of us today could we reconfigure a portion of it to [1:44:04] have some level of activation to meet a pedestrian underpass possibly um I'm I'm [1:44:11] not sure or maybe I could ask you like what you would imagine constituting activation like I think it would be [1:44:19] extraordinarily challenging to get a retailer to sign a lease to be underground like there's not going to be [1:44:25] enough traffic to support that um at least I'm I'm fairly confident so we'd have to talk about like what other kinds [1:44:30] of activation would make sense to go down there like could we have bike parking there so that people could easily be coming and going with their [1:44:36] bikes sure um you know Pet Wash stations other things we could have glass windows into them so that it looked like there [1:44:43] was um activity inside I don't I would have a hard time imagining a commercial [1:44:48] an actual True commercial use there um just because of the volatility of pedestrian traffic that's going to be [1:44:53] coming and going so one example that just off the top of my mind comes in if [1:44:59] you have that coffee shop potentially on the what I will call now the first floor [1:45:05] could it have seating that extends down into the garden level that is then potentially opened up with glass [1:45:12] absolutely so something like that because right now what I'm really concerned about is directly kind of [1:45:20] coming straight at me so in front of this screen right now we are talking [1:45:25] about dropping down I forget like 12 plus feet right [1:45:33] and so you spent all this time building it up and then it's just going to be [1:45:39] kind of a wall or it's going to be dug out and then it's going to just be [1:45:44] cement parking stalls on both sides and that is not going to be inviting and [1:45:51] it's not going to create of that continuity that we're looking to really [1:45:56] hone in on by doing this and I know that we're not doing it now we're preliminary talking about it but that's why we've [1:46:03] rushed these conversations and been pursuing it as aggressively as we can because we haven't officially broke [1:46:09] Broken Ground yet on either of these projects and we're trying our best to get that alignment working I yeah I [1:46:16] think maybe let me take a better approach at more proactively answering this question um [1:46:23] we need to maintain good connectivity between the buildings that design is imperative to us it's the the way that [1:46:29] the saltdale guidelines work where this is in my mind an example an excellent [1:46:34] example of true mixed use and if and when the underpass comes to comes to [1:46:39] happen we'll need to maintain that connectivity at grade but could we incorporate elements in the underpass [1:46:45] that enhance that absolutely we've got good width between the buildings to accommodate the underpass uh we've got [1:46:53] the length and depth of the site to accommodate you know future stairs indor pedestrian Andor Ada Pathways up and [1:47:00] down within the site I just think from our seat it's um difficult to say today [1:47:06] what that activation might look like until the design plans are much more advanced but I can tell you this that [1:47:11] based upon our history within the city and I think our willingness to be very thoughtful about design um that we [1:47:17] continue to be very good partners and I I hear that and I [1:47:24] definitely see that and I'm just trying to get ahead of it so that we don't get something locked in where 18 months from [1:47:31] now we're saying well we can't have anything it's going to be kind of a lousy pedestrian experience on the west [1:47:36] side because we didn't have these conversations soon enough or we didn't realize what we were locking ourselves into and so that's where you know where [1:47:45] I come to my perspective is why these two projects and why do we [1:47:52] need to break ground on these ones right now I think the simple answer to that is [1:47:58] that you know we've owned the site for almost three years and we need to figure out a way to develop these sites and create betterment for our [1:48:06] city I should know the answer to this do you also own the the 7,000 block of [1:48:13] France is that your project as well yes okay what is the timing of that one uh [1:48:19] that one is further behind Okay um because where my mind goes that one [1:48:25] hasn't a fully approved Vision so invest time and resources into that one to give [1:48:30] us that flexibility to figure some of these components out I think there's a lot of different nuances between the [1:48:37] projects yeah I just I think that this is going to be so beautiful to be clear [1:48:45] and I know that what I'm giving you is a lot of of push back on some of this right and even my earlier concerns and a [1:48:52] lot of that comes from I view that our role as being on the city council is to [1:48:57] help bring this transparency in the decision making process and the I forget [1:49:03] what phrase was used but kind of the resistance that you observed earlier was also feeling like we didn't do the best [1:49:11] job and so it's taking accountability in that and now I'm wanting to get ahead of that and so I'm wanting to make sure [1:49:17] that we're having as many of these upfront conversations as we can [1:49:23] and right now you know we had a conversation I forget if it was 2 weeks ago or 4 weeks [1:49:29] ago that has this going under and so I'm just I'm really not connecting you know [1:49:35] we're under and then really high to go back under and it's going to be a a [1:49:41] mound for for pedestrians and so I don't expect you I know I'm coming at you and [1:49:46] I don't expect you to like completely change the architecture and design this this design doesn't have tunnel [1:49:53] underneath it this design would have to change to have a tunnel going underneath it so if you're having a hard time kind [1:49:58] of reconciling those two things you're not wrong because this is not that this would have to have a different kind of [1:50:03] architecture or a different kind of design to accommodate it the point that Ted was making and all and all Echo is [1:50:09] that the 7250 and the 7200 buildings themselves those structures are not [1:50:14] negatively impacted by having the underpass come underneath we'd have to figure out how this connection is made [1:50:19] at grade so that if you're on the first floor of the office building you kind of seamlessly walk across to the fitness or [1:50:25] wherever it is that you're going um which having it set a level below would [1:50:30] kind of add some challenges to so that would need to get reconciled but what you're looking at right now is not an image of the tunnel it's it's our [1:50:37] current image AR I think that's really well said and then lastly I would ask director Milner um if he would just [1:50:44] opine on our level of participation yeah it's been great we're [1:50:51] going to keep working there and we got the concept that we need to iron out all these details that we heard tonight we're just not there yet so yeah and I [1:50:58] and I understand that um I would like to see what some of [1:51:04] those renderings could look like right because we are being asked to approve this now and again I want to know what [1:51:11] the possible future holds with this site and if you have been in conversations which it sounds like you have been and I [1:51:17] really appreciate that partnership I would like to know how you're kind of playing around with how that would play [1:51:22] into this project if there is an underpass and would like to see some of those designs thank [1:51:29] you sir when I look at the um East Side [1:51:34] looking East and then looking West I notice that the Terrace on the top floor is facing the residential neighborhood [1:51:44] and it kind of reminds me of dialogue we had when we were talking about adus which were you know don't put your [1:51:49] balcony facing your neighbor's property and so I just have to put out there as a [1:51:57] suggestion would it be possible to put those Terrace units along you know just [1:52:04] flip it so those were on France Avenue instead of and so they were looking toward the East instead of looking [1:52:11] toward the west so dramatically and you do have them on both sides but it just seems very pronounced on that west [1:52:19] side yeah we we um do as you as you said member rester we do have them on both sides so that that step back and kind of [1:52:26] these Terraces exist on France in a little bit of a different design way just because of the differences between [1:52:32] France Avenue which is a little busier and and the west side of the site which is quieter um so there there's not [1:52:39] necessarily something to flip um just because they are essentially parallel um [1:52:44] and we were able to achieve these I think positively by pulling the building back right so instead of the building [1:52:50] coming up and meeting it we pull the building back and then just leave it as open space right so the the and these are not public these are private teres [1:52:57] so they're not loud there's not parties this is just some somebody's dining table and their Furniture you know it's [1:53:04] it's just outdoor private space the the one criticism well I mean a criticism [1:53:09] I've heard from more than one individual is just feeling as if you know they're [1:53:15] going to be watched um from occupants of the building who will be looking [1:53:20] literally into their back yards so just and you're probably aware of that I'm sure that's come up at the neighborhood [1:53:26] meetings yeah and what we would uh remind is that this building is 27 ft [1:53:32] away from the tree line and then further from the houses so we we tried our best to make sure that there was enough [1:53:38] separation enough buffer between them this is four to five times further away [1:53:43] from residential homes than we would typically see on a uh an urban Redevelopment like this so that that's [1:53:49] what I would offer in response [1:53:55] all right uh thank you gentlemen um just one quick follow on I think to what member U has been visiting about with [1:54:02] you about and that is that first of all an observation