a special meeting of the Hopkins School Board started. Um, welcome everybody. Thank you for being here. And I would like to um give a special welcome to one of our representatives of a search firm that we chose to interview. Thank you so much for being here. Um Deborah Taylor >> and you are representing HYA and Associates. >> That's correct. >> Um and just officially I um call this meeting of the Hopkins School Board to order. Um it is 5:32 p.m. on Tuesday, January 20th and we will go ahead and um get started right away as I know our treasurer has some place to be. And also um just for our community's information, Director Thompson cannot be here this evening. He sent me the following message. Um I'll be fine with either HYA or MSBA. I think HYA's national footprint is good and I've heard good things about MSBA's SI searches. Main thing on my mind that I'm sure will get flushed out is do both firms have enough capacity with their current search obligations to give us the time and attention we'll need. So that gives you a heads up as to one of the questions you can >> very good >> address. So thank you for being here this evening. We're going to um we could go let's go around the table just quickly say your name um so that um >> may I ask long as we're doing a quick introduction would you would you mind if I ask each member to quickly state a specific question that they have for me which I can then incorporate into my presentation just to save you all time. Would that be all right? Just a moment to do that. >> Sure. The format that we were going to go with was to hear your presentation first and then each board member was going to ask one question. >> Um, and we were going to limit >> board member questions to two total. >> Um, but we can be flexible and adaptable. And so if each board member does want to name their first question um before um the presentation, let's go ahead and do that. Thank you. I would like Director Heyman to start, please. >> Good evening, Johanna Hyman. Um, thank you for coming tonight. Um, one of my questions. Um, is the following. Your proposal emphasizes extensive community engagement and consultant authored leadership profiles. Can you walk us through how community input is synthesized into the profile and how you ensure quieter or less traditional voices are not filtered out in that process? >> Thank you. >> Hello. Uh this is Jiming Joe. Uh my question uh is how does HYA uh separate a good uh superintendent candidate from a okay superintendent candidate? >> What are your [clears throat] criteria? Thank you. >> Hello. Hello. My name is Brooke Roer and um I will save my question for after the presentation. >> No problem. Thank you. >> Hi, my name is Shannon Andre and my question is, have you ever run into a situation where you couldn't find a good fit superintendent for the district you were working with? And how do you handle that situation if you've ever experienced it? >> Thank you. You want me to call? Yes, please. >> Hi, Deborah. I'm Roa Marie Piri Reed, um, current superintendent. Yes. And my question is, how do you support candidates through the process, especially those who are sitting superintendent? And, um, how do you manage for confidentiality? Um, some of the stress they may experience during the process, and public visibility. >> Thank you. >> Um, good evening. I'm Rachel Hartland, the treasurer. And a question that I have relates to the cost. Of course, I did see that there was a cost proposal included with the information the district already received and I was wondering what if any, you know, additional services might your firm offer um at which cost and, you know, if there's anything that is is out of scope but common that the district might see. Thank you. >> Hi, I'm Sarah Wilhelm Garbers and I think the question I'll surface here is how are you intentional and just want to hear more from you in ensuring that it's not just a great superintendent candidate but a great one for the particularity of furthering the work of our district. Thank you. >> You are welcome. Thank you very much. All right, we'll go ahead and get started. I heard you say earlier that we had about 30 minutes. Is that correct for our conversation? >> 20 to 30 minutes for the presentation. >> Okay. Then I will go through these slides rather quickly so that we'll have time for questions and when one of your questions arises in relation to my presentation, I'll take a moment to just point that out and uh elaborate just a moment. Okay. So um first of all, as you know, my name is Dr. Deborah Taylor. I really appreciate the opportunity to be here to present our proposal on behalf of HYA. [clears throat] Before uh as we prepared our proposal, one of the things that we do is to research your district um quite thoroughly. So the first few slides I have to share with you are about Hopkins and um that helps us illustrate that we are um a firm that really tailors the no pun intended uh tailors the proposal to the specific situation, culture, context, strategies and goals that you are working toward. Uh and that was something mentioned by an earlier question and that is um a good versus great candidate. If you have a very specific profile such as one that might match with the aspirations of vision 2031, you're very likely to have an excellent fit and that's what we would be searching for as we worked on this program. I was personally very impressed with your vision and the work that you have underway. Um, I can see that you are looking at a transformational process to really improve education for all students and again that type of vision is something that you would like to see in your candidate and your future superintendent as well. You have a strategic plan that's in place and I can observe that you are making good progress focusing on teaching and learning school district culture and your operations and um [clears throat] by all accounts you have you are very well regarded. you are making good progress and you be you are particularly uh focused on the human element, the engagement and the inclusivity uh and how important it is to honor each individual student and of course staff member as well within your school community. Well, now we're going to move on to your role and as a school board, you have a monumental responsibility. Uh, and that is to move forward with the superintendent selection and the contract and eventually ongoing evaluations and is something that as you are well aware actually this statement was taken from your website on the left hand side. Um, as you proceed with this process, it's important for that you understand uh and come to know the professional and personal qualifications and characteristics of the school district, what your stakeholders know and expect. You had asked a question a moment ago about how can we ensure that we have a full range of community engagement and input and I think that's possible in a number of ways. And if we are selected, what we would do would work with you to identify how we would access in individuals. We would look at both uh virtual in some cases a is a really good venue for busy working parents and community members, but being able to attend in person various [clears throat] community group events and take part in a in-person focus group there is very important. um when you have that opportunity even to spend 45 minutes with a small group of people and you'll hear specifically their um both their comments of POS in a positive nature and any future concerns that they'd like to voice in relation to your future leader. So I believe that that in-person kind of focus group is extremely important. At the same time, you have a district uh which is uh I would say average to above average in size and you have many citizens who might like to know more about what is the search process all about. We can provide you with a community forum and invite folks to come and or uh join in uh electronically to explain what the process is like once the district has made a plan and is ready to proceed with a timeline and specific activities. Some people just have [clears throat] questions or would prefer to take part in a a less formal setting and that's very possible for us as well. So why HYA? I know I'm going to be working um my if you will competition this evening is the state school boards association and I am aware that they have recently obtained a number of search contracts. I believe that they have 10 uh or so in place right now. So it's important for you to understand that HYA as a corporation which has many individual consultants, we can concentrate our work on your district. As you can see, we've already taken some time to research the district to become familiar with the type of um experiences that you've had and what your goals are for the future. Uh by working with HYA, we guarantee that we're going to be providing you with um the not only the experience of our firm, but also that personal touch, an opportunity to get to know you and to enact a process that you are very comfortable with. [snorts] We have the statistics behind us as well. In the last uh 3 to four years, we have had completed the most searches uh nationally. We completed over 90 searches in 2324. And as you probably observe from our application, there is a list of individuals both within the state and the Midwest and nationally uh who could be contacted as references because we have completed a large number of searches. It's important to know that 94% of our superintendents stay for the full term of their first contract. And I think that shows that yes, in fact, we have found a leader that our school board and community are very happy with. I understand that in Minnesota that's a three-year contract. You have an opportunity to continue it, but that's the maximum amount that you can. Uh even so um having that recruiting advantage knowing that folks who come to us are going to be very serious about moving forward with you is extremely important. We have a wide reach not only nationally but in Minnesota as well. Uh we have our network includes retired superintendent some of whom you may know by name. Uh one is uh Dr. Carlton Jenkins who had been a superintendent here a few years back uh Dr. Ted Bazing and there are others. We also have networks here um within the state with aa with the uh excuse me Minnesota um administrators association. So we have many ways to network uh even though we're a national firm. So we had talked a little bit about this before. Um, I guess for your sake, it's important to know that our emphasis, like yours, is on inclusivity and ensuring diversity in your candidate pool. And um, we therefore have experience within our associate group. Uh, 35% of our associates are persons of color, 49% are women. So, we bring that diversity right here to the table. So at this point or when you we conclude our presentation and you've had a chance to confer and consider HYA our question would be which firm has the infrastructure relationships and expertise to recruit your next leader? This is a um visual of our team myself and Dr. Walters and Mr. Fapert are all experienced superintendent. Um, I have myself had 16 years in the role before retiring about a year and a half ago. Um, I sometimes call it rewiring because I'm very busy now even though I'm not currently working in the system. But that provides all of you with some confidence that folks in our team will have had an opportunity to work with school boards, with school communities, and have a successful term as superintendent. myself, I currently serve on on a board and some of our associates do as well. So, I'm also acquainted with the role of the school board and uh the importance of focusing on your needs and your desires as leaders in this process. [snorts] So, some people will say, well, you know, it's in in search processes are the same. Everyone does it the same way. Well, that's not quite true. I've already mentioned that we do take our search process and really um develop it in such a way that it meets your specific needs. We take your direction on how you would like it to unfold. Um there are four phases and um it takes about three months to move through these phases before you reach the final decision makingaking point. First is the engagement which is reaching out to your community having our forums and working with focus groups to get to know individuals and how they would like to see you move forward with your future leader. That [clears throat] information helps to create a leadership profile which uh we then summarize and return to you as a school board. you will then accept or refine that profile and that becomes the you know immediately the the face of the person that you are seeking. Following the engagement process we moved to the recruitment process and I wanted to let you know that once you selected and contracted with our firm we would immediately post your position even though the leadership profile was still being developed. We are at a point in time in the middle of January which is considered still a good time for for recruiting. So we would want to do that as soon as possible. Um [clears throat] our job posts are uh are national. We work with all of the associations. We actually have a LinkedIn presence which is a very popular place for people to search for jobs at this point in time. However, if you felt that you would like to go beyond and look at uh extensive advertising outside, we do have additional costs. It was asked before about some additionals. For example, if you wanted to work in education week or another um another advertisement that requires a specific cost, we would inform you about that and we could work out an arrangement to have that accomplished. Um [clears throat] in the next phase of the process, uh we look at selection and um that takes about 3 to four weeks and during that time period, we work with you to establish [clears throat] your interview protocol. We will provide you with uh excellent uh research-based examples, but we would really like to get your feedback about specific questions you may wish to incorporate. We develop an interview calendar and then we'd also work with you on the finalist feedback. And then last but not least is that all important transition. Uh you have a a current superintendent here, uh Dr. Reed and I know that she will be very willing to assist with the transition and once that first day of work begins and the person takes on the position on their own, they will be needing support. Even if they are an experienced superintendent, moving into a new community and getting to know the students and the administration and working um effectively with you as a school board might require additional support. So, we provide informal mentoring, but we also provide a transition uh seminar that goes on over a period of six months where a superintendent and a board member, potentially a board chair, can attend a virtual series of virtual meetings. And those meetings are specifically designed for that first six months, helping the individual set up their 100-day plan. uh setting up and reviewing in detail the strategic plan that you have in place, getting a feel for the place in which we are in which that in that particular program and moving on. Um [clears throat] also to uh what specific issues might need to be addressed immediately and in the short and long term. So that is lets you know that our we're not going to be um a temporary presence. will be working with you and supporting you and your new superintendent for some time. So I know that many individuals are interested in keeping track of the candidate applications who might come into the portal once um individuals are ready to make application and um it's it's important for you to understand that we are fortunately in in a computer age. So, we've made an we have an opportunity for all of our client districts to have a personalized board portal. And here are the here's the information that's incorporated. Uh you can go through and look at this any time. You can look at the candidates application materials. This is private to you and anyone else who you may designate perhaps your HR person in the district office who can review this and be be apprised of what's occurring. It would look something like this. As you can see, there would be six tabs and uh it would just help you continue to organize and a place that you can go when you need updated information. We've gotten excellent feedback from boards who have worked with us on this process. It's really useful. All right, so getting back quickly to the engage phase. I've briefly discussed it with you. Um the first thing we'll do upon approval is to work with a board planning meeting and uh that would mean we've come back to work with you or whatever it works for you uh work virtually to go over the timeline and it make it specific to your needs. Um part of the engage phase is interviews as well as focus groups. So we will individually interview each board member to get a feel for their purpose, their goals as we move forward in the process. And we'll also conduct focus groups and the community forums as I said and we have an optional stakeholder survey that's available to you. That's an additional uh cost to do a formal survey. This is just another look at that a different graphic. Another look at it. So um I mentioned the people who work with us have very positive feelings about it and and what is the difference between what we might do and in others. Well, we'll personally be present in your district. We will support you. We'll be the face of the school board in um carrying out your wishes in the interview and uh focus group process. And I think that's very important. And we will be devoting our time to working with your district solely. At this point in time, none of us has another search that's underway. What might that look like? Well, here is the search timeline, which is very similar to the one that I included in your board proposal. So, you have had a chance to review this already. I just added a few dates. I don't know if you're going to be making your decision this evening about the appointment or if that will be at your next meeting uh coming up a week from tonight. If you um are ready, whenever you are ready to invite us back to work with you, we will be prepared to support you in finalizing this search timeline. I've mentioned to you that uh I'm assuming that you are looking for the July one start date. That's correct. Okay. Excellent. And u when we meet with you, we'll come up with a specific timeline with with specific dates to move each of these processes forward. So again, more of a summary. We are your ambassadors. We are looking to provide you with that um versatile meeting formats. We are looking for supporting your community with by having flexible meeting times [clears throat] and also um looking for diverse and inclusive ways to include community members. One example I'd like to give you is um we'll reach out to community organizations whether it be your school or district PTO or um other organizations in the community whether it might be uh Rotary or Kuanas where people normally would gather and also u of course have an interest in supporting the schools and you may naturally have other groups that you would like us to connect with. Those were just a few examples and then we would uh request that we be incorporated into their agenda or invite some of their group members to join a focus group. So I think one of the most important things to recognize about our firm is that recruiting advantage. We truly work very very hard to aggressively recruit candidates for you. Um you are probably aware that like educators in general it is difficult to find high-quality individuals to serve both in the schools as teachers and administrators and as well as superintendent. Um so we have a large diverse network. Um it may be that on the other hand it may be that you have an administrator here in your district if who you would like to see apply for the position. uh if you have an internal candidate, we would treat them just like any other candidate, but we would certainly take them that person through the process. So, your options range from local to national and um our network provides us with uh information that really support us in the um not only bringing a diverse set of candidates to you, but having people who really match your profile as that proceeds. Um I'm enjoying the the graphics time. I don't know about you, but I have a great time doing these on my slides. So, just another way to look at it. [clears throat] All right. Um, another important point is, and again, how how many of you have ever been involved in a superintendent search before? Any of you? Okay. All right. Great. Wonderful. So for others um it's important to recognize that whether we um that there are sometimes unconscious biases that occur when one is looking at uh employing a new person or interviewing a new person and something we have to be very very careful about and that's one of the reasons why I dislike uh the whole idea of video conferencing as a screening tool. I think we need to take a look at all of our candidates for the qualities and the experience that they bring forward. Um, once again, more exciting graphics for us, but in the interest of time, I'll move on. Uh, so we've talked about the high the HYA transition academy, and here are some of the outcomes of that. the 100 day plan looking at aligning uh communication and measuring progress of your current strategic plan as well an evaluation process that's very important for the school board of course uh and also a strategic plan assessment. So it would give a new person coming on the scene that opportunity. Now this is available to all individuals that we recommend that the district might place. So any of our clients for no charge and others if they're interested would need to pay an additional 4500. So that is built in to your fee already. And finally the um supports that we provide are in project planning, community engagement, recruitment and sourcing, uh candidate management, vetting and due diligence and also advisory services. So what I'd like to just comment on now um in relation to some of the questions that you've brought up before is the idea of how does one support a candidate to toward the successful outcome. Um and again um a candidate may be looking at a number of districts. It's possible that they may be candidating in more than one district. So we need to make it clear uh upfront that if that's the case that they need to inform us. I find that one is working on a search uh it's very important to find out exactly what the individual candidate needs and that support is important. It might mean uh checking in with that person every week