Good afternoon. The time is now 4:09. The Weisetta Public Schools Board of Education work session for Monday, August 25th, 2025 will please come to order. We'll start with introductions beginning from my right. >> Heidi Kedar, Sheila Prior, >> Dan Janestra, >> Valentina ears, >> Sarah Johansson, >> Chase Anderson, and I am Milan Sony. Thank you and welcome everyone this afternoon. We have two items on the agenda, a finance and operations report and a schoolboard report. First, executive director of finance and operations Trevor Peterson will present an update on facilities. Yeah, tonight we actually have uh John Deutsch um director of facilities and transportation and from Carl Sanderson we have John Hunick and Jason Renmester and then we have Aaron and I um Aine is that your last name from W Architects. So, they will be uh here to present um a facilities report for you tonight and we'll certainly entertain any questions or comments at the end of the presentation. Director Sahony, members of the school board, Dr. Anderson, uh tonight with me we have John Hunick from Krauss Anderson, Jason RMster from Krauss Anderson, we have Erin Osing from W. Um just a a real a brief kind of um overview is these have been our strategic partners as we've gone through this facility and and capacity studies over the last dozen years plus. Um they've been very helpful in in helping us to guide us through this and uh today we come forward with um some new opportunities um and just kind of an update for the board as a whole. So I will turn it over to John. >> Thank you John. Thanks for having me. Um we have a short presentation here. Um there'll be others helping me through this on a few slides that we have. Um a little bit of summary of where we've been to date. So in June, if you remember, we we've taken a look at your enrollment and you've had several different um professional companies look at your enrollment and we'll talk about that a little bit more. U we also talked about capacities in the building, right? what's the right size, the right student um teacher ratio in each classroom. We're going to talk about that in a little bit. Uh so that happened in July and then in uh further into July, we started talking about ideas and solutions uh for each building, not only in terms of it relates to capacity but educational adequacy for the students and staff as you improve spaces. Um now coming August uh we started talking about ideas and we're going to touch on some of those tonight on where we are today and um next steps after that. So jumping into capacity again I talked about um you've had several companies take a look at where you're at in capacity. The district has chosen smartly to use an average of each professional firm of where you're at. And what became very clear quite quickly is by 27 and 28 you're you're exceeding capacity and you'll see that in the next slides. So the slide up now and I think many of you have seen this before. This is the elementary school capacity. So the dark blue line is at capacity and so that would be 90. So what you use when you count capacity, you typically use somewhere between an 85 90% uh capacity because not 100% of every room can be used at one time, right? That's almost impossible because bubble classrooms or uh other programs that are being used in the building. So uh 5,487 uh is your average. So in short, get to my right page. I got some more notes here. So your your students you can see over time you range from 5,812 to 6,68. Okay. So you can see in the next five or six years there's a bubble of students that go quite a bit over your capacity line. Okay. And then things start to flatten out from there. So it's fairly self-explanatory. Did I miss anything there, John? >> No. I think that um one thing to point is as we go through this the level of confidence um becomes less and less as the farther you go out. Um really this is a 10-year projection and and there is a a fairly high level in the first five years but after that um you're talking about students that may not even be born as of yet. >> Right. And future developments that aren't even on the radar yet that wouldn't be in here either. So those aren't shown. Also jumping to the middle school. Um again come 2728 that increases quite quickly. Again in this case we're using 87.5% for capacity. Okay. And the range from students there will be 3,177 to 3,480 students. So again you can see the dark blue line in the capacity over. So in a short amount of time um you'll be over that. Uh there also was a lot of other a lot more discussion at Central Middle School and what what is the right number of students in a building? What's too many right like if east and west um is in that 850 range plus or minus 850 to 900 um and it's determined by the size of the building the type of spaces you have that about 1,200 students would be ideal. So to make that a 1,200 student building, where would those students go? Because so that becomes part of the equation if we're talking about either additions to other buildings or if we're talking about a replacement middle school. So it's not only about uh enroll um enrollment going up, but also right sizing central to make that the proper size. And then the high school right loud and clear. Um you can see that that this this goes from um 4,046 to 4,924 students. So So there's quite a jump in 10 years, right? What do we do with that number of students, right? Where do we put these students? What does those spaces look like? Um I think a noteworthy item um we had met earlier as of today that are signed up for class, you're at 4,50. So just a little bit more than you're already showing. So that's that's pretty darn close. But it's um only August and then in October, if you remember, you redo your numbers and when where those numbers are at. So there's quite a bit of growth. And by the way, I want I do add that 87.5% on capacity. Kudos to your staff, administration team, and principles. From my experience, um built a lot of schools over 30 years. That's that's a very good that's using your building to its its fullest potential. A lot of times we'll use something more like a 75 on a high school maybe 80% because a high school you know who's taking what class, what room's going to be used. Uh and that varies a lot. So a good kudos to administration team for using that building very well. So they are going to be short spaced very soon. And then we're jumping in right in and we can certainly answer questions and we're done. So then the team has got together what what do we do? We're how do we address capacity and how do we address enrollment? So in summary, we're talking about a new elementary school number 10. Okay. To make up for capacity, uh middle school number four, and we're dusting off some studies that you've done a couple times already. Um, should you do additions to East Middle School or West Middle School? And you know what? Let's weigh the the pros and cons of doing that or I like using plus and delta better. What's the cost difference? So, those are being looked at again, whether it's a new middle school or additions to East or West. Uh, expansion to uh the high school is clearly, you know, with additional 900 students coming. We're certainly going to need to do something there. building out of classrooms uh at the early learning center, um renovations of SD uh C spaces, and then renovations at Elm Creek Transitions and Creekide to each one to uh deal with capacity and enrollment, some of the educational adequacy needs and safety and security, right? Security and safety priority number one. So, we taken a look at each building in terms of um improving security and safety. There's also uh site safety at Plymouth Creek, uh renovations and additions and full kitchens at uh Birch View, Greenwood, and Sunset. All which are just not adequate for those students or and staff. Um furniture replacement, modernization at the other middle schools, right? That's uh that's a lot of that is adequacy, right? If you're going to have a new school, um what do we do at the other schools as needed? and renovations, additions of right side kitchen, cafeteria um at East Middle School. And then of there's a few athletic and activity spaces. Part of that is a little bit of a domino effect when you do additions at the high school, right? Because there's not a ton of green space left besides athletic fields. Thank you. Um most of you are aware that um you do own 86.6 acres now. Uh there's currently a traffic study happening. We've had several meetings whether it's Mandot uh local governments, county been trying to meet with the railroad. Easier said than done, but they'll be part of the solution, too. So, as that traffic studies happens, it's what other stop lights do we need, what turn lanes do we need, what accelerations do we need, what roundabouts we might need, those type of things. Uh as it affects your site and how you get there, walking paths, um other park opportunities. So those are going now as we speak and we need to know a little bit about those so we can plan for those and budget for those. So those are taking part as we speak and then Amy is going to touch on the community task force. >> Good afternoon board members and Superintendent Anderson. Um the district has a long history of involving the community in the referendum planning process. um and we are on kind of a tight timeline. So we were thinking you know how can we best get a representative um sample of voices throughout our community to participate in this process. So we will be convening um a task force of about 15 to 20 members representing a diverse cross-section of um different perspectives and they will be drawn from our existing committees. I won't read through each of the committees, but it's really just to make sure that we're getting um you know broad um perspectives at different levels. So early learning, elementary, middle, high school, empty nesters um we'll get various perspectives. Um and we will also work with our family liaison to make sure that you know we're making sure that different cultures are represented as well with that goal of 15 to 20 members. So this group will be convened in midepptember and go through October. Those dates are yet to be set. Um with their their goal is really to come up with a recommendation that will be presented to Superintendent Anderson who will in turn um bring it to you as a board and then you will have your chance you know to um ask a many many questions and gather additional feedback as needed. Um and the this task force will be provided with key data much of what which you're hearing tonight. Um as well as background information that has been studied um over uh the last few months. Um so the goal will be for this group to meet from three times from midepptember through October again with that goal of submitting a rep uh recommendation to the superintendent by late October. Um members of this group will receive background materials and research to guide their discussions. Um district staff and many of our architect and construction partners here tonight will participate in the task force as well helping with facilitation um providing their expertise and support. And the other piece I think is really important to remember is this is one piece of getting feedback but we also did that community survey. If you remember, Peter Leatherman came in the spring and shared the results of the initial community survey. So, we have some really good baseline data to move forward with. And as soon as we have a specific list of what potentially, you know, comes out of the task force um to bring to the community as a recommendation to you as a board, that will get tested as well. So you will have data to inform your decision making um and and that will be from a representative sample of the community. So this task force is one um one way that we are going to gather feedback but the two surveys are also very important data points as >> uh schedule we call this uh it's a little bit different than the last time you saw. I call this our road map to a referendum. um lays it out nicely. So on the far left you can see that that's each phase. You have project planning and community engagement. That's where you are right now, right? You're just getting into the community engagement very soon. You have yourformational campaign and get out to vote and eventually as the board desires and votes on um a potential referendum or election day. And on the bottom, once a referendum passes, you'll go through a design phase through a public bidding for construction and then ultimately construction. And with the number of projects we read, there will be a lot of phases, right? Some projects will start sooner than others. So that'll um be a lot of information. Some dates I want to highlight on our road to a referendum. Amy talked about a little bit, you'll be doing a survey number two in September. you can see on the top there that that's really going to really build you a new road or new map and what direction you're going to go, right? And what what you're going to look at. Um some other important dates um are submitting the review and comment by November 25th to the Minnesota Department of Ed. Uh something we're required to do. So there'll be some key dates before that that um the school board will be approving for for us and we'll to do that. Um deadline to certify ballots is in January and then you go into your campaign awareness. Um and then once you get the u positive review and comment back from the commissioner and we got to make sure we publish that uh 40 to 70 days prior to the election. So that'll be in February sometime. So, uh there key dates that we'll need to hit and remember to do um for a referendum. So, on that high note, uh that's the schedule from today and moving forward a road map. So, um next steps, uh SLT continues to meet uh twice a month. They're really helping guide us and give us direction. A lot of really good discussion in there on where we're heading. Amy talked about the task force. um they're going to be our sounding board, right? There's I mean we have been meeting all summer, but in reality I think we've been meeting for a couple years maybe now, maybe longer. So there's a lot of information to feed the task force, get them to understand what we've been working on a really long time. Um and get them comfortable and help guide direction. Uh and then ultimately it's everything comes back to the school board for recommendations and next steps. So with that we open it up to questions. >> Thank you John and John. Um any questions then? Yeah. >> Thank you so much. This has been a very informative presentation. I have one question. Um can you tell us a little bit more about the review and comment letter um that is to be published? um you know for those watching who may