Mr. Mayor, no changes to the agenda. >> Motion to approve. >> Second. >> I. >> So moved. >> Second. >> I. >> [snorts] >> Um I'll borrow from community or excuse me um community events. Uh which council members at this point are planning to participate in the parade float? >> Okay. >> I cannot get off work. >> Okay. Right. But I have nothing else. >> Public works have anything? >> Um no. >> Chief? >> I the grant opened up finally for the squad cam body cams um and I completed it and I hoping and thinking I did it correctly and submitted it. Um don't know when we'll hear anything. I believe they try to get it up before this end of fiscal year which is September. So hopefully we'll hear something soon. I got it done early enough so if there are any issues or concerns they would have time to get back to me and say hey you got to do something different or fix something. And then uh we are ready to go for the parade. We have extra officers uh coming in for to handle the parade and kind of keep an eye on things and then I think one extra in on Saturday night as well although that historically hasn't been a a really crazy night for us but you never know. That's all I got. >> All right. Attorney, you or you? Who wants it? >> Do the report first and then >> Yeah, there's not a formal report but I'm happy to address anything uh Rich will be talking Main Street. Um I know Rich blessed you with the story so I don't I can pass tonight or if unless you guys want one but >> I want one. >> [laughter] >> You want one? >> Let's see what you got. Let's see what you have here. >> I've got a little nephew named Jack. Um and we were at my folks place the other day and they have a big garden in their back. He was out there. He was watering pulling weeds and everything and he started talking to like the vegetables. I don't know. I was trying to make them grow. I don't know. So I was talking to him and I'm like and he's like oh no yeah I talk with the I talk with the vegetables and they they talk back so yeah so apparently Jack and the beans talk. >> [laughter] >> That's cute. >> Well done Grasshopper. >> [laughter] >> Well done Grasshopper. >> Ready for me? >> Yes, sir. >> All right. Let's see if I can figure out how to do this. Has it been that long, Rex? Really? Well, you know, I never was very good at it. >> What about your manual steering? >> [laughter] >> Kids on the mound. >> Oh, this one. Share. >> [laughter] >> That was a loud one. >> Slideshow. From beginning. Check it out. So, this seems like a nothing burger, um but some of you've probably talked about this project before. So, the purpose tonight is just to put it back up there to see if there is interest in a new approach that might want you or cause you to want to put it on your capital improvement plan sometime in the next 5 years. We are going to talk, just so that you know what to expect, so you don't jump in too soon with questions. A little bit of background, description of the problems as I see them. Uh a proposed solution, and talk about costs and funding. And then, I'll talk to questions and discussion. So, you're free to ask anytime you want, but if you can't help yourself, but maybe it's going to be more efficient if you wait toward toward the end of the discussion. I'll be back with you. So, um you're looking on the left-hand side of the image here, Town Avenue. That's downtown Elko, where the bars are, where my cursor uh is hovering. And over on the right side is Serene Course, which goes up to two. We're talking about this gravel road connection between the two. >> [snorts] >> About a quarter mile long, a little bit over. This is one of the last gravel roads in the city limits. There are some gravel streets in Elko, also. And this connects downtown Elko to Xerxes. The problems are gravel surfacing is one. It just always has a negative impact on the users, adjacent property owners, and the public works department. We're asked very frequently, why isn't Main Street paved? The uh negative impacts that you can imagine for yourself are bumpy, dusty, muddy when it's wet. Um for public works, they're having to go out and blade it to keep try and keep it as smooth as they can, apply dust control to keep it from being dusty. Uh for the neighbors that live on it, uh there's two uh properties that connect to it. Uh it's a double-edged sword. The bumps and dust keep people off of it, so they have low traffic volumes. Um and it keeps speed down, but they have to drive on it, too. Probably the um bigger public safety issue, not that it's a crisis, uh but it is an issue, is that because of the configuration of Main Street, we're unable to put stop control on Main Street at Xerxes, and instead have uh Xerxes stopped at Main. Xerxes has traffic on the order of 3,000 cars a day. Main Street has on the order of 300 cars a day. Um conventional wisdom, the Minnesota Manual of Uniform Traffic Control Devices, would all indicate the stop should be Main Street at Xerxes, not Xerxes