or two. It might mean um checking in to ask about additional information that they might require. Um we also support people going through the application process which is an online process but you know certainly from time to time people might have questions about that. So we want to be sure that our candidates are successful and that they are going to be prepared for u moving forward successfully. It's also necessary to um point out that the state of Minnesota has a complex uh system for qualification as a superintendent and uh I myself do hold a uh superintendent's license in Minnesota. Uh and I receive that as an in through the alternative pathway which many people do. uh it requires some additional coursework and uh two or three different groups that one must interact with. It's really quite complex. So with that experience, we know that we'll be able to support a candidate from out of state who might not come to you with that um Minnesota credential through that process. And we have connections at the university as well. So that's a very important piece. Um, let's see. As far as the good or great, we are definitely going to be looking for the great candidate, the greatest person for you. Um, and um, as you can see, our attention to detail, our communication with you and um, getting to know your district and staying in touch with you and being available to you 247. Truly, we are. We'll give you our cell phone numbers. In fact, we already have uh as time goes on to see if you have any specific questions, we make that available to you as well. Um the last thing I have here, and you may wonder why um I realize that, you know, this is a challenging time right now in the schools throughout the country really, but in particular here in the Twin Cities and the suburbs of the Twin Cities. And I essentially wanted to let you know that if a potential candidate has questions about perhaps they're from out of state, they have questions about the community and how the school board and the school administration are addressing some of the challenges that they're experiencing right now in the community. Uh I would point out I think your excellent uh board safety statement that you shared and um and again I'm certain that that's something that you would want to discuss further with your search firm to ensure that it was very clear that you maintain your or continue to have your focus and support for an inclusive and diverse school community and to ensure that every student in the school community is successful. And one of the ways to do that is to provide these kinds of reassurances to the community, the parents, staff, and the students. So, I really um would like to thank you for your leadership in that area for certain. And now we're back to questions along with some lovely pictures of the students in your district. [laughter] Thank you for that presentation and also thank you for acknowledging the times that we're living in and also um the ways in which the Hopkins community shows up for each other. So I appreciate that. >> Of course. Um, and I would like to then offer an opportunity for each board member, um, Vice Chair Roer, you get two, um, to ask, um, follow-up questions or if you have an additional question that you wanted to get some more information on from HYA specifically to, um, feel free to do that. Um I'm going to start with you uh Vice Chair Roer because you didn't ask your question um before and then we'll we'll end with you. So thank you. >> Okay. All right. Well, thank you. Well, thank you so much for that very detailed presentation. I really appreciate it and learning more and it's always helpful to hear about the experience that you bring um as a superintendent in this current process. So the question that I do have is um how will you support the board in aligning around a shared leadership profile before candidate interviews begin >> um to develop the leadership profile? How would we engage the board with that? >> Yeah. So yeah, so how would you like help us as like a board >> um you know align around like the leadership profile that we are looking for in the current superintendent? I mean, excuse me. In our future, superintendent. [laughter] >> Certainly. We can we can >> I know what you meant. That's fine. Yes. Well, thank you. Well, I I have to say the first thing I would do would be to um just bring to your attention the Minnesota superintendent competencies so that you would know uh what a high quality superintendent is from the standpoint of the Minnesota Department of Education and the research uh base that went to that. So, you'd have a starting point. Um the interviews that we would be conducting with you would provide us with more information than you might share as a group and and again that would be returned back to you in the in a summary. All of our interviews that we conduct will be turned back to all of you in a summary form so you can hear all of your voices and and what your interests are. focus groups and if you choose a survey, the community forum will be collecting feedback along the way and all of that will be distilled into the uh core elements that you would find most compelling in your future leader. So that profile um it's not possible for me to imagine exactly what it would state but it will be a culmination of both what is expected of a high quality leader what we've discussed the competencies as well as what you and your community desire to see in your future superintendent keeping in mind the strategic plan and goals you have and uh how you would like to move the district forward. We would be working with the community and then come back to you with a draft profile. You would be then as a board um refining, making adjustments and um once you were comfortable with the content of the profile, we would then release it and make it public. So that's a decision that you would make with input from the community. >> Okay. >> Thank you so much. >> Sure. >> Director Xiao. >> Hi. Yes. Hi Deborah. Thank you for uh the presentation. Um it's more of a general question. Um but as you alluded to, this is the first time a lot of us are uh evaluating a superintendent. Uh what advice would you have for us on how we should evaluate a superintendent applicant and uh what what are some of like two or three things that we should look for? >> Sure. Um well, we wouldn't be bringing anyone to you that wasn't qualified. Uh that's one thing. I think the first thing that you should be looking at is um whether you personally and again this you're going to be part of that decision um whether you personally believe that this individual presents the leadership profile characteristics that will assist uh your school district in moving forward. So let me just give an example. Um suppose that you're interested in uh focusing primarily on student achievement as in your next superintendent. And again, this is just nothing nothing at all to reflect on on your current school system. But if that's the case, you may be looking for an individual who has um either classroom a tremendous amount of classroom experience or a person who has worked in a leadership role and very successfully moved a school system forward to improve outcomes for children. So, uh you could determine that. Um again, we would assist you with that through reference checks, etc. In the case of the interview process, there's really two sections. There's first the first um group of candidates would be a larger group and then you would narrow it down to one, two or three finalists. So you would have two opportunities to meet with each candidate. And oftentimes the school board goes off script on their last interview and they might ask some follow-up questions from the first that they did not have an opportunity to ask about. So, um, you know, I think between that and our report back to you on references for each candidate, I think should give you good information for decision- making. >> Thank you. That's very helpful. >> Sure. >> Thanks. Um, and I did want to mention um, if a board member if you feel like you need a followup on your first question, feel free to do that. Um, and and then you still have a second. So, I wanted to clarify that. Okay, Director Heyman, >> thank you for the informative presentation. Um, one question I have is [sighs] um, will candidates you you acknowledged our current strategic plan of vision 2031 and will candidates who are thoughtful and aware but per but even maybe critical of the current strategic plan be considered or is alignment with the existing plan used as a screening or filtering criter criteria in your search process? >> Yes, that's a good question. Well, and not knowing your system well enough, um you might be in a position of getting ready to restart a new planning process. I I don't know. I find though that um a person who is truly interested in your pos in your current position that's open is going to be focused on getting to know as much about you as they possibly can. and things like your current strategic plan are going to really inform um them about your work that you've accomplished and your aspirations for the future. So, I think a good candidate should come prepared to be able to speak about um what you currently have in place as well as what their vision might be to move the the school system forward and the success they've had in other leadership roles that would accomplish that. But once again um you know a plan is is a flexible document and um it does it does necessarily have to be adjusted at times uh in the event of change in the community or perhaps all goals were accomplished. Well, we've got to go back to the drawing board and start again. So, um, but I do think it what I typically would recommend to a candidate so that they would take time to become familiar with your current plan and other information about the demographics of your district. >> Thank you. >> Yeah, >> director. Oh, no, sorry. Clerk >> WG that Okay, great. Thank you. >> Yes. Excuse me. Thank you. >> I think my question is I appreciated I'll start with what I appreciated. I appreciated how you highlighted your all's work and in um seeking to include voices and I think as you uh director Heyman had named um you know voices that are diverse across our community and one of those that I was curious about is um what is the imagination around students uh of all ages in ways that we might include them in our listening um for what they're hoping for is from us as a district in this next season with leadership. Thank you. >> Thank you so much for that question. Uh actually I didn't mention it because uh it just didn't occur to me to point it out but that is the first thing we do is to work with representatives groups of students and uh we work with both middle school students and high school students to seek feedback. Uh and it's can be done in a number of ways. Um I think a comfortable way is a a focus group. And the idea behind a focus group is that we ask similar questions to every group and uh I find that the students when we work with students they have such interesting perspectives and um not just about the day-to-day but you know about their future and I think that's important for you to know when we provide you with feedback we'll provide it by group not so that you can individually identify anyone but we would have a separate set of feedback for students community, parents, staff will also of course invite teachers and other support staff from the school system to take part in focus groups. So you will have a very broad and inclusive um way of looking at it. I know that you're uh also have some language diversity in your community and we highly recommend looking for ways to connect with individuals of various languages and to provide interpreters for those community or parent focus groups. We would have to work with you on setting those up, but that's extremely important too to be sure that we have an inclusive voice. >> Great. Thank you. Mhm. >> Thank you. Uh, Treasurer Hartland, >> thank you. Um, I echo my colleagues thanks and appreciation. Um, a followup to my initial question was you mentioned an additional cost would be a stakeholder survey. I was wondering if you could touch very briefly on the cost and format of that and then I do have one other question. >> Sure. Um, I have just one second. Uh it is uh $2,000 and it has a um it's an electronic survey uh and it's researchbased. We've been utilizing it and adjusting it for many years. It [clears throat] provides you with the same type of feedback within the stakeholder groups that we spoke about. Students can utilize it, staff, community parents. Uh so it's it does not take more than about five or 10 minutes to complete. It's a series of questions that um again we're looking at focusing on the next leader and their characteristics in the question. >> So is this like a link that would be generated that we could email say to parents or something like that? Is that what you mean by an electronic survey? >> You're asking if we could generate that in an email. Is that what I'm sorry I didn't hear you. Yeah, I I am curious how we will you said it's an electronic survey and like how would we generate it? Certainly. Thank you guys. I see what you're saying. So, I would imagine that your district has utilized surveys in the past and uh it would depend upon the group. First of all, I would we usually set it up for about um 3 to four weeks of time. We would advertise it on your with your assistance assistance of the staff here uh on the website. Um normally if you have utilize your social media to send out the link and or a QR code to link directly to the survey. Um the um other ways would be to set time aside in school perhaps during faculty meetings or staff meetings where the staff could you know collectively complete the survey. Same with students in home rooms etc. So there are ways to get a lot of robust engagement in that survey. Absolutely. If it's uh properly if people are properly notified about it. And um the other thing is some people say well what about folks who aren't technically savvy? Well some schools choose to make uh hard copies and perhaps take them to an assisted living location and have them complete it and then turn it back in and hard copy to us. So there are many ways that we can get input. traditionally and non-traditionally. >> Okay. Thank you. >> And then my second question is either from what you know about our district or in the climate today, what do you see as a big challenge that we might face and briefly how would you help us with that? >> Sure. Well, I think that the transition to a new superintendent is quite a challenge. Um I understand that you've been with the district a number of years. Is that right? >> Nine. >> Nine. Right. Right. Um, so I think I think what you ought to understand that a new leader coming into the school is going to require some time to transition and um they will it usually takes six months to a year before all aspects of the position and the responsibilities are are known. Um and I think that um the important thing again from what I've seen in your district uh is going to be to keep the momentum the positive momentum going uh in terms of the accomplishments that you have completed so far and also to address um you know any issues that may arise. I think that uh from the community's standpoint uh maintaining strong positive communication, focusing on inclusivity, looking for ways to invite the public in to ensure that they uh are that they understand what the school system is all about and also that they have an opportunity for input in an ongoing basis is very important. I've always found as a superintendent that that I can't you can't communicate enough. um as the more you can reach out to people and speak to folks and share information online the better. So um so I think ongoing communication would certainly be helpful and um and then perhaps uh you know the challenges that we have right now um politically uh you might be seeking a leader who has a calm demeanor who is able to um um diffuse challenging situations uh to um address and come up with solutions when there are distinct differences of opinion. And that, you know, is certainly one of the challenges that I'm sure you're currently seeking or seeing at this point in time. I would need to get to know your district more to be able to comment further. But just to give you a little bit of an outline if you ask me in a month after I've completed all the community engagement sessions, I'd be able to provide you with a lot more detail. >> Thank you. >> Um, have any more questions, >> Dr. Mary Perry Reed does not have any more questions. Um, so forgive me if I missed it, but I don't feel like I heard what you if the answer to the question of have you ever experienced not finding the right fit superintendent? And if you have, how how do you handle that situation? >> Yes. Yes. I have not personally had that situation, nor am I familiar with other circum excuse me um superintendent searches through the firm where that has been the case. But if it were the case, um one opport one option that you might consider is hiring an interim and restarting the search in a future year. An interimm is something that someone that you might work with for six months or a year's of time. Um, but that has not been something that I've run up against as a problem. And I think part of the reason is because we do aggressively recruit. Um, and when I mean that, it's not that we are calling everyone that we know and saying, "Hey, this is the job for you." But really just connecting with our associates and our contacts in the state and saying, "We're looking for a person to fill this role. Here is the profile. Can you help us identify some people who we might reach out to? Uh and I think that's the difference. The application will be available to anyone who wishes to apply. So all applications will be reviewed. But I think uh once we have a clear understanding of your future leader expectations, we would be effective I think in our recruitment strategies. >> Thank you. Um, and just to to to um just a quick followup, if we did go through that hiring and interim process, is that something that would be included in your um this proposal that you've set before us or would we be adding that on to the cost? >> You know, not having done that before, I would really have to check. I can say that we have a guarantee in the contract that if the person that you decide to hire uh does not stay with the school district through the first full year, we will provide you with the search services without additional cost to find another person to replace that. So that's the guarantee that >> you know we have made known and available to you. So, if for whatever reason that person decides it's not the right fit or you decide it's not the right fit, we would be there to help you recruit a new person, I would I would have to check on that. Uh, and I would have to get back to you, but I certainly could do that. Yeah, I'd be interested to hear if that would be transferable to the interim process or >> I think the most I think the most important thing to emphasize is that we are personally going to support your quest for your new leader and u and that will be our sole responsibility. So, we'll be putting all of our time and effort into that. >> Thank you. And we also provide a price match for similar services. If that is something that uh our competitor is offering a different price and you'd like to uh consider that, I I can certainly work with you on that as well. >> Great. Thank you. >> Of course. >> Um and then my second question is how do you help the board reach consensus? Um, and expanding on that, how do you handle situations where the board is divided on candidate preferences? >> Yeah. Well, um, our goal first of all is to work with the board to help them um, gain an understanding of the interview process. So uh we would offer a pre-inter sort of mini workshop for you as a group and that hopefully would assist you in understanding how yourselves how you can work together to achieve consensus. Uh however uh there are some specific things that we have found that are useful in facilitating groups toward consensus and most of the time what we seek is you know returning to a specific candidate's strengths and um part of the process that you'll be doing is taking notes about each candidate interview. So take a look at the strengths of each person. uh perhaps you might share them with one another to see if you have uh agreement. Um if in a larger group we would use a fistto five protocol. I'm not sure if you're familiar with that. If you're just as you work through, you know, um if you have no problems with the candidate, you know, you're going to have all five fingers up. If you have if you can't accept them for any reason, you might have your fist and and that will help you see how the group is progressing toward a full consensus. That's just one example, but there are, you know, a number of different protocols that we might use to support you in that decision. >> Thank you. Sure. >> Appreciate it. >> And direct vice chair Roer. >> Um, thank you so much, Shannon. was kind of my question as well around just like the alignment of the um the profile of leadership that we're looking for with our superintendent. Um my other question would be um so how do you evaluate a leader's ability to hold competing truths? So like academic urgency, fiscal responsibility, labor dynamics, and community expectations at the same time. Well, I think as um as a leader who has been in that role, uh I certainly feel that it's important to have knowledge of all aspects of the district's operation. And um depending upon I've worked in different school systems, so the time and attention you might spend in a certain area will vary depending on the time of year or a specific issue that's cropped up. For example, if you're in the midst of labor negotiations, then that will be a focus for you. Um, I also believe it's important for a superintendent to understand how to delegate andor utilize the expertise within the school system. So, um I would um want to be sure that a person had the um not only the knowledge and skills in each of those areas, but also could effectively oversee, delegate, and then yet maintain uh clear oversight of the work to be sure it's accomplished appropriately. Um it is important to have a balance as well. You know, most people in you all have jobs and I'm sure you're very busy. Um it's important to recognize that um a good leader also has a personal life and perhaps a family life and uh you know I encourage people to ensure that they have they take time for themselves as well as uh devoting their time and effort to the school district. >> Thank you so much for that. Just a really really quick followup. Is there any is there any aspect of the superintendent search where you engage different entities such as like our city council or mayor um in the process at all just like giving like some feedback or are they considered like the community engagement just because our work intersects a lot and just was wondering have that is that historically a part of the superintendent search at all? >> Yes, absolutely and it could be part of the interview process in addition to interviewing you. You could ask us to interview your mayor or you know other individuals in the community that uh have positions of importance that you would like to be sure are connected with the search or invite them to a specific focus group you know for their roles and responsibilities as well. So, this is your search and I want you to emphasize that we would want to personalize it, customize it just for your needs. And if that's an area you would want us to focus on, we definitely would. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Um, I appreciate your time, your presentation. Um, >> and we are at our time almost exactly. So, well done everybody. Um and uh we'll look forward to getting back to you after we've deliberated um and decided on a on a search firm. >> Excellent. Um do you think that you'll be just a question? I wasn't certain if this is an action decision you'll be making this evening or might you be making it at your next board meeting? >> Yes, we're hoping to have the decision made tonight so we can let you know. >> All right. Very good. >> Yes. >> Very good. Uh would you like me to stay in case you have questions for later on or >> um if you have the time that would be great. Um >> Sure. >> Yeah. >> Okay. I will do that. Thank you. >> Thank you so much. >> It's a pleasure speaking with all of you and I really appreciate the opportunity to share HYA's experience and uh we look forward to working with you hopefully. >> Thank you so much. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Thanks again. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> No, she said she would be waiting in the hall. So I don't know if Natalia went to go get her. >> Yeah. >> Um I think >> MSBA did that. I I guess just out of respect for >> presentation I but I guess we're waiting to see if if she's here. >> So [laughter] she personally >> um yes she's here in person. Yeah. Mhm. >> It was pretty share anymore. >> Oh, yes. >> Do you like the teriyak time? >> Oh, is this teriyaki? >> No, this is just tea. But I want to ask who can get teriyak. >> Public servants. Somebody teriyak. So bougie like can you get teriyak? >> [clears throat] >> Thanks again. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Got to make sure you clean your teeth afterwards. >> Bring your own teriyak just like [laughter] >> dabbling on. I am >> your personal ter. >> No, I like it. I like flavor. It's really good. You cook with it. >> Use a lot of sodium. >> It's high in sodium. You check your blood pressure. >> You don't use low. >> Okay. >> Sodium, >> but then I use like six times more. [laughter] It's the pizza, you know. >> Oh gosh. That's hilarious. >> See here. >> Hello. >> Hello. >> Welcomebody. Hello. >> I'm going to try and hook my computer up so that I'm running it from this. So, if you give me just a minute to see if that's going to work there. >> Hello there. >> I have an HDMI port. >> Uh, you might need an adapter. Do you have one? Yes. >> I can dig through my briefcase. >> Oh, no. I I have one. >> You're okay. Okay. I'm just going to give you each one of these before the meeting. >> Oh, thank you so much. >> Yeah, I'm Barb, by the way. >> Johanna Johanna need more. [laughter] >> Thank you. Thank you very much. >> Absolutely. I'm Barb. >> Thank you. Nice to [clears throat] meet you, Brooker. >> Nice to meet you, Vice Chairman. Hi. Nice to meet you, too. Thanks for being here, Dr. >> Nice to see you as well. >> Thank you. You're welcome. Hi, >> Nice to meet you, Sarah. >> Thank you so much. >> How dare you? >> Grab. Great. No, this is actually a very healthy snack if you're looking to like shape up a little bit. >> Shape like shape up. >> You're looking for energy balance. Like >> this is the pinnacle of balance videos. >> There's no way or just >> how dare you. [laughter] >> So, let me close everything. >> No. >> Open up the one. >> Clearly not >> that I need tonight. >> That is hilarious. I'm married. >> Presentation show from beginning are very perfect for each other. Appreciate it. >> [clears throat] [clears throat] >> Are you ready? >> I think I am. >> Wonderful. Thank you so much for being here. Um we look forward to hearing more about the executive search services through MSBA. Um, and just so you're aware of the process, we um are have 20 to 30 minutes for your presentation and then >> 30 >> 20 to 30 >> 20 to 30. Okay. >> Thank you. >> Um and then each board member will ask a question and we we get the opportunity as well as our um superintendent um and then uh get the opportunity to ask to ask a second. Um, and we're hoping to keep that to 20 to 30 minutes as well. So, thank you for being here this evening. And, um, feel free to go ahead and get started or we could go around and introduce ourselves first. Sure. >> And then, um, we'll get started. Okay. Thank you. Would you like to start, Director Heyman? Sure. >> My name is Johanna Heyman. I was just elected in November. This is my second ever board meeting. So, thank you for being here. Thank you. >> Hello, this is Jiming Joe. >> Hi, my name is Brooke Roer. >> Hi, Shannon Andre. Nice to meet you in person officially. >> Thank you. >> And Roaria Puri Reid, current superintendent. >> And Sarah Wilhelm Garber's also my second uh board meeting. So, thank you for being here also. >> Thank you. I truly appreciate the chance to visit with you about MSBA's superintendent search services. Uh my name is Barb Dorne. I'm the director of leadership development and executive search at MSBA. And the first thing I want to do is acknowledge that we are in difficult times. So all of you as school board members and Dr. Mary Perry Reid, I want to thank you for everything you are doing for the students in Hopkins public schools. That is unprecedented times right now. And for those of you who were at the MSBA leadership conference last week, I think that sense of camaraderie and shared vision and care for our students came through very very clearly in the days that I was there. So, thank you for all of that. Uh, so Chair Andre, members of the board, Dr. Mayor Perry Reid, I am hoping to tell you a lot in 20 to 30 minutes about the superintendent search services that MSBA provides. Um, it will feel like I'm telling you a little bit about a lot of things because there is so much involved in a superintendent search and I know you have seen our proposal as well which is a pretty thick document. So I'm going to refer to that a few times as well as the information that is in the um folder that I distributed to all of you as well. So the first thing I want to talk about is the fact that uh when we partner with people who are different than us the outcome is always stronger. That is a core premise of board leadership. It is something we take uh very personally at MSBA and I want to share with you the members of the team that we will be sharing with you as part of the superintendent search process here in Hopkins public schools. I have been at MSBA for almost seven years now. Uh this is the only work I do in superintendent search. It is something that consumes me year round but particularly from November until June as well as all the members of my team. Um as far as the leadership team though I am going to speak a little bit about the people that are on our service provider list here in the metro area. There are five people who will be participating as uh veters and recruiters for the MSBA search. You can see them right here. Uh first of all, Dr. Kate Magcguire. Uh she was the superintendent for a long time in AIO public schools. when she retired from there. She did work as the interim superintendent at Anoka Henipin and also in St. Louis Park. Uh Dr. Magcguire was also superintendent of the year in 2014 here in Minnesota. If you look inside this booklet here, I should also mention on the left side of the folder is a map and this is uh the service providers that we have across the state. So, we have a statewide reach and everyone on here are consultants that assist MSBA because they have experience as an administrator, a superintendent or a schoolboard member. Everyone in the yellow area, myself, Amy Jordan, Shelby Herrera, and Maria Shinderbogger are MSBA employees. And for all of us, this is all that we do is the superintendent search. And we also do superintendent evaluation, which of course is tied very, very closely to superintendent search. Everyone else is um a service provider for us in search work in the metro area. You can see the people that we have identified behind here with their resumes. This information is also in the proposal, but I did include it in here one more time if you'd like to see the backgrounds and experience of the five people that make up our uh Minnesota Metro vetting team. So, in addition to Dr. McGuire, uh Dr. John Ward is a service provider for MSBA. He is a uh longtime Mountains View um member of the staff there. He spent about 25 years, eventually in the district office for about the last 20 serving as general counsel and assistant superintendent as well. Dr. Bernardia Johnson was formerly the superintendent of Minneapolis public schools. I would say that Dr. Johnson is one of the most fierce advocates for students that I have ever met. uh the passion just oozes from her when you speak to her about public education. So, we're very excited that she is on our team as well. Uh Josh Paulie is a school board member formerly in Minneapolis public schools. His background is in the private sector and in entrepreneurship and he is also our national recruiter. And I'll talk more about our team when we get a little further in here as well. And then uh Connie Hayes is a former superintendent of Intermediate School District 916. uh her background is in school psychology and she is one of the most insightful veterans that I have ever worked with as well. So these five people in addition to myself and the team that you see listed um in the yellow area of that map will be working exclusively for you on the Hopkins superintendent search process. I value these folks for a lot of reasons. Um not only because they think differently than me and they have different life experiences. They also have um some wisdom and some experience and connections that I think are second to none. And in particular, their Minnesota connections and experience are very very deep and very very wide. So as they work with us on the team, I will be asking them for assistance in recruiting. They will take a look at all of the applications. They do help us winnow down the pool to those who most align with your leadership profile and the results of your public summary report. And so I'll be leaning on them quite heavily because I'm very very aware that I don't know everything, but I will be serving as the search lead for Hopkins Public Schools. So that means that you will be hearing from me a great deal and I will be available to you whenever you have a question as well. So I'll be the search lead for you on this process. I want to talk about some lessons learned. First and foremost, uh, one of the things that I think people get a little bit, um, I can't think of the right word, but they get a little bit overwhelmed by is the amount of work involved in a superintendent search. And there are a lot of different things involved. So, it can feel at times confusing to sort of sift through all of the noise. So, I'm going to tell you first and foremost, there's no magic to it. Uh, every search firm will do the same things, but we all do them differently. So there's six things that every search firm you visit with or any proposal you receive will talk about. They'll talk about creating the leadership profile in partnership with the board, members of the public, and the staff. They will offer engagement opportunities for people to be involved in the process. They will advertise this. They will recruit people for the positions. They will vet those applications and recommend finalists to you. That is just standard. The last piece is facilitating the interview process. And again, that is just a matter of extremely strong communication during that phase. I'm not going to get into depth on each of these, but I'm simply going to tell you that what we do 10 years ago is probably very similar to all of the other search firms. We've been doing searches for over 15 years here in Minnesota, and in the last five, we have become the premier search firm in the state of Minnesota. We've done over 130 searches in the last uh 10 years, but prior to that, we probably are sitting close to 250 or 300 searches. But we also are statewide, so it is a much larger footprint. In the last few years, we're doing most of the metro searches as well. So, how we do this is different. The what I'm not going to spend time on, but I will talk about continuous improvement just for a moment because things need to change. And the continuous improvement model that MSBA uses us uses is really based on this. So, first and foremost, educationally here in Hopkins public schools, are you still doing things the same way that you did five years ago or even two years ago? Things have changed. Correct. And they obviously need to do that. And I think for us at MSBA, the turning point came in 2020 because we were doing things very similarly to more traditional search firms. And the pandemic really forced us to take a closer look at what we do, how we do it, and why we do it that way. So we did start to think um much more clearly about continuous improvement in 2021 after the pandemic. So the methodologies will evolve with the time and um I'm going to talk about that a little more specifically with this middle one on innovation and adaptability because we think that is key. Uh the speed of education matters and I think search processes need to keep up with that as well. So then the next couple of slides we'll talk about the innovation adaptability. Absolutely. We think transparency is going to be the most important part of a successful search. Uh that'll come apparent here in a little bit. But we do believe that MSBA is the most transparent search process that you can possibly utilize. And I'm going to share with you some reasons why that is. So these slides simply take those six things that people do at a search firm and breaks them out into what MSBA does that is perhaps different. But again, more detail is in this proposal right here. So first, creating a leadership profile. That's a partnership between uh board members, the search firm and members of the public staff, community members, students, etc. So, every single year we refresh our hiring criteria because things do change. Uh five years ago, AI AI was probably not in consideration as something that your superintendent as a leader really needed to be aware of. So, we've added things along the way over the last few years as education has evolved. So the hiring criteria is what you as a board will take a survey on. We will then take your survey information and we'll craft a leadership profile for your review. Also, you'll be gathering information from the public, staff, students, etc. You can choose timing wise to build the leadership profile before all of that information is gathered or after all of that information is gathered. With it currently being the middle of January, I'd probably recommend the board creating the leadership profile and using information that you gather from the input opportunities for your public to support that rather than waiting than um if you'd started this a few months ago, you might have been able to wait have a leadership profile that you put together with all of your feedback as well as the public. In this case though, I'd encourage you to think about the profile being created by the board in combination with uh MSBA's uh MSBA's work as well. You are unique and so I talked a little bit about board and stakeholder, but your vision 2031 is so exciting. Obviously, that's going to be a very big part of developing the right profile for the next leader here in your district. And the timing I mentioned because you do not have the luxury of time as much right now. It is high search season. I'd encourage you to think about releasing the leadership profile sooner rather than later. And we'll talk some more about gathering input from your communities to uh support and see whether that aligns with what you're thinking of or not. Public engagement opportunities. This is something everyone does. Everyone does it differently. I will tell you that we have created some things in the last few years that no one else does. This has come in part from the feedback loop that we seek from all of our clients as well as all of our candidates. At the end of each search season, we send out surveys and say, "Hey, what did you think of the search? What went well? What could we do better?" We take that very seriously. And a couple of things that we have added just in the last few years are the first two here. Uh search preview meetings are held with internal district leadership. So that would be typically um administrators and also leadership of your bargaining units. So we want to meet with those groups and we can do as many groups as you need. We can do them virtually or in person and we want to share information with them before the search really gets rolling because those folks internally have so much uh credibility and they have so many contacts that we want to make sure they have the information they need to feel comfortable being asked questions about the search process. So for example the search preview meetings when I sit down with those folks I'll share information out. I'll share with them the uh timeline that the board has decided upon, the vacancy brochure and the leadership profile and the u public summary information opportunities through a survey, focus groups, etc. So, I'm sharing information out. I'm also answering their questions and I'm going to be going to ask for their help because the more people that are involved in this process early on, that's for the better because it will prevent misinformation from taking root and we want to at all costs avoid rumors starting and people not understanding what's happening and why and when. So, the search preview meetings were added maybe two years ago, two or three years ago, and they've proven to be a very, very effective way to loop in your internal district leadership immediately. Now, the Q&A with MSBA sessions, we've been doing those for about three years, maybe four years. Uh, and that came about because people had questions and they wanted to know what's going to happen. Um, leadership transitions create a lot of anxiety. There's a lot of emotion involved. There are a lot of um rumors that do start unfortunately. So, the Q&A session is something that we host. It's a Zoom meeting and we hold it at maybe four o'clock on a weekday afternoon and we answer questions no matter who [clears throat] they are. Um, we present the leadership profile, the vacancy brochure, the timeline and the opportunity for input through the st the surveys and the focus groups. Uh, but we also record it because we know people cannot all come at 4:00 on a Thursday, something like that. But because people are so busy, the vast majority of folks watch this online, not necessarily the live session. But to accommodate their questions, we have a survey link that we send out that says, "What questions do you have about the process?" Anyone and everyone, whether they are a community member, parent, student, they can send those questions to me in advance and I will be sure to answer those questions during the live session. So if they can't join us during the live session, they will watch the recording at a later time, hear their questions answered. So that has been a really important way for us to keep transparent information in front of everyone because it goes on the district website through the entirety of the search. So if any of you as board members are asked a question, for example, that you don't know an answer to or com aren't comfortable answering, you can ask that person, have you watched the Q&A online? people when they go watch that often have no more questions but it has been something we added um two three years ago I think and it's been proven to be very very helpful so we do provide a public survey also very early in the process we think that that is the most equitable way to gather information from all the different school communities here in Hopkins public schools uh we will also um do listening sessions and focus groups I want to share a couple of thoughts on this though first and foremost we feel the survey instrument is the very best way to gather information um and level the playing field between how loud the voices are heard because very very often what happens with uh the focus groups is there are barriers to access. People are unable to come to those sessions because they might do shift work or they don't have child care or they don't have transportation or they don't want to be out in public or they don't speak English as their first language. So there's many ways for people to be excluded from the listening sessions and focus groups. [clears throat] We will certainly do those. We just want you to think very carefully about how we design those and who comes and how people are um able to participate. The survey instrument has proven to be an exceedingly effective way to hear all of the voices. We offer it um automatically in three languages, English, Spanish, and Somali. We can do other languages if you request those. Um certainly we might need the help with translators inside the district. Google translate is not always the best tool to put them in different languages. Uh however those three are offered Spanish, small and English. We also provide it in hard copy because for ADA reasons first and foremost not everybody can or will use an electronic copy. So we want to have that available to people. Also hard copies can often be um shared by a trusted resource within the district. Often marginalized communities don't they don't know me. they don't necessarily want to come and talk to me about something, but they'll talk with cultural leaison. They'll talk with staff they trust. U maybe their own students can help them take the survey. So, we want to be as inclusive