Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Welcome to the Jordan School District Board of Education Study Session. Today is Tuesday, April 14th, 2026. And in attendance this evening are all members of the Board of Education, as well as our superintendent, associate superintendent, business administrator, and board attorney. We will go ahead and get started this evening with a motion to go into closed session. >> I move that we go into closed session so that we can act as an evaluation committee on a procurement solicitation, and also for character and competency of an individual. >> I'll second. >> We have a motion by Mr. Denford, a second by Ms. Wood, that we go into closed session acting as an evaluation committee to a procurement solicitation, and also for character and competency of individuals. Um we will take a roll call vote. Mr. Barnett. >> Yes. >> Mr. Denford. >> Yes. >> Ms. Barrow. >> Yes. >> Mr. Robinson. >> Yes. >> Ms. Wood. >> Yes. >> Ms. Dean. >> Yes. >> I am also a yes. So, that vote is unanimous and we are now going into closed session. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Okay, welcome back to the Jordan School District Board of Education meeting. Today is still Tuesday, um April 14th, 2026. We still have all members of the Board of Education, as well as our board attorney, our superintendent, associate superintendent, and business administrator um with us tonight. As well as many people who are visiting in person and online, and we will go ahead and continue our meeting this evening with a report on the results from a field house survey regarding um potentially building field houses at our high schools. Before we move into that presentation, because we have people here, I'll give you a little bit of history. Um the board decided several months ago to study the idea of of having field houses installed at all six of our high schools. So, I know there's been a little bit of confusion with like which high school, it's like The Hunger Games. It's really not like The Hunger Games. Um we we're looking at the possibility of a every high school receiving a field house. And the way that the board has discussed funding that would be through a bond, which would mean that we would be putting this question to the voters. So, not it's not even a board decision. The decision the board has to make is whether that's a question that is worthwhile to place on the voters' ballot. So, with that back history, we will um welcome Field uh Field House Lighthouse up to the microphone, who have been conducting the survey for us so far. >> Perfect. Thank you. Um my name is Christie with Lighthouse Research. I'm the Chief Insights Officer. Um I have Charlotte Davis here with me. She's our CEO. Um and I we will kind of tag team this together, but um when when we conducted the survey, we um conducted we were contracted to do 900 surveys. And what we contracted to do was survey residents of Jordan School District. Uh we actually got 906 uh mixed mode surveys is what we call them. Um mixed mode meaning that we um took a two-pronged approach to data collection. Uh we contacted individuals uh by email and invited them to do an online survey. And then we also have a call center where we reached out and telephoned individuals in the district to ask them to take a survey over the phone. Um with this mixed mode approach, that gives us the best um opportunity to reach as many residents in the district as possible. We conducted da- uh data collection between January 31st and March 11th of this year. And uh our results um with this 906 mixed mode surveys provides a 95% confidence level with a plus or minus 3.25% margin of error. Um, 5% is our industry standard and we're well below that. Um, we ensured that all respondents were adults living within the district boundaries and that they are likely to vote in the November 2026 election. We asked two questions. Number one, if they are registered to vote and if they are not, if they are likely to register and vote in the upcoming election. We had an even split of male and female respondents. 50% were male, 50% were female. Um, when we look at home ownership, we see that 87% of our respondents were homeowners and 11% were renters. As you can see on the right, we have a breakout of residents, um, respondents that live in each of these areas. Um, it's important to note you're going to see a vast difference in responding. For example, uh, West Jordan and South Jordan are higher, uh, percentages than what you would see in, for example, Copperton. Um, this is based on population. So, this is reflective of the population and so, uh, that's the that's the reason for that. That was purposeful. So, we don't get too much over sampling in any one area. Um, as you can see with the ages, we also got a, um, distribution of different ages and that also was meant to be reflective of the population. It this is not I apologize. It is not Thank you, Charlotte. >> Real fast, um, the trouble with with representing just the population is that especially in, uh, off-cycle election, the youngest population is never represented appropriately in those who actually vote. And so, we did a study and balanced between representative of the population and the population who actually votes. So, it's a it's a combination of the two that we went to match for on this because we didn't want to If we did a cross section of the actual population, it wouldn't very closely match who's going to vote come this fall. And so, we did it we did a hybrid approach on the age. >> Thank you, Charlotte. So, not representative of the area, but of voters. Um we asked respondents to identify um what their annual household income is and also because the bond would impact them this way what the estimated value of their home is. Um as you can see with the household income, we have respondents most frequently said that they have incomes between 100 and 150,000 dollars. Um followed by 200,000 dollars or more and 150 to 200,000. Um when we look at the estimated home value of respondents, we see the most frequently respondents said that they have homes valued between 600 and 700,000 dollars and 500 and 600,000 dollars. Um when we asked respondents if they have children living under the age of 18 in their home, 47% of respondents said yes. Of those, we have 81% of those said that they have children that attend school in Jordan School District schools. Um to give you an idea of how that breaks out, uh we asked them um where their children attend school. So, we have 65% of respondents that said that they have elementary school children in the district. 