Welcome to the Mountain City Council. It's Tuesday, September 9th, uh 6 o'clock. Can we uh rise for the pledge of allegiance? >> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, liberty and justice for all. All right, we got our agenda, but part of the agenda, we do want to move number 10, continuation of city banners discussion. >> Uh, council member Mcin is not here, >> so and she was kind of the leader on that. So, we're going to punt that to the next meeting. >> Okay. So we'll just cross off number 10. Uh beyond that, do we have any other agenda items? Okay. >> Nope. >> All right. So we got our agenda with taking off number 10. Uh does can I get a motion to approve the agenda? I'll make a motion to approve the agenda. Um removing item number 10. >> Okay. I got a motion. Can I get a second? >> Second. >> All right. Any discussion? >> All those in favor, please say I. >> I. >> I. >> I. >> Those opposed. All right. That's our agenda. And we got our consent agenda. Does someone want to go through those three items? I can rattle those off. Okay. Um just A through C. Um consent agenda. Item A, approve payment of claims. Item B, approve minutes from the August 26th city council regular meeting. And C, approve resolution 2574, approving expansion permit at 1765 Jones Lane, U planning case 25-10. >> All right, we got our consent agenda. Does anybody want to pull any of those or talk about any of them? >> All right, hearing none. Can I get a motion to approve the consent agenda? I make a motion to approve the consent agenda. >> I got a motion. Can I get a second? >> Second. >> Okay. Roll call, please. >> Council member Herro. >> I. >> Council member Pew. >> I. >> Council member Castellano. >> Hi. >> Mayor Holt. >> I. All right. So, if you're here for any of those three items, that is passed. Uh, number five, we got comments and suggestions from anybody present where the item is not on the agenda. You want to come up? you give us uh your name and address and give you three minutes. >> Hey, how are you? >> Good. >> Hello everybody. Hi again. My name is Johan Shuma Danielson. I reside at 6039 Beachwood Road in M. Um I came to you guys uh two weeks ago regarding the fiber optics installation and m Mr. Hold you contact you told the city manager to look into um what could be done. Um so I've tried to reach to you um but apparently it didn't go through. Do you get my emails? >> No. >> Okay. >> Darn. We've been having a a conversation between mutant and death. Sorry about that. Could you expand on on the email just roughly? >> Well, I think the request was to attempt to have the various uh cable companies use the same conduit and >> ultimately they're putting in different equipment and we can't really force them to use the same conduit. Um, I did have a comment, not to throw him under the bus, but I did have a comment from the city engineer in there, too, though. I think that essentially what your comment was, right? >> One more time, >> regarding um having different cable companies and fiber companies use the same equipment to cut down on resources basically. >> Yeah. They're they're not actually in like each one owns their own conduit and they're responsible for that and they're they're basically big enough for their own wires. They're not sharing like the internet isn't being shared between different cable companies. >> Okay. So So then my comments still stand about them putting their cable in the same location, not deciding to wrap my house around with cables. Like they've already done the work and putting in between. So, the way my block is organized, it makes sense to put it where the where the power line is. I've already petitioned all the neighbors and they're all in agreement that they don't want their front yard dug up. Um, so I'm also reaching to you because I've been trying to reach those guys at Miko and they're playing dead. So, I have the impression that they're waiting that the deed be done and being me being faced with the fact that, well, that's done. No, you can't complain anymore. And to put it mighty, that really makes me irate. Um um so I'd like to know what what you guys can do to contact those people because I've called them numerous time. They never returned a call. They returned the call once after one week of pestering them. And the person said Steven's uh something said that he would respond within a day or the next day. Never responded. Tried to reach him all week last week. Didn't respond at all. So I'm really at my wits end about what's what's to do. Well, we can certainly contact them. Um, I I would say our public works guys have pretty good working relationship right now. Um, so you thought it was Steven. Maybe >> Stevens. I don't remember his last name, but Dustin gave me his email address. So I I called him and I emailed him and um Stevens did not >> We can We'll call him. >> Did not respond. >> Okay. So you talked to Dustin. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> So >> thank you. I appreciate it. Can you connect them together so at least he can talk with them? >> Yeah. >> I think your answer from both of you is we're not going to be able to combine utilities into one thing. >> Um at the same point we understand I mean you saw my front yard. >> Yeah. >> Right. It it looks like hell, right? >> For real. It does. It does. and they they put, you know, I I have, you know, a weed company that comes and does that one spot that they screwed up is weedy now. And so now I got to spend time and energy and we're getting other emails um from from other residents that, you know, they're supposed to put it back kind of how they had it >> as good or better. >> Yeah. And I got to complain more then >> cuz like I'm I'm going to have to go down to the hardware store and pick up some seeds and sit out there and water, you know, do my, you know, just like everybody else, right? >> Mhm. >> So I mean, you see it, you go by there every day. >> Yeah. >> Um but yeah, combining. So that's So now that's that was Frontier that came into my front yard and screwed up my mediacom line. >> It was out internet for two weeks. Seriously. And then now we just approved another company that Miko to come to town and then they're going to put in lines too, >> right? So >> because then I'm wondering well MCO is there and then media is going to wake up during oh we need we need fiber is it going to be yet again another digging and wrapping the house and >> yeah and that's the other thing too is like we did hear for years that people wanted more options, right? So here's here's the way to get your options. Unfortunately there's some disruptions to get the options. >> Yeah. like we had why did we only have two options in our town? Yeah. Well, now we have three or you know more. Um comes with a little >> But in my yard there like the front yard is I saw your yard. Yeah. >> So I'm I'm really concerned about my yard. It means like they're going to trash all my flowers like years of working down the rain, >> right? >> And then I know they're going to have to dig cuz I when I talked to the person he explained that they'll have to dig each time there's a connection. So there's the gas line and there's the water line. So, it's like at least digging twice >> plus the trench plus whatever they're going to put that I don't know. Is it going to be like one of those ugly mini boxes in front? >> Yeah, it'll be on the ground in my front yard. Yeah. >> And then and then my stuff is sloped. So, how are they going to do it? And then then there's I got two trees. So, what's going to happen with those trees if they dig and they kill the tree? I mean, who's going to pay for that? So part of the problem that you don't want to hear is you don't own that couple feet, right? Just like I don't own the part where the weeds are. Unfortunately, I got to take care of it, right? >> But if the tree dies, who won't then owns the tree? The city. >> But I'm just saying like you you take care of your yard all the way up to the street. You got these flowers and >> you got kind of a natural garden, right? All the way to the street. >> Not everybody does that. you know, maybe they'll they'll they'll shield it and put in um >> so I I do I do think that they're gonna >> if they put in a box in yours, it's going to be some disruption. >> And then that's why I want them to go in the in the easement in the back where Frontier went through >> because it makes sense. I mean, it serves all the properties plus everybody's connecting from the back with their internet. They don't connect from the front. They go connect from the back. >> If again, I that's why we're going to try to connect you. If we can be less disruptive and that works, great. Let's do it. >> I wouldn't I'd just be prepared because everybody else is front yard. >> I understand. >> Just so you know. But I do know and you know cuz you drove by. >> Sarah, you may know, but what's that? Is it 15 ft is the rightway that >> No, 10. They vary, but I think it might be closer to 10 there. >> It's like from the center of the road. >> Yeah, it's based on >> Oh, is that why Okay, I see what you're saying. Yeah. Okay. width of the road >> from center line back. >> So if it's it would be different if it was a 66 ft ride of way. Y >> or a 55 foot ride away. >> Some are 40. >> Yeah. Some are 40. Some are 50. >> So Johan, you know my fence that I have on the one side. >> Mhm. >> Right in between me and the other guy. >> Mhm. >> Where that fence stops is where I was allowed to go cuz I don't own the rest of it. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> The rest of it is the cities. >> It's set back, right? >> It's a setback, right? So that's why, you know, you say, so now m mine is just grass, right? And so that whole part that they disrupted was grass. Um, but that's why you can't you're not supposed to put stuff in the rightway that you don't want to get destroyed cuz >> yeah, >> you're going to unfortunately probably have that destroyed. >> But I I understand. At the same time, I mean, the city has been given them the right to put stuff, but not put any stuff. and they don't have the right to bring down the value of my property because if I have to remove my flowers and if they put an ugly crappy plastic tub in front of my yard that diminishes the value of my property also >> and again you are able to put stuff in the rightway but technically >> no but they if they put that stuff on my on on the rightway which >> ugly boxes in our front yard I mean it is what it is >> no I don't disagree it is not what it is >> I have I have a box that's now buried that thank god my lawnmower can go over cuz it's heavy enough, I guess. >> But I see what they've done on on West Edge. It's ugly to put like those ugly boxes everywhere. >> Yeah. I mean, is there something we can do about ugly boxes everywhere or is that just they're allowed to do it? >> You know, the nature of what they put in those spots really depends on what they're installing. And we've had some success requesting different shapes. I mean, I >> because Frontier did it everything underground. I mean, there's nothing that sticks out. They have, you know, the plate. >> And you're saying Midco is the one that's coming for you? >> Yeah. Then Midco is going to come again >> and they're going to be above ground. >> I I that I don't know because I'm unable to midco the boxes in my not in my yard but in Johnas's yard. They're flat. They're >> okay. Cuz mine I think mine was Frontier >> and it's the under >> Yeah. >> the buried thing. >> And they said you didn't have a choice because I talked to them too and I said, "Well, don't you usually do the thing where it sticks out?" Because I have that mine right next to it. Yeah. So why don't you just tie it to that thing? It's already there. No. Oh, now I got that and the other thing. That's just they didn't do it for me. I don't know. I talked to them and then then I complained because they ripped the hell out of my yard. I kept emailing them on my private email. >> Mhm. >> You know, not trying to get special treatment. And I was like, what are they going to do? You know, and finally I did one day I saw them in our yard in our neighborhood and I I went over to him and I said, you know, who's running the show here and come and look in my front yard. So then he came over and they said, "Yeah, we'll come and fix it in the next couple days." So, >> and then you saw how they fixed it. So, >> we'll connect you with them, but again, I'm just putting expectations. If they have to go that way, they're going to go that way. >> If there's no other option, but hopefully, yes, they can make an exception, you know, go in the back or do something else. But, >> yeah. >> No, interesting. >> We'll try. >> Not the install. But yeah, please if uh Jesse, if you can get them >> to call him tomorrow right away. >> Thanks for sending the email, Jesse. Sorry, I didn't look at I didn't see it. I will look again in my Maybe it's in my junk box somewhere. >> Yeah, I was I think I was replying to the same thread that the three of us were on, but I I can still follow you. >> Thank you. Appreciate it. Thank you guys. >> Thanks. Yeah, appreciate your time. >> All right. See you. >> Did they do your neighborhood yet? >> H >> Did they do your neighborhood yet? >> No, >> they've done mine, but but it's across the street. I didn't get to >> All my flowers are in the background. >> Yeah, you're you're right up to the line, too. >> Yeah. >> So, you're going to have an issue. >> My flowers are going to get ruined. >> Yeah. >> Corner yard in for a treat. >> All right. Anybody else want to come up? All right. Come on. >> All right. Give us your name and address. >> My name is Kim Belnick and I live at 55549 Bartlett Boulevard. And um I just wanted to um get a feel from this council on the comments that were made about selling parks um for um to generate revenue. And so um just want to be sure that I understand if that was a rogue thing that happened or if there is um discussion about that. So, we we talked about well, I guess the two of you guys brought it um in front of the council as like a workshop item. >> Okay. >> And in our and this is back in like January, February, whenever our work original workshop was. And actually, we're going to talk about that later on. Uh it's in our packet for like our uh agenda items for this year, like what we want to kind of work on this year. And so, do you have that up? I know this is a little out of order, but you know what page that is? >> Probably towards the bottom. >> The very end. >> Okay. >> The priorities. >> Yeah. >> 2368. >> 23. Okay. I think it's the first page. So, parks. This is kind of our parks workshop items that we we are coming up with. So number F or letter F >> letter F >> look into each park comma use etc. That was big picture what we're what we're thinking about um and then you know partly to that then you guys brought >> right >> you know your your thoughts on to a workshop that >> was very well well attended which is fine. everybody can come to any workshop they want. Um, and it was, yeah, yes, we do want to look into each park in in use and stuff, but I think there was some narrative that got out there that's like, oh, we're selling everything to fund a water treatment plant or, you know, and and anyway, so the last couple meetings after that, we've kind of said, okay, well, hold on. What are our actual expectations of this? And it's really to that look into the parks and the use and etc. That doesn't mean we're selling. That doesn't mean, you know, that doesn't mean we're not selling, but that doesn't mean we're not, you know, what are we going to do? >> And part of it was a workshop for us to just chat about it because we can't talk behind >> closed doors, right? We have to talk in front of people, you know, at least three of us, three more. Um, and then it was, you know, you guys brought together, uh, you know, kind of a document or whatever, and I think it whittleled it down to like eight parks or roughly eightish parks that were >> we just identified that were different variables. Yeah. >> On the list, and a couple of those were like common properties, >> which when we start getting into the dock program, that's a whole another thing that I don't want to touch, right? me personally and I think we're all kind of on the same page that we're not we don't want to go down there down that road and I think we did talk about that last >> uh meeting we were just we all kind of agreed we're not touching >> if it's a dog we're not touching it >> so then I think it's down to like three >> now look into the use and the park and whatever could it be I mean if it's just woods could it be a dog park could it be something else could we sell it could you know whatever right uh I know there's one that's in between another like two houses. That's like a park, right? >> Mhm. >> There's no indication that's a park. And now the neighbor, you know, they emailed us and said, "Don't do that. Don't sell our park." >> It looks like to everybody else in the world that it's, you know, a lot that's empty that wasn't built on. Anyway, it's it's a park, right? So, it's I think it we're down to three or four is what we're going to talk about. And then that's in the the workshop is going to be next city council meeting right before the meeting. So at 5:00 >> 23rd >> on the 23rd we're going to talk about that. >> Okay. >> Um and the thought is first of all okay if we're down to three or four what what do we want to do and what do we want to give instructions to the parks >> open spaces commission. Is that what you're talking about? >> Yeah. To you guys because you're on Kim's >> since you're on the board. >> That's right. >> What do we want you guys to look into and then come back with us with recommen. Yeah, >> at the same point, you know, if we're like, "Hey, we really want to do this or this with that, >> we we want to give you clear instructions on that." And then also, if we wanted to down the road, we could do another another joint meeting. I know you weren't you weren't part of the joint meeting. >> I wasn't in a >> I couldn't make it. >> Right. Um, and that's the first joint meeting we've had >> in years. In years, I've been on the partisan open spaces commission for a long time. >> Right. >> Well, thank you for that clarification. I really appreciate it. Um it was shocking to see and not have been um informed that that was going to be on TV because I did get a lot of questions that I couldn't answer because I didn't know what the genesis of that comment was. So um and I know that >> um you know we have to abide by guidelines and confidentiality and all those kinds of things. But to see that on TV and being a member of the parks and open spaces commission made me um it didn't build belief in this particular council. >> I will say um based on the guidelines that we're required to follow as a as a council, >> the workshop was designed to be a discussion around long-term strategy. >> And that is not a close session. and it is open for anyone else to hear in all, you know, for clarification. Um, it was unfortunate that a member of the parks commission decided to go out on their own and represent themselves in a way that made it sound like, you know, we were just going rogue and going to sell all the parks to pay for the water treatment plant. That was erroneous and she was obviously misinformed. Um, I understand she was upset about some other items. And I'm also kind of upset, Kim, that you're not aware of some of this stuff. As a member of the parks commission, as Jason said, we discussed this back in January. We also had a joint meeting. Um, we've had multiple discussions. So, I'm not really sure why you weren't informed. >> And most of discussions were about selling parks. >> They weren't about selling parks. It was about evaluating. That's my point. We are evaluating and trying to come up with a long-term strategy. As a council, we are responsible fiscally for the taxpayers's dollars. Are we actually using them in the best manner possible? You know, do we have a strategy around these parks and open spaces? We've got a lot of lots that are just grass that we're maintaining that aren't really serving a purpose. Can we repurpose them? Do we need to sell them? you know, we we don't want to just have things for no reason, you know, that are just sitting there. What what does that do for the community? What service does that provide? And that's what we're trying to get to the bottom of. Um, a lot of these properties, especially like the one that Jason was talking about, um, those were acquired through a foreclosure or for, you know, tax reasons >> and nothing's been done with it. >> And, yeah, I mean, could we do better? Definitely. But we also have to figure out a way to spend the money in the most effective way that we can. And the other part of this discussion is the fact that we don't have the manpower to provide the maintenance and upkeep on some of these places. So, can we do a better job? Can we plant native plants in one place where that's just a strip that's used to access a dock in the commons program? That would probably be a great place to plant native or you know a runoff type situation with a rain garden rather than planting native plants in the middle of a play area that become an overgrown weeded mess. Those are the type strategies that we need to discuss and that is something we have to do is in a workshop format which is what we were trying to do. Unfortunately it was the same night as the lid discussion which meant we had a packed house. Um that was unfortunate. Um, and >> well, it was unfortunate because half the people that showed up came and a lot of people left because they're like, you know, the Art Tessa, right? >> I had people from there calling me and saying, >> "I thought you were approving the commons phase two." >> Now you're selling the property. And I said, >> "No, on the in the council meeting, I think we're going to hopefully approve phase two." >> And again, this was put online. Whatever. Again, everybody come out to all of our meetings, please. There's never but anybody here. There's four people here, right? >> Four, five people. Part of them is the police. But >> well, I don't want to take up any more of your time, but I I just felt the need and the desire to speak to you in person and tell you that >> um I was surprised. And um >> we just so you know when we put out our alert that we're having a workshop our our alert was a little vague but part of it is it's a vac we're just talking about you know high level. So and again unfortunately someone took that and pushed it outline and made a big thing about it. Come on out and save your part. That's not what we're talking about. That's not what we're doing. You know, we're this is super high level and again, we can't talk behind the scenes. So, sure, we usually have our workshop in that little conference room and we leave the doors open in case everybody wants to come in, hang out. No one ever comes to our workshop. Not one person ever comes to workshops. It just doesn't happen. So, we had it in here because there's 50 people in here. >> And most people I've ever seen at a workshop. But, and part of it is the three of us had no idea what we're talking about either >> because I I didn't call the workshop. They didn't call the workshop. Those two two people can call workshop. They they called the workshop. Those two and they brought the thing up in the first place back in January that that something they want to look into. So I don't know, you know, and then Jesse's like, "Hey, you know, the whoever Channel 5 wants to talk, you know, I you know, >> we're blindsided by that." >> Yeah. Like, okay. Well, we're just >> more than just you. >> Yeah, we're all blindsided. >> Can I elaborate on that, too? Go ahead, please. We're sorry. Were you >> No, I'm done. Um, I realize you're probably privy to a lot of this too, but just now that we're talking about it, for anyone listening too, it's like if uh two people call for a workshop and then we show up, it's more of a opportunity for us to publicly discuss it. Even though people don't usually show up, but to kind of get ourselves organized before we bring it to a meeting or like I was under the impression that we were going to come to the workshop, decide what we wanted to bring to parks for the next meeting, >> right? And like we don't get I didn't get the workshop materials until I sat down here, you know, and I could do the same thing if um >> which is >> you know me and council member Pew call for a workshop and others wouldn't see the documents until we get there. So we kind of just >> it's really informal. I mean it was vague and confusing but >> that's kind of on purpose because we don't really we weren't making any final decisions at that meeting. It's just a workshop. >> But the intent um just because I also had to answer emails. You know, I had one lady call me asking that if we're selling Carlson Park and the beach, and >> you know, I was like, "No, no, no, no." It's like, it's an extremely short list of a lot of places that um are called parks by name, but they're there's not even a bench. It's a corner sliver thing, and we're, you know, what are we going to do with it? It's not going to materialize to anything that's going to >> move the needle financially huge. It's an open space. >> That's right. And I think um council member Pew had said that maybe you guys had already spoken about kind of redefining the definitions of what >> that's right >> parks are or aren't or the different kinds. >> Yeah. >> And so we were going to discuss that later >> and then it just kind of got you know >> a little I I'm not a I guess gossipmonger. I wanted to come in and see face to face and and just get an explanation for it. So, next council meeting or I should say workshop at 5:00, >> you know, please come. >> I will. >> Yeah. And then >> the 23rd >> um again, it's kind of meant to be a discussion with us, but you guys can maybe come and listen, see what we're talking about. >> Okay. >> And then if we or you know, hopefully we'll have some discussion as we're like, okay, let's do this going forward. And then I would imagine the next step would be let's let's have the parks, you know, with the staff work on blank >> if we want to move forward with something. And then you guys would come back with the recommendation of >> do this, this, and this. And then we either take it or not. And then, you know, sometimes the planning committee, they come up with great ideas and we're like, "No, you're wrong. You didn't see this, this, and this." >> That seems very fair. So, I appreciate that and I won't take up any more of your time. >> Thank you. All right. Anybody else? Cool. All right. So, I'm going to call that at uh number six. We got Orno, please. >> Welcome. >> Welcome, >> Mayor City Council. Uh going over stuff for the last couple weeks. We have nothing significant on the crime activity reports or anything. everything. We're busy, but it's normal trending stuff that we deal with regularly. Uh, nothing upticking. Uh, just a note that there has been some theft from vehicles, breakins of vehicles. So, again, we just remind everybody to lock your car and take all your stuff in, all your valuables in with you because it's the best way to avoid that to happen. If they see a laptop sitting in there, they're going after it. So, um, but on on a note, uh, I know my shift on this side is out constantly walking the neighborhoods, driving the neighborhoods. We're trying to stay on top of it because I know in the area surrounding us there there are issues. So, just want to remind people to be vigilant and take care of your uh your vehicle and your uh personal belongings. Um but we don't have much officers are dealing with juvenile on ebikes still. Um we have just mostly what we're doing is we're catching them and we're educating them and we're calling parents and releasing them to their parents and letting their parents know what's going on. We are ticketing for what needs to be ticketed for so that they get the clue. We are trespassing them from properties. So we're doing what we can do. Um, and we're trying to educate ourselves as well as the people that we come in contact with when we deal with them. So, um, right now we are actively backgrounding two cadets for our cadet program. Uh, hopefully we'll know in the next couple weeks if they're moving on or not. So, we have to finish up all the uh internal investigations on that. Uh, O incredible festival is this weekend. We are going to have pretty big presence there. We were requested to be there. So, uh we will have a lot of officers roaming. Um other than that, uh just it's going to be a busy month for Arnold. We have a lot of training come up for uh postman medical training, uh department firearms training, SWAT annual shoot, and then um in two weeks, um again, like I talked to you, we won't I won't be around. We will be up at uh Camp Ripley with the SWAT team doing our annual evaluation for the SWAT team. So, we are going