as possible. And so, we do run that survey for maybe five weeks, four to five weeks at this point in the year. And we get a great deal of feedback that we provide to you in a public engagement summary report. We weave in all of the information from the stakeholder survey as well, excuse me, the focus groups as well. And I want to mention the student friendly version because that is one that we added this year. Uh it is the exact same survey in plain language. So when people take the survey um for example online and they click on self-identifiers I'm a parent and guardian or I'm a staff or I'm a a student when they click student they go to a survey that is the exact same survey. The language however is sort of how they speak more often. And the simplest example I give is instead of saying um fiscally you know fiscal infrastructure or fiscally responsible it's money. So the language is much more simple and we want to get as much student voice in this as possible. So we work with the high school and the middle school to perhaps allow time in advisory periods for students to take this survey. We never want to require anybody to take it particularly students. You probably have a policy around that. And yet by setting some time aside during free periods, we get a lot of student voice and it is extremely interesting to see what they say. We'll separate out their responses from everyone else as well. Um, and our reports, if you want to see some reports, you can see some searches we're currently doing. If you go to their landing page, you can find the public engagement summary report if you want to see the kind of information we provide. But we really think that's important to get those voices heard. There's a little space right there between listening sessions and district tours because the opportunities for people to be involved in the search process come early or come late. So early, we just talked about all of those opportunities. Later on in the process, you might want to involve your school communities in uh interviewing the finalists or collecting input from individuals in your staff or your parent groups um about what they think of the finalists. There's several ways they can provide provide feedback to the board on the uh finalists themselves. Typically, it's done in round two when you're down to two or three people. Um, if there are six people in that first round, you're asking a lot of members of the public to come and sit through eight, nine, 10 hours of interviews and opportunities to provide feedback. But there are a lot of different ways to do that. You also want to be careful to set expectations that are um fair. For instance, don't call them a hiring committee if you do have committees involved because you are the hiring committee. The superintendent is the only employee the school board hires. You oversee this person. So, we are very careful with semantics that perhaps input committees are um included or search committees. We just don't want to give people unrealistic expectations that they get to decide who will be the next leader here in Hopkins. So, all of those things are options as well. meet and greets, community Q&As's, um, district tours are always a wonderful idea. Some of these things, if you look at page 15, I think in our proposal, um, uh, there is an additional charge, but only if it's something that is really creative. You are going to have opportunities no matter what. But if you want us, for example, to create an online form that is open to everyone across the district to provide feedback on your finalists and you want us to digest and um compile that information, that's a little extra work. So that might be an extra thousand dollars or so, but generally speaking, everything is included. I just realized I didn't tell you to look for one more thing in your packet here. So if you look on the right side of this folder, if you go past the PowerPoint, um there's a very colorful page here as well. And this is one from a search we did last year. And one of the things we like about the survey opportunities, we can compare apples to apples what the board felt with members of your school communities as well. So for example, the specialized skills, the board survey on the left, you can see halfway down, those were the top seven that the board came up with. And on the right, that's the public input. Everybody who took the survey or participated in focus groups, those were their top seven. Now what's interesting about this for example is this was out of you have about 23 or 24 choices of hiring criteria. So if you look at this the highlight indicate alignment between the board and members of the school communities. So you can see there was quite a bit there and then the board had created the leadership profile up above based only on their specialized skills survey results. So the leadership profiles up above which came from the specialized skills or hiring criteria survey when we got information from the public you can see there are a few things that the public prioritized that the board had not and again this is only the top seven out of 24 choices. So what you do in that case when I talked earlier about the public whether it aligns or doesn't align with the board we want to take that information because we use it in several different ways. I don't think you'd want to modify your leadership profile. It's probably too far down the road if you choose to post this position fairly soon. And I have a feeling that you as elected representatives are in touch with your school constituents and so you probably have the same goals as your public will. But if there are things that show up here, we're going to use them to screen the applications and looking for things outside of your leadership profile and the public summary report. We will look for things specifically that your constituents have said are important to them. even if it's not in your top. We're going to use that information to also craft interview questions for the board to consider and develop in both round one and in round two. And we will use it to help you in your deliberations of who to bring in for the interviews, who to move forward into a second round, and who to ultimately hopefully select as the loan finalist. So, the information gleaned in an applesto apples comparison. And this is just one part of the overall survey report. Um has been really really helpful to have boards look outside of what they came up with to the larger community as well. I'm just going to keep talking because I have so much to say here. So excuse me for a moment. Um one of the things I think also that people don't understand about MSBA searches because they're different than other search firms is it's not prescribed from beginning to end. This is not a process that at the planning meeting we make decisions with you exactly what's going to happen from beginning to end every step of the way because things happen, information comes to light. Uh you learn more, we learn more, we hear things in the survey we didn't expect. So you have spots along the way to pause, pivot, and make the decisions that are best for Hopkins. So, we might have an idea of what the interviews are going to look like or how many people are you going to interview. Um, we may have a sense of how you want to involve the community in the interviews. We don't want you making that decision, however, until after you've seen the public engagement summary report because there's going to be a lot in there. So, you'll be able to make a more informed decision. So, the fact that it's not figured out all in advance is good because it allows you to customize this every single step of the way. But some people are uncomfortable with this because they want to know exactly how round two is going to go. And I'll say, "Well, I have an idea how it's going to go. There are certain statutes that will apply to your interview process and there's going to be some more information provided to the board before they make a decision specifically about round two." So, that's a little different than some, I think, um, because it does kind of unfold as we go. I do want to talk about advertising the position here next. Um, and this will be on all the sites locally, nationally, and regionally. Um, there's another sheet behind the colorful sheet called advertising and recruiting. Uh, this simply provides for you some insights into where we post this position. Uh, we think the AASA, the, uh, national superintendent association, administrators association, we pay to boost the posting to 31 different diversity jobs boards as well. Uh we get some wonderful candidates that are looking for jobs in Minnesota and they found us on these jobs boards in addition to perhaps finding us on MSBA or MASA or EDPOST or uh or in Rebellis. I want to mention Rebellis for just a moment because it is a proprietary application database that is available only to schoolboard associations that do superintendent search. So if someone for example is looking at jobs um through their superintendent search uh MS excuse me super schoolboard association search services they'll see these applications or opportunities in Minnesota regardless of that they're in Florida or Michigan or Wisconsin or Nebraska they're going to see Minnesota's opportunities because schoolboard associations are doing more and more and more searches nationally so it will be in revel as well the proprietary database I want to talk about power of the grapevine uh because word of mouth is extremely powerful, probably one of the most powerful as well. And this is where I rely on um those five service providers because their networks are quite deep and they are going to um help drum up interest in this opportunity. I am going to talk here at the end a little bit more about our recruiting philosophy because it's different. Um, but I will tell you again that I trust and believe in so deeply the people who are on our team that I know we're going to have a phenomenal pool if we are um, fortunate enough to be selected to work with you on this search. In terms of recruiting candidates, uh, NAS, the national affiliation of superintendent searchers, we will be the only firm you visit with that are members of that organization. Uh, the folks I talked about earlier are extraordinarily wellconed. We did add a national recruiter last year. Uh Josh Paulie, who I mentioned is on our team. Um he is in the private sector, but he does recruit nationally for MSBA. He goes to a lot of conferences with a QR code for MSBA openings. He visits with people and tells them to give me a call if they're interested in coming to Minnesota to work here as well. >> And I'm so old. He was a former student of mine at Champlain Park High School. >> Really? >> Yes. I just met with him this morning. So I will uh have to tell him I know this now. So >> just yeah >> that's wonderful to hear Dr. Mary P. >> We'll forget about the old part but it is [laughter] a very fun connection. >> That is great to hear. Um I do want to talk about our national presence a little bit because I think that we um we've gotten the short in the stick a little bit because people do speak about our lack of national experience. So I want to take a moment to clear that up. Yes, we are the Minnesota School Boards Association. We specialize in Minnesota searches. We only do searches in Minnesota. We also only do superintendent searches. That is it. We are not looking for associate superintendents. We're not looking for um director levels. We're not looking for um teacher staff at all. It is purely superintendents and purely Minnesota. So, our connections there, I think, are important. However, um I'll just give you a snapshot of last year's searches, if I may. So last year in MSBA's um searches, we had a total of 376 applications for our searches that we did last year. Of those 376 applications, they came from 34 different states across the country. So we had people applying for our jobs in one year from 34 different states. Also currently our database Revelis has uh 789 profiles and profiles are what um candidates who are seeking work in Minnesota need to fill out first before they can apply for a position. So work history, transcripts, you know, lensure, all of that needs to be uploaded for the profiles. Of those 789 profiles, um that includes administrators looking to come here from 27 different states and three different countries. So, I think our reach is as broad as anyone's and people are now beginning to realize that if they go to the MSBA website, they will see the opportunities here in Minnesota. They are not limited only to our searches. Um, we will post any positions that are being uh conducted by districts themselves. We do have a number of districts that take our workshop on hiring the right superintendent and then to save funds um they do conduct their own search. So, theirs go on there as well. But I think the misinformation about our national presence is something that we are trying to overcome and correct. And I think just the searches we've done in the last 5 years alone should prove that we do have a very large national footprint. Now national pre or Minnesota presence we talked about that. Now I want to talk about recruiting philosophy. Uh because we do not serve as a gatekeeper between the school board and and candidates. the um philosophy differs in that we don't invite people to apply and people know that they don't need to hear from us in order to apply. It is a wide openen search. Anyone can apply for this job and have a shot at this job because we don't have a stable of people that we are trying to place. Uh we don't work for the candidates at all. We work for the school boards only. So we aren't trying to place anyone in this position. However, we will make sure they know about it. Um, word of mouth, I keep going back to that as well. There are, at last check, 1,549 people who have Minnesota superintendent licenses. That's a lot of people. And no search firm anywhere could possibly know who is the best of the best of those, 1549 license holders as a superintendent. So, we think our philosophy to make sure people know it's wide open, that they can contact any of us, anyone on my team directly, contact me, anyone, anytime. We all have cell phones on and check our emails seven days a week during search season. uh we think that results in a much stronger pool and it also in a way counterintuitively does result in a more diverse pool because one of the things uh that was shared with me about three years ago has meant more to me than I can possibly say is um I've had a couple of different people say this. I want to be careful that I'm I'm not being critical of any other process being used to recruit candidates. However, I heard from um I don't want to give away I heard of candidates have told me that they felt like they had a shot at this job and they told me it was the first time they have not felt tokenized in a superintendent search. Very often there may be the sense that oh they're just calling me because they need a more diverse pool and they're telling me I have a shot at this job and maybe I do. [clears throat] Sometimes though, some people in our circles of administrators in Minnesota have felt used and so they've quit taking calls from recruiters because it does feel sometimes as though because they are different, maybe they are female, maybe they're a person of color, that they are perhaps being recruited for a reason other than the qualities they bring to this job. And so it's more equitable in our opinion for people to come find this job. If they align, they align. if they want the job, they should apply. We will tap people on the shoulders through our networks of people who might need to be encouraged to look at the opportunity. You've all seen the statistics of people who won't apply unless they meet 100% of the leadership profile, 60%, 40%, and it gender- wise it's very different. So, we want to make sure that we are reaching out to the emerging leaders here in Minnesota. We have a strong partnership with the aspiring superintendent academy at MASA. I speak at that every single time they have that. uh we speak at MASA conferences about superintendent search. So people do know that our recruiting philosophy works and so that's all I'm going to say about for right now. But I'm I'm really proud of the differences we have in how we recruit because we do recruit. It's just not an aggressive recruitment and it's not an invitation to apply. It is an opportunity we present to as many people as possible and we let it leave it up to them to decide if they want to throw their hat in the ring or not. Okay, I'm going to move along a little more quickly >> and I just want to do a quick time check. We have about five to seven minutes. >> Okay, thank you. So, we are going to vet the applications and we will recommend to you who we feel are the strongest. Um, everyone is going to see this. We will do bias training with your board. There is um unconscious bias in superintendent search like there is everywhere. Uh, you can call me in advance of the meeting where you're going to discuss private data in a public meeting. you can talk to me oneon-one because I will let the board know, hey, you've seen the applications. I will let you know about two days beforehand that these are the folks we're recommending. Please call me if you want to find out why or why not because I'm not going to discuss that in a public meeting. No identifilable information can be shared in that meeting, but I will talk to you oneonone as well. We include in-depth background checks, educational credentials, work history with all of the semi-finalists and finalists that is included. It's a nationwide criminal database uh check as well. Please talk to our references. There's also a page in here with some representative quotes, but because we do the survey every single year, we have a lot of quotes at our disposal, and you saw them all through the the process in the proposal as well. We partner with um MSBA, excuse me, MASA and BOSA, BOSA, on just about everything. I'm going to skip over the interview process because it's nothing truly special other than communicate, communicate, communicate. Clarify expectations so people know what to expect. Um, no matter who it is, we want to make sure they know what's going to happen. I'm going to jump past this. That's a Tiger Woods quote there if you're a fan of Tiger Woods. And this one is a Winston Churchill quote. We don't get better um more than once a year. We actually do it during the sur we added the student survey for example during search season this year. So as something comes up that improves the process we will do that all we do is schoolboard leadership that is our one and only focus. Our mission is to support and educate school boards and it's no difference in superintendent search work. Uh two hallmarks of our process. I think we communicate better than anyone. I think we are more transparent than anyone else. Um there are no hidden fees. You can take a look at our page 15 in the proposal for more detail on that. Uh the post-hiring support, the transition workshops are invaluable. That's where we meet with the new board team and we make sure that all of you are on the same page about expectations for their first year and all of you are on the same page about performance evaluation metrics and what you are looking for for them to accomplish in their first year. They'll be drinking out of a fire hose, but we will help you come up with goals or standards and elements that do reflect that. We often get asked, "How long do you stay engaged after the hire is made?" And that answer, because we're MSBA, is forever. You know where to find us. We will be there forever. We will answer any question from anyone on the board or the superintendent for as long as they are here. So, we stay very engaged. Now, because of the partnership importance, the superintendent is a member of your board team. Again, I mentioned MASA. I talked a little bit about their conferences. I talked a little bit about uh how we work with them, but their model contract is a joint effort between MSBA and MASA. Both associations believe in and support what's in the model superintendent contract. Our superintendent evaluation process also is something that we have partnered with MASA on as well. Um we speak at their conference and we speak at the aspiring soups conference as well. BOSA, the only thing I want to mention about that is that um we work with them to make sure that they're going to have a license if they're going to work in Minnesota. Uh we look through every application and if they are an out ofstate applicant, we put them in touch with Karen Sha, the executive director at BOSA, we send them a list of what they need to know about getting a Minnesota superintendent license. There is no reciprocity here. Out of state candidates often make that mistake and assume if they're a superintendent somewhere else, they can work here. They can if they get a provisional license. So we work really closely with BOSA on that. And we want to make sure that they are supported. So candidates have told us because we survey all of them as well what went well, what could have done better. People feel like we communicate accurately. We don't want to set candidates up to fail. We're very clear with them and expectations. And the last thing I'll mention because I'm sure I'm just about out of time is um the unparalleled depth of Minnesota knowledge. There are statutes that apply to superintendent search that not everyone will know about and they are very often obscure. For example, many people think veterans preference applies to superintendents. It does not. Um, if you are related to a candidate to the fourth degree, it it changes the voting structure. Has to be a unanimous vote of the full board. Uh, that's something people often don't know. The open meeting law is very different in our state than other law or other states. The government data practices act is very different from other states as well. I have peers across the country that do superintendent search for um their schoolboard associations and they cannot believe the degree that we have in terms of transparency that's required in Minnesota. But those laws are important. Um, I'm next door to Terry Morrow in my office and down the hall from Gary Lee and Tiffany Gustin. I rely on them a great deal. So, here's a list of searches. I'm not going to go through them other than recency is important. Some of the firms you're talking to have probably worked with some of these districts. We have done all of the most recent searches for all of these districts. And if they've done a repeat search, we have done the repeat search for them as well. We're very