at me. Um, Greg can attest that there's pretty high non-compliance with the stop signs at that location. They don't roll up, they don't see traffic there almost ever. It doesn't look like it's a major road, and so the tendency is to drive the road you see and blow through the stop signs. That's not necessarily hurting something until it is. Somebody's there, they don't see them, or there's a kid on a bike or something like that, and they violate that stop sign, that's when the danger can come in. Um I'll leave that there. Other problems, we've got some sharp curves, so the thought is, well, let's just go throw some some pavement down on this road. Got some sharp curves on the west end, and they're uneven, they're not the same radius, so those can cause problems. The concern is you go pave that, speeds will increase. And um, without some care, you'll have uh, possibly people leaving the roadway. I'm going to give you an engineering lecture uh, interlude here. I want to talk first about design speed versus speed limits versus travel speeds. They're all different things. So, design speed is a speed that when I design a road, I pick or it's picked for me in some cases. For example, a state aid road or a freeway or something, you know that design speed's going to be 70, 75 miles an hour. Um, but we can pick the speed, and then that drives decisions that we make about the sharpness of curves, the width of the lanes, the steepness, the um, the shape of the vertical curves. You know, if you got something that's really steep with a sharp crest, you need to have distance to see if there's something over that crest so that you can stop anytime if there's something on the roadway. The slower the speeds, the steeper and sharper those can be. The faster, everything has to get flatter. So, that's design speed. That's nothing the driver sees. Speed limit reflects speeds deemed prudent by society for conditions. Those are set by state statute. Either based on the adjacent land use or the type of roadway or lack thereof. Travel speed reflects driver's good judgment and the speed they choose to drive the roadway or not use good judgment. Speed limits um this segment does not meet the statutory requirements for an urban district, which is part of the speed limit statute. Urban district, the speed limit is automatically 30, whether it's signed or not, it's 30. This doesn't have the driveways and the spacing for a quarter mile to meet that. So, bad news is that speed limit is by law 55. >> Holy cow. >> People may not drive that fast, but that is the limit. >> Wow. >> Design speed elements that Luke and I choose can affect travel speeds, which in turn can affect the speed limit. So, for example, some of you may recall we did a speed study. We had MnDOT do a speed study on Xerxes cuz there was a question about the speed limit. They determined the appropriate speed limit based on the speeds people were driving to be 35 mph. So, that would happen here. If we did something similar and if we found people were driving 32, MnDOT would say the appropriate speed limit is 30. But, that's based on the speed study, not on statute. And the speed study, like I said, based on how people use the road. So, establishing speed limits is not the purpose of this review, but influencing travel speeds, I think, is a consideration for any of our roads in town, including this one. One thing about gravel roads, a lot of times you'll say, "Well, you'll hear people go, how much traffic does it need before it's cheaper to pave it?" And the answer is that doesn't exist. It's always cheaper to leave it gravel. Both in the short term, paving's expensive. And in maintaining it, you got to seal the cracks, seal coat it in some cases, overlay it, replace it. Over the lifespan, pavement is more expensive than gravel. So, we don't pave gravel roads for money. We pave gravel roads for quality of life. Cuz there gets to be a point people just won't tolerate it. It's too, you know, the traffic's too much, too many clay, too much dust, public works can't keep up. So, this is not about money, it's about quality of life for the users of that road and the people alongside it. Back to the problems. This roadway's uh classified as a minor collector on the city's functional classification system. The typical speeds in that are 30 to 35 mph. Uh I already mentioned I'm concerned if we just go slap pavement down, speeds will increase cuz it's not a traffic Uh the reverse curves at the west end are too sharp for 30 mph in all weather, especially winter and general rain. You could have people sliding off uh if you just paved it. Uh and the reverse curves, they're not equal radius, so anybody that's driven for very long soon gets conditioned you're going to have an S curve, you're going to have an equal S-curve the opposite way. If they're unequal, you could have some driver error and people leaving the roadway. However, realigning that roadbed would be costly and risky. You've