I think in the conversations we've had [1:54:08] around um the notion that we've got this strange period of time where there's [1:54:15] actually an opportunity with two projects developing across the street from each other on France Avenue to try [1:54:21] to figure out how to get people safely across France Avenue underneath France Avenue with something akin to what we've [1:54:27] done around Centennial Lakes where we're going under York Avenue and and other [1:54:32] streets uh Park Lawn I think and uh and so as we think about that and remember [1:54:38] Ang you talked about it you you guys have been right in the middle of those conversations and have been continually [1:54:44] saying you're going to be good partners on this so I I just asked walked over to ask our City attorney and uh and um [1:54:53] director Teague if a condition of approval on this matter could be or Ryan's cooperation on participating in [1:55:00] creating an underpass connection across France Avenue and I I take it you'd be willing to do that as a condition yes [1:55:07] okay uh that's all I had thank you thank you stand by we may have more questions [1:55:14] when we get done with public testimony either uh in Chambers or virtually here so thank you [1:55:31] all right this is a public hearing matter and I'm going to open it up now for public testimony um we'll call at [1:55:38] the beginning of the meeting director benot stated that you'd have three minutes for your testimony you'll get a [1:55:43] yellow amber colored light when you have 30 seconds to go and think about wrapping up your comments when around [1:55:49] the time the red light comes on and we'll in that manner try to treat everybody equally here in terms of their [1:55:56] voice being heard so folks are certainly welcome to come forward and and uh offer [1:56:01] testimony regarding this proposal and uh I think we have been [1:56:07] consistent uh in taking staff recommendation uh we' probably close public testimony tonight and then keep [1:56:13] the record open until uh that particular Sunday August 11th and then uh continue [1:56:19] the action to the August uh 20 2024 city [1:56:24] council meeting yes sir David Frankle 4510 Lake F Joy Dina [1:56:32] uh I have a question regarding the not sure what it's being called but the holding Pond the Wetland whatever uh on [1:56:39] the west side of this project uh there's no document that states where this water [1:56:46] will go it's supposedly just a transitional body of water that will end up in the storm water system but it [1:56:53] doesn't say anywhere where that water is going to end up is it going to end up at Lake Dina is it going to end up in [1:57:00] retaining pond area a couple blocks away is it going to end up in Minneapolis the [1:57:05] major reason I asked that because there's a little bit of a problem right now and I sent the council an email in a [1:57:10] photo the Weber Woods ponds I didn't realize when they were built they're going into the minneap storm water [1:57:17] system and it's dumping into the holding pond at Lake Beday makasa and that pond [1:57:23] is flooding if it goes up much more you might get a call from the City of Minneapolis you're we're contributing to [1:57:29] flooding some basements over there uh I didn't realize that when these were built we can't just kick the can down [1:57:35] the road you can't help one one project and then flood a lake or a pond whatever [1:57:41] with storm runoff uh the other issue is and I've brought this up literally hundreds of times the city belongs to [1:57:47] the National League of cities National League of cities says use data and evidence in decision making I keep on [1:57:54] hearing France Avenue is a dangerous road I would not disagree with that but it certainly is not the most dangerous [1:58:00] road in Thea when it comes to pedestrians and bikers The Crossing for the current 9mi Creek Trail is well [1:58:06] marked it's got a light on it it's Gallagher is not a real busy street that crosses uh France at that [1:58:13] point I would like to see some data as to why France Avenue is so dangerous [1:58:18] every street is dangerous for pedestrian biker but I bike a lot Dina and it is [1:58:24] relatively safe if you follow the lights if you want to jwalk or go against the lights you you know that's dangerous at [1:58:30] any Street and I can tell you probably the most dangerous Street in Inda is where the or the Eastbound highway 100 [1:58:37] Exit the Valley View that is suicidal in there and I bike it all the time and I got to race cars going 40 50 miles an [1:58:44] hour and I don't win that race so there are other issues if you think France Avenue is dangerous the last thing is [1:58:53] as I'm sure director Milner realizes you [1:58:58] cut into a road you don't know it's below there right now the City of Minneapolis has a project at 43rd in [1:59:04] Upton was supposed to be a simple Road reconstruction project it's going to take an extra three months because [1:59:11] they've hit some utilities they weren't expecting you know roads opening roads [1:59:16] can be a big surprise especially old ones uh when they did Golf Terrace near me they didn't realize there were seven [1:59:22] layers of asphalt on that street and they ran into a foundation of an old Farmstead had no idea it was there so if [1:59:30] you think going down into a road is simple and easy it is not and there's going to be a lot of surprises under [1:59:36] that street which in talking to the henan County engineering they're not real thrilled about opening up that road [1:59:42] to put in some type of tunnel but the last thing I guess is there doesn't seem to be a lot of [1:59:48] coordination was mentioned earlier you basically got four major entities on this so-called tunnel project who's [1:59:55] coordinating all that and when will this tunnel be finished in order [2:00:00] hypothetically for the two developers to do their projects on either side you going to hold them up years to do this [2:00:07] all right thank you Mr [2:00:19] frinkle a couple of [2:00:24] you'll probably need some assistance we want to get that um keyboard out of your way so you can use this [2:00:45] Center I'll get it Focus okay I'll give you a chance to focus it [2:00:56] okay my name is Sandy Carlson 4433 ellworth Drive I live in the south Cornelia neighborhood one General [2:01:04] comment is that the neighborhood cannot make meaningful public comment when all [2:01:11] we have to look at is a white square on a site plan it does not meet the spirit [2:01:17] and intent of public comment so I'll just uh leave that at that [2:01:22] um you're being asked if the proposed site plan is consistent with the overall development plan and I do not believe [2:01:30] that it is consistent with the plan I'm referring to resolution 20 uh [2:01:37] 20231 approving the or zoning ordinance Amendment and revised site overall [2:01:42] development plan page 4 section 3 paragraph 8 which clearly states [2:01:52] that approval is based on the following conditions phase two retail housing or [2:01:59] hotel uses must have entrances must have entrances on the two Street frontages [2:02:06] 72nd Street and France Avenue this was clearly articulated in this resolution [2:02:13] that traffic must flow directly onto France Avenue from this site along with 72nd Street the proposed apartment [2:02:21] building plan does not include this entrance this is not an optional item [2:02:28] this project should be disapproved as it does not meet this condition of resolution number 20 [2:02:36] 23-11 um a second item while I don't believe the proposed apartment plan meets the overall development plan I'll [2:02:42] make a couple uh some additional comments parking is proposed to be [2:02:49] shared between the 7200 and 7250 buildings the stanic revised memo [2:02:57] recommends 573 parking stalls for these two buildings this is without shared [2:03:02] parking the developer has proposed 470 stalls resulting in 103 fewer parking [2:03:08] stalls from those in the stanic report if the shared parking is inadequate [2:03:14] parking cannot be absorbed on the neighborhood streets overflow parking from the crti society already overflows [2:03:20] into the neighborhood it makes Hazelton a single Lane Street and then Marlan gets filled with cars when a memorial [2:03:27] event occurs if parking isn't adequate the developer needs to find a way to add on-site parking without affecting [2:03:35] setbacks on the west side of the building use of a parking stall cannot be optional the cost of parking stalls [2:03:42] for the apartment building must be included in the rent for all units including for affordable housing units [2:03:48] should this plan be approved which I believe it can happy based on that resolution approval must address these [2:03:57] concerns thank you thank you would you mind [2:04:12] giv anyone else in the audience wish to testify [2:04:24] Mark Mitchell 7001 Heatherton Trail my question really is um for uh director [2:04:32] Teague I was looking on the uh Edina site regarding the um the building [2:04:39] height overlay districts otherwise referred to as H ODS and uh according to the map that [2:04:47] that is posted on the um Hina City site it was uh developed in December of 2013 [2:04:54] is that still the is is that are those the parameters that we're still using [2:05:01] from from 11 years ago because if the question is if it is this proposed [2:05:09] construction uh exceeds the H4 which means four stories and not to [2:05:17] exceed 48 ft and I heard 72 ft from the developers I believe [2:05:22] so that I'd like yeah so would you pait the question one more time please because it may not get answered tonight [2:05:28] but we'll get it answer so the question is if this is if this map of these um of [2:05:36] these height overlaid districts is still based on the 2013 data that's published [2:05:42] on on your City website our City website then this Pro proposed project exceeds [2:05:49] the H4 um by 24t so that's a that's a question that [2:05:56] I'd just like to know the other one is uh still green here at 7001 Heatherton [2:06:02] Trail it tees into 70th Street and this gets to council member Pierce's um [2:06:07] comment about traffic and traffic and traffic uh I took a video I