46% said that they have middle school children in the district and 41% said that they have high school students in the district. Um we asked those respondents, are your children involved in athletics or extracurricular activities? And we found that 73% of respondents said that they are their students are involved in athletics or extracurriculars. We then asked respondents to identify what those athletics and extracurriculars are. We see that most frequently 60% of respondents said that their children are involved in court and field sports. And we defined court and field sports as anything that is on a court or anything that is on a field. So, this includes baseball, basketball, cross country, football, golf, rugby, soccer, softball, tennis, track and field, volleyball, wrestling. Um that includes quite a bit of sports. Um 23% said that they're involved in dance. 14% in cheer or gymnastics or tumbling, and 13% said that their children are involved in theater or drama. And those were most frequently mentioned by respondents. We asked respondents, before we got into their opinions about the bond, we asked about the need, if they feel that there is a need for more space. We asked, in your opinion, does Jordan School District currently have adequate space and facilities for accommodating student athletics and extracurricular activities? Most frequently respondents said probably. We see that 42% of respondents said probably. 19% said definitely. And then we had about 20% that disagreed. 13 said probably not and 7% said definitely not. The thing that's interesting here is that we have almost 1/5 of respondents, 18%, that said they don't know. They just don't have enough information to know if the district has adequate space and facilities. Um then based on what they said before, so the question just as a reminder was do they does the district have adequate space and facilities for accommodating student athletics and extracurriculars? Um we those that said definitely or probably not, we asked why do you think it definitely or doesn't probably does not have adequate space or facilities? And those that said probably or definitely, we asked why that is. So, the follow-up question, why do you say that the district does have adequate space and facilities for athletics and extracurricular activities? We see that most frequently, more than 1/3 of respondents each said that um it seems sufficient, and there seems to be adequate space and facilities. And others said they know from experience or observation. Um this was an open-ended question, and so what that means is we took all of the open-ended comments and we categorized them into these categories on the left um and provide them in the detailed results uh the result the written report of results. Some of these quotes we decided to put in here to give you an idea of what people are saying exactly to fit into these categories. Uh one respondent said, "All of the schools I've seen have space." Another said, "The junior high and high schools have enough room outside to accommodate any outside activity." "Inside the schools, the gym provides enough adequate space for any athletic event they need." One respondent said, "All of my children played sports, and I have many friends whose children play sports. I have heard no complaints about not enough places to play sports." And one other respondent said, "The places I've been to, it's been big enough. It doesn't have to divide, and there's a lot of space." Now, on the contra- in contrast, we also asked those respondents said that that said the district doesn't have enough space or facilities why the dist- why they say that. Um most frequently, more than 1/4 of respondents said that there is a lack of space. Um next, respondents said, "There's no pools." Um and then followed by that, there's shared spaces and competing for space. Um some of these quotes um are as follows. "The spaces I've seen are small." "I see what other districts have. I know the athletic spaces and the performing arts spaces are small compared to the other districts in the state. And one more respondent said, "As sports and activities are consistently added as both club and UHSAA sanctioned sports, it significantly decreases space availability for all activities. School footprints and fields do not increase proportionally to student opportunity." Now, during this point during this portion of the survey, we introduced what the bond would potentially mean for respondents. And this is the introduction that we provided respondents. To meet the growing demand for athletic and extracurricular space, the Jordan School District is considering a bond initiative to fund the construction of new field houses at each of its six high schools. This proposal would help by reducing expenses for school groups who currently rely on external venues for practices and training. The bond proposal would be for approximately $120 million or $20 million for each school. The field houses would be approximately 35,000 square feet, similar to those found in other districts along the Wasatch Front. If this bond passes for the average household with a home valued at $615,000, it would result in a tax increase of approximately $98 per year or $8.16 a month paid over the course of 16 years. After respondents had that information about the bond, we then asked, "Based on this information, would you support or oppose this bond initiative?" We see that most frequently, more than 1/3 of respondents said that they would probably support the bond initiative, and 18% said that they would definitely support it. Um when we add these two bottom box scores and these two top box scores, we see that about 40% said that they they would oppose the bond initiative, and we see that 53% would support the bond initiative. 7% simply don't know or were undecided on how they would vote. Uh again, we asked the follow-up questions, the open-ended questions, why would you support the bond initiative and why would you oppose the bond initiative? Uh we Respondents who said that they would support the bond most frequently said that athletics and extracurriculars are important. We see that 20% of respondents said that. Um 11% of respondents each said that they would support it for student opportunities and participation. 