got muck soils through that whole corridor. If you look at the aerial photo, it's all wetlands on each side except for where the the houses are. So, if you were going to try and straighten out the curves to a softer radius, you'd be removing a lot of muck. You've got to bring something in to replace that muck. And that consolidation of the material that you bring in could keep happening for years. So, that's the risk. But the current roadbed, imperfect as it is, has been there a long time. They They did a lot of hard work to try and stabilize it. They think there's tree trunks and stuff down there. And it's consolidated for as long as I've been here. Uh so, it's uh in Corey's opinion, it's a good road from a stability standpoint. So, one solution we've tried different ones. We were going to make it a full urban section, beautiful all the way through downtown Elko, and it was that was 15 years ago. That was going to be 800 and some thousand dollars. That got rejected. Uh so, we started thinking differently this time. What if we choose and live with a lower design speed? Say 20 mph. It's only a quarter mile, so that 20 mph 10 mph is not going to make a big difference in delays for people. They're probably going 20 25 already because it's rough. So, if we design the road, make choices based on that, this is what 20 This is what uh from a bird's-eye view, this is what the pavement would look like. We I did a best fit of radiuses that are safe for 20 that are equal on the existing roadbed. We would have to put warning signs. There's no question about that Um at each end like I've shown here on the graphic. We would put a center line skip marking down the middle of the road. And we would put marked 10-ft travel lanes of paint on each side. Normal travel lane is 12 ft. >> [clears throat] >> What we've noticed when we've done this on other roads to try and attenuate speed, we are conditioned as drivers to not cross that center line. We don't like it. Even Corey was surprised to find himself following the curves on Aaron um just because there's paint there. I mean, the car don't care, but we do. So, that center line stripe keeps people on their side of the road. That edge marking will make that road feel narrower, and that naturally makes you feel like going a little slower. So, that's the purpose of those paint marks. We normally don't mark our pavements except for major collectors or cases like this. We make the pavement 26-ft wide even though the lanes are only 20 added together. Uh and that's simply to allow some room for folks outside that paint mark if they're pedestrians or if they get a flat tire, they can pull over to the side. They've got a little room and still allow two-way traffic pass. And then they recognize that's >> I say it all the time. I really do. >> And then beyond that, we'd have a 2-ft gravel shoulder that just helps support that pavement edge keep it from crumbling and gives a little buffer between the pavement that's the edge if someone does get a little careless and they're pulling over. This is a profile view. So, if you imagine you could get into the ground and look at the road sideways. It's exaggerated. It's not as in reality it's not as steep as this looks. So, just just a heads-up on that. But, if you look at the um the steep part on the right-hand side of the graphic, you see a faint sort of dashed line scribbling up the hill. That's the existing profile going up to the hill towards Xerxes. And it does that right up to the edge of pavement on Xerxes. So, if you pull up there and do stop, you're sitting kind of like this and you're at an angle, so you're looking up, you know, kind of over your shoulder. It's hard to see. We normally want to have a 3% or flatter grade at the top of the hill for cars that have to wait for something. So, this profile, the heavy black line, shows fill going up that hill so that we can create that uh flatter spot for cars that would be waiting at Xerxes for uh a gap to pull out. The uh the slope of that is still above our standard 8%. I think we're willing to live with that on a low volume road with tough sight constraints like this. Uh it's flatter than what's out there, but the main purpose of that fill is to give you that flat spot at the top and I think that's intuitive by looking. >> Mhm. >> However, >> just so we're on the same page, too, we should never be using stop signs for speed control. >> Right. >> Let's just clarify that so it doesn't future conversations come up that people are complaining about speed. Your stop sign's not your correction for that. >> I should have put that in the end of the report. >> [laughter] >> Mhm. >> Yeah, you most certainly would have to change the design to meet state aid standards and it would be significantly more expensive at that point to meet those standards. >> So I've been here 15 years. We're very familiar with that intersection. Um One of the residents there does complain quite often about the stop signs. We