won't show [2:06:12] it here but uh this afternoon it was I was surprised it was it was considerably [2:06:17] lighter than it typically is but is a,1 1,002 1,003 1,004 you just have this [2:06:26] stream of cars coming excuse me coming eastbound off of [2:06:31] Highway 100 or from that direction and then if you look to the east the intersection with 70th in and uh France [2:06:40] it's often backed up all the way behind the the circle and it it just with these [2:06:47] proposed um constructions especially the going to come in on the 70th and France in [2:06:55] addition to what's here uh it it's concerning and it and I invite anybody [2:07:01] to come over to to my house and just stand there and take a look right look West and look and look East and you'll [2:07:07] see that it is a constant stream of and it and it's just bound to get worse I [2:07:12] don't you know just in theory so feel free to stop on by 7001 we'll have a [2:07:18] beer take a look uh talk it over um but yeah if we could get an answer on that [2:07:24] then then certainly 70th in France is going to way overshoot its hod [2:07:30] restrictions all right thank you Mr [2:07:37] Mitchel good evening my name is Nora Davis and I live at [2:07:42] 6921 Southdale Road in the lake Cornelia neighborhood and I'm here tonight out of [2:07:49] concern for my South Cornel your neighbors but first I want to go down [2:07:55] memory lane a little bit I attended a lot of meetings about the greater [2:08:02] Southdale District plan once I found out where they were that was a whole another [2:08:07] issue but I did and persisted I encouraged my neighbors to come because [2:08:13] I said this is really important this is going to impact us you need to be there [2:08:18] you need to talk about your concerns and they did come and I remember the very [2:08:25] last meeting that I attended they were talking about things like special [2:08:32] sensitivity for the cornelian neighborhoods and I thought hey they get [2:08:39] it we're going to be respected that sure isn't been happening [2:08:46] so I'm just really really concerned about that and I know there is going to be tra traffic through the [2:08:52] neighborhood drivers are not stupid I mean they're going to find out very [2:08:58] quickly that they can go down 70th make a turn right in front of Cornelia School [2:09:04] make another quick turn and go straight down 72nd and it's it already happens and [2:09:11] it's only going to get worse and I don't think an apartment company can say well you can't [2:09:17] come and you know unless you're stupid and that's you know not the way you're going to come come but there's going to [2:09:23] be concern for kids there's concern for corelia school because when they whip [2:09:30] past they're not looking for kids um we did a traffic study what was that a year [2:09:36] and a half ago and I remember one of the little guys who held out the the flags [2:09:42] at the at the 70th stop and he told our mayor people don't stop they don't [2:09:49] they're in too much of a hurry so I'm really concerned about that and I'm also [2:09:55] concerned about trees developers love to put beautiful Lush trees but they're [2:10:02] deciduous trees and they drop their leaves so we're talking about having no [2:10:08] coverage during a lot of the years I have a massive Cottonwood it starts [2:10:15] dropping in August it's already started to drop and it's going to be gone [2:10:20] probably the last part of September so that's a long time without any coverage [2:10:26] so again I am very concerned about my neighborhood and I I would ask that you [2:10:33] treat South Cornelia with the same Sensitivity I heard with the St Peter's [2:10:40] project that would there was concern about the neighborhood and I also heard [2:10:46] a lot of concern about the Neighbors in the Kevin Keys project [2:10:51] sometimes I wish Kevin would come back I miss him I took my car there um that would solve a lot of problems um and I [2:11:00] have one other comment about the retail actually I'm glad there's not going to [2:11:05] be any retail Mr Davis I'm letting you drift over a little bit so if you could wrap up okay talk fast if you go look at [2:11:12] Onyx if you go look at 71 France they're empty it's a constant revolving of [2:11:18] businesses in there how does that act a space it doesn't thank [2:11:30] you anyone [2:11:36] else good evening mayor hin and council members my name is Steve Brown I live at [2:11:42] 5528 Halifax Lane I'm here tonight to urge you to support this project when it [2:11:49] comes back to you uh for a vote you probably in about 2 weeks my primary reason for urging your [2:11:56] support is that this project provides 153 units of housing which will home a [2:12:02] significant number of people this is important this area needs [2:12:08] people it needs people to energize and activate this area it needs people to activate the [2:12:15] sidewalks and the trails that we've all talked about moving through this area it needs people to support the retail [2:12:22] places that are across the street on France in the new development the Macy site it needs people to activate this [2:12:29] new underpass think about the difference in activation If This Were a hotel versus [2:12:36] housing that underpass would probably not get nearly as much use from people [2:12:41] who are only here infrequently as opposed to people who live there and we delighted to go across [2:12:48] the street and get easily to a restaurant or retail spot he needs people to activate the [2:12:54] long envisioned West prominade we talked about that in these stht guidelines that [2:13:00] just got mentioned there's a great prominade to the east of France there's a hope that there'll be another great [2:13:07] prominade to the west of France and you've done some good things to try to make that start to happen this is just [2:13:13] one more thing that could could happen uh the good news is that the South L area is designed to support [2:13:22] this number of people we're not dropping this into a quiet neighborhood this is the Southdale [2:13:28] area equally good news if you go by the headline in Wednesday's paper which read [2:13:33] rental appetite devours low Supply these new apartments will lease up quickly so [2:13:39] this is not a case of building something that's going to sit fallow and not be [2:13:45] used I also urge you to support this project because it provides 15 affordable homes or 10% of the [2:13:51] total in truth I wish it could be 20% or 30 new affordable [2:13:57] homes that's because this is an ideal location for affordable housing it's [2:14:03] close to groceries pharmacies Medical Care Facilities other shopping [2:14:08] entertainment parks and even a library in a Government Services Center it [2:14:14] offers easy access to Transit and to jobs it's an excellent location for [2:14:19] affordable housing perhaps the requested variance to lower the first floor ceiling could be granted [2:14:25] in exchange for the developer considering going to the 20% level instead of the 10% level obviously [2:14:33] that's a pipe dream because it's a financial uh challenge to do that but I [2:14:39] think it's something that we all should have in the back of our mind to not just settle for 10 when 20 could be much more [2:14:46] appropriate for this area thank you very much thank you Mr Brown [2:14:58] Leisa pman I live at 7206 name please Lisa pman you Lisa um [2:15:05] and I I'm just giving you I I fled Minneapolis to Idina for a little bit more a little less Urban environment and [2:15:14] um have been here for about two and a half years um when I purchased my home I [2:15:19] did look at the website that the gentleman was talking about and it said it was zoned for four stories cuz I [2:15:25] could see those buildings were looking bad at that time and you could tell something was going to happen um [2:15:32] unfortunately I didn't realize I was going to have a six-story building towering over me one I'm there's a pond [2:15:40] and then I'm right there that first Circle so I now have a six-story building over me we've [2:15:46] got there'll be two build two construction projects going on now we're [2:15:52] talking about the Macy's one and this tunnel and your traffic which you study [2:15:59] now you see the traffic that's going today but when you start having all these construction projects you're going [2:16:05] to have streets shut down and you're going to have everything coming through 72nd Street I live on a block that has [2:16:13] 24 residents we now have probably 200 residents on the Block next to us it's a [2:16:20] lot density and then all those buildings behind us um it just feels like it's [2:16:26] closing in um you know and I'm very concerned about the traffic I'm very [2:16:31] concerned just about the snarl this all these projects was in that within four [2:16:37] city blocks we've got all these things going on building huge buildings and [2:16:42] building many PE bringing in many new people we have a school is that school [2:16:48] going to be able to accommodate all those children have we prepared for that you know how are we going to get how am [2:16:54] I going to get to work in the morning when I've got construction it's going to be on France it's going to be on 72nd [2:17:01] it's it's going to be hard to get around and like they said 70th is already quite [2:17:06] busy thank you was pero would you give us your address one more time please 7206 Bristol Circle Bristol Court Circle [2:17:15] yes bral Circle thank you [2:17:24] evening good evening everybody my name is Assad here I live at 7212 uh Bristol [2:17:31] Circle I know this evening we were mentioning a lot of bringing life to South Cornelia I will guarantee you [2:17:38] there's already life briming and vibrant communities that are there already neighbors that are here and it's not [2:17:45] just people that we see each other outside it's people that we share coffee we talk that we have conversations about [2:17:52] the safety of our neighborhood when I moved from Columbus Ohio three years ago I was looking at a [2:18:00] place to settle down put some Roots down in the metro area my wife my beautiful [2:18:06] wife and I were bringing five kids and we wanted to make sure that the places [2:18:11] we were going to provided us grade schools good Community safe places good [2:18:18] parks and every single time we typed a Dina came up I promised my wife and kids [2:18:25] that we were going to try this place one year if we liked it we were going to buy a home and settle down as we did two [2:18:33] years ago to see now the this proposed [2:18:39] building that sits right on the edge of our home bringing a lot of [2:18:46] traffic density safety concern all also as it [2:18:51] was raised before it would be me and my kids sitting in our backyard looking up [2:18:59] at a building that is six stories high of people looking down on [2:19:07] us unobstructed view of our home I know it was mentioned it's a a little bit far [2:19:13] off from our home it's not people would be looking down to see what me and my [2:19:19] kids are doing in our backyard and I don't think that's what we wanted to [2:19:26] move into this neighborhood and I don't think it's fair for all of us my neighbors and I to live in that [2:19:33] situation in that environment so I urge you I plead with you to [2:19:40] reconsider thank you sir thank you [2:19:57] hello again jie Weston 6136 Brookview Avenue um I don't live directly in the [2:20:06] neighborhood but uh I was at meetings a year and a half ago when earlier stages [2:20:13] of this were being discussed the Pud um proposal of the hotel was being [2:20:21] discussed and I'm hearing people talk about lots of people in this area is a [2:20:29] good thing but there's one part of that population that really is not being [2:20:34] talked about it's the little kids kids that are not in school yet [2:20:41] and 10% maybe more of this building to be [2:20:46] affordable housing we've also got the Macy site a good portion of that [2:20:52] affordable housing so why isn't a dayare center for the [2:21:00] preschool kids being considered as part of this proposal to be a [2:21:08] requirement there are so few of them there's a shortage of them in the city [2:21:15] people that live in the building that have younger children what a luxury to [2:21:20] be able to go downstairs bring your kids to the daycare then you go off to work [2:21:28] it would save driving trips time energy [2:21:33] emotional energy um and frankly I think I wish I [2:21:40] had thought of this two weeks ago when the Macy's site was being discussed [2:21:45] there seemed to be more importance on a dog park than there was for presol school kids for a lot more [2:21:53] Apartments why aren't we discussing this there needs to be something addressed in [2:21:59] that regard um one other thing uh the water [2:22:04] feature the pond for this area um it's a very low elevation and [2:22:12] Chad could maybe fill us in some here but if we have torrential rains which [2:22:20] urin and a half ago we were in a drought now we're not in a drought now we can imagine what could happen if we had a 5 [2:22:27] in rain and the climate is helping us imagine that if that pond gets up to too [2:22:34] high a level does it naturally flow out through the storm sewer system and [2:22:40] eventually to Lakey dinina or is there a lift station and if there is a lift [2:22:46] station to handle that excess water who is responsible for it because this [2:22:53] is on private property does the city have responsible responsibility for it [2:22:59] which is where I think it should be because I know the city will take [2:23:04] care of it a private ownership who knows who knows would who [2:23:11] would be responsible for making sure that a water level does not get too high [2:23:17] in the future I trust our city engineering department I think they do a great job so that's something that [2:23:24] hasn't been discussed at all I'd like to hear them say something about it tonight [2:23:29] thank you Miss W thank you anyone else wish should testify it's [2:23:37] in the [2:23:42] audience welcome hi good evening uh mayor huband and City Council Members a lot of you know me I'm dietr Nissen I [2:23:49] live at 71 04 Glouchester Avenue here in Edina um I am here because I like my [2:23:56] neighbors you know we walk the streets I walk with my two little girls past 7200 all the time we go to luns and Bley and [2:24:04] um we enjoy the area I grew up biking in this area uh as a teenager uh so I know [2:24:10] South Cornelia very very well um I share the concern of traffic uh above all else [2:24:17] because to uh Nora's point you know people drivers are smart they're going to figure out okay well I can avoid this [2:24:24] that and the other to get to where I need to go the fastest route um and we already have an issue in like [2:24:31] Glouchester that kind of part of of town with folks zipping down quickly um and [2:24:38] so I do I do worry about adding 150 more people who again they're living their [2:24:43] lives they got to get to work they got things to do um so that is something [2:24:49] that I I hope you put at the Forefront of every time we add an apartment or we add things it's to council member [2:24:56] Pierce's point it's not in a silo um it adds to the greater pressure on our [2:25:03] whole system of of our city services whether it's uh fire police Public Works [2:25:10] um everything's interconnected in that way as I know all of you understand uh so I would just ask that you step back [2:25:17] look at it from a macro perspective and think about that before you move forward with this um my preference for that [2:25:23] space personally is uh to council member agnu point an underground um tunnel or a [2:25:31] bridge um it's been something since I was a teenager I wish was there to bike [2:25:37] over and walk over to Centennial Lakes uh just to make it easier um there are a lot of motorists in uh that particular [2:25:44] part of Edina who do not I'll say respect our traffic laws [2:25:50] so it makes it tough uh to to look at adding more people and having more traffic and more and more I thank you [2:25:57] for your time thank you thank you Mr [2:26:09] nisson hi there my name is Neil Johnson and I live at 7137 Cornelia drive and um my main [2:26:18] concern is really about traffic as well um it it really I want to just provide a [2:26:23] good context about it because I live right at 72nd in Cornelia drive so I live right at that corner I've got two [2:26:30] I've got two kids um and there's over a dozen kids that are actually south of [2:26:35] 72nd and they commonly will come up obviously for school but also for plane [2:26:40] and whatnot across all the different streets that are north of of 702 there's commonly children that are that are [2:26:47] going across that area and if I and there's about 7 1700 people that live in South Cornelia overall now with with the [2:26:55] addition of those apartments and let's say that's about two person two people per apartment then that would be an [2:27:00] additional 20% of people that are basically going in that area now the problem is is you know if I were in your [2:27:07] guys' shoes I would go well yeah they'll probably just take 72 and take France down but the truth of the matter is is [2:27:13] that the congestion that occurs in the uh in the backup of 70th excuse me 70th [2:27:19] is that that roundabout there's a tremendous amount of backup and what I see all the time is that people as soon [2:27:25] as they as soon as they start seeing that backup on 70th Street they immediately take West Shore uh drive [2:27:31] down they'll take that West and then they'll take um 72nd through or what they'll do is they'll take Cornelia now [2:27:37] they're going by the school and then they'll and then they'll um then take 72 [2:27:42] okay so that's that's a a major concern you know um and so if we have now all of [2:27:50] these people that are that are going to be living in this area I guess my question really boils down to this why [2:27:56] do you need to have an an exit um for this property to 72nd Street why [2:28:04] couldn't you have it basically Loop into the into the uh 76 7200 building you [2:28:11] know maybe in the future when a when you have the wer for it continues through okay fine then you can build it through [2:28:18] um so that it has that artery so it can keep it away from the neighborhood but in the meantime we basically you know [2:28:24] serve the residents there in 7200 funnel them down to Gallagher so that they can go out 72 and um and it'll actually be [2:28:32] be more private for them I believe as well so um I would I would that's [2:28:37] something that I would personally propose to you to when when discussing this this plan um so that I think it [2:28:43] would be an additive for the 7200 it be it would definitely be an additive for the neighborhood and really my big [2:28:49] concern is I just don't want to have a kid that gets hit by a car you know I [2:28:55] don't think anybody wants after tonight's meeting to have that on their hands so and when I when I think about [2:29:02] um how that how that basically gets presented in terms of traffic I think that's that's the major uh component [2:29:09] here um so I'll just end it there yeah right thank you thank you Mr Johnson for [2:29:15] those thoughts e [2:29:56] I came tonight to talk about transition I find this project to be one that's very difficult to come up with a good [2:30:03] transition plan and when I thought about that I [2:30:08] suggested to myself why don't I go out and look at some of the other buildings that have come on recently and see what [2:30:14] they've done and so you can see here the building over in morning site [2:30:21] it's right across from the new Cafe that's opened again so it's nice to visit and I like the building I walked [2:30:28] around it and I got around all the way to the west end of it and I saw there a [2:30:34] very good transition zone the building was down two stories it had a nice patio [2:30:41] there and the the residential area was very close to it but I didn't think it [2:30:47] was really too too uh difficult for them so I think this [2:30:53] building maybe was built by the developer that's here today they did a very good job on that and I'd like to [2:30:59] see you encourage them to look at other alternatives for the transition [2:31:11] zone my favorite project in a dinamite be this one the townhous is on 72nd in [2:31:17] France