11% said they would um that they feel that athletics and extracurriculars help benefit or shape students. And another 11% said to support the students in general. Um to give you an idea of what some of these respondents actually said, one respondent said, "Extracurriculars are super important for kids, and if we make it more convenient for the kids, that's what we should do." Another said to support athletics for the youth to help other problems they face. Another said, "Even though I have no children, I believe all kids should have the opportunity for growth." And one more respondent said to give all kids the ability to be competitive across the board in all sports, not based on best facility. And again, this is just a small snippet of what you'll see in the actual open-ended responses. Uh on the other hand, we did ask those who would oppose the bond, uh why would you oppose the bond? And we see that most frequently, 40%, 39%, so 2/5 of the respondents said that they simply don't want the increased tax burden. Uh 20% said that they don't feel that there's a need. 20% commented on the district management of funds and felt that the district should make do with what they have. And 18% said that the funds should or the focus should go elsewhere. Um when looking at what respondents actually said, one respondent said, "Taxes are already high. Our officials need to be better at allocating the funds. Another said it seems like we have many taxes already being levied on us for all kinds of needs. These taxes never seem to expire. My taxes go up every year. When will it stop? One respondent said I just don't see the need to put in that any new facilities. And another respondent said they already have the facilities that they play and practice on and I don't think they need separate practice and playing fields. With all the tax increases, I don't need another $100 increase. We We wanted to inform respondents of some of the potential benefits of field houses at each of the schools. Um but we wanted to know of these potential benefits, what would be most important to them? Which of these benefits are most important to them? So we asked respondents to rate on a 1 to 7 scale, where one is not at all important and seven is very important, how important each of the of field houses on district high school campuses would be to them personally. Um I I feel just because we're we're going to look at some segment analysis later in the presentation, I want to go through each of these and uh show you where exactly they fall with these potential benefits. Um the highest rated on average was uh the benefit this first benefit, "Ensures all students, including those with disabilities, have equal access to safe facilities." That was rated highest in terms of importance to respondents. Next highest was this one that says, "Provides year-round space for athletics, performing arts, clubs, special education, and other programs." Uh 4.96 was the average they gave to this one, uh "Supports student focus, behavior, and academic success through expanded PE and other programs." Uh they gave a rating of 4.89 to "Creates a community space for events, fitness, and activities for all ages. Uh respondents gave an average of 4.71 to the benefit of it reduces scheduling conflicts and late night practices by easing gym and outdoor field congestion. Uh respondents gave an average mean rating of 4.56 to generates revenue for student groups by hosting tournaments, camps, clinics, and rentals to outside organizations. Respondents gave a rating of 4.42 to attract strong coaches and helps keep students in the district. And they gave the lowest average mean rating in terms of importance to reduces wear and tear on existing gyms and fields lowering long-term maintenance costs. Um I will say this average, even though this is the lowest, is still right in the middle. It's not um unimportant, I should say, on average. Once we um asked them to rate each of those potential benefits of a field house, we asked respondents, after giving those ratings, are you more supportive, less supportive, or about as supportive of the bond as you were before? And we see that almost uh 2/3 of respondents said that they're about as supportive, that their opinion really didn't change after looking at those potential benefits. However, we see that 20% of respondents said that they are more supportive of the bond after hearing each of those potential benefits, and 14% said that they're less supportive of the bond after hearing each of those potential benefits. Um again, we have 2% that just don't know. They're not sure. Um we don't know why that is, but in our experience, what we've seen is those that say don't know is they usually just need more information in order to make a decision. Um as a concluding question, we asked respondents, how would you like the district to communicate with residents about this potential bond? Um most frequently respondents said that they would prefer the district communicate with them through email and mail. Uh 42% of respondents said that they want email communication and 28% said that they would want mailed communication. Okay, I mentioned that we are going to look at some differences in responding based on um segmentation. So, uh Charlotte, do you want to explain a little bit what we do with our segment analysis and what this means? >> Uh for the segment analysis, it's a we take all the data and we start slicing it and dicing it according to different demographic or other characteristics. Uh in this case, we're specifically looking at things such as gender, age, um their home ownership status, those sorts of things. We then run statistical tests among the groups and identify any differences. Statistical significant difference is defined as a difference in value that is too large to be attributed to chance alone. So, the statistical tests prove that there is a relationship in in these. So, um Christie will go through all of them, but for example, men are more likely to feel this way or women are more likely to feel that way and the statistical tests prove that it's not just by chance. Is that good? >> Yeah, that's great. Thank you. Thank you, Charlotte. Um going back to that question, we asked respondents um after they learned more about what the bond would entail, we asked them, if you recall, um would you be likely to support or oppose this bond? And we found that uh women were more likely to support the bond, younger respondents, especially those under 40, were more likely to support the bond. Uh those that have children, especially those that have children that go to school in the district, are more likely to support the bond. Renters are more likely to support the bond and those that are employed part-time. Uh however, we found that men are more likely to oppose the bond as are older respondents and respondents with no children as well as homeowners and retired respondents. Um when we that that long list of benefits potential benefits that I just read to you, um we found that women, those that are younger, those that have students in the district, and those that are renters, uh were more more likely to rate those as higher in terms of importance. Um whereas uh those that were more likely