to be busy for next month with training, but it's just how the cookie crumbles. >> Sorry to interrupt. Question. Um I got a phone call or something about some activity down at Surfside. Was that a training thing that was going on with the lake rescue, water rescue? >> That was Hannah County. >> Yeah. >> Is that what they were doing? >> Yeah, they they trained. >> I kind of assumed that was because I didn't hear a lot of sirens or anything like that. So >> yeah, they usually don't share with us what they're doing, but they're we know what you know that's their area, so we just leave them be. So >> well, it was quite motion evidently >> if if the fire department is involved. Just you know, it's a lot of times it's Monday night. >> I think it was on Monday. >> I think I saw the a fire >> the fire and rescue was there. Yeah. >> And then yeah, the boats for Henipin County. >> Yeah. Okay, that's fine. >> Any questions for me or anything you guys got? Um, when you mentioned the like vehicle break-ins before, is it in in mound, is it mostly like residences, driveways, parks, or like just businesses? >> It varies, be honest. Uh, thinking back from last year, it you know, parking on the streets. um parking at like we had a lot up in Orno and the the dog park up in Orno where people were parking or leaving their cars unattended and unlocked and leaving their wallets, purses, phone, stuff in there and people just it's a crime of opportunity. So if they can easily grab it, sometimes they'll bust a window, sometimes they'll break in somehow to get it. So um it varies. It's just if you're leaving your car for any amount of time, you know, don't leave anything visible and if you can at all help it, get it out. Just take it out with you, too. So, >> are the DWIs are those mound residents or are they people traveling through our community, >> the people that are committing this? >> Yeah. >> Uh I I really I don't think they're m Sometimes it could be kids out. Oh, back when I was in Mound as an officer, we always called the kids were out car shopping and they were basically going down the streets, checking doors, taking out >> D. No. >> Oh, yeah. She was asking about the DWS or the like mound residence or like >> they vary to be honest with you. They they they can be passing through or they can be an actual resident. Um, I know I see Ubers all around, so people are doing their best, but I think there's just those few that, you know, >> make the wrong decision at that point. So, >> okay. >> All right. So, we'll not see you next week or two weeks. >> Two weeks. Yeah. >> Then we'll see you October. >> If there's anything comes up, let us know. We'll make sure someone's here. >> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. >> So, >> cool. Thanks. Thanks. Good luck on training. >> All right. Number seven, we got Rhonda Nelson, the Gillespie Center. [Music] >> Welcome. >> Thank you. >> Perfect. Thank you. As Jason said, I'm Rhonda Nelson. I'm the director at the Gillespie Center. Um, and I uh requested to come and give you guys an update. I was here about a year ago and kind of shared with you. I was brand new then and um share with you our strategy. But I first want to start with um a big thank you u gratitude. Um we have come a long way which you'll see um in a minute here. Um but a lot of that is in part to you guys. Um I appreciate your your donation last year in this year as well as the plus plus is you know for the other things that you do for us for like mowing the lawn and doing the flags and send parking lot stuff. So um that's definitely appreciated. Um, so just wanted to and I know I have some new council members, so give you a quick update. Um, as I mentioned last year, we created this new strategy um, when I first joined and um, I love it. Um, I think it's important and I think it does align with your strategy, right? We all want to see a thriving community. Um, and our mission really is around um providing a a dedicated um we're dedicated to providing a supportive uh culture um space and uh environment. I write this over and over again on Thank you, Chris. I can't believe I can't remember it. Uh to enrich the lives of our um community members of all ages. So, while we are a senior center, we do um we have kind of tried to shift our focus and really open it up to all the community. Um we have found that our seniors like to share their activities with their intergenerational family members, right? Their their their kids or especially their grandkids. So we do have um activities and things geared around them. Um if you want to flip to the next one. So last time I rolled out our goals and I just want to give you a quick update on how we're doing against those goals. Um so we we focus just on four big goals. Um, one of them is increasing our membership. Um, and if you recall, membership really is a loose word. Um, I really consider them supporters. Um, it's like basically for an individual, it's 40 bucks for the year to join. And it's not like joining a health club, right? You don't have to, um, be a member to use any of our services and programs. Um, nothing. Um, but it really is just kind of a financial contribution. Um but we are um up um this is a challenging one because a lot of the people that like to be called members are passing away, moving on, right? So um we're trying to find ways to engage um our younger seniors and and bringing them in. Um while we've increased it, it's not as as high as we'd like. Um the next one is a big one. Um increasing our profit. Um this year was our first year that we're operating in the green for many years and haven't had to borrow against our endowment that Mr. Gillespie set up um once upon a time. So um super excited about that. Um that is a lot of hard work and due diligence. We've we've tried to increase our fundraisers, although fundraisers typically don't make a ton of money. Um like when we have a bingo event or kind of that average fundraiser, they might bring in about an average of $1,000. So we have a few bigger ones. um one coming up as a matter of fact which I'll talk to in a minute but um pretty excited about this one. It's a challenge because our expenses keep rising as everybody's does, right? Um and our building is old. It's 25 years and um you know still original boilers, air conditioners, all that kind of stuff. Um the third goal is increasing our programming usage. Um so that's really the bigger one other than membership, you know, over membership because that's who's using the building. So, we do have a sign-in sheet. We do ask people to sign in when they're go going to a program or a seminar or service. Um, so we track that. Um, and we are um up greatly um almost 40% over our goal. Um, and then the last one I'm particularly proud of. It's NPS, which stands for net promoter score. I'm sure you guys have all seen that. Um, pretty much anywhere you go now or any thing you sign up for or buy, they ask, they send you a quick survey and on a scale of 1 to 10, how likely are you refer to refer to this to a friend? Um, so we did a survey when I started last April and we did a second survey, we're measuring this annually. Um, and we're up 95%. So, super excited about that. Still room to grow. Um, but it means that the people that are coming um are happy with what we're doing. Um I'm not going to drain these slides, but I put them in here just to give you again an overview and for the newer members on kind of what we do. Um we do offer a lot of services and programming. Um we've some of these we've done for a while, but a lot of them were new that I've added in the last year. Um and many of these things are um costneutral. Um I uh you know work for example with Ridgeview Medical um to bring in like the free flu shots. We're doing dementia screening this month. Um they also do seminars for us on a monthly basis on different health related topics. Um we do have a hearing services defensive driving classes. Of course we're an election site for Mound. Don't forget about that. Um and we have a lot of programming. So anything from card games to ukulele. um pretty much and we always ask for um if somebody's interested we put it out in our newsletter and say hey who's interested in this and try to get a gauge. So we've added a few new things like a walking club this year um a Roomie cube club things like that. Oh ma jang as well. Um so you want to flip to the next one and then this is just a list of more things um that we offer. So a lot of educational programs um excursions um that they pay for but we try to keep it cost neutral. We're not making money on those things, but we do have to rent a bus. Um, so we work with a company out in Norwood, Young America to get an cost-effective bus. Um, and then special interest. Some of those things um do cost money. So like the historical and author speakers um so we try to keep that kind of to a minimum. Um and of course community talks. So we have Mayor Holt coming in October 1st. >> Yeah, you said that cost a lot of money. I guess >> that one's free. I hope >> that was free. >> Yes. And we just had the Orno Police Department there about two months ago doing a special session on um frauds and scams to keep seniors safe. Um we've had the fire chief, Chief Peterson, out as well and he's coming back again um in the next few months. Um so if you want to go to the next one, marketing update. So this is exciting. Um, a year ago we had just gotten our new logo. Um, but I'm proud now coming back here. It's now finally on our building. That was a little bit of a hurdle because as they painted the new building, they found um there's a strip across the portica that we were going to remove to put the logo and it was all rotted underneath. So, we had to defer to this year, get it fixed and repainted and now the logo's up. So, it was up just before the Spirit of the Lakes. So, that was that was great. Great. Um we've expanded a lot of um our marketing um to include a website. Um our old website was um really clunky and not maintained. So we um got a new website that is user friendly that I can update on a real-time basis. So it's very effective. Please visit it. Please check it out. Can see when Mayor Holt is speaking. Um uh newsletters. So I've really worked with the city including mound um to get our events and our programs in the city newsletters. Um that includes all the West Honka communities around us from St. Bonnie to Orno etc. Um and then really increased our social media presence. Um Facebook is growing. Um I had a marketing intern in this summer and a free marketing intern. Happens to be my daughter is going to school at University of South Carolina for marketing. So, um, it was kind of a win-win. And she created an Instagram account. So, that's not being followed very well because it doesn't really relate to our audience. But, if you're on Instagram, please follow us. >> Do you have Facebook, too? >> Yes, Facebook. Yeah, big big Facebook. So, we we try to post at least three times a week. >> Okay. >> On Facebook. >> And we're without our social media person right now. She left. >> Oh, Maggie. >> Yeah. Oh, yeah. Right. >> We should have a new one pretty soon. >> Oh, good. >> So, we'll connect you. >> That would be great. with them and we should a lot of times we'll share your stuff anyway I think or at least >> I don't know so much um but Orno started doing that so if you guys could do that too that'd be great so let me know when >> you can share our >> thanks Jesse all right um fundraising as I said that is one stream of revenue as a nonprofit um trying to you know make our budget it's difficult um so we do try to do as much fundraising in the center as we can um I won't drain the stuff on the left, but you can see um we did the big spring fling. I know some of you guys came to that. Um that was successful. Um we partner with Alan Elmas. They do a great job. They give us um six cruises in the summer and they donate um $6 per ticket back to us at the end. We provide volunteers to work the boats, but it's a huge like this year, last year was record sales. This year beat last year's sales. So, we're really excited about that. It's if Yeah. if you ever need to do that on a Monday. And you don't have to be a senior to go on it, although there is a lot of seniors. I I market it to other um senior centers and senior living facilities. So, they often have big groups and buses that come. Um but that's really successful and people love that and it's you can't beat the price. They char we charge $25 for the cruise, which is an hour and a half narrated cruise and it includes a lunch. Wow. >> So, it's a good deal. Um and then you know Scotty B um our mound resident um chef um he does he was just here a week ago and um he donates his time and does a quarterly lunch for us and those lunches usually bring in about a thousand bucks but um it's fun and the seniors love it and we have a room full of people so it's it's good. It's a win-win. >> Um coming up we have a fashion show, we have a bingo. Um those will be smaller. Scotty B, like I said, comes back quarterlies. Um we'll do a holiday boutique every year, which we'll do in November. Um at Christmas brunch and the pancakes with Santa, so that's a family kit event. Um and the big one is our 25th anniversary celebration. So you will all receive invitations. They went out in the mail on Friday. Oh, you already have them. Awesome. That's great. Um so we're excited about that. Um it'll be a mix, right? We're going to have a program um dedicated to, you know, honoring Bill Gillespie and our history of of the last 25 years. Um but we also have the Abiders coming which was donated a B somebody donated. They bought it at another silent auction and donated it to us. So that's awesome. Um the Sons of the American Legion in Mound is um doing the pork chop dinner. Um so I think it'll be a really fun event. And then of course the Lions are um as Kevin knows I had to get a license. Um they're um doing the bar. So we'll have a cash bar. Um okay, I want to go to the next. Let's see here. Oh, there there it is. But you have the invitation. So um I hope you all make it. Um you could buy a table, have a city council table if you'd like or whatever. So, I'm here today ultimately to give you the update, but also to make the next acts for 2026. Um, I would love for you guys to continue funding us. Obviously, we're a huge community asset and we're growing. Um, and we need support to help us grow. Um, I did some checking. Um, you know, most senior centers are run and funded, managed by the cities. Um, we never have been because Bill Gillespie came forward 25 years ago, right, and did that. Um, I also checked with like similar cities. So, Delano City is run, Delano Senior Center is run by the city and their budget is about $500,000. That's what they spent last year. What we spent last year was $325. And we have a big building and it's AJ. So, I think we do a pretty good job of trying to manage it effectively, but it's still the the costs will go up. I know um just this year, right? Like I know all of our maintenance costs have went up and our um electricity went up like everyone's, right? But um so it just keeps going up. So last year you donated 6,000 and again thank you. I would love to see you donate more. I know that you're in I I'm not you know I obviously know you're in budget constraints. Um I did secure funding from other cities. So Orno gave us 12,000 last year and um Ministrista just signed up for 10, which was a fight, but they did it. Um Spring Park gives us about four. So I would love to see Mound give us 10, but realistically at least six or with inflation, maybe seven, whatever you want, whatever your heart desires, right? >> Yeah. Um, but I appreciate you continuing to support us and especially in the support of our grounds and upkeep and and that's been very appreciative. Other ways you can support us. If you flip to the next slide, um, again, like us on Facebook, um, helping us with, you know, the the newsletters and stuff and connect with Maggie's replacement on Facebook and stuff like that as well. Um, consider becoming a member. If anyone would like a tour um, before the event, um, please stop in. I'd love to give you guys a tour if you haven't been there. Um, and certainly attend our other fundraisers and programs. So, there's a lot there's a lot to offer. And that's it. Do you have any questions? >> I don't. >> The building looks awesome. >> Thank you. >> The spring playing was cool. I like that. >> Yeah, that was fun. >> We did another um similar something similar. Um, we had a band summer. We called it the summer concert. It was called the arcades. Yeah, >> it was not very well attended and I promoted the heck out of it >> summer. >> It was a really good band. I know maybe it was summer, but um hopefully the word will get out and if we do it again, we'll do it, you know, in the spring or you know, the winter is hard because a lot of our members are snowbirds, you know. So >> Oh yeah. >> Yeah. >> I you know I used to play in a band when I was young, right? >> Long time ago. >> Are you going to here? >> No. I'm just thinking like the sprinkling I think was cool because you you had well you know Jeremy, right? >> Yeah. Jimmy Band. Yep. >> Yeah. Local guy and pastor and >> uh and then his kids were playing and stuff and that was just fun. I can't remember was there there was was it just him the whole night? >> Yeah. >> Because he did Bob Dylan and then >> Yeah, he did two sets like one Bob Dylan specific and then >> one without. Yeah. And that was I thought that was Anyway, I'm just thinking like more Battle of the Bands or like you know get the high school involved. >> I would I mean as a kid that was like where I wanted to be you know we play we had to play at the like the Legion and my >> That's a great idea. >> Parents are like you're playing at a bar you know >> you're 16 you know >> so >> we might be okay with people playing at the Gillespie Center. >> Yeah. Oh yeah why not right? Um anyway, just >> one of the challenges with bands now about high school, we would probably want to do the cash bar, but like the band like the the reason why the arcades didn't make as much money is I had to hire a bartender. So, because we don't have a liquor license or the liquor insurance, we've looked into it, right? It's expensive. >> So, it's like, oh, you know, we need to be more financially solvent to be able to invest in that. But if we did, it would return, right? Because we could do more >> because people expect to have a cash bar at some of those types of events, right? >> But like when the Lions um give us their light licenses and they come and work it, they gave they give us the proceeds, so we make money on that as well. >> So, you don't have to tell us the number, but you you made money that night. >> Uh the spring fling. >> Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. I I thought that was a great event. I thought that was cool. You should I would definitely come to more like that. Yeah. >> Do you guys have a beer and wine license and just not like a spirits like not a full liquor license or not? >> No. No. We don't have anything. And it's mostly because of the insurance. >> Yeah. I think beer and wine is quite a bit cheaper and then once you add spirits I think it gets really expensive. >> Yeah. We we probably would never we don't do spirits even with the lions. >> It's just beer, wine, and salers. >> Cool. >> Yeah. >> Any other questions? We'll talk about the money thing in a minute here. >> Yeah. >> No, I'm just curious. Do we need to make a public announcement that serves two per purposes if more than two of us are going to attend, which I know I would like to go. >> Oh, like a potential quorum notice. >> Yes. And so if we're doing that, at least that's getting it out in the public as well. Yeah. >> Um and then it protects us in case we do have a quorum, which I think we probably will. >> We usually do quorum notices, but um for community gettogethers like this, I don't know if we have to specifically. >> We would do it just to be safe. >> We always try. Yeah, >> that's why I was saying, you know, it would be beneficial to them as well if we it's just one more advertisement for them that they're having the event >> as long as we're clear on what >> the event is. >> Yeah. Right. >> And and I I know it says in your invitation, but I'd be honored if you would speak, you know, a couple minutes at the event as well. >> Just just saying what it's on my list to do when I get back into town. Um, I'm leaving tomorrow for a vacation, but um um to uh follow up to see because it would be great just to hear from the mayors of different cities on what the Gillespie means to them. What does it mean to the community, right? Because that's what Bill Gillespie, you know, that was the vision is it's community center. It's benefiting the community. >> Yeah. >> Um and what does it mean to the community? >> So, no no big thing. >> I haven't looked at the date, but yeah, I'll think about it. Uh but I'm definitely going to come on the first for sure. >> Okay. Yes. uh at 1:00. >> 1:00. Yes. >> 1:00. So if anybody watches this later. >> Yes. 1:00. >> 1:00. October 1st. July. We had what 30 people? 25 30. >> Yeah. >> Last time. >> Last time. >> Last year. Yep. >> And the year before that it was probably 40 maybe. >> I would think it would be bigger this year just with the questions on the water treatment. >> Who knows? >> Uh >> and it's posted around town. It's posted at Jubilee. >> Oh, okay. Yeah. Um, and basically it's it's kind of informal. So like you know if people want to ask questions or you know hey what what are we doing? You know >> sometimes just like people don't want to come to these you know three-hour meetings. >> Yeah. >> You know twice twice a month. So it's nice to get that get in front of people and yeah it's good. >> Cool. >> Great. >> Um well you can either hang out or you can sit down whatever you want to do but we'll we'll talk about what we want to do for money. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Yeah. Appreciate it. Thanks. Um I I will say, you know, we kind of last year it was kind of like right up against the line with the budget and this and we we kind of talked about this in our budget meeting, you know, recently that, you know, the we know she was going to come and request more. >> Um you know, I think I think we should be doing at least, you know, the 10. I mean, Matric is doing 10. >> Do 10,000 10,000 in one. Well, yeah, if you want to I mean six >> friendly competition >> is not that big not not that big of a deal but I think at least doing that I think would be unless you want to do a little bit more in that or not but >> it is in our town. We were doing this before, you know, it was a lot higher in the past if I remember right >> and then she approached me. It was a year and year ago or so and it was like right out right around the budget time and it was just not a good and but we you know we did what we could you know so I mean do you guys feel like or >> I'm comfortable with that. You guys have looked at it in relationship to the budget, right? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We're not exactly in like better >> shape. >> Yeah, we're not perfectly >> okay with 10,000. That's a consensus. >> And we're going to talk about the budget next meeting, >> right? >> Um >> so there'll be more to come on that, but it it >> Yeah, we're sticking to our financial plan and if it, you know, >> the whole work. So >> um >> yeah, we can do that. >> Yeah. >> Well, I'll make a motion. >> Okay, go ahead. that um we make a commitment of $10,000 to the Glasby Senior Center for 2026. >> Right. >> All right. Got a motion. Can I get a second? >> Second. >> Any other discussion? >> All those in favor, please say I. >> I. >> I. Those opposed. All right, that passes. >> Thank you. And you're doing a great job. I mean, phenomenal. So, don't quit. >> Take suggestions, though. Well, we're giving you whether they're good or not. All right. Number eight, we got discussion action uh planning case 259 variance for second driveway apron. >> All right. >> Good evening, Mayor Hold, members of the council, uh guests, applicants. I'm Sarah Smith. I'm the planner. Um, I'm going to provide a brief overview for you of the planning case that was submitted to us from uh, Rod and Kathleen Fear. Uh they're the owners of the property at 1705 Baywood Shores Drive and they have submitted a variance application requesting approval to allow a second access for their home and property to gain access to an existing storage and parking area that's on the north and in the rear side of their property. Um the property is zoned R1. It's a single family uh designation. It it includes a single family home uh with a an attached garage. It was constructed in and about 1984. Um Jesse, if you wouldn't mind maybe putting the aerial up, that would be helpful. Um on the overhead the the property is identified in the blue and it has frontage on Three Points Boulevard and it has frontage on Baywood Shores Drive. Um, the application is requesting uh a apron curb uh that would serve an existing parking area that they use to store equipment, recreational vehicles, trailers, that sort of thing. Um this particular area has a driveway here and the application of the code is you get one driveway per code. Um it is important to note because it was talked about a little bit at the planning commission meeting is that the code actually states that the number and types of access drives onto major streets shall be limited to a single access unless improved by the city engineer. and some of the discussion uh that took place uh amongst the planning commission and we've also had some conversations as a staff and and it was also mentioned by the applicant is that Baywood Shores Drive is not a major street. It's a local road. My understanding the application of this code has been everybody gets one driveway. Uh a second one can be applied for uh with circumstances if you're on a larger road or if you have a probably a very large spans of uh driveway. For example, if you got 300 ft of road and you want to do a ring road, that's very much different than if you have a lot that's 60 ft width. So uh that was one of the discussion points uh at our meeting a week ago today. Um, a couple of other um, information uh, tidbits about the property. Um, this actually came about uh, the property owners uh, had reached out through a contractor to request a new apron put in and the contractor reached out to our to our public works director and that access request was not granted on the basis that the code says you only get one. And so the discussion for uh the staff in cooperation with the property owner is what was the recourse or the remedy for that and it was determined that if they wanted to pursue that second apron opening that they needed to pursue the variance process. A little bit about the property. Um there's an existing gravel class 5 area. Uh this is kind of in the north area. This is our existing driveway. Um that area currently exists. It's currently in use. Uh it's my understanding uh it has standard curb. So the the folks when they are packing or backing their or driving their items in, they're jumping the curb. And the concern about wanting that to be pulled out and replaced is to allow for uh minimizing potential damage on their trailers and on their on their personal vehicles. Um, with regards to the area, as is noted in the planning report, there is standard curb in and around that area. Um, there's also some painted curb that was uh done by the public works department. um following a request to first of all I think identify the hydrant that's in that vicinity but also to prevent parking so close to that intersection uh for specifically folks coming from three points making a southbound movement. Um a couple things and this was again a little bit talked about at the planning commission is is it a driveway? Is it a is it a parking area? Is it a storage area? Um, we do have standards for driveways. Uh, number one, minimum 10 feet in width at the apron, max 24. They're also required to be hard surfaced. And, and when I mean hard surface, I mean something similar like concrete or batuminous or a pvious paver that's engineered for that use. And they're also required to be uh located 1 ft offsite and rear property lines. Um, and so that was a bit of the discussion is it's not improved. Um, does it need to be improved? Is it a driveway? Is it a secondary parking area? Um, and so some those were some of the the discussion points um at last Tuesday's meeting. Um, it was also mentioned uh at the meeting um Mr. and Mrs. had reached out um to several of their neighbors um to explain their situation and explain their request and they provided that uh document uh to the to the staff and it was incorporated into the planning commission packet. Um mo most all those neighbors expressed support for the existing uh condition and allowing that access. Um, with regards to other comments, uh, our staff did not support the variance on the basis of four findings that were included, uh, in the planning report. Um, and you can find those on pages 2354 and 2355. And there was also a technical letter that was prepared by the city engineer uh based on the location um of the property and in particular uh the the parking area uh that's located on the property at present. Um some of the other uh disc discussion items um that were brought up or mentioned um is that there there is an existing driveway across the street that recently was expanded and um it actually could be closer to the intersection than this. Uh and it was also mentioned that there are similar conditions in and around the neighborhood. uh and and Miss uh Theier provided some graphics uh photos that were entered into the record as amendments that are included into the executive summary um as addended addendum information from our from our planning commission packet. Um, very quick analysis of the property is even with the current parking area, for lack of a better word, we believe the property is compliant uh with hard cover allowance. Um whether or not it's gravel or it's um concrete, it still counts because it gets compacted down. So, if you've got a gravel driveway, it counts towards hard cover. Um the the the reason the case is on the regular agenda is that we have differing recommendations from the staff. our staff didn't support the request uh and and the planning commission did not accept staff's recommendation for approval or I'm I'm sorry for denial and they they recommended uh approval of the variance request based on the discussion that took place at the meeting and some of those high points were number one parking is already taking place. Um it was felt that parking in the rear is preferred versus front yard parking uh because it's kind of tucked back. Uh other points that were brought up at the meeting again was um this actually is a very similar situation. I do point out that is their only driveway but it is in the in the vicinity of the location. Um and so that that recommendation for approval uh was six in favor and two opposed. Our two planning commission members that were opposed um commented on a couple of things. One planning commission member specifically talked about the need he'd like to see this improved to standards meaning hard cover you know concrete bat butuminous meeting the setbacks meeting the opening. Um the other member also expressed support for an improved um area as well, but also cited some concerns with um you know what the practical difficulty or hardship was and um and potential safety issues on that corner as well. Uh we did provide uh in your packet summary minutes from last Tuesday's meeting. Um we will be happy to uh answer questions for members of the council. Uh as is normal and customary when we have conflicting recommendations, we do not prepare a resolution in advance of the meeting. And so uh any future resolution would be prepared based on council discussion uh and direction that takes place as part of this meeting or a subsequent meeting. and then that information is brought back in the form of a motion that would be acted on at that time. So, um I uh I always um make a point of mentioning that we also did notify neighbors as a courtesy so we could have some folks here with us this evening. Uh at last Tuesday's meeting, we did not have any neighbors provide comment on the application. However, the applicants were of course present and and I think Mrs. theory is here as well tonight. So, she'll have some I'm sure we'll want to share comments with the planning commission with regards to the current request >> with the planning commission >> about the commission. Okay. >> Yep. Following last week's meeting and to share information with you folks. >> All right. Does council have any questions for Sarah? >> Um I do. So, they're just going to fill that driveway with rock that they currently have. It's just adding the apron. the um you can the current recommendation from the planning commission does not require that parking area to be improved. It would stay existing. >> So, can it be redirected so that it's parallel to the house rather than all the way out by the curb which is causing issues with traffic as well as it being almost directly across from the neighbor across the street? I believe Miss Heric that's probably a question maybe to to request uh Miss the like deer to to uh respond back to you. >> Right. Um because I'm I'm looking at two that's what we're looking at on two different screens here. Um I'm looking at Henipin County which is showing me an aerial and he's got a Google looks like Google Maps. Is that what that is? >> Yeah. Um it does seem that that entryway is very close to the, you know, the corner. Um and also very close to a fire hydrant, which I believe you designated has to be 80 ft. Is that what I saw? >> Uh the area is um public works did park uh did paint that area in the vicinity of the >> um of the hydrant and also to prevent parking specifically around that cur curve area. Innesota folks making the southbound turn. >> That would be a concern I would have. Um I would hope that you know we've got very few ordinances and I would hope that we would stick to what we do have. However, I understand the issue for the homeowner. Um I would like to see them move it over so it's parallel to the house and looks like there might be a slight retaining wall there. Um you know, I would also like to see them pave it or black top it or whatever it's called. I mean, >> improved surface. >> We've got a lot of these. Yeah. I mean, I know when I lived in Apple Valley, this was not acceptable because there was concern about um things actually going into the water table. Um which I realize it does run off the driveway and goes into our water system anyway. Um you know, if I was a neighbor, I wouldn't be happy with this. I don't even like my driveway. So, um I just think we could do better. That's my personal opinion. Um, but as a council member, I do understand the issue for the homeowner. Um, but I definitely would like to see it moved parallel to the house and away from that curb for the reasons that you've listed already. >> So, do you have any other questions for Sarah? >> Um, yeah, I do. I don't know more discussion or questions, but um, the city engineers letter mentioned that it also would be an option. Like I just want everyone to >> make this work if we can. I don't like the way that it is currently either and I don't recall ever really not agreeing with the planning commission's recommendation, but I just have some questions on the options. So, the city engineer stated that they would like to see it where the driveway just combines with the original front like the the you know the main driveway >> like >> so um where their main driveway is the second one just kind of coming to that. So they would still have one entrance, >> right? >> So then I guess, you know, if that's an option, that's good. But I guess my question too is like, can you make your driveway apron wider? So can you have like one wider apron instead of two? See Matt nodding his head. >> But that would also require them to drive in through their yard, their front yard to get >> Well, they would move the driveway to >> Oh, to the other side. >> This is kind of like neat. >> And then if you had one wider apron, I mean, that's an option. And I guess I mean I'm familiar with the area. So also the n the the home across the street has one driveway on Baywood Shores and then their second opening is on Three Points. I don't think we can see it, but Right. >> It's in the backyard. Would that be an option for that property >> whether they >> There's some I think there's some challenges with that. >> Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I know there's topography and it's hilly, but I'm just trying to look at everything here. Um, so the original apron could be extended and using, you know, meeting the original driveway is an option. And I don't know. I mean, I'll be honest, just because it's in front of that yellow curb and the fire hydrant and the no parking and the safety concerns from the city engineers letter, I totally understand. I don't want to go against that. But I have a few neighbors that have kind of I don't want to say the exact same, but a similar setup and you can buy like those you can like fleet farm like the curb ramps. >> Oh yeah. >> Black rubber. My neighbor uses that when they move their trailer, their boat, their ATV camper. I mean, you throw those, you get out of your truck, you throw those on the curb, >> you back your stuff in, you pull out, and then you put the ramps back in your yard. To your point though, I don't think >> they're like that big. >> They can't go down the left side of the house because there's not enough room. At least according to Henipin Countyy's aerial shot. >> What do you mean? >> They'd be because if they combined the driveway, it would I think be on the other neighbor's property. >> Who has the the cat toy, the laser pointer thing? I don't know if I'm getting my point across the correct way. >> Are you Are you able to pull up Google Maps? >> Thank you. >> You're welcome. Okay. Not red, yellow. >> Yellow. >> Red just shuts it all down. >> So like the engineers letter, what I was kind of agreeing with is saying like the driveway would kind of go like that. >> So you're saying bring it over like >> and then make the make the one apron bigger and then you don't have any of this going on. >> But see, every other house >> it's on the left side. >> Yeah. >> You wouldn't put a driveway on that side. >> Oh, no. I I get it. I'm just saying they already have stuff there if they want to. there. But I'm just saying like naturally you're going to put you're going to put >> you able to speak. >> Yeah. In a minute. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Sorry. I wanted to make a point and then you can then >> we're talking to her and then I'll bring you up and then we'll bring her back up and then we'll make a decision. >> I don't know the rules. >> Just give me a minute. >> I can clear it up. >> Naturally, you're going to you're going to put your stuff on the left side. You're not going to go around your front door and around the back. So, it's kind of like it's already a problem where it's at now. >> So, unless you say, well, you know, seed your lawn and re, you know, start over and go that way, but there's there's not a lot of room over there either, and it's already existing over on the other side. So, >> and I So, I I empathize, too. I mean, I like the optic just the fact that there are options to either >> you know, follow the city manager's recommendation, get the, you know, black curb ramp seems to be the cheapest. It's not the coolest looking, but um and then I mean the one entrance on a major road like I just want to point out. I don't think we can move this. This is just a photo. >> Yeah. Really? >> Okay. So, the house that's here >> and the one that's here both have like horseshoe driveways. You know, they have two entrances. So, I'm not, >> you know, trying to pick on on one or the other, but you know, that's a major road. And the homes do have two entrances where it says they're supposed to have one. So, it's not the most unique ask in the world. It's just the unfortunate position of the way that that >> it's two >> curb comes around when you speaking of the safety concerns from the city engineer. >> You know, do you have anything for sir? >> Yeah. >> No, I think there's a second home here. >> All right. Should we hear from the applicant? >> So, it's like there. >> Oh, sure. Yep. Yep. >> Okay. All right. Thanks. And we'll >> Thank you. >> Don't go anywhere. Don't go too far. >> All right. If you want to come up and give us your Sorry. >> Hopefully a lot of this will like make sense. >> This yellow >> yellow that yellow >> just give us your >> Hi, Captain um 1705 Baywood Shores Drive Mount. Um so I'll address all of that. I do have some stuff that I'd like to read out. I appreciate Kevin, Sherry, Jason, Scott, and sorry I don't know you and Michelle and everybody else and everything that Sarah's done for me. Um, so good evening and thank you for your time and effort to put in that you put into the city and the city council. Um, I'm going to be explaining the reasons why I asked for this variance and why it's important to my spouse Rodney, which he's sick. He's not here tonight. Um, first, thanks. Um, Rod is self-employed. is a contractor and has been for decades. Much like any of you who are small business owners who puts in a lot of hours with little appreciation, a thank you, a smile, and of course some revenue. I'm a local insurance agent, have been for 40 years. We have serious ties to this community. I have been a boater and a member of the Minnitankka Power Squadron for 30 plus years. So is my husband. Um we purchased our home at this address 1705 Baywood in November of 16. So just about nine years ago. During those nine years, we have tirelessly worked to clean up our neighborhood and our actual property. Jason lives down the street from us. So does Kevin. I know you guys have seen the differences and the changes that we've put into that actual property. >> You talking about me? >> Yep. >> Oh, I don't live anywhere near way. >> I thought you lived over by Jennings. >> No, that's the other Jason. Okay. >> That's my doppelganger. >> That's your doppelganger. Well, I was told that you live over by Jennings. >> No, that's the other Jason. So anyways, we're pretty sure I've seen you walk down the street a couple of times. >> Um, so this area, yellow, this entire area was all thick woods like this is. We took out 86 trees with the arborist from mound to take out all of those trees because they were dying. They were infected. I got septus on my legs and was seriously in a bad way from trying to clean up this property when we first bought it. The reason that we cannot go on this side, if you notice the difference between here to here, as Michelle was saying, that's 8 ft. >> Yeah, >> I can't do it. >> Yeah, >> I would love to go on that side. >> I can't. So, that parking pad was put into place because it made the most sense for us. Our home is a walk out. We have a actual door right here, a door underneath this deck, and our front door. Obviously, our garage door and a garage door here. So, we have several entrances. This is not difficult to get to and from. It is not an imposing. It's not unusual. We lived in Atico for 19 years. I lived in Crystal for almost all of my life. This is common place that we're used to and accustomed to. Soh, let me get back to my stuff. Um, we take pride in our home and our neighborhood. We get back to our neighborhood and community, volunteering, like I said, at the Minatown Takas Power Squadron, supporting our local kids and neighbors, the individuals that Kevin was talking about, the Johnson's who live over here that you can't see with the circle driveway are like they're like family to us. Um, myself even testifying against the killing of Eli Hart. mound is important to all of us, everybody. There are a few things that happened since we asked for the additional apron to be placed on our property. I'm going to kind of go through a timeline, so I apologize if this seems lengthy. We asked for this back in July by CC Concrete. The reason we asked for it was because Jameson, who lives at this house, 1700 Baywood Shores Drive, was getting a new apron put in and new asphalt, and he also was getting an extension on his driveway right here. He has a drive-thru right here, the back of his house. I had a drive-thru on the side of my house to answer your question right here. The same thing. The reason that it's there is because there is a uh plot drawing that you supplied that I'd asked you because several neighbors, including the bakers that live here, hadn't have been there for 40 years, had said there was a driveway there. When three points was redesigned and redone and recurved, they took it out because the people that lived in my house at that time said, "We don't need it." So, lo and behold, lucky me, I don't have access to it. Would I like one here? Heck yeah, I would. I'll take it if that's where you want to put it. Right there. People drive in and out on three points. They back up their trailers. There's no severe hazard. There's no strange weirdness that goes on. There is no possible way that me pulling out of here with a trailer, with a boat is a hazard to anyone on three points. There is a stop sign right here. I stop like any other lawful person does. And I make sure the coast is clear. If you want to talk about a hazard, which if you guys have been in my neighborhood, Kevin, these bushes that belong to Jameson, you can't see more than 40 ft down the road. Everybody that lives on Baywood Shores Drive and Baywood Lane, we exit out Baywood Lane every time we leave the neighborhood. He used to be on the planning committee as far as I know. So, we asked for this apron to be put in. Chris got a phone call. The morning he was going to do it. His crew was there. He had paid for a permit. It had gone through the city. It was done and he was going to do it. He was getting ready to get the saw wet and cut the apron out. He got a phone call from Ryan and said, "You're not doing it." One per residence on a major road. He's like, "This isn't a major road. You're not doing it. It's how we read the code. It's how it's always been. It's how it's always going to be." Chris got disconnected. It was a charming conversation. I contacted the city about how this was handled. I wasn't happy because I'd already paid for the permit. I'd already paid for all the the time for the his staff to be there, the load to be dropped off, the actual rubble to be removed. I had $2,000 put into this already. He was putting in a driveway, which he did right here. So, he was kind enough and decent enough to take the $2,000 that I paid him and put it towards the $9,200 it cost me to put in a regular driveway. All the while, Jameson is adding six feet onto his apron. The six feet that was on there now took him five feet from this corner. Five feet from the stop sign. He pulls out of his driveway and he is not even a half a car length away from the stop sign. I have a yellow curb, a fire hydrant about, if you have the graphic in front of you, you can correct me if I'm wrong, about four feet or five feet. I asked the city six years ago, will you please paint this? You're out here and you're painting the corner. Will you please paint this? I am getting tired of the Johnson kids and all their little squirrely friends going out boating and parking right here. I can't get out. I can't get out of that driveway. My husband can't go to work. There's five cars there. I call the Orno police. They're like, "We'll go over and talk to them." They come and talk to him, the kids move the cars. It happens again. They painted it yellow for me. Jameson wanted it painted yellow because now when he backs out, he backs out and for sure there's not a car there. So, he loves it. So, when I contacted the city manager, I had a hard time getting a hold of him. I reached out to Jason via Facebook and went, "What am I supposed to do? This is not normal for me. I'm an insurance agent. If y'all called your insurance agent and they weren't calling you back after a deer hit, you would not be happy. Jason said, "I'll tell them to get a hold of you." Finally found out from him. Jesse Dixon called me. Talked to him and he said he talked to the city manager in between time and was told your best course of action is to do a variance, which I'm in the middle of. He said, "Get a hold of Sarah." Sarah Smith is an angel. I don't know how all you people I mean the girl needs a raise. She needs a lot of vacation time. She's an absolute angel. And I'm not just saying that to suck up to her. She puts up with a lot. Sarah told me that it's possible that this can be granted. The code reads the number and types of access drives onto major streets shall be li limited to a single access unless approved by the city engineer. unless they feel like it. It's only on major streets that only have one access. That's what the code says. This code has been changed three or four times. Sarah sent me the information. It has been changed, altered, shifted. It's not made in cement. So, I filled out the variance request the few last days of July. I went from July all the way through to September a month later just because of timing and how your guys's stuff works. We went to the planning committee last week. I don't have a bunch of graphics. I don't have a bunch of information for you guys because I went from being told Friday no internet you guys didn't have I didn't have a phone call. I didn't get anything much to Sarah's trying. She called me from her personal cell phone I'm pretty sure and said this is what's going on. I've had three days to try to get my 60-year-old butt in gear and figure this out and go, "This is what I got. I think this is terrible how we've been treated. I don't think this variance request should even went through." The DOT says that is not a major road. I have an email from the DOT. I'll be happy to share it with you. I brought eight copies. You can all have one. I also have a recorded statement from Ryan saying that my road that I live on is not a major road, nor is Dove, nor is any other small little road. So Kyle at the DOT is the West Metro Manager. Kyle's like, "You live on a local road. I don't know if you want those or not want those. You live on a local road, Kathy. You don't live on a major road. If I live on a local road and not a major road, then how does this legally get past your legal department, your city engineer, your city staff, and the planning committee finally goes, it's not a major road. Yo, it's not a major road. It shouldn't apply to you. How does this happen? Is it because people are using their feelings instead of using what is actually code or what is actually supposed to be? You don't have the right to do that. This is my right, my constitutional right to live and prosper in the city that I pay taxes in. We did receive push back like Sarah said. First, as I understand it, and Sarah can nod or say yes or no, we do not have to prove a hardship. That is not part of our requirements. Secondly, to change this from a class 5, which by the way, I gave you guys options at the planning commission. I don't know if it's in the file because I didn't see it. This is class 5. This rock is just orange rock that Kevin is right. Across the street from his house, he looks at orange rock. The people that live across the street are in my snow club. I know them. On the back of their house, they have another little area that they put all their stuff. It's class 5. By Sherry's house, she's flanked by a dirt driveway and another big house with a circle driveway that's dirt and another small little driveway that's dirt. Across the street from her place, there's a lot of them. If you go over to Cathy's house, it's the same thing. How many places in Mound have dirt driveways? You're going to penalize me because I want a silly apron right here. so I stop damaging my vehicles and so that I can increase the value of my home. How is that possible? That's not right. You're using your feelings instead of what is right. So, getting back to Baywood Shores as a as a major street, I don't know if you want to listen to that voice recording from Ryan because I was like, how do you say no to me or answer this question when you just arbitrarily said, "Not going to happen. I don't like it. I don't feel it today." If I said that to my clients, I wouldn't be an insurance agent. I'd be out of business. For the attorney for the city and the manager and the staff to say it's not allowed and that it's hazardous is not accurate. I don't know how many accident scenes, reconstructions, or anything that you guys have ever been at in your life. There is 41.6 miles of roadway that Mount is responsible for, including alleys throughout the city. There are roughly 50 plus homes that use Three Points Boulevard as their major driveway. This gentleman right here, like I told Sarah last week, love him to death. Dustin Timonss, he's an ER doctor. He can't back up a boat trailer or a snowmobile trailer to save his life. We can have breakfast. He can impede traffic. I sit there and I go, "Rod, go over there and help him." No, he's got to learn on his own. Go over and help him. There's six cars going in both directions cuz we sit right here is our kitchen. And I watch it and I'm going, "Are you kidding me right now? He is He's going to save somebody's life today, but he isn't going to be able to back up that trailer." So, off we go and we go and help him. There is no possible way that us backing out of here is creating a hazard. As Matt has said, it's hazardous. It's dangerous. It's not. >> Can you? >> So, I'm almost done. >> I'm almost done. I know you're watching the clock, but I waited for everybody else, so it's my turn. >> The speed on three points is 30 mph. >> It takes 120 ft in good conditions for a vehicle to stop. If it takes 120 ft for a vehicle to stop >> at 30 mph, are all of these driveways and every driveway hazardous? How does where do you get the qualifications to say it's hazardous? because you feel it's hazardous. I asked for this to be yellow. There is no yellow here. You have a picture of that. The yellow stops for about 6 ft and then it is added on. I cannot to answer your questions. Can I go this way? No. Can I go this way? Absolutely not. The reason why I can't go this way or this way, there is a shut off valve for the city water. The city water has told me Can't do it. I don't remember what the nice guy's name was, but you can't do it. Water shut off valve. Gas valve is right here. That gas valve feeds all four of our houses. Can't do it. I'm in a conundrum. Can I put a mirror right here on Jameson's stop sign? I can put a a traffic mirror so I can look out because if you go over to Cathy's house, there's a mirror that's in her area. I think it's on Inglewood is the name of the street that has a mirror on it. So when people back out, they can look up at the mirror and go, "There's nobody coming. I can go." I'm willing to do that. It's in my cart. All I got to do is proceed to check out. It's 70 bucks. Other thing I've said was I will put if you're going to make me, which I don't want to do cuz you guys don't like the it's a dirt driveway. I will put these little cement I don't know what they're called. They're kind of atards because that's where my husband shops because he's a contractor. These little guys. They look like this. >> Oh yeah. >> They look like that. The driveway is what? 10 foot by 24 ft in order to constitute a driveway or a parking pad. This is $760 worth of money I don't want to have to put out. Here's the dimensions. They're basically 24 in by 16. Here's what they look like. Here's what they look like with large vehicles parked on top of them. Do I want to do it? I don't want to spend the extra. My quote that I got from Ankor Construction here in in um Mound was 260175. So, I'm 200 bucks into this situation with you guys. $2,600 here, $3,000 with the concrete company to put the apron in. And I still can't even back up into my own driveway. Do you see my plate? Is it a hardship? Yes, it's a hardship. I'm not able to use my personal property in the manner that fits my needs. [Music] Any questions for me? Does council have any questions? >> I do of Sarah and she may not know the property across the street. >> Wait for Sarah then. >> Oh, do >> you have any questions for her? >> Yeah. Okay. >> I don't know the rules. >> Sorry. >> That's okay. >> Okay. Do you have any questions? >> I don't either, evidently. >> I I have I have some questions. Um, so what is this driveway used for? Cuz I see a camper on there. >> There is a camper on there right now. There's a fifth wheel on there because it goes into winter storage on October 1st. It goes up to our cabin on Max Lake. My husband has a 1- ton truck that is a four-door with an 8ft bed. It is about I think we measured about 26 feet in length. It does not fit in that driveway that is currently here. When it does, it's right out to the actual green line. There is no way an Amazon guy, who by the way, I don't know if y'all live in an area, but Amazon, those are all people that are crazy. They back up out of this road like they're on fire. And I'm not kidding. It's scary. So, you can't park it there. In the wintertime, there is a round top, which is I'm sure you've seen, probably Kevin has. It's one of those things from an ARS. It's a big tarp type of little housing thing. He backs up when he puts it in there. It's diesel, so it gets plugged in. There's electricity that comes from a shed right here over to there, and he plugs it in so that it stays warm and it will turn over. He goes out the back door, right out to the shed, and drives right out and goes to work. >> Okay. And then you say in July your permit was approved by the city >> when Chris from CC Concrete >> was was doing my actual job. I paid him. I signed a contract from him and he said he had all the paperwork done. All he had to do was just get paid, which I did. He came out with his whole crew, did Jameson's As soon as he got his crew starting to cut out and do stuff, they got their tools out. Literally, Jason, they were standing there and I had nine guys and I think a couple of girls and they were ready to rip both of them out and he got a phone call that said you can't do 1705. >> Wait, who did he get the permit from? >> I don't know. >> Okay. You said that you said the city. >> Yeah. I I don't know who whoever said go ahead and do it. >> Did we give him a Did we give her a permit originally and then take it back? So, a permit was issued for a driveway replacement, which >> not the the curb cut, >> which was when it was became evident that it was for a new curb cut, it was rescended because it was determined to be issued erroneously. >> Okay. Got it. >> I didn't file the permit, so I have no idea. I asked for an >> You said the city approved it and then took it back. So, I just wanted to clarify what that meant. Um, with this curb cut, you're not gonna Well, you just said you're gonna not put that stuff down there, but you're just gonna leave it gravel. You're not gonna >> I would love to leave it gravel, Jason. But if y'all are going to be like, "There's a condition to this and I want it pretty." >> I literally I'm okay with doing that. I will haul somebody in and have them bobcat it out and clean it out and then they'll put in 10 by 20 four or whatever is the minimum requirement and they can put it in there. Um I'll put in the mirror if you want the mirror put in too. >> Okay. The the reason why I asked that is because when when we do improvements to the house now this might this is a different potential subject but >> if if someone does have an old you know class 5 driveway >> or dirt driver or whatever, right? There's a lot of them around town like you said. >> There's a ton of them. I drove around the last two weeks, >> but those people probably haven't done any major or even minor. Uh >> I don't know. Have you been to Wexford? Because there's a gentleman that lives on Wexford that just put up a $1.6 million house in like uh five years ago right across from Eric and Denise Schmidt. It's a big white house right on the corner of Wexford. He asked for a >> Does he have a gravel driveway? >> Sorry. >> Does he have a gravel driveway? he does on one side of his property and he asked for a driveway to be on Wexford and not on the other driveway and you guys said no and then he said well this is what I need to do this is the design I'm not changing it you guys caved and he never changed that he just put grass seed over the top of it >> okay just so you know like most of us weren't here 5 years ago but >> right >> us as in the city council yes but >> you know it could have been Ray Salazar for all I know >> it was probably back in his day Um, >> I am ready to like do whatever you guys I mean I'm I'm here to work with you. I'm not trying to be difficult. >> Well, I'm just saying the gravel thing that's kind of why you put that in the code to say if when you do improve >> Mhm. >> No, you're not really improving anything. You're just trying to get a curb cut. But I'm just saying if you were to like remodel your house or do something, we we say, "Well, you got to improve your driveway." >> Right? This is your secondary driveway. So again, I don't think this really ties to this conversation, but I'm just saying when you said there's driveways and what, yes, there are, but in the future, eventually down the road, hopefully there's less of them. >> So here >> for the people that remodel their houses or do something to their house, >> here's my comment back to that. I asked Sarah point blank. Um, I put a garage right here. I put a garage right here. I spend $30,000 on a house improvement and put an attached garage on the back side of that house. Am I going to get this apron? >> Probably not. >> If you did, if you did, >> if I put a $30,000 garage in, why would I not get an apron? Well, you'd have to put in a >> Well, that would be the variance, you know. >> Yeah. >> But what I'm saying is to to your point of do you have an improvement to do? If I put a $30,000 garage in, I still would have to fight to get an apron, which doesn't make any sense. Why would I put the garage in if I can't have the apron? >> You wouldn't, cuz then you'd come do you do what you're doing now. You come to planning, you go through council, and then you'd say, "Okay, well, here now I got this beautiful thing." And we'd say, "Well, great, but you got to redo your driveway." >> No. >> So, just just throw That's what the old code says. We none of us made that code. That's just >> I know. And the code I didn't make the code either, but the code says a major road. It's not a major road. Okay, that's that's a different thing. Yes. Anybody have more questions for her at all? >> Did you want to say something? >> Okay. I thought I thought you said something. >> Maybe I'm just lost in the conversation, but can we can you make that straight parallel to your house rather than having it curved? >> I can't because you know what what happened was the folks that lived here before. Yep. >> And I'm sure Kevin can attest to this. There is a beautiful brown fence. It's a chainlink fence with the brown striping stuff that go in it. Somebody hit it and hit it hard at some point. And it's bent right here. And to accommodate that, the fencing company when they came in, they twisted it and they pushed it this way. So that's why there's this curve is because there is a terrible slope that is in there. There is a retaining wall along here which is within a couple of inches that you probably can't see of that fence because >> I have no choice, >> right? >> And I can't. If you guys want to give me permission to cut into here where it was before, I'm shaking. Sorry, I'm cold. if you want to give me permission to cut right in here because this was supposed to be a tuck under a garage and that first which I'm sure if you scroll through Jesse you would find it there's two little arrows >> and on a drawing for a plat or a drawing for a home from an architect two arrows going up to a home and down to the street and signify a driveway access. There was two at that property, but it got taken away when Three Points was put in. >> When you're done showing that arrow thing, can you explain all those other pictures that you did? >> My point. Those other pictures like annoying. Sorry. >> Those other pictures are >> You got to talk into the thing. >> I do. >> Yes. >> Okay. It's recording. >> Yeah, that's why. >> So, the other pictures that are in your packet are pictures of other vehicles. Right there. >> Sorry. >> Oh, yeah. See the arrows and the arrow? This in signifies a driveway. This was a driveway. This was an access to three points. And here is the access to Baywood Shores. >> Okay. Can you show the pictures and just >> all the crazy pictures? >> Why? Why are you >> So, go back to the one, Jesse, if you wouldn't mind. Wait. So, go. Nope. Sorry. Keep going. >> Sorry. I wish I could control it. I thought I would have control of it, which is why I didn't bring my laptop. >> Okay. So, whose yard is this? >> This is my yard. >> This is my pickup truck. You guys were saying, the city engineer was saying you can't see down three points. This is me and I'm not on the curb. I am at level with where you would see the fire hydrant behind here. I am in driver's seat. I can clearly see this car coming. >> Oh, there's a car coming. >> I wouldn't pull out. There's >> This is Redwood. But I don't know if you know who Redwood is. He's very large man around mound all the time. >> Okay, let's go to the next one. >> So, what's what's >> this is me in my truck looking the other way. This is Jameson's house right here. Okay, >> so this is stop sign. This is where I'm staying. I can put a mirror here so that when I'm in the other picture, I can look back down west. >> All right, what's the next one? >> This is a bad one to see. This is a gentleman who is pulling out. He lives on three points. This is the top of the hill when you're on three points and you're heading west and you're going back towards Shell gas station. >> This poor guy has to pull out at the top of the hill and very harm's way in hazardous conditions. Somebody going 30 m hour. >> Okay. >> He can't see. >> All right. >> But he's allowed to drive there because that's where his driveway is. >> Right. >> These people pull it backwards in or do they just never move their cars? How do they get out? >> Yeah. This is a three points house. >> Okay. >> And then is there one more? >> Here's another one. This person pulled in. This person backed in. You can't say that backing into a driveway is impeding. We are a boating recreational community. >> I saw two large boats being pulled down the road and they were impeding traffic like you wouldn't believe. >> And then last one is this guy >> just another person who's got a driveway that they pulled into because eventually you got to back in or pull out. >> Got it. Okay. So, I do have just out of interesting sakes. Um, I had the city of Orno, just so that you know that I'm extremely thorough say how many cars go up and down three points. >> I don't know if you guys get these. You probably do. >> We asked them to do that. So, >> yeah. >> Yep. They put their little trailer with their little thing. >> So, believe it or not, I wish the cop would have been here because I would have been like to go, "Uh, who's going 54 miles an hour on that street?" Mhm. >> There's a lot of traffic that goes on Three Points. That does not go unnoticed by me as a resident because I sit there. I live there, >> right? >> I have a pet. >> I just want an apron. I don't think I'm asking too much. >> All you're asking for is an apron. Got it. >> Right. >> All right. >> You guys painted it. Jesse painted it for me. So, or whoever at the city painted it for me. >> Appreciate it. >> Why would you paint it if you weren't going to allow me to acknowledge it's a driveway? >> Okay. All right. Do I get your rebuttal after any other questions? >> No, this is your chance and that's >> Oh, well, thanks for your >> If you have any other last things, say it now. >> No, I don't know if I have any other last things. Um, >> we'll we'll we'll talk about it and we'll make a decision. >> You have something? >> Yeah. Um, Mr. Mayor, members of the council, I just want to be clear that the zoning code or ordinances that are enacted by the city council that govern the use of property Um what we have and and under this set this provision of code we have that you can have one apron. Um driveways have to be paved. If there are unpaved driveways it it's most most likely that they are legal non-conforming uses and then they'll bring up brought up to code. You said with there is some major work that's done. Um the the my understanding from reading the code where it talks about having one apron it can be modified if the city if at the city engineers discretion that discretion has to is has to be done with a rational basis. Um if there is which is laid out in uh Mr. Bowman's letter. If there's a disagreement with that dis that decision, this is the avenue where it goes down with the variance from that code provision and then the city council will make its decision using the criteria for a variance and exercising its rational discretion. >> Thank you. >> All right. Thanks. >> All right. Discussion unless you want to bring Sarah back up if anybody has questions. Otherwise, just talk with us. All right. No, I just was going to ask Sarah about the driveway across the street. Did they have a permit? >> Do you want to come back up? >> Did they file for a permit or do you know? >> This is part of the problem. We're self-reporting for complaints. And I'm assuming someone must have called and complained because I don't think Ryan would have been just driving around and noticed that this was going on. You see what I'm saying? >> No. To be honest with you, Brian was >> this is between >> us now. Okay. >> She directed at me. the rules. Sorry, it's fine. It's fine. >> I'm just trying to keep it on track so we understand get going. If you want to talk to someone, talk to her or talk to us. >> Okay. No, it's fine. >> I can jump in if if I may. Um Yes, please. So, >> my understanding from Ryan is that he was called by the contractor. >> Okay. >> Um and I do believe that there there was a permit across the street as well. >> So, he did w he did widen the driveway in accordance with >> because it was the same contractor working on both sides of the street. >> Thank you. Any other discussion? >> So can you talk about the legal non-conforming the payment comment you made? >> Yeah. So if if we if typically if you find if if you have a condition on your property that exists and the zoning code has changed, you don't h you're not required to bring that property to the new zoning code. It's called legal non-conforming use. Got it. >> But in this situation, um the question is one is it considered to be a driveway because there's no curb cut. It's and so once and once a curb cut is made or this variance is granted for a curb cut, you can put conditions on to bring them up to bring a property up to code. >> Do we have to do it right with this curb cut or is that for the future use down the road? >> Well, as part of the variance process, you can look to say will allow the curb cut and and we and you can do what however you want to do with the with the driveway. That can be part of the variance. >> Yeah. >> So it can it can be the varian >> you don't have to force her to to tar it right now or asphalt. >> No, I mean Sarah and I did talk about that um prior to the planning commission meeting and um that can be part of the variance. The condition can be that you know it does with regard to this variance allowance you don't need to uh pave or this is what you have to do but if there's any other um I guess other permits that are pulled for the for the property major construction then maybe we'll look you can >> but that would happen anyway because if she built the garage then we would part of the condition of it you'd have to potentially pay Yeah, but we want to make but but the way the resolution would be drafted just would make sure that >> that this in the future it may have to be paid based on other work that may be done. >> Okay. >> So, this is my opinion on this thing if you guys want to hear it. Uh she's been using this thing for how many years? It's all we're doing is giving her curb cut so she can access the property that she's already trying to do, not jumping a curb. I don't think it's a big deal. I think the other thing too is it's not a major road. It says in the code that the major road potentially is three-point hypothetically, but this other road is not. Go around mound right next to ours. We we have a we have a up and down driveway right right next between me and your houses. Um and it's on both roads. It's on uh what road do you live off? >> West Edge. West Edge and uh Beachwood, right? You come up and you can go right back down. I don't know. I just think this is a common sense. Just let her curb cut it and move on. I don't think it's that big of a deal personally, but you guys can fight me on that. >> No, I can be talked into it. I I just like I guess I do want to make some comments though. And what's our end >> game here tonight? Is it to make a decision for a resolution for the future? Well, from what it sounds like, we're going to have to come back at the next meeting and do it on the consent agenda. >> Oh, just like what we did with the lids. We >> should have been able to figure that out. Sorry. >> So, the other thing, too, is never it was six to2 on on planning. Yep. >> Planning there were no slouches, right? They had a good discussion about it. Um, and even the two I get I want I want it to be paved eventually, but I don't think just for her to use her property it I remember talking when I was on planning remember with you and we would have that discussion where it's like well my truck doesn't fit in my garage and I was like well why'd you buy a big truck? You know you had the house before you bought the truck. you know, at the same point it is >> oh boy, >> you know, a problem, right? Cuz it's like I can't park my truck and I use it and I and I'm working and so this is a uh a problem. >> Yeah. For them. >> I guess my the comments I wanted to make were I don't I I like that the neighbors I don't know if they voiced support or no one objected. They were you know >> Well, they all signed you >> they all sign. If the neighbors are like that's most important that your your neighbors are are cool with that. Um, I don't want to pick on your other neighbor, but like my other main point is that if it does create an issue, you know, if it's like a safety thing, backing out a boat, I get it. A lot of people have boats and they their driveways are right on three points and it's busy. >> And I was honestly thinking of that one neighbor that you mentioned where the boat's like sitting 90 degrees, you know, perpendicular to the road. I mean, that's just what happens. >> But we're backing off of a of a road. >> That's what I'm saying. I'm just saying like, you know, there's boats that back up into every street, major road or local road, and >> some people need several attempts to back their trailer up. Um, >> and I I was actually least concerned with the material of the driveway. You know, that wasn't a big sticking point to me if it was now or later. >> I think if it was a main driveway, it was exploring all the options. You know, >> if it was if it's a secondary, I'm not that concerned if it was main >> because a lot of people have a secondary. I mean, my neighbors one where they have like the the crushed gray rock and I mean it looks really nice. It looks better than a lot of people's pavement, you know. >> Um, but I guess I do want to comment on I don't think anybody was acting on on their feelings. I mean, I want to give our planning commission credit. Like you said, they do a good job. I think city staff was probably whether it was city staff andor planning, I would stand behind them probably just using the most caution that they thought they should and not making any wrong decisions and doing this the right way, which leads us here. >> Yeah. >> But yeah, I I I mean I can be okay with it. >> You have any comments? Well, I my my gut instinct is to go with the city staff recommendation >> because I think that we keep making exceptions and we're constantly so why have ordinances because everyone comes and makes an exception to it. Um, and at some point in time we're going to have to stop or else we're going to have to say, well, you know, two weeks from now, someone else could come in with something similar and what are we going to say to them? Oh, well, no, now we're going to follow the ordinance. >> Yeah, I've never I always think about that, too. And I've never not gone with planning's recommendation that I can recall, you know, and >> but I mean that is always in the back of my head, too. It's like, >> but I think you have to think about our staff has the expertise. >> Yeah. >> They're following the the ordinances that that were laid out >> by this city government >> and um you know the question to me is well maybe we need to go and change the ordinance. >> Well, that's the problem and that's one of the comments that she said was >> if if we're so supporting this then change the ordinance. don't keep making people or the council constantly go against the rules and regulations we've established. >> I mean the point to make on that too is you know like this case is just as important for referencing it in the future for variances just as we're referencing past variances now. So >> but remember like >> I agree with you too. >> I remember all the details about the shed thing but remember you know I had a problem with that and I voted against it. Yep. >> Um, but then there's other ones that have it's like it's two inches higher than the top. You know, their their garage is going to be two inches higher than their house. >> You can't even tell from the street. It's like make a common sense decision here. >> Yeah. >> She's trying to use her property. Give her a cur. I don't think it's a big deal. >> We got to use some common sense sometimes with government unfortunately. >> Or yes, we do need to go back and go through our code. problem is lot a lot of times we're reactive because we haven't we don't we can't forecast a problem you know and all of a sudden oh god I never thought of this would ever be a thing >> all of a sudden >> thinking about the city engineers letter too you know like kind of just making sure that we take every concern into consideration I don't want to jog past that you know it's not people's feelings we're just looking at every scenario responsibly but the fact that no neighbors objected is important >> and I would have more of a problem if it was the other main road even though the planet says that that's where it was originally supposed to go or something. But >> yeah, I'm I'm >> I don't know. >> I'm okay with it. >> What do you think? >> My only comment is I'd like to see it move so it's further from the corner which would resolve the issues that everyone else seems to be having from >> so straight, >> right? So it's straight, >> you know? I don't know if that's viable. It sounds like >> it isn't, but I don't really know. I haven't looked at it physically. Like in other words, have to go right like this, >> right? because that would put it over here and make everybody happy. It's a little further away from the curb, you know. Plus, it might be easier for her to manage if it's straight rather than curved. I don't know. I don't back a boat trailer up. I'm going to be the first to confess. >> How do you put a verbiage for make it more straight? >> That's my technical term for it. Make it more straight. >> Give a distance from the end of the lot. >> Oh, you you measure it out. >> So many feet. So many feet. >> That's my best guess. That's Sarah's court. >> Just make it go. Sorry, I can't touch it. >> That's what I was thinking. That's close to >> So that's right here, which alleviates these issues. Sorry, I know everybody can't see what I'm >> I just I just for a point of clarification. >> Where's that? >> What the council member is talking about is that it goes from the back goes straight and instead of curving the way it does, this goes straight towards the street, >> right? So it's perpendicular with the house. >> I'm just trying to compromise the yellow. >> Like if this can go this way, it puts it further from this issue over here and the fire hydrant, you know. I just don't know the terrain here. I don't you know obviously >> see we're getting into stuff. See, we're getting into engineering road. >> Um, why don't you come up and just real quick? >> I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. When >> it's got to be videotaping this, too. >> Sorry, Jason. When we bought this property and all these trees were here, we had contacted the city and the gas company and said, "This is our goal." And they said, "The gas line comes in off of the main road. It takes a sharp turn and it goes to here." Okay. >> It then elbows back down and it accommodates. There's a icky spot on the road. Icky on the road because Tom Kelly had an issue with his gas thing. So, they had to rank into all of this just to get here. So, they redirected it. >> So, can you make it straight or No, >> I can't. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. >> Appreciate it. All right. >> All right. Sorry. >> Are you okay with the curb road or not? >> No. It's not ideal, but >> you know, there's nothing we can do about it evidently. Again, I just think it's common sense. Give a curb cut. Yeah. So, anyway, uh we we need to give kind of I guess a vote or motion to staff. Okay. So, are you for it? Do you want to make a motion or do you want me to make it? >> I I don't care. I wasn't for it. I mean, I like I said, I was talked into it just based on the neighbors, you know, being okay with it. And there's busier roads that votes are back out on too. So, >> okay, I'll make a motion. >> I can make a motion. I don't know what it >> I'll make a motion to allow the curb cut and for staff to bring back recommendation for consent agenda for approval of the curb cut >> with no conditions. >> Yeah, let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do this. We'll do motion to um direct the city planner and city attorney to draft a resolution >> for the granting the barriers. >> Okay. cancel on previous motion >> with no with no conditions or with >> um well I don't >> I I >> we're not making it straight. >> Yeah, I don't think I think the only I think the only condition that we talked about was that you'll allow the variance is also going to include the ability not to pay. We can keep it as is right >> for Yeah. And until such time at such time that we'll come up with some verbiage >> until such time that other construction or >> Yeah. If she adds onto the house or builds a garage or big shed, then yes, you might need a pavement at that point or whatever. >> Okay. >> Is that >> Yeah. I mean, yeah, because the resolution is going to capture it. The motion is just to draft that resolution grant uh granting the variance. >> Okay. Okay. I don't want to drag this out, but then the conditions would be that for future permits like a shed or something, then paving would be probably required. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> It's like the longest motion ever. >> All right. So, do you want >> Well, okay. So, we'll just say it's because the the details will be in the resolution that's brought back. >> Okay. I would say resol or it's a motion to direct the city the well the director uh director of community development and the city attorney to draft a resolution to grant the variance um for the curb cut and for not improving the driveway area. um until such until such other till until other improvements are made on the property. Stop it there and then we'll bring and then we'll we'll have the details in the resolution that fall in line with what you're thinking of. >> Okay. So that's my motion and the address is 1705 Baywood Shores Drive planning case 259. I got a motion. Can I get a second? >> Second. >> Okay. Any other discussion? All those in favor please say I. >> I. Those opposed? >> I >> Okay. >> Did you say I? >> No, I said I I didn't say it loud enough. >> Okay. >> I'm in agreement. I say I. >> Okay. So, three three to one. Sorry. >> So, we'll come back and it'll be on the consent for >> uh two weeks from now. >> Okay. >> Does that make sense? >> Okay. So, we the three of the three of us said yes, we're we're going to but it still needs to come back on the the next meeting, whatever date that is, the 20 >> in two weeks, >> 3rd. >> Uh so, it'll be on the consent agenda. Now, someone can still pull it from the consent agenda and we can still discuss it and decline it or approve it. But all things going great for you, it would be approved and then done to you two weeks from now. But again, it's not a done deal if it's on the consent. >> Yeah. And if I may, Mr. Mayor. >> Yes. >> Um, as we know, resol the resolutions for this have to be in we in written form. >> Yeah. >> And so there was >> Yeah. To create the record, the findings of facts. And so the um the reason why we didn't have a resolution in front of you because of the differing opinions of both the staff and the planning commission recommendations. So in it is not it in this in normal fashion that we do um there's you have discussion you vote on make on bringing a resolution back in two weeks for the next council meeting to have on the consent agenda. >> Right. >> Okay. So just work work with Sarah um and then you might want to come two weeks from now. So thank you. All right. Uh, number nine, we have >> we got approve resolution 2575, authorization plans and spec expect specs to award bid for the water treatment plant improvements line. Thank you, mayor and members of the council. Matt Bowman, city engineer. Um, so yeah, before you tonight, we're as we're asking for authorization to bid the well 9 project, which is actually the third phase of the the state granted money for the 10.3 million. Uh, so I got some numbers in the in the letter there. Kind of the budgeted amount for the well work is 1.85 million. Our current estimate is 1.2 um a little over 1.2 2 million and give and take on where how some of the money is being split between the different projects, but we we should be well within the budget. Um so we're just looking for authorization to bid. Um I'll comment now that that number is also probably higher than what you're going to see when we come back because we we're discussing well there's two wells to be abandoned with this piece of the project too. Um, and one of them we're actually going to recommend not to abandon first uh because of the aquifer that it taps into and some um risk management strategy that it provide the city in the future. And so that'll bring some of that cost down that we save that for later. >> So that part is not like a now or never thing. It's like you're just saying don't do it now. >> Yeah. So ba basically because you have an well that taps into a certain aquifer, it gives you a right to tap a new well into that same aquifer and >> Okay. at a better location, closer to the the plant potentially if we if we needed it, say 20, 30, 50 years in the future. But if we get rid of if we abandon it now, we lose that right to do that. >> Just so everybody knows, uh is this is the well up by uh >> three points. >> This one that we're >> Oh, yeah. So, the drill >> the new well >> Yeah. >> goes uh by the in the water treat by the water treatment plant site at Sorbbo Park. >> Soro Park. Yeah. Um the wells to be abandoned are up off a three points tucked up. Um yeah, just like a block in there. >> Yeah. Okay. And so again, this is part of the uh 10.3 million that we got from the state of Minnesota and uh we got it in 20 and then we unlocked >> No, we got in three and then we had to change the locked >> in 24. Yep. Um and uh so this again, this is the well we're we're drilling no matter what. And then we're going to tie into the current um uh well, we don't have a treatment plan >> into the new >> into the eventual new treatment plant, but even if we don't do the treatment plant, it's still good that a new a new well is going to come online for >> uh purposes of serving mound with water. So, uh, so yeah, and then you you guys are just going out to forbid. And so when we get that back, we're hoping for the one two number >> or we're >> it'll likely be less than that because of what I just talked about with that other well. >> Perfect. Y >> some good bids then, >> I think. >> Yeah. >> All right. Any any questions for him? >> All right. Uh, do we got a resolution? Okay. Does someone want to make that >> motion? I hear Kevin likes to read these. >> I don't know if he likes to read them. He just only when he does. >> You want to read it? Go ahead. >> No. >> All right. I think that's my queue. >> All right. >> I'll uh make a resolution. >> Motion. >> Motion for a resolution receiving plans and specifications and ordering advertisement for bids for the water treatment plant improvements. Well, number nine, resolution 2575. >> All right. Got a motion. Can I get a second? >> Second. >> Okay. Any discussion? All those in favor, please say I. >> I. >> I. >> I. >> Those opposed. All right, that passes. Thanks. >> Thank you. >> All right. Number 10, we're skipping till next week. And then number 11. This is just the council of priorities uh checklist check-in. Um I think last year we did this in July. Can you go as kind of as big as you can on that? So I'm going to try to read it from here. Um, so basically what we're going to do, and I'm going to try to go fast because the last time I did this, I think I took two hours. >> Um, can you just highlight as we go? Just say green is like done. >> Yeah. Can we update this like just so we when we look at it next, it's like, okay. Yeah. >> I have the highlighted version on my computer, but I didn't give it to him. >> Um, and I don't have my computer. Um, so water funding, again, work with state rep. Myers and Senator Jonathan Stewart to get more funding. And again, that's ongoing. So, I think I would maybe let's just ongoing. Let's just do yellow because that's we're still working on it. Well, just do that one section. Well, what Well, hold on. Maybe maybe the whole thing is yellow. Uh work with federal uh elected reps uh to get money. Now, that one uh it actually we we only thought we were going to apply for three. We actually applied for 15 and we just heard back uh right before the last meeting that we only got uh we're only in the bill for 1 million now. So, do you want to put just a little thing and just say um in bill for 1 million and assuming our federal government uh votes on this September 30th or by September 30th and doesn't do a continuing resolution or something. Hopefully, we'll find out soon. Um this was um kind of the point of I guess me and then with uh the uh finance committee too that we were thinking about you know is there a way that we can fund this thing on our on our own and I thought you know we'd need to have a serious discussion. I know we did back in July uh we had you know invited everybody out. were at the the tent and Spirit of Lakes and we said, "Hey, come on out." Put on Facebook. Um, we had seven people show up. So, um, we're still trying to fight for this. At the same point, I still think and part of we're coming back uh what, next week with a resolution for uh for the uh study utility study. >> Okay. So, next week or two weeks from now, we're going to potentially approve this the study And then once we get the study back with the utility study, then we'll we'll be able to see, okay, how what does what does this look like for each resident if we ended up going ahead and passing this on our own or should we just keep waiting um for for money from other people? Uh so state of the water meeting March, uh that's green. We did that. Uh we do that every March and we again we just maybe just do slash we did one in July just so we kind of remember that >> July 22nd uh update in every newsletter. So I I I said this last time I think there was 10 out of 12 newsletter since I've been you know in this spot and so 10 out of 12 we referenced you know our update the water whatever and then this last uh newsletter we just put that in there. So, I think it's 11 out of 13 now. >> Um, maybe just put 11 out of 13. >> Well, this isn't 2025. 11 out of 13 in the last two years. >> So, it's kind of done, right? >> So, I would say, yeah, we're we're ongoing. We're always doing that. >> That'll be done. >> Uh, the fourth quarter, we'll put it in there, too. >> Uh, look for savings. Uh, watch for spending. So, again, we're we're on top of that, Jesse. It's a con constant discussion if you know what they're buying, what they're doing. You know, every meeting member we're going through the what they've spent. So, I would call that good. Green. And then uh this we'll talk about two weeks from now. Stay on the long-term financial plan for 2025 budget committee to review. We'll have more on that in two weeks when we we have to make a decision uh by the end of September. And that's our only last meeting. So hopefully we agree on something next meeting. Um eliminate your budget. There you go. Uh so whatever we decide to set the levy at at the 923 meeting is the highest we can go. We can always come back lower uh by December uh in our final meeting. >> Uh communication. So website, we did get the new uh website for 2025. Uh that looks great. We're still working out some of the kinks. Again, Maggie's gone now, but she got it pretty much done by the time she left. Um, posting weekly creative updates. I know Jesse hasn't has taken this over uh since Maggie. I'm sure you love that. But anyway, it's I still see it happening, so that's good. Uh, facts about mound. Uh, updates about well in the next one, too. Meet the staff Tuesday. I I just saw one the other day. They're, you know, I think good to get get the the message out there. You know, who these are. Explore Minnesota. Do we ever get on the website? I know you're >> talking about that. >> Well, we I think I'm I'm not sure if we're on the website or not. I get the invitations. >> Okay. >> For the meetings, I guess. >> We've never >> Yeah. Okay. >> You're on. Yeah. >> Okay. So, just put yellow. We're still working on getting on their website for Explore Minnesota. uh newsletter, park feature. So, we work with uh uh Joanna Khan to put a park feature in in either all or most of the newsletters. Um so, that's green because we keep doing that. Uh and then council updates, we're putting that in there. And then please fire, you know, we're putting that in there, too. So, that's ongoing. We're doing it. Uh digital news newsletter, I think that has to be yellow. Um we're not quite to the push level of you know we don't have everybody's emails and stuff but we're trying to push more data more information to people so they are informed >> um okay parks last lake common so remember that we did this back in January February whatever uh so finish phase two again I think our goal was we don't want to look at a dandelion park for the next three years so let's just get it done in fa and do it so finish phase two for 2025 I call that good. And then the the phase three, you know, we did kind of pivot on that a little bit. Um, so I would maybe write a note that we're putting uh, you know, the artwalk in in the phase 2.5. We're going to focus on that for 2026, but potentially that could be phase three or, you know, the last phase of this park hypothetically. >> We haven't agreed to an artwalk though. No, no is need to come up with a different >> could just call it work on phase 2.5 because it was the arwok the fire pit and then a bunch of other stuff. >> Yeah. >> Right. So I' I'd say over the winter >> let's try to get phase two and a half or whatever three call. I I called the two and a half. So we better keep two and a half. >> Yeah. >> Keep that um >> want to stay consistent. >> Uh you know working on over winter so we're ready to go for the spring for the new year. if you know what the Arlo walk is going to look like if we're doing fire pits or you know whatever we're doing. Um and then >> um so then just put yellow on that part on the half of it. >> We are keeping it on schedule so that's good. >> Yeah. >> Well again three was 2026 and I know if you in the past the phrase was phase three in the future, >> right? It wasn't 2026 specifically, but my point with, you know, especially this park is like, let's just get it done. Like, why why are we why are we just dragging this thing on? That was my problem with Surfside, too. Yeah. >> Is like, >> you know, we did this master plan and then, you know, then it's just like, but we never had money and it's like, >> right, >> are we doing this or not? Because if we're not, let's just get off the list and say, well, this is what your park looks like. So, that's not what we want. We want to finish this thing. Okay. Lost Lake Commons adding and her sister's uh trail. >> I know you guys have talked about that in parks, right? >> We have to go to the county. >> Okay. >> And get them to move on extending >> the trail. >> So, we'll put that as a yellow and then the parks, you guys are going to continue working on it. >> Okay. Um wayfinding trail signs. So this is actually I would say yes we are we just approved that right in our last meeting. Um now signs with local businesses work on design sign. I mean that's kind the wayfinding trail signs is what we just did in a last. So I think that's the intent of what we're talking about. So I would say that that's done or it's going to be done. We voted on that uh grant opportunities for age friendly city grant. Do >> we? >> We actually have there is a group um that met at Gillespie that's interested in pursuing the designation as age friendly city. >> Okay. And so, um, they're supposed to meet again this September and talk about next steps, >> okay, >> that they bring. >> So, really with because you have delays on, >> we're just I'm just kind of leaving in on your lab. So, >> if you know you need anything from us, let us know. >> And then event coordinator position. So, we did kind of talk about um that and actually I think we was at the first August meeting. We gave approval. Of course, it's probably too late for this year obviously, but >> Right. But the framework is there. >> The framework is there for next year. So, I think we probably got to put that as yellow. Like we're the framework's there, but do we got to fine-tune it over winter to get that ready to go for events next year in the park? >> Right. >> Okay. So, >> accurate. >> Again, the parks uh Joanna, she came up to Yeah. >> And and asked us to do, you know, more events and stuff. And then we had our attorney work on it, go back and forth. >> We passed the resolution. >> We passed a resolution. So the framework is there. I think we had we're going to fine tune it over the winter. >> So we're not talking about add to staff. We're just talking about creating >> Well, my plan >> my point with putting commission parks member, >> okay, >> is really her. I mean, she is the one who volunteered to do it. >> Okay. So if she wants to take it on then that's I mean her time obviously but it's free. >> I just want to make sure we're clear on that. Okay. >> But we were looking at an intern or >> I think originally it was like how do we add like a parks person right to our staff and it's just we can't we don't have enough money. >> So that's why I was like if we can get more volunteers from whether it's parks or intern or >> sure >> one of us wants to take it on. >> Um she decided to take it on so that's great. And >> okay, >> so hopefully next year we can kind of expound on that. So like when we do this in January again and we say okay what do we want for next year or you know 2026 that this should be a big thing that we talk about of you know if she does three events in summer or four or you know in our new park you know >> right >> the point of the park you >> look into each park use we you know we talked about this earlier but this is uh >> you know we're going to talk about this in the workshop um right >> next week >> and just so everyone's on the same page I've been I have been I don't know what Kathy's been doing but I've worked on building out a strategy that I'll get over to Jesse by the end of the week so that it can be sent out to everybody. >> The strategy meaning >> around parks, the overall strategy about what we can possibly do as a council to make sure we've got it budgeted for financials, improvements, long-term strategy >> for material for the next workshop. >> Yes. >> Okay, cool. So with workshops, >> half the time we come and they just give us the paper, you know, the stuff, right? >> And then the other half I think it's just an agenda, right? It's just like high level. >> Well, can we get the the strategy? >> Can we do that ahead of time? >> Yeah, we it would just be posted like a packet like normal. >> Jesse definitions of different types of parks, right? >> Right. I think Yeah. I mean, I've just put it out in a word document, but we'd PDF it and then Jesse could add or maybe we I won't PDF it. Jesse can add a comment at the top that this is >> a discussion. >> Well, I just caution because what happened last time I >> remember you're one person out of all five of us. So, if you throw something out there, >> I don't know. I'd almost keep it more high level. >> Yep. >> Um >> it is >> because we might all say, "Well, what are you doing?" >> No, I know. Oh, I know. And that's why this is laid out more as a discussion agenda type situation. >> Well, I put a lot of disclosures on there. >> Yeah. >> That this is a workshop. This is a conversation piece, >> especially if he's going to post it, you know, on the website or out in public. Yes. >> Otherwise, >> I I do not want to have a repeat of the last. >> Well, and maybe we say again when you when you send out the workshop alert, we need to be more specific on, you know, write a paragraph of what we're actually discussing. And maybe you got to work with uh the two council members on framing that >> exactly >> you want to put on there we can we can do >> I'll work with Jesse >> okay uh okay so parking lot resurface I know I just talked to you a couple weeks about about that we're getting are we getting close on that or >> we're working on >> can it can it be green >> because I'm trying to get it done this year so if you want to do something now I would recommend just like sealing it fog sealing Okay. >> And once we're done with a with all the Lost Lake Commons work, then we look at maybe resurfacing. >> So, I wanted to make it look nicer because it doesn't look nice. So, what does fogging do? >> So, that that basically turns it black and kind of reseals it. So, it'll look like kind of what we did around city hall here. >> Does that look nice? >> Last Did you do that last year? >> I was sealing it >> like a seal coat. >> Yeah. >> It'll look nicer. >> It'll look nicer. Otherwise, you're talking about repaving, but how much is that's going to be a lot more money. >> That That's quite a bit more. And we wouldn't want to do that until because we use that lot to access the park to do all the other work. So, >> yeah, >> any kind of construction work that happens in there. If we re >> construction, they're going to kind of scuff it all up and it's not going to look nice again. >> So, >> well, there's no point to fog it if we're going to redo it. So, I just have to be patient, >> right? That's what >> Okay. So, >> well, I think it also would depend on when >> when we going to combine this with another deal, >> but >> well, probably phase three, depending on when what phase three is. >> No, I'm saying like you said, we'll wait till the fall because we're going to combine it with another job and >> we had talked about possibly doing it with um I think the work on three points and then >> was that the electrical work? >> No, just with other road work. We ain't got crews in town. But so now we're we're we've been talking about it as a staff and um we can make it look nice and we're not going to destroy it by driving across it just now. It's just that a matter of doing an actual resurface >> before doing more work across it is >> So are we talking about Lakeshore Drive and the parking lot or we talking just about the parking lot? I was specifically just talking about where the farmers market sits. >> Okay. Because Lakeshore Drive really is messy. >> That's another problem, >> too. But >> when's that on schedule? >> Uh, Old Are you talking about Old Shoreline? >> Oh, sure. >> That's actually it for reconstruction for next. >> Yeah. >> For this next year. >> Yeah. For6. >> Okay. >> That's good. That's good. >> Let's say when you do that, why don't we hopefully combine that with a repave, >> not a fog. So if the timing is right, >> then we come back to because we still have the future lost like I don't know how far how two 2.5 and like the shelter >> are kind of >> but why do they have to destroy everything and drive it over it? >> The weight of the >> they just need to like they're going to be turning equipment around. They got to drop a lot of stuff off especially when they're going to build that shelter. >> Yeah. >> They're going to want a spot where they can lay down just beams and different materials. My point is I wanted I wanted our downtown to finally look good and just move on from that. >> And that's what we were talking about earlier. >> You want it to look good, but you've got to stage it. And that those driveways are probably the last the last work done because he's saying, you know, >> I get it. I get it. >> They've got to haul in all that stuff. I I >> You know what I would like to add though is when we're looking at um the street and the parking lot and the park that we look at potentially solar lighting systems for all of that and the lighting would go all the way up to commerce, you know, so it would be consistent. >> All right. Well, I'm not going to get my way on this. I don't think so. >> My my point is I think farmers market, I want them to have a nice new pad. >> Yeah. >> I want that to match the new beautiful park and the concrete uh walkway that we just put in and then what we're going to about to do this fall. And I I don't know just, you know, I hear comments and I people talk to me and they're like, "It's like World War II going through your town, you know, seriously." And you know, yes, we did the sidewalks and now we just got the uh you know, all new roads which is like always beautiful >> and it's just like let's just finish this last thing and be done. So fine, let's just move. Do you want to just say we're going to have to move to 2026 >> or do you have any >> I mean I think that that would be if it's an actual resurface then it would have to be at this point. Um I and I for what it's worth, the scope of the park and what we thought we were maybe going to get done for 2025 when we were talking about it in January was a little bit different than when we were talking about it in >> right >> June. So I mean I I think that plays a little bit of a part in it. I mean, if if um and then to Matt's point, I mean, I guess maybe over the winter we'll have a better idea of what phase two and a half looks like and maybe this is more feasible >> for the spring and you So, I I guess I'm trying to be glass half full for you too here on this one because I >> I think there's always options. >> Okay. I'm just like, you know, we get the calls, we get the emails, >> you know, and I think people wanted to see it done. I mean, the dandelion field is looking better, >> right? And we're getting there >> even better next year. >> It's going to be better next year. And then we can finish this parking lot farmers market's going to be happy. And then that takes us to the next. So, why don't you just push that just say going to punt to 2026 or whatever you want to say. Move to 2026. >> Align with timeline for closely. um >> phase three. >> Yeah. Well, and so this uh ice rink in the winter, I mean, again, that goes with the one on top. If we did that, you want to, you know, have a nice >> ice >> area to put it on. >> Yeah, that's yellow. >> Um again, in the workshop, there was a talk about a playground downtown. Um again, artwalk. I think playground was nixed, right? I would hope so. We've got how many other playgrounds? >> So, why don't you just say >> uh I deleted >> that was brought back was the splash park. >> Uh well, the splash park member is very very very expensive. >> I know I'm I'm not in favor of it, but but I thought that there was somewhat of a positive >> and you know, >> we had a lot of money. I'd love a splash park when I drive by Wisetta and there are people playing on there every day >> in the summer. >> Yeah. >> But you know a lot of money right so we just can't do that. Okay. So and then t you know art walk whatever right discuss and join. We did right that we did that in well we did part of it in uh May and we can do more you know over the winter. >> Mountain depot we did that was your deal. >> Yeah. Can I >> talk on that for a second? I think we should leave it >> yellow. I mean, we do have there there is budget already set aside for it in forget if it's parks or public works or whatever, but okay. >> But it's not um detailed like if we're going to give parks and open spaces kind of direction on >> like I feel like it needs to be more specific >> like we met as a finance committee last time. I wanted to bring to our next >> council workshop of the budget as a whole to outline the depot improvements like inside and out. you know what inside and outside like cosmetic improvements and then some of the internal stuff that was already planned. I think it's kind of spelled out on some of the equipment but it's really vague so it doesn't really give parks anything to like what exactly should we do with whatever amount of money. >> So I feel like we can't make that green yet part of the 2025 budget. >> It's in for 2026. There's mount depots in the budget for 2026 but it's not clear on what it should be. There was one suggestion that we do the skating at Surfside because the depot has >> facilities >> and you could, you know, merge those two. >> But to that point, we should say, you know, this is to cosmetically improve the outside of the building or the roof or the siding or the patio or if it should be internal like with the kitchen equipment or whatever. >> The other thing about like reinvisioning the use of it too, >> just making it better. Yeah. make it a better like so people want to come there more often. >> Uh our rental fees are do we know how >> get the most out of it that we can. >> How often is it used now? >> I think it gets used more than I thought it did and I was kind of off base there but I mean if it can get used more and look better. I mean it's like our >> So if one of our premier parks >> renting it out is it rent it out most weekends >> in the summer spring? >> Yes, in the summer it is. I just think it'd be cool to give parks a detailed, >> you know, here's what we should do for it to get >> Well, why don't we have parks imagine >> that that's what they're good at. >> Yeah, for sure. >> You guys have a number on the budget like here >> the number, >> here's the, you know, we need to this or that, but then big picture, >> how do we get more usage in the winter or, you know, do we do a nice skating rank in the winter? And just with some other moving parts in the budget, I think there's room to put a little bit more money to it than what is set there right now, but that's just like a future workshop thing. >> So, can can you get our liaison maybe some data on like usage and and then just put that as agenda item for the next parks meeting so that they can chat specifically about this line item. And here's a budget for next year. And then >> again in our next council meeting two weeks from now, do you want to chat about >> Yep. >> maybe your ideas or like big picture and then give more direction. >> Sure. >> To them. >> So >> kind of want to Yeah. Just learn on what they're already working on and doing and >> see what else they think is most important >> if I think you know paint. >> Can I interject? Yeah. Um, so what specifically I'll have our admin gather information like how many like how often it's rented or what are you looking for? >> Yeah. >> Could could you do like the last like year to date or like the last year or like what? >> Well, we can do we can do a monthly breakdown. >> Yeah, sense. Okay. >> Was rented for this much and then also this many days or this, >> you know, and then maybe month by month we can see. It'd be good to know if it's weekends mostly or weekend summer weekends. >> It starts at graduation season and ramps up from there. >> People are renting it out a year in advance for those, >> right? >> Oh, wow. Okay. >> Yeah. >> Does it have a fireplace? >> Okay. >> That's the other thing, too. Like >> could it be this is probably not going to happen, but like a you know teen center like you put some couches in there and they completely again maybe not bad but just I'm I'm not the greatest one but like have parks deal >> think outside the box of what >> bring it up. Yeah, >> right. >> All right. C code enforcement rental unit codes enforcement planning. Um well heard it left but >> I haven't heard any more on that. Have you? >> Yeah, we've been kind of quiet on that. Is there any updates from you on >> I can't remember where we left it off. I uh I I'll have a I don't know Jesse if you know but I >> Well, we have there's a a draft I think we probably need to bring to a a workshop which we could do in October. I mean I I foresee it as I mean 923 spoken for. So, um, that's one you just want to slate for first or second meeting October and then we could talk about it and something we could do over the fall or late late fall for 26 or something. I mean, I guess it'll depend on when you want to do assuming it gets passed when you want to do licensing and um, some coordination with safety, but first thing is probably to bring it back in its draft form >> and this is just for rental units. to make sure >> longterm >> long-term rental units, not >> it's still it still does not allow 30 days or less to short-term rentals. It's all it incorporates that part of the code. This is just >> placing on residential uh uh leases and residential, you know, that rentals and residential areas. Um a permit application or permit requirement. I think where we left it off was that the consensus was, you know, unanimous that we did want to move forward with it >> to look at look into it. >> We left it that licensing and multi. >> We were going to like look at best practices from other cities that already have a code and just kind of make our own. >> Well, I I think that's how I developed a draft of of the ordinance. Um, and maybe if we go into October, that'll give us some time as a staff to talk about it, too, to make sure that we're okay with it because I think we've we've stepped away from it long enough and maybe time to >> like maybe we should say second meeting in October. >> Well, we have the budget next two weeks from now. >> Yeah. >> So, we're going to have to Is that going to be on time for you? Or second meeting, would that be better? I >> I It'll be fine, I think. >> Okay. All right. Uh and then the the second B is if a project is approved, keep moving it forward. That just means um you know if if you got a an approval for a remodel of whatever to how do we keep and I I think we already kind of got the answer on that, right? That we don't have a lot of bite on that, right? >> And which one? >> Well, I'm just thinking like if if a if a pro if a developer comes and they >> Oh, yeah. There's not a lot we can do, >> right? We talked about it's entitlements versus Yeah, it Yeah, we went through that already. >> Okay. So, so we should call this >> Yeah. Do you want to green or strike through it or both? Just cuz >> we talked about it, but there's nothing we can do. >> Yeah. There we go. Uh, Mount Citizen of the Year. Um, >> I'm pretty sure we put that in last there, did we? Yeah, I have one in my mailbox. >> One so far. >> Yeah. >> Oh, there you go. Um, and of course it had her name on there before. >> So hopefully they're not. >> Anyway, as you talk to people, see if anybody wants to do a submission for by the end of the year. So I would just say, you know, green, I mean, we're doing it. >> Can that be an organization or just an individual? >> I guess I can go look that up, but Uh I >> think we want individual though. >> We wanted individual last year. I mean we kind of >> Yep. >> Okay. Tree lighting ceremony. Um we're doing that this year. Uh walkthrough light display. Um so I know public works did a really good job last year on this. But >> with with Ryan and the crew, you're going to give them some maybe I can meet with them too. >> I'd say earlier the better. >> Okay. But I mean, can you talk talk and just say, "Hey, Ryan and Dustin, um, start thinking about this because I know last year was a little struggle at the end, even though we've been talking about a whole year." So, um, and then can we rent those fire pits from Matrista or whoever we borrowed them from last time? >> Yep. >> I think they let us borrow. Um, I want kind of the same setup and I think we were hoping to put >> Santa farther. >> Oh, Santa at the gazebo. at the gazebo. So then people have to walk together and maybe don't put all the fire pits >> blocked right by the parking lot last time. It'd be nice to the like the kids down the thing. Yeah, it'd be cool. >> So can you and then obviously WCC I know you're Did you just talk with them this week or is that next week? >> Uh Thursday. This coming Thursday. >> Maybe if you can chat with them just saying because I know they're they're the ones that put on the Santa party. Uh, and then get the word out. We need to um, you know, keep I I would say put on Facebook soon. Maybe Kathy can do a graphic and just say, "Hey, >> save the date." >> Save the date. >> Yeah. >> Yep. Can you remember to do that? And I'd do that a few times, right? By the time >> the next newsletter won't come out until >> November. >> November. away in November. >> So, we're going to throw that in there. Do a save the date. We could maybe do it like a big page or something. >> And the fire department is still going to do their rotation. >> Uh I think so. >> Yeah, they did that last year, right? What's that? >> Oh, no. No, they didn't do the drive-thru thing last year. They canceled that. >> That's right. >> Yeah. You just were at the park. >> Yeah. Two years ago, they did it. So, I don't know if things are going to do anymore. Customer service is always top priority for all residents. Absolutely. Green. We're doing that. Um, Mount is open for business. Green. I I think all of us, but I know I'm talking to people all the time about that. Jesse, uh, and Sarah, reach out. I know you did try to reach out to some of those. I I have as well a little bit. Uh I know Landon is that property over there still for sale. U-Haul I know we're I was talking to her trying to get her to do that. Uh downtown that whole area. Any news on um Charleston or anything? >> Yeah. >> Nothing. >> So we're ready. People want to bring stuff in front of us. Do we know what's happening with the old um vacuum cleaner store? >> Got a new roof. >> Yep. It's a saw that >> it's called Soda Golf. >> Okay. He's doing the golf thing. >> It's an indoor golf simulation thing. >> Okay. >> And so yeah, they did get a new roof. Um walked by it a few times. You they're starting to build out a little bit in there. >> I haven't talked to him, but sounds >> okay. >> Interesting. >> Uh shop local. We We're still doing that. Um, I guess just for for us as we're shopping local ourselves, if you see anybody that doesn't have a thing on their window still, like I know every time I go into Jubilee or go out, it's still there, right? >> Yeah. >> But like if you see something, just maybe grab a new sticker and go give it to them if it fell off or something. >> Uh, I I think this was yours, Eric, but I don't think we're doing this, right? We were going to kind of just >> and holding off till we do a little more clean up and >> strengthen infrastructure >> strike it through and >> what is that now >> waiting also waiting on the website to be developed out so that we could create a page >> uh the development the economic development committee >> we we still have that out there as you know like a plan >> to do but we're not doing any action on that this year >> uh that's already done adopted drain has done uh introduce, we already did that. Introduce in February, so we're good there. Spirit of Lakes, we did that. Um work with the board. I've been doing a lot of that. Um as well as you guys as well. Um >> we have anybody? >> This one, just so you know, I I did talk to them. I would probably cross that off just because there kind of the point that they said is if you want to join, please join. >> We'd love to have you. More the better. >> But we want you to join cuz you're really ready ready to go. Exactly. >> Not cuz the Mount City Council said we have to put a rep on there. >> So I I think that's that's a dead deal. Unless again if someone wants to do it and they're like you I'm really into Spirit of Lakes. They they're looking for people always. Uh same with Orno. Yes, we're done on that. Social worker came this year. >> When are we gonna talk to Spirit of the Lakes about maybe moving part of their celebration to >> Don't tell Lost Lake comments? >> I mean, part of it is maybe in I mean, maybe next year if it looks like >> it's done more done then maybe I can chat with her about it too. >> Yeah. um you know depending on the 2.5 right and you know >> if we're >> well at least having that sort of conceptual conversation >> then maybe it's not that next year 26 but in 27 >> right >> and what does that look like >> yeah I'll I'll chat with her uh joint powers agreement this is an ongoing thing. And just so you know, an update if we haven't told you recently is both of the the fire um >> what do they call it? The utilities >> relief >> relief >> the relief associations uh both have their own pension, you know, payout things, right? And they don't talk to each other well. In other words, one's better and one's not. And so we're trying to reconcile if there's a way to bring that into one uh plan. And so the the fire commission, you were there with me. >> Um we we did talk a little bit about that. So more to come on that. >> Um really that's kind of the big stick in the mud right now. And then after that then it's still we haven't agreed on a a framework for budget per se. Um so that would be the next issue. Uh we were originally trying to get this kind of done halfway through the year being ready to go for the new year. Um that is going to have to be pushed obviously. So um promote mountain history. Again I think we're doing that on social as well as um if if there's anything that you guys want to add to like a newsletter or the historic society or something you know we can really do that. I think we should maybe formalize a a better relationship with the historical society, you know, because there are things that we could partner with them on like on the pathway signs. They can get us access to grant monies to fund those um that signage and stuff. So, I think we should really be talking to them about a partnership. You know, I don't know if you want parks to initiate it. >> I think that'd be good. Yeah. >> You know, but but I think we need to have more conversation with them. >> Part of what we if >> what this art walk is going to look like too, we'll may need to coordinate with them on stuff too. >> Yeah. >> Um >> Okay. Invite M Westa High School to present uh spring and fall. Do you still have the old contact or maybe Kevin does? Um I know they change every other year, you know, every year. for West guys. >> It's the student uh council. >> Yeah, we can track them down. >> You can just email Kevin Borgers. He might he'll give you whoever's the running of the student council and then could we invite them you know October maybe October November something like that we stated that um Centennial we are when is that going to come back I know there's >> just kicked them out too >> they were over at city hall measuring stuff >> I think they finished that all up so >> okay >> I can find out But I'm hoping soon. >> Okay. So, probably October, hopefully the first October meeting. >> Uh change of mayor term from four to two uh wouldn't apply till 20 or next election season, then 2027. We did look at that. The I guess the thought at the time was we're not going to do that. We're not going to change it. >> So, take it off the list. >> Yep. Uh city council to perform interviews for candidates. We haven't had any. Um, so obviously do we need to formalize that in our >> um so we the the next one that would come up would be planning commission but help me out Scott. I think because we are losing one >> that's going to bring us down to that number that the council determined down to down from nine to seven. >> Yep. So >> yeah, >> we wanted to go from 9 to 7, >> right? And so the thought process is is that although it's, you know, it says nine right now, you don't have to fill that. And then through attrition once we get down to that seven, then we do a code amendment to have it be >> to say something. So it's not we're not >> in essence forcing the issue. >> Okay? >> We're just addressing it when once it we're allowing it to naturally occur and then addressing it when it happens. Have you got anybody saying they're not going to renew? >> Yes. >> Two, right? >> Yeah. So, I think we actually going into 26 will be down to our seven. >> You'll be down from 9 to 7, >> right? >> Oh, yeah. >> And then so we'll do the code in January, >> correct? >> Yeah. And it's it's a simple code amendment, just changing the number from 9 to 7. >> Can you just say update code in 2026? When do we look at this again to like, you know, like take these two pages of green and yellow and then what we want to say are our priorities for 2026 and just kind of like, you know, bleed some of it over and then some of it goes away. When did we do that? >> January. >> January. Yeah. >> I think we did a workshop >> either right before our first one or second one. >> Sounds right. >> Yeah. >> And we really kind of copied and pasted this one the year before >> as well. So, >> um, yeah, we had a workshop because we were all, you know, chatting about it. >> Okay. Is that it? >> Yeah. >> Oh, that's it. Nice. All right. All right. Uh, does anybody have any comments on this or anything you want to add by the end of the year? >> Uh, I think number 19 is I want to make 2026 priorities one page. >> Nice and concise. >> All right. >> Cuz we're getting so much done. >> Yeah. Well, we might be able to. Uh, okay. Number 12, comments and reports from council members. Council member Pew. Well, I attended the fire chief the budget uh presentation >> and it was um it was very informative and um as you said there there's a real difference in the way we do our pension fund for mound versus St. Bonnie and that's going to be a point of reconciling which which one they go with or or compromise >> blend of the two. Um but um all in all I think that seems to me the two fire chiefs are are um are you know I think they're ready for doing this. I mean I think they're ready for the change in the crossover. >> Okay >> that was it. >> Uh M is out. Council member Costalano. >> Um I just have a question on the or this sheet that we have the response for the LMCD variance. I don't have anything personally for me. >> Uh maybe just a couple questions, Jesse. Um so it says the city suggests that Minnetonka Flats contribute yearly to a maintenance fund. Do we know what that dollar amount looks like? >> Okay. >> No, so >> I just want to be able to answer questions if they come up. >> Yeah. So the the hearing is tomorrow. Steph felt it was important to to um >> comment. >> Yeah. Well, I was I started getting ahead of myself because if you recall and Mr. Mayor, you were there, but one of the early discussions on this whole on the project itself was how it related to um Lost Lake and the channel. And ultimately, it's the city's responsibility to to keep navigability in the channel. And there's nothing ever been memorialized on how that is meant to be. um just that someday if it's not navigable the city will be per its permit at the DNR will be responsible for maintaining that navigability >> and the city has not dredged in some time and it will be a potentially large project. So, um, since there's an opportunity for public comment, this is meant to basically say, not it's not the project itself, it's not the docs, it's just that something should be memorialized since this is a public use. So, um, >> so that requirement and that dollar amount is not that's for the hearing. >> Yeah. And I don't know that we know what the LMCD's uh authority is necessarily or what they would if but if there's going to be future potential other future docs or something like that. Um you know it's an opportunity to get our word out there to say this is something we should be talking about. Okay. >> Um trying to still maintain in the in there that We're we're not saying that the dock system is a bad idea. And for what it's worth, the variance is for length and not for the amount of docs. Anyway, the LMC has been pretty upfront about their ability to fit at least as many docks as they're as they're proposing. >> Okay. >> Um that said, it's a pretty high-profile thing. The rumor mill has been pretty a buzz over >> Yeah. what's going in, what the city's, you know, we've had people come and ask about the city giving up or that it's city docs that they're the city's donating or things like that. So, we're also I didn't want the council to be out of the loop and this is like has come up previously in this meeting the only way to really talk to all of you at one time. So, >> um that's the genesis of it. Well, thanks for sharing. I mean, this and it kind of just continues to our improved communication overall. I feel like I was just curious about some of the details, but I mean it sounds like a good idea. >> Yeah, I know. Scott, we worked with Scott to sort of I would say flesh out the language. I don't know if I've missed anything. >> The only problem was it doesn't say a dollar amount and it doesn't say >> and then who else that's on the lake, right? which is a lot of doc program. Um what about them right? What about so it's a little singleary in my brain but >> yeah and I I think in general it's the first I mean since the city's docks were were installed it's the first project that's that's like this on there. So if anything, it's taking advantage of an opportunity for public comment to just get that sort of message out there that I mean eventually navigability could become an issue and some things have to be done. So I I don't know that I don't know that we would at this time want to say, you know, hey, it's $1 or $1,000. It's just that um it's something that we could work with them to implement. But this also what I was saying is I I don't know what their what kind of conditions they even do put on permits or whether they would um so and and the thought process too is if they do just you know the LMCD says no that's not what we do. We're not going to provide that condition. then we'll just look at other avenues. Okay. Um that there are some available but >> we're paying to dredge that. I mean I think this makes sense. You know that we should have an expectation. >> Yeah. This is just an opportunity because they asked for comments and I said it's due tomorrow. So let's put it out there. And if I I I the aspect of having it be part of a you know like this type of um process by OCD then if there's ever somebody wanting to put a dock in that has no project with the city then it can be then it would be part of the be captured this way that that's why this was looked at but as I stated that LMC, we're hoping LMCD at least looks into this >> and then we can work through those the details of it. If if they they don't, then we'll look at other avenues and see how that works. Cool. >> Well, do do they have the ability to not? I mean, isn't that part of their mandate legislatively? Isn't that why we pay membership to them? Uh, I'll just re uh the council member just said that isn't this part of their mandate that they have? Is this part of what they're supposed to do is is is have these have these out there if I'm That's what we're going to find out. I mean, there's a this is so um one of my partners has has Let me back up a little bit. We're going to we're going to explore this to see if you know if this is something that I think it makes sense to have this on there. Um that's the I that this discussion we have with staff. Um I don't want to get into you know what is their what is their mandate not mandate and and but with regards to it that's maybe more of a legal question to go through that. I'd rather put it into a memo off, you know, off the public record. >> But I think that by putting this forward, I if we can capture this as part of that process, then the next time something comes up, it'll be we'll have something in place to deal with it. We I think the issue is that this has never this has not come up before. Um the city I'm assuming when they wanted to dredge it years ago was to take care of the blighted area and create something for like you know the dock area the downtown and >> it was more of a a city amenity but time as times have changed you can see there's more being added to it and so this is why this letter is going out and exploring it. Um, but I don't I I just don't want to go into the the I mean, if you want if you do need something with regards to is this more of their mandate or where they're supposed to be, I can provide something that in a memo form. That's what you if you want something like that. >> Kevin, did you have something to add to that? >> Was just Oh. >> Oh, no. Wrong Kevin. Sorry. >> He acted like he wanted to say something. Well, no, I didn't really. But I think the the impetus for producing the letter was that >> particularly the DNR >> really changed their rules overnight >> where they weren't allowing >> Yeah. >> the access to the channel directly. They were only allowing access to the previous open avenue to the Lost Lake channel. That was the the big change though. and the expansion of the the number of slips which was based on the shoreline that the the Lake Mitaka Flats developers own. >> So the what they got a permit because it's a floating bog basically. >> Yeah. >> And that's >> No, I don't think so. >> Well, that's what it is. >> It's the emergent cattails. They >> DNR decided cattails or something like that. >> Floating. So that's why they got a permit to take it out. And to be honest, we we could probably as a city if we wanted to take it on, we had a thousand trillion dollars. We could take out the whole thing if it's floating. We would get a permit for that hypothetically. That's that was the problem because they they were not able to get a permit to take out. You can you can take out a certain amount or you can, you know, put a dock over it. Theirs when they tested it, it was actually, you know, floating uh invasive bog basically. And that's that's their per they already got that person that's already done deal. They're the only reason they're going in front of this group tomorrow >> is to get a uh what 100 foot variance or something like that. It's not about the docks. It's not about it's about getting the var. So >> I don't know. I mean some of the the verbiage in here I think is a little aggressive personally. Um, at the same point, it does make sense that whether it's them or anybody that lives on the channel, hypothetically, if that's the city's opinion, that they should be paying instead of the the taxpayers uh of Mound. At the other same point, Mound owns basically the whole lake because we're the ones that >> which >> have property on there. So, like right next door to them, they don't own this. They don't own it. >> Yeah, they do. The one next door, Surfside, they don't own it. Mound owns all that area. We can sell it to them if we want, >> but that's Mound. So, the next person to take out any of that to create a dock for Surfside restaurant or the the vet shop or the the haircut place, you know, for dogs. Uh, they don't own that. They don't own the channel. >> And same thing with over right over here. >> We own the thing right to the channel. So, >> I don't know. It's kind of like we're pinpointing them specifically. >> But I do get at least the verbiage of, you know, if if there is any future dredging, they should be part of it. Um, but that should go out to every every person and the ones in the department. That should go to the people in the dock program, that should go to all the town homes there. I mean, they should all share in in dredging. I >> instead of just picking on, you know, one new element. >> I will say that uh my writing style that aggressive language came from me. >> Yeah. So maybe you tone it down a little. >> I I but >> I think that is totally done. >> No, that I mean >> but I I understand what you're talking about. >> To your point though, I mean and to someone else, I think it was Kevin that said this, you know, there are other people sitting on the sidelines right now waiting to see what this does. >> So we need to be very clear in the fact that we are assessing how that should move forward. What are you talking about? Who's waiting? >> There's other property owners along here that want to put a dock in and haven't been allowed to. No, there's property owners all along here. >> Yeah. >> Okay, pull it up. It's It's mound. >> No, it's not all mound. It is not. >> Okay. >> I mean, this is Henipin Countyy's property map. This area right here, which I was shocked to, is owned by a Charles Well, I don't know if we want to say that out loud. I'm just >> What are you looking at? >> Henipin County property. >> Well, it's public record. You can say it out loud. >> Okay. Yeah. >> Well, I don't want to pick on somebody. >> No, it's not. It's fine. >> It's okay. Yeah. I mean, this says it's Charles Coxvald in Tonka Bay. He owns all this shoreline that backs up behind the Sleens, part of Surfside. >> Does he own any land though? >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> The lake shore. >> Okay. >> Mhm. >> Well, if he has a floating bog, he can't get to the channel, though. >> Yes, he can. >> Where's the channel? No, because Mound owns that. >> That's correct. >> M owns the next piece that you're >> correct. But this is what it >> I understand that they own this >> and this. >> Yeah. So they can't get to the channel. >> Well, they're they're going to ask is what I'm saying. >> I don't care. They they can buy the property from us if they want it. The mound mountain the city of mount owns it. >> Correct. >> They are not. So that's the difference. I want to just clarify if people watch this. >> Right. >> Lake Maka Flats owns all the way to the channel. >> To the channel. >> They are in the process. Yes. changing the documentation according to Henipin County. >> Well, no, that they own all the way to the channel. That's the facts, >> right? >> So, this other group that owns I'm going to pull it up, too. The other group that owns that does not own >> all the way to the channel. >> Is this the power company? No. Cedar Holdings owns >> Look at what I'm talking about. >> Yeah. No, I I think >> city owns all that. >> Yep. >> That Lake Maka owns to there. The apartment right north of there. >> Yep. That's how they got boats in there. >> Commerce Boulevard they own to the channel. >> This one, >> right? >> City mound north and then dock program, >> right? >> You go on the other side, >> city mound all the way. So the whole lake is owned by mound. >> Correct. >> The cattails. >> Correct. >> So I don't know what your argument is. Doesn't make sense. >> They're not going to be I think >> they can't go to the channel. Lake Mitaka Flats can go to the channel, >> right? So what are we going to do when we let them do it? And they're going to the channel because they own that property. Yeah. >> But what when what happens when these other property owners >> say you don't own the property? City Mountain does, >> right? Yeah. >> If you want to buy from us, let's talk >> and maybe you maybe you can get to the channel if that's the problem. >> Maybe that takes care of our water system. >> Yeah. You want to if you put a good number on there, maybe you can get to the channel, too. >> There you go. >> But that's the thing. This is the only other property. So, with this letter, it's a little aggressive to say, you know, to pinpoint this brand new development that we're trying to bring to Mound. And I don't know. I think it's a little they're the only ones that this is going to affect. All the rest of them, yes, if we want to sell Mound property of cattails to other people, please make us an offer. We might want to sell it to you. Maybe we don't. I don't know. But they're the only ones that that are affected. This is the last deal. This is the last deal. If we sell this property, this building, right, and then we we sell the next thing all the way down to the channel, >> that could be a something, right? >> Right. >> Maybe we'll keep this and then we just sell and say you can look at the lake. >> This affects one property and it's that their property. There is no other effect unless we sell to them. >> I think you're you're just you're looking at the you don't have the right lines on here. So the the flats property remember it was like most of their acorage was like >> the water remember like the property line it was like they own it's a little bit of land but most of what they own was like >> all the way out there and I think what Jason is saying is the others don't. >> Yeah they own all that. >> Anyway that's all I had. I would love Surfside to be able to get to the channel. >> Mhm. >> And to, you know, and again, if that's a thing that we want to sell mounds strip, if this works out for this other group >> and then they they have invasive bugs and >> there's a lot of misunderstanding out there, too. >> Yeah. Because people >> Yeah. They're always aren't looking at the right thing, right? >> It's weird. >> Look at a map on >> Maybe that's something to put on the website or on Facebook. just an explanation and a picture so that there's clarity on it. >> I don't I mean again if we want to sell it then that that's a >> because I'm wondering you know if we get into dredging remember we had the other town home association they came and wanted us to dredge for them and we said no >> the the ones off of commerce. >> Oh over there. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah, and that that's the whole thing with this whole dredging thing in in the first place is this is getting way in the deep weeds, but you know, does the dock program >> take that on, right? >> Is the dock program supposed to be the ones that dredge? because part of a good chunk of the people that go through that channel is the dock program. But then another part of it is people that want to come and get an ice cream cone off the lake. We want to promote them to come do, you know. So, >> right. >> So, part of it is the city's responsibility, but >> um I don't know. Again, I think it's I think they should be from what I've heard anyway, you know, LMCD is going to make this decision about this 100 foot thing, but beyond that, they already got a perm for the dock. They already got a permit from the DNR that's saying that the floating bog is invasive to take it out. I think they've already worked on taking it out. Um, they're just getting a variance for the 100 foot thing or whatever. I I don't know. What do you guys feel about sending this letter, but then also the verbiage of, you know, putting the, you know, that they should pay into a I don't I just feel like that's very premature. At the same point, if we make it vague enough that at least we told you that in the future if we do assess them or the dock program or you know like Wisetta put in things daily use, you know, here you can pay 20 bucks, park your boat for the day, you know, however we want to charge people for accessing this channel. But do we want to put the verbiage in big picture? Do we want to send a letter or do we want to? >> So, I have a question and as a new council member, you know, I guess I understand that the DNR owns the lake because they own Lake Langden. I get that. >> However, why does LMCD have anything to say about this? Because the rest of Minnotonka is owned by the DNR. >> They dock. >> Okay. But this isn't part of Lake Minnotonka. >> They they do they docks >> on Minnetonka. I >> I don't know. I don't know the difference of Lost Lake versus Lake Mitanka. >> That's what I'm asking because technically >> looks like it's the same thing to me. Well, but it's not because we own all of that. Whereas out in Minnotonka, >> we don't own the where the even where the channel comes through >> technically. >> That's what I'm asking. Technically, where is that line? And why are they involved in this discussion? >> I mean, it's like the same body of water. That's what I would gauge. You know, it connects like Forest Lake, Ross Lake. >> You could make that case with Lake Langden because Langdon feeds into >> Yeah, you get your >> but I think the distinction is navigable. Um, the channel is navigable to through Lost Lake from Lake Onaka. >> Okay, that may be I mean I just ask. >> Yeah. No, I think that's what it is. >> Don't know till you ask. >> That's all I got. >> Well, what do we want to do? We got to decide if we're going to >> Oh, I mean I I I don't think we should not do it. >> Like maybe it's a little aggressive, but I don't want to not >> send this. >> Okay, that's where I'm at. So that's why so instead of having in their language about here's what we want them to do with you know the detail level of detail >> are we wanting to have in there that there should be there should be some I guess pulling back from saying let's get into a fund where do you where how far back or where do you see it going >> I I don't know this whole like first two paragraphs I think are >> there should be a cost share I mean that's kind of what I was happy to see So >> I I would just send the bottom two paragraphs >> and make the point of the lost lake channel would not exa exist without city mound public funds dredging right and then the second thing the city does not object to the installation however blah blah blah you should put into a fund eventually we'll discuss it down the road. Is there any context loss if we lost if we do just get rid of the first two paragraphs? >> I think that's important especially if this will be public that the residents and the citizens know that this is the reasoning because there is a lot of speculation. Yeah. >> And a lot of stuff on public um comment boards and social media that are causing a lot of confusion and disturbance. >> But again, I have I just got this before I got here. >> I understand. >> So I think we all got this right now. We I want to make sure that these facts are 100% correct and I think >> I haven't read took time you know again I'm reading it while I'm sitting here but >> I thought you were objecting to the fact that we were saying that they would have a cost share or financial responsibility. >> I mean if that's what we want to do that's that makes sense. >> They should if we want to you know assess them >> but you can't just focus on just them only correct. You got to say, well, anybody that's So, the department's right next to them. >> Can we generalize this to where it says is considering >> I didn't even see it >> reviewing or assessing? >> I mean, we're talking >> docs >> potentially down the road, too. And there's been discussions, >> right, >> last year, the year before about >> who should be dredging, right? And we I think we actually passed a resolution, if I remember right, that said the city does not dredge. Right. >> Right. It's a policy. >> A policy. So why are we saying >> that now we're singling out this group >> because they want to just put it I don't know a little more aggressive. I >> mean >> it is somewhat our responsibility to keep it navigable. >> Right. That's specific to the DNR permit that was that was uh issued to the city. >> What is to remove the blight from the community? So this would be a compulsion put on the city to dredge the channel to keep it navigable due to having a permit to open in the first place. So that policy was more so um directed at requests that were coming from like Harrison's Bay where um for like future uh requests for the city to intervene and create new navigability versus >> this one. So I my understanding is that if I don't know who determines navigability, but if it was determined not to be, the city would then be >> we're required to keep it navigable. >> Right. >> Have you looked into the >> what we made that >> resolution? No, we have not. >> Okay. So I I want to caution >> that before we send this letter out that you're look at what we said as a council that we will not dredge for people. And then now we're saying you you must judge. >> No, I didn't read it that way. I mean, I I understand what you're saying. I mean, it shouldn't all rest on Minnetonka flats. >> However, you know, if we don't keep it navigable, it's not going to benefit them in any way. >> Well, we have to keep it navigable because we have all those slips agreement, right? >> So, I I think we should >> send it. I mean, we we're required to keep it navigable, you know? I mean now more so than ever, but >> and I will say that a lot of the social media stuff is people are questioning why are they getting to do this and nobody else has been able to do. >> I think people are going to have to figure that out on their own. >> We don't know. >> I think people are just going to have to ask and get their answer. >> They own the property. >> They bought a way bigger piece of property. If they want to write an offer to the city of Mountain for Cattails, >> we'll look at the offer, etc. Yeah. >> Yeah. If anybody on that channel when you say that >> because people will start making offers and we won't have a process. Yeah. So, we better figure out a process. >> I was just concerned >> for accepting people's request >> to buy our cattails. That's interesting. So, >> speculating on what that amount might be, but I think we should send it. I mean, >> yeah. >> If we're all This is a meeting tomorrow they're having. This is why it came up tonight because it they got a meeting tomorrow night and >> this could be part of the record. >> Um >> I'm good with >> and I think that the if I remember the data I noticed >> it came out after the last council meeting. So this is the first chance you have to to look at this >> the data >> or this I mean the notice >> if I'm right the notice to the city that we can do this came out after the last council meeting. So that's why you didn't there was no information for you at that point. >> Okay. >> I I again I caution a little bit of premature here. I know we're on a deadline because they're going to get it tomorrow and but we don't really have a plan. We don't we don't have a plan for for dredging. We don't we're just threatening. >> We have a plan for selling. We don't have a plan for >> We have a plan for selling cattails. We don't have a plan for dredging. So they have access. >> We're just putting this kind of a threatening letter. Hey, by the way, and if I'm them, I'm gonna go, well, are we talking a thousand bucks a year? Fine. Are we talking 100 grand a year? You know, like, what are we talking about? >> There's no data here. >> And they're already advertising that they have these docs. They're saying that each homeowner will have a lot. >> They need 100 feet variance or something for the dock. That's all they're even talking about. So, >> I I don't know. I'm not a huge fan of sending this >> in how it's written. I would say we'd tone it down a little bit, but at the same point, if the council decides that in the future, this is a permission slip that say, well, we did send this to you saying that hypothetically we would come up with a strategy on how we're going to dredge out that channel and you're going to be part of it. >> I guess I would just go with then what you're saying then because I do want to send it, but we can just do the bottom >> paragraph. That's what you're having an issue with is the intent of the pri last paragraph. >> No, I like the bottom two. >> Yeah. the top. I I don't see why >> that again. I don't think you're >> I mean, the only time we talk about them being required to pay anything or get involved in the dredging is in this last paragraph. >> Yeah. And >> yeah, >> that's what we should change probably. >> No, I I mean, if council is good with that, that's fine. I just It's just like we're we're saying, "Hey, by the way, we're going to do this down the road." >> I mean, I'm details with the last paragraph. I'm okay with the beginning of it. >> Okay. Well, I like the middle one. The middle paragraph. Well, and that's what I mean because I think Jesse's approach of actually addressing this is very appropriate. Yeah. >> Based on the comments I'm seeing in social media and that people that are reaching out to me. >> Um, >> setting the facts straight, I think, helps. >> I had one person reach out and explain what the facts were and then they go, "Oh, okay. Well, I'll call you back later." >> Because they were misinformed, unfortunately. >> That's right. And they also said they said something about I said well this is about a 100 foot thing and you know yeah we have our city uh representative Ben Brandt. I said >> you know go there say what you want to say to the to the group. >> He's our representative of right you know of mound but >> at the end of the day it was >> well why can't other people do it? And I said well you don't own the cattails to that goes all the way to the channel. They do. That's the end of the story. I don't understand. Now, again, that's thing one. Thing two, do we want to assess anybody that owns to the channel, whether it's doc program, the town homes, these guys, that other guy that bought that little property right on the channel, right on the under the bridge. I mean, do we want to say, well, you need to participate in a future dredge opportunity? We do got to, you know, have it have a go, but at the same point, >> I don't know. It's they're >> it's kind of like we're forced to make a decision just because they're meeting tomorrow night. >> I I it may be problematic with existing docks >> as opposed to this future doc >> to have to impose that kind of requirement unless it's voluntary. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it maybe it may be problematic. >> So now we're saying that they have to do it, but the other people that don't that are in the past. >> So like the for an example, the the apartment right north of them >> Mhm. >> they have a dock with a bunch of >> boats on, right? >> So now they have to pay. They don't have to pay, but the flats have to pay >> just because they're a new develop. It doesn't make sense. This whole thing is, I think, a little rushed just because of the meeting tomorrow. we don't even know what we're talking about with Navilia and what we voted on a couple years ago. And I mean, I think we all need to understand what we're doing. >> Um, and it's almost like >> in a nice way it's saying, well, what the heck? At the same point, we're not against it, but you know, by the way, you might have to pay down the road, >> right? Which is, >> yeah, can we not address this last chapter or this last paragraph, excuse me? Well, that's the whole point of it is addressing are they going to have to pay in the future, right? That's the whole point of sending this letter before the comment period. >> Well, but I mean I >> is that something that we could assess at a later date based on and then just a few, you know, future council would pass that >> if if we're if the city has to dredge >> a disclosure, >> then we assess. >> I have no idea. >> You know what I I don't know. You don't >> I don't think so. >> I just think we got to be fair to all the properties. There's not a lot of them, but all the properties on there. And it feels like we're sending a letter that's pretty aggressive and almost like, you know, fodder to decline whatever they're trying to do tomorrow. And I don't think any of us are saying we don't want that we want them to be declined these this 100 foot variance whatever. Are we saying that >> we're not? >> No. And we say that in the letter though too. We say that we're not opposed to >> the Minnetonka. We're not opposed to the installation of the flats as now proposed. >> Yeah. >> Because they did change it evidently based on that. So I think the last two paragraphs is like the last lake channel would not exa exist without bound dredging it with public funds blah blah blah. That makes sense. >> Y >> and then the second paragraph is the city does not object to the installation of their slopes. It is the position of the city based on the direct access that any permit issued must be issued with the requirement that Lake Miton Minnotonka flats have a shared responsibility for the lost lake channel navigability. Can we even do that is you know >> well I think that's what the next sentence gets to >> city suggest that >> we could cut it off after that. >> Well you're saying you want to tie this permit to >> a policy that we don't even have. >> True. on paper. It's just like what are we doing here? It's like we're we're trying to have this be a bigger issue than it really is. I don't know. I I don't know if I would tie it to the I mean, we should have said this, you know, originally. I know they were trying to tie up with apartments before. That's what the original >> Well, originally we didn't think they'd get dock access. >> Well, they they had an agreement with the apartment. They had >> yeah to do that and then because of the floating bog >> they got a a special permit from the DNR which is right on the first two paragraphs I >> was before I sat in the room with the DNR with about this project with the DNR of the Henipin County LMC >> conservation district maybe >> and the city of mound five government agencies and the DNR was very like nope you're not touching a cat So I this is true the first two paragraphs but >> I don't know how it's written is it feels a little >> what do I do? Is there anything wrong with us saying that the 19 slip road access with direct access to these left? Sorry. >> We don't have to say anything. >> Well, we should say the city does not subject to the installation of the Minnitonka flats that has now proposed because that ties into the other sentence somewhere in one of these other paragraphs. >> But do you still do you think that we should say >> no >> that in the future we were going to assess you? No, because that's >> maybe we don't because if we have to make sure that it's navigable, all we have to do is make sure that what's what n what is navigable now is navigable. We don't need to >> expand other areas of navigability, do we? >> So, can I we have >> the council has a policy to not dredge the lake, >> right? because we've had when the drought happened over the 3 years, we had numerous >> areas >> and we and the part of the policy was so lost lake is not the dock program. It's a totally different thing. So you're talking about the dock program, but there's lost that was in the dock program and now it's a public, right? But that's a public amenity, right? And this is a private new player on the lake. We're just saying >> potentially we don't know. So you're saying, you know, we don't have enough information. You're right, but we don't know what the removal of the cattails. Is it going to affect navigation? We have enough. We've had We just measured the depth. I had our crews go through the channel when we measured the depth and it's right now it's fine. >> Okay. There's not a problem. Actually, the the lowest lake level is right outside of the bridge entering, which is not our responsibility. So the DNR has expressly required the city to main nav navigation of that one channel. They have not give there's no parameters of what that means. >> Okay. >> Okay. So all we're saying in this letter is >> what what if there you know we don't know what the effect of removing 600 ft of floating cattails as you call them. That's and it's 617 feet. It's 100 the variance is 100 ft and beyond this the length of this slip is 617 ft. So that's what we're just saying, you know, we want to just say, hey, you know, the folks that are re that are license holders in the mound dock program, Mound residents, our Tesla, and the Lost Lake Villa folks, they all are paying license fees. And eventually that money will h if we have to get to the portion of doing some form of a dredge that there we're retaining we're going to have to figure out something in the future to retain some of those funds for dredging. I mean it's going to have to happen at some point. >> So So you're kind of saying is >> that's like not part of the dock program. It's not. No, it's good. No, those 47 slips that we rent is not. That's fund 285. That's That's >> So when I rented that dock that one year, that's not because I was on the waiting list of the dock program and then you said, "Hey, I can go ahead and buy a $2,000 dock or whatever." >> Yeah, that's not part of the dock. >> Okay. Well, I considered that. Okay. So, what this is kind of saying is like if if the axe like if if there's consequences of them moving this if that causes something that we have to pay for it. >> That's not what it says though. >> You know, I've had I don't want to talk publicly about I mean it's not like they're completely opposed to the idea. So, >> okay. >> Okay. I mean, I don't know what you've heard, but I mean one of the developers is a license holder in Lost Lake, not the dock program. He's the Lost Lake Villa license holder. So, >> yeah. >> Okay. >> So, I don't know. I don't I mean I think you know we just you know you're >> we have to think about having funds for you know this contingency. We don't know what 600 ft of cattails being removed could have what effect it has. >> Yeah. Something else. >> So there's there's no reserve account. >> There is nothing res No, we don't have >> So maybe that's where we need to be. >> We need to address that. Yeah. is creating a reserve >> which is creating the need to I think send this >> so I don't know >> well we haven't done a good job of having reserve accounts in the past for some of our other >> entities for lack of a better term >> this I mean >> we're just talking about a voluntary at this point it's voluntary >> y >> we don't have any authority to >> where would dredging where would a dredging amount come from in your opinion out of the all the funds all the funds that go into fun fund 285 which is lost lake that also includes the transit district so >> everybody that's paying like our Tesla and the town homes anybody that's paying in inside there >> district is in there >> yeah they're going to be >> that's all under the HS so we used to have it itemized their fees used to be itemized out where they paid a specific amount to channel maintenance maintance to slip maintenance, you know, those things. >> Okay. So, where's all this where's this money going then? This channel maintenance, >> you said. >> Well, we don't itemize it out anymore. It's just a license fee. It was part It was itemized as part of the license fee and we got rid of it because it was just kind of confusing. So, so we just have the fee, the loss lake fee. So, >> so what we should do in the future when we talk about fees in November is reestablish >> if you're in that area that line item will go to a new fund that will be a dredging fund. >> I mean that would help it just be a dredging but you want it to be a reserve fund. >> Yeah. Reserve fund for future dredging. If you are accessing Lost Lake in a boat and you know and you stored your boat on there now, how is the apartment pay for that >> commerce place? >> They're not paying. >> That was private property. >> So they're not paying for it, but we're going to make Matonic Flats pay for it. >> No, >> no, we can't make them do it. >> So it's volunte >> this whole thing is very >> so aggressive for voluntary. >> Here's here's some suggested change languages. Kevin, you can help me out here. >> We should send this to the department, too. >> Um, it is just starting three sentences down in that last paragraph. is a disposition of the city based on the direct access that any permits issued by MCD uh must be issued with requirement that Maka Flats negotiate cost sharing um uh cost sharing uh financial responsibility for the loss lake channel on vacation maintenance with the city. It's just it's not a requirement that they actually do it. It's requirement that they that they negotiate with the city. Um, it's so, but again, >> we're making our Tessa do it, right? And the condominiums pay for those docks that they're leasing from us. >> We used to have a line item. We don't have a line item. >> I understand we don't, but we're still collecting fees from those. >> Yeah, they paid $2,500 each of the for each of those slips. So, >> but that just goes against the program. >> Well, but Art Tessa is doing it on their was it 12 or 13 that they got? >> 10. >> 10. Okay. What about the cond the condos? they pay a lesser amount, 1300. There's 22 23 of those and then another um the remainders of the 47 are mound residents who pay 2500 >> a year. >> So they are part of the docks program then it's not it's different. So what about the people behind >> separated Lost Lake into its own separate? >> Yeah, this is >> so like the f the old couple mayors ago he lives on lost lake. That's part of the That's a common. >> So he's part of the dock program. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Exactly my point. Exactly. >> But that's not different. >> Yeah. But he has to go through the channel to get to his house to where to where his boat sits. >> Yeah. >> He should be helping pay for the navigability, >> right? We need to make it fair across the board. This whole thing is you're sending an aggressive letter to someone. >> I don't know. I don't mind sending a letter. And >> can we not say that we're investigating the possibility that we may apply fees to all loss lake whatever >> if I'm them first of all welcome to mound right this is why we don't have development >> we're not exactly business friendly >> yeah exactly here business friendly mound second of all why is the commerce place getting this letter hey by the way I know you guys again I get that they're taking out a lot of cattail I get it and and if that destroys >> maybe we we say that hey by the way when you're taking all these cats if in six months we can't get a thing through there. That's your problem your problem because wasn't a problem before, right? >> I'd be more happy with that versus, >> you know, all of a sudden, you know, you're going to get this blanket fee that we don't know what the fee is yet. Right now, we don't have no policy on this. >> So maybe changing the language to, you know, we'll have to investigate the possibility of a future assessment if there's implications from >> we have tested I I'm assuming all along there. It wasn't just one or two places. >> This is very last minute. like 13 or 14. Yep. >> So, you're saying this is not how you run the program. This is not how you run government. >> So, we hang on to that say you'd rather just not send it. >> I wasn't I wasn't consulting this book before this uh before the meeting. I just got this when you guys got it. We all got it right right now. >> I would have not I would have changed this a little bit as you just heard for an hour. >> I don't mind sending something saying that potent but it's Maybe we need to have a workshop on this. >> Yeah. And in our whole doc program and how the whole thing works. And >> that's something we do need to address. >> Should we you know, you know, two years ago, we just talked about not doing not ability, you know, and and again, I know it's a little different, but >> we also didn't have another large party adding 19 docks and clearing a path. I think to Kevin's point, he's already measured the depth of the channel. You know, I mean, if this does disturb any muck or anything else underneath those cattails and it does flow out into the channel, then they should be held accountable and required to deal with it. >> I would before that because that makes sense. It ties it to them. >> Correct. >> You know, whatever. But again, there is still no dollar amount on that either. >> So now great, well, screw it. We're not putting up, you know. >> Well, >> again, business friendly at the same point. I get 100%. We own most of the channel. We own most of the cattails up to the channel anyway. >> This is why I like this beginning part personally. I think it's it's telling it's stating the facts from the city's perspective as well as saying we don't have a problem with the installation of the flat of the flat slips, but can we address what Kevin was or Mr. Costalano was saying, which is, you know, if and as Kevin Kelly said, if they disturb the channel, they should be held accountable for reparations or clean up of that mess. >> I don't know. That's you. Now you're turning into a whole different thing because originally it was I mean this letter is actually nicer than that that, right? You're like, "Well, if you screw it up, you're paying for the whole thing." That's >> you have to clean up the mess you made. >> It's just saying you're going to have to share with other >> people that use that lake in general, >> which is why we need to change the last paragraph. But yes, I mean, if if they damage our property, why do we have to send this letter? >> If anybody damaged our property, we would expect them to reimburse us for it. >> It's an opportunity to back back up a little bit. I mean, we're talking we're talking about two things here. So we're talking LMCD variance for um the boardwalk and then allowance of those docks. Right. >> Okay. So that's opposed to that. >> No. And that's but that's one thing. The other is we have a it's a DNR permit. Correct. >> So >> the floating box. >> No, no, no. For for our channel for the dredging >> dredging >> we have. So it's two, you know, remember this is we're talking about >> two we're talking about two separate entities. That's why I I started out with I think that that it's possible that they that they may not put this we're trying for this, but it may it's possible that they may not put this on on as part of the um variance for the permit for the docks because it's two separate entities. I mean, that's a it is a possibility. Um but we you know, obviously you don't know unless you unless you try and so I mean obviously that was the that was the rationale for putting this out there. We had a certain deadline. It's coming up. we were told about it like um so many days ago to and so the response is you know put together saying okay you know here's here here's a uh the city's position with regards if we try to get some cost sharing and I think it was trying to also um capture the fact that um as as uh Mr. Kelly said that there is some positive uh you know, you know, positivity from the property owner that they would enter into they would agree to this anyways to some to something. >> Um and they were trying to put this in here so that if there is a situation, say those other properties develop, they change their docks or something like that that they or something that then then there's a precedent out there. There's something out there that that could capture it. I mean, I think that was the the rational purp or the purpose for putting this letter out. >> Um, we may not be able to get all right now, but we're thinking we're thinking of 10 years from now, let's say two properties get, you know, get bought, you know, bought up and they want to develop some other residential or commercial right there and expand their docks or something else like that, then there's something that's that we can, you know, hang our hat on. I again I like the idea. I just think this is rushed because it's the day before >> and I think whatever we say has to be I get I maybe appropriate for the timeliness of this thing and it's tomorrow night. At the same point, I think this deserves more discussion of why um you know, why we're doing this. And yes, if there's another future thing, what's the council's position on, you know, should they be paying, you know, if if we say, well, $100 or $200 of your doc fee every year goes to navigation of the channel, then they should, you know, each, you know, 19 times 200, you know, that they should be paying that. But again, I think until you create a policy on that and then can we retroactively say, well, commerce place, you already have docs on the lake. You use our channel every day. We have to make sure it's but they're not in they're not our Tessa, they're not in the dock program. They're not in the special fund category and they're not in common. So, who probably can't do anything like that to those until there's some change to the property where the city would have more control. >> Right. That's all. So, I just don't like that we're pushing on this one thing without I mean, they should be pay the apartment should be paying too. >> Yeah. >> If you're going to make these people pay, the department should be paying as well. >> We need to level set on that. >> Level set. The two should equal. And if that's going to be our official city guideline, that's fine. I mean to point of Jesse and Kevin, I mean we initially made an agreement I guess with the DNR to you know do this for the better and the expansion and of the city and whatever it said here something about to mitigate blighted area. Um that still would hold true. Um, but we've also developed it now and we've got these all these different parties that are involved in renting those docks, you know, and they should all be treated equally. We shouldn't be saying, well, Art Tesa only has to pay this and, you know, I'm a little surprised that the other town homes are not paying the same amount. I mean, we need to re-evaluate that. >> Well, they they started a long time ago, you know, >> but I think I think it is true that we we need to We need to have a clarification statement of ownership so that people understand right >> this crazy sort of fact that the city owns the lake. >> So we need to clarify that. Then we need to clearly state an equitable policy >> around everyone's participation in keeping the channel navigational. Um and um you know if we spell out the the steps then implementing the fee structure or whatever falls in place. >> But again he said you can't retroactively fee people. Well, no. >> Unless there's a turnover in housing. >> Okay. Well, retroactively. But what about to the future? >> Well, that's what kind of what they're trying to do here, >> right? Uhhuh. >> I don't know if I'm right on this, but you know, the town home the channel town home association. Looks like they own or is that part of the commentary? >> That was in existence before the the channel Drudge way before. >> But still, they get through. So they should be paying the channel. >> They had access. So Jason, this is just a this is a I don't this is just a response to a new use of the channel by a private >> Yeah. >> property owner. >> The public the city amount public paid for the dredge of the Lost Lake channel >> long time ago. >> Well, >> that still benefits the city. I mean it was part and that >> led to the development of the villa town homes putting in those docks the slips the lost lake slips and not not the dock program that was public investment >> all along to to improve a blighted area in town. This was economic development. You say you know about economic development in the city that that was the investment. Now, the L, you know, the LMCD, they're following their guidelines, but what they're doing is they're they've approved the AD doc just like they normally do. They talk about the setbacks and they this slip meets all of their requirements. >> What we're saying is this is a new a new use that hadn't been in existence before. It's just saying, you know, for the LMCD to be aware that if there are future players that are coming into the use the loss late, shouldn't they all have to have some um >> skin in the game, >> some maintenance fee to help pay for a future drudge? We do not know how much a drudge is going to cost. We don't know when we would ever have to do one because we're we've just started monitoring. This is the first year we actually went out and measured the water depth out there. >> You know, I thought since our crews were going out, we should go out there and take the measurements and we did that even before we knew this change was a foot. >> Okay. So, we're just saying, you know, just as a first I don't see this as really being particularly aggressive. We're not we're not signal singling out Mitaka flats only, but this is a new significant change to the use of the channel to a to a public amenity that the citizens of Mound funded and are still funding. Again, I just have a problem with having whether it's the channel association or the commons or our Tessa or the old department, >> they all we should have them all paying versus, hey, you're brand new. Welcome to mound. You should be pay why aren't you paying now? >> So, this is a thing that we did a long time ago so we get developments like this to come here now. Here we are. >> Why did we decide that we the city would not dredge? What was that conversation? I wasn't here for that. What >> that was >> was the logic just because they didn't want >> water was low and >> Okay. >> You know, some people bought houses in tougher navigable areas. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> In some aspects and we just, you know, we heard from a few people and we just said as a policy, we're not we don't dredge. The city will not dredge if you come in front of us, >> but we don't own those other areas. We own this particular piece of property. >> We don't own it. The DNR has a we have a agreement with the DNR that we're going to >> have we own the catels the the navigable part. >> We have an agreement with the DNR that we're going to make sure that you can get through there. >> Okay. Which means we have to keep it navigable. >> Own it. But yes, we >> I mean short story long, I think we should send the letter. I just wanted to learn more about it because I want to do like the what if and >> you know like the what could happen in the future. There's just that this if anything I'm going to get a conversation started with Minnitonka Flats on anything if they have something to say about it, >> you know. >> So, you want to tie their permit >> to this future policy that we don't know yet. >> If there's complications of moving all that stuff, you know, because it was fine before our test didn't move anything. Those docs were already there, >> right? >> They didn't nothing needed to happen for them to >> show up. Any permit issued by LMCD must be issued with the requirement that Meniton flats have a shared financial responsibility for loss lake maintenance. So there's, you know, I wish we would have had this, you know, a month ago so we could have actually talked about it and had a workshop and >> see is this is how we want to >> conduct business here. But >> again, here you have this brand new development that they want to spend money in our town. Beautiful development, not section A. You know, that's what the word of the day back in the day was. >> And You know, again, the the whole thing is is this 100 foot var variance or whatever that they're trying to get. There's nothing. I mean, they already got a permit for the dock. They already got a permit to remove the logs. It's the 100 foot variant. So, I think we're just we're we're reaching a little bit, but >> Okay. Um, you want to send it? Do you want to send it? You want to >> I'd like to send it with amendments to the last paragraph so that we're not picking on Minnotonka Flats. I mean, we're stating clearly we do not object to the installation of the slips, >> but the whole point of sending this letter is to pick on Madong Flats >> because they're the new game in town, >> right? So again, doesn't make sense to me, but >> well, but I mean, okay, but I mean, I'm wondering if Scott can't add verbiage at the end that just says you take out go from, you know, we don't object as as it is now proposed because there was a change in the proposal, which is stating we're okay with that change. you know, the city reserves the right, you know, or something to the effect that, you know, if damages occur to the navigable channel as a result of the changes of removing cattails or whatever it is, they're moving the bogs. Um, we would expect that, you know, Minnetonka Flax would be held responsible for that. Period. I mean, none of these other entities are trying to remove cattails right now. >> No. True. You know, I mean, I think that sets an example to everyone else as well. You know, we're not trying to just pick on Minnotonka Flats. We're concerned about the navigation of Lost Lake and we are responsible for that. >> Sorry, I I think agreeing with you. It's the same way that you would say if it were any private residential development, if they caused some, you know, did something in that channel that caused >> it's like if we have, you know, >> just foot the bill for them. >> When we have someone use Surfside, if they man damage the property, we expect them to put it back the way they found it. Mhm. >> So, I'm more comfortable with that. >> Mhm. >> I think >> if you want to do like a future fee thing, we got to send it >> that needs to be >> it has to be to everybody. >> Totally evaluated. >> But yes, if they screw up the channel because they're taking out >> Yep. >> 100 yards or whatever the 160 yards, whatever they're doing. >> Well, you know, that channel probably has many mysteries. >> Oh, god. I don't even know. Like, you know, because there used to be willow trees. >> Yeah. >> Down by the bridge. And are they are parts of those willows still there? >> Sure. I think some of them are still there. >> So, Scott, >> the other thing for attorneys talk is like, >> well, how do you know that it wasn't, >> you know, how how do you prove that it's so much bad now? >> Well, well, it's even a different issue is that um this is different than um damage to a public rightway where we have jurisdiction, >> right? >> This is navigable water. We have a DNR permit. our requirement to take care of it. >> And you know, if if if there's no condition on there no condition saying if you come, you know, if you do damage, here's what you're going to do. >> Um I don't I don't even know at that point if we would be the ones who have the recourse. It would be LMCD or well, it's an LMC permit, not the DNR, though. >> So, I mean, this is this is the problem. It's, you know, it's it's Naval Water. That's not our jurisdiction and and if if we just have the requirement to take care of it and I haven't read that permit but I'm assuming regardless of what happens it's Mr. Kelly it's up to us to the city to to deal with it. I don't have a problem with it honestly because I just the more I think about the last part it's like this requirement will ensure that loss lake channel is maintained for all to use and we're kind of looking out for all the other people that are renting those slips and the people that have homes in the villa the villas lost lake you know it's just you know >> yeah but again now you're you're telling them that they have to >> per the per their permit they have to get an agreement with us of an undisclosed amount and agree to get their permit to do this >> like if we have to dredge But you're not doing it to any of the other people. >> Well, they didn't move the >> cattails. >> Yeah. Well, again, I wasn't back here back. >> Well, there were conditions the other people faced when their docks were put in. That's why their price was established. >> So, yeah. I mean, I I don't know that. >> What do you want to do? I think we need to do a letter. Um I'm not so sure that we're ready to have it delivered tomorrow, but that um if the letter can be amended with comments and everything and we workshop it or approve it at our next meeting to send to them. >> So they're having their meeting tomorrow night and potentially they could get their permit tomorrow night. what they were trying to do is tie that to this to this future, you know, paying on the channel means >> well, >> it's kind of >> I don't think that we have to feel rushed like we just got this. >> I know, but the reason why they put it on our desk and we didn't see this, you know, well, first of all, we haven't met in two weeks, so >> Right. >> But >> and then of course it's tomorrow, so Right. >> We don't really have a chance. They'll just have No, I think we have a choice. They just have to wait for our response. >> But I'm just saying they're going to have the meeting tomorrow night. So, do you want to tie this whatever our response is to their permitting? >> Are you you want to do that? Well, if they don't, you're you're saying basically if we don't give them something for tomorrow, they won't tie it to >> that's what this says because they're trying to get the permit tomorrow night. >> This is saying, "Hey, we're going to throw out we're going to throw out this letter and the requirement to get the permit is that they have to be this last paragraph." That's the whole point of sending this thing right before the deadline. So, are you okay? If we don't send it, then there is no going to be, you know, a condition to whatever permit they get and then we're sending a letter after the fact saying, "Oh, hey, the way by the way, as a feel-good, please donate to our channel fund." >> So, we're not we're not we don't have we're not having a say in there's two permits. So, one's already been allowed by the DNR, >> right? The cattails are in the process of being removed even before the >> it might already be done. >> The the length variance that's what's if that's what is on the table, not the city's involvement. we're saying is that the Lake Mitaka Conservation District is doing what they are required to do is determine setbacks, measure shoreline and allocate how many slips are available for their use. Okay. The city's not is not is not take in this letter. The city is not we're not saying we're okay with it, right? We're not saying we say in the letter that we're not objecting to it that we we agree to it >> but >> we don't have any recourse. We don't we don't have a recourse unless we want to >> uh talk about the length of the slip and I don't think we do. I mean >> so why are we even sending this? That's the whole point. This feels rushed. It feels last minute. if it we haven't even talked about this and then in the last well what should have been a done meeting an hour ago. We're going through this letter and we all I don't think are ready to make a decision on this. I mean I I would say if anybody wants to watch this video you can see how conflicted we are on this topic in general. I don't know why we even need to say anything. And if you really want to tie their future navigation of the channel to they're getting this permit, then fine, we can do it. But just know that, you know, we're not doing it for other people. We're not doing it for the ones that can already navigate it. So now we're picking on this one group. So, what do we want to do? >> Yeah. Well, I mean, you could and I don't I I I hesitate to say it because I don't want to cause delay, >> but we but you could say that this is what the city is exploring. We ask that the matter be tabled >> to the next meeting. Oh, boy. >> But I but I don't think that's what you want to do either because you don't want to delay the project. >> We don't want to delay the project. We I don't think we care about the dock in general if they screw up the nav navigation again potentially, you know, pay, but again, I don't think we can enforce that. So that's that's out of it. So then why are we doing this? Well, we're doing it because they're a new development. The point of this dredging how many years ago was economic development. Here we have a a development that's ready to go and now we want to put this last minute thing on there and potentially, you know, have that be an issue. I I don't know. >> Yeah. I I I I'll say that this is president. No, obviously to to the council and the council can decide, you know, where they want to go with it. So, um, you know, I I don't have I mean, I as you know, for myself, I don't have I don't have an opinion one way or the other. It's a matter of what direction you guys want, what direction the council want staff with staff help with direction you want to go. >> I if if we want to send a letter, I'm fine with it. I would, again, like I said, lighten the verbiage a little bit. I would not specifically tie it to the permit, but I would say the city is looking into, you know, a fund and how you can future help us pay for navigation of the channel or something like that. Um, I I get if you don't tie it to permit, then does it have teeth? I don't know. You tell me, but >> Well, I mean, it is possible even with the with on there still may not have teeth. I mean, because it's not >> because it's not our it's not our thing to do. >> It's not our >> So, why are we sending this? >> Why don't we just take more time and think about what we want to send them later? >> Well, it's tomorrow night. So, >> I that's what I'm saying. Like you said, it's more of a voluntary, you know, ask for later. But I don't know. >> Or else we're just going to keep kind of going in circles. I think >> I think again the point is I think we're all conflicted on what what message are we saying to them. Do >> raise your hand if you're against them getting a dock. >> No. >> I don't think anybody's against them getting a dock. >> No, that's not our purview anyway. It's the LMC. So, they're going to fight that out tomorrow night. Good. Great. Go for it. We as a city a long time ago said we're going to navigate this channel for economic development, whatever. Right. Well, here we are. Here's the development. We had our Tesla too, right? We we used to say this to them that they got to pay for channel 2, you know, hey, by the way, you know, the the other places that the that that have been there, >> yeah, >> you know, if they change hands and we want to force them to pay for it at that point, too. >> I get it. The city, you know, is paying for this. The people that use that channel the most, I think, should be line item, you know, the navigation thing and for future D. I don't know how the hell that's going to be enough money for the future. It's 500,000 or something down the road. >> But it's been what, 20 years since we dredged that, >> give or take? >> 20 >> 197 was the >> 27. Okay. >> 30 years. >> Yeah. >> Maybe we never have to do it again. I don't know. Maybe we do. >> That'd be lovely. But >> well, 30 years and it's still fine as of yesterday. So, what are we doing? I mean, >> but we should be preparing for it just in case. I mean we it could be changed. >> What could be changed? >> The last paragraph. >> Okay. >> To be as opposed to being a we want this as opposed to saying this is our this is more of our aspiration and I'll and I'll explain to this and >> is that we talk about look we don't we we're okay with the 19 vote slip. We have concerns about costs for, you know, for for the future that we talked about and that the city is going to invest look into creating a a fund for um that would include users for the future dredging of the property. I mean, it's it's not looking at the condition on there, but it's at least explaining what's going on. I don't know whether or not we can get people on board with regard to it and what it's going to look like, but if if anything that I've noticed that when this has come up now that this has brought up an an issue that wasn't, you know, on the radar before about I mean it's just like other things that with with >> that have been created in the past. there's nothing there to deal with it for the future and it's it's reactive and reactive in the sense of >> if we had a if there's dredging tomorrow >> that need to be done where would the money come from? >> Yeah. >> Well, I like what the amendment to the last paragraph is you've just laid it out. I mean, it gives us time if we decide later that we might want to, you know, next year talk about a plan if we ever needed to dredge, how how and what properties would be affected and the slipers and all that stuff. That just makes it super vague, which is good. >> At the same time, you're understanding that most likely if we do come up with some sort of a plan that it's going to be voluntary for all these all these different users. >> But you're saying we don't even know if the LCD can even enforce our ask >> to tie it to the permit. No, I don't know if they will tie it. I I I don't know if that because all there, you know, Mr. Kelly explained, you know, what they're doing is variance dealing with setbacks and and those kind of things. And they may look at this and say, "Well, this is beyond what we're looking at doing here because we already gave them the the dock, so we're not we're not going to do it." So, it's I I'm not saying they can't do it. Um I'm saying is that they may not do it because the type of of application that's in front of them. >> Okay. >> Well, what you were saying what now? >> Um the amendment that you kind of stated to the last paragraph was just I thought fine. It's less aggressive. It doesn't say >> Minnetonka Flats. just says that someday in the future we may have to look at cost sharing for dredging. It's nice and >> we're assessing the possibility of >> can we assess properties and say you got >> on west edge. >> Yeah, that's >> we used to do it kind of like for street. >> Why is it any different than a navigable waterway? >> Are you talking about it right away that the city has >> no a whole different discussion? >> No, I don't even >> we we don't do assessments anymore like that but we did. >> Okay. Um, I don't I don't it I don't >> I'm not going to say no. >> No. >> Can can can we not assess for the dredging? I don't have the answer to that. Whether or not can you count this as some form of a 429 project um that we're going in and assessing properties that are benefited by it. I I that part I have not looked at yet. I mean, that's always a possibility, too. Um, more likely it's I'm gonna say more likely than not, that's not available, but I'm not going to >> Yeah. >> throw it out yet. >> So, if we're if we sign a letter and at all, the whole purpose is why don't we just send a letter to the flat saying, "Hey, I hope you guys come to the table and give us money for graduate >> if we're not tying it to a permit." I mean, what's the point of sending this in the first place? I'll leave that over to Jesse and and Kevin on this one. >> Well, and until we do an assessment of what's going on there to begin with, I don't know that we can even say that. >> Are we making a problem where there's no problem as well? >> Somewhat term it's going to be a problem. >> Well, spread to 30 years. So, what if it's in our 30 years? >> Well, at least we have been sticking money into the fund that >> now that we know that this is something that is important. >> We need to be aware, right? Um, but I don't know the the one person I talk to on this. >> I don't go on Facebook and next door it's just I just don't do it. >> But um I look at our Facebook. Um but >> the one call I got is a property owner that didn't know what the deal was. I explained it and then she didn't want to talk about it anymore. >> Which is why I like the clarification in the first three paragraphs. I think it's beneficial for us to state here's what happened. Not everybody was involved in your meeting or was here in 1997, you know, to see what was actually done. This is all part of the bureaucratic part of government which people are not aware of. I mean, and at the end of the day, you know, I believe we do have a responsibility to the taxpayers to make sure that we keep that navigable. You know, we've committed to that. why all of a sudden somebody had decided on a council that we're not ever going to dredge. That's a pretty broad general statement >> that's different than this challenge. It is different and I agree but we should have >> noted that in our whatever the decision and policy was that we made >> it it probably >> and I don't know maybe it is >> it's it's a little different but it is a yeah we have >> policy they've always held Lost Lake as a separate >> correct >> project or entity >> right >> and so um you know it's sort of like we're we're learning the history >> is that how the fund is set up Kevin Kelly is just for saying to be honest with you. So >> it's just the fund that's set up for accounting purposes. Is it strictly exclusive to Lost Lake or is it other docs program? >> I'm not the finance director but there's >> I mean Jesse would know 285 that's the number assigned to that area and it's part of it's the transit district as well. So that whole area >> included our TUSA that was part of the you know marketing of that property. So >> see this issue is bigger than just what we can discuss here tonight. We don't have all the facts. >> So the two the lake Minnotonka you know lake the lake use lake management policy that the council approved is for the entirety of the lake >> right >> that the city does not own property beyond below the 929.4 for ordinary high water, >> right? >> So, we're the purpose of that is because of all the requests that we were the city was getting to dredge property we don't own. The city does not own Lost Lake as well, but we have a permit from the DNR where the city is required to maintain navigation like I said many minutes ago. >> Thank you. Okay. So, do we want to send the first three paragraphs and then the fourth one do what he just said a few minutes ago? >> I'm okay with that. >> I'm okay with that as long as Scott has the language he needs to delete and add. >> Well, I I I do work on it with uh with staff, too. So, it's a it's a >> it's a team effort. Um, it's >> Well, you're here to advise us, so listen to you. >> Well, that's that's not advice. I that's that's just that it's it'll be that if you if your direction is to follow that, the language would be worked out with because ultimately, you know, it's it's uh you know, it's uh Mr. Dixon who has to uh sign off on it, >> you know, with it. So, yeah. So, I mean, he's going to, but I I will help I will put that language together. We'll work on in the morning that follows that more um aspirational language that we talked about. Is that what you're thinking? >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yep. >> Vague. >> Yeah. Let's go and send it. >> Okay. All right. >> But I think we do need to get that history that community statement out on our website or somewhere so that people understand this because you're going to get lots of confusion. >> Well, and that way staff when they get the calls can say and direct them out to that either stock. Can we put that in the which page of the website would we want to put that >> when you Jesse when you put it when you finalize this thing and send it over? Do you want to put it as a thing on the I mean what do you what would you do? Put it on the page item on library. >> You know it'll be part of the record. >> Is that good enough? >> Um >> it's good enough for me. We can if we want to get into >> remember the whole messaging of the parks and we screwed that up like >> you just throw this out and then people go what >> you know >> what is this all about? We got to make sure they >> in the LMCD they made I'd imagine they're going to look through this. It's part of the packet and they're going to talk about it or not. I'm sure there's going to be people that will show up. I know one that one lady was wondering where it was. >> Yep. >> Um we'll see. That's not our issue, but that's that's theirs. And Ben Brandt's our rep, so he you can vote for what he thinks. Was he consulted at all with this letter, Jesse? Ben, >> no. Is anyone gonna go to this meeting tomorrow night? >> I wasn't planning on it, but >> can we get it turned around by noon or 1:00 or what? What time meeting? 5 or 6. >> Yeah. >> Maybe appointed him to Ben. >> Well, then >> maybe if you want to talk to him, call him before. >> Well, I mean, yeah. Is he Is someone going to brief him about this? sees our representative. >> Do you want to call him in the morning >> and just let him know >> what we just talked about? >> And then he can come back and tell us what happened. >> Yeah. Well, >> yeah, he's our representative. >> Do you guys get the LMC emails >> like with the packet and all that? >> No, that's why I didn't see the budget. It goes to you and Jesse. >> We can always follow up on that. >> I'd imagine you could probably request to be part of just like on the city, right? >> You could probably request to be part of it. I don't I get it for maybe just because >> Okay, so we're doing that. Um, do you have anything else? >> Nothing else. >> Okay. >> No, you finally brought something. >> I'm done. >> Well, I made our up my update long last last meeting, too, with Park. So, I I'll try not to next time. >> Talk all you want. Council member, we're here. >> I'm done. >> All right. And then Yeah. >> Cancelled each other out. >> I'm done as well. Okay. uh workshop next meeting 23rd >> correct >> at 5. Um probably put it in here I'd imagine. >> Uh just making that. >> Yeah. And then we're going to verbalize or put a better description of what exactly we're talking about. >> We'll work out between now and next Thursday. >> Okay. and then put some kind of a high level agenda of like what we're doing, what we're talking about. Okay. And then uh do you number 13, do you guys have anything talk about comments, reports? No. Uh okay. Number 14, I'll take a motion to adjurnn. >> Motion to adjurnn. >> All right. You got a motion. Can I get a second? >> Second. >> Okay. Any discussion? All those in favor, please say I. >> I. Those opposed? All right. That return.