I do not understand why we are always afraid of tow houses at the the [2:31:24] site in question um I think a lot of the problems that [2:31:30] previous speakers have mentioned are related to the height of the building and the density of the building town [2:31:37] houses eliminate a lot of that the town houses will also fill the middle part of [2:31:43] the housing segment that we're short of uh so I I encourage you to encourage the [2:31:50] Builder to look at this project thank you very much thank you Mr [2:32:03] Carlson anyone else in the audience wish to testify this [2:32:10] evening check with director Ben to see if we have anybody online that would like to offer some public [2:32:18] testimony we are very lonely over here tonight there is no one online [2:32:23] okay all right um director teag uh I just again a reminder that your uh [2:32:30] recommendation from staff is uh we pass a motion to close the in-person public hearing tonight keep the public input [2:32:36] open until Sunday August 11 2024 which we can consider between that date and [2:32:42] August 20th which we would come back on August 2024 and uh continue the action [2:32:48] to that city council meeting on the the 20th of August 2024 is that correct that's correct all right is there a [2:32:54] motion to that effect so moved second member Jackson moves and member Pi seconds that we [2:33:01] close the in-person public hearing this evening uh keep the public input open [2:33:06] until Sunday August 11th 2024 and continue action to the August 20th 2024 [2:33:11] city council meeting uh any further discussion on the motion is stated all those in favor of adoption of the motion [2:33:17] stated say I I I oppos carried uh now that we've done that I [2:33:23] think there's probably why well we've got some folks uh departing uh but um I think there are [2:33:30] some questions that we could answer tonight uh and I think starting out with [2:33:35] uh Mr Frankle who's worried about and I know he sent an email to this effect that uh the work we did over in Weber [2:33:42] Park is somehow going to cause a problem in uh Minneapolis and cause flooding basements over there and and I sent an [2:33:49] email on that over to the engineering department and I think um with to Ross [2:33:54] mittner and I think you have probably saw that as well what what are your thoughts on that yeah I appreciate the comments and the pictures but that's [2:34:00] untrue we created way more flood capacity in Edina we actually reduced flood risk in Ed and we've reduced flood [2:34:07] risk for the people in Minneapolis so we're reducing flow we're pre- pumping before storms we don't do any pumping [2:34:13] during storms so the pitcher could be caused by two things just a big rain event La a few nights ago was like an [2:34:18] inch and a half in a pretty short short time where the pond was just full or we think the outlet pipes might have some [2:34:23] debris in it and Minneapolis needs to take a peek at those Outlet pipes so uh definitely not true that we're forcing [2:34:29] water down to Minneapolis and we'd be happy to discuss any more of those details with him if he's interested I I [2:34:34] would also add that Minneapolis Park Board and City of Minneapolis were were integrally involved in this project with [2:34:41] us and I think Mr bitner's comments was if there's some blockage in Minneapolis it's often due to Natural material or [2:34:48] beavers or something but they'll if they have a problem over there they'll fix it but we're not creating a problem for [2:34:55] them by uh having this system in place in Weber Park correct all right um one [2:35:01] of the other things we talked about was uh it's always a concern I guess is traffic uh and the data on traffic I [2:35:09] know that there have been some studies done in the past on the volume of traffic on France Avenue and I don't know if we have any current data on that [2:35:15] or can we get some from the county between now and the and the and the August 20 meeting yeah there's public [2:35:21] mapping I was looking at right here on the minda traffic mapping so again we've re reviewed these numbers and 70 both [2:35:28] 70th Street and France peaked in the early 2000s it's less traffic than it was 25 years ago which is interesting [2:35:34] people we're still experiencing high traffic I'm not going to uh dismiss any of those things on 70th and the stories [2:35:40] were heard but a traffic overall is actually less than it than it used to be based on those numbers on the website [2:35:46] and they're required to do those counts every few years but um there's still some issues in those PM Peaks I mean we [2:35:52] see cars take a shortcut I think the other comment I heard earlier was there's 1700 people that live in this neighborhood there's only about two ways [2:35:59] out to the east so you need to take just 1,700 times 10 trips a day that's a lot of cars just from the neighborhood that [2:36:05] we got to keep in mind uh that that are trying to exit this neighborhood the uh the traffic on France Avenue and that [2:36:12] was my recollection too was that and I know people have a difficult time believing this but my office is right on [2:36:17] France Avenue and I see the traffic daily uh that the PMP does have some volume to [2:36:24] it south of 70 especially when you get south of 77 to 494 as they Tred to get on [2:36:29] 494 but in 2003 I think the volume was about 30,000 cars a day and now it's [2:36:35] probably a third less than that yep it was down the 20,000 and depends where on France you're looking at it and [2:36:41] measuring it but yeah it peaked at kind of 30,000 and now it's in the mid 25s 26,000 in that range and remember Pierce [2:36:48] has his finger up I wanted to ask one other traffic related question that is and Mr Johnson caused me to think about [2:36:53] this uh in his testimony because we met with him I stood in a corner and I I go that way all the time and understand the [2:37:00] the PM Peak pressure on 70th uh because it's one of the only through three through streets uh through our community [2:37:06] in the Richfield um but we were we were doing a traffic study that basically was going [2:37:12] to look at the traffic Shed from 66th to like 72nd and then from France to [2:37:18] Highway 100 and I don't know where we are on that uh study and and if we've [2:37:23] come to any conclusions about how we can traffic uh how we can calm traffic and maybe affect volume of traffic uh in [2:37:31] that traffic shed yeah we did complete the study and then we also look back when 70th Street was reconstructed in [2:37:37] the 2008 or n uh that was a huge project with the neighborhood we worked at the neighborhood and it came up with 133 [2:37:44] traffic measures that should be implemented with the 70th Street reconstruction and we reviewed that with this recent traffic study 12 of those [2:37:51] have been done we've completed 12 of the 13 and the 13th one was add more capacity to Highway 62 because that's [2:37:58] why people are getting off and they're trying to cut through on 70th because 62 is so we're still advocating working with mindout on on that idea but that's [2:38:05] the one measure that we have not been able to do but it's not really in our control member [2:38:11] Pierce thanks thanks Mr Mayor I so I appreciate all of that uh you've heard [2:38:18] me say this before I it's a challenge for me when people [2:38:23] are articulating an experience they're having but the data that we have doesn't [2:38:29] support that and then that puts us in the position of telling the residents [2:38:35] essentially well that's not an issue we've done here's what we've done and so [2:38:41] that's not an issue um and so we just have to figure out how to deal with that [2:38:47] and in all honesty I I am I struggle with that I've spent time with with [2:38:53] director Milner and the traffic commission to walk through the process [2:38:59] um and there are factors in there that make a ton of sense to me like the the one that made the most sense to me is [2:39:06] that we actually don't want to put controls in a place where people aren't [2:39:11] necessarily going to um it gives a false sense of safety essentially and that's [2:39:17] the way you described it and so there are factors where we actually don't want to do certain things because it makes [2:39:23] things unsafe and so I just think we have to figure out a way to communicate [2:39:28] that um because it's not a good position to say yeah we've done the study traffic [2:39:34] is fine because traffic's not fine like people are experiencing issues and I'm [2:39:41] at a loss for how to address that so that's the only comment I wanted to make good [2:39:47] observation um this is for director Teague uh Sandy [2:39:55] Carlson argued that the site plan was not consistent with the overall development plan she cited section three [2:40:00] subpart 8 there's supposed to be entrances on two sides of the building you have a comment on that one [2:40:07] yeah there are that that's not meant to be Drive entrances it's entrances into [2:40:13] the building from The Pedestrian walkways so there's entrances on both those sides so that condition is is [2:40:19] satisfied okay and then she cited a parking issue that she said there was a [2:40:25] requirement of 573 vehicles and we were at 483 which [2:40:30] was over the number that was required based on what they were proposing for a project I wanted to know if you could [2:40:36] reconcile those two numbers remember that I [2:40:43] do the the project provides a little bit [2:40:49] over what the code requires that is true um but it's compliant they're just [2:40:55] providing more parking than they need I think the study she was looking at was when they were thinking about doing [2:41:00] retail and some other things on the site and so there was more parking required even in 7250 there was going to be [2:41:06] retail yeah so then there was a requirement of like 573 but the revised [2:41:13] plan they exceed the number of parking stalls required between the two projects [2:41:18] so that's that's a non-issue I take it yes yeah age and then and then this Mr [2:41:25] Mark Mitchell from Heatherton Trail raised this issue of is there a four-story height limitation