to rate those benefits as lower in terms of importance were those that were older and retired. Um that question where we asked um where we asked after seeing all of those potential benefits, we said, "Did your opinion change uh your support change at all?" We found that women and parents were more likely to be more supportive of the bond after hearing those potential benefits. Um whereas those who are older, those who do not have children, uh those who are retired, and homeowners were less likely or more likely to say that they oppose the bond after hearing all of those potential benefits of the build houses of the schools. Um and that is just a summary of what we found in our segment analysis. So, Yes, did you have another question? >> No, I just want to I want to be a little more clear on these. When we're looking at likely to support or oppose here, and we're looking at men versus women, it doesn't mean that men oppose the bond as a whole. It means that uh like I'm all of this is all the details are found in the in the full report, but for example, when it came to the response of definitely oppose, men were 28%, women were 15%, and that was proven to be statistically different. So, that's where we draw that conclusion from. Um also though, 30% of men said probably support, which is more than the 28%. It's really about the comparison between the two. So, if you were going to try to promote a bond, for example, you could target men specifically to help overcome some of their barriers to move them to the side of support. Does that make sense? >> Thank you, Charlotte, for that clarification. And again, um this is just a very high-level uh presentation. All of these details can be found in the full report. Um do we have any questions? >> We'll get the full report, won't we? >> I I have sent it to you, Dr. Anderson. He has it, and I believe he will share it with you accordingly. >> I was curious, uh as we were talking about uh why do you say the district does have or doesn't have adequate space? Do we know how many of those were maybe elementary school parents versus high school parents? >> Yeah, that's a great question. We did not run that analysis. That is an analysis we can run. Did you? Okay. Charlotte Charlotte will dig in a little bit more and see if we have that. >> I can I can look at that. Uh it'll take me a few minutes. >> And let me just add elementary, middle school, high school differentiators, yeah. >> Thank you. >> That's fine. >> And that would be a very large table. But yes, we we definitely can look at that um analysis and send it forward. Any other questions? >> I have one more question. On the field house bond potential benefits, was that all respondents or just a segment of respondents? >> This was all respondents that were asked this, whether they opposed it or supported it. Mhm. >> So, it seems to me that the survey said district high school campuses, but I don't know if it's as clear to understand that every school would get a field house. Is was that clear in the survey because it's certainly not clear with >> We did say it's considering a bond initiative to fund the construction of new field houses at each of its six high schools. >> That thanks, I missed that. Thank you. >> Any other questions? >> I just have a procedural question. >> Yes. >> So, um in terms of next steps, if the board wanted to take this one step further and do in-person surveys, what would that look like? >> Um I just because Um full transparency with the we could do in-person surveys. We actually would recommend doing focus groups. Um just because you could get a broader spectrum of individuals that whereas you're limited on you're already limited with qualitative data with how many individuals you can contact and um doing the interviews just kind of dissects your sample size even more. Uh we would recommend doing focus groups that follow up on some of these. In fact, we say that the best research um while it may seem contradictory actually does pose more questions that that brings up more questions to ask and to dig into. Uh the benefit of the quantitative research is that it gives you statistically valid data, whereas the qualitative research um gives us the opportunity to dig into the why behind these answers. Why is it that people feel the way that they do? Why is it that they would um say some of these comments? So, that that would be our next recommendation. >> Thank you. And what would the timeline be if we were tonight say, yes, we'd like to hold some focus groups? >> Um Charlotte, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm thinking we could move as quickly as next month. Yeah. >> Thanks, that's helpful. We appreciate all of your work. >> Of course. >> This is great information. >> Of course, happy to help. >> Can I ask one more on that focus groups? Um what advantage does that give us that this material does not? >> Again, the qualitative research gives us the more of the story behind the statistically significant valid data. And so this is, like I mentioned before, the plus or minus 3.25% margin of error. Um that's the accuracy of this survey. Um that that points to the accuracy, whereas the qualitative allows us to better understand the feelings and behaviors and attributes um that participants ascribe to their thoughts. Does that >> The information that we're receiving from that would be the information we want to promote the bond, right? Because that's where the misconceptions are going to be coming. >> Correct. So our objectives, because we haven't contracted yet to do focus groups, we would define those objectives with you and work closely with you to discover what we want to learn from the focus groups. Once we discover what those objectives are, we fine-tune them into a discussion guide um to use in the focus groups, making sure that all of what those objectives are met. So your next step would be if you determine to do qualitative research is to determine what exactly you want to learn from the qualitative research. >> In the Oh, go ahead. I'm sorry, I forgot. >> Um on the athletics and extracurricular activities, was this information um obtained from an open-ended question? And also, was there any um specification about whether or not these were um at school or other places. >> That's a great question. Um, is this the is this the question you're referring to in which athletics or extracurricular activities your children are involved? >> Yes. >> Okay, this is not specific to schools. Um, for example, we have, as you can see, piano. Like some people take piano lessons. Some of their children take piano lessons. And so, this is just athletics or extracurriculars that their children are involved in, period. We