00:01:12,310 S1: Good evening and welcome to the Monday, May 11th Maplewood City Council meeting. Uh, for those of you who are watching online or tune in later, we did our budget kickoff in the, uh, manager's workshop right before this council meeting. Uh, yes. It is the start of our budget season. Uh, it may only be May, uh, but we have a lot of time and opportunity to come up with the very best budget that we can. And so tonight was the kickoff. Uh, we also announced all of the different public engagement opportunities, including surveys and different summer events that we will have this summer, uh, where you will have a chance to weigh in and share with us your priorities. And I have to say that we really work hard at the budget. Our staff, when I say we, I'm really looking at our staff. The staff works hard and they present it to us as the policy makers. And I have to say that we really dive deep into preparing the best budget that we can. I have to say that today I attended the Regional Council of Mayors meeting. And how does that relate to our budget? Well, we met at the Federal Reserve and it was probably about 35 mayors. I think we get a tour of the Federal Reserve, had an opportunity. We had a presentation by the ninth District Fed chair, Neel Kashkari, and Aileen Chernoff. The vice chair was there as well. We had an opportunity to ask questions, I think very meaningful questions about the impact of inflation and tariffs and what we can expect in terms of. Forecasting ahead for the economy. So it's not that we're just having discussions here. It goes much deeper than that. I have to say it was really a great opportunity. And if you ever get a chance to do a tour of the Federal Reserve, please take it. And yes, we did get to see the vault. That was kind of the highlight for everyone, but it was a very meaningful opportunity because we have to we, each one of us and we we actually talked about this as a group, that we have the responsibility of formulating a budget for our communities, and there's a lot of moving pieces that go into it. So it was a I feel like I did more than just the budget kickoff tonight. Uh, we I've kind of been immersed in budget kinds of things for, uh, most of the day to day. So it was a good day. It was a good day. So with that, let us start with our Pledge of Allegiance, please, and get our meeting started. 00:04:05,669 S1: I pledge allegiance to. 00:04:07,030 S2: The flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. 00:04:21,470 S1: City clerk, would you do the roll call for us? 00:04:24,629 S3: Member. Cave. Here. Council member Johnson. Here. Council member. Lee. Present. Council member. Villavicencio. Here. 00:04:31,029 S1: Mayor Abrams I'm here as well. Thank you. Council members. Would someone like to make a motion to approve our agenda? 00:04:38,149 S4: So moved. 00:04:38,870 S1: Second move by cave, seconded by junior men. The motion to approve our agenda. Uh, is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying aye. 00:04:50,870 S3: Aye. 00:04:51,389 S1: Any opposed that motion carries. Moving on to the approval of minutes, we have the April 27th, 2026 City Council workshop minutes. Would someone like to make that motion. 00:05:02,579 S2: So. 00:05:02,819 S1: Move. Second move by Lee, seconded by junior. The motion to approve the April 27th, 2026 City Council workshop minutes. Is there any further discussion? All those in favor signify by saying I, I, I will abstain because I was not present. Thank you. Uh, next we have the April 27th, 2026 City Council meeting minutes. Would someone like to make that motion? I move approval. 00:05:31,540 S4: Second. 00:05:32,220 S1: Moved by gentleman, seconded by cave. The motion to approve the April 27th, 2026 City Council meeting minutes. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying I. 00:05:46,339 S3: I. 00:05:47,139 S1: I'll abstain. I'll abstain. Thank you. All right, moving on to appointments and presentations. Uh, administrative presentations, the council calendar update. Uh, Mr. Sabel, this is yours. 00:06:01,930 S5: Uh, thank you, Madam Mayor and council members, just a quick update on the council. Uh, just note that May 26th meeting is a Tuesday, so to be, uh, day after Memorial Day. So just, uh, please adjust your calendars for that. And then, uh, starting to forecast out into June, uh, June 8th, we will have the climate, uh, mitigation plan adoption. I know that that has been many months in the making. So it is finally reaching its conclusion. We will have a presentation by someone from Ella's about our general obligation improvement bond issuance. Uh, we're not sure which one, but it's always nice when our friends from elders make an appearance at the council meetings. And then I also just want to forecast that we're going to add a special council meeting on June 15th to talk exclusively about the budget. So the mayor mentioned the budget kickoff. This is really kind of a deep dive opportunity to talk about council priorities for the remainder of the year. So please come prepared with as many questions as you can have. And staff will be prepared to provide some historical context for everything. But I think that is a really a great grounding exercise, and I thought it was important that we do it as kind of a standalone item. So I know that it's June, I know that it's summer, but we'll have three meetings in the month of June. So, um, there, I'll just want to say that there's also a lot of, uh, summer events that are starting in earnest. Uh, and I know that, uh, city clerk sent had forecasted a number of community festivals that will range in the thousands of participants, and we received another three applications in the past two weeks. So, um, it's the place to be, uh, this summer. And so it will be very busy and very fun. And we'll, we'll manage it throughout. So with that, I'll stand for any questions. 00:07:41,439 S6: Any questions for Mr. Sable. 00:07:44,879 S1: Okay. And we have no council presentations tonight. We have a presentation by our management intern, Colin Vu. Mr. Sable, do you want to set this up? 00:07:55,269 S5: Uh, thank you, mayor and council. Yeah. Come on up while we get set up. Um, the city of Maplewood took an investment in setting a management intern program last year for the first time. Um, it is something that I think is important to me professionally, that, uh, I got my first start working in the city because somebody gave me an opportunity. And so I had always pledged that when there was ever given an opportunity to create a program like this, I would. And so with your support, we were able to create this management intern position. Uh, Colin Vu was our first inaugural intern. And, um, I can say as many things. I'll stop saying too many things, but Colin has been, um, head and shoulders above what anybody would have expected. He took every task. He created his own tasks. He was always asking for more things. He was just an exceptional talent. And one of the pieces of of a culmination of the whole year is sort of a capstone as a to talk, excuse me, to talk about the journey, what you've learned, and then also give the community an opportunity to see him in action. So not only is this, um, a culmination of a year, but it's also kind of a springboard to the next career, which I know is going to be successful. And so with that, we'll get the slide deck up and running and, um, uh, sorry. Okay. Thanks. 00:09:22,019 S1: Welcome. 00:09:26,059 S2: Okay. 00:09:27,740 S1: I don't think the microphone is on. 00:09:35,419 S7: Yeah. You're good. Okay. Yeah. There you go. Alrighty. 00:09:39,820 S8: Good evening, Mayor and council. Thank you for having me tonight. Uh, my name is Collin Vu. I've been the City of Maplewood intern since May of 2025, and I've been the intern for roughly one year now. So it's amazing to say that a year has flown by incredibly fast. And when I was creating this presentation, I was trying to determine what should I add? And I just decided to add in everything that I've worked on throughout the past year. And to say it's a mouthful would be an understatement. But just to begin. Um, so I'd like to break down into different quarters throughout my year being here. So just within the first quarter, uh, my first goal was to, was to connect with as many of our leadership teams as I could. And one question that I asked each member of our leadership team was, how do you define success? And each member defines success as being family oriented and creating the best opportunity for their residents. And immediately to me, that stood out as Maplewood Pillar is to support and empower people. And as that is one of our pillars. I recognize how important that is to not only our staff members, but to our residents. And next, just working on the revision of personnel policies. Just trying to ensure that what we have written down for our staff members is accurate and they can refer to it. And I think this is a great opportunity just to really dive into that realm, as I want to focus in human resources, understanding how to revise personnel policies played a great role in understanding how the city operated, and especially how staff can follow these rules and regulations to ensure that what we have is the best city. Next is the charitable gambling, although you may have not known, but I assisted our administrative team in creating ideas for what the charitable gambling was and how can we properly allocate those funds to award those winners of those fundings? And last but not least, for the June through August quarter, is a luncheon learned with our embedded social worker and fire marshal. We discussed the unsheltered population here in Maplewood. And how can we provide the best resources and tools for our staff members to clean up those encampment sites, and also to treat the unsheltered population of dignity and respect? 00:11:52,820 S8: Next is our second quarter. So this quarter I spent heavily with connecting with various city leaders. Some I connected with was the city manager of Brooklyn Park, Stillwater, Roseville and Bloomington. It was just a great opportunity to connect with different leaders, as they have varying of demographics, and understanding how they operated played a great role in understanding how I can apply that to Maplewood itself, as we have about 43,000 residents and other cities have 80,000 to 100,000. How can we implement their skills and learnings into Maplewood? And during this time as well, I created the idea and concept of the capstone project, which I'll be diving into shortly. But I started connecting with local nonprofit organizations within Maplewood and outside of Maplewood. I connected with over 40 non-profit organizations. Sitting down with them, going to their buildings and touring who they were, understanding more about what opportunities they have present for Maplewood residents, and as well as attending the PMP conference. Just a great way to network and socialize with other city leaders as well, and also connecting with other interns from other cities. A very rare occurrence for me to find other interns in other cities, but it's a great opportunity to connect with them, learn more about what they're doing, how their city is operating. And last but not least is the pillars and purpose. This is something that we started to implement as a city for our new staff members joined the city, uh, discussing who Maplewood is, what our three pillars are and why they are important to who we are and how we apply these pillars and purpose to becoming, as I quote, uh, City Manager Michael Sabel, to become the best run city in the East Metro. How can we apply these pillars to become that? Next is the third quarter, December through February. And during this time I wanted to really dive into other departments. So I spent about a month shadowing our payroll coordinator, uh, as well as joining as many trainings as I could. One train that stood out was the High Performer organization training held by the city manager, Michael Sabol. Again, uh, just learning how the city can change its culture to become more efficient and tools and resources that we have. How can we push ourselves outside the norm and become greater city, so that others may look at us as not only leaders in our field, but also just setting a standard that they can follow? Uh, next is a new program that the city was involved with is with actual Hill Murray. Uh, we interned two students from their high school, and they provided assistance for our administrative teams. So you could say an interns intern, almost. But they provided great assistance with just our day to day task and also creating new ideas for our safety committee and providing assistance with our Wellness Committee. I think it was a great opportunity to have some fresh, light and especially young ideas on what the city could be in the future. And as well as trainings, just performing the Clifton Strengths training with our HR manager, Nancy Steele, who really allowed me to understand my strengths, um, how can I apply that into the workforce and into teams and understanding what strengths connect strongly with each other and which ones compete at times? 00:15:06,990 S8: And our final quarter, which is currently now, I've performed some compensation studies for the League of Minnesota Cities, currently revising our job descriptions for over 80 roles here in Maple in Maplewood, some ranging from the early 2000, some ranging from 2025. So just having the history of how jobs used to operate are very interesting. And as well as being able to attend the heading Home Ramsey meeting. Just learning about the unsheltered population here in the Ramsey County. What resources are available? And there are some great speakers there, as well as city leaders who discuss what tools are implementing into preventing homelessness. And last but not least is career fairs. I had the great ability to join three different areas for career fairs. The first was the Mone College Prep Academy in Saint Paul, with over 700 students to attend to discuss what city government is and how government operates. And safe to say, we had a large amount of students interested in local government, which I think it's great to expose young minds and young adults to what the government is if they've never explored that career path before. And next is North North Senior High School, which is right up the road from us. This is another great way to connect with local schools about how cities operate. Uh, it was great that students came up to me and ask me, how did I find myself in local government? How did I apply for internships? It was just great to provide that. My previous history and my education to high schoolers who are interested in seeking higher education. 00:16:40,440 S8: And next is project management, which I dove heavily into in 2025 and 2026. Uh, I'd like to start off with some projects that I it was engaged with versus the police department rain garden, which I like to say left a mark with the city, which was my intention of just coming to the city every day and seeing the rain gardens slowly grow and hoping to see it there within the next ten years, when I come by and see that I left a mark with the city, a physical mark. Uh, next is the 1902 archival management project for Metronet. Uh, we had over 70 years of maps located in one room up in 1972, the Public Works building, which was previously our community developed building and really getting to learn the history of Maplewood through his maps of how Maple developed out the years and connecting with various stakeholders. Metro iiNet shredded Mid-America and the documentation process for Community Development team. Next is the non-profit Expo, which I like to say definitely left a mark within the city as well. And with nonprofit organizations from across the metro coming in and saying that they wanted this event more frequently. Some wanted quarterly, some want annually. But we'll see how that goes. And next is the Icma Emerging Leader Development Program, which is, I can't say enough words about this program. It's been amazing just to learn about different cities and how they operate, especially nationally, connecting with different stakeholders who have experience in crisis management, communications, and more importantly, AI as it's a growing tool of every city. And it's a little odd being in the same program as I'm the only one in the Midwest. I'm the only I'm the youngest individual there. But I'd like to say that I've provided a great information to other cities, especially if it comes to our safety trainings, for example. We recently performed a safety walkthrough, ordered emergency kits for different buildings, and when I discussed this with other cities they've mentioned they've never thought of that before. So it was great just to share ideas. And next is just a quick video of the nonprofit expo that was hosted on April 16th. 00:18:50,740 S9: Hi. Hi. How are you? 00:18:52,539 S1: I've had a chance to talk to some of the community partners that are here, as well as people that are living in the community. 00:18:58,259 S3: It's been good. 00:18:59,019 S8: Today we are attending Maple, its first non-profit expo with roughly 25 vendors from across the Twin Cities. The biggest outcome is just for nonprofits to come together to build connections and partnerships. Oh, that's that's great. 00:19:12,019 S10: I'm recently retired, and I thought it might be a good opportunity to come and see what kind of volunteer opportunities are available in my local area. 00:19:19,460 S11: This is wonderful, and it's great to see all the local organizations, the people that are coming are people that live here, so it's convenient for them. 00:19:26,569 S12: So we're always looking for people. 00:19:28,329 S11: I want to give back to my community and help those that are desperately in need, and also to help the elderly and the other people with special needs. I love. 00:19:37,490 S13: Doing that. 00:19:38,529 S11: I think the most important thing about volunteering is just community neighbors helping neighbors, people getting out and responding to real needs so that they can better understand their community at large. 00:19:49,089 S14: In these difficult, challenging times, people sometimes feel very isolated, and by connecting with community and by volunteering, they are not just connecting, but at the same time, they're also building their skills and deepen their connection with people that they have not even know because they are isolated. 00:20:06,210 S8: This is just the pilot event, but hopefully this event can occur more frequently within the next few years. 00:20:12,049 S10: I think giving back to the community is fulfilling for me, and it's it's good for my community. 00:20:20,569 S8: And alrighty, and some major takeaways I've had from this internship, which I feel that I would not have the opportunity from other internships. One of the biggest major takeaways is becoming a high performing organization. I feel that this isn't discussed enough in other cities or in other organizations, but becoming proactive in the culture change. How can we become greater leaders? How can we become individuals who promote change? I think this highlights really the Maplewood. Um, ever since my ever since I've joined the city, just how can we continuously grow and become better? Next is the perspective change. One thing that I, when I first joined the quote 30,000 foot view was thrown around quite often. And this wasn't thrown often in college, so this was quite confusing to me. But now I understand that. I mean, just to have a greater lens, especially when it comes to leadership working your task on hand. But to have that 30,000 foot view and see things not only a year and a head, but understand each problems and how can we create solutions to those problems? And next is community growth. As Maplewood is growing with the sensory ponds development coming up and coming, just understanding what community growth means and how can we implement our resources and tools into that growth to not only promote residents coming into Maplewood, but also residents leaving Maplewood without understanding of, I know how the city works, I know how the city operates, but these are just some of my major takeaways. Of course, if you sat down with me and talk to me, I'd love to share more. There are more than this, but this right away. When I think about Maple, these are the takeaways I have. But I appreciate your time and if you have any questions or comments, I'd love to hear them. 00:22:04,380 S1: I want to thank you for the your commitment to Maplewood, and I want to thank Mike Zabel, too, because educating and training up leaders is absolutely critical to the future of our community. and I really like all of the different kinds of things that you were able to experience in Maplewood, and especially the nonprofit Expo. I think that that is a natural fit. From what we have seen of our community, people helping each other, people volunteering in a number of different ways. I'm looking forward. I'm I'm sure we're going to have another one. I know that that's on the on the radar and council members, I'll just remind you that several council meetings ago, we agreed to have staff look into Just serve, which I think is a nice way to kind of dovetail what you have done in terms of bringing nonprofits together, that I talked to Mike about it today, and that resolution from the council will be coming out, I think, in our next council meeting. 00:23:12,529 S5: Uh, mayor and council members within the next two. Okay. Have myself a question. 00:23:18,160 S1: Which is a nice kind of a follow up to what you have done, because it's those connections that really matter. So thank you. We wish you the best in your next endeavor. Thank you for everything that you've done for Maplewood. We appreciate it, and we hope it sounds like it was a very good experience for you. 00:23:33,480 S8: It was amazing. 00:23:34,799 S1: Wonderful. Uh, Councilmember Villavicencio. 00:23:38,960 S10: Uh. 00:23:41,000 S15: Thank you, Collin, for doing this year. Internship. What a stellar amount of things that you did. I'm just so impressed by that. So thank you for choosing Maplewood. And, um. Um, it was great to get to know you. You attended many, like you said in your presentation, many of the events that we did. And, um, it's great to know that young people can come to Maplewood and have a good experience. So thank you. 00:24:09,240 S3: Councilmember Lee. 00:24:10,119 S7: Thank you. Mayor. Collin, I just want to say I'm incredibly proud of you and how much And seeing you have grown so much, how much you've grown this last year. From your initial conversation when you started in the the one office, the little break room to who you are today, you've grown significantly and to to really see what type of opportunity we were talking and we talked a little bit about this, that there's so much more opportunity in government. And you being getting this opportunity is such a great opportunity for you to really see what is out there. My internship, my data entry every day for three months. And that was not fun. So I think, you know, I didn't get the experience that you got. So I'm happy and I'm proud that maybe what can provide that sort of opportunity. I've heard from at least two youth already to have seen your article and, and are excited to apply for this next round of intern. Outside of that piece, you did so much. I don't know what's there going to be. I don't know if there's gonna be any work left for the next intern to do, but my question to you is, you know, what would you say to someone who's considering applying for this internship? 00:25:08,950 S8: I'd say to take every opportunity the city offers. Every day is something different. So just to if something's offered to you, just say yes and do it. Um, I feel that every day was always a challenge, but I appreciate the challenge as I felt that it really allowed me to grow myself as a leader. 00:25:26,940 S7: Thank you. Thank you. Luck. 00:25:28,380 S6: Councilmember cave. 00:25:30,259 S4: Um, Colin, I just want to, you know, everyone commented on it. Wonderful. You did. I can't even express what a great job you did. And your shoes are going to be so big to fill for the next intern. I do appreciate Mike's insight into bringing someone like you into our into the staff. Um, not only did you show all the things you did and the experiences you had, but staff also had experience with you and is everything but positive. So, um, I look forward to your endeavors. I know you're going to go far and you know, the next Colin 2.0, um, hopefully is out there. I remember meeting you. I got to tell you in the maps room that when we were on the tour, that room that used to be full of it was up with you. Steve and and Colin cleaned it out and it was full of not much papers and maps. And you did a great job. So here's to you. Thank you. 00:26:26,210 S6: Council man. 00:26:28,690 S16: I just want to thank you for all that you did and for being the kind of person you are that you took everything on, and we're willing to learn from it. That's incredible. It's wonderful. Thank you for being here. 00:26:40,569 S8: Thank you. 00:26:42,450 S6: Go ahead, Mr. Sable. 00:26:44,369 S5: Thanks. Mayor and council members. Um, I also just wanted to show my appreciation to the to the leadership team. Uh, this is not. This was an absolute team effort. I mean, you got to do ride alongs, and you were in all of the vehicles, and you got to experience the entire city. And the leadership team really did, uh, as put tried to put as much into the internship as we could. And so it was an incredible success. Um, so I'm so glad you said yes. it's been wonderful. So thank you so much. Appreciate you. 00:27:13,960 S1: Thanks, Colin. 00:27:14,880 S8: Thank you. 00:27:17,880 S1: Council members. Next on our agenda is our consent agenda. We have items G one through five. Would someone like to make a motion? 00:27:25,480 S7: Motion to approve consent agenda item G one through five. 00:27:28,359 S16: Second. 00:27:30,240 S6: Second. 00:27:30,920 S1: Gentlemen, the motion to approve consent agenda items G one through five. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying aye. 00:27:41,000 S3: Aye, aye. 00:27:41,680 S1: Any opposed? That motion carries. We have Councilmember Lee. 00:27:46,519 S7: I was just going to see if we can highlight G2, the financial report. 00:27:50,759 S3: Uh. 00:27:51,599 S1: You know. 00:27:51,960 S3: We'll we'll. 00:27:52,880 S1: Stick it in. Um, even though it's already been approved. Uh, mister room, did you want to comment on that? 00:28:02,799 S17: Thank you, mayor and council. Um, part of the transparency that we try to provide our financial reports. Um, as you recall, actually. G-1 are all the disbursements that are sent out every two weeks. So council can approve that and review it, whether it's through accounts payable visa statements, as well as payroll, electronic disbursements. That's all part of G-1. So you see all those expenditures. But then we also want to give you a high level review of overall, the general fund, where it looks like what it looks like at Q1, and then also looking at our investments and how those look. So as you can see from the charts for investments, we're pretty well diversified. We make sure that we're looking at security because it is not our money, it's our the community and the residents money. So we want to make sure that it's safe and then we have it available as needed. 00:29:01,859 S3: Thank you. 00:29:03,859 S1: Moving on. We have no public hearings tonight. No unfinished business. Going to new business. We have a conditional use permit and setback variance concerning Peach Automotive. Miss power. This is your topic tonight. 00:29:20,170 S18: Thank you, Madam Mayor. Members of the council, I will draw your attention to the overhead as soon as we pull it up, and we'll. We'll get started. This is, uh, pertaining to a property at 1770 00:29:32,529 S18: Jarvis Avenue East. Um, if you're familiar with the area, you will recognize it there, outlined in red. You will see to the north of it we have residential properties. And then adjacent to it, on the west and east and on the south it is more industrial. This is one of those areas where you see in our community over time, we have different types of uses coming together. And when we do that, we need to kind of take that into consideration and take a look to see. Is this meeting, um, our zoning and guiding in respect to what's being asked of it. This has historically been used as an industrial type use since 1988, when it was built. The properties to the north, the residential, they came about in 1999 to 2014. So just keep that in mind as we go through. It's one of the things that we looked at in considering this, and it's one of the things the Planning Commission looked at as well. So as I mentioned, you can see the 1.36 acre site in red there. This is Peach Tree Care. It's a tree trimming and removal contractor. It currently operates in the site. If you go there, you'll see that they have a number of areas within the building that they don't currently utilize. And so there was similar to what you saw in another application about a year and a half ago. There was a understanding that there might be a way to better utilize that. And some of these, um, some of these industrial type uses, such as car repair that are minimal and not major car repair, but more minimal car repair sometimes fit well in those those spots, particularly in a case like this where it's all in the interior of the building. Um, so to move forward with this, the applicant needs to have approval of a conditional use permit. And then the setback variance. And part of that is obviously because of the adjacent residential properties. This will quickly just go through the rest of these. As far as the comp plan, it obviously is guided appropriately for this particular use. And what they're asking would meet the intent of the comp plan as well for that designation, which is employment zoning, M1, which is light manufacturing. This is also consistent with that. The vehicle maintenance garage is required to be, as I said, at least 350ft from any property, um, for residential use. So that's what the request is in relation to the variances to the north there. 00:31:56,589 S18: The site was initially developed in 88, as I mentioned. Um, Schwantz enterprises was there for quite a while, and then we also had a contractor that came in between Sean's and the current user right now, and we believe there was some car repair done as a part of that. So it's not inconsistent with how it was being used previously. Um, the garage bays for the general maintenance. These vehicles would offer routine and minor maintenance services to the public, such as oil changes and basic upkeep that would be done on the interior. As I mentioned, if there is some accessory type things, adding washer fluid or something they may do on the exterior in a very limited way, but has to all be within the yard. They can't store anything long term in the yard that is in fenced. Is is has a fence around it as well, and they are making no exterior modifications as a part of this proposal. If they wanted to do that, they would have to come back. As you can see on the overhead. Um, the the is the site boundary is in dark red on the left side. Um, and then you'll see in the middle you can get a better sense of the parking spaces that are there. And then if you look to on the far right hand side, you'll see the interior, which gives you a better idea of where the doors are. There are four doors on the western side there, north and south. The west side of the building. And that's the primary entrance points for the garages. Otherwise there's office and they will continue to use it as it has been previously for the tree, the tree operations. 00:33:39,569 S18: The property is between 57 and 105ft. When measured from the site's property line to the adjacent residential property lines across Jarvis Avenue. It obviously curves around there, so it's not consistent all the way around, but approximately 92ft to the residential property across Jarvis Court diagonally. 00:34:02,150 S18: State statute allows us to consider three things as a part of this reasonableness, uniqueness, and essential character. 00:34:12,309 S18: Staff found that the zoning ordinance permits a vehicle maintenance garage on the property, subject to a conditional use permit. Similar light manufacturing auto oriented businesses have historically operated in the neighborhood, and when you drive around that area, you'll see that right away. It's it's kind of the feel of that area. Um, south of Jarvis, the property, as I mentioned, was developed in 88 largely will be utilized the same with the exception of those empty bays. They're going to utilize those, um, for this repair service. And they are zoned to permit this use as a as I mentioned, historically, they have been used this way, but now they're asking for the conditional use permit to make it legal. They purchased the property in 2024, and previously it was another user that was there, as I mentioned, the public hearing notice was sent to 17 properties within 500ft. No comments were received and no one came to the meeting to speak in favor or against the proposal. We had staff take a look at the project. There are a number of conditions that are within the staff report that they need to comply with. I spoke to them again today, and they are aware of all of those and have no issues with any of those requirements. Um, Planning Commission recommended approval on April 21st. We have with us tonight, uh, Michael Poche, the owner and Monier, if you'd like to ask them any questions, they're here in the audience. You can speak to it as well. With that, we recommend a motion to approve a conditional use permit and setback variance resolution for the property at 1770 Jarvis Avenue East, subject to the numerous conditions within the approval. And with that, I'm happy to take any questions you might have. 00:35:51,260 S1: Thank you for that report. Does anyone have any questions for Ms Parr. And then if we have any questions, we'll ask those. And then I'll ask you to come up to the dias and or up to the microphone in just a minute. Any questions for Ms Parr? Okay. Then do you want to join us up at the microphone, please? 00:36:11,250 S1: Good evening and welcome. 00:36:13,289 S2: Hello. 00:36:14,809 S1: Is there anything you'd like the council to know about your proposal? 00:36:19,889 S19: Um, I guess we weren't really prepared for that. 00:36:25,570 S17: Yeah. Um, you know. 00:36:27,090 S20: I think the net did a good job. It's not really out of character for the area or the shop itself. Um, for a tree trimming, um, tree removal business. We've got a lot of real estate. Um, a lot of square footage inside the building. Um, extra offices that just sit empty. And same with the garage area. And The mortgage is up there, you know, so it would help to, you know, justify that as well. So. Um, yeah. So we, you know, we do our own, um, repairs. The last company was an HVAC company, so they'd have, you know, small vans and they would go around town, fix your AC, fix your heating for you, and they would work on their own vehicles, uh, you know, inside the shop. So we do the same thing. Um, I'd say probably, you know, a good half of the shop is just completely unused. Um, good. Half of the office offices are unused, his office is unused. We basically just have a kitchenette and a common area. And we've got a front desk that, you know, I just set my lunch on sometimes, you know, it's, you know, so we've got we've got everything we need. Um. 00:37:46,239 S1: It sounds like a reasonable use of some extra, Footage that you've got in your building, right? 00:37:53,510 S20: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah. 00:37:56,110 S1: Let me ask you this. Are you okay with some of the restrictions that we have in terms of the hours of operation and the, you know, the vehicles have to be stored inside of the building. Are you fine with those? 00:38:10,630 S19: Yeah. That's perfect. 00:38:11,789 S20: Yeah. Yeah, that's completely reasonable. You know, the basic 9 to 5. And, you know, you keep you know, I understand that if I was, you know, if I was a city manager or a planner, you know, if you let somebody leave a vehicle outside for just a few hours because you're just working on it, that turns into a day that turns, I can completely understand how that would. 00:38:32,710 S3: Okay. 00:38:33,469 S1: Any questions for the owners? Okay. Council members then we have. Thank you very much. Did you think you'd be talking tonight? I know a very good job. 00:38:44,110 S19: I appreciate. 00:38:44,750 S1: It. We have one motion. Council members. Would someone like to make it? 00:38:47,989 S16: I move to approve a conditional use. It's a choral response. 00:38:52,500 S3: Yes. 00:38:53,780 S1: How about if Council Member Goodman. And then we'll reserve the second for you. Is that okay? 00:38:59,139 S16: I move to approve a conditional use permanent and setback variance resolution for the property at 1770 Jarvis Avenue East. 00:39:06,260 S15: Second. 00:39:08,699 S1: Moved by journeyman. Seconded by Villavicencio. The motion to approve a conditional use permit and setback variance resolution for the property at 1770 Jarvis Avenue East, subject to certain conditions of approval. Uh, is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying aye. 00:39:27,940 S3: Aye aye. 00:39:28,539 S1: Any opposed? There you go. All right. Congratulations and good. 00:39:32,780 S19: Luck. We did pretty well for now. 00:39:34,739 S16: Practicing together. 00:39:35,659 S3: Yes. 00:39:39,300 S3: Wire. 00:39:39,699 S7: Yeah, that was pretty good. 00:39:41,219 S1: Uh, next, we have a resolution of support for Ramsey County. EDA. Mr.. Or Mr.. 00:39:46,960 S2: Yeah, it'll be me. 00:39:47,960 S1: Yeah. 00:39:48,360 S5: Thank you. Um. Thank you, mayor and council members. This is a resolution that has been requested by leadership from Ramsey County. Uh, as you know, in 2025, Ramsey County, uh, sought approval at the Minnesota legislature to expand their eligible uses of their Housing and Redevelopment Authority dollars and which would require them to create an economic development authority. Um, and what Ramsey County is trying to do is to expand their economic growth and community investment programs and initiatives that they have. Um, they have asked every community in Ramsey County to opt in to this piece. Um, it is a statutory requirement. I believe the only city who has opted out, I believe, is North Saint Paul. And that was years ago. Uh, and so this is a request from them to, to put this as forward, uh, as you know, Ramsey County does a number of economic growth initiatives, primarily around growing new businesses, whether its CEO now or CEO next, or their Ramsey County open to business. And what they're trying to do is to expand that offering to also do some improve the capacity of business support organizations. So community development organizations to help new entrepreneurs do business plans and develop financing models, really to expand some technical service offerings. So again, trying to spur economic growth and job creation in the county. And I think lastly, the the sort of the largest, they're estimating approximately about a $2 million budget that would begin in 2027. And that really is providing some grants and low interest loans to businesses looking to start up and expand. And so by choosing to opt in, the city of Maplewood is able to access those dollars. Um, I as you know, I like to do simple math. And so about half of the money would come to the suburbs and we would get about 20% of that half. So there is some real dollars and real investment that we can make. And I think that PA has a really strong relationship with with the whole Ramsey County team. And so we're excited to put forward this there. I think I would say there's there's no harm in doing this, but there is a potential lot of upside. And this is my opportunity to thank Lynn Becker and the team at Ramsey County for being good leaders and good partners, and this is our small opportunity to also then offer that partnership back and say we would support their initiative. So with that, we'll stand for any questions. 00:42:14,500 S6: Thank you. Mister Sable. 00:42:15,380 S1: I want to say thank you to Ramsey County as well. Uh, in reading this, this was really pretty exciting to see what the potential of this could be for some small businesses in our city and for Ramsey County, just in general. So thank you, Ramsey County. This is, I think, a very excellent way to expand your EDA authority. Councilmember Villavicencio. 00:42:43,369 S15: Thank you. Mayor. I had a couple of questions for City Manager Sable. Um, one, you mentioned that North Saint Paul, um, opted out. Do you know why they opted out? 00:42:55,050 S5: Um, mayor. Councilmembers. Councilmember Villavicencio? I do not. I just know that they're not eligible for HRA dollars. 00:43:01,010 S15: Okay. And, um, of course, I always think, you know, regional, um, work is the best, um, for everybody. But one thing that I know that our residents care about is, like the breakdown. You mentioned that Maplewood will get a a portion of the breakdown of the money that's equal to our size. But is that in statue or what? What makes us reassured that that will happen? 00:43:29,929 S5: Um, mayor, councilmembers, Council member. Villavicencio. So it is an internal policy in Ramsey County that these programs be divided 5050 between Saint Paul and suburbs. Historically, Saint Paul has always been the largest in population and has often had the most access to dollars. And so Ramsey County has kind of pledged internally that any dollars that they give out will be divided 5050. And then, as the second largest city in Ramsey County, where 9% of the population, but we tend to get a little bit more than that. So, um, because we have good programs and we have good services. And so, um, I think Ramsey's pledge their commitment to do the 50/50 split, and then we must compete within the other suburbs in Ramsey County. And I, I if we're if we're doing our job well, we'll come out ahead in the long run, I hope. 00:44:18,960 S15: Okay. Thank you. 00:44:20,840 S1: They had a little bit of information to nurse Saint Paul. Uh, Darcy, this is, I think, a historic anomaly that, uh, Nurse Saint Paul opted out years ago of the Ramsey County EDA. They have their own. This isn't anything that's new. And so therefore their residents do not pay into the Ramsey County EDA the way we do. And so it's all tied together. This isn't a recent decision or anything having to do with North Saint Paul. It's just the way that they structured it, they weren't ever part of it. Danette, do you know, do you have any more specifics about that? 00:45:01,110 S18: I don't. Madam mayor, I would concur with what you just stated, but beyond that, I'm not aware. 00:45:05,909 S6: Okay. 00:45:08,949 S1: And it benefits our residents. So, yeah. Council members is there. Would someone like to make that motion. 00:45:16,510 S4: A motion to approve the resolution? Exercising the city's authority to opt in to and support the Ramsey County Economic Development Authority? 00:45:24,750 S6: Second. 00:45:26,030 S1: Moved by cave, seconded by June, the motion to approve the resolution exercising the city's authority to opt into and support the Ramsey County Economic Development Authority. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying aye. 00:45:40,980 S3: Aye aye. 00:45:41,699 S1: Any opposed? That motion carries. Thank you. Moving on to the gun range. This is kind of a culmination of I think we've talked about this many times. Well, I think we've we I've brought this up at our council meeting multiple times. We have met with the county. We have met with the city of Saint Paul. And that's only since January. This actually goes back years. Uh, so this isn't anything that is particularly new. Mr. Sable, do you want to do the staff report on this? 00:46:18,500 S5: Yeah. Thank you, mayor and council members, I this is a, uh, a resolution that was drafted by staff as a result of the conversation on April 13th, the, uh, a majority of the city council had said, yeah, we would like you to put forward, uh, a resolution expressing our opposition to continued use of the outdoor gun range that is currently on Ramsey County property and controlled and managed by the City of Saint Paul. Um, in your council packet is a number of background items that I that I will walk through. I think it's important for the community to hear it. If they don't, if they don't have access to the packet. But in the mid 1950s, this City of Saint Paul Police Department began using a parcel of land owned by Ramsey County as a pistol range. It was in the early stages of policing and the use of and so they they operated that firearms training center on county owned land in the city of Maplewood. Uh, in March of 72, the city of Saint Paul entered into an agreement with the then named Village of Maplewood, putting some conditions about what that would look. So there was issues that were addressed that were dealt with. Hours of operation and also of coordination with the police in Saint Paul and the police in the city of Maplewood. And so, um, I think I'll just reference Colin vu talked about finding historical maps and historical documents. It's often difficult to find things from 50 and 60 years ago. And so as we have done research on this, we've just uncovered more agreements and more documents and more signs. And so we wanted to provide some context that there are a number of agreements that exist out there. Uh, in November of 74, Ramsey County officially entered into a 99 year lease with the City of Saint Paul. Uh, it is a no cost lease. So the city of Saint Paul does not pay for the use of the land and the gun range. Uh, that that lease will continue until December 31st of 2073, uh, which is a very long time. And I'll provide just a little bit of context. When the City of Saint Paul initially began shooting at the outdoor gun range, it was a farm field and there were no neighbors nearby there. Uh, since that time, the city population has grown considerably. I believe the population and when the city was incorporated was 14,200. Today it's 42,000, which is a I. If my math is correct, 196% growth in population at that time. And so the characteristics of the neighborhood have changed. Um, in 1989, the city of Saint Paul did actually acquire land in the city of Maplewood. They own about a 4.7 acre parcel next door. It's immediately to the west to serve as kind of a noise buffer, because as as the community changed, as more people moved in, there were more complaints about noise and disruption. And so the city of Saint Paul actively worked to create a little bit of a noise buffer. Um, the city has received complaints about noise probably since its inception. Uh, but we know that they've increased. Uh, in May of 2021, uh, Ramsey County entered into a revised lease agreement, reducing the hours of operation. So shrinking that time that they there was shooting there and also provided suppression devices because as technology has changed, the types of weapons that they shot changed and long rifles are very loud. So suppressors were were put onto long guns. And there are also handguns have changed considerably. So the other component in that lease was providing notification to neighbors within a certain radius about here's when shooting will occur. Um, I would say that this issue really came to a head when, uh, Ramsey County decided to sell its portion of the golf course and then bring that into a housing development. So, as you know, uh, Maplewood will be introducing its first new neighborhood in more than 25 years at the, uh, Ponds Century Ponds project. And so, um, you approved a conditional use permit and design review and wetland buffer variance for a new structure. Um, so that that coincided with that housing development coincided with the City of Saint Paul application to create a new building on the site that they leased from Ramsey County. And so last year, you approved the City of Saint Paul application for a new building, which spurred this conversation about what is the future of the gun range and what ought to be inappropriate use on that land. Um, so not only did you approve with the City of Saint Paul application, uh, for the conditional use permit, but also in the near the same time frame. Uh, we've had the conversation about the Century Ponds development. And so in March of this year, we have our final approval of that 206 unit development adjacent to the gun range. Uh, and so all of these things culminated in a conversation about what is the appropriate use of land in Maplewood, what is the highest and best use for our community, and what do we want to see? And I would say this is probably the 20th conversation I've had about this in a public setting. Maybe not exactly right, but it's been a long time. And so at the meeting on April 13th, the council asked us to put forward a resolution. And so what you have before you is a resolution expressing opposition to continued operation of the Saint Paul Outdoor Firearms Training Facility, located on Ramsey County, property within the city of Maplewood. I just would recognize that there are a lot of moving parts to this, and so it can feel cumbersome so much before you is you have a number of whereas clauses that ultimately lead into six actions being requested by the city council. The first one is formal opposition to continued operation of the outdoor training facility within its municipal boundaries. I don't think the City of Maplewood has ever formally declared its opposition as a governing body, that this is no longer a use that we would support. Uh, it's been in use for a long time, and the characteristics of the neighborhood have changed. The second one calls for advocacy for residents in the city, reaffirms its obligation to advocate for its residents, to ensure that local conditions are not dictated by external decisions that often fail to account for Maplewood evolution as a community. So I talked about the evolution of the neighborhood and also the population growth. It's fundamentally a different type of parcel than it was in the 1960s. Number three, there is a rejection of the status quo justification. Um, it has been often repeated that while these people knew the gun range was there, so they shouldn't have to live with it, but that justification doesn't, um, hold water. So the city affirms that longevity alone does not constitute justification for continuation of an inappropriate land use, and policies and practices must be evaluated based on present day impacts, community expectations, and alignment with public good. Um, so those have evolved. Um, number four calls for immediate re-engagement. This city calls upon Ramsey County to reengage in a meaningful and solution oriented process that includes evaluation of alternative uses of the property or relocation of the facility. Um, this is a Ramsey County parcel of land. They are the fee title owner of the of the property, and they will ultimately dictate. They do have a lease agreement with the City of Saint Paul. So it's not simply a one sided conversation, but it is ultimately Ramsey County's land from which they would choose to do with it. Number five, the City of Maplewood remains committed to willing to work collaboratively to identify alternatives that support public safety training needs while respecting the integrity, growth and quality of life for Maplewood residents. Um, I will say, historically, the City of Maplewood Police Department had previously used that range as a free service because there is a state, uh, sorry, a police officer standards and training requirement for outdoor shooting. A decision was made several years ago. Uh, to no longer have, uh, Maplewood officers shoot there at the range. And so our officers actually use a range in Forest Lake for their outdoor practice. In fact, I saw an officer walking in today who had just, uh, had their certification process. So, uh, it is a requirement within the police community, but it does not have to be in Maplewood and Maplewood. Officers no longer use that. And so, um, that was a decision. And then lastly, the final item is that the city clerk is, uh, is asked to transmit this resolution to both the Ramsey County Board of Commissioners and the City of Saint Paul. And I say relevant regional partners, which would largely probably be other law enforcement agencies who might use that range. And so I apologize for going along, but I think this is an important conversation to have. And we wanted to make sure that it was, uh, thoughtful and on the record and also then outline, Um, you know, the city of Maplewood. This resolution says we formally oppose the continued use of it. We're willing to be a regional partner on a on finding a new path forward. Uh, and we just, uh, put this forward as a request. And so, um, I would expect questions or, and or conversation from the council. And so with that, I'll turn it back. 00:55:41,099 S1: Thank you, Mr. Sable, and thank you for staff for putting this together. Thank you, Mr. Beatty, for giving us the legal eye on this. I really appreciate that. Uh, you know, it's one thing to say that this is a no cost lease, which is a little bit concerning. Uh, Ramsey County owns the property. We are part of Ramsey County. Uh, and there is no charge for Saint Paul to use the property. But I would suggest that there is a cost. And the cost is to Maplewood residents who are near there who hear that, who are subjected to the perpetual gunfire at an outdoor range. And it. You know, I have on my time on the council. I have never hesitated when things don't make sense. Uh, just because we've done something. One way to continue to do it that way, we really need to dig into things and really consider what are there for alternatives. I appreciate that, you know, we want to continue with the dialogue. And part of that dialogue is we talked a little bit today. Maplewood is looking to heavily invest in a public safety training center in our community. That will be a regional asset. So we stand for the proposition that, you know, we need to to make sure that our public safety officers are very well trained. I do have a question for you, and this is another reason why all of this has kind of come together in the New Ponds development that when Ramsey County sold the property, it is. We've gone through all of the approvals with D.R. Horton. That was who they sold it to. Uh, can you refresh for the council's memory just how close the nearest townhome is going to be and the nearest park? Uh, because we're looking at the addition of a I think it's 207. Uh, it's a it's a whole new neighborhood. Townhomes and single family homes. And if and the numbers that I recall and correct me if I'm wrong, but the nearest townhome will be within about 65ft of the property line for the the gun range. Is that about right? Is that Ms Parr or Mr. Sable? 00:58:04,559 S5: Mayor and council members? Well, I will buffer some time for, uh, the staff to look that up. That that distance. Uh. Would make sense. It would be consistent with it. I don't think it would be substantially more than that. Um, with regard to your you're correct. So the the Century Pond's development does include a new city park that is paid for by the developer, and that park is about 600ft or so straight due north of the firing range itself. And so, um, the houses in the, in the, in the townhome units that are constructed near there will be very close. They will hear them. I can see both staff are, I'm sure, measuring using some sort of a Google map, uh, feature on that. But um, you're right, of the of the 206 units that are going to be there, the townhomes will be the closest because they are in the southeast corner of the development. And so they will be closest to the range and there will be some single family homes, uh, beyond the, the range itself. And so there is going to be noise that is going to be heard within that neighborhood. I will say that the developer, Doctor Horton, did make an effort to purchase that parcel as well. There was not interest on on the Ramsey County or City of Saint Paul site to to make a change. But there was part of the their desire to potentially purchase that and extend that housing development. So we do know that there is residential redevelopment interest on that parcel and potentially the parcel to the west if the City of Saint Paul were interested in divesting of that. 00:59:40,690 S1: Okay. And my other question before I move on to Councilmember Cave. As I recall that Saint Paul Maplewood does not use the gun range. Ramsey County doesn't even use the gun range, and they're the owners of the property. The only users of the gun range is the City of Saint Paul. Is that correct? 01:00:03,489 S5: Um. Thank you. Mayor. Council members. Mayor. The the short answer is that within the 1972 lease agreement between the City of Saint Paul and the Village of Maplewood, there is a provision that the City of Saint Paul will be the only user, and if another agency wanted to use it. It would only be at the express permission of the police chief in Maplewood. That has not been in practice. And in fact, the Ramsey County lease from 2021 01:00:36,519 S5: says that other agencies may participate in coordination with the City of Saint Paul. So there's actually a discrepancy between what the two leases say, because one is brand new and one is 50 years old and people didn't look at it. So, um, it is supposed to be the city of Saint Paul only. But there is a there have been instances where other agencies have used the range in coordination with them, which is, I think, inconsistent with what the lease agreement called for originally. 01:01:05,519 S3: Thank you. 01:01:06,389 S1: Councilmember Cave. 01:01:07,909 S3: Um. 01:01:09,309 S4: Just comment that I think this is really well put together. I really like in the resolution, especially number four for immediate, you know, Reengagement. I think it shows that our good faith and this isn't something we just want to slap somebody on the wrist for. It's this is serious. Like you mentioned, we're so close to the residents and and to the park. I do have a question on number six, though. Um, would it be relevant to add the Saint Paul police chief on there? I know that it says, um, relevant regional partners, but since they're such a big stakeholder in this, the police department, I just wonder if they should get that. The Saint Paul police chief. 01:01:50,710 S5: Uh, mayor and council members, I would say you can amend any resolution that you would want to, but you can also, if there are enough head nods that you would want me to send it to the police chief, I can certainly do that. So. Okay. Um, I'll give you the choice of amending it on the fly. Or just telling me to do it. I'm happy to do it. 01:02:10,500 S4: It's easier if you want to send it to the police chief, however. Yeah, yeah. 01:02:14,900 S1: I certainly think that sending it to the police chief makes sense. I am always reluctant to amend things on the fly because there's internal consistency. There's external consistency. And I know when I was reading this, this is incredibly accurate and reflects kind of the history that we have had with the gun range bringing us to this resolution. So I would be fine just directing Mr. Sable. 01:02:43,219 S3: As. 01:02:43,420 S4: One of our regional partners. 01:02:44,940 S3: Is the. 01:02:45,659 S1: Place to send it. Councilmember Villavicencio, your thoughts? Council agreed. Okay. Council member. 01:02:50,780 S3: Lee. 01:02:51,059 S7: Well, I had some questions on paragraph eight and nine if we have some minutes to discuss that. 01:02:55,500 S3: Well, first. 01:02:56,260 S1: This is the question before you is whether or not this should be sent to the state. 01:02:59,699 S3: Police. 01:03:00,539 S7: Oh, yes. 01:03:01,139 S3: Yeah. 01:03:01,659 S1: And Councilmember cave, Councilmember Virginia, in your thoughts? 01:03:04,010 S3: Yes. 01:03:04,409 S1: Okay. So, yes. Uh, Mr. Sable, are we good with that? 01:03:07,610 S3: Yeah. Okay. Yes. 01:03:09,210 S1: And Mr., uh, Councilmember Lee, what are your questions? 01:03:13,090 S7: Thank you. Mayor. You know, I think this is, uh, you know, this has never been done before to formally put together a resolution to tell Ramsey County that we are no longer interested in putting a gun range in south Maplewood. It's clear that we are not interested in our residents, are not interested in it. And I think this is very well written, with the exception of just wanted to bring something to the council to kind of see to have some conversations further on. Um, on page 91, paragraph, whereas nine and ten, I think everything else is very well written. Uh, but nine and ten when I read it, if it feels, I get it. Um, there's been some conversations, but I think what's important for me is we're going to continue to have meaningful and important conversations, good conversations into the future. The whole purpose of this resolution is to spark them, to want to have conversations with us because we mean business. We want some change in South Maplewood. But I think paragraph nine and ten comes out a little bit heavy handed. Feels a little bit more finger pointing versus more diplomatic and more. Let's continue to build our relationship. So I am interested to see if council would scratch nine and ten. Everything else though, I think it looks really good. Paragraph nine and ten on 91 on page 91. 01:04:22,190 S3: So. 01:04:22,789 S5: Um, I mayor, council members, Councilmember Lee, if I can though. So if I work from the bottom page, if I work from the bottom, whereas clause up, it would be this third from the bottom and the second from the bottom. 01:04:34,389 S4: Does it start with whereas. 01:04:35,670 S2: Yes. 01:04:36,190 S5: It would be. Whereas the continued operation of this facility at its current location reflects a long standing pattern in which problematic land uses are placed in neighboring communities with less influence over the decision. That would be number nine. Number nine, and number ten would be. The city of Maplewood has repeatedly raised concerns and sought constructive solutions, yet those concerns have not resulted in meaningful reconsideration or adjustment by the parties controlling the facility. So if those are the two that you're referencing, correct? 01:05:05,300 S7: That is correct. 01:05:05,780 S19: City manager. 01:05:06,219 S1: Councilmember cave, let's start with you. 01:05:08,739 S4: Um, I first want to know if we take it out because we kind of talked about it on the back side. 01:05:18,820 S4: So give me a second here. 01:05:23,900 S4: Um. 01:05:28,019 S4: I mean, I'm okay taking it out. 01:05:36,099 S4: I don't see I want to I want to see what the. 01:05:39,780 S3: What. 01:05:40,860 S4: What's the pros and cons of taking it out? Can we can we have somebody with that? I mean, or is it just my opinion because I want to know if this is going to because we wrote a resolution. So I want to know what it means to take something out. 01:05:53,420 S1: Well, talk to Mr. Beatty about that, I guess. Um, I think I already shared that I do not like editing on the fly because when you do a document like this, there's internal consistency and external consistency. And I read this as looking at something. Is this all factually correct? Yes it is. And so I don't like changing things up at the DS I don't. That's just my that's my thought on it. But Mr. Beattie you're you certainly helped in editing this. So tell us your thoughts about editing on the fly. 01:06:35,250 S17: Madam mayor Council. Well. 01:06:37,210 S21: Yes, this was a collaborative project. I think the intent for all of us who had a role in this was to draft something that would hang together as a whole. I think the mayor is correct that there is a risk of changing things until you have had a chance to look at them. What I would suggest is if there is an interest in taking out sections or modifying language, or maybe supplementing the language, that one of the options would be to direct staff to produce another version or two of the resolution that could be brought back at a future meeting. You could then read the dueling resolutions and see which one you you like better. Or you could conclude that the resolution as a whole hangs together and you're comfortable with it as written. 01:07:34,519 S1: I will tell you, I certainly don't want to delay, but, Councilmember Goodman, you have some thoughts. 01:07:39,119 S16: I like it the way it is. 01:07:40,760 S3: Okay. 01:07:41,639 S16: It flows. So it says the entire story of why we are even writing it. 01:07:49,079 S4: True. 01:07:49,960 S16: And let us not forget that the same people own that piece of land, own the one that they cease to have a golf course and decided that they were going to sell it to D.R. Horton. So I don't think it's out of line to remind them of these two paragraphs. 01:08:11,349 S1: Okay. Council member. 01:08:12,829 S3: Lee. 01:08:13,630 S7: Thank you. Mayor. I think my piece of it is, given that this is our first time that the council has come together to review this. That's why I wanted to bring that to the table and that if there are items, you know, if there's a way we can. I mean, my my purpose in this is I know where I stand on this issue, but I want to make sure that Ramsey County and Saint Paul also knows that we want to continue having conversations. And so to your piece earlier, Council Member K number nine, we do mention it on the back. And I think what we mentioned on the back of number, I forgot what number it is number four for. I think it's more respectful. It's more directive in terms of the the verbiage and the language that comes in. That number four is more in alignment with, uh, you know, r r r willing to work with them to have further conversations. Um, versus the whereas I think that's very finger pointing, and I don't want to point any finger at Ramsey County or Saint Paul. And number ten, I think that's a piece of it where, um, when I read it, it's very finger pointing. It's your fault that's not working out. And I think that's the piece of it is I want to make sure that they understand. We're not pointing fingers. We want to have conversations with you. We want to move forward in a meaningful conversation. So that's why I'm interested in taking those out. Everything else I don't question, I think everything else looks really good. 01:09:22,619 S1: Councilmember Villavicencio. 01:09:24,899 S15: Thank you. Um, I I'm open to looking at an alternative version, but having said that, I think, you know, when I look at these two sections, I mean, the word collaborative solutions is right in there. And, um, you know, I just think in this, in this era that we are that, um, being a little bit strong is okay. And, um, but again, I'm open to looking at an alternative. Um, but I look at these two sections as, um, appropriately strong. 01:10:03,569 S3: Okay. 01:10:04,050 S1: Thank you. Uh, so we have. 01:10:07,210 S3: Uh. 01:10:08,050 S1: Councilmember Cave. Let's see if we can. 01:10:10,130 S3: Reach. 01:10:11,250 S4: After hearing all my constituents. And I hear you all. Um, you know whose words best reflected is probably Nicki. For me, it's. You know, I can see how we can change things, but they do very much show this does very much show the problem. We've been with Ramsey County for so long. You know, with this, I think they need to. They need to see this. It's their property. They they sold the the golf course to it. So I think leaving it in there is going to be fine. I do see what you know, council member Lee said. But I think leaving it in there is going to be fine. 01:10:51,590 S1: So it seems to me that the majority of council members are fine with the draft, as is. Uh, is there any other discussion? Then would someone like to make the motion? 01:11:03,590 S16: I move the resolution regarding the Ramsey County gun range. 01:11:08,069 S3: Second. 01:11:08,470 S1: Second. Moved by gentleman, seconded by cave. The motion to approve the resolution expressing opposition to the continued operation of the City of Saint Paul. Outdoor firearms training facility located on Ramsey County. Property within the City of Maplewood. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying aye. 01:11:29,029 S3: Aye aye. Any opposed? 01:11:30,670 S7: Abstain. 01:11:32,989 S1: Abstain. Okay. There's one abstention. Uh, Mister Sable. 01:11:38,390 S5: Um. Um. Thank you, mayor and council. So, uh, just to provide a context for what's next, we will, um, the city clerk will work to put this in a format that's suitable for sharing with appropriate signatures and seal. We will then distribute that to the Ramsey County Board for the City of Saint Paul Mayor and City Council, and then we will do a secondary piece. I will largely share with County Manager Becker. And then obviously, I'll probably include the Saint Paul police chief in terms of next steps, there is no deadline for the for a response from Ramsey County. So that will be potentially a part of this conversation. I will forecast to the City Council that the City of Saint Paul has submitted a third application for a building design on the site that is currently in the process of review, and so you will likely see something I'm going to look to come. Community and Economic Development Director par for a answer to. 01:12:41,060 S18: That city manager Sable. Um, madam mayor, members of the council, we would expect that it would get to you next month. It needs to go to the Planning Commission. It will be at their next meeting. So depending on how that goes, you could see it as early as next month. 01:12:54,770 S1: Thank you for that update. Council member Kate. 01:12:57,289 S4: And I have a question. Do they not have a, um. I'm sorry, don't they have to clean up the contamination? Don't we have something in place that they cannot? You know, they're not going to be able to build anything until the contamination is cleaned up. 01:13:12,689 S18: Um, madam mayor, Council member cave, we do have a condition within the previously approved, um, application that does speak to that. Um, and we've had some conversations with them previously, them being Ramsey County in relation to that because they are the responsible party as the property owner. 01:13:30,489 S19: Um, okay. 01:13:33,130 S1: So to be continued, I guess we should say. 01:13:35,569 S4: So how does it I just have a follow up. I'm just a little confused here. Ramsey County is the property owner. They're responsible for clean up. And yet Saint Paul's going to propose a building on it. Seems like we're kind of. 01:13:52,600 S4: That just seems kind of odd when Ramsey County hasn't fulfilled their part of the bargain yet, they're allowing the tenant to give us a. 01:14:01,920 S18: Madam mayor, members of the council, this particular, um, request that they're having is specifically related to the building. The one that's going to be coming back to you is related to the building. Um, to a greater extent, not so much the range components, those are required. Um, however, they are not. One is is they're not necessarily exactly hand in hand when the consideration came before the Planning Commission and ultimately for the Council, it was more of a conversation about that building as an accessory use. 01:14:36,520 S2: Okay. 01:14:37,119 S1: Thank you, Mister Sable. 01:14:39,800 S2: Anything else? 01:14:40,520 S5: Um. 01:14:46,069 S5: Madam mayor. Members of the council. Stay tuned. 01:14:50,510 S1: All right. More to follow, I guess. 01:14:52,270 S2: Yes. 01:14:53,189 S1: All right. The next agenda item. The ordinance amending section 18273 pertaining to illicit discharges. Mr. love, this is your topic tonight? 01:15:03,430 S19: Yes. Good evening. 01:15:04,109 S22: Mayor and city council. Um, the Minnesota Pollution Control Agency does regular audits of city's municipal separate storm sewer system permit. Now, that's a long name. It's probably, you know it better as miss for. It's a lot easier to say as well. Um, during the recent interview, they did find that there was some code language that is required by recent changes to the existing permit that were not in our city code. Uh, they really dealt with the storage of deicing, uh, salt, material on commercial and industrial parks. And really what this comes down to is the language that we need to add into the code covers. De-icing salt must be stored in an area that is covered or indoors. De-icing salt must be placed on impervious surfaces, and the facilities must implement practices to reduce exposure when transferring. So when you're moving it from vehicle to storage and whatnot, um, section 18 to 73, as you mentioned, is the illicit discharge, um, section of our city code. And this is really the best spot for it because it speaks to protecting downstream water bodies. Uh, staff does recommend making these changes. Um, also want to note that as fall approaches, we'll have an article in our living about, uh, proper salt storage. And we're also going to be updating city staff as part of our annual illicit discharge training. So with that I'm available for any questions. 01:16:41,520 S1: Any questions for Mister Love. Seeing none. Someone like to make the motion to approve. 01:16:48,359 S16: There. 01:16:50,439 S23: You got it, Cathy. 01:16:52,039 S16: I move to approve the ordinance amending section 18273 of the Maplewood City Code pertaining to illicit discharges. Adding a new subdivision on proper salt storage. 01:17:01,920 S1: Second move by seconded by Lee. The motion is written in our packet. Uh, is there any further discussion? 01:17:12,399 S24: Hearing none. 01:17:12,960 S1: All those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye, aye. Any opposed? That motion carries. Next we have award of bids. This is for our street projects. Uh, Mister Love, this is your topic. 01:17:28,680 S19: Yes. 01:17:28,960 S22: Mayor and council. Um, as as a quick reminder, our 2026 street improvement project is made up of two areas, as you can see on the overhead. The Walter Beam area, which is about 2.4 miles. That's going to be our pavement reclamation or grinding up the asphalt and new pavement and County Road C, which is our full reconstruction area, and that's about two miles. So all in all, 4.4 miles of street improvements. These roads have an average PCI rating of 37 out of 100, so they're definitely in need of some love and attention. So these two areas also represent what I'm going to refer to as the base bid of the project. So all the street improvements, we did have one bid alternative. And on the County Road C area you'll see that Barclays Street in Brooks, kind of in the middle of the lower image. There is part of that project that a Berkeley there is adjacent to our Harvest Park, um, property. That parking lot is our main parking lot, and one of the things in the master plan was noted is that it was needs needs to be replaced, so we added it on as a bit alternate since we're going to have a contractor right there in the area and thought maybe if if it worked out, we'd be able to do that as part of the street improvement project. 01:18:49,140 S22: So when we look at our bids, we did get two bids. The low bid was a park construction company. The base bid was 9,983,000. 01:18:59,659 S22: This was roughly about 46,000 over our engineer's estimate. So about a half a percent. The base bid, which is that parking lot 195,000. That was roughly about 8000 over our engineering estimate, again, about 0.5%. So really close to our engineer's estimate. 01:19:20,140 S22: When we look at the overall project costs and the proposed funding plan. The total project cost is $11,786,700. 01:19:29,619 S22: This includes construction and all our soft costs for such things as consultant construction, surveying, as well as construction testing of materials. Um, the our original funding plan was a little bit more than that at 11,874,000. So it's a little bit under our original funding plan. A couple highlights from this. Uh, to note, there's $4.8 million, almost 4.9 of geo improvement bonds. Uh, Saint Paul Regional Water will be contributing about 671,000. And that's for our water main improvements. And there's about 1.9 million in street assessments. With that tonight, Council, you have three items before you. Uh, staff's recommendation. Recommendation is approval of the resolution. Receiving bids and awarding a construction contract to park construction staff does recommend the base bid and the bid alternate. Um, following that, council will consider motions to authorize the use of WSB for construction surveying services, as well as it incorporated for construction testing. And with that, I'm available for any questions. 01:20:42,159 S1: Thank you. Any questions for Mister Love? Councilmember cave. 01:20:45,560 S4: Just one comment. Great move on. That alternative, you know, with the parking lot right there. That's that's really wonderful. Thanks, Steve. 01:20:57,880 S1: Okay. Council members, no other questions than we have three actions. Would someone like to make a motion? 01:21:02,359 S19: A motion. 01:21:03,279 S16: To approve. 01:21:06,319 S23: I'll take edit motion to approve the resolution. Receiving bids and awarding a construction contract for the 2026 Maplewood Street Improvements city project 2521 to park construction company for the base bid and bid. Alternate one. 01:21:19,560 S16: Second. 01:21:20,520 S1: Moved by Lee, seconded by junior in motion A as listed in our packet. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Aye aye. Any opposed? That motion carries. Next is motion B. Would someone like to make that. 01:21:37,750 S16: I authorize use of WSP incorporated for construction surveying services. 01:21:42,989 S1: Second it's traveling as written in the packet because there's more in there. Yes. Is that do you intend to include that to you? Yes. Okay. Thank you. So moved by journeyman. Seconded by Villavicencio. Uh, is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying aye. 01:22:05,310 S2: Aye. 01:22:05,989 S1: Any opposed? That motion carries. And we have one other motion. Motion C as written in our packet. Would someone like to make that. 01:22:15,590 S16: I authorize the use of ITT incorporated for construction testing services, and further authorize mayor and City manager to sign the attached proposal from ITT incorporated? 01:22:25,270 S4: Second. 01:22:28,010 S1: Moved and seconded by cave motion. See as listed in our packet. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Any opposed? That motion carries as well. I want to thank council and thanks, staff. Uh, we have concluded the business of the city tonight. Thank you. And we are adjourned.