over there [2:41:31] somewhere uh way back when that uh you found on the website that maybe is [2:41:37] inconsistent with the Pud or yeah we we do have the height overlay District map [2:41:42] but when we established the Pud Zoning for the site that's when we established [2:41:48] the 72 foot height requirement for the building um and 76 for the other building it [2:41:55] might be something that we want to consider um putting in some asteris or something [2:42:02] that recognizes puds that have gone above what the what the height overlay [2:42:07] District map shows Brer um we also heard from somebody who I believe said they looked [2:42:14] at the height overlay districts and so they were surprised that this was going [2:42:20] up and I think it would behoove us to go over our map that we have showing those [2:42:26] Building height overlay districts and update it and for example Maison green is shown as having a limitation of [2:42:34] either four stories or two stories and that certainly is not the case but [2:42:39] there's as I was looking at this map I saw that it is out of date for a lot of [2:42:44] parcels and it also got me thinking um four stories is what the [2:42:49] limitation is supposed to be in the transition zone and so if you PUD in the transition zone um so that you're going [2:42:57] higher than those four stories you know we can say there's a greater amount of distance between the building or there [2:43:04] is a significant amount of distance between the single story residences and [2:43:10] the building that's going up however it is still much higher than that four [2:43:15] stories that the overlay District says and it is the transition zone and so I [2:43:22] think we really need to take the transition zone you know to heart when [2:43:27] we are talking about creating uh PUD the other thing is that when you talk about [2:43:33] the differential between the building height overlay district and what developers are granted through puds I [2:43:41] think we need to bear that in mind because it it appears in some cases that [2:43:47] we're not acknowledging that but were saying oh look there's 40% open space for the public but you know we've given [2:43:54] a lot to get that and that you know allowing more height in a PUD is really [2:44:01] the motivation that went back to the very beginning of puds so that you would have open space and I just want to put [2:44:08] that out there because I think sometimes we say oh look at all that open space we should give financial support because [2:44:14] we're getting all this open space well we're getting all that open space because we gave a lot we gave additional height [2:44:19] which is essentially giving you know what you would have to have a much larger parcel to put as much building as [2:44:27] is going up so I I think we need to really take a holistic view of the the [2:44:34] way we're doing development and we do need to have more transparency in that building height overlay map it is very [2:44:41] out of date yeah so that that's something maybe you can have the Planning Commission look at in the [2:44:46] context of doing their work on the zoning you know I mean there should be some notation on the height overlay District that this could be affected by [2:44:53] you know PUD uh determination I just want to push back I [2:44:59] don't think it should just be an asterisk with a note I think we need color coding indicating what the new [2:45:04] building height is on the different Parcels that we have allowed to be [2:45:10] built I'm not I make notic about the methodology but I think it's an issue [2:45:16] that needs to be raised or at least so people don't get confused when they look at the height overlay [2:45:22] District um Nora Davis uh was concerned about several things one [2:45:30] of them was uh retail she was worried about retail but this this project has no retail correct correct yeah so with [2:45:37] the exception of well yeah the 7200 does not the 7250 does uh which has been [2:45:43] approved already y all right and then the tree concern that she had about gee [2:45:48] they only plant the ous trees and the leaves go away in the fall and and she's worried about that um we can probably [2:45:54] talk to the developer about that if there's any conifers planned for the for the site and [2:46:00] um we could address that now or you know if you want to comment on the landscape [2:46:05] plan and and uh and the use of conifers to keep that sort of green barrier in [2:46:11] place to the neighborhood [2:46:22] have something to present be there otherwise one of the sides Terry Manar Confluence landscape [2:46:29] artion planning um mayor council members I think in the plan we do have a diverse [2:46:35] mix of deciduous and coniferous that'll be happening along the western side of the site that'll help with some of that [2:46:42] barrier that's there a lot of the existing trees that were kind of found and some of that Remnant scrub along [2:46:48] that edge were very um invasive and kind of just wild growth that occurred there [2:46:54] over time in times that can feel like a forest but the reality of it is is it's not really good for the environment or [2:47:00] anything and then that when that falls away that doesn't look as good as it could have looked so our intent is to plant up that edge to really kind of [2:47:07] create that barrier in a series of layering too as you get closer to the path so it's not just all on one side [2:47:12] it's a mixture of both sides of the the water body and I think as we um tend to [2:47:19] in urban conditions it's not really conducive to place uh coniferous trees on a street like France um they just [2:47:26] don't do well with that air pollution that's happening in our climate we're experiencing so anywhere within the [2:47:32] development where we can incorporate some of those evergreen trees like through the central Corridor um we'll begin to take a look at some of those [2:47:38] ideas it is kind of a mix of trying to provide pedestrian environment coniferous trees don't really lend [2:47:44] themselves very well to pedestrian environment but we can kind of take a look at what that becomes so and and if the tunnel goes through uh commissioner [2:47:52] agnu I think that kind of changes the whole character there as well but um and with that I can respond to that now I'm [2:47:57] up here we are looking at that with um Mr fiser and um and uh well Mike and [2:48:04] Mike and taking a look at what that what's happening there and the nice thing about that western side is as you [2:48:10] come through the tunnel the fact that the back side of our site where the road goes through or the the prominade um [2:48:17] it's actually at a lower elevation so it doesn't have as much of a slope so it kind of feels like a cleaner transition [2:48:22] it doesn't feel as much of a a deeper kind of sunken area as it would on the Macy side but also um the height [2:48:30] elevation of the 7250 does require some kind of transitioning that we've been talking about as part of that process so [2:48:37] we want to keep that daylight in there but uh still be able to experience um people to be able to get out through both walkway and stairs as well as the [2:48:44] ramping experience to go up to the West Side so good thanks y um there were a couple of [2:48:54] uh neighbors a couple of residents over on Bristol Circle that were concerned director Teague about um looking at a [2:49:02] six-story building 200 plus feet from their house uh but that issue was resolved I [2:49:10] think on October 18th 2022 when the city council granted prelimary approval of the [2:49:16] overall development plan or was that 23 or 22 yeah it was the 23 resolution [2:49:23] established the height y yeah um so understand the concern but that [2:49:30] was one that we addressed back in 2023 [2:49:39] um and then there was a concern by uh resident Janie Weston about uh gee the [2:49:47] water feature uh how old did new feature manage water if we have a really bad [2:49:52] situation this might be director Milner it seemed to me the question was how will a new water feature this proposed [2:49:57] manage water compared to the existing situation yeah it's a constructed Pond today and there's uh three property [2:50:03] owners have rights to it it's privately owned it's a uh private lift station [2:50:08] that manages that water and the design they have is still keeping the same capacity if not creating more and it'll [2:50:14] still be a privately owned and maintained system I would say it's similar of what many developers do but [2:50:20] they do it underground and we don't see it so this one's just kind of a open water system and they'll continue to [2:50:25] maintain it moving forward um I'm not concerned with it overfilling and creating water cascading down 72nd [2:50:32] Street it would have to go up extremely high way above a 1% storm to ever over [2:50:37] top 72nd Street we had a couple of folks that also were concerned about pressure [2:50:42] on the school system I think from uh kids being in in this market rate apartment building and this is actually [2:50:49] an issue that we've looked carefully at over a couple different times I don't know if manager Neil you'd want to want to comment on this we we went through [2:50:56] the effort with a school district of hiring Hazel Reinhardt the former state demographer to look at this issue of how [2:51:01] many kids are in these market rate apartments and thank you your honor we [2:51:06] did and in fact I think we just looked at this uh yesterday um the Hazel Reinhardt study and then the update of [2:51:13] it that was just uh I think last year in market rate Apartments uh the the range [2:51:19] of children that end up into the school system is anywhere from 0.11 to 0.15 per [2:51:26] unit it's a little higher than that in in um affordable uh buildings but for [2:51:33] Mark rate departments that's what that that's what her data produced [2:51:38] okay um now I may have missed a few things that uh other council members [2:51:46] had um picked up on that one I asked yes member Jackson yes thank you Mr Mayor could you [2:51:53] address um what what are the licing licensing and Zoning requirements for a [2:51:59] child care center if there's a commercial