can run an analysis of just respondents with students in the district and see where this plays out. My assumption is it would be closely mimic these results in terms of hierarchy of what's, uh, highest and lowest. Um, and I apologize, what was your other Oh, if this was open-ended. Um, it is, in a sense, open-ended. We call it an unaided question. Um, the only difference between unaided and open-ended is that, uh, because they're short responses, we just code those on the back end, whereas we don't provide you with the full list of what everybody says. So, yes, it it was essentially an open-ended question. >> Thank you. >> Yes, let me explain, um, why it doesn't add up to 100%. We actually code all of these respondents for responses for multiple mentions. So, for example, if you have three kids, you might have one involved in piano, one involved in martial arts, and one involved in court and field sports. Um, that is why it doesn't add up to 100% is because, um, for that reason. We distribute it based on multiple mentions and not just one singular mention. >> And could they have mentioned several activities their children do? >> Absolutely. So, one child, say they have one child, 15 different activities, they all would have been coded. Yes. >> To Mr. Robinson's earlier Dr. Robinson's earlier, uh, question, I think it is important to point out that you would outline the objectives and and Lighthouse would create questions around those objectives. But it is In the past, when we've done this, it has the focus groups have have helped us shape the message and understand how best to deliver it. And that doesn't mean that you're advocating for it necessarily. It's just where is the confusion? Where are the misunderstandings? So that we can make a clarification about what exactly the board is proposing and what what what misunderstandings we need to overcome and what method of communication is most effective to convey those ideas. So it isn't strictly about how to advocate or how to you know it it's just what what do people misunderstand and what do we want to clarify so that they really know what they're voting on. >> One of the benefits that to the focus groups also um Dr. Godfrey, if you correct me if I'm wrong, in the past what we've done is um we found that a lot of individuals and you can see that reflected in the survey. Um people are saying probably or probably not rather than making a definitive response um or I don't know because they just need more information and one of the benefits of the focus groups is that we can determine what more information they need. What is it that they need to know in order to be able to confidently make a decision on supporting or opposing the bond. >> Go ahead. >> Um I was curious if focus groups were held. Do you pull from the already pulled people, the respondents, or is it a fresh batch? >> We we can do either. We have the capability of doing either. Um I personally I am as chief insights officer I am the one that moderates those focus groups and I personally prefer a fresh batch of individuals. Um but but we can we can do whichever you feel. So or we can powwow internally and see which way we feel are best. Or we could do a mix, yeah. >> The other benefit of of a focus group is that um like I said you un- understand an- you put something out there like this, there's a worry that people misunderstand what the message is, and it just helps you make sure that clear that up. Um also, the snacks behind the scenes are exceptional and really do help with understanding what people are saying on the other side of the glass. >> Absolutely, snacks are >> I'm coming. >> Okay. >> The slide that shows those who would oppose or support I'm assuming those percentages do not include the the offsets by those who may may have changed their minds due to additional information about the benefits. >> Um I'm sorry, can you rephrase your question? I'm not sure I follow. >> So, there's it it looks like it says, "After giving those ratings, are you more supportive, less supportive, or as about the same?" >> Yes. Um >> It looks like there's 6% maybe that are more supportive now than they were. 6% are more supportive, 14% 20% or more, 14% or less. Does that change the the overall who are in support? >> I think as I was sitting back here, I thought, "We need to split this and so you can see those who are supportive and where they moved versus those who were not and where they moved." So, I've already written it down and I'll get that to you cuz this is the general everyone. So, the more supportive could very well be already supportive. Um but let me let me split that for you so you can see how people moved. >> Okay, that would be helpful. >> versus where they where they just were in general. >> After the after the entire survey, how many are supportive and how many aren't? Yeah. >> Yeah. Let me get those numbers over to you uh by the end of the week. Thanks. Uh just to clarify, that would be more of a segment analysis. I don't know that we can uh definitively say based on this question that they're more supportive because they may have been um like they may have moved from somewhat to vary and so they could have still been or they could have been like somewhat unsupportive to somewhat supportive. So, we're not exactly sure what bucket they would fall into, but we can run that analysis as Charlotte mentioned and show where the swing happened. >> Would you mind describing just the size of the focus group and what that format looks like, please? >> Sure. Our focus group is anywhere from 8 to 12 people. I feel like 8 to 10 is the sweet spot. And then we we never recommend doing just one focus group because you never have anything to compare it to. You never know who's going to be in the group and it could be an anomaly, an outlier. And I would hate for anybody to make any decisions based on one focus group. So, we always do at least two, preferably three, to compare the data from one focus group to another to just get an entire comprehensive big picture. So, what we would do is we we would invite around 10-ish individuals to come to a focus group. We would hold those on one night, most likely at our Riverton office, which is down the road in Riverton. We have a pretty good show rate, so most of those 10 will, if not all, will likely show. And then we also invite individuals to come and view the focus groups behind the glass. We can also close-circuit video the focus groups, so anybody who's not able to be in attendance can see that and watch the focus groups from a different location. We also record our focus groups and have video available the following day for anybody that was not able to attend. Once we draft our