proud of the work we've done in the last five years in particular because that's when we implemented the continuous improvement model and I think at this point I'm not going to go through this slide because you know who you are. This simply says why Hopkins Public Schools not for us but for candidates. People are very interested in this opportunity because of these things. They've contacted [clears throat] us. Some are interested in this search more than other searches we are currently conducting because you are truly unique. Um, with that I will stop and open it up for questions from the board and I will leave that up and I am thankful I spoke really fast but I almost got through it all and not quite. >> Thank you so much. That was that was right on time. Um, very impressive. And I wanted to um uh just mention too that um I think that we had discussed as a board and also you and I mentioned that um Hopkins is con is is wanting to do the superintendent training, search training with MSBA. So, I just wanted to remind our community and also the board that MSBA will truly be with us during this process. I know Terry's number and use it frequently to check in with him. So, that is a resource because we are a member district that we will carry with us. Um, so just wanted that as a reminder. And um the process that we're following is that each board member will get an opportunity to ask a question um and then uh again to a ask another one. I was reminded by our wonderful um school board assistant that um I neglected to walk us through the process of approving our agenda for this evening. So I did call the meeting to order. However, we have not approved our agenda, although we are following it to the letter. So, well done us. Um, so at this point, I would like I would look for a motion to approve tonight's agenda. >> So moved. >> I have a motion. Is there a second? >> Second. >> I have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, please say I. >> I. I. >> The chair votes I. And the agenda for tonight's meeting is approved. And we will go right back into the um new business part B MSBA superintendent search firm proposal. And I would invite um clerk WG to ask her first question. Great. Um thank you. Thanks for your presentation and being with us. Um so actually the two most significant questions that I had coming in you answered which um the one was around national recruitment and I I I actually don't need followup with that. I thought I really appreciated how you directly addressed that. So I just want to name that um that that was one of my questions. The other that I was uh wondering about as part of the community constituents that we want to hear from our students um you also answered that. So I think just one thing I would want to note more so um and just for us and I want it to be said here uh if we do move forward with uh leadership profile just with the timing considerations. I think one of the things I would want us to be really intentional about is highlighting how if we did work with you on this, um, we have all of these opportunities along the way to ensure profound deep listening and collaboration and input from our community and just that our communication along the way that we're being so clear about that because I think that's a concern from some of our community members as if they thought the board was just like, well, we just decided we don't, you know, we don't really care what you think. Thanks for, you know, sharing. And not that I think that's what we'd be doing, but I think us being incredibly intentional in our communication and evidencing uh like in then the interview questions. Hey, here's where the community input has now shaped and nuanced our leadership profile. Hey, here's how we are involving community voices in these moments along the way. So, I just more so wanted to note that and um I I don't have any further questions. >> Thank you, Dr. Mary Perry Reed. Thank you, chair. Um Barb, I had a question about um how you interface with candidates either once you're discerning that they may they um their candidacy may be declining through the process >> or in the event that they are not selected to advance by the board. I know that um you interact with a lot of licensed superintendent throughout the state and a lot of um candidates and um I'm wondering specifically how you communicate with candidates who are eventually not selected, right? knowing that you'll have to maybe engage with them another time in the future should they apply for another district that you are helping to um support. That's a great question. Thank you for asking it. So, um we take great care to treat all candidates respectfully, honestly, and transparently. I believe our reputation with candidates that have made it to a certain point in the search process and were not successful in being selected that they if they'd like feedback from us, we will provide it. >> And so I hate to use the word coaching because that sounds that's not quite right. Feedback however is really important. So for instance, people who are interested in this opportunity very often may call me and say, "Hey, I'm thinking about Hopkins and do you have time to set up a Zoom call?" So we'll set up a time to visit. And I want those folks who have not been through a process before to understand our process is different, particularly in that all of you will see those applications so that they're not needing to curry favor with the search firm to be considered. So that might mean that their references are not all administrators. maybe they can include a reference from a schoolboard member or um a parent. So it it it's a different lens that I give feedback in advance if they ask about. Then if they are not selected for an interview very often people call and say what can I do to strengthen my application and we will provide that feedback to them as well. Um if it's not myself it's one of the folks that help me conduct searches as well. Um I also want to treat them carefully in terms of data privacy. So, it's a big risk in Minnesota to apply for a position if you are a sitting superintendent in particular. So, there's some things to think about. One, when all of you are looking at the applications, we talk about data privacy to no end and we will talk about the risks of looking at this information in the public, how you will speak about these candidates in a public meeting. So, we want to make sure those names remain private. The only time a name goes public is if they are selected to be interviewed by the school board for a position. Now, in statute, it defines that person as a finalist. If they're going to be interviewed by you, they're considered a finalist in statute. However, round one is semi- finalist. So, the semi- finalist names go public if the board is going to conduct those interviews. Now, depending upon your policies, if you've adopted policy, I think it's policy 208 that says your committee meetings are not subject to the open meeting law. If the board is interested, you could conduct round one in committee and those names would not go public. For example, even though the full board would help select the semi- finalists, they still remain candidate ABC. Perhaps a subcommittee could interview them and those names won't go public. They'll come back for round two recommendation from the subcommittee. That's really rare that a district will conduct it that way, but that's your choice. It is an option that you have at your um if it's okay with your attorney and it's in policy 208, you could conduct these interviews round one offsite in private. Um and the last thing I'll say is for the folks who have interviewed with us and been unsuccessful, we call them immediately to let them know of the decision of the board, um they are disappointed always. And so we say take a few days, call me if you'd like feedback on the interview because sometimes there is something they're doing in the interview that is causing the board not to feel as comfortable with them as perhaps someone else. Um, and we'll provide that kind of coaching to them as well, but only upon request. We don't decide that we need to tell every candidate how they should do this because it's their career. They're going to decide what to do, but we will provide feedback upon request at every single stage of this process. And we survey them at the end of the year. all candidates who either applied or were interviewed or hired, they can tell us anonymously what went well and what didn't go so well and we get very high marks for our um transparency with the candidates and we get some good suggestions of what we could do better. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Um my first question is um have you ever run into a situation where you couldn't find the right fit and how would you manage it? >> Great question. um that happens occasionally and sometimes it's a matter of timing because we do the vast majority of searches in Minnesota. So, we've probably done, you know, 250 in the last 10 years. There are going to be times in that um occasion where a search doesn't start until March or April. Um boards always have the option of hiring an interim instead before they start a search, but last year we started a search in April, March, April. We did it in six weeks instead of three months or three and a half months. We did it in six weeks. It was very successful. And yet, if they had not found that person who was right for their district, we would have said, "Okay, tell you what. Let's hit pause. We'll find an interim at no charge. We have a whole list of people that want to serve as interims in public schools across Minnesota, former superintendent. So, we'll help you find that interim, and we won't bill you till you actually have a sitting superintendent. So, the next year, we'd start the search over again, do everything again, no charge. you will not be charged until you have chosen this last finalist. And if it's not this year and it's the next year, you wouldn't get charged a penny until then. Um, but we do a lot of work with districts that are seeking interims, even if we're not doing a superintendent search for them. And we don't charge for any of our interim search work either. Um, and sometimes it's not a question of fit, it's a question of running out of time or the pool is not as strong as you want. And that's one of those instances where you could pause the search and decide at that point you're going to suspend it. Look for an interim instead. I would prefer that you not go through round one to make the decision to pause the search because those people have gone public or even round two and yet this is your search. So, we have had boards that after round two say, "Still don't think we found the right person." And I need to call those candidates and let them know the board has decided to reopen the position or get an interim and come back the next year with another search. I really would prefer that if the pool's not who you are hoping to hire that you don't let those names go public. It's a consideration, I think, as a professional courtesy that you don't interview people you cannot see sitting in that chair. But sometimes it happens for whatever reason. [clears throat] Thank you. Um, so if I heard you correctly, um, you if if that situation does happen at some point in the process, um, and the board chooses to call a pause, you help us find an interim, um, and then when we want to restart the process, maybe next year, you will be there to help us run the process again. And all of this is included in the original. >> Correct. Like >> correct. >> Wow. Okay. Thank you. >> Appreciate that. Um, Vice Chair Rober, >> thank you so much. Thank you, uh, Cheer Andre. Thank you so much for the, um, the presentation and just laying out things. I know that um, I've been through a few of the MBS, MSBA trainings, and the conference and you all are um, very intentional in how you engage with school board. So, thank you for that. Um, just listening to one of your um, statements, however, just about like the tokenism in candidates and some candidates may be feeling like they're being chosen just because of their um, you know, like of their race or maybe because of their gender. And although that is a consideration, I'm wondering how does your firm approach equity in its decision-m when supporting districts with explicit equity commitments? >> Great question. Thank you. So, um, first and foremost, the inclusiveness of this district is a very high priority and people know this about your district. >> So, what very often happens when the leadership profile is published and the results of the public engagement summary report, we ask candidates to take a good hard look at that to see if from a values perspective, they align with the values of this district. We don't want people to try to fit into a box that does not suit them. So we will work with them to ensure they understand the importance of those things before applying for this position. If they are going to um if they have and this is what we sometimes ascertain through the pre-ins that we do with the candidates. If they have a check the box mentality on what diversity, equity, and inclusion is not a fit. It needs to be intentional and thoughtful and a part of who they are as a person and as a human being. So they'll do the research on this district. They'll go to MDE and look at all the reports. They will go to your website. They will read the vision strategic plan. They will do all of that. And we want them to understand what this board is looking for because you are a different board than other other districts are. Every board is unique. So we do a lot of searches and yet searches are never the same because the boards are different and the district is different and their equity commitment is different. So, we won't ever tell you what you should do unless it's within the bounds of the law. It's like looking for the right person is a a you decision, not an MSBA decision because we don't live here, work here, breathe here, raise our kids here. So, you're elected to do that. And so, we trust you to make these decisions and we will certainly make recommendations and we will defer to the board every single time in terms of knowing what's best for the kids that go to school in Hopkins. So it's it's central and I know that already from your school board that it is central to finding this person. It cannot be performative at all. Has to be who they are. Right. >> Yes. Thank you so much for that. Um I really appreciate um you emphasizing that it has to be a part of who you are and just not something that you're looking to do um in a performative matter because that just um I think that really matters to our community. Um, and also just with that, I know that there are a lot of superintendent searches going on right now for multiple districts. And so, um, I think you wait for >> Oh, yes. Sorry. Yes. I will. >> Mhm. >> Thank you. >> Okay. [laughter] >> Director Xiao. >> Hi. Uh, thank you, Barb. Uh, I appreciate the presentation and being here. Um, one one question. uh we are most of us have not done a superintendent search before um so I'm curious to uh talk to you and understand uh you know advice on how we should evaluate candidates right what what separates a good candidate from an okay candidate and what you know how can we figure out you know who can you know kind of personally or with their leadership uh affect change >> great question so you'll have access to the applications once the deadline has passed we don't want you sort of going in and out looking at the applications as they come in and out because sometimes people withdraw you know they they submit and then they're like I don't know so they might pull out so once it's passed we'll provide you with those applications it will be an overwhelming amount of information to look at so what I do is I say a couple of things first go through the list and everyone deserves a shot correct so when you look at the information in the uh database don't try to look at everything because you could spend an hour to two hours reading everything. I would say read their cover letter, look at their resume, read their answers to the questions that are specific to Hopkins in the application, and read their letters of recommendation. Those are the sort of the four big things. It'll give you a sense of who they are. It's a very simple thing to look at, just those four. Then I would say create piles. Yes, no, and maybe. There are going to be some people in your pool that you instantly know, I want to interview this person. Yep. Yep. And maybe it's because you already know them. Education is kind of a small world, but that's a yes. And there will be people that you're going to go no. You you read their experience, their background, you read their cover letter, it you won't want to interview them. You got a whole bunch of people in the maybe category. I would take a deeper dive into those folks and look maybe at um more in-depth at their work history. Um maybe take a closer look at their transcripts possibly dep on how recent some of those things are. But I always say you have to upload all of your transcripts. But what people did when they were 22, 20, 21 years old, don't consider that necessarily as a a determining factor. But the may are the ones where you want to kind of put them in piles. Do not do a social media sweep on the people that are in your pool because that's our job. We're going to be vetting people. Um, we will do the social media sweep. We will get all not two sides of the story, we'll get all five sides of the story because you know how crazy it is in social media right now. We want people to have an opportunity that is fair to them. And I can't tell you how many times you Google someone, you see a story and it's like, "Oh, I don't want to speak with them." And yet we see value in that person and we talk to them and there is a perfectly good explanation for what is in the paper or what the rumors are. A good leader is going to have people who do not like them very much. They will have perhaps made tough decisions. Those folks are not going to be supporters of them. When the names go public, you're going to be lobbyed for and against people. And we want you to give people grace and say, "Thank you for your input. We don't want you as board members debating your constituents about who should and shouldn't be in the pool when or who's going to be interviewed." But we talked to you about how to do that. So, that's what I'd look for. Um, the two documents we always say go back to is the leadership profile and that summary report of the public input. Those are your two big drivers. Meanwhile, we're doing a lot deeper dive on every single person in your pool. Some board members choose to take a very cursory look very quick and then wait to see who we're recommending. And we're probably going to talk to 8 to 12 people that we think are strongest. We're going to try and get it down to six. But once you know who we're recommending, then some board members say, "Now, I'm going to go look at those six people much deeper because MSBA is bringing those forward to us next week." So, that was a lot, but that was just my initial thought about how to as lay people because it's a lot. Have any of you been a superintendent before? Dr. Mary Pere doesn't count you, but any board members. [laughter] Okay. I'm aware of three people out of 200 board members statewide that were superintendent at one time. >> So, they understand the job and the hiring is maybe easier, maybe not for them. But otherwise, it's awkward for us as regular folks to be hiring someone who has gone to school for years and years and years. But it's a partnership. You're the governance, they're the management, and working together. This district can just It's exciting. But I want to acknowledge it's awkward to review applications when you don't do this for a living. >> Thank you. >> Yeah, >> I second everything my colleagues have said tonight. Thank you so much for coming and um giving an excellent presentation. Um I have a question about developing the leadership profile. Um you have shared that our current strategic plan will help inform the leadership profile we develop for the superintendent and um I think there may be or there will be an expectation that the next superintendent um be asked to lead or support a review of the current strategic plan. Um, and so can you talk about how MSBA balances those two realities when developing the leadership profile? >> It's complicated, but yes, I will tell you what I think. So, I think that the board's role is to set the vision for the district. You are the governing body. The superintendent works for you. They will provide leadership around a refresh of a strategic plan. And yet, they are not setting the vision for the district. That's the job of the school board. Correct. So it gets messy with strategic planning. If you look at the governance model when a superintendent wants to lead the visioning, they can facilitate visioning. Absolutely. Because all of you as board members are the ones that will be setting that vision and holding the superintendent accountable to reach that vision. So I think understanding the relationship between a superintendent and a a school board is going to be critical. And so I think you'd want a candidate who understands what a high functioning school board looks like and knows how to work with the board in a way that doesn't use superior authority and yet provides you the support and the information and the guidance to take the district where it really needs to go. And so sometimes that's a prioritization. I talk a lot about um the high priorities in the district and then you have higher yet and you have highest priorities. The highest priorities are what's going to be in your strategic plan. That's also what you should base your leadership profile on because that's what's going to move the needle. If you have a two-page leadership profile, it's going to be very difficult for a candidate to really figure out if they fit here or not. So, you want to have a profile that is succinct and clear and based on what is most most important to the school board in Hopkins public schools. So, I think it's about relationships. They they should not come in and just say, "This isn't a great strategic plan. I want something different." >> That's not their job, >> right? It's your job, >> right? I think my question is if the you know the superintendent is hired say by July 1st and then this board sitting here wants to revise or review the strategic plan. Um how do we evaluate candidates now when we may be you know looking to the future or changing not changing the direction but reworking the strategic plan. >> I think you could ask about it in the interviews and maybe it's a question you ask about in the application because the questions in the application are meant to help you decide who you want to bring in for an interview. If you want to ask about what have they done in strategic planning or implementation, when have they worked with school boards and at what stage of a strategic planning process, a good leader is going to be able to come in and and step in at whatever point you're at. Um, I would say it's a pretty heavy lift their first year when they're new to the district perhaps. Um, I think they're going to have the right skill set for it. And you can ask very concrete questions, very behavior-based questions in your interviews that will help you figure out, do they really know how to guide us through this? Do they know how to lead without telling us what to do? Those kinds of things. So, it is it's complex like I started with. Um, sorry if I missed your question off right away. But how long is the plan? Is it through 2031? Truly the plan right now? >> Yes. So it's out there five more years >> and and >> yes with an expectation I think that the new superintendent would work with the community to >> and that is um having gone through this process um when Dr. Premier Perryi Reid was new. This was her process, right? And in um intermediate district 287, the new superintendent came on and we have a new strategic plan. It is fairly customary that that is something that new superintendent undertake when they when they come on. Okay. >> And I think you address the question very well. >> Thank you. >> You said no questions. You haven't changed your mind. Thank you. No, I'm good. Thank you. >> Great. Um Dr. Mary Pier Reed, did you have a second question? >> Um my last question is so um there are some people reaching out to me just to sit down for coffee. Do you have any advice or guidance on what is helpful for the current superintendent to share with potential candidates or maybe you know what's not helpful? I mean, obviously I'm going to try to use my most professional discretion, but just any advice that you typically offer when this question is asked. >> Yeah, and thank you for asking that. So, one of the things we talk about at the planning meeting is the role of the current superintendent and what would you like that role to be? Typically, there is no role other than to serve as an ambassador for the district to answer questions from candidates about what is it like to work in Hopkins? Can you tell me a little bit more about the board? Things such as that. But typically the superintendent doesn't come to the superintendent search planning meeting. Uh they don't come to the um any of the meetings really the special meetings that are a part of the search process. One thing I would caution um for sitting superintendent is be careful that the expectation isn't to have um to meet in person with people. there is sort of this um like I don't meet people for coffee ever candidates that are interested. I don't want to be wooed, right? I want to provide the information they need to decide if this is the job for them. If I were to have coffee with some people and not with others, people talk and people will say, "Well, she met with her for coffee, but she didn't have time to meet with him." And they start to feel like there's a hierarchy in terms of their chances to get this job. So I often caution superintendents to do the same thing is to take phone calls to visit with people. You could have a Zoom meeting, answer questions. Just be careful not to get pulled into helping people one more than another because that word will get out. It's like, oh well, I had lunch with Dr. Mary Perry Reed. You didn't have lunch. H it it just starts to feel uneven. So I always just say be really careful that everyone is treated the same. But boy, an ambassador for the district talking about the wonderful things happening here if you're willing to take those calls can be invaluable. >> Thank you. >> Yeah, >> thank you. Um I wanted to just quickly check with Vice Chair Roer. Were you going to ask the question about um how many other districts MSBA is working with and capacity? Is that where you were headed? >> No, I was um >> Okay, then I will ask that question. cuz that's my question. I just didn't want to like >> Oh, yeah. >> steal your question. >> Um, so I'm I'm well aware just because I I talk with other um board members in other districts that you are involved in um other superintendent searches in other districts currently. And I think that is um something that we're wondering about how I know that you mentioned that there are six people [clears throat] in your firm that will be working exclusively to Hopkins. wondering if I'm hearing that correctly in meaning that they're all six going to be working only with us um or what is the capacity of the firm and would there be some sort of um conflict running searches because I know we running one. I think you're wrapping up Adina. They just announced that their interim is staying. >> So >> that isn't but I I know you're you're working with some other districts. So I'm just wondering about that >> and thanks for the chance to clarify. Uh so the folks that work with me on the superintendent search team work exclusively in superintendent search. >> Okay. >> Because of the number of searches we do and the number of people that we have involved, we would be working on searches perhaps simultaneously. Some are way up north, some are in the southeast, some are in the metro. Um so thank you for asking that question. So yes, exclusively on superintendent search. That's all that that's all that we do. I have absolutely no concerns about capacity because of the number of people we have helping us, the service providers that are there as well as the resources within MSBA. If you look at the resumes in the proposal, you'll see an awful lot of people at MSBA touch superintendent search but are not full-time in the search process. So, our marketing communications team, our um technology team, there are people at MSBA, I'm sure you know, and their resumes are in here that do help us with a lot of different parts of this process. So, I would say we're a welloiled machine. Uh we also work extremely hard and during search season, we put in as many hours are nec as are necessary to do a good job for the members that trust us with the search process. So, I have no concerns about capacity. I also think doing other searches at the same time can be a real asset because you're for some candidates kind of a one-stop shop and they're able to ask very um pragmatic questions about the different searches that we are conducting and choose for themselves which one they might want to apply for. Uh some people might choose to apply for all of them if asked. I would discourage that because you want someone who wants this job, not any job. So, we know a lot of people and talk to an awful lot of people during search season. And because we're not going to talk people into applying for this one or that one, I don't see any conflict of interest at all because it's 100% in the hands of the candidate to decide where they want to throw their hat. Not up to us. So, I don't see that as a problem at all running concurrent searches. >> All right. Thank you. >> Yeah. Thanks for asking, >> Vice Chair Roer. >> Yes. Hi. Thank you. Um, so my question is is now that you've kind of answered a little bit of well that you answered Chair and Dre's question, it kind of simultaneously goes into mine. I was just wondering that you know we there is a high number um of superintendent searches happening. So it apparent that this job is potentially high burnout um maybe rewarding, right? But just want to be honest about like the burnout that comes with this position. And so [clears throat] was wondering when you are doing superintendent searches, what are some of the things that you're hearing from the candidates about that burnout aspect of the job? Um, and then how are you promoting districts um, as kind of I won't say like a soother, but like how are you promoting districts to those candidates to where they feel um, uh, confident about, you know, applying for the superintendent regardless of, you know, the the burnout aspect of the role? And it's a loaded question, but just >> it's really interesting because after the pandemic, some people there was sort of a mass resignation. People got their district through the pandemic and then they just they were so burnt out from that that there were a whole bunch of openings and not that many applicants. Now, despite how difficult the last year or two have been in public education, especially here in Minnesota, the numbers are back up again to be like prepandemic levels. Good people are seeking opportunities to make a difference. >> I don't know that burnout is as prevalent as we might feel because of the passion that these people have to lead school districts. It is challenging and self-care is very important and I know MASA as an organization provides professional development opportunities for all administrators in the state and some of those things do focus on workload um work life integration not work life balance that's impossible but I think that there there's an awareness of it now so that people are setting up some boundaries around their time or when they will work and it it is not something I've seen the candidates I'm talking to aren't feeling burnt out even if they're sitting soups. They are feeling frustrated and they are feeling um challenged in ways they have not been challenged before, especially in terms of um federal funding and student safety and mental health of staff and students. That is new and yet I think they're embracing it and it is extraordinarily rewarding. But I think the fact that the numbers are going back up in the applicant pools, they're not also people that um tire kickers is not the right word, but I think before the pandemic, we had lots of people applying that just wanted to see if they'd get an interview and they had a license, so I'll give it a shot. Now, what we've seen since the pandemic and especially now with the things the way they are, the people who want to be a superintendent or want to stay a superintendent really want to do the work. They're not just on a whim saying, "I wonder if I can get an interview in Hopkins." They really want this work. So, again, it goes to personal values. Um, I don't know. I've never been a superintendent myself, so I I don't know how to avoid the burnout. I know that I'm working 70 hours a week for six months out of the year, and I don't burn out because I just love what I do so much. Um, I think it just comes down to each individual person and districts can support them by recognizing that no one's perfect. And I think your expectations of your new superintendent need to be realistic. You can't expect them to read your mind. You need to talk about expectations that first year so that all of you are on the same page because they don't work for, you know, six or seven individual board members. They work for one body. The school board is a body. That's who they work for. And so hoping that they'll please every one of you individually is going to set them up to fail. So that's why we talk about as a body, as a board, what do you expect from your superintendent? And then we try to adhere to that and remind you about that importance because if they're trying to please all of you, they are going to probably leave. I don't think they'd burn out on the pos the profession. I think they'd burn out on a board that asks them to, you know, if you micromanage them and ask them to do everything each of you individually wants, I think they'd burn out on you, but not on being a superintendent. >> Does that align with your lived experience, Dr. Mary Perry? [laughter] Not >> to put you on the I'm just joking. >> Oh, okay. I have a wonderful board, but what you say is true, >> right? that a a great leader will want to live up to and meet the expectations of their school board and when the board is not operating as a single unit that becomes very challenging or when the expectations are unrealistic and then you know then we're on a decline. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Um director Xiao. >> Yeah. uh should hopefully a quick one. Um but uh you know for a district of our size and complexity I guess if you want to call it that. Um do you generally see previous superintendents you know being the most successful? Is that not necessary? Um what are what are some of your thoughts there? >> Also another great question. Um there are some incredible administrators who are not currently superintendent. they could be very successful in a district this size because they have um it's not as though they have to be everything to everybody. You know, we've done searches for districts that have two or 300 students and we've done searches for districts that have more than 28,000 students. And so the process and um everything that's goes into being a superintendent is scalable based upon the size of the district. So you have people in the district, for example, who would be an expert in school finance. It's not all going to be on the shoulders of superintendent. You have HR expertise. They don't have to know everything about HR. So, I think that um I think they would find this a really nicesized district where they don't have to do everything and wear every single hat and they have an incredible internal team who have specialty ex areas of expertise. they can develop those leaders, strengthen from the inside as well and lead and be the internal face and external face of this district when in the community. Um, so yes. Did that answer your question? You said it might be short, so I tried to keep it short. >> Yeah. No, I think it's possible. So that's that's helpful. >> They're really going to look for three things before they apply for this. They're going to look for your location, your salary, and your reputation. The biggest one is reputation. That's what's going to draw people to any superintendent job. Some locations in this state are harder to fill than others and there are two or three people apply. Other districts get 20, 25, 30 people applying. And it's those three factors, but I'll tell you the reputation is the one that makes the biggest difference. >> Thank you. And for our last question of the evening, uh, Director Heyman, >> my last question is similar to, um, Chair Andre's and Vice Chair Roer's question, um, but a little bit different. Um, how do you approach situations or how does MSBA in particular approach situations where a highly qualified candidate that lives in this area um could be a strong fit for more than one district you're conducting searches for? I know you talked a little bit about it's up to the candidate to throw their hat in the ring. What if a candidate would be is like, "Well, I like this one and I like this one." And how does that work? It usually comes down to timing. If they really truly are interested in both districts equally, it's just going to come down to timing and who has the second round of interviews first. Because if they get an offer from that district, they're going to take it. They're not going to string them along waiting for the interview in the next district two weeks later. school boards expect an answer within a day of at least entering contract negotiations. So unfortunately sometimes the tipping point is who interviews first, right? Um and I've had calls because we are doing another search simultaneous and people were calling with interest in that and they would say and I hear Hopkins Hopkins is going to be opening up. >> That that was my >> Uhhuh. Yeah. I I can tell you that several of the people that spoke to me about both opportunities said, "I'm gonna wait for Hopkins." >> That's great to hear. >> I've heard that as well. Yeah. >> Thank you. Um I believe this concludes our um presentation and question and answer section. Um I would look for um before we move on to our next part which is um the deciding on which search firm we wanted to go through. I would ask um the board I know that um uh Dr. Taylor waited to see if we would have questions during this time. So, I'm wondering if the board feels comfortable having both um search firms here at the table with us so they are available when we ask questions or would you prefer to call them in if we have questions? So, give me a feel on the temperature. >> I guess I would prefer to call them in if we have questions. >> Well, how how do they feel about it? >> How do you feel about it? that there's only one of them here to ask. >> Oh, yeah. >> Um >> Oh, did she leave >> or she's >> No, but I think I think Natalyia is going to get her. >> I agree with Brooke or sorry, Vice Chair Roer. You're >> okay. Yeah. >> Um go ahead, Chair Andre. to say as well. Um I think if if it is possible for us to to discern if we do have questions and then that way you know they wouldn't have to stay if depending on how long we take it. But >> that's great. So we could um yeah we could just do uh once around the table and just let me know. Do you have questions follow-up questions um for either HYA or MSBA before we move into our deliberation and decision process? Not at this time. >> I do not. >> Um I am okay. I took notes. [laughter] >> I'm going to leave the table. Okay. >> For the moment so the board can continue discussing, but I wanted to thank you for the opportunity. We'd be honored to help you. However, you make the decision that's best for this district and we'll support you no matter what you choose. So, thank you. >> Thanks for the chance to visit with you. I'll wait back here just for a moment and you can tell me what you need or don't need from me after that. Okay. >> Thank you everybody. >> Appreciate it. >> I cannot get out of this mode. >> Here we go. >> Um I do not think I have followup questions. Actually, >> I might have one for Hya, but >> I don't Can I just discon if she's here? No worries. >> Great. >> Um, thanks for having me adapter, too. >> Appreciate it. >> So, are we >> Do you want to go ahead and ask your question for HYA and then I can review my notes quickly? >> Uh, Dr. Taylor, >> one of our board members does have a follow-up question for you if you don't mind coming to the table. >> Not at all. And I did get an answer to the question you had asked me earlier about the interimm. >> Oh, great. >> So, uh, but I will address that after your question. >> I have one question and maybe a half a question after the one question. >> One [laughter] and a half. Okay. >> If there's such a thing. Um, >> dangerous one. My first question is with respect to all the unique um statutes and requirements that Minnesota has um with respect to open meeting laws and superintendent requirements because you are a national search firm. How do you go about ensuring you have the expertise in those um those requirements such that you can help guide us through the requirements because I don't know that we all know what those are. >> Sure. Very good question. I appreciate it. Well, as I mentioned, um I recently completed my superintendent certification and one of the requirements is becoming familiar with the Minnesota laws uh and statutes. As a sup as a former superintendent, uh I had the responsibility to familiarize myself with policy and statutes in in various locations. So, I'm familiar with that process. But prior to coming this evening, I did take a few moments to review some of the information that I had been working through, you know, as a candidate for the certification lensure. And um I've observed that most of the requirements that Minnesota has are similar to those of other states. One of the key differences is that you are required to conduct your final interview in public whereas you can work with the uh candidates in executive session or a non-public session when you are doing initial interviews. Uh so so that is one thing but I am well acquainted with the requirements uh the legal requirements for the interview process and laws in general uh in Minnesota. As far as the the rest of the firm, of course, we have many other individuals who uh can assist us in with any issues or questions that might arise. So, uh I don't anticipate that would be a problem. And then my half question is could you expand slightly upon your recruiting method if you are um proactive in recruiting or if you are more um uh objective in allowing anyone to apply. >> Well, I do think it's a combination of both. anyone can apply and simply because a person wasn't recruited doesn't mean that they would not be considered as an applicant. Uh we would be looking for to ensure that they met our your qualifications, your leadership profile and were high quality, meaning that they had the necessary education and experience that you had outlined as requirements for the position. Uh and um so the recruitment that we would conduct would actually be dual. One portion would be passive and reviewing applications as they arose. We actually have all of the superintendants open positions posted on our website at hya. So we do have many many thousands of people who review them. However, if we are familiar with a unique characteristics through your profile and uh find that there might be a person either in the area or in the Midwest who would be a perfect match uh through our associate networks, we might reach out to them and see if they are interested. So, that's the recruiting portion. Interestingly enough, uh shortly before coming to the meeting, um I was in conversation with a few associates and we had a few people in mind who we might reach out to in Minnesota and the surrounding area if again we were selected. So, we're continuously looking for a combination of open application process and the passive side and active recruiting because of course it's very important that you get the very best person for your superintendent. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Um, and you said that you'd gotten an answer to the interim situation. >> Yeah. So if I don't anticipate this will be the case. But in the event that uh the board chooses to hire an interim could not locate a suitable candidate, we would not have an additional fee for supporting your movement toward the interim. What we have is a very large network of associates and people who serve in interim roles. We would work to locate some individuals who you could then interview. It's not as detailed a process as what you would do if it's just a temporary person. Normally, it might be a retired superintendent or, you know, something along those lines. So, yeah. >> Great. And then if we chose to to >> then conduct another search, >> would that be something that you would also be >> coming in and completing the search for us? >> Yes, we would be able to do that for you as well. There might be a few additional costs, but it would depend on exactly what form that search would take, but uh we'd be committed to you for the long haul. Like I said before, [laughter] >> great. Thank you. >> Of course. >> Appreciate it. >> Sure. >> Can I ask a question? >> Yes, Vice Chair Rober. >> Um I did forget to ask this. So I'm wondering so with your national um experience and this may be something that the school board decides um as the um directors out mentioned that I'm new to this as well and so just um when you are recruiting candidates do perks matter for um how can I say this like for national candidates right like do they often require more perks to come and manage a um you know like a a district in Minnesota like do they do you see that there's more you know like ask around the benefits of them coming to a Minnesota district versus a um a homegrown superintendent? [clears throat] >> Yeah, I think much depends upon um uh the circumstances of the individual. But one thing I would mention is that it's important early on in the process and and at the point in time when you finalize your profile that you come up with a salary range would be my recommendation so that you can advertise that. That way it won't be a surprise for a person. If they are seeking something that's quite a bit more than you're able to or willing to offer, then they won't pursue your opening. And that's better for both parties, I think. Um, you also have available to you, um, the use through the both the state department of education and something that we could assist you with if you just required it, a uh, review of competing salaries, if you will, the salaries of superintendent from your area. You might select all of metro, uh, Twin Cities, all of Minneapolis and St. all suburban areas to compare your u future superintendent salary against the salary is also dependent upon the experience of the individual. So you wouldn't want to say it's simply this amount but it might be a range would be dependent upon experience. Um regarding uh negotiating other kinds of um additional contractual benefits that would be again you there are probably some areas that are typical simil similar to the contract that you currently have with your superintendent. Um, and I I think that would be a discussion that the board would need to have upfront before perhaps we got too far down into the recruitment phase. So, for example, if you were not willing to exceed a certain dollar amount or you were only willing to look at this much paid leave, for example, you know, those kinds of things, that's what people typically look for. >> Thank you. >> Sure. Of course. >> Thank you. And I did um myself just have one question that I'd like to address to both. So uh Miss Dorne, if you wouldn't mind coming back to the board table for this. Um >> do you want me to leave the table or have >> No, I I I want to hear from both of you. >> Okay. >> You can take turns. Um decide who goes first. Um, but one of the things that I I think you both addressed in your proposals and what stood out to me about both of you from the other um, search firms that we heard from was um your your commitment to and and calling out of equity. Um, I also recognize that that is um lowhanging fruit when you're looking at a Hopkins website or have heard anything about our district. Um, so I would imagine that any any person submitting a proposal to Hopkins would make that front and center. So what I'm asking is what about your firm specifically shows us your commitment to equity? [clears throat] >> Did you watch it? It doesn't matter. You want to go first or second? I'll go second. Go ahead. >> Okay. >> Thank you for asking that. Um MSBA strategic plan was refreshed uh a year and a half, two years ago and one of the challenges we faced as an association was every single district in the state of Minnesota voluntarily pays dues to be a part of MSBA. So 331 districts are members of our of our association and every single district has a different school board with different thought processes on diversity, equity, and inclusion. So, we committed to a diversity, equity, and inclusion strategic plan and faced a lot of push back from about 75% of our members and remained committed to it and discussed language and options. And so, we now talk about belonging because we don't want to lose our members simply due to the fact that they feel differently about that topic. We also looked internally and are trying to revamp our own hiring processes because we recognize we are a largely white organization as well and trying to get to the bottom of that. We only have 25 employees. So, it's not as though we have resources to um attract and retain people other than who currently works at MSBA. So, I would say that our organization is on a journey. Having said that, prior to working at MSBA, I was the executive director of the YW.CA CA in Mano and I led that organization for six years and in a community that is 98% white as the director of the YW.CA. We launched racial justice programming, hired a director of of racial justice. Our mission is to eliminate race was I'm sorry I don't work there anymore. Our mission was to um eliminate racism and empower women. And so that is what I personally focused on and had my own racial equity journey through those six years that truly transformed how I look at the world. So I think as an organization we're doing a better job of it. And I think our recruiting process in the fact that we don't seek people out um to diversify the pool but rather make sure that people are aware of it. And I have to give credit to Bernardia Johnson for this and speaking with Bernardia about why she joined MSBA as a recruiter and a veter um last year and Dr. Magcguire said the same thing this year in fact because they they have had requests from other search firms to consider partnering with them and we pay Squat for their work. We do not pay very much because we are a nonprofit association. what they both shared with me and Bernardian specifically said, "I like the way you do searches because everyone has a shot at this job and there isn't a a corral of people that you pursue for each job in trying to get them involved in the process." She said, "You look specifically at the opportunities in the district. You look at the leadership profile and you give us the room to talk to people that we feel should consider the opportunity. but you're not asking me to heavily recruit them. She felt that was a more equitable method of recruiting and it did entice her. Um, so I think we're on our own journey and I think we do a good job, but I'm trying to work as closely as I can with people that have been in the shoes um to help guide me in the conversation around recruiting and specifically diversity, equity, inclusion initiatives. It's a political football and we have to be very careful in all of our work and I've worked with plenty of very split boards, a lot of three three boards right now and helping them find candidates that they can all agree on and whether or not equity gets in the leadership profile is often a very robust conversation with that board. But it's their call. It's not mine because it's their search, not mine. >> That was a long answer. I'm sorry I didn't quite get to the heart of it. But when you're on in the middle of a journey, you really can't say this is exactly how we do it and what we do it. And I think 287 would also be a great resource for you. I know they do everything through an equity lens and some tools that they use to review applications might be a really nice tool for you to weave into your superintendent search also. >> Yes, it we are planning on bringing them in to do a a training. >> Great. >> Okay. Yes, as I mentioned earlier, I know I had a lot of data to share with you this evening, but uh we are a equity focused firm and both in the way in which we employ our associates, our consultants as I may have mentioned to you are over 30% of minority individuals almost 50% of our associates are women. So, we have that um felt experience, lived experience if you will, to bring to your specific situation. Um, HYA has, as we've discussed, almost 40 years of experience in conducting searches along with providing other educational consultation to school districts around the country. And we have gauged over the years the changes and variations in uh our school district's needs. We've maintained though our focus is on finding a leader who is going to support you and being able to provide the best education for every child in your district. Uh we believe that the superintendent has many roles and responsibilities as you pointed out before director Roer. Um but the primary one is ensuring success for all in the school system. And um when we assist any district in searching for their new leader, we are very much focused on that um that responsibility because we know that that's what will drive your school system, your community, your families uh to a successful outcome over time. Um, personally myself, I've already mentioned my role. I've worked in senior leadership positions in a variety of settings everywhere from regional districts to uh suburban and districts and rural districts. And um one of the things that I would say aside from the the political language that was mentioned before that surrounds the topic of inclusivity and diversity, uh every one of the board members who I've worked with as um person in the role of superintendent has had a a true commitment and understanding to the importance of ensuring that every child has a has an excellent school experience and is prepared for either their work uh beyond or post-secary education beyond high school and uh that takes a variety of forms depending on the district and the needs. It may be uh in focusing on a variety of instructional interventions that will ensure improved outcomes for students. may be um looking at how behavioral um and dis behavior and discipline is carried out to again ensure that all students are appropriately addressed. Uh so it's at my core actually even my dissertation was about ensuring all students can be successful in school. So something I believe in my heart. >> Thank you. I appreciate that. Any other clarifying questions before we let >> Yes. Director >> Chair Andre [snorts] >> um for MSBA. Quick question about the recruitment model. Um it sounds mostly passive. Um but are there um proactive um steps you take to go out and maybe find candidates or make them aware of the opportunity um to the extent that they maybe they're not looking right so like for my job I get emails and calls all the time say you you're probably not looking but I have this great opportunity. Um, how much of that do you do as part of the recruiting process? >> Yeah, thanks for asking that. Um, we talk about it at our service provider calls every two weeks and one of the things that we do is we talk about who would align well with this and who knows them. Uh, just today I had a call with my metro service provider and we came up with another 12 to 15 names because when you've been in the business as long as Dr. McGuire and Dr. Johnson and Dr. Ward and Connie um you know a lot of people and you hear about a lot of people who are rising stars. So those folks we decide who will reach out to whom and in what manner because we want to be very careful and very respectful that they should know about this opportunity and take a look at it without us putting pressure on them. But I think it comes down to uh the term as a tap on the shoulder. There are some people who need that encouragement before they'll look at it or consider it because they may think, "Oh, I I'd never qualify for that." So, those are the folks that we talk about in our meetings. And then individually, we don't want one person getting five phone calls. We'll choose who's calling who and when and what are you hearing and maybe it's not the right opportunity now, but we have them on our radar for future uh for future contacts as well. Um the other term we use is shake some trees and as post you know positions are posted and I reach out to all of my statewide folks. I'll say hey we need to shake some trees for XYZ school district who might align with what the board is looking for. Uh so we brainstorm that as well nationally. I should also say that one of the things that Josh Paulie does is he will take a look at the profile that you are looking for in leadership and put all of the statistics for Hopkins public schools. He's really good at technology and really understands how to look for stuff. So he'll put that information into his search database and he'll pull up maybe the top 25 schools that are similar to Hopkins across the country and then he will reach out to the administrators in those districts to see if they are aware of the opportunity here in Hopkins and let them know that they should look at it. Um and that's in addition to his when he's at conferences and handing out business cards. So that's a targeted model that we try to find districts with similar whether it's um similar strategic plans or um academic or social emotional aspirations. Um find those schools, reach out to them. What we won't do is contact a sitting superintendent in Minnesota and say, "Hey, you should apply for Hopkins." Because we as an organization have an ethical problem >> stealing leaders from our members. Okay, >> we just we won't do that. I'll guarantee you though that those people know about this opportunity and the awareness is really what we try to build more than a personal invitation. >> Thank you. >> Okay, thanks for asking. >> That was very helpful. >> Appreciate both of your time. >> Um and we will be in touch after. >> Thank you so very much for your time >> and I wish you all the best. >> Likewise. Thanks for the great questions. This is a very thoughtful process and I I know it takes a lot of time but really truly those are wonderful questions. So thank you. >> Have a good night. >> Thank you. >> Excellent. >> Stay warm everyone. >> You too. [laughter] >> Hey are you leaving? >> Yes. >> Okay. So then how we Okay. >> I just wonder how do we notify them afterwards? >> Um I'll send an email. >> Okay. Um so this takes us to our uh next agenda item which is the final decision. Um we will have some time to um discuss um and then um we will look for a motion and put it to a vote. Um I have been um in contact with um Treasurer Hartland. So, um, just knowing that she brings a perspective from hearing from half of the the proposals. Um, so yeah, just opening it up at this point. Um, I I don't know. Is there an appetite for having discussion before we call a motion or do we want to have the discussion after the motion? I'm open to either one. Let's have a discussion. Let's have a discussion and then make a motion on who we're going to choose. I think >> so. Um Yeah. Yeah. I would invite board members to >> let us know your thoughts. >> Chair Andre. >> Yes. Director Heyman. Um this aligns with um what uh clerk WG [clears throat] um mentioned um when speaking with MSBA. Um I have um a lot of concerns about the recommendation. Let me start by saying I really like MSBA and I'm leaning towards MSBA. With that being said, I have concerns that they would be willing to develop a profile, a leadership profile before getting stakeholder feedback. And so while I understand we are in a time crunch, um I would want to be assured that the leadership profile will incorporate um community and stakeholder feedback even if it's a little bit at the beginning and then we do more and continue to refine as I think she mentioned we would obviously be able to do. Um, but I would uh be very concerned about developing a leadership profile without having any um community input. >> That was concerning to me just a little bit. >> Yeah. And I do think um I I also agree. I think that all of us were envisioning a lot of community input at every phase. Um and I think um MSBA made clear I think both actually made clear that this process is ours >> and um their job is to make it work for us. And so if that is a big ask that we're going into this with and it sounds like this is a commitment of this board to have community input and in particular um personally my bias would be getting student input at this immediate >> level of the process. Um, I would prioritize that over other um that and staff and I think that um MSBA would be open to that. >> That would just be my impression and as the board we can say this is non-negotiable. This is how we want our leadership profile to to be. Um but yeah, I think that that [snorts] was the impression I got. >> Yeah, I just I think it's a big ask, right, given the timeline. Um, so I just want, you know, we're not going to be able to do all the surveys and >> um and um review all the data and review all um submissions from community members um in advance of developing the leadership profile given our timeline. It's just not possible. And so I think um so long as we make it very clear that that leadership profile is not um is that that leadership profile is malleable depending on the feedback and community input we get is is a very important piece of >> um whatever whoever we decide that we um communicate that to them. >> Yeah. And I do I did like too that they have an example of what that could look like. Um it was provided for us that um you know the the we have the leadership profile but the ways in which the public input is part of the hiring criteria I thought was really and how it aligns um to that board input I thought was really um interesting and goes to exactly what both of you have been speaking to is that yes, it is part of that profile and that things change as we go through the process. Um I I did like that that there's an an example put before us of how that could look and work. >> Yeah. I have a question um for clarification purposes if anyone else caught this. Um, it sounded like the leadership profile you select out of like 24 I think she said items or did anyone else catch that? >> If if you caught it, can you can you clarify what I heard? >> I suppose I I could have asked a follow-up question about this because I I heard two things. um one which is I think we have or I made an assumption I guess that we have uh spaciousness to ensure that the language of a leadership profile is in alignment broadly with how we would describe our district or you know some of even that last slide around the distinctives of Hopkins or things. Um and yet then there are 24 different um what are we looking for categories for superintendent um qualities and it seems that we get to identify of that uh as more of a selection thing so people can selfidentify in a way that is consistent across applications or things. Here's our seven areas of most prioritized focus. Um so I was presuming it was probably going to have a little bit of here's our own narrative. Here's then within that the I think about uh job applica, you know, job postings where it's here's the description in paragraph form. Now, here's the required key characteristics. Doop dup dup dup dup. >> But we could ask that for follow-up clarification because I am not a trustworthy source of truth on that just interpretation. >> Well, and I think too um it is a framework and probably a process that they go through with all boards to get to their leadership profile. Um, and it again I think and this is true of both firms. I think that a lot of that is up to how we want it to look. If we want more than that, if we want less than that, um, I [snorts] think it is something that we get to craft. Um, they just have a triedand-true method to get boards to a finished leadership profile. um which does which is important because it does drive um a lot of the work um and um we get to make it our own >> chair and >> yes >> yes um on a different thing I don't know if anybody else caught but I I heard that there was two different um gu guidance on how we can do our interviews one of them said you cannot you can you may be able to do a select committee and one said you can you may be able to do an executive session. >> Yeah. >> Um and uh you know so I don't I don't know which is which and which is true. Um and so that is concern you know not you know like in of itself it's fine. >> Nick [laughter] knows >> Nick knows right. So if we get some guidance on like who's actually right um you know maybe it's a mountain out of a molehill but maybe it does demonstrate that one >> knows their law a little bit better. And I don't want to step in something innocuous like that and have you know open meeting violations or whatever violations for something that's very innocent because our guidance was wrong. So if I don't know can we get clarity on what actually is >> do we have clarity Nick? Do you know at what stage of the process? >> Yeah. So one one of the firms said >> uh you can >> you have a subcommittee >> you can have a subcommittee >> and have a closed meeting. Right. So not the whole board >> like three. Right. I I I think that's that's how I interpret it. And then one said you you could do an executive session even for the initial interview >> because you I guess the theor my read on it is it's private information, >> right? And so like the whole board, >> right? But I don't [clears throat] >> I feel like that doesn't sound correct, but I don't know. >> Yeah, it is. Um it's actually policy 205. >> Oh, no. [laughter] 205 is the policy that you have regarding open meeting law and it depends on how you define um what constitutes a committee and it's still up to the board on if you want to keep that aspect of it open. Um so by Minnesota law what you heard very clearly is that the design is transparency all the way through some spaces look and we do have the language in 205 that would say if you don't have a quorum [snorts] but if you have a quorum then that thereof means it's kind of more of the full meeting of the board. If you have a full meeting of the board as you've communicated with the community, then that means you'd be looking more at a more transparent process. Um, there are some ways that you can have a select smaller group that would look at being part of that committee to narrow if you were looking at it as that as part of your structure and the way that you design it. You could have meetings that were not in view of the public. Um, some search firms do it differently. Some will say that based on these things, we're going to recommend semi- finalists up front. Um, there are just different ways that you can structure it, but we do have language as was identified in 205 that can create some opportunities, but it's really about the way the board crafts it. >> Does that help? >> Uh, yes, but it so we could not >> do an executive session in the for the initial interview. Is that correct? It would be very difficult with the language that you have right now. >> Yes, I that gives me a lot of reservation that somebody suggested that my two cents not a good idea. >> Uh hya I'm pretty sure. >> Yeah. And I think >> when I heard that there's no >> I think the um >> Thank you. >> the >> suggestion was that it's possible yet not done. So, at least that's what I heard that it is an option but very rarely done. >> And I would just addendum that to say that was from MSBA. What I heard, right, is that we could have a committee potentially dependent upon um but that was not um from HYA. They did not name that as you could do but wouldn't recommend. They they named the my my memory is that HYA talked about a subcommittee. Um MSBA said you could do some of the interview like final meetings have to be final interviews interviews of finalists have to be in an open meeting. >> Um but [clears throat] that you could do initial interviews in a closed session but that is rarely done. That's what I heard. >> We might have to play back >> the recording to know. >> I believe I believe HYA said executive session, but I might be I wrote it down because I was like, "No, I don't think so." >> Okay. I heard >> video I [laughter] heard executive too, but >> Okay. >> From Ha. >> Um, you heard it from HA. >> From executive I heard HYA. >> Interesting. Okay. I heard it totally differently. Anyone else have any memory? >> I would need to play it back. Do >> you need to to hear the >> Yeah, it was a question. It was your [clears throat] question, so you probably remember it more. >> Well, I mean, I I think you've beaten open meeting laws into me [laughter] cuz I was like, I don't think that's true. But >> yeah, definitely. >> I mean, and also it would it would go directly against what we're naming we value is just openness and transparency and communication with the public. So, I don't think even if that was We wouldn't do it. >> We wouldn't do it. >> That's true. >> We would not do it. >> Just [laughter] >> um I agree. Yeah, thank you Z for bringing that up because I wouldn't have I had it totally wrong in my head. >> Um any other thoughts? >> Um so Chair Andre, so within the two search firms, I think they both did an incredible job presenting. They both were very convincing. I'll be completely honest. I like the aspects of both of them. Um, one of the bigger concerns that I just had about um, MSBA was just um, I think they do definitely have a great focus on like Minnesota pol uh, policies and understanding like all the the legal ramifications of like school boards within our state. Um I am just concerned about like the lack of diversity within their internal team though just to be completely honest just because um I would like to have a diverse uh experience and um advisory from their team to um uh to advise on the practices when searching for a candidate. And so I know that they mentioned that it is improving. HYA to me had a um a more structured process around um you know their internal team dynamics and it's displayed within even their leadership that they showed um you know uh shared with us um who's on their team and so that's really important to me because that is something that um I uh that I'm personally impacted by right um just as like a leader is that I would love to have folks who are um who are uh recruiting me to have some lived experience that I have had when I am to apply for a um a very intentional position like a superintendent. I do like MSBA's their association however with school boards and their knowledge of school boards more um because they do do the conferences they do um you know have trainings around like school board uh practices and standards and so that feels more comforting to me. Um, so I'm I'm still making a decision in my head which which firm I think I would go with, but just those two uh distinctions really stood out to me as they both were discussing like their processes. And so, and I also do like the national reach that um HYA have just because I do think it's very important that we do look at the um this the scalability of different districts across our nation and bringing that expertise to Minnesota because we have been in a deficit with our educational data for a very long time. So, I would love for some fresh new perspective, outside perspective to come and lead um you know, our great district. So that is something um that I also was looking at in terms of like which firm would have that uh would have that pathway would have that best pathway. >> Thank you, Vice Chair Roer. Um I I agree. I share your concern. um and also did um appreciate MSBA's response to my question. Um but I agree with you. I don't think that there is a true substitute for um having leaders reflect the um people we are trying to attract to our district. And I I would just remind the board that um it is part of our values as a district. Um that we that our goal is to have our staff reflect our student demographics. Um and that should always be at top of mind when we're considering um decisions like this. So, thank you for speaking to that. It is highly important and [clears throat] it's very important to our students and in particular if we want the outcomes that we say we want um for our families. >> Any other thoughts? Director Xiao, did you want to jump in? >> Did you want to jump in at all? >> No. >> Okay, then just Yeah. >> Uh I Chair Andre. Yes. clerk WG. >> Thank you. Um, yeah, I appreciate this and and I think um, you know, a couple things. One is I I do believe wherever we end up, both of the firms that we invited in. I feel good about that and appreciated what both of them brought to the table and I'm I don't have any red flags in either direction. It's the fist of five. I have no fists um that I'm that I'm feeling in either direction. Um, I think I I actually was uh expecting coming into tonight that I was going to um say HYA was my top pick. That's what I thought coming into tonight and my mind changed sitting here tonight. Um so again, I would go with either and will support that. Um I think for me MSBA um ended up stronger uh for a couple reasons. One is I actually felt like the nationwide that was a big question for me because I didn't want to become just like I'm a a annoyingly proud motan right now. Um [laughter] and uh yet I I also recognize that I think it's really important especially given the values of our district that we are ensuring that we are inviting forward candidates from around the country um and maybe some persons who can help us think they might not be from Minnesota and can help us think differently about what are some of our norms. Uh not to say that motans can't also do that, but I I thought I appreciated how that was addressed the nationwide uh questions. I also think pointing back to the presentation um you know just the intentionality too with having it posted at so many different recruitment sites. I think that was actually a concern of mine with hy is like well you have 40,000 subscribers which is huge right and who are on the subscriber list versus um what are all the diverse networks that and you know and that sounds like that's actually an intentional thing that you're you're ensuring it's posted in all of those different places and I think I both want to really honor uh director or vice chair excuse me vice chair roper >> it's okay [laughter] >> it's new >> it is new um and I I want to I really want to honor that. And I think um one of the things that struck me as um you know as we were hearing from MSBA was I also have um as a person who's worked in higher education and nonprofit leadership uh have heard from quite a few friends my friends of color um who in searches what she what she named about the tokenism or the sense like oh well like great that you're tapping me but you're you know like you're just tapping me because you don't even know anything about me. they don't care about what I'm bringing to this. And I think when hearing that particularly um diverse leaders of color um I'm assuming leaders of diverse sexualities and genders um are saying I was humanized. I was treated as like a full person who's coming to this as a leader and hearing that there's a level of respect and uh that that was meaningful to me to hear that and particularly um hearing with Dr. Johnson um with her expertise and that she would say, "Hey, folks are trying to get me to work for them to do recruitment and I'm saying yes to you all." That I I did appreciate that. Um and I think centering in an ongoing way all of our values and um I think it just remains vital in in this work. So I I absolutely go either way. I'm leaning the one direction. That's why um yeah, >> thank you. Appreciate it. Chair Andre. >> Yes. >> Um, Vice Chair Roer, I just wanted to I just um Googled wasn't familiar with all the individuals listed on the superintendent search leadership team. >> Um, and I just wanted um to point out two things that Josh Paulie um is national, right? So he uh she said attends national conferences and will you know tap um national contacts. So I think having at least one dedicate >> clarifying though he is local he's from Minnesota >> right he's local but he his his specific role at least I understood his specific role was to >> um focus solely on national candidates and and reaching nationally. So I I do like that there is someone still dedicated and specifically dedicated to that. So I don't think going with MSBA necessarily forecloses um finding a unique candidate that could be from another part of the country. >> Um and then Dr. Bernardia Johnson. Um I believe she is uh the former superintendent of Minneapolis public schools. Y >> and is she African-Amean as well? >> Yes. >> So to have someone on, you know, the search leadership team, although I agree that the MSBA's institution um perhaps may have not be reflective of our community um in full that at at least um Dr. Johnson would be on our search committee as a service provider. just wanted to bring that to your attention to the extent you didn't already know. >> Yeah. No, thank you so much um director uh Heyman, I really appreciate that insight. I was speaking more to um that the internal team of and and this is not the like the the total deciding factor, but it does um as a as a leader of color who have to who unfortunately have to consider this like majority of their team is is, you know, and um and she said it is majority um white. And so um so that does kind of want I I kind of do want to understand how they do make equity decisions based on that factor. Um and so I do love that we do have like you know some you know a limited amount of diversity within the search firm but I do value having more to be completely honest. Right. And then just also with H hya just their um the their their national uh their national reach um I think is is they they have a more extensive national national reach than MSBA does. And so that's kind of just where to I didn't I didn't want to I'm not um you know uh I'm not neglecting um Josh Pauliey's experience. I'm just looking at HYA's um extensive experience as a organization with national um searches. And so I do think both organizations bring a a great deal of um experience. I'm just looking at the the experience as an organization totally versus individually. [clears throat] >> So that's kind of where my where my statements were aimed at. So thank you so I understand and I agree about the national presence and overall experience that HYA does have many more years experience doing superintendent search or just nationally than MSBA. >> Thank you. Yeah, and I I think um Vice Chair Roer um at least speaking for myself, I'm um very much, as I said before, in agreement with your perspective on that and I think it is a Hopkins value. Um, so thank you for for bringing that up and I know that that's the lens through which I I looked at these proposals and at the presentation tonight um because it is important that Hopkins continue to maintain um a high level of representation in our leadership in the district. Any other input? >> Uh Chair Andre. >> Yes, Director. >> Oh, sorry. Thank you. Uh, one other item um, and maybe for the people watching, uh, for our decision, the cost, uh, the total cost was comparable, right? They were both >> 20ishk, is that about right? >> 24 >> and, uh, >> I mean, I I don't know how people interpreted, you know, an additional amount of money for stakeholder surveys >> for hya. to me was very um I don't know insulting is a strong word but it was very I was taken aback that it would not be included that seems like a very critical piece to the um to the you know making our decision and so you know does that does that change the cost calculus for HYA at all or is it still about the same or are there other things that we might have to pay for >> I agree I was that was going to be my my um point if someone else didn't bring it up was that I feel like if we're looking at just dollars um which is not always which should never be the the sole deciding factor um hya does come in because of all a cart um items at higher than MSBA not by a lot and certainly um you know we can talk about whether other factors make it more important um bring a value ad um beyond dollars but I also you know heard that while they would help us find an interim um there wasn't that clear um commitment that we got from MSBA that well we will restart the search process for you free of charge this is our commitment to you. Um, I got the impression that that would come with some additional cost from HYA if we did find ourselves in that situation. And I'm not saying we are, so perhaps don't make a decision based on that. Um, but yeah, I think the the money I think we might find if we wanted something [snorts] that would be standard with MSBA, we might have to pay additional for that. So that I think is a factor for consideration. >> Okay. >> Thanks. [clears throat] >> And also um I think you brought up the point too that there isn't that depth of knowledge of statutes and limitations on the search process that we get specifically to Minnesota that we get with MSBA as well. >> So those are the things I'm noodling. Chair Andre, I just had one more observation um that I wanted to say. I I do going back and looking at HYA's presentation. I do really um like that they put together a search timeline right at >> the get-go. Um I think timelines are really important. Mhm. >> I don't think that was emphasized as much by MSBA. While I'm sure they would agree to put a timeline in place, um I do think that it's important to um be realistic about what the timeline is and um when things need to happen. I kind of think of it as um a home remodel, right? you you want to have plans in place and stages and um completion deadlines of certain items in a timely manner. And so I do like that HYA made clear that the one of the first thing right that they have on here is um planning meeting with board and putting together that search timeline. It says HYA will develop a specific timeline with the school board. >> Yes. And I do just want to have it be noted that both firms in their original proposals gave us timelines. So MSBA did provide that information as well. It just wasn't part of tonight's presentation. >> Okay, good to know. >> Yep. And chair Andre. [clears throat] >> Yes. >> Just just to both second um well not formally seconding just to affirm uh what you said with MSBA. was on page 19. Um, and to connect director Heyman with what you named, I do think even even as we say like say if we did go with MSBA, uh, I think being clear here's our our planned for timeline and then here's, you know, as we communicate and here's the moments where the exact details of that will continue to shift as we remain in a co-creating process with our community, you know, but I think having a clear overall I'm absolutely with you. I think clarity of communication and communication and communication will be a deeply valued thing by our community. And I I I want this and I think we all do this process to be one that just um brings us even more deeply together uh as we lean into the future as a as a district. So, >> Mhm. >> Kieran Dre. >> Yes. >> Mr. Chair Roer. >> One thing that I do like about um again this is um hard for me just a little bit difficult for me because this is my first time going through this. So, I do have all the questions. M >> so my apologies because I do agree with um you know what all of my colleagues are saying just about the differences especially director Z about that cost since we are like we have like no fat to trim you know from >> teriyak yeah like I'm asking for teriyak seaweed and he's like we don't have the budget for it so like you know about every dollar that we spend has to be very intentional and so um I I was thinking about that as well when we were talking. I also want to just um point beyond the superintendent though. I do like HYA's experience with um their search for cabinet members because um it does in I think you know like the superintendent yes is like the visionary of the district but the cabinet is kind of like the the heartbeat of the district. And so um good cabinet members also does uh um make up how our superintendent is successful. And so their insight to like like cabinet and administrative work um is a plus to me because I think it's super important that we consider who's serving with the superintendent and not just fully solely focusing on the superintendent alone. Like we need like transportation. We like we need all those folks to be topnotch in you know including our superintendent. And so, um, that that was a little bit of a distinction that I liked about HYA versus, you know, um, MSBA just saying we focus only on, you know, uh, superintendent search, which is totally fine, though, I'd like just a little bit of diversity and experience with that. So, that's something I would like to mention. >> Yeah. Thank you, uh, Vice Chair Roer for bringing that up, too, because it reminded me of one of the things I really liked about HYA is their transition, um, supports for a year. um >> which I feel like was not as addressed with MSBA beyond the you know you're members of MSBA. So we'll always be there and and helping you. Um so yeah, I had forgotten about that. Mhm. >> So, thanks for talking about that more deeper into the district um focus of HYA. >> Uh are we feeling like we've >> one more comment about HS or HYA if possible? >> Thank you. Um, I do think it's not so much a comment about HYA, more a question I want to pose to my fellow board members. MSBA um has a conflict of interest and e an ethical obligation that they cannot recruit like actively recruit current sitting superintendent in districts in Minnesota. HYA does not have that conflict for that ethical obligation. And so that's just something to consider. um how we feel about that that you know MSBA is a nonprofit. It serves um all of its members. Every single school district in the state of Minnesota is a member of MSBA. So while they have this immense >> Not all, >> not all. >> Not all. >> A lot. >> A lot. Most >> 330 did she say? >> Yeah. But not not everyone. >> That's not everyone. Okay. Yeah. >> Thank you for the clarification. >> Yeah. >> Um, is that a concern to anyone? Just something to discuss or >> consideration? Yeah. >> Or or think about? >> If I could just share that um the metro area superintendent definitely know that Hopkins is looking for a new soup. And I'm I'm very confident that the vast majority of all sitting superintendent know about this opportunity. So >> I don't know. >> Nonsitting superintendent know about this opportunity. [laughter] >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But I I just wanted to share that. >> I do understand um director Heyman the conflict of interest concern though. >> Yeah. >> Right. because I would be devastated if someone shouted to our superintendent right while she's sitting. However, I do know that um it does happen, you know, like recruitment is it does happen and so um that is something to to think about as well, especially if we're if candidates decline to take a job like you know do like where do we search if we went through all of the candidates? Like do we start that whole search over? Like I know they say they hire ins, but um you know like where do they begin to pull from once a candidate declines? So I understand where you're coming from with that one. >> Yeah. And what if there's a someone that's a superintendent in another district that they believe is excellent and while they may know about the role may need a what did they say? a tap on the shoulder or encouragement to apply. I think MSBA's approach has to be a little bit different than HYA's approach in doing that. >> That was my understanding. >> I do want to remind everybody about the time. >> Um it is almost 9:00 and we still haven't had a motion. Um so just wondering do we need to take a break so people can think a little bit more? Um, or are we feeling like we've reached a place where someone would make a motion about a particular search firm? >> Should I make a motion about a particular >> search just to use the restroom? I know it's late, but >> Okay, five minutes we will be back here. Um and then at that point I would look for a motion. Great. >> Thank you. >> Okay. back everybody. Um we just had a quick break and um for board members to gather themselves, think more about um this decision and um I um would like to I would look for a motion that the board appoints um MSBA, Executive Search Firm, as our search firm. Do I have a motion? >> Um, I forgot to say >> I'll I'll make a motion that >> that we appoint MSBA as our search. >> So moved. >> Is there a second? >> Second. >> I have a motion and a second. Any discussion? I would just like to say that um I'm very grateful for both firms. Their proposals were excellent. I feel like we would have been in good hands either way. Um just that MSBA nudged out just a little bit more. Um so with that um with that I would um all those in favor please say I >> I >> I >> I any opposed. The chair votes I and MSBA is our superintendent search firm. Thank you all very much for the process for all your thoughtful questions and your great input. Um, I am really excited to get to work and I would look for a motion to adjurnn. >> Motion to adjurnn. >> Is there I have a motion to adjurnn. Is there a second? >> Second. >> I have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Seeing none. All those in favor, please say I. >> I. I. >> Any opposed? The chair votes I. in this meeting of the Hopkins special meeting of the Hopkins School Board is adjourned at 9:02 p.m. Thank you all. >> Thank you. >> Thank you.