building do they do we have to have any sort of zoning requirements [2:52:05] to allow um child care there or can they just rent a space in a commercial [2:52:11] building uh being that this is a PUD and [2:52:20] listed within the uses includes uses allowed in the pcd2 zoning District so [2:52:26] they could do daycare there if they wanted under the zoning they would have to park it we'd have to look at the parking regulations to make sure there [2:52:34] is enough there um but it might be a possibility on this site and in one of the commercial buildings the office [2:52:40] buildings that are being proposed either at 7250 or across the street or up at [2:52:45] 70th in France we've got some commercial buildings going in is there any zoning [2:52:51] requirement other than parking that would prevent a child care center from going in any of those office [2:52:58] Towers uh it it's possible I'd have to check the individual zoning on each site [2:53:05] but it's a possibility because I think of that as being a business and you know that's what commercial buildings are for [2:53:12] to have different types of businesses in them um but as far as you know it doesn't isn't a glaring prohibition [2:53:19] against it and that's right okay thank you you know one of the things that Neil [2:53:24] Johnson got me thinking about too was um when he said could we adjust the garage entrance on the project um it seems like [2:53:32] me like I recall that when we approved that project that I think Dean deolis was the architect on that never got [2:53:38] built of course uh that we had a Prohibition on a left turn out of the [2:53:43] out of the site onto 72nd so they couldn't go left they couldn't come out of the building and turn left on the 7 [2:53:51] 72nd you remember that I do yeah yeah they were going to [2:53:56] reconstruct um 702 and it did include that that median um that's right there [2:54:02] was a much more dense developed development you know 300 housing units plus the 30,000 square ft of of retail [2:54:10] so that was going to generate a lot more traffic than what's proposed here [2:54:20] um Mr Carlson what do you what do you think about it no right no left turn out of the North End of the site there into [2:54:27] this into the neighborhood I I would ask that uh we study that further with staff [2:54:32] Andor the traffic experts I don't know that we have a horse in the race okay [2:54:37] okay that's yeah thank you for that [2:54:43] um hey that's that's what I had on my list anybody else have anything all [2:54:48] right we're going to we're going to keep this open then so people can still correspond with us and we'll review all [2:54:53] that information then we'll make a decision on the uh site plan request on [2:55:00] the 20th of uh August and now that ends the public hearing portion of the agenda I think we [2:55:07] blew away by the clerk's estimate of [2:55:14] but yeah there were important things to talk about so um we're on to um reports and [2:55:21] recommendations uh we just have one matter there see if I I can get it up here it [2:55:28] is the uh resolution uh that adopts uh or accepts [2:55:34] donations and uh see if I can find it [2:55:40] here do anybody care to make that motion to adopt that resolution number 20 24- [2:55:46] 52 so move second uh motion a second to adopt uh [2:55:52] resolution 2024 52 which accepts donations on behalf of the city of viina um any further discussion all [2:55:59] those in favor of adoption of the motion say I I I I opposed carried I found it [2:56:05] uh with this new format I had to search a little bit [2:56:13] um here it is I get the report all right so yeah some really generous gifts this [2:56:19] uh period to the park and recck Department uh uh Dian Dan and Diane plucket leam uh contributions to the [2:56:27] city Foresters fund to plant trees and city parks all of these are in that category Sue and Dan deise Mary and Paul [2:56:34] guey uh Robert Linda vs uh Nancy Maxfield Wilson Dana and James Arnold [2:56:41] thank you so much for those contributions to the tree fund for parking uh planting trees in city parks [2:56:48] thanks so much and then a couple of memorial benches purchased uh for the Centennial Lakes Park Peter and David [2:56:54] budge and Kirsten strable Strobel I guess it is Kiron stroble excuse me for [2:57:00] mispronouncing your last name uh and then Bruce Pernell uh both uh very very [2:57:06] generous donations those will be on the website and then we are at um commission [2:57:12] correspondence I don't think anything has come in and now we are at manager's comments thank you your honor I've got [2:57:19] three short items just to update you on first is that we we received bids uh for [2:57:25] the Tactical Training Center at the South Metro Public Safety Training Facility the lowest responsible bid was [2:57:31] about 990,000 more than budget so we're taking some time to figure out um if we [2:57:37] want to try to raise additional Revenue with the with the partners with the owners or make some design changes to [2:57:43] the building so that's happening right now uh number two is that we have an explore we will have explor Chamber of [2:57:51] Commerce uh make their annual presentation to the Council on October 1st that's where they tell us uh what [2:57:58] they did operationally in the last in the previous year and what they're planning for the upcoming year and [2:58:03] finally uh we scheduled a close session of the council uh for 30 minutes on at [2:58:10] 5:00 on September 3rd to give you a litigation update on the Kyle Moore uh [2:58:16] verse city of V matter I know you're hearing about that Minnesota Public Radio did a a story about it you might [2:58:23] be getting questions about it all four of the five of you weren't present when the events uh transpired um so we do [2:58:30] have the attorney from the uh firm that's representing us uh has agreed to [2:58:36] uh do a closed session with Council that night all right I you was one other [2:58:41] thing that came up u in concerns of residence residents I thought you could comment on and that is uh Mr Frankle [2:58:48] raised the issue of what do we know about the status of the uh US Department [2:58:53] of Justice uh looking at the uh issue of the ada8 what did the bridges ADA [2:59:00] Compliant and I think he used the correct terminology he called it an inquiry with that he called it investigation there's a distinction [2:59:06] there I think there's it's an inquiry it's an inquiry not an investigation maybe director Milner can give M has [2:59:12] maybe may have an update tonight yeah there's no update we're still waiting from them we don't expect an answer any [2:59:18] time soon we've learned it could take anywhere up to a year to hear back from the glj on some of these items I also [2:59:24] remember he asked another question about the condition inventory of the Grand View parking ramp so the condition uh [2:59:30] survey was done we were trying to determine how deep the chlorides the salt that the Jerry's uh Enterprises [2:59:37] have been putting on that ramp How deep did they get into the concrete and are they affecting the spr dressed concrete [2:59:44] which are steel cables right that's an issue if it gets there and starts rusting the cables we we found that is not an issue and there's not a the final [2:59:51] report's being worked on right now we just haven't had the final report yet from the consultant so when we have it we can make that available so we got [2:59:58] some good news from that review is that an inspection that we make periodically just in the in due course yes yep it's a [3:00:05] little more invasive we had to drill holes and just see what it looked like but yes at the age of that structure it was time to do something like that okay [3:00:12] and what's the frequency of something like that um that's more like an every 20 year kind of thing as we get to the [3:00:17] age of that which was built in ' 87 so it's more than that but it was time to do it very good thank you for that um [3:00:25] that's all I have thank you thank you um member Risser you want to lead us off um [3:00:32] sure okay the I would like to say as your noise oversight um Committee Member [3:00:39] that this month August there are public workshops that the Federal Aviation [3:00:46] Administration is hosting and these are webinars that people can participate in [3:00:52] Via zoom and they will be held Wednesday August 14th and Thursday August 15th and [3:01:01] um the first webinar on the 14th starts at 10000 p.m. and goes until 300 p.m. [3:01:09] the one on August 14th goes from 6:00 p.m. until 8:00 p.m. and thank you um [3:01:16] director benat for getting that information up you can go online if you want to participate you have to register [3:01:25] okay if you want to Simply watch it you don't you can um watch it even after it [3:01:32] will be put online so people can see it at their convenience uh but if you also go to [3:01:38] that link you can get more information and I know the Adina Community was very [3:01:44] active I believe it was about 11 years ago when there were proposals to change flight paths and really people came [3:01:52] together there hasn't been much information that the noise oversight committee has been able to provide and [3:01:59] so this is kind of your opportunity to see what is being presented and then [3:02:05] there will be a comment period And so people can participate in that but I [3:02:10] really do encourage people to engage to go to this link um to register and to [3:02:18] find out during the webinar you will learn about the current management at [3:02:24] the Minneapolis St Paul of Minneapolis St Paul airspace future implementation [3:02:29] of area navigation departure procedures and that is known as [3:02:36] rnav um you'll hear input from the Metropolitan airports commission and um [3:02:42] those members of the noise oversight committee um who have been the team that has been working very directly with the [3:02:49] FAA and U the environmental study process that is part of this this is a [3:02:55] lot but if you go to the link that is shown on the screen right now you can [3:03:00] also take a look at um more information about what Arnav is and you can look at [3:03:08] the communication that has been going on between the knch and the FAA um I would [3:03:15] also be happy to answer and questions if people want to send me an email um J [3:03:21] Risser atam mn.gov so that is all I have tonight but please [3:03:28] do participate it's this month it's coming up very shortly got one thing for you uh related [3:03:36] to the airport and they're doing the state of the airport in late September maner [3:03:41] Neil trying to attend maybe you'd like to join I yeah we can talk about that later [3:03:50] okay um very good yes member Jackson thank you Mr Mayor so um first of all [3:03:58] I've been talking to people who are getting the US internet and they're concerned about their yards being torn [3:04:04] up and especially a street that had recent Street reconstruction so I talked to Mr Milner briefly about this but one [3:04:11] of the neighbors suggested um a thing called one dig and I looked up and the national league of cities has a um memo [3:04:19] about dig once and I wanted to read the definition policies Ander practices that [3:04:25] minimize the number and scale of excavations when installing telecommunications infrastructure in [3:04:30] Highway rights of way so it's really about being on federal highways this memo that I'm looking at and I know that [3:04:37] putting conduit down for future telecommunications is going to be cost prohibitive but I just wonder if there [3:04:43] was any sort of way we could look at our permitting process for getting these um when telecommunications Comm companies [3:04:50] want to dig up our yards they say can you wait two years when we do our streets or if there's any way we could [3:04:57] tweak our policies to minimize the um invasion in people's right of way so [3:05:04] please send me a link to the policy we're happy to review and update any permitting processes your last comment [3:05:09] about uh can they wait till Street Recon we meet with private utility companies two to three years out before [3:05:14] construction and say we're coming please update your stuff now so we don't have multiple digs so we are doing that [3:05:20] proactively they don't always do it when we want but we try to communicate with them at least so terrific yeah and I [3:05:27] know it's it's complicated and and we don't have a lot of control over when they come but I would I I'll send you [3:05:32] the information and I would just love to know that we're doing all we can thank you um and then of course last night was [3:05:38] night T night and I got to go out with Lieutenant Heckard and and go to a lot of block parties we had a great time um [3:05:45] I want to thank Officer Nick Donahue who put it all together I think he did a really nice job um I want to thank the [3:05:52] neighbors for holding all their parties I had a great time meeting with people and it was they were everywhere we're [3:05:58] driving around going was that one of them we were supposed to go to no no no that that's a another Street they were just everywhere and I love that I think [3:06:04] there were 96 stops um that different members of the city council and staff [3:06:09] went to last night so it was just a phenomenal night um and I do want to remind people that on September 26th our [3:06:16] Police Department is having an open house you can come in and see the police department but more importantly every [3:06:22] kind of police equipment you've ever imagined will be here as well as activities for kids of of all ages and [3:06:28] so uh if you had fun seeing the police cars last night come on the 26th and you'll see everything you could ever [3:06:35] imagine so with that that's those are my comments that's a a great reminder thank you for doing that uh remember Pierce [3:06:43] thanks Mr Mayor I will Echo uh night to unite um was fabulous uh we were with I [3:06:50] actually was with the mayor and um Chief Milburn um and the one thing I think I [3:06:56] would just that was impressive to me all the stops that we made just how engaged [3:07:03] U neighbors were um asking great questions um asking questions about [3:07:10] services and how to interact with the city um and so I I we thought that was I [3:07:16] I just found that um very encouraging um just the dialogue that we had um and [3:07:23] then I have gone on a handful of walks with residents and um just really some [3:07:32] awesome questions and um one of the things that I think I we could say I [3:07:38] think at every stop that we made just about every stop that we made um people wanted to make sure that we share that [3:07:46] the residents appr appreciate the work and the effort from the city staff as well uh so nice work um and it was a it [3:07:54] was a beautiful night um let's hope we have more of those [3:07:59] beautiful nights uh so that's it for me thank you thank you [3:08:04] remember thank you I I'll Echo amazing night last night so thank you to all of [3:08:11] the police staff that also help coordinate that because I think we we sometimes underestimate the level of [3:08:17] effort one both on the the sides of all those in our community that are taking the [3:08:24] initiative to reach out sign up for their block but then from a city staff perspective I know the police department owns a lot of this of coordinating and [3:08:31] making sure that we have people to go out and how cool was that I didn't even know that there were drones out for some [3:08:37] of them and so now I'm going to have to like tell the person that registers on my block to make sure to select the [3:08:43] Drone box next time if that's an option um or I will come to the open house and [3:08:49] potentially there will be the drones there as well um and then one thing that [3:08:55] has come up a couple of times um from just various people in the community whether they're calling in or otherwise [3:09:01] is their frustration over the construction which I know is just something that we need need to deal with [3:09:08] and we deal with it here in Minnesota and we I know do a lot of things at the city level to try and mitigate the [3:09:15] impacts um to members of our community but I'm particularly curious if on [3:09:22] the offramp from the 50th from South 100 [3:09:27] if there's better signage that we could add for people to know that they won't be able to go any further than 100 North [3:09:36] because i' I've heard that a lot of like they get off and they think that they're going to 50th in France so they take a left and then they get routed right back [3:09:43] on to 100 and then they're frustrated and so I'm thinking just better sign AG of like if you want to [3:09:49] go east go west to go east and so I don't know if we have sufficient enough [3:09:55] signage or if you have any thoughts on that um we didn't when we started we [3:10:00] didn't have enough signs we've added signs two to three different times already we added go I like your term go [3:10:06] west to go East we had to go west to go East we added 50th of France District here's the businesses we've added a lot [3:10:12] of additional signs I don't know how many more we can add um so I think we've [3:10:18] we're maxed with signs cuz people can't even read how many are out there already and there's corresponding project got a [3:10:23] complaint today so I'm I'm just feeling that yeah maybe there there's probably some B it's new people that are coming into the area versus people that are [3:10:29] traveling quite often so no I hear you we'll take another look at it thank you I think member egg was on to something [3:10:36] when you come up that ramp nor southbound uh at 50th it should be a big sign right there it says don't turn left [3:10:44] don't even think about it yeah um you're not going wanting to [3:10:49] get off to go right back in France that way yeah yeah something because we had that same issue down uh at uh Wooddale [3:10:56] in 50th trying to make sure people understood that businesses were still open trucks had to go one way and and [3:11:03] now I think the signage is pretty well cleared up but uh still uh we worry about businesses down there uh we've got [3:11:10] pretty hard data down from that group down there that 50s and France Association of businesses down about 30 [3:11:18] % uh due to that project down there and so that's really painful we've talked to them met Council about some kind of an [3:11:24] impact fund I'm so waiting to hear back from them they said they' talk to staff about it but can't say I'm particularly [3:11:29] optimistic uh we'll keep after them um then I want [3:11:36] to throw a compliment your way the two of you you must be calling each other before you get ready for the meetings now I mean you look like you look [3:11:42] fabulous together tonight well thank and then Sharon got in the act by putting on her green lanyard because she didn't [3:11:48] want to be left alone down that at that end of the Das with out her green some green on the meantime the rest of us are [3:11:54] just kind of AD [Laughter] H making individual statements down [3:12:01] here so uh National Night Out uh as everybody has said was just a fabulous [3:12:07] night weatherwise it couldn't have been better and uh you know the five I think we went five different places and the [3:12:13] chief uh uh brought people up to date on public safety issues as I'm sure all the rest of the police officers did and it's [3:12:20] really nice to see the way the neighbors not only appreciate each other and want to get together and visit with each other but how they really appreciate the [3:12:27] our our police department and I think it means a great deal when you get out amongst people in our town and you see [3:12:33] how well appreciated you are as public uh safety officers it's got to mean a [3:12:39] great deal for your ear morale too um I don't know if that's true in every Community but they're really well [3:12:45] appreciated here um so that's it for me um anybody else have anything else they [3:12:51] thought of that want to want to bring up all right is there a motion to adjourn so moved second member Jackson moves [3:12:57] member Pier seconds we adjourned this meeting of the Edina City Council this Wednesday August 7th [3:13:03] 2024 any further discussion all those in favor of adjournment say I I I oppos [3:13:08] carried We Stand adjourned