objectives, we have a discussion guide. We go through that discussion guide in the focus groups with our our participants. And then what we do is we take that data and we analyze it and then present have a report and a presentation Um or a presentation about the findings for the focus group research similar to what we've done here. Did that answer your question? Perfect. Anything else? >> Like everybody got what they need for Lighthouse? Okay, thank you so much for being here. We appreciate the information. >> Of course. >> And and I think board members now we have the question of we have a few options. We could end the discussion now. We could continue to research or we could make a decision. Um, so I will turn it to you for discussion on those options. >> I move that we move forward with focus groups. >> I'll second it, but I want to discussion. >> So we have a motion for Mr. Damphord that we continue on the process of research with focus groups and a second from Dr. Robinson. Okay, discussion on that motion. >> For me, I think before I would want to move forward with focus groups, I would like the more detailed information we're waiting on that some of us had requested from Lighthouse. And then I feel like I would be better able to decide whether or not I would be in favor of focus groups. >> I think that there's a lot of questions still left to be answered. Um for instance, um this proposal requests one at every school. We talked in the past that maybe we wanted to do a couple in the district. We also talked about uh perhaps trying to find a private donor that would pay some can we pay some Um you know this this one's if there's a hundred dollars more year per taxpayer but could we refinance our debt and could it be a bond that wouldn't cost taxpayers more money I'd want to know some of those information some of that information before we go forward if that makes sense so I just would like to have us nailing down some of the details of what this bond would exactly look like cuz it's a different question to say are you willing to pay another hundred dollars a year for sixteen years versus we could refinance our debt and you'd be paying the existing amount and that would be a different question. And I don't know if it's too early to ask those questions before we go into a focus group but I think you'd get a different response. >> So you're wanting to answer those questions so that in the focus groups we can get a better sense of option A B C. >> Correct. >> I'm wondering if we can answer any of those questions now is there an appetite on the board for putting only some high schools receiving a filled house and not others. >> That's not one of the answers I I would have a location for instance there's some coals is an empty building in the Riverton area would it be beneficial to purchase that or off site location I would not put it at one school not put it at all six they would to me that would be something. >> that's an important consideration before we ask for donors because it is probable that if we got one that doesn't mean we got six and so something to think about um so going off site does does that still meet the needs? I know one of the questions on the survey, it probably wouldn't still meet that question of having it accessible to all students and um but that was only one question. >> Well, let me just say why I think we get one shot at this. I do not have an appetite to do what some districts do and put this on a bond and it fails and then we go around and do a lease revenue bond and raise taxes. I don't have any appetite for that. So, we either do this right or or we accept the results. >> Yeah, I think that's good. >> I was hoping out of this first round to determine whether or not there was an appetite from the taxpayers to fund it. And it looks like based on this information it's close. You know, it's maybe half and half, maybe slightly more in favor. That's primarily what I was looking for to make a decision. I I personally don't need uh focus groups. I'm sure there's some beneficial information that we could garner, but I'm I'm ready to move ahead as a district doing whatever we need to do to to get this on the ballot. >> And let me clarify the motion. The focus groups are to define what's the misunderstanding in the public so that in our selling of the bond, we know how to sell it. I'm not asking for is there any interest. What I want to know in the focus groups is what do you misunderstand? What misperceptions do you have? And would would those misperceptions cause a failure in the bond where clarification would have changed the vote. That's why I want a focus group is to say, what is it that the public doesn't understand so that we can educate them? I very much what I read in this survey is the public would like the right to decide. I I what I read is, please take this off the board's decision and give it to us. Give it to the public. So, I want to know how to give it to the public and sell it and let them know what they need to know to vote one way or the other. >> One of my concerns is that this has been on our minds for a while now. A year? I don't know, maybe not quite that long, but um Lighthouse can get to it in May. It might take I'm I'm I'm a little bit concerned about the timeline that we're pushing it out even more. >> What is what is the time frame for getting this on a ballot? >> That's gone this year's ballot. >> Mr. Larson, can you speak to that maybe using past experience? >> I'll look it up, but my recollection is July. But let me look. >> So, July is when you would start a campaign for a bond. >> No, July my recollection is that it was when you had to file with Lieutenant Governor's office that you wanted an election held for a purpose. >> I see. Thank you. >> But we have if if we want this initiative on the 2026 ballot, we have until July to do that. Is that does that fit within your time frame? Could we have information back to you from focus groups before July? >> We could. I I mentioned May, that's the soonest we we could do it, but we could extend it to give you more time to build our objectives and work around that. We could have results back by July, yes. That is doable. >> You think you want it before that though? >> We could have them before July for you, yes, so that you have it ready to present. >> It So, I'm just thinking of logistics, too, because do we have a a board meeting in July that we would be able to put this on an agenda? And have time for it to be presented and then have it on an agenda? >> If your if the focus group and the I'm saying if if the focus group is not to determine whether to put it on the ballot, but how to communicate it, you could decide before getting the focus group results to put it on the ballot and use the focus group results to make sure that the campaign is effective because actually the national trend is toward a shorter campaign as opposed to a longer campaign. So, somebody mentioned a timeline on campaign. If you had information back by July, that would give you time for a fall campaign that meets the timeline that is expected. But if communications knew in May uh or sooner that you were going to put it on the ballot, then they could start to research other similar ballot initiatives and how they were promoted and then we could use this information. So, in other words, you could decide that you wanted it on the ballot and then decide how to communicate it after that point. >> Do we have any historical information about previous surveys and our success at passing a bond? Meaning, have we learned that any survey results under 60% of support, the bond usually doesn't pass. Does that question make sense? >> I I think it would be difficult. This is a little nerve-wracking in front of these two to talk in these terms, but I think it would be difficult to make a comparison between this bond result and other bond results because this is such a unique ask. Um where it's asking for athletic facilities versus a school uh versus in the past we had schools mixed in with a lot of other projects. So, I think it would be hard to make a comparison, but we could we could look for that. Um >> I am interested in those that we succeeded on or didn't just from an initial survey point of view, even if our campaigning might be more effective if we've learned over time. Because in my mind, if somebody said probably, they could easily swing to now that I've thought about it not so much. I I would love to see if we have anything historical to give me context. >> think we have much that would be helpful because we only did a lighthouse survey before our previous bond and regarding cell phones. And that previous bond was within a context that doesn't exist anymore asking for buildings that are very different from what we'd be asking. >> Okay. >> So, we could provide that. I don't think it would be useful. >> So, just to maybe build a bit of a pros and cons list. >> Can I ask one more question about um I'm curious, too, about the possibility of another bond, how long there needs to be between um a possible failed bond and another bond attempt or Does that make sense? So, and or a successful bond and another bond attempt? Is there a way to ask find out that also >> I think >> in case there was a future need for a bond. >> I don't know if there's a hard and fast rule, like have to give this much time. But, I would say that looking at our future building needs, this is a unique scenario because any other time we've bonded, we have had urgent housing needs. And in this case, we're looking for something optional. It would be nice and beneficial, but it's not as urgent. And so, it's hard to put data behind something because it's such a different scenario. And I'd also just love to revisit the political climate right now, which is that it seems that the state legislature has sent forth the message that they're concerned about property taxes. As I've listened to several of my own representatives talk about their summary report and the issues that they're hoping to tackle going into next year, across the board, I have heard property taxes mentioned. So, that gives us two tactics, right? One is fuel the fire, ask the taxpayers for more money, and then potentially lose the ability to ask because legislators feel like we're being a little bit um loose with the way that we're using the ability to tax. Or hurry and do it before you lose that ability. So, it's I guess it's just two schools of thought, but I want us to have that at the forefront of our mind in the process of this discussion. >> But But would they take this one away? They wouldn't take the GEO bond away. They'd take the lease revenue bond away, but I don't >> don't think they could In terms of things like ability to ask for a referendum or ability to limit the amount that you can ask for on a GEO bond, those are things that I've heard tossed around already. >> But this wouldn't be subject to referendum cuz it's a public vote, right? And so, and >> Right. I was just listing ways that the legislature could limit our ability to tax. >> I mean, I think you bring up a really good point, but I do think that they're going to target if we did it underhanded like some districts have done where they build it and then raise your taxes without your input. >> Yeah, I'm the we all who are um are educators at heart and who understand the benefits of athletics to academics, we understand this. But the surface level, I think it's it's a a weird ask to say, "Hey, this education institution wants to ask for an increase in taxes for something that might not be easy to see a link to education." Um and I understand that's flat, so nobody throw tomatoes. But I do think that we need to think about how it will come off to our constituents. >> And educate them. It's a communication thing. >> Right. And And so, that leads to another question. How much effort would you want to put into educating on this vote? Because I really would like it to be a hey, some community members have suggested that this is a need, you tell us. We'll know by your vote if it is a need or not. Um I would I don't know how interested I am in spending a lot of money if we do decide to go to bond. But that's just a question I have. I'm not saying we shouldn't, just I'm not sure I'm ready to. >> I'm not trying to sell it. I'm just trying to educate the public. If you want field houses, vote yes. If you don't, vote no, and then we'll know. Matter settled. >> I see that. Can I ask just a little bit of follow-up on your comment about legislators? Is the concern that if the majority of voters say yes, we're willing to pay for this bond, that legislators may be punitive towards a school district who even asked and was successful? >> Yes. I do believe that that could be the case, but they can't direct that to just one district. So, our actions will roll out and affect the entire state of education. >> Even if the voters supported it. I mean, I could see if it was if the board voted, but if the people voted. >> Yeah, and >> The people voted for Salt Lake School District to spend $300 million on two high schools. That's $600 million, and and the fact they passed 750, if I'm not mistaken, and they have targeted Salt Lake School District because of that. They want to limit on what they can build and stuff, but again, I think it's letting our our bread our our legislators know and we need the help from the public. It's their voice and they have a right to vote on this. I'm super excited about these results. They're much better than I thought they would be. Um I think that we need to do this is a great opportunity to really advertise what we've done. You know, that we have two high schools we've rebuilt. We didn't tear them down and build brand new spacious buildings, but we we saved the money and used it you know, extended it really well. We're not building any new schools for a while. There's this little window that we could have what other people have already taken and we're going to ask an opportunity to go to um Corner Canyon's facility and Aaron went with me and we had some school principals and they have a huge advantage in the educational process of their school because they have facilities. And if we're going to offer all these programs, we've got to offer facilities. I see kids practicing on our fields at 10:00 at night because it's the only time they can practice and they're on school at like 6:00 in the morning because it's the only time they can get a field. And so with these kind of results, we need to move forward. I do think the focus group will help us understand the misunderstandings, but um I'm ready to vote. I don't know I don't cut anyone else up, but I want to move forward. >> It's interesting cuz I had hoped for a more clear outcome. Um I think there is no question in my mind that getting field houses at each high school would solve a lot of problems. What gives me pause is that the results were not abundantly strong to what I was hoping for. Um I love that Jordan has a reputation for leading. I'm not as confident in leading in this way when most high schools in our state do not have field houses that this would be the first priority. Now, having said that, I'm willing to go with what our constituents really want. Um It's I just don't feel quite as confident as Dr. Robinson. >> And and I heard the exact opposite cuz when you say to people, "We want an extra $100 a year." and you don't get a resounding no, that's significant. We asked them, "Would you be willing to pay $100 on average more?" and we got "Probably." That's astounding to me. Because when you say, "We want more money." the expectation is a resounding no. And we didn't get a resounding no. That's what I heard. Is it was very, very clear, "Ooh, yeah, I'd be willing to do that." instead of absolutely not. >> Our past bonds didn't start out this positively. >> Okay. >> I think they've earned the right to choose for themselves, to take this off the board's decision and let the public choose for themselves. Our job is to educate. Here's what you're voting on. Let's be very clear. Here's what the options are, but this is your choice, no longer ours. >> That's our Our decision is, should we give the people a voice? That's our decision. >> I'll add a little to that decision and and I know we preface preface before, well, what if we put some skin in the game? >> Yeah. >> Let's not forget that we are putting a lot of skin in the game. Because once these field houses are built, they need to be maintained. They need to be cleaned. All of that falls to the budget of the board and the taxpayers. So we are making a decision that has impact. We are going to use funds that could be allocated differently if we choose to do this. >> I wonder also if the resounding yes or the probably is a result of the taxpayer knows or has high confidence in where this hundred bucks is going to go. They know exactly what they're buying with their hundred dollars or their sixteen hundred dollars over sixteen years. And and and maybe in some other bonds not just in Jordan but but elsewhere it's like where is this money going? What is it going to be going? You know, it's like >> It's equally distributed. Yeah, every school gets one. Every high school in this district would get one. That was the success of last bond was we were very precise. These are the schools we're building, there's where it is. Every community kind of got something except for one part of the district and they got the next school. So I mean the equality but this also gives us really good opportunity to advertise what we've been doing and how good our budget is. I think we do lead the way in using our money wisely. >> I can't remember if we had discussed what the ongoing cost would be. Had we mentioned that before? Was that included in things? It was about 1.2 million dollars a year. A year for six to maintain. >> That I mean the first presentation it was about 1.2 million dollars a year ongoing. >> Thank you, I couldn't remember. >> And that was not part of the survey. So, I wonder if an ongoing cost had have been included in the survey, would have made a difference to the support. I'm just still very I'm just lacking confidence. >> Understand that. >> that this will succeed. >> Understand that one point >> Whoa, whoa, whoa. What what does succeed mean? If it fails, that's their choice. We're not We're not saying, "Oh, it has to pass or we're in trouble." What we're saying is you get to choose. And if you choose no, >> my money, resources, reputation that that we're putting on the back. >> Yeah, even if it fails, we educated them and then they chose no. If it passes, we educated them and they chose yes. It's worth educating so they know what they're choosing. >> But but sir >> would hesitate saying what is a success here. >> Well, I'm still comfortable with the word I used because I think you can't help but but create here is Jordan asking us for money again. Oh, and are they asking for it again? And again, I don't want that reputation. So, I think I would like to be careful. I I Yeah. >> But let me ask, is your careful meaning we're not going to ask or we're going to tell you why we're asking? >> We're still deciding. >> Where's the carefulness there? >> I'm still deciding. >> And I I agree with Suzanne about being careful. When we first started talking about the possibility of um a bond for field houses, one of the assignments that board members received was to reach out to our local elected representatives for their thoughts on um on this idea. And um I only got responses back from two of my elected representatives and um both of them were not didn't see it as a great idea. And I'm not saying that that would stop me from moving forward with putting a bond on the ballot. I think that it is something there is something to be said for reputation um especially among other elected public officials. >> One of the things that is tricky about property taxes is I can't say to taxpayers, "We're only going to increase $100 a year." Because we are not the only entity that can increase property taxes. And so I was remembering a LEAC meeