and culture [clears throat] commission to order for September 2nd, 2026. Jordan, could you please take role for us? >> Uh, we'll do. Uh, Tom Sonic, >> present. >> Carrie Neto >> here. >> Ashley Perfect is absent. Uh, Sharon Clark Williams >> here. >> Raquel Sodto is absent. Laura String >> here, >> Eliza Verma >> here, >> Arosco Garcia >> here, >> and Troy Woods is absent. >> And our staff leazison Jordan Layman here. Thank you, Jordan. All right. Uh, we are going to adopt the agenda. So, has everyone had a chance to take a look at the agenda? This is basically our standard agenda. Nothing special on here. We'll have our regular updates. Anything anybody want to add and change anything? >> Nope. Love the agenda. Move to approve. Second by carries. Second by who? Eliza. All in favor say I. >> I. >> I. Agenda adopted. Approval of minutes. Everyone get a chance to take a look at the minutes. Any questions, concerns, edits? >> If not, I'll look for a motion to approve the minutes as stated here in the packet. >> Motion to approve. >> Second. >> Second Sharon. All in favor say I. >> I. >> All right. Minutes approved. Nobody here for a meeting open to the public. We have no public hearings. Commission business action items and recommendations. So subcommittee updates. So let me jump over to this. Our public art project is our first subcommittee. Any updates here? Uh Laura or Carrie? >> Um Jordan, any updates on the penny press? >> Um I haven't get contact with them. Um I gave them a call last week. >> My mic is off. Um I gave them a call last week and I haven't heard back and I also have emailed. So, I'll probably be following up with them again um to get some communication going. >> Sounds good. >> And I've reached out to multiple vendors for uh possible vendors through Etsy um as a starting point for sidewalk stamp since my original person has been unresponsive. So hopefully we'll have information on that soon. >> Okay. Anything else from public art? Okay. Mural subcommittee updates here. Um, I met Brian in person at the Minnesota State Fairgrounds and we had a lovely conversation. >> Brian who? >> Uh, Brian from Steel and Stone Design who will be doing our >> boulder as he told me. He's like, "No, he was not going to shave it or anything like that. It is going to be an actual natural boulder that will say 45th parallel on it." and I got to see his work in person which was quite lovely and uh we talked about how we're moving forward and I have made Jordan aware of what's all the next steps of trying you know getting a contract together talking to him finding out what his sequence is we had a conversation about that what is the sequence of how he does the work so we can put the specifics in a contract but I wanted him to relay those directly with Jordan rather than through me. As I as I said, you know, that's the let's get it in writing and get it signed off. And once that gets signed off and the fair is over and he's done with his fair business, um I'm going to go out to the quarry where they will have selected several different boulders for us to choose from and I will pick one. >> Oh, cool. and uh he will get to work on it and so that should take place at the end of October. I have called Gopher signs in regards to making the sign signage for information and uh it I'm waiting for a call back and I did get an email from I can't think of his name, one member of the parks commission. I'm going to give him a call because um we haven't been able to catch each other. So I can actually walk one member of the parks commission and say here this is where it's happening. Let me know if if that's not great. So I will put the marker in the right spot on the day that they actually bring the boulder so we don't um have to move it again. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> And that is where we are with that. >> Did you say you met him at the fair or is it just he exist? He is he is out at the state fair right now on Machinery Hill and he's got he brought I cannot believe how many rocks he has brought out. There are boulders. They are gorgeous. So if you have a lake home you might want to go look at >> cool stuff he's got out there [laughter] cuz I mean you need a little space to put one of those on display. But yeah, and he had the variety of things from fountains to cool >> all kinds of things just made out of natural stone that is what would you say is indigenous to the upper Midwest type stones and yeah, it's like look really cool. So it made me feel good and it made me feel like yeah, this is somebody who if we hire them, they're actually going to get the job done. [laughter and gasps] I you know, you just never know uh what's going to happen with people. And then we can actually see the body of their work and realize that they're busy all the time. And I got to um just have side conversations with people who had actually had work done by him and they were there to make appointments to get more work done. And so that was uh I think bodess really well for his company. >> Good. Good. >> That made me feel good. >> Yeah, that's great. I want a big rock in my front yard. >> Yep. That's what he does. That's what he does. >> Yeah, >> this is pretty cool. >> Got a guy. >> I don't need it to say anything. I just just a big rock. [clears throat] >> All right. Well, that's a great update. So, um kind of good. Kind of gives you a little bit more uh uh confidence in the where we're getting the product, I guess. >> Yes. Because, you know, nowadays it's often difficult to tell if what you see on a website is genuine. So, now I can say yes, the things on the website are genuine. I saw them with my own eyes. I touched them with my own hands. They are real. >> Well, I meant the legibility of the designs. >> Oh, sure. >> Were it's authentic. Um, they were very highly legible products, which I thought, okay, that's what we're looking something that's not going to, you know, get damaged real quickly and need, you know, up updating and stuff. >> Very good. >> Okay. Um, I have some updates on the light pole banners and I want to use you all as well again to help out on this. Um, I think it's kind of fun that we're all uh getting involved with with some say on on what we would like to see on this. Um, but Sharon, thank you Sharon sent me several recommendations of local artists who do this kind of minimalist type of artwork that we were talking about at our last meeting. And I reached out to four of them um and heard back from three. One who said that they could not do it and two who said that they could um and starting to get some pricing information and some uh but we got to get some more details to these artists as well. But I had a really great phone conversation with one of the artists. Um and honestly when when Sharon sent me that artist, I thought there's no way this person would do it. It'd be too much money or something. you know, it's really great stuff. Um, but um they're this one I spoke with uh he and his um daughter who I assume is like his business manager. Um we talked through and they're very open to negotiation. They usually start um any kind of project like a commission like this starts at $10,000. And I said that's not our budget. Our budget would probably be more like half of that maybe. Um, and so they said they're totally open to work on it uh with us on it, especially if they were to retain uh rights to then sell those things as well because there could be a market for this. I said, "Well, there definitely be a market in North St. Paul and with the car shows and everything else." >> Um, so one of the things that I just I I was hoping to I just got some information at the last minute, so I didn't have time to get it to Jordan to send it out to everybody or get it in the packet. I tried to print it out and my printer won't work. So anyway, if anyone wants to take some homework, if you want to look up, who are my two again? Um, there's two artists. Um, great websites. Bob Teima is one of them. TM A Tea, sorry. Um, and I think if you just search Bobtima, you'll find it. And then Mark Herman, hm-n, it's markh hermanstudio.com. Um, both really great stuff. They, this is the type of stuff that they do. It's like, uh, local Minnesota or different cities, uh, iconic places or things, you know, they've got lots and lots of examples of these things. Um, I think what would be great about either of these, I don't know for sure. I haven't talked to Bob yet. Um but in my conversations uh conversation with Mark Herman um we could set this up in such a way that if we were to pay him for x number of designs, the city could have those designs to do whatever we wanted with them for city purposes without selling the these signs or or images. But then he part of what would help negotiate the cost down is that he would retain the rights so that he could sell the images because on his own website he sells all of these images in different ways. It's coffee mugs or uh posters or note cards and things like that. I don't think they do t-shirts, but I'm sure we could get there. Um so if they retain the rights or um working with local North St. Paul uh shops, you know. So, and I I could not think of the names of any of the shops because it's too familiar to me, you know. It's like Schlechen Company. I don't think that's the name of the >> No, I know what you're talking about. >> Collectibles. >> Is it that what it's called? Okay. I would have never guessed. Um but it's just like, well, I see them, so I don't need to know the name of them, I guess. But um but certainly those would be stores that would probably be interested in being a wholesaler uh for some of that stuff because I think as people started to see these things that people would want to buy the stuff because it's really really great. Um so anyway, if if you're all interested and would like to take a look at at those two artists at least uh for starters and if I hear from any others I'll let you know. But um just to try and keep the ball rolling, one of the things that we'll have to do and why I wanted to talk with you all tonight is narrow down our subject ideas. And I'll go over what we had. I think we had 13 >> um when we met last time. >> And so what I'd love to do is talk to you all and say, "Okay, can we narrow this down to say six to eight and then see where we go from there?" Um, I know like Bob Teima's pricing ca right out of the gate. He said be very interested. It would be like $500 a design. >> So, you know, if we did six, that's $3,000. If we did eight, that's $4,000. So, I think his price is lower. >> Um, but we can talk more about this as as we go. Um, would it be okay if I just review the subject ideas and then if you all want to say, "Hey, is there something that you would really fight for that you think would be that's iconic of North St. Paul?" I have my own ideas about this, but I'm just I'd be happy to hear what everybody else has. So, >> yeah, if you could just go through the list without saying anything and then we can circle back. >> Okay, perfect. >> Yep. >> No judgment. Casey Lake Park, Silverl Beach/park, The Car Show, The Gateway Trail, The North High Polars, Windmill, The Canon Veterans Park, Snowy made the list, the Scouting Museum, downtown 7th Avenue. Extraordinary. Three square miles and 45th parallel. Go away. That's 13. Okay. Is there anywhere you say eh that we could cross off the list or anywhere you say absolutely that one has to be on it? >> I think we can though I think we can drop the three square miles. >> I think it's cool but I I don't think most people know that. No. I don't think it's what we're known for. >> It's okay. It's not the most interesting thing. >> Yeah. I feel bad because Troy isn't here and this was his. But I'm like, extraordinary? I'm like, it's hard to picture extraordinary. >> What does that look like? Yeah. >> What does it look like? >> Yeah. >> But, >> okay. >> I also have a question. What is the 45th parallel? [laughter] >> Yeah, you bet. >> I miss you. >> I guess we all just didn't have Mr. Cannote for middle school, did we? [laughter] >> I like have an idea. big ass. >> It's a It's It's um It's the demarcation line halfway between the North Pole and the equator and it runs through North St. Paul. >> I was actually going to like put my vote behind that one. I think it's actually a pretty unique character. >> It is. It's not that many towns that actually lie on it and we do. We're halfway between. So check your phone when you get home and you will see that you're halfway between the [laughter] the equator and the North Pole. >> Um, anybody else thoughts? Liza, >> I feel like one that we is a must is we must do Snowy. That is >> always a must. >> Hard to avoid that one. I know >> it is. >> And I also think we should do Veterans Park. Mhm. >> Veterans Park. Yep. We got a lot of those in our St. Paul. A lot of veterans. >> I think the Gateway Trail, too. Yeah, that's uh that's the cannon. >> Gateway Trail. We should do the bridge. >> Mhm. >> Like >> Oh, >> what's I don't know. >> Over Mcnite. >> Yeah. >> Over. >> Oh, yeah. >> No, no, no, no, no. The one um >> like on the way TO MY HOUSE. [laughter] >> OH, YEAH. >> OH, that one for sure. Like I feel it's like the bus >> one over Century >> like >> toward the burger. >> The one over Geneva Avenue. Yeah, that one cuz like I feel like everyone goes through that one. >> Yeah, the one the one by the Dairy Queen in the Burger King. >> And that's the one I also always go on runs with. >> Although, you know, that one's a little tricky cuz it goes It's halfway in Oakdale. >> Oakdale. Yeah. >> And we shoot then we take a picture of it by angling towards >> Yeah. Just the same. Well, you know, in the background, >> we laugh, but that's kind of a cool idea because what could happen then is you catch it at sunset >> and I don't know if you guys have noticed when you're on the gateway sometimes and you look out over you can see such a wide expanse of sky >> and catch it on one of those nights when the sky is like incredible or I mean the artist can envision that this is one of those nights with a gorgeous sunset. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. One of the things that Mark Herman talked about is he said if I I want to know exactly what are the places or things that you're interested in because he said I want to come out and see them because I would not do any design without really having a full understanding of what that is. Yeah. I thought that's cool. I said >> he said maybe you could give me a tour. I said I would be more than happy to give you a tour. Look at that stuff. >> Um okay. >> Can we just hop back to Snowy for a second? >> Yes. Um, I know when I was a kid and before we ancient time ago, there was not always a snowy. Okay. It used to just be the snow pile in the winter. And um, >> you're that old. [laughter] >> Yes. Do you not see the gray hair? Uh, [snorts] one of the things that I associated with North High or not North High, but North St. Paul and we're almost home was seeing the water tower cuz there weren't the there wasn't so many trees and wasn't so built up and Snowy is on the water tower. So instead of just having Snowy, it could be the water tower that has Snowy on it since >> I know certain parties are find Snowy objectional and he's been on too many things. [laughter] >> What a nice middle ground, Sharon. actually is that I well you know it does remind me of some of this art and so I was just looking about there's this uh remember the I I can't the Japanese artists that did the big crashing waves remember when we were talking about we had this idea maybe doing that on the bathroom building as a mural right >> um >> and so that big crashing wave and that picture I don't know if you know the one that I'm talking about >> but you know what the title of that thing is is uh is something like a view of Mount Fuji. >> Yeah. >> Because Mount Fuji is little in the background. And so this artist did all of these and then I just saw I think it's Mark Herman had another one where it said he has one that's called Mount Rushmore. >> And what you see are like a couple of bison in the foreground and then way back it's just like landscape and then way behind you see a little snippet of Mount Rushmore. I think that's kind of cool. Not that we have to do that with snow. saw you is obviously >> well it kind of would be it's kind of the same concept because he would only be like this big because it would be the water tower, >> right? >> Yeah, >> this is nursing. >> I I'll just a thought there. >> I got that uh noted. >> Can I make a suggestion as well? Um just like on a I'd be remiss if I didn't say something on staff and how it's very unique that North St. Paul has its own electric department. Um just for the whole like met twin city metro area. I don't know another city that does it and it is as an Excel customer myself, it is really impressive how fast they can get out there and kind of the preventive measures. So, just wanted to throw that one out there as well. >> All right. >> It it is cool because we are a [clears throat] city. Uh we are not a suburb of St. Paul like everybody else. >> So, no one believes me when I say >> maybe like the windmill then be something to highlight. [snorts] Is that like >> Well, that would take that would take in the wreck department because once again, it would be one of those images where >> it would be hard to do that turbine without getting the wreck department in it and perhaps one of the vehicles >> in front of it. >> Oh, I like that idea. >> I I would just I think our electric utility and public works too are really awesome. [clears throat] >> Um Okay. Uh, so I'm going to say Silver Lake or SLB Beach is >> I vote for Silver over Casey. Not that I don't like Casey, but I think Silver is the iconic lake, the more historical. >> Yeah, agreed. >> I don't think Casey Park was always there. >> No, >> even if we just did the pier, I mean, people are going to recognize it. >> I'm also going to vote against the scouting museum, even though I was a troop leader at >> Yeah. point in my life. But I think that gets a little >> it's kind of supporting an organization in a way and it's not >> and it's not >> that unique to North >> but it's not No, because it was at Harmar Mall forever for years upon years. Yeah. >> Harbor Mall. >> Harmar Mall in Roseville. >> Yeah. >> You ever heard of Harmar Superstar? >> That's beautiful. >> Oh god. >> Talk about talk about aging ourselves. [laughter] That was a Well, that's a He was like a '9s guy, wasn't he? >> Yeah, but still. >> Yeah. >> I feel like the car show is such a draw and brings some to the city that that would be a good one for us to do. >> And maybe the car show with the North St. Paul background or the Seventh Street background. You know, >> they could be combined. Yeah. >> Downtown and car show. >> I feel like >> What about North High School? >> Yeah, >> we should do something with North High School. >> We are getting up there. >> We're getting there. It's on the list. So, I got to say you Ed, I'm Yeah, as I was kind of thinking about this, >> we have a big polar. Just a big polar bear. >> I agree. I mean, >> but then White Bear Lake, man. >> Oh, >> we know. But that's always been an issue. >> White bear. We're the polars. >> Yeah, that's [laughter] right. We're the North High School. >> And their bear is black at a white bear. Their mascot is [laughter] >> a black bear. >> All right, you had to get on this. You got your computer? >> Yes. >> Google. When was North High School founded? I can't remember. Wasn't it like 1904 or something? >> And then when was or when was Nor St. Paul founded and when was uh White Bear Lake founded >> Incorporated? >> Get into this. >> What's that about? >> Are we having a history lesson? >> Well, I I don't think we need to. >> We were 80 years before them. >> 80 years. >> Oh my gosh. 1904. No, 1905 to 1984. >> That was what? 1984. >> What? 1905 to 1984. What? >> What happened to 1984? No. 1984 for White Bear Lake. Is >> the White Beer Lake High School because of Mariner? Probably maybe because of that change or something. >> Well, no. It was always White >> No, White Bear Lake High School was its own high school. >> There was always White Bear Lake High School. And then around 1974 they opened Mariner but then it subsequently closed nine years later because of a decline in youth population. I'm not going to go through the whole history but >> they merged them. >> So Wiper Lake Area High School. >> Yeah. It became Wiper Lake Area High School. Yeah. >> When When did So North High was 1905? >> What? >> 1905. Yeah. >> That's okay. So I was only one year off. Okay. And what? So I just don't want to concede the polar bear. >> Polar bear to White Bear Lake. >> It's not there. Like I said, theirs is a black bear. >> It's our bear, too. It is. >> Yeah. Their mascot wears a black uniform. And unless it's changed >> for real. This >> You never noticed that. Their color is black and orange. >> I know that's what their colors are, but is there bear? >> Not when I was in Not when we were in high school. No, it's white. No, it's white. >> That's like the least whitear. >> It is now a polar bear. >> White bear. >> That's the difference. Polar and white bear. >> Okay. So, their their mascot wears a white uniform now. >> White bear. >> He's a white bear that wears a >> shirt. But ours is a polar bear. >> The way we've combined >> Oh, they must have did that when they became >> the high school. >> White Bear Lake area. >> Yeah. >> We end up with eight. >> Yeah. So, North High P. Okay. Here's what I've got so far. I got Silver Lake Beach car showdown 7th Avenue >> Gateway Gateway Trailbridge >> North High Polers Canon/Veterans Park >> Snowy uh Snowy on Water Tower >> and then was the other one were saying Windmill Electric Public Works. So what do I got? Seven >> 45th parallel is eight. If we can >> Oh, 45th parallel, right? Mhm. >> Okay. >> It could just be >> or it could just be the literal 45, you know, 45th. >> Mhm. >> Okay. >> Parallel be just words. >> I mean, it's special. I think it's special to us and that should be included. >> I thought parallel was like a street in North. >> I was like, maybe that's where she lives. >> We have >> It's a new nightclub. You're just too young. [laughter] >> Okay. It's a good business name. >> Yeah. It could be like a globe or something with like you know a line with it maybe. >> So I think this is good. So, we have eight >> and this is um something I can get to artists and say, >> you know, where do we go? And maybe I think what we can do is maybe, you know, rather than doing, you know, obviously we're not doing a broad call for artists, but could we get maybe we could do like a request for proposal from the two that have submitted and say, "Hey, here's what we're kind of looking at. Do you have any thoughts on this or?" Yeah, I think that's feasible. >> And I do very much like them working with or Mark Herman uh working with us on price, but then being able to sell because I think that's >> we as a city can't sell those things, but I'd want one. Like I think there's a lot of people that would want that art to proudly represent. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Love it. And I mean if it's for city use like depending on like the image and stuff like it could be something that's hung down in like the down there >> for sure. >> Yes. Right. >> Yeah. Or in here. I mean this these walls are terrible. It would be great to have Sorry. It's amazing in here but like it'd be really nice to have something to look at. >> Even this is fairly recent. >> Yes. >> Right. And now people watching from home get to see that in Jordan. I don't get to see that. I'm just looking at whatever the heck I'm looking at out here. Beige. Lots of beige. >> North St. Paul, the home of beige. >> Stop it. >> Sorry. Sorry. >> Well, I think it's all sounds really good. >> Yeah, these are great things that I think be really great representative of the city. >> Um, and if we make have to make some tough decisions, if we want to whittle down to six or something, we can just decide that when when we look at the total numbers. this gives us something to work with and take next steps. So, thanks for talking through that with me. Um, I think this is fun. I mean, I think it's great that everybody's involved and having some say in it. And even Jordan pulled out and kind of saved the >> added electric utility and because I was kind of thinking the windmill is off the list, but when we put it with the electric utility and everything, I mean, it's >> it's something that makes us unique. Exactly. >> For sure. >> Whenever there's a storm, I get little messages from my friends who live like, you know, just a few miles that way, and it's just like, I'm fine. Like, >> I got to [laughter] tell you, >> don't know about you guys. >> I have a coworker who lives in northern Indiana that was in these big storms that were up there. Two weeks, no electricity. >> No. >> Really? >> Yeah. >> Internet two weeks. >> There's got to be >> some heads rolling up in northern Indiana, I'll tell you that. All right. Um, okay. Hey, thanks for all that help everybody. That's a great conversation. Um, utility boxes. I know we have an update here. Who wants to take this one? >> It's beautiful. >> Yeah, our utility box is out there now for the world to see out there in at Silver Lake on the corner. Can't miss it by the tennis courts. It's >> really, really nice >> and it's really cute when you come up and you see the little squirrel poking out there. It's [laughter] >> great. I imagine we are done for uh the year on utility boxes. >> Yes, that is our last one for the year. >> Gotcha. Art cart. >> Uh we started brainstorming for next Sorry, this is art night. I'm conflating them, but we started brainstorming for next year's art nights. Um so between Raquel and Ashley and I, we all have ideas and we're reaching out to our contacts to see what we can make happen. So more to come with that. I don't think we have anything specific planned for the arc card though because we're kind of in a dormant period. >> And I did I hope that um this is clear but Jordan because I think when we met um I crossed it off on the list for Ava uh that there's no art cart at the uh arts festival this year. Right. Um, I think I that was something I wanted to discuss actually with you guys because that has like all the like tables and chairs I would assume that the art the hired artists would be using for the community craft. >> Oh. >> So, not sure I if we can afford the space I think it'd be good to have just to make sure that we have like those things >> just for the stuff. >> Yeah. We won't have Okay, that's fine. I need to have it. >> It doesn't say art cart on it. Even I did not recognize it when I was supposed to be setting it up. So I I don't think we have any concern there. [laughter] >> But we're not going to uh have people there with a craft available for children. >> Correct. Yeah, just the supplies inside. >> Okay, that's totally fine. Um okay, Carrie, anything else on that? >> No, I I think the other things on my to-do list were um getting some better signage and I have some um she sent me an initial email, but I haven't gone through it to put it together. So, I will work on that. >> Okay. Um, and then Autumn Arts Festival next Saturday. Um, I think I've got messages back from everybody. I added those to the list for Ava. Um, I think she mentioned that she's still needing people for setup and maybe take down. Luckily, we don't have to do the big tent this year. That took a lot of time right there. So, there's actually they're [clears throat] paying for people to set it up. um because I think setting it up on asphalt is a little more complicated. >> Um so I'm glad we don't have to do that. And then there's not art cart. So I mean there there are kind of some maybe fewer things but um and I think setup and take down went really well last year. >> Did the call go out to NHS yet for students to sign up? >> I don't know. Do you know Jordan? >> I'm not too sure myself. I think I've heard some things but I can follow up with Ava. >> Awesome. >> Yeah. I know. One of the things we talked about when we had a Jordan and Ava and I met week or two ago, [clears throat] one of the hard things sometimes with the with the high school volunteers is just not having anything for them to do. >> I know. Yeah. You know, that's the worst. >> You [clears throat] get all these people and they're like, "What can I do?" And they're like, "I don't know. There's not really anything to do." >> Um, so there's it, you know, I think it's a big event and it feels like you need a ton of hands on deck to to do everything. And my experience is that um we've typically had more help than we I don't know that I I know that I have never felt every one of our arts festivals like boy I wish we had more help. >> There have I've had the opposite feeling like I don't know what to do with these people who want to do something. But so I know there's a lot of people there, but it's um a lot of it, >> especially the art vendors, >> they really take care of themselves in a large way, you know. So Carrie, what you know, I I asked you or you offered to do something. Was it a volunteer coordinator or what? >> Oh, I think I did it last year. You just like stand at the tent and like when people come in, you check them in >> cuz I think I gave them a walkie-talkie and a button or something. >> Oh, maybe. Yeah, I think I think Ava uh pinned down Ashley for that this year. I don't know. But what? Fine. >> We'll just we'll we'll put you to work. >> Thanks. I just want to have to walk a lot. >> It's the power. I understand. >> See, you know, you know, you know where I'm coming from. >> Who gets a butt? >> Yep. >> Um >> ask for a walkie talkie. >> You >> I was going to get one for you, but >> you there at the arts festival. >> I really hope so. Looks like a lot of people requested time off on that day, so >> Oh, no. >> Oh. depending on work and if not I'll try to get my shift covered off for >> Where are you working? >> I work at two I work at a gas station and a restaurant. >> Which restaurant? >> Uh Washington Square in White Bear Light. >> Whoa. White Bear getting those tips. >> Gotcha. >> And also they had a market fest. >> Yep. >> Have you guys heard about that? >> Mhm. >> Jordan, do we have something similar or was it would it be possible to make something similar? because I liked that a lot. Like even though I was working in excruciating heat and with that smoke out there, [laughter] >> I'm not uh familiar with the Market Fest. Is it How was it? To me, it sounds similar to Autumn Arts, but I'm assuming it's not. >> It's kind of Okay, so Autumn Arts Festival is artists. Marketfest >> is like a farmers market. >> It's not really. It's just like a bunch of vendors in general. Like >> it's a variety of vendors and it happens on I believe Thursdays. >> Yeah, Thursday. And um >> and also they'll have people like from Ramsey County will be there and handing out information or Excel Energy handing out. So it's like a street festival. It's kind of like the car show without the cars and a few more um >> people would be there like let's say the like you were talking about North St. electric would be there and the people who have businesses within town would be there and then outside vendors would be like selling things like corn or hot dogs and whatnot. So, it's just kind of like a street fest that happens. >> Do we know if the city itself in White Bear does it >> themselves or if it's a like the chamber or third party that's kind of hosting it? >> I don't know who hosts market. >> I don't know. >> Who hosts >> [laughter] >> market fastest white. All I know is that they didn't close when there was all this smoke out there >> and and [laughter] they said, "You Ed, how about you run the stand tonight?" >> All right. [laughter] >> But it's it doesn't it's not very long. It's only like a couple of hours after work and then >> wasn't it like if you're outside for an hour, you smoked the carton of cigarettes. Yeah. >> So there you go. No, I just meant >> four carton cigarettes down my lungs. >> I just meant for Jordan's purposes to get a feel for what it is. It's kind of like almost a a popup street fest after work on Thursday nights and it's over before the sun goes down. >> I mean, definitely would say it would be more of a question with for Vince uh and communications person Ava Gertrart. Um, I would say my personal estimate estimate estimation is that a weekly event is maybe something that we just don't have staff for. Um, I would say there's always opportunity with attracting like the chamber com of commerce for the North St. Paul, they usually when you have a third party kind of doing it, um, you have a little bit more wiggle room on what you're allowed to do. >> So, never got into Rotary Club. >> That's a bummer. Um, >> it's a bunch of volunteers. >> Yeah. I have a question because I don't remember that. It's been a few years. Is the street closed or are you just walking up and down the sidewalk? >> The street is closed for like all car. Obviously, the vendors can drive through, but only if they're going to set up or set down and cops can drive through. >> Okay. You know, it's shut down like a car show. >> Okay. >> And it's a pain. >> Remember, >> you got to be quick with moving your car out of the parking lot. I thought since I work at the restaurant, I could have it parked there. Nope. So, my car is surrounded by officers and they're like all trying to figure I'm like, "Can I help you officer?" Like, "You got to move the car in like 10 minutes or we're giving you a ticket." Oh my gosh, you guys. I work here. >> So, then I had to walk like two miles just to get to >> But it's okay. You know what? I had so many donuts, so many boba lemonades. It's really fun. Other than working like during that little rush [laughter] after the market fest is like slowing down. They all walk inside the restaurant. Okay. you know, back on track. [laughter] >> Okay. Okay. Some fun facts. Uh, I got to give our White Bear Lake friends some credit. White Bear Lake was founded in 1858, which was 5 years after the state was founded, right? 1853. >> When were we founded? >> 1887. >> Oo. >> New Kids on the Block. >> However, one thing I'll tell you is the current mayor of North St. of White Bear Lake is Mary Nlowski, classmate of mine from St. Peter's Catholic School here in North St. Paul. North St. Paul native. >> So, >> we got that. >> All right, let's uh get back on track here. So, anyway, so Autumn Arts Festival, I don't have really have any other updates unless you do, Jordan. Um, but main thing is just tell your friends come. >> So, do we need more people in the morning or do we not? Because I can wrangle my my significant other to to come and >> bring that significant other. >> Ball and told he's going to be there. [laughter] >> Yeah. What time are we supposed to be there >> for I said I I could come in the morning and I don't remember what time that was. >> Remember >> um I can touch base with Ava, but I'm getting there at 8:00 a.m. So, I'm assuming that's kind of when we're starting like setup at 8:30 until 11:00. The morning shift is from like 11 to like 1 >> and then 1 to >> Yeah. >> or something like that. But >> yeah, >> I definitely think like emphasis on like the Yeah. set up and tear down or like where we need more more bodies. So, >> is Eva gonna send out thatformational sheet like she did last year with like here's when everything happens and >> yeah, I think she has something made up so I can um I'll ask her about it. >> Okay. Yeah, it was really helpful to have it last year because I could just print it out and then whenever people ask me something I could be like here it is. So >> nice. >> Yeah. So handy. >> Okay. Um yeah, that any kind of other message to And I think she was going to send a map too of the >> Oh, yeah. That'd be helpful. >> Yeah. >> Um, >> now do the local businesses know this is happening and behind their businesses because I can see where it would be opportunity for them to put stuff on the sidewalk. >> I don't know. >> Okay. >> I've always had the impression that they were aware of it and so I think it's good to good to bring up just to confirm just >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Be good for them to know. They'll find out Friday night when they start blocking off all the parking. >> Yep. >> Um Okay. Um community project, Eliza, Laura, Sharon. >> No, >> nothing there. >> Okay. Um that gets us through all of our >> flags count. >> What >> do the feather flags count? I don't know what that fell under. >> I think that was under art cart. >> Okay, then I missed the update on that. Sorry. >> So, I >> Yeah, cuz you're not on that group. I guess we can call that uh what should we call that? >> Yeah, I don't I don't know where it fits, but um I waited for I wanted the official art um which I'm not able to open from the email that was sent. So, I'm going to come with a flash drive tomorrow to see if you can just give it to me. >> Um I am out of the office for the rest of the week, but I will I can let Yeah, I'll let Ava know. I'll send her a [clears throat] message to let her know. >> Okay. because I just want the official artwork instead of just the one that I found online. Um, that looks kind of like it. Um, but then I'm ready to order. So then I can leave that information with you. They ship it within 24 hours. >> Um, so it would come rather quickly. And right now there's 38% off flags. >> I'm glad I waited. Interesting discount. >> I know who chose that number. Um, but hey, it's a discount. So, um, then I'll leave that information >> for ordering and get it done. Maybe we can we'll see how it adds up. Maybe we can order more under the allotted amount. So, >> yeah, >> we'll see. >> Yeah, it's just to kind of think about that with the turnaround time. It could have been something we could use for the >> Yeah, and it might still come. So, um, cuz I'm doing not just the stakes in the ground, but the weighted things. So, it should still be fine on the >> um, this is one of the things that came up after the last meeting, but the weighted things is probably going to have to be I don't know the options that you have, but it's probably going to have to only be weighted because um, we're not allowed to stake things in the ground. Like, we don't allow renters to do it just because of utilities, but the weighted things >> Yeah. >> would probably be So, >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Cool. >> Weighted things only. Okay. Yeah. So, do we think there's potential to have them before the festival? >> I do. >> That'd be great. And at a 38% discount? >> Yes. >> Fabulous. Okay. Anything else update wise? >> No. >> All right. Good updates. We had a lot to talk about. Um, old business, nothing. Um, reports from staff. Jordan. >> All right. Um, just very quick ones is that I am out of the office until um Tuesday next week. Um, and then also there's three commissioners whose terms are expiring uh this year. So if you guys I'm assuming you guys know who you are. Um I don't need an answer today but just by November first if um I could get a confirmation if terms are going to be renewed or not. Um that would be great. Um and then the last thing is a staff report that I am going to read from the community development director Ken Roberts. Um so this is regarding just premeating kind of protocols and communications that staff is uh requesting from the commission. So uh as staff we're uh moving forward we're asking if the commission could please send any agenda items, discussion topics, questions or project documents to the staff leaison no later than 11:00 a.m. the Wednesday morning the week before the arts and c culture meeting. Um, so for example, items that need to be voted on by the commission like the 45th monument expenditure that kind of happened last meeting or new items need to be discussed um just like for just essentially yeah a discussion um like the feather banners last meeting is the example I'm using. Um are all topics that the staff would need to receive at least a week before the meeting. um if potential discussion topics develop after that Wednesday morning submitt deadline, we're it's not like it's a end of the world sort of thing. It's a we're willing obviously we can be flexible. Um we're asking if they could you could please forward the topic to the staff leaison and community development department or director to discuss if that topic needs to be prioritized for the nearest commission agenda or tabled until the next meeting. Um, so if there's like updates, so more simple things that aren't questions, kind of discussions that you're asking, like, you know, throwing out to the commission or to the staff, um, or needs votes, um, those kind of like smaller updates, um, that don't require action or anything. Um, can be shared during commissioner updates. So, for example, like recapping like events like, oh, art night, we had this last week, it went well. These things didn't go well. We'd like to change this. it's kind of more of an update, not more of a discussion. Um, sharing progress updates, such as waiting on response or letting everyone know the subcommittee is working through something, um, would just be something we would ask be included in the commissioner updates. Um, well, not like the most ideal situation. It's not the end of the world. If something needs to be added to the agenda last minute, like for example, like the the light pole banner stuff, that can some be something that you guys can add to the agenda the night of. just more of we're asking to make the kind of make it more of an effort or make the effort to um try to get it to us as soon as possible because we're trying to get it um on that packet and for uh everyone to know beforehand. So, if there's any confusion as to what would be considered something that needs to be a week before or not, feel free to email us. Um, so with these changes, um, we would probably no longer need the subcommittee updates as like a general agenda item. Instead, it would be individual items that are normally discussed in the subcommittee updates. Um, that would be the agenda items. So, it just be kind of like spread out more. Um, this is kind of similar to how planning and parks commission um, procedures go. Um, how their agendas and such are set up. Um, just in general, it's kind of it's important. We think it's uh important that staff, commissioners, and the public are kind of aware of the topics that are going to be um on the agenda to be discussed. Um it's also important that we rece staff receives documents or handouts. So they may be included in the packet when it's published. Um because if the is it hasn't been something that we were really at least the staff leaison for the commissions were aware of but if we get if there's items or documents being passed around in the meeting um after the fact we have to republish the packet. So again not the end of the world if something comes up but you know just to try to be more efficient um if we can get those beforehand before it's published [clears throat] that'd be great. Um finally um if the staff lean hasn't received any agenda items, discussion topics or questions um or documentations um or staff doesn't have any uh those similar items themselves um then staff will consider cancelling the following meeting. Um let's see. Um if the meeting is potentially cancelled um uh we definitely want we understand that that doesn't mean like progress hasn't been made at all on anything. Um, so I would send out an email asking for the commissioners to share updates um, by a certain date and then I would send it out to everyone just so everyone's aware of kind of what's going on. Um, and then yeah, that's pretty much it. If you have any questions regarding this, uh, uh, please contact, uh, the community development director, Ken Roberts. I can give you his contact information. Um, >> I'm sure we all have that, don't we? >> Um, yeah. I'm like, that was a lot of >> I know. I can send it out as an email. >> Bullet points would have been nice. Like, >> yeah, I'll reach out to Ken and probably Brian about this, too. Yeah, I I got questions about that. So uh just a just a couple of things I want to um so I think that okay one thing is I understand the need if there are documents that are going to be shared so that the public has access to those same documents when they're going to be shared so that those are sent in advance. Um however I also think that since the very beginning with this arts commission part of the purpose has been for this to be uh an opportunity for the group to meet to have discussion and it's like a working session of of what what we want to do what we are doing uh you know a place to bring up ideas and and uh and bring things forward without it being um somehow already formally considered uh prior to the meeting. >> Um and um so so that's where I and so the so the notion that we would if there are not new documents or ideas submitted in advance that we would cancel the meeting just seems antithetical to the purpose of the commission frankly. Um, and so that's so those are some questions that I I can get those to Ken, too. But, um, I think there I I I totally get the the need for having um the, uh, uh, documents made available sooner. There are, however, times where things become available last minute. Um, and so I would expect that those also be made available in the meeting. Um, or just added to the packet afterwards as needed. So we can update the packet afterwards if uh, if new information comes available last minute. These things happened even in city council meetings. Um, and it's just the nature of the movement of of progress. Um and so I would I would ask that we revisit this um this entire subject the premeating protocols and communications. Um so I because I rather than uh you know one of the things too is I think our subcommittee updates have functioned very well for us for the last six years um to to encompass everything that that we have been working on outside of things where there may be new ideas that people need to bring up and those are things that uh we want to have the time and space with this committee uh and this meeting to to uh present as a forum for us to bring up new ideas that that may may come up. Um, and so, um, rather than having line item, uh, you know, I think I think I'll just I I think that's something that I'd like to, uh, I'd like to, uh, challenge with uh, Ken and uh, city manager and uh, and whoever else necessary to about just the overall structure of the meeting rather than changing that, which is seems to me a little arbitrary. And I I you know I get where Ken is I think I understand where Ken is coming from. I don't mean to you know transpose myself onto what he's thinking, but it seems to me that Ken's goal and his job really is to make sure that this commission and all commissions are being as transparent as possible for the city of of the citizens that live here. Right. So maybe in a way to achieve that, but also kind of respect the the cadence that we've come to or the the points of order that we've come to be used to as a commission or that I'm used to as a commission. Instead of just listing subcommittee updates, it's all of those subcommittees >> and we talk about it and then we know those are the things that we're going to be talking about. Those are the points of order. Um there might not be something new every single meeting for each of those points, but at least we have a general idea and the public would have an idea of what's involved and maybe there can be, you know, other category when that's where the the feather flags pop in, you know, or or whatever else we're working on. >> But I do have a question about that because I mean the current agendas are very sparse. So we always go through all the subcommittees. I mean, I think anyone in >> in the public >> that's watching this on YouTube sees that we always go through that. So, is listing it out just the thing that's missing? >> I think at least I can't talk for Ken, but I think the logic is if some if the packet is published a week before the meeting, people can see what's being discussed and if they ch so choose to come and share their opinions, they're able to. >> But if they don't know exactly, they just know it's subcommittee updates, right? they don't might not be able to know, you know, we're going to talk about a mural at the >> utility boxes, >> you know, maybe they want to share something. Yeah. Um >> they just wouldn't have that opportunity if we didn't list it out is at least the logic that I have gained from this. >> I mean, I do understand that, but we do then post the minutes from the previous meeting so they would have the information of what was discussed and what is being >> I mean, I don't even know a lot of the times what's being discussed sometimes, so I don't know how the public would know. Um it just that's just the logic I would see is that I think it can be difficult to figure out what exactly is going to be talked about other than just the general subcommittees. Um >> because sometimes ideas come up and things are different and I mean if it's a brand new idea, it's a brand new idea. No one knows about it. It's kind of the the point of it, you know. >> Yeah. And we and that's the thing is that we need the time and space this forum to discuss those brand new ideas. >> Especially since we can't do it outside of this forum, right? Right. >> We have to do it. >> So, this is Yeah, they're seeing it get made, but I think the clarity is just listing the subcommittees and then as the time goes by, like we did not have anything underneath the subcommittees in March. There was not we didn't we didn't know what we could tell you. But then as the projects develop, then the projects would get listed under the subcommittees. I mean, it's going to take more space, but that's what I hear happening. I mean, cuz we never know what pieces of paper or like just my update on talking to that gentleman. Well, that happened yesterday at 5:00 there the that was when I was at the fair. So, you didn't you didn't hear about it from me until 2 this afternoon. And so there that would be something that that would not be possible to be put in advance other than the only line item that could have been is updates on 45th parallel. And I I don't see anything wrong with updating every single project. And even if it's there are no updates, then people know, okay, nothing has happened since >> they last spoke of this. Mhm. >> And so then gradually as the summer goes along because I kind of see that as our [clears throat] on season that would get filled out and then now like after this week uh utility boxes is going to fall off. So we're not going to discuss utility boxes next time because there are nothing coming with that. So I think that's one way that could really help. We don't often have handouts. Do you know what I mean? We don't often have things to to distribute. I think for like when it's like a example of like what you guys are thinking when is like what I'm seeing it doesn't happen yeah every meeting but like >> like for example this is what the the rock is going to look like that probably should be included in the packet um or even like the project proposal form probably should be included in the packet is my understanding well and I wonder too you know you keep notes every meeting Tom on our um smart sheet what is it called >> the A3 >> yeah I mean we could post that or update that. >> Yeah. I And I just Yeah, we'll we'll take it up with with Ken and whoever else is necessary. Um I think you know as far as transparency, I mean part of our transparency is that we are here. This is open to the public and it is videotaped and made available to the public that way. So uh [clears throat] as far as if there are documents shared among us, I think those should also be shared to the public. Um and I don't think that's difficult to do that otherwise you know putting you know what is the you know it's a commission and it's an arts commission. It's not serious government business that's happening here. Um, and any decision that we make that would impact the residents financially is something that is made in a council meeting when they determine what the budget for the arts commission will be. So even when we vote on things that cost money, that decision has already been made. So as far as like transparency for residents, I think it's kind of a stretch to say that we would really need to be that much more specific on every one of the postings of our agendas prior. uh the week prior in order to gain uh credible transparency. I think we had plenty of that. >> And I wouldn't say it's just that. It would also just be helpful for staff to know so I can come in. I can't really participate in the meetings because I don't really know what's happening. I don't know until you guys say it for a lot of it or I get it the the day of and I can't necessarily vet it or check it. um it would be useful for staff and kind of understanding what um is going with the >> you know what the routine of this meeting has been since you've been here and when we [clears throat] say subcommittee updates they are the exact same things. >> Yeah. But I don't know what the updates are. >> And often times neither does the rest of the the the rest of us don't know either. >> And I think that's the kind of the point of it is to change. At least that's from what I understand from the document. >> Well, if we're going to write it all down, then we don't really need to show up then I don't get it. If it's all going to be written down in advance, then if people want to know what's going on with us, [clears throat] then they would just read it rather than us. >> I think there's some misunderstanding as to like what this is kind of trying to be. It's essentially what the parks commission does. It's what the planning commission does. It's not like it's a detailed step by step, but essentially you know what they're going to talk about. You know what the documents are going to be included in that. Then the discussion is at >> understand that. I really do and I value those commissions. But the the vast difference between those commissions and us is we are a team of artists. We're on a team. We're a team of volunteers that love what we do and we have to come. We have to show up and talk together to get to those decisions. We We can't just make them. They They come at random times. I mean, for artists, they come in the middle of the night and that's when we're going to have our idea. So, we have to meet. And so, the concerning part for me, though, I love a night off. I mean, I just wouldn't tell my family that I'm not here and then I'd go shopping. But, like, I love showing up and and being together because that's when we do the work. And we can't always provide that ahead of time because as artists, it happens in this space. So that's the difference between us and the other commissions. There's nothing wrong with the other commissions. It's amazing. I wish I was more like them and could plan and make lists, but I scribble and that's what we do. And so I don't want to lose that. I do understand the need for more structure or the wish for more structure. I'm just not sure that >> it's a little different than deciding whether or not road A or road B is going to be repaired or are we going to put benches in park A or park B because that's uniform what's happening. I think which is what is the point trying to be conveyed is everything we're doing is original thought and there's no guidance from anywhere other than us pushing back on each other to make it happen. And that's what you're seeing here. I know it's sometimes it seems wandering and circular, but we cannot meet outside the space. It's first of all, it's a violation of the rules and second of all, it's unfair to the public. So, they're getting to see it real time. This is how we are making our decision is you're watching it happen for real. This is reality TV for real. [laughter] So I think that's where it's that where there's kind of a conflict because ours isn't set and determined and you know there's not this like con, you know, like the parks have to do certain things all the time. They have to replace things on schedule. They have to fix things on schedule. There's a broken light in one park. They've got to figure out how that's going to get repaired. Where is that money coming from? It's a little bit different for us. But I guess the whole point is they'd like us to tighten up a little bit more. See, this is happening. We're see how we're all the same. We're all just like talking out loud like we heard words. Now, what do those words mean? And we're all struggling here trying to figure out what do those words we just heard mean and how does it apply to us? And so I think that what I hear is tighten up. try to get things done in advance a little bit more and Tom is gonna clarify it for us >> if if I've got it straight. >> Yeah, I think it'd be best to Yeah. meet with like Ken and Brian directly or phone call or something like that. >> I'm still concerned though, Jordan. You mentioned that you don't feel like you're included or or a part of this or or knowing what's going to happen next. I mean, how can we help in in that? I would just say as many email updates as soon as you get them. >> Then vice versa. I would love to have email updates from you on where we are with the penny press. You know, I mean, I think that's a reasonable request. Maybe we can also see some minutes and agendas from the parks commission to know what it is that they do so wonderfully. Well, >> it's on the website. >> Oh, is it on the website? I'll check it out. >> Fantastic. >> Don't Don't you read those when they come up with >> No, I don't. I got to do better at that. >> Well, okay. So to pull this to a close, I've been trying to email you more religiously this summer. >> Yes. And I have that working more. >> Yes. Okay. >> So be more like Sharon. >> No, I [laughter] No, I can tell you guys what I did and then this will be in informative to Tom when he goes and talks to the other people. So, what I've tried to do is um each step and it and I this this time it felt bad because I did not see the guy till yesterday, but I tried to email her and say this is what happened, this is what I'm doing and this is the conclusion we have at this point. So, when I get some information, then I try to email her so we're at the same point. >> Okay. So, does that make sense what I just said? [laughter] So, there now there you've got that information. So, do what you will with it. >> Thanks. Okay. Uh let's let's uh table that for now. We'll come back. So, any uh updates then on the budget and events calendar? >> Nothing for me. >> Okay. Uh reports from commissioners. Sharon, you anything? >> No, I have nothing else to say. >> Harry? >> Nope. Just uh uh uh I'm sorry, Liza, I'll go down the line first. Anything? >> Nope. Nothing for me. >> Laura, >> nothing for me. >> I'll just say everybody please come to the uh Autumn Arts Festival next Saturday, September 12th. >> Uh you student commissioner, you have anything? >> Um well, uh well, starting my college courses. Those are going good. >> Yeah, >> I always have something to say, huh? Goodness. Everyone else is like a busy college student now. So >> taking a lot of your time. >> It's nice though. I feel like everything is going the way I wanted to go, you know, like a busy not like at home doom scrolling. Like that was annoying. Thank goodness I'm more out and about now. And I feel like I'm way more extroverted ever since I started working at a restaurant cuz I deal with some people that just [laughter] [clears throat and cough] But um other than Oh, I missed the August meeting because I was at the at the state retreat for my state representative thingy. Mjigi. It was like a retreat for like 5 days. It was nice, you know. It was it's like what I want to do. It was nice. got into arguments, debates, and all that. But like it it wasn't like a bummer. It was like let's go. Like this is what I want to get into when I grow up. Like bigger arguments obviously on television. But it felt really nice. I felt very not accomplished accomplished but bigger leagues now. >> Fantastic. That's good to hear. And then, oh, one of my teachers running for city council in near White Bear Monida, and he said I can hop on his campaign. Do that. >> And then I uh Sam Rosemark. >> Mhm. >> I'm going to meet with him, try to hop on his campaign, too. >> Good. And then me hopefully I can start my campaign senior year if this bill in Congress passes. Lowering the local government office age requirement to 18. >> Wow. >> Oh yeah. >> So I'll either run. >> Isn't it that already? >> No, it's 21. >> It is. I know that. >> But if they lower it senior year, you roco as a city council member or a county commissioner. One of those two. I still got to figure out which one I'm going to go for, but >> [laughter] >> I think the county commissioner pays more. >> Significantly more. >> Also way harder to get. >> Yes. >> Significantly more. >> You drop out of high school if you got >> Well, I was going to say >> Wow. Um >> could use it to fund your, you know, pay for college. >> I mean, yeah. >> Tell your mom you're staying at home and pay for college with >> I thought I'm like, wow. They're going to be like, how is he going to run for county commission and he still lives with his parents? [laughter] >> You're in the county. >> There you go. There you go. >> But yeah, >> fantastic. >> I mean, I hope it passes. That's plan A right now. Plan B is Marines. Plan C is I don't know what plan C is. I had it earlier. I probably lost it somewhere. >> Well, well, it sounds like you're going places and I'm happy to hear that. >> Thanks. >> Yeah, >> good job you had. All right. Well, our council leazison is not here, so I'm going to adjourn the meeting at 7:36. Thanks, everyone. All righty.