not be aware of what's in it um as well as then the um you know items or the takeaways from that letter after it's published >> for the review and comment. What's in the review and comment? Um it's a a document where they have about 12 bullet items or requests that they have. A lot of it's existing data on your current buildings, the size of them, what you own, your enrollments, a lot of existing information, where your boundaries are. Um, and we gather that information. Then what also we'll grab is everything we've been working on to date will become an attachment and they're going to want to know how much new square footage you're adding. And then they're going to ask, can you afford it? not just afford it based on passing a referendum to pay for the bond, but is it adding staff and do you have the ability to pay staff to like if you have more square footage at the high school, can you afford to hire staff? So, that's going to be part of it. It's also going to ask about uh gas and electric usage, uh can you afford those bills? Uh it's going to ask detail about the projects they just in the last year uh we submit to, his name is Chris Kubish at the Minnesota Department of Ed. he has his own little budget sheet the way he thinks want broken out. So we have to take our budgets and put it into his spreadsheet um so he can analyze the budget that it's uh in the means if you will of what other schools cost. So it's their checklist to say okay yeah you're using x amount of square foot for new or remodel or site work. It's for them to be able to check that also. And then they also like to look at your financials that will be coming from your financial advisor and what that looks like and your uh we'll give them copies of your um enrollment study too studies. So that's pretty much it. >> That's a lot of information. Thank you. >> Yes. Yeah, it'll be pretty thick this time. >> Yeah. So I have few questions mainly around uh community task force and communication. So um Amy feel free to jump in and I understand we may not have answers to all questions but as we go through the planning something to keep in mind. So the first question is um so I've been part of uh CFAC right so I know the audience and that's well qualified allies I'll put it that way. Uh my question is as we look at let's say other committee members right other committees that we are trying to tap into or even if we open it for general public what are the qualifications or expectations are we looking at from those individuals because those 15 20 folks if they are representing community they have to be I'll call it strong enough in that domain to even understand what the referendum is and it's not easy so what kind of expectations will we set up >> I don't think there are any set expectations other than to bring various voices to the table. We really want people at different levels of their understanding so that we can share information and you know bring them up to the same level. Um so we have not my next step would be to reach out to the leaders of these committees. Um, it's going to be real important that these people can attend all the meetings because we're going to be scheduling them starting in midepptember. And if there's only three or four, it's going to be really important that they can commit to being at those meetings because there is going to be a big learning curve. I I agree with you on that. So, we're going to want to make sure that they're available. And then we're going to take a look at, you know, the overall composition of the 15 to 20 to make sure that again we have diverse perspectives um you know, from early learning through our high school and transition that you know we have um different perspectives. So, we really do want not all people that know a lot about the district, right? because we want to make sure we we have to be able to to gather all that input and and make sure to make sense of it regardless of where people are coming at. So, we just really want to focus on on getting that diverse cross-section of people. >> Okay. And then are we also expecting um I'll take our boundary conversation right after every iteration there was sort of you know broader mode going out to the community what has changed from prior iteration to the next iteration so do we anticipate any of those updates going out to the broader community or how do we how do we keep community members updated >> the updates about what's happening at the task force um it'll be >> findings changes refinement and so on >> it'll be similar similar to the boundary meetings that we did and we we tried to give updates about what they were talking about, but they really are learning sessions. Um, and as administrators, we're there to answer questions and, you know, provide additional information. So, it's more just giving updates that the meetings are happening, but really once they make their recommendation that goes to the superintendent, then we share that, you know, with the whole community and then talk about next steps that the board is now going to be taking a look at it. You're going to have the results of the second community survey. So you'll have that data as well and then it really becomes the board processing um both the recommendation of the task force addition the additional data and then any other feedback that you're going to be wanting as a board. So the only recommendation and again we'll see if it makes sense is again to publish some kind of meeting notes and the reason I'm saying this is depending on how long it takes and how many iterations and Q&As we go through or how the recommendations change we don't want that to be a surprise at the end of the decision cycle. Um we noticed that during our boundary you know discussions some people weren't aware of what's going on. Maybe they were aware what happened in iteration 2, but not necessarily in iteration 7. So again, I'm not suggesting it has to be at that elaborate level. But as long as we keep everybody updated why those decisions are being made, how we got to those decisions, it'll make >> everyone's life easier when we come to that decision table. Again, >> I mean, if anyone else wants to add in, I don't remember that there were actual meeting notes, per se, but the community task force will come and give a presentation to the board and talk about their decision-m process or it's not really decision-m, it's more the information that they gathered and to give that context of why, you know, the recommendation is that they're making. So, you will be able to ask questions about that process. I'm not sure about the actual meeting minutes. >> Yeah. And I didn't mean really like meeting notes, meeting notes, but how did we get to that final recommendations? What? >> But they do come and and do a presentation so that you you can ask a lot of questions. >> Sounds good. >> I might just add to leading up to that, there'll be a number of opportunities for presentations. I mean, probably every work session is going to have some type of an update >> uh in the coming months. And I'll be uh making my annual rounds to PTA groups here this fall. and uh I'll talk about the process, the update, here's our current thinking, here are some possibilities, and then this year uh because of the timing of a possible uh vote um in April, I'd likely be making a second round to all the PTA groups in January, February to give them a further update after the review and comment has been submitted and we have a pretty good idea what what types of projects we're going to be asking the community to support if the board makes that decision for us to move forward and that'll uh be a good way for us to help ensure that uh the community is up to date and we'll keep the board up to date. So we have a lot of mileage to cover between now and November 25th which I think is set at the deadline the latest date by which we could present a review and comment in order to make that uh I don't know target date of April 14th or 15th I can't remember what day it might be uh in regard to possible community vote. >> Okay, makes sense. And again, last request, I know Amy, we talked about it offline, but if there is any, I'll call it byite-size educational videos, articles that we can start publishing. So, just everybody knows what the referendum is, how it works. Again, not a big essay, but small, you know, consumable size information. We can >> You mean once we start the referendum campaign? Yes, absolutely. Yes. >> Thank you. >> Oh, yeah. idea. >> Um, so I have a quick question for you, Amy. Um, is there a reason that we decided to as we're forming this committee that we decided to go to current committee members versus opening it up to the wider community? >> Um, I would say timing. >> So, >> so I have a couple of questions and a comment. Um, and it kind of follows along to the plannings at the different levels. So, and also thank you for pulling this all together. It looked all pretty on the map and I know that there's like thousands and reams of pages of data and such. So, thank you for all the work that goes into this. Um, as we think about our element and I'll go up through the levels. So, first, as we think about our elementary, um, are we we do a pretty good job of capacity and and maximizing our capacity in each of our buildings. Um, we also know that through our process of cost containment and other things that we've um that our class sizes have inched up and not just at the elementary but at all levels, right? We um that might not be the number that we want to land at moving forward. So, are we looking when we're thinking about capacity? Um, I just want to affirm that we're looking at capacity based on current class size levels as well as um maybe class sizes that that we would aspire to be at at some point. >> Uh, I'll answer that. Yes, we are. And that's some of the 90%. Plus, I will tell you the other piece of this is that the way that we are educating students, you saw SDC, specially designed classrooms, there are all these there are all these different needs that are that are starting to come into the system. And so, all of that is being looked at. And so, that's where our capacities at our schools, the numbers are changing. Like, if you look at it, they they change periodically. If you look five years ago to what they are now, they've changed for the simple fact that this classroom now is no longer a loadbearing classroom. It is a specially designed classroom and it's a pull- in pull out those um things. So it on top of just the classrooms and the boxes of which the students are in, you also have then circulation, you have cafeteria, you have gym, you have all these other spaces that play into this and those become limiting factors as um so that's part of the whole reason for the 90%. um and why we don't just say 100% thinking that we just we you know just fill it that way. So >> okay, thank you. Um >> I might just add one other thing with that. So the 90% versus 100% if you walk through any of our elementary built buildings right now most of the classrooms would likely be getting utilized for something. There's always a you know a need that's met in any available space. But um if you were to build a facility plan on a 95 to 100% it gets really tight. You don't really hold on to much flexibility within buildings. So you have to have a little bit of uh agility within the building to have options to consider in the event um you know we can't always predict how many students will move in and in what grade levels and are they headed to the buildings that might have more capacity than others. So, um, much like with a high school, I think with 87.5% and our middle schools have probably been in that 75 to 85% range. A lot of it depends on how you schedule, the degree of specialization of classrooms, uh, the having available spaces that are uniquely designed for students that have unique needs. and we're seeing that there's an increase demand for specialization of classrooms which does take some of those classrooms offline. So with that 90% that we're using and again that's planning purposes for for planning purposes. Um the intent is to help us create some agility within those buildings. So there's flexibilities from the principles. >> Thank you. So, building on that specialization, then I'll combine my one of my middle school and and high school questions, which is um I noticed in the middle school improvements, we were talking about furniture refreshes and some other things, but we also remember when we built Metal Ridge, especially as we were going out and seeing different class, different elementary schools and learning spaces um that we learned a lot about um about how education is being delivered in different places. And so given that we have not built a middle school in a super long time, how much are we thinking about to kind of next level middle school learning as we look to uh design our middle school classroom or as we look to sorry as we look to think about renovations at our current middle schools in addition to designing our new middle schools and keeping them on par with one another. >> Right. And a a lot of that and I'm going to step into an architect's shoes right now, but a right we'll we'll plan for the spaces accordingly. Right, the average student per square foot and there's going to be a lot of user meetings, a lot of tours, a lot of what works best, right? Now, there's we want to keep equity between all the buildings, too. >> Yep. >> Right. So, there's a lot of that'll work out in the wash after the referendum. That's why uh design if you look at the schedule is going to take nine months to 11 months. The first third of that is planning and thinking and working with staff again what works better this works here this doesn't work here. So a lot more of that will come out when it comes to replacing furniture at the other buildings. You can do a lot of neat things with furniture that's a lot cheaper than moving walls. Will a little of that happen for some equity reason? Yeah, possibly. Um but a lot of that will come out in the design process with Walt. So >> and then my last I I said I had a couple. So um thinking about the high school too, right? We know that we have a tower space where we could put another tower in. Um again on this and the differential learning, right? I think about aviation programs. I think of business centers and medical complexes. Um so we're doing the same just to affirm we're doing the same with the high school and really thinking how we'll educate our students. >> Absolutely. And there's been a lot of meetings already with staff not only middle school but especially the high school on those visions um what are those career path or uh career tech opportunities uh that students are looking for foretta public schools and again we'll be highly recommending tours of certain facilities like what does aviation look like what does this look like so we've done a lot of different things um and then what's going to fit into those spaces so absolutely >> awesome then a safety and security question Um, we learned from Meadow Ridge, right, that we really and then we partnered with the city of Plymouth to put that tunnel underneath. You talked about working with railroads, you talked about roundabouts, all those kinds of things. Are we thinking about to some of our established wise out of neighborhoods that are on the other side of 55 and ways that families, if they're going to that space, can get across that highway safely? >> Yes. I mean, there's a lot of discussions. We just had one, was it this week? Early this week. um and talking about opportunities to improve all four sides of your site to make that process better. And a lot of it's, you know, which way are buses going to go, >> which way are parents going to go, right? It's easier for a parent to go across a railroad track than a bus, right? So, a lot of that discussion is still underway. And and on top of that, the city and the district, city of Madina and the district have been approached by Three Rivers Park District, and they have basically this 5 to 10 year plan of of trying to figure out some way of crossing 55 and and connecting that to their overall uh trail system. And so we've we've started to engage with that. We've shown them some of our preliminary stuff. Um talked about the traffic study, all of that. So there's there's information that's being shared. Um I don't know if the timing will work out where it'll all you know be perfectly put together but on the same aspect I I feel like that's happened now ahead of which is different than Metal Ridge where we were kind of the first to be up there and and learning from there. So, >> okay. And then my last question, hearkening from our very rich discussions of facilities in the past, um I had colleagues who would talk a lot about um butts and seats versus educational capacity and our collaboration with teaching and learning and what are qualiz classrooms and things. And so when we're looking at our capacity numbers, I just need an affirmation that we're working a lot also with teaching and learning to think about not just how many kids can we fit in this classroom or in this cafeteria, but also um from a teaching and learning perspective, what does that look like from the learning environment? >> Yep. >> Agreed. Yes. Yes. Good. >> That's that's part of it. Absolutely. >> Yeah. I do set on those meetings with all those and work with the team as well. We're utilizing that middle school review that we brought a couple years ago. That was the intention of that was to be able to talk about so to get at your questions about equalizing or creating equity amongst programming doing the same at the high school that CTE is in review this year. So that'll be a big lever on that as well. And then we continue to monitor um delivery of programming at the elementaryaries. what does our reading programming look like as well as the PLC work that we know strengthens our teacher efficacy piece and so really keeping that teacher need in mind and their workload and their ability to collaborate. So, um I appreciate having a seat at the table and working with these guys on that as well. >> Okay. >> Anyone else? No, >> I have another >> Oh, go ahead. >> Okay. So, now I have other questions. um as we're this probably is for admin as we look at our capacity in all of our buildings um and we have to prove the need right to the state of Minnesota to be able to build another building. Are we able to also consider location of the building or is it like we have a lot a lot of um uh developments happening in the northern part of our district. Are we able to say we can't shuttle everybody down into these other schools consistently? And so is that an a consideration? >> That's been a consideration. Um it's a it's a smaller part of the consideration. They will look at total cost of operations, transportation compared to that new building. Um that's where it comes into play where a lot of times when you look at >> additions onto buildings, they will have a percentage of addition that they will only allow onto a building. you can't take a building and add 250% to it and then say, "Okay, we're we're good to go." That type of thing. So, there are things like that that go into consideration um as we move forward. Um will it play out in this? I feel like the growth just continues while it's it's coming from the north and the west. We're still seeing, you know, increased numbers all the way throughout the district. So, >> yeah, houses are definitely turning over. Um, another question that I have is, and this is probably just a confirmation of what I think, but um, I wanted to hear it from you. We, you were talking about developments that potentially haven't even been built yet. We have considered everything that we already know of, right? >> Correct. >> Okay. >> Yes. >> So, that's already there, but there is still land that could potentially get sold and could fill up with homes that we just don't have any idea about yet. >> 5 to 10 years from now, you just Yeah. You just don't know. relevant takes place. >> Okay. Okay. And then one last thing, I know S is not here and she's the one who would be able to really speak to this, but it would be wonderful and we talked about this in the facilities committee about some of the conservation and the energy efficiencies that um that have been done throughout kind of our journey as a district >> um and how we can bring everything kind of elevate everything as we're doing looking at our new buildings as well. So, it would be great to be able to hear about >> and I can touch on that a little bit. I mean to date you've already been doing a lot of really good things with your mechanical, electrical and plumbing systems. Maybe not necessarily solar, geothermal, but the energy efficiency in your buildings has improved immensely from 10 years ago just from things John and his team are doing. Uh what are in the budgets that we are starting to build is a line item called sustainable design. Uh and I'll I'll go from that could be solar. Um I'll go by example. We're doing several projects right now that have geothermal and there's um a federal uh grant uh if you will available called inflation reduction act IRA and what it says is okay if you're going to do something improve x amount of energy in your building we will give you a million dollars back and it's all based on what size that geothermal field is how much energy it's providing and saving um there's quite a big metric to figure that out so we'll studying the those things, right? Um, but while we're looking at that, you know, we're going to look at the payback. So, if it's a premium of x amount of millions of dollars to do a geothermal field, what's that payback? Is it 10 years, 20 years, 50 years? You could start too high. Does it make sense to do it? Um, but there is a, you know, five to 10% depending on which building we have a line item set aside for sustainable design. and we'll weigh all those options and as we go through design, we'll give you reports on what those things look like. There's other opportunities too besides solar and geothermal, >> right? Um, just a quick question. Do you ever see buildings go both geothermal and solar at the same time? >> Um, trying to think, have we done both? Um, >> or is that caused? >> You know, we have buildings that have some solar and geothermal. They maybe necessarily didn't happen at the same time. Uh we've done some solar p projects that became like powering the parking lots and it's more of an educational opportunity as much as it is an energy savings. So students can actually log in and and learn about that. Um and then geothermal but yes the answer there's no reason you couldn't. >> Okay. >> So >> thank you. >> I might just share a little bit too in regard to the location of our schools. the growth really is going to be in the western part of the district. As we all know, that's where we own the property where um the 86 acres that one of the two of you mentioned, I think would be large enough for both a middle school and an elementary school. Um in looking at those uh trend lines, you might recall when Hazel Reinhardt was here presenting, um the birth rate in the state of Minnesota is on a decline. So, I think that that's a a something that is being monitored. Um, it's hard to know how that directly impacts any given school district because regardless of what the statewide birth rate is, that doesn't necessarily mandate or uh dictate how many uh students will move in to a particular school district. So, I think we have to be responsive to that. Um although we haven't uh tended to build schools to accommodate open enrollment in the event that uh we do find a decrease in the um residential population within our school district open enrollment uh consideration is an option. I think when I came here in 2008 I think we had I don't know exactly but 10 or 12% open enrollment and now we're well under 1%. So, we really don't have uh too many open enrollment students anymore within the school district. I think my numbers right. Don't quote me on the 1%, but it's it's pretty small. We don't have too many. I I think the statute requires 1% of a given grade level. So, if you have thousand students, I'm looking at Jen to get the right affirmations that adds up to a whopping 10 students per grade level, I think. Right. So, it's not like it's a huge uh impactful uh variable for us. We're also looking at things in regard to how big do you want a middle school and because Central Middle School is former high school, you know, there's square footage in that building, but is a middle school of 2,000 or 2500 kids something that we want to aspire to and and think would, you know, be the right way to go. Um, we do large schools well. Our high school is u one of the best ever. So our students that are there I think uh find that they get a great experience there and it doesn't necessarily feel overwhelmingly large to the students that are there um to expand that and to accommodate more students in whatever form or fashion is determined the best way to move forward I think is is very doable. But we do have to take a look at the developmental needs of students. What works well for one grade level may not be the same for other grade levels. and you know looking at uh the type of programming at the high school and working with teaching learning and uh giving consideration to the capacities of our current three middle schools. We've explored the east and west expansion. There aren't great options for that that we've discovered to this point, but it's not without options to give reconsideration to. So that'll be something that we'll be looking at seriously here in the next u several weeks slash months. And we do have to keep in mind, and John would have a better perspective on this than I would, but the complications of uh transporting students from the far west of our district to the locations where our three middle schools are is is a challenge to try to meet that three tier system that we have in place, which we have found to be the most efficient model for our transportation. So anyway, there's a lot of things to think about and you know on first glance it can look uh relatively easy or simple to solve a problem but uh when you solve one as we know we oftenimes create others that we have to navigate through and work with. So those are just a few thoughts that came to mind in regard to the location and the fact that our growth center is going to be in the western more part of our school district. Time's up. Okay. Sorry, >> Milan. I had a question. If >> Do you have a question? >> Yeah. >> Okay. Go ahead. >> I'm just kind of following up on um Heidi's question about, you know, additions to existing buildings versus the new um and obviously, you know, most of our growth of new homes is going to be happening in the Northwest and we have the land there and that seems like we do need a elementary and middle school there. Um, we heard from one of the demographic studies that Plymouth was expecting maybe between 700 and a thousand new families. And when we were able to meet with the city council, and I think you were there, um, John, they were saying that we they were expecting growth of, you know, highdensity housing along the 55 corridor, which would obviously affect a lot of our buildings. And I wondered if um if that having that information has changed the plan at all or are we thinking it's not going to happen anytime soon or have you had any other discussions with the city about that? [Music] >> I have not. A lot of what this is built on is either current um current development development that's in for application or possibly that's being sold and and looked at that. So, um, anything along those lines, I mean, they will pop up periodically. And then, um, Jen and her team has done an amazing job of just kind of seeing where that's at, what, you know, how many students is that's going to bring to us. Um, Hazel has given us some amazing data when it comes to houses and how many kids we're pulling from houses as an average. Um, all of that. But I think that's kind of sitting now in a shaded area because development's coming and we've experienced that. And and I think what we're kind of going through right now is after COVID there was a pause and that's kind of what's kind of got us off track a little bit in terms of what we're doing is is the trend line is back. It just took a year or two off. So Jen, did you have anything else you want to share? some of those that the city's talking about were in the plans already that Hazel was looking at that we looked with um internally and with teamworks. One thing to keep in mind is that just because our land is out to the west northwest and that's where our growth is, there's going to have to be some shifts of where students are going. And so if there's new developments on the east side of our district for Plymouth, it's just going to be some shifting. But we did take just as John had talked about earlier, we did take into consideration everything that is on paper as planned um for the all cities that are part of the district. >> Thank you. >> Oh yeah, Valentina. Go ahead. >> I'll have kind of several question in question. Uh first my question is why did we decide and who decided to have 15 or 20 members? If we're talking about diverse, this sounds quite small amount of people to uh make decision for the whole district. >> Um they're not making decisions. They are just going to make a recommendation to the superintendent who then make it to the board. Um it's based on past practice. in both um the 2014 