do periodically sit there. Does someone every once in a while blow that stop sign? Yeah, absolutely. But since public works did a good job of cutting back the trees, that's greatly reduced issues. And in the 15 years that I've been here, I've been to two crashes on Circ C and both involved drunk drivers and they were not at that intersection. So can it happen? Absolutely. Has it happened? Not in the last 15 years that I'm aware of. >> If you have a question, go ahead. I I had another thought but >> Okay. Are the two homeowners that are on the right Sorry. Are the two homeowners that are on that road right now, are they currently complaining about the gravel and wish that it was >> Not that I'm aware of. >> Okay. >> Uh I was just going to remark that >> [clears throat] >> as things continue to evolve and grow here, there will come a time you'll need to close Xerxes for us for extension or some improvement. So, having this connection made and paved would be a benefit for routing traffic for a detour. Um but I don't know that we're going to be there for a while before that would happen. Uh so, [snorts] and maybe some opportunity will come up with some sort of development projects in Elko where it might make more sense to look at this kind of an old way. I don't see an urgency. Um we've even had flippant remarks about why don't we just disconnect that road on one end. Um but I'm not there yet, either. So, just wanted to present this information so you knew what I think the best solution is for the lowest cost. Um Corey is keen to just go pave it. I want no part of that, but he's welcome to do it. Um But that, you know, that has potential consequences, too. >> Another option that could be explored, too, is just keeping it in the back your back pocket for future years when you have larger projects, payment rehab projects like that. Not necessarily couple it with that, but you could have it like an add alternate. Just in the event that you get favorable pricing. What that allows is let's get pricing on it and then decide whether we're doing it or not. So, if you have a big project where a contractor's going after it, gets competitive pricing, you might be able to get, you know, get this one 50% off kind of thing. Um >> Yep. >> Not to say that that's certainly, but just the economies of scale might help drive that down if if somebody's on the fence in terms of of price like that, that's something to keep in your back pocket. We have the idea of what we'd do here, so it won't take that much effort to get that and then bid it as an alternate, so it's you get a bid for your base bid for everything else, then they give you a separate bid for this and you can decide whether you want to go do do it or not, too. >> I mean, I think it makes sense to put in the plan somewhere so that it's like built in so it doesn't have to be a quick pull something together and then throw it in if if something like that does come up. But remind me, do we have uh an upcoming pavement project in the near future that it already could be piggybacked up? >> So, 2027 and 2030, you know. >> Yeah. And then possibly, depending on how much we accomplish in those, possibly like a 2032. >> And then with your beautiful crystal balls, um you know, if we did it in '27 versus in '30 with inflationary costs or something like that, like on average what would based on what we've seen maybe over the last however many years uh like how much of an increase is it every year we delay or every road project we delay from '27 to '30 to '32? >> It depends. >> You have your anniversary bill, too. >> For reference, like for for pavement, right? It's largely driven by oil prices. Um oil prices were pretty favorable earlier in the year when a lot of these contractors got locked in for the for their projects this summer. So, actually oil for bituminous prices on average are significantly lower than they were last year. But we've seen inflation through other things at times, you know. Bituminous is is you kind of don't know until you start bidding that that that year. Um as with other other materials, PVC pipe for instance, that's has a lot of fluctuation with it. Steel, um it's not necessarily just inflation. You you can get inflation in terms of the the labor aspect of it, but uh materials are a lot more volatile, I'd say. >> It's probably safe to assume generally that it's like >> 3 to 5. >> else. The flip side is you're keeping your money longer, too. And you might be be a lower or higher bond interest at that time. So, there's a lot of I tend not to look too hard at that. I just delay things as long as I can stand it. >> I know we don't have Renee here, but Tom, maybe you could speak to like what is the long-term plan for that road and that area? >> If we look at the aerial photo of the adjacent land uses, you're kind of looking at it. >> Marsh. It's all marshy. >> It's going to It's going to be some uh large single-family lots and wetlands. >> Yeah. >> So, it may not be the adjacent properties, but it's going to be what develops on this side, this side, and up and down here to how much traffic is going to go on that road. >> Exactly. Yep. >> Yeah. My and this is very high-level, but if you look at further to the south, where you can develop as you're going down Chalan Ave, that's already developed. Those traffic patterns and where it may cuz there's break points. It's easier for me to go this way than this way to get to where I want to go. A lot of that is locked in. Everything that's developable to the north isn't going to be using this. If they're going to go to Xerxes, France, or straight on to two, depending on where they're at. So, we've had some discussions as part of this current comp planning process, what classification is that road really um in the long term. >> What I think about is that Xerxes is likely to continue to increase cuz it picks up Beard, it goes all the way down 86. So, you have growth in that area. So, the importance of this as an alternative connection for something, whether it's congestion or disruption on Xerxes, will become more important as Xerxes traffic grows. >> Mhm. Well, and I think that Xerxes traffic will start turning left onto Main Street to get up to Quick Trip and anything else that develops up there. I mean, that's where we cut through if we Oh, we forgot to turn down Chalan, we go >> Yep. Yep. Gives you a second bite at the apple. Yeah. >> Yep. >> Yeah, they do have that that challenge link. >> Mhm. >> But you got to remember, so. >> Mhm. >> And I guess what I was getting at is like is this designed long-term? >> Oh, yeah. >> Or is it something we'd have to consider as we continue to grow? >> I don't see I I mean there'd be a two-lane road. It might be a lower design speed. That doesn't mean it'll be used other than those curves. Um this will carry a lot of traffic as as I've laid it out here. >> Mhm. >> Yeah, and the physical constraints really don't provide you to do much beyond that anyways. So it that's kind of it for a very long time. >> And it's a good question because it's like is it like when we painted one of the roads or whatever then we had to rip it out. So it was is it is it worthwhile to do this and then we're going to have to rip it out and replace it with something else. But >> I don't think so. I just don't see much else happening to it other than as a link, a backup, a second choice, which becomes more important as things grow. But maybe it's not that urgent right now. If it was you'd have more hue and cry for paving it. >> What do you as council hear in the community related to it? I mean we have people that call us with questions or complaints. Are you hearing a high Are you hearing a demand for us to do something with it? >> First I've heard of anything to do with >> Yeah. >> Well, the last one that we responded to was actually a traffic control complaint at Xerxes. They didn't like those stop signs, couldn't figure out why they were there. So we we looked at that intersection. That was what, two, three years ago? >> I mean, I don't hear anything besides out-of-towners not understanding why we have that there. But everybody else doesn't seem to care. I don't know that anybody else understands they just given up. >> [laughter] >> So the What's ask? Is he asked uh do we want to consider doing something in it or do we want to wait? >> That's That's the first question is do you is since um this is really a preparatory discussion for the scope of what we might be talking about as part of our CIP cycle. You guys on the 23rd will be asked to approve the CIP through 2030, but we're also beginning the process cuz we're a little behind on that one for the next 5-year that would run 2027 through 2031. And so, the question is is this something that you see happening within that 5-year period that you want to have a more thorough discussion about or is it just a non-starter? Now that you have more information on it. >> I think it can cook. That's what I think. It can sit and cook. >> I I >> As in not adding it? >> Not adding it. Not messing with it. Leave it. Let it cook. >> don't think it needs to be added, but if everyone else wants it added, then I'll go along with you, but I just don't >> I see a long-term need, but not like a right now need or within the >> after 2027 that we're talking about. >> Yes, I want to know what else is in the in the box for the >> for 23? Or >> Well, for the 5-year. >> So, it's the stuff that you're already familiar with, some of it which we're doing 2027. So, right now uh within the 5-year. Do you want just property tax related or just in total? >> I mean, I don't need to know now. I mean, I don't know if like everybody is going to table [clears throat] it forever or I mean, I agree we're going to have to do it at some point in time, but in the next 5 years, probably not. >> Yeah, I mean, in the And the thing is like, oh, throw it on the table. We'll compare it to what else is there. You know, what's on the is laid out and see or we I mean we've done this level of work. This doesn't go away. If at some point it becomes an issue, it's not that hard for at that point probably Luke to adjust kind of go broop. >> And there's nothing on Challenger, France, or whatever or being street as it turns into any of it. Nothing in the near term in that time frame, either. >> I guess the other thing I would wonder is like I'm thinking back to Woodcrest and putting the road in there and then the neighbors were like, "What the hell are you doing? We don't want a another road up here." Like it might be I know there's not a lot of property owners around that, but they might have a strong opinion that I would like to consider. >> Yeah, they might. We we did not talk to them. Um one other thing I've heard from time to time is, "Oh, that's a that's a back door to the bars and if you pave it, it's going to make that worse or something [snorts] like that." I don't know if you have any thoughts on Is that a real thing or is it >> [laughter] >> Uh over the years I have found and so have my officers' vehicles in the ditch along Green Street there and along Zertsies, but once again, that was alcohol related, so if you pave that, yeah, maybe they go that way instead of the other way. I don't That stop sign probably has been a cause of issues for that and if you remove that, you know, or if you add a stop sign there, you know, that might actually cause more problems. >> Okay. That sounded indefinite, so >> [laughter] >> My biggest No offense, Luke, but you remove the stop sign on Zertsies, that's a long stretch where right now they know they have to stop and the fastest that people go on that road is from Winthrop to County 2. That's >> Just that people go on that road is from Windrows to coming to that's the longest stretch without a stop sign. >> Mhm. >> Just be prepared if you do do that change and you will stop signs. The speeds will go up. >> [laughter] >> You did get the part about stop signs are only for clarifying who has the right of way. >> We understand that but the general public does not understand that. >> What I'm getting at is if you have a speed issue, don't just throw a stop sign down. >> Yeah. >> What's the solution then? I'm I'm just curious. >> Things like traffic calming, things like the striping, narrowing your road, doing curb bump outs, um more >> More driveways. >> It's more >> And then enforcement is all we're left cuz we're engineering here. >> Yeah. And when you put up stop signs where they're not So, we're conditioned based on where stop signs are supposed to be. When they're not where you're expecting to be, you have a high degree of non-compliance. So, for example, this afternoon I ran home cuz I had a contractor at the house and I was going through the stop signs at the interchange. And there are not stop signs on the other side and I watched a large semi with a heavy load just roll right through them like they weren't there because you don't expect to have stop signs on one side when you didn't have them on the other. That's not exactly the same but it illustrates the the point. So, that's where you can get the non-compliance. The other issue with why you don't use them for speed cuz if I have a stop sign, I'm going to decelerate heavily and I'm going to accelerate heavily on the side as well. So, in locations, let's say residential neighborhoods where like, oh, we're going to control traffic by putting up stop signs everywhere. Then you start getting complaints about people non-compliance. But then you also have people heavy acceleration away from the stop signs and that creates a safety issue in and of itself. blunt, we have a very high level of compliance within the community on most local streets. Even though we get complaints about speed, we almost always find that people are traveling the vast majority of everybody is traveling in the speed limits. And there's always that person that's going There's always that small percentage that will exceed the speed limit. Um so we might see some speeds increase. Rich referenced the speed study we did on that. It was 30, and we did a speed study and they moved it up to 35. Um so also be careful, as a side note, doing speed studies cuz more often than not it increases the speed cuz you're doing it because people are driving fast, but then the speed study the speed that they issue results the way people are driving the road, which is faster. So I don't know if that answered the question, but um no, there are other ways you can control. And also targeted enforcement, speed trailers, those types of things. >> Andrew, just a reminder, you mentioned, you know, we're kind of stuck with what we have. We did lower reduce our standard street width for new subdivisions down to 28 ft partly for that reason, that we don't need that extra width. It just encourages speed. Let's tighten them up. And that seems to be a going pretty well. >> So highest level question, is this something that you think is something we should be discussing as part of the upcoming 5-year CIP? >> That sounds like it. >> No. >> Where are you at? >> No. >> Josh? >> so. >> No. >> Kate? >> Yes, I would. >> I guess I'd be fine leaving it on the table to discuss later, I guess, yeah. It doesn't hurt to have more information. >> You were a no, right, for >> I'm no, yes. >> All no? Unanimously no? >> Right. >> But you're aware of that. And if we get into the discussion and you're like, "Well, maybe we could roll it in here." We can always add it back in. >> there's a similar or a larger project that it makes sense, absolutely. Yeah, we can say marry it to something else. >> Now, just be aware that the financing mechanism because we cannot use 429 would need to be street reconstruction. Street reconstruction projects require that it you hold a hearing with the adoption of your street reconstruction plan and then there's a reverse referendum period. It's one of those types of authorizations. So, you just can't like, "Hey, we got the project. You know what, Luke, just add that on as an alternate." We would have had done We had that need to have a little more lead time on it and be planning for that. So. About a year in advance um You can hurry up and do it in a matter of months, but usually you want to be thinking out a ahead of time on that. >> I I do have one quick request and it can just somebody can just shoot it to me an email because I don't recall which other roads we put on the MSAS within town. >> We can send you the We just adopted that back in March, so we can send you the the the routes. >> Okay. >> The one thing to think about that when you're setting your MSAS for instance, if you were to decide to put Main Street on that in the event you do, the big thing is is picking a road that's going to have low volume and then you do a project with it and then you're locked in for 20 years. Remember that how much you're getting that a lot of times is dependent on the volume of on that roadway. So, picking a road to spend your money on and then having it be a 300 car a day roadway would not do you any favors. >> That might be a good topic for a future engineering report just so you understand why the selections are made. Uh there may be roads on there we don't intend to do anything with. We just want to max out that mile, that kind of stuff. >> Yeah. If you guys have We gave one here a few years ago when we first became MSA city and can dust that off and kind of give everybody a reminder on how that works. >> When was that? What was that? Was that like 4 years ago? 5 years ago? >> Three. >> Yeah. >> Municipal State Aid, it's only been a few years. >> It was pre me and I would appreciate it. >> [laughter] >> Yeah, it's certainly something we can bring back. >> I'm done. >> Okay. Well, the answer was no. >> I'm not hurt in the least. >> Thanks for the presentation. >> You're welcome. >> Uh, all right, next is community development. Was there anything >> Um, no. >> Uh, parks, is there anything? >> Well, did I guess maybe did you have any questions on the report related to the citywide sweep? >> No, I did not. >> Um, generally speaking, um, I think the historical results show that it has been effective cuz we had seen a decline and we believe that the bump up we're seeing is the fact that we did not do it last year. >> I didn't get any emails this year. >> So. >> So. >> Well, citations just went out. >> Oh. >> All right, spoke too soon. >> [laughter] >> It was a little while ago, so it's tonight. >> All right, I'll be watching the email. >> Um, but I have nothing else. >> Uh, was that for parks as well? Anything? >> Uh, nothing for parks. >> Saturday's big day, guys. Come on down, as they say. >> Come on down. >> It'll be fun, fun, fun. Officer Mees and his kids will be leading the parade in the squad, so >> That's excellent. >> Awesome. Scale. I could have bored. >> Do we know how many floats we have? >> Did she get back to you, uh, did Jody get back to you? Are we up to 40 votes now? She mentioned to it me in passing when she was in the office for something else. I think we're there's a we're in the mid-40s, I think. So usually we're right around really high 40s to mid-50s is pretty typical. >> The Elcan New Market baseball is unit 49 out of 57. Yeah. Back to you for >> Executive Committee I actually I was held up in the office and so I only caught remotely the second half of the meeting. And >> is tomorrow. >> Or exact, sorry. I was talking service delivery. Apologize. And exact tomorrow. So I'll be honest and then I had sound issue they had sound issues. So it I didn't get like 80% of the meeting so I don't have a report. >> And then executive tomorrow so anything for I-35? All right. Item number 10, discussion by council. Is there anything you guys want to talk about? If not I'll make a motion to adjourn. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> Aye. >> Aye. >> [clears throat]