and 2017 uh we brought together two different groups and that seems to be a good group to work with um to share the information and maybe John you can speak to other districts but I think it's a comparable number um that other districts use to make sure that there's enough representation but it doesn't get too big to be able you know to manage the group but it was based on on past history. >> Yeah. Many districts are similar. Yeah. >> Okay. Uh next one. When I'm looking at the groups, uh to be honest, majority um I'm in hard position. Um I do see um majority of groups are more obviously who are involved in education and I can see that obviously they're going to be more prone to uh support uh the decision but at the same time remembering that um Hazel um Reinhardt told us that elementary uh data is not that hot to be honest that the birth rate is going town. So especially for elementary uh level um at least with me it leaves a little bit on not on easy place. I'm not that professional but at the same time here I'm from professionals that uh in Minnesota it's a low fertility. So in looking at the data which you provided today even for elementary I it doesn't look that hot. uh what are we going to do if we're going to build a building and um the amount I mean if it is for elementary on average it's uh recommended is 5,487 you fill it up 2,000 what are going to do with uh the uh one thing is to build the building it's one cost it's like one thing is to build the swimming pool another thing you have to maintain it So are we going to be if we're going to be knowing that birth rate is not that hot and there is a possibility of building a building and then not being able to fill with students. Uh we uh and to be honest um uh Hazel also kind of gave us a little bit a hint that we can obviously having being this district many uh students and families would like to join it that anytime if we'll do open enrollment we will fill it up. Are we going to be transparent then with our community that we will be uh open enrolling students to taxpayers? are we uh would they um uh support that idea? >> I think I'll start with looking at Hazel's um study. Um when you look at the ele the enrollment versus capacity, again, I talked about the fact that, you know, our capacities that are really at our elementary level right now are ever changing for the simple fact that students are coming with different needs and and we're having specially designed classrooms, things of that nature. um when you look at the study as it is, um that dotted line is the quote unquote capacity for all of our elementary schools and we're over that by 500 students in a couple of years. So when you look at that as it's as it sits and you look at if you say the next five years because we've looked at development, we've looked at what's in the queue, what's known as development, things like that. That's about three to five years uh historically in this district learning from it. Three years, five years we build Metal Ridge and by the time we we start Metal Ridge, there's no houses around us. We finish Metal Ridge and it's there's houses all over. Um that I believe that just that that number alone shows the need for an elementary school or something along those lines. and 500 kids when we looked at it like we've done we've studied additions or things like that there's there is not the ability to do that um I've been here almost 13 years and we've done additions to Sunset Greenwood Oakwood >> um like we've done additions to Meadow Ridge we built Northwoods with that addition that Metal Ridge had >> any addition right now as we look at it is going to take an amenity offline somewhere, whether it's a field, whether it's something along those lines. So, we're kind of we've kind of maxed those those types of um solutions. And so, that's why we're here. And that's one of the reasons why, you know, the number as it looks, capacity versus enrollment, >> kind of leads us in that direction. uh she said that uh typically middle school and high school where at least in recent years it showed that u more students are joining maybe they're going somewhere else and then joining but it didn't sound to me that elementary she was that um sure uh and again she hinted that um if we do open enrollment we are not going to have any problem. Another question is we have this uh territory being uh bought. Yes, we have a building right here but this is belong to Visata. Can it be used for example to have some addition to Plymouth Creek? uh to this being uh yeah, so remember this this property was purchased because we already had an agreement, a lease agreement with the church for the parking lot. >> And without that parking lot, we had no parking whatsoever other than what's in front of Plymouth Creek. >> And so we we had that built in for first of refusal. Could we put an addition on to Plymouth Creek and do something here? >> We could definitely look at it. Would it be 500 students, which would be almost 50% more of what that building currently is, or or higher? That would be a challenge. Um, you would be having a building, which again, we've kind of said our our sweet spot at at elementary schools, max is 900 students. >> Um, that's what Northwoods and Metal Ridge were built at. That would put Plymouth Creek at close to probably 11 to,200 students. I'm not telling obviously I mean not asking to put all the student in one but finding some kind of solutions again u for me middle school looks like uh data is supporting it that we are getting students we need uh space uh elementary I would like to hear to be honest uh more data then uh because this is a big mistake I mean if we will make uh such kind of mistakes and there are some histories of other district which build the building but then they have to uh literally abandon it. It's a quite an uh big expense. We're asking from people from uh taxpayers >> if um if you are sure um yep but it would be nice to see that kind of information coming. And another one looking at the um who are going to be in this task force. Uh which which of the group will be representing parent I mean parents empty nesters so that they will give their feedback how do they feel? There are some on those existing committees and then they would have to decide who would be presenting or or presenting the recommendation um both to superintendent Anderson and then to the board. they would make that decision as a group. >> Thank you. >> No other questions? Uh I think some of the community, not maybe everyone but some of the community will be excited about the possibility of sustainable energy. We have had that push for a long time. So the geothermal solar, I think that that's some something very sweet to hear from them at least. Um so thank you for that. Um some of the questions I had were already asked by my colleagues here. So I'm I'm glad that you know those were taken care of. Uh as far as capacity is concerned you said 20 by the year 27 28 we will have a need for an elementary and middle school. From the chart that you showed me or showed us elementary is already at full capacity right? So the three more years um how much pressure is that putting on class sizes? A lot right? >> You got that John or >> the second or third chart? I think >> I think that there's a there's a couple of of factors that play into this because you know students don't all come neatly packaged at 25 kids as we put them in or 23 kids as we put them into these. So as we look at capacity there is some flexibility that happens right like if you look at our current section number and our current um um basically student numbers in classrooms it's it you know it ranges and that's what it is. It's a range. So as we look at this I think that we've already started to feel that. Um, my team would tell you that this summer has been one of the busiest summers that we've had where we've just been building additional capacity and making sure that the 900 or 800 square foot room can be used at an elementary level for um a loadbearing or a grade level classroom instead of it being a specialist. So, we're pulling specialists and we're putting them on carts and we're doing things like that. That's happening already around there. Those are things that that when we get above 90%, which this is, those are little kind of relief valves that we have as we go throughout. When we get to that 27 28, those are we're going to start to run out of those. And then that's where you'll start to, you know, you'll you'll start to feel um the the the schools will feel the pressure. You know, you're going to have two FIED teachers teaching in a similar spot. you're going to have you're going to be talking about your computer lab not being an actual room but being you know on a cart and being pushed into spaces things like that those are that's where we're going to be at at that point >> so what I'm trying to say is that there is obviously a great urgency for elementary level than the middle school right >> would I be right in saying that okay >> absolutely >> um I don't know if this data has anything to do with the boundary changes I know when we discussed the boundary changes one of the requirements was to make sure that it helped reduce class sizes. Is that going to happen or is that this data this information already accounts for that? I I don't know if it helped reduce class sizes. It allowed for classrooms in areas where we were going to we were planning for growth that they would have additional classrooms. >> Okay. um you know there are schools on the west and to the north that there are a classroom that's we're we're calling a flex room right now and that is 100% designed as as we see this enrollment come those are rooms that we can push into we can do you know if we needed to add another section things like that those are we can do that I mean we it doesn't work well to do that during the school year but it does work well is as is if you're taking intervention and you're moving, you know, a group of students in there for additional help or things like that because your class sizes have gotten to that larger size. >> And then the final question I have has has to do with budgets and costs and everything. So when you build new schools, obviously the capacity the the enrollment is not going to be obviously anywhere near the capacity, right? you're going to slowly start building unless you you make major transfers from already overloaded schools then take those kids and put them in the new schools. You can adjust all those but eventually I think the enrollment and maybe I'm wrong enrollment number revenue will be relatively less than the fixed costs for that for those buildings for example right the utilities the classroom furniture all those things that we already paid for you know inventory all those those costs will will be there they will not go away so will have you considered that that effect on the budget itself? >> Yes. I mean in terms of all the needs are going to do as we plan for the number of students and what their needs are going to be from furniture to technology, >> right? >> And operating? Yes. All of those are factor into the budget as we move forward. >> Okay. And you you are comfortable that the the budget will not be very skewed or it'll not be way out of whack. >> Yeah. Yes. Um we we do a lot the schools right between Wald and Krauss Anderson. So a lot of it is based on history. Okay. >> Um there's a lot of stats and information out there on um whether it's a cost of building or how much furniture does a typical student cost, right? Like number of students that go to the building. Same with technology needs and that lot of information. And again also review by the Minnesota Department of Ed that reviews hundreds of these over the years to help check So, >> all right. >> I might just add too that all these questions were the same ones that came up when we built Meadow Ridge and when we built Northwoods. There's always a concern. You know, if you build it, will they come? Well, they did. >> And when we opened Metal Ridge before, well, before it opened, we started adding on because we could see that the number of students that were going to be uh coming to that building exceeded the original capacity. And then we learned from that when we built Northwoods. We built the full size just as Meadow Ridge is. I think we opened Meadow Ridge or Northwoods with I don't know maybe 500 students. John, you might recall uh looking back historically. I think there's 850 or 900 there currently. Same at Meadow Ridge. So those are two buildings that did not exist until the fall of 2015. and we have 1,700 I suppose more kids because I think the other buildings are probably pretty much the same. So these are all great questions. Valentina's questions about the concern for overbuilding. I think that's part of what the review and comment process is for as a state, you know, really vets the proposal and the plan to minimize the chances for school districts to overbuild and have those and and that has happened. Not very often, I don't think, but new building is built and then the students don't materialize and they don't open it in the first year, which that's not where we want to be. Uh we're trying to hit the sweet spot here of uh you know the waiting game to see if they come but it takes four years maybe to get a three to four years to get a school and then you're in the position to do like we've done because really class sizes are limited either by financing and funding availability or facility limitations. And we've had uh kindergarten classrooms at Central Middle School and and from Birch View and from Plymouth Creek over the years. We've had uh we've leased space for uh utilization for some classrooms. So leasing space is never really a very good investment I don't think for public school districts. So we're trying to figure out that sweet spot. That's what this process has been up to this point really. John Hunik and W with Krauss Anderson and W architects and engineers earlier to be responsive to what we're seeing as our needs in regard to funding the building once they open. That's more our our thing to make sure that we have that figured out. And uh there's never maximum efficiency in those first years when you open a new building, especially if you're, you know, you're under capacity to some degree, but you grow into it. And if you don't have that space, if we didn't have Northwoods and Metal Ridge now, I have no idea what we'd be doing. We'd have kids. >> That was exactly my question. Actually, the last part that you said was my question. Not I'm not concerned about growing to capacity eventually. What happens in the first few years when let's say that that school has a capacity of 2,000 students. Just throwing numbers out there. You can't get 2,000 on the first day, right? You'll have 200, 300 in the first year, maybe 300 more. So the first few years you are basically fighting the loss of revenue so to speak because you don't have 2,000 students versus the cost and the expenses that are fixed. Right? So that's something that I I I I think needs to be looked at. I'm sure you did. So >> yeah, we'll be Yeah, we'll be studying that too. And remember part of it is central will be right sizing also. So you already there's going to be students a lot of them moving right away besides your growth. >> So like yes >> and and I think it's important to remember that Metal Ridge actually opened up over capacity and so like and we had these same conversations will be able we be able to build this elementary and then when it opened it was over capacity. Um it takes 2 to 3 years to build a building if you're not doing that. And what we know is it takes a lot less time to build a house than a building. And so once the um referendum pass and we know this from experience once the referendum passes people start signing purchase agreements on the land that's available around that. So the numbers that we see at the moment like right now um there's not a bird in the hand which is a w which is a school. Once we see that and we build the building for two to three years we're going to see a lot of change in our community. At least that's what history has taught us. >> That's very true. I was also going to add and that's another reason you did three or four um studies enrollment studies right you did and you took the average in fact I think Hazel did two if I remember right she did one a while ago so hence you're doing that and and birth rates are down a little bit but that's a trend that's not a norm right if you look over the history in 50 years to 100 years it's it's a trend uh and I agree once you start building the outcome and in a community in a district like Wasetta public schools. It's you've proved that already time and time again. So, >> okay. But she also can I uh she als um Hazel also pointed out that K25 uh growth used to be driving uh 61% from 2014 2000 to 2020 but then the enrollment went down to 20 uh 3% in the years from 2020 to 2025 as if right Now she was saying that it is 10.7%. So it used to be that elementary was uh driving force so to speak. It was going from 61% to 23% right now to 10.7. That is where my uneasiness is coming. I'm not against but at the same time I want I don't want to be responsible uh for saying yes and then taking that responsibility. One more thing can it be uh done since look like middle school building is need to be uh I mean look I mean looking at data can it be that middle school building built and you use part of the middle school as an elementary and see how things will come to fruition if they'll come. maybe not three four years you're already building right next not far away elementary building and then um financially at least we're not asking people to pay for item which might not come to fruition Valentino I think the short answer is yes I but I think you do it a little bit different in terms of I think you build a middle school and an elementary school it's just what's your what are your student capacities at both those buildings right like we've not talked about what is the elementary capacity building that we would build or the middle school building that we would build. If it's 800 each, that's 1,600 students. If you look at it and say, "No, 1,600 students for that K through eight growth, that's too high." Then you build them at 600 and 600. You know what I mean? I don't know that you build one building and then split its identity to an elementary middle school or if you just build something that's for this capacity at K through8. I think we're saying the same thing just in a in a different way. I think we have to to your point October one we will get what our current enrollment is for this year. will have a lot higher level of confidence with that and then it'll be where is our growth in terms of that is it because there there will be some at the elementary level I mean I think our chart does show there is some growth that we have to or some enrollment that we have to accommodate at the elementary level and there's some at the middle school but what is that total what is that total growth that we have to accommodate at those two levels >> I'm curious this uh last time when uh we listened to numbers with enrollment looks like elementary numbers didn't come to fruition listen within I think at two weeks ago the numbers are better right now for elementary yes we're seeing we're seeing growth and one thing to keep in mind too is that although birth rates might be down a lot of the students that enroll in Weisetta are migrating in so they weren't necessarily born in Minnesota were even in the country and they're moving here into the district. Um, as of this morning or this afternoon, we are at 58.45 for elementary, which is up since the beginning of June, July. We are growing every week. Um, not going to do the the quick math here, but that is up even I know from the end of last week actually. So, we are seeing the growth there. We're seeing it at all levels right now though. >> Thank you. I would just say I think all these are really good questions and we don't want to overbuild either. So, we're, you know, going to be working the numbers really carefully here in the coming weeks and months. And again, we're trying to thread the needle here on trying to not overbuild, but also be caught off guard and have way more students than we can accommodate because we only have so many classrooms and and uh even leasing facilities is just not a great investment because you end up remodeling and doing a lot of things for a short term. uh that utilizes resources that we could use toward uh school facilities that will serve us for a long time. So, there's a lot of steps and a lot of mileage to be covered yet before we get to uh any decision making. And I will just say that I think the engagement and the the presentation, the questions were really helpful because we're hearing from you kind of at the first swing through um the highlevel concepts. what are the types of questions that come up? So, I think it was a really good representative sample for us to pay attention to that we can use as we uh continue to move forward and and uh try to arrive at the best possible package and set of facility responses that we can do. We appreciate the time tonight. >> Okay. All right. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Yes. >> Thank you. >> All right. The next item on the agenda under board reports is the community relations committee report. Committee chair direct uh director Dan Janestra will pro uh will present an update on a board initiative for community listening sessions. Dan. >> Yes sir. Thank you so much Melind members of the board and guests in the audience as well as administration. The community relations committee met April, excuse me, July 18th to talk about the merits of school board listening sessions. This was in response to, I think, a real profound desire from folks in the community to engage with the school board more. And in hearing feedback as well as research from administration, the committee community relations is bringing this topic to the full board for discussion. I will read out a framework for what schoolboard listening sessions could look like in just a moment. Schoolboard listening sessions are in alignment with board policies 902 and 905 and authorized by policy 212. This is not a formal proposal but instead a framework for further schoolboard engagement with constituents pending board members feedback. So I'll start just by introducing the purpose. The purpose is to provide board and community members the ability to ga engage on governance issues and grant the board greater understanding of constituent interests. This was in response to feedback from administration who I think shared a concern that the board may slip into management. Um should we not state very plainly and very clearly that the board would only be engaging individuals on governance related topics? What board members one or more may invite audience opportunity to address the schoolboard speakers discussing governance topics to a listening session after the work session. Emphasis on after the work session due to feedback from administration who shared that a lot goes into setting up these board meetings and as a committee we wanted to reflect the um time and uh setup needs of our administrative colleagues. And so we recommend as part of this framework that these listening sessions should they go into effect occur after the work session. Why? To accommodate the listening only nature of the audience opportunity to address the school board as well as the school board's uh non-attendance of previous community listening sessions. Um I will add this is in response to a desire from board members to be able to ask questions of audience opportunity address school board speakers. um as well as you know previous listening sessions where the board did not attend. An example of this being the um task force um talked about earlier with the boundary uh area redraw attendance and recording. The meeting will be posted. This is to reflect the fact that a quorum may of the board may or may not show up or attend. Board members not asking questions or seeking further understanding will still be encouraged to attend. A quorum will not be required. The meeting will be recorded via audio to ensure transparency and accountability. It will not be a filmed. Disclaimer. We think it's really important to emphasize that u while we may be seeking an audience with the audience opportunity to address the school board speakers. Um this is not a guarantee of action or a guarantee for um you know some response to a constituent need. Instead, it is us acting as a school board to ask questions, provide information as well as seek a further understanding of speaker's needs in terms of governance. So, it is not a promise from the board or administration. And lastly, to place a time limit uh outlined in the policies mentioned below um is the authority of the school board to place proper time, place, and manner restrictions. Um one of those is an ask that it not exceed 30 minutes. Uh we think this is to respect everyone's time and be mindful of our audience as well as potential speakers. So I will now turn things over to my colleagues on the community relations committee just to maybe sum up some things that um I may not have uh addressed as well as provide some of their own thoughts or feedback. >> You want me to go first Dan or Par? Okay. So thank you. Thank you for that u presentation Dan. Um, so I'm going to read out this was distributed to the community itself and Amy Parnell and Chase was in on the in that meeting as well. So why do we need community listening sessions with the school board? Number one, they build trust and transparency. Number two, they promote equity and inclusion. Three, inform better decision making. Number four, they strengthen community relationships. Five, increase engagement and support from the community. Number six, provide direct avenue for community to share their perspectives, concerns, and suggestions. Number seven, helps district set goals and priorities, key components of the strategic road map. Number eight, builds a culture of continuous improvement. I think this is very important. And this is something that uh that comes from the fact that this in marketing terms is a pull marketing. It is not push. We are not trying to come up with something and ask the community to give feedback like the you know task force or when we did the district boundary changes. This is something that the community has in mind and they want to bring it to us. That is what is referred to as pull marketing. This is what we want. We want the community to come to us and tell us what they think is important. I will give an example. Three years ago u I think it was Heidi another former board member Jesus and myself which who met with a group from a uh from from the community called the healthy foods healthy habits Facebook group. So four representatives came and spoke to us and told us what they think should happen with the kids eating habits etc. A lot of different things were discussed and I think some of them were adopted and so that is some of the that is something that is very important. We improve continuously based on the community feedback. Number nine fosters a sense of shared responsibility. Okay. Number 10 ensures that community voices are heard. So what are the policies that that support this endeavor? I'm not going to read the whole policy, but just name the number. Policy 212 2D. The school board may schedule a special work session or a special listening session where the primary purpose is to hear feedback from the public on a specific topic. Policy 902, stakeholder engagement policy. This policy establishes the expectations of the administration, superintendent, and school board to incorporate stakeholder engagement in decision-making processes. And policy 905, community involvement in decision-m to emphasize the importance of providing community members with a variety of ways and opportunities to share input on issues related to the district and its schools. A couple of examples that come to mind uh where the community many members come here and speak at the public you know uh during the board meetings during those three minutes I've heard members community members come here and talk about class sizes I I don't know of any time that we have invited some of them and discuss that with them and see what their concern is right um the the healthy foods healthy habits is exam example is a good one. There are there are there's a community member that came here and spoke about solar panels. Inviting them to come and talk to us where we can ask questions. There's a back and forth I think is very important. Now, this is not something that will happen every time, every month, you know, it may not happen for several months. If there's a board member, if I understood you correctly, Dan, if there's a board member that has a question about something that somebody said at the podium um about an issue, then the board member can ask for a meeting where all board members can meet with with the community members that brought up that issue or that individual, you know, only that board member can meet with them. It doesn't matter as long as we give the community the opportunity to talk to us. We want to listen and this is how we plan. This is how the policy says we should be planning. So I think I think this is a very crucial uh step that we need to take as a board and uh and like Dan said I'm not in favor of going from a governance lane to management lane. School building construction is management issue. They will provide us the details to add us the data and then we will you know vote on that right that is not something that I think community listening sessions would be important for. Maybe they will provide feedback and if we think that community should come and talk to us about that then we will obviously give them time. So thank you Dan. Yeah. And so Dan Milin, you covered most of my thoughts. Again, the key items that I want to hit is again not all topics will be brought forward. So if anyone wants to present any specific topic in these forums, we still need to assess and make sure if that's the right topic to be brought forward. Is this in strategic alignment with our school district? Right? So again it's not just open for all but again it has to have that strategic alliance. Um we also talked about setting up the right expectations upfront with presenters and so on. Right. So and most importantly other than the extra 30 minutes after work session when we talk through how to operationalize as an example right we are aligning ourselves with most of our meetings and cadence and all of it. So we're not going to create a whole new cadence and whole new approval process nothing like it really we are asking for additional 30 minutes of you know board members time whoever can attend and then sort of institutionalize that process into our current cadence and that is possible we talked through a few options. So again, net net we're not necessarily adding any major overheads on board members other than requesting 30 minutes of you know everybody's time maybe once a month whoever can attend. There has to be clear expectations set up guidelines set up on what topics what to present no commitments and again we will not step into any operational or administrative role. It is literally just learning more about the topic, having the dialogue, get feedback from administration, rest of the board and again at the end of the day if we feel this is something worth taking forward then yes otherwise we're not going to take any action. So again it's not commitment of any sort just because somebody's coming and presenting the topic but it gives opportunity. And one last thing again we've seen this over and over again in different committees. Our community pool is extremely talented district. So again there are individuals in their own expertise areas right call it facilities call it technology call it teaching and learning AI. I think there are a lot of things that community members can bring forward and I think we can't expect one person to be expert you know in all areas. So I think it's a good forum to at least learn, understand and see what can be applied. So that opens up that forum as well. So again I'm fully supportive of that. >> Thank you Paris and thank you Dan. Um I'm now going to leave it open for discussion then. Right. Okay. >> I have some questions. Um, I guess I'm I'm kind of, you know, not close to the idea. I think it's an interesting idea. I've been, you know, in other school districts where listening sessions were kind of a regularly scheduled thing before a work session. Um, I I was wondering if somebody could speak more to like how would this look? If I understand correctly, somebody from the community might come during opportunity to address the board. Then if somebody on the board felt like they wanted more information, they would ask at a future work session to have a 30 minute meeting after the work session with that and invite that person in. Is that what I'm hearing or >> I let Dan answer that? Yeah. >> Yes, that is correct. >> Okay. Okay. And >> either just that person, by the way, if I'm not mistaken, either just that person or maybe a couple of people with them >> because people leave their their you know, they leave their contact information when they come and speak before us. >> Correct. >> Um I'm wondering Yeah, I think that setting expectations might be difficult, but again, I'm not opposed to the idea. I'm really just I'm trying to stay open to it. Um I'm wondering you know when you guys just discuss this in committee or like you know because this is a work session and we're we're having an opportunity as a board to discuss this also the you know SLT team is here as well like I was I guess I would like to invite you if you had any questions or comments too. I hope everybody feels absolutely >> asking about this. I'm happy to share. I am the chair of the community relations committee meeting and we were asked to have a July meeting which we don't typically have to discuss this topic and I think it's fair to say there are different perceptions of what happened at that meeting and what we might have agreed upon. I did hear the all the ideas. I tried to share some additional things to think about. Um from my perspective I'm still not real clear on on what the purpose is. I'm not clear on what problem we're trying to solve. Um, and Amy guys and I did a lot of research with other districts and it is true that some have their listening sessions before the meeting. Some are even more restrictive than us. They will require that you sign up by noon to speak at a meeting and we will let whoever comes come and speak. But it does stay listening. um we talked to I'm not sure how many maybe 25 or 30 and none of them um engage in dialogue. It is strictly listening. So this would be something different than that. It would be an outlier. And so I just wanted us to think through some of what might be unintended consequences from that in terms of you know outcomes. And I I know that you did try to address some of those thoughts that were shared at that meeting. But I do think um and when we talked about the community task force, we do have a long history of listening to our community in many ways and one is what you brought up about the food group. We did um have a separate meeting and there were board members that were included in those discussions. So I think we really try to be thoughtful and and um respond on a case-byase basis. And so sometimes it might be a series of meetings. Sometimes it might be, you know, more of a forum where we're asking, you know, a number of people to come and speak. Like if you think back to when we when we changed school start times, that was a topic of great interest. And the board was present um to listen to all of that feedback. Um as as that moved forward, um we do a number of surveys. So that allows people that are not going to come to a meeting. They maybe aren't going to schedule something with you one-on-one, but it allows them to have a voice because we do what's called a representative sample so that we are hearing from people that is kind of a cross-section of our community because it's really important. We want to know what all people are thinking. And then I know as board members, people are reaching out to you by email and phone and um a number of different ways. And you know, I'm sure maybe you're having coffee with people in the community and hearing their concerns. So, I just think there's a number of of different ways to do this. Um, and if this is something, you know, I guess I'm also not clear if this is something that's a collaboration between administration and the board or if it is board driven. Um, what would our role be? What would your role be? I think there's additional things that need to be thought through. even um I know originally you talked about before a work session and then after um but we have staff that would have to be here to record and I that's one example of something that we haven't thought through. So I guess my my hope or recommendation would be that we could slow this down and have some additional conversations and really be clear about who's responsible for which pieces. um you know and possibly in hopes of bringing this to your December organizational meeting and have it be you know if it is something you want to move forward with. Um it's just I I can only speak for my team and Amy, but this will be a really really busy fall if we move forward with this referendum. Um so I'm just I'm just asking for consideration of some additional time. Thank you. >> Okay. May I May I respond to Amy? Um, so you brought up the example of school start times. That was the one I was referring to as push marketing. This is something that the administration came up with. That idea was the administration's idea to change school start times and then you went out and got community feedback. That's not the kind of community listening sessions we are talking about. We are talking about them coming up with issues like class sizes. They want to look at class sizes. Okay? They want to look at solar panels. Uh the ideas that they come up to us with that that obviously in marketing terms is referred to as pull marketing. We want them to come to us with ideas and this could be one of the several ways that other districts are doing, right? You know, you said, you know, and even us, right? Email emailing us, texting us, calling us, going for coffee. This is another one another additional avenue for us to meet with them talk to them. Um I don't know if we are making making this such a big deal. It it should not be. I don't know if there is so much involved in this. First of all, I don't think it's going to happen every month. Okay. It's very unlikely. And uh if a board member has a question about what was said at the at the at the podium by a community member then I think it is it is it is important for the board and especially that member to listen to what they have to say and get get an understanding and sure it'll be a listening session but to clarify there might be some questions asked no commitment no guarantees Right. And to listen to the community is all we are asking for. And I think I think I'm very supportive of that idea. >> If if I might speak as um executive director right now, the longest sitting one and um this has not been brought to our strategic leadership team and so I don't want to pretend to to speak on behalf of that team. um but because it hasn't been um there are huge implications or potential implications to all of our departments and I think it would be really important to to hear that feedback and value that feedback from your leadership team so that it is something um when I heard I really appreciated um Director Sahony your list of um reasons for this and things like trust and transparency and equity and in in decisionm and engagement with community and a culture of continuous improvement. I think everything that you stated were all goals that um we have as a school district and we definitely want to lean into. So, so with that in mind in a culture of continuous improvement, it's always important that we collaborate on things that we make decisions around and so that they're done collectively for the best interest of the district. We certainly all share that goal. And so I too on behalf of the SLT members um would ask that we have an opportunity to just slow it down a little bit and have a conversation about what this might look like, how could it look like, who's gatekeeping the topics, who has to be at those topics, if if you know, let's use the food people. um one is that something then that we would want our food department here to hear and be able to provide context and and so I just there's just so many things here not quite worked out and that's just not been what makes Weisetta great is we're very intentional in our decision making. We're very thoughtful and we we take in a lot of perspective so that it's done with us. Um, I'm concerned when our our department that is in charge of community outreach and communications has a lot of questions that we make sure that we are making these decisions in collaboration with one another. So, um, because we all want to reach those 10 10 or 11 or so. I was trying to keep up with you, Director Sahony, but you had so many good ones I couldn't I couldn't keep up. But um my hope would be that we could just slow the role a little bit and be very in intentional and strategic with this so that we have a chance to collaborate with um other leadership members. >> I let me ask a quick question then and then I'll hand it over to you. So making decisions in collaboration you know board and administration which decision are you talking about deciding to whether to have the listening sessions or about the decisions that come out of those listening sessions those obviously will not be taken by us. >> Sure. Sure. >> I I am talking about the holding of the listening sessions and just and just leaning into you know what are the expectations of members to be here? Um what is what is the cost to additional people staying longer in our tech planning? Um you said some topics could come and some couldn't. Who's gatekeeping those? Who's deciding those? That that could get sticky with it. And I think also um respectfully leaning in to leadership who does deal with family and parents and is trained in this this area. um to know that sometimes unintended consequences come from the best of intentions and we just want to make sure that in order to meet these goals that we just have some time together to wrestle that and then um make that that collective decision. So I know that would be the ask from your leadership team is just just a little bit more time to talk this through. >> Thank you. >> Well, thank you um Director Miller. I think that's exactly why we um as a committee brought this item to the board table was to get that feedback. um and to have it in an open um you know forum um so that the public knows this is something that we're taking very seriously. um your uh research for our um uh director of communication and our um administrative professional was very appreciated and reviewing it was very fascinating. And I think what I was drawn to um as perhaps a takeaway is that yes, board members can hear the data and they can hear the findings of these surveys. It is a lot different to hear those perspectives in person versus seeing it represented as a number. And so I think that's the value um that we're trying to get away from this and um and part of that process that we have been um undertaking I think as a committee is to go to the um administration um and hear all what you have to say because um while we were able to accommodate some of your feedback um there is are additional sentiments that you've shared with us that we um you now look forward to engaging on further and so I think that really stresses the virtue of having these um open forms for feedback. >> I have a couple questions and a and a bit of history. Um indeed fascinating and profound this conversation. Um first start times. Um we actually start times started from our community. It probably was when Dan was in school. Um maybe you're in elementary school so it might not have been there and it was probably when Milan's um children were in school too cuz it happened. But we had a pretty solid community group that was um interested in changing start time start times that was led by a pediatrician and some other people in the community who are still very active in our community. And the result that we came to was years of ongoing dialogue and research and investigation from from local uh state and national people to to get to that point. So it's important to understand that we've done this in the past um and we should remember that process. Words matter. Um, so my next question is, we're calling these listening sessions, but the way they're being described, they're actually dialogue sessions. Is that right? A good yes or no would be helpful with that. Is this a listening session or a dialogue session? >> Listening session. >> So, we'll just listen or will we talk and have dialogue? >> No, we'll listen and if we have questions, we'll ask questions. >> So, it's a dialogue clarification. >> I'm sorry. Please don't raise your voice at me. It sounds like a dialogue session. >> Okay. Second, um, my second question is, so it sounds like dialogue. Um my second question is so if I'm a community member and I have something important to say and I see that a listening session is posted and I decide to come and I think it's in alignment with the strategic roadmap and I ask to talk about it who will decide if my topic is the right topic and who will decide if I can talk about it because it might be really urgent and important to me and my student at that moment. So, who decides that in that posted public meeting? >> Well, thank you, Sarah. I think that's a very um important sentiment to share with us and it is something that we talked about a lot, which is, you know, are we opening the board up to stepping into management? Um and I think that will um you know definitely require board members to be at their very best and to really know what the governance lane is as well as the uh management lane and to make sure that yes if someone does come forward with a um concern a uh point of feedback that is important to their themselves or their child in the moment um that we're able to say well I think your feedback or your concern is better shared with administration than us. Yes, we do appreciate hearing from you, but um we are not um you know really tasked with being able to respond to that. Um it is not a um you know place for board members to uh you know uh add or take a vote in response to. So I hope that tends to your question. >> So So I think what I hear you saying is that you will turn me away from a posted public listening session if you decide the topic I bring to you is not what you want to talk about on at that moment. Well, I think to say that the board would be making a unilateral decision uh would not be the case. Um instead, what it would be is us being able to state because this is in whether you want to look at how the Minnesota state legislature has said it, how the Minnesota Association of School Boards, Association of Metropolitan School Bo School Districts has stated, they are very clear in their trainings, which I know you've taken apart of uh taken part of many times in your 12 years of service to our community. um that there are very clear and distinctive lanes and there is such a thing as the board stepping into management. There's also such a thing as the board staying within governance and so we are able to state that very plainly and very clearly to constituents. No, we are not turning you away. Uh we are instead asking that you have this conversation with an individual who is empowered and is able to respond to your need. >> Okay. Um my next question is um talk to me about some logistics. We heard we talked for almost two hours tonight about our referendum coming up and the timeline that we have and the work that the administration and the community and all the things that are doing. And so um how are these listening sessions going to um interact with all the things that we're doing to get ready for a referendum and how and I'm and I'm super curious about how that will then engage our staff who are working um on that referendum too. How do we see those things in that and that and what we're trying to do to get the referendum passed? How will those work together? >> To put it simply, it comes down to building trust in the community. Um, we have a well uh qualified uh very high achieving administrative staff um who have engaged the public and plan to do so. And I think it's important to emphasize that the school board also has to make a decision by deadline uh November 25th whether or not we're going to do this. We also have to make a decision uh in January on the language and wording. There are going to be multiple occasions throughout this referendum process that we as a board weigh in. And so to hear those constituent sentiments uh is going to be very valuable and I think um it would be well intended for us to hear them firsthand um as well as to understand that while we may hear some concerns sometimes um we look at the overall frequency that people come to address the school board, it's not at every meeting. Um, but yes, it does step up when big issues come to our table. So, I think it's, you know, really up to us as board members to affirm why we ran for the school board in the first place, which is to tend to the people's business and say with a conclusive voice that we are available and we are here to immerse ourselves in the community and the people we serve. >> I don't think you understood my question, which was about staff time and what they're doing with that. And I guess I would just say my last question or my last nope, I'm going to finish. Um, my last statement would be that I would like to hear the numbers from Trevor about like what that would be or from the thing about how much that would cost as we think about additional staff time for staying and the amount of time that it would cost for a record because I do think we pay our helpers that help to record this and run this through. So, let's just see what the fiscal impact is as well. >> Thank you, Sarah. Those are numbers I would look forward to hearing as well. Thank you. >> Oh, can I can I hold on one second? Let me answer Sarah's question about the referendum. If there is redundancy, I would think that we would not have a community member come and talk to us in a parallel lane about that thing. So referendum is probably out of the question. That is not something we would ask somebody to come and talk about at a listening session. These are things that are not being done or conducted or being looked at by the administration already. Administration has ways to find out from the community about how they feel because they have surveys. They have uh these task forces and all that. We are talking about issues and concerns that have not been brought up before but they will definitely not overlap with what's going on. Okay. I think again I think my question was about staff time, but that's okay. We don't have to talk about this more. I'm thinking about our administrators staying here for that and the number of other things that we have to do given that we have a referendum coming up. But I've taken way too much of the time with my questions. So I will yield the floor to Heidi. >> Okay. >> Thank you. Um, so I have a question about what our current practice is because if if I remember when I first started the practice was that if we had somebody come to the audience opportunity to speak, they were followed up with. That's the reason that they were they were giving us their phone number, their email or whatnot, so that we had an opportunity to follow up with them. And if it was, you know, an a management issue, it would get funneled to the right person in the admin. And if it was a schoolboard issue, it would get funneled to the chair of the board. And so I'm wondering if something changed and why we haven't been leaning into that as a process. Thank you, Heidi, for sharing those feedback points. Um, I think that is something for us to discuss as we engage the opinions of the SLT. um as well as deciding the future of this item um going forward. Thank you. >> So after hearing uh you know this discussion which thank you for the discussion. I do think that we don't have a lot of opportunity as a board and SLT to talk about these things. So I understand why it was brought tonight. Um, I'm I guess I'm not fully on board with everything as it has been described only because I do worry that like this seems more like a question of procedure than anything. Like there are ways for us to have meetings now currently or at least that was the practice before I got on the board. if there was a meeting with the healthy food and habits group and if there was a meeting with people who were talking about you know school times um changing. So I'm wondering do we need do we need something like more regularly scheduled? It sounds like you're kind of not doing that anyway. So that we could, you know, kind of play it by ear if there's a person on the board who would like to discuss something further or would like to provide, you know, to to have a listening session. And I have heard of listening sessions and I've attended listening sessions before where the board members have asked questions and that's just the term that's used. Um, but in general it's not expected that there will be like a whole lot of, you know, because you don't want to start arguing with people from the community and and so I think setting the expectation that you could ask questions to get more information. Sorry, I'm kind of I have a lot of thoughts so it's hard for me to keep everything straight that I wanted to say. Um I'm wondering if to you know move forward with this use the options that we have available already and and if there's you know because of the referendum I don't know if the district was planning to have a big um you know information session for that anyway or if if a board member feels like they want to have something else you know with less people or people who have come to speak that that could be requested as well. Um because our policy does allow it and I don't I guess I don't know what we're trying to change here. Final thought, I don't the listening sessions that I've been to before, we did not record them. It was it was a very more um it was just a more informal, you know, meeting. And I I don't know why we would want to record them. And that might also help with not having staff have to be there to do the recording. Um, and I don't know that we would need SLT there either if it's just, you know, just a listening session for board members. My thoughts. Can I >> I was going to um respond briefly to what Sheila said. Um I think in many ways you summed up what our intent is is really just to um exercise the um language of policy 212. Um this is not the addition of a program. This is not a formal proposal uh but instead just a framework of how we um you know utilize language that already exists um and uh incorporate into how we um fulfill our responsibility to the community. >> Yeah. And I think there is more to how we actually operationalize it, right? Looking into cost, looking into SLT time. Again, at the end of the day, collectively, board and administration feels that, hey, we don't need to record these, right? That's totally fine. Again, those were the ideas that were discussed. We just wanted to bring it up to this group and have that further dialogue. So, nothing has been finalized. It's not like, oh, we listed down everything. It's it's an open forum right again at the end of the day the idea is oh we have to have SRTs we have to record if we don't do these two things then these are not meaningful and oh by the way these two will add substantial cost right if we get to that maybe we may not want to do it and use some of the existing cadences right but we just don't know enough and again that's where we wanted to bring it up to everyone's attention have the dialogue again Dana to your point we wanted to get you know your inputs all of SRT inputs and see what the best way to accommodate and Sheila to your point if this is something was informal again that's probably we were looking at making it formal rather than keeping informal I personally did not know and that's probably bad on my part I should know but I did know right and again I'm thinking from community standpoint so once I let everybody know that hey there is this option open maybe there are more they'll come up and talk about it Again, not the tactical issues because that will have to direct but anything strategic, right? Sustainable energy, AI in education, pick a topic, right? Those were the type of things that at least I had in mind that I was expecting community to bring it up and make us better as a school district, not to like get into tactical things which administration handles on day-to-day basis. >> So, I have some closing thoughts. Um I hope that the committee uh community relations committee will take to heart that we lean into our strategic roadmap map when it comes to efficiency and effectiveness. Um I think efficiency is is going to be really key as we are faced with funding issues and so we have to be really careful about all the things that we you know are are are jumping into. um we just went through a process where we asked admin to um formalize school visits and whatnot. And so, you know, asking too many new initiatives can put a burden on things. And I think we really need to be careful about how much we're asking all at once. That's number one. Um, I think we we can also gain a lot of benefit from taking a step back, slowing down, and especially when our admin is asking for some time to work things out. Um, this is the board and admin relationship and partnership is absolutely the number one most important thing to this district. and our students will feel it and they will feel the giant impact if we start veering away from that when our admin is asking for time and a little breather to work through things. I think we need to listen. Thank you. >> Let me say a few things here. There is no intent here to have a strain relationship with the admin and the board. But I am not hearing or I have not you know had any evidence of how this is going to disrupt what we are doing or how why it is going to be expensive why we cannot do it uh if it is something not really on a regular basis this is something that I think I'm very very passionate about I will I will in I will want this to move forward as as listening sessions that are you know asked for the board by the board initiated by the board. So I'm not seeing agreement anywhere. So so I I don't know I don't know what what to do. Maybe maybe we need to >> if somebody wants to do a listening session we have it in our policy. I would say ask for one. >> Yes. If it was that yes if it was that easy we would not even bring this up. I have a recommendation. I think that we as a board need to do a study session on the policies that are currently in place and understand them fully with potentially a moderator who can help us through them because as I read them, I see something different than I think everybody else is seeing or reading. And so I think it's important for us to have time and bandwidth to discuss that. and then I think we could bring it back at our organizational work session in December because this is something that's really a board initiative. And so I don't see the urgency in getting it in place. Um I think we can we can set up a schedule. We can get that in because we had been talking um in board development on topics for things that we can train our board on. I think this could be this could take place of one of those issues and and go from there once we have a further discussion and have some feedback from our administration. Give them an opportunity to really think this through and then potentially look at where it goes from there. That would be my recommendation. >> I'll maybe just share if I may. Go ahead. >> No, Valentine has something to say. Go ahead. Um I don't know hearing the discussion and I appreciate the input from the board members and also my team members here tonight. Um this is something that clearly needs some definition. I don't think there's any consensus on how to best move forward. From the way I would see it, I think we do have a lot of ways that we collect feedback currently from our constituents in our community. Does that mean there aren't new opportunities to do so? No, I don't think so. Um, and I think from my perspective, what we would be looking for is something that could be complimentary to what we're already doing and not uh a duplication of what's already occurring and um, you know, encouraging our community to always feel free to reach out, which I think they do feel free to reach out to principles, their teachers. They find me fairly easily. um our directors and executive directors I think are uh pretty well connected and questions will either come directly to them or indirectly through principles or other staff within the community. So, I think we do have a lot of ways that we're doing this. Um, maybe be maybe to take some time and and uh kind of streamline again defining what is it that we're hoping to accomplish. Not necessarily what problem are we trying to solve, but I mean that would be one way to look at it. If the problem is there aren't opportunities for community members to provide feedback and input, then you look for a solution. I think we do have some solutions in place for that. But can we strengthen it and find ways that uh more people are more comfortable reaching out and sharing insights? So the idea of community feedback is not a bad thing. It's not something any of us are afraid of with my team or any other staff member. It's just a matter of how do we define it and organize it so that we ensure the feedback that's coming to us actually can be helpful, not distracting and causing uh our team to create additional workloads of researching and prepping for uh new topics that come forward from um individuals or possibly small groups of individuals that command a large degree of time when there already is pretty heavy workload. So I think that's what we just want some time to process and and have some uh consideration for um because we are uh in the throws of getting ready for 13,000 K12 students uh showing up here next Tuesday and that's pretty heavy lift and a big endeavor and then while they're here for the next nine or 10 months that keeps us pretty busy too. So, you know, our admin team will work in partnership and uh we'll look forward to uh continuing uh our our planning and thinking in regard as to how we can best collect feedback and input from the community. So, those would be my thoughts in the moment based on what I heard here tonight. >> I decided just to listen. I'm going to spend some time actually also asking our district I understand it it's actually sort of trend nowadays for our listening sessions uh at our school boards. So others are doing it and somehow they are managing it, managing time, managing money and um but what I'm hearing I'm hearing quite a bit of uh reluctance and resistance trying to even to work through uh how do we know what kind of problems can arrive or what kind of problems can be solved if we don't know them? Uh we like as service I know some school district they have student service um teacher service um service and uh community service and they uh discuss it actually school board will know even more details we don't know and I'm hearing quite a bit of also constant remind governance management sometimes you we're not doing even governance level uh to To be honest, one of the schoolboard work is curriculum. When it was last time we discussed any curriculum, I don't remember it didn't happen. So, we're not doing governance level. As for governance versus management, there are sometimes you can be stepping out down a little bit on a management level if something is not happening. As for community, uh I I'm going to bring statistics from Hazel again, 935 students who are living in this district are choosing to go somewhere else. That is a good number. We don't know why they're choosing to go somewhere else. And as uh listening sessions, I would like to know some details like maybe you investigated more time. how does it look like? But at the same time, I can be um I think that it can be useful because and another thing is I feel like some sort of hesitancy on who knows what community will bring. It takes quite a bit of courage to um for a parent or a teacher uh to show up and speak on public. So I don't think that they're going to bring something which is which can um which is it can be very I mean not that uh valuable. I suspect as an adult they will um measure if this topic is worth bringing to uh school board. But at the same time I feel like this can give an opportunity for the community member for the teacher to speak out whatever is not was not being solved at some at even administrative level for example then at least you will know there is a problem then you'll uh discuss how this problem can can be solved. So I I'll be honest. I'm not sure why there is that much of a uh talking about and another one for me is frustrating. Let's wait till December. How long did it take took us to discuss about uh school visits? Uh in December we're going to have holidays. Okay. Christmas then. Um and when we're talking about the school year started for me it's already started today. uh it's not a surprise I suspect to anybody that school year is starting on certain day uh so and this one is not maybe there is uh some there are some people need to be present uh for running but I I'm not sure this this um price tag is worth discussing compared with uh what kind of losses we're experiencing ing when some families are not feeling that they are being heard or some uh some underlying issues were not being solved. I think that that that can be I mean if you want to discuss cost and uh when we are bringing costs um it was interesting when to be honest we had the um voting about uh moving to odd or even years it was done everything that I will not be able uh to vote and uh never mind. So we are saving how much? Uh 300 $350 on uh the meeting. So uh we would not meet on different day when we are talking about 80 on VC. At least I heard that it it cost uh $100,000. I mean let's let's let's uh let's measure them uh eloquently. I mean $350 versus uh 10 um stockish uh $100,000. Please don't bring every time is uh putting some sort of a burden on uh any some people who are trying to bring initiative immediately cost. I would like to hear then to what degree we are burdening what what is what is what are these numbers and while I'm at that I would like to hear we're supposed to be at student achievement I would like to hear some data about student achievement I'm patiently waiting I will wait a little bit more thank you >> okay thank you >> go ahead >> um did you have more remarks you wanted to Were you going to >> Did you have more remarks you wanted to make? I'm only going to speak if I'm the last person to go to sum everything up. >> Well, yeah. I I I don't have anything else to add. Uh it looks like we are divided. We This is obviously not >> Can I make a comment, please? >> Huh? >> Yes. I was going to >> All right. Uh Dave Lutz, executive director of human resources. So, uh just some feedback because it was sought from members of of SLT and our district administrators. I think echoing superintendent's comments that um collecting feedback is is something that we do all the time. It's not something that we're hesitant to do or or you know afraid of doing, etc. Um I just uh would agree that I didn't hear a lot of formation of concept, right? And so what are you going to do with the information that you get? Who's present at these meetings? Um what does that mean? If you get feedback and administrators aren't present, but they're expected to implement something as a result of that feedback, what type of situation relationship does that uh create? And so um you know, the the the through line of relationships between our board and administration is is essential. We need to be collaborative and and obviously supporting our entire district. um that relationship goes you know from our administrators and uh to our staff and and all of our uh teachers in the district which is you know felt by students etc. So um I would you know like to hear more of a formation of concept um in terms of what what purpose is this solving and how does it solve it? You know if you ask for feedback and the mechanisms aren't there to solve problems um then by asking for that feedback you can sometimes do more more harm. Um and so that's the piece that you know just in hearing the dialogue it doesn't sound like there's a complete formation of concept um that would uh again make this an effective tool that would justify the human capital that's exhausted as a result of it. Um as the the executive director of human resources we're again our our employees our our staff are pulled in many different directions. we have to make sure that that we're maximizing that resource as well. It doesn't just come down to dollars spent. Um it's a human capital conversation as well. And so um those are my comments. Thank you. >> So let let me let me let me answer that. Thank you Dave. Uh I think the assumption here is that when we have a listening session, we'll listen to the community and then immediately come back to the administration and say this has to be done. you have to spend certain number of dollars and you have to spend certain number of hours. That is not the case. If a community member brings an XYZ topic to us, we listen to them and like we would do in any other circumstance, we bring it back to you and say just see if this is feasible, right? We are still sticking to the governance lane, we are bringing ideas to you, right? That is a part of our strategic plan. that is should be a part of our road map and and I don't know I I'm hearing a lot of resistance in terms of increased workload increased cost um will will the board members go rogue you nobody said that but this is what I am sensing and that is not the case I'm pleading to you this is not the case this is something we want because I think it is good for everyone for the community, for the administration, for the board, for the students most importantly. Okay. Um, so I I I'm not sure I'm not sure I'm hearing anything that is absolutely convincing me that this is not what we should do or even hold off. >> Is there anyone from administration who'd like to provide any final comments before I Okay. Well, I want to say thank you to everyone for the really wide ranging um discussion we're able to have. um for those who are not um able to weigh and I invite you to do so. I think this is a really important uh conversation to continue having and um I think this is the perfect place to have it um to solicit the feedback of those we serve, those we work with um in that spirit of being lifelong learners and how we can best build programs um that tend to the needs of the people we serve. So, thank you so much. I am appreciative of the feedback we heard. Um and uh I believe in just what I've heard. Um you know, as a committee, we will be um in conference with uh the SLT as well as um our fellow uh board colleagues um to really put together something that we think um meets all needs um while allowing us to hear more from the people we represent. So thank you so much to everyone for their I think very well thoughtout feedback and uh sentiments they provided. >> Yeah. Yeah. I just want to say one more thing in closing. At least we got I'm happy that we got this conversation at the board table right and uh and we are talking about it now. So whether we approve this as a working or listening session or we just rely on the policies to have conversations with the community. It doesn't matter to me really as long as we we use that opportunity to talk with the community and listen to them. I think that is that is the most important thing that should not be lost. All right. Any anybody else want to make a quick comment? I just uh want to say thank you very much for bringing some initiatives, some uh new uh thinking because things are changing and my my understanding also that uh this school board used to have something similar. Am I right? >> I have no idea. >> We have a number of reason we've had listening sessions. Yes, the schoolboard has had a number of listening sessions throughout. We've had listening sessions around topics. We've had listening sessions around to help us inform decision- making. We've had listening sessions just in general around as we do um that we used to sort of call it the um it was the Westerm Anderson show as we were going around talking about our facilities and all the things that we were doing. And so, um, I guess I will affirm that yes, the the history of the Wise School Board is to work in collaboration with the administration and to reach out to the community to make sure that we, um, welcome all voices and share information and listen to the feedback. >> Right. Okay. I think that that completes our work session for this evening. We will take a short 10-minut break and reconvene for the closed board meeting. 10 minutes should be enough, right, Amy? Okay. Thank you. The time is now 6:20. The Wisetta Public Schools Board of Education work session for Monday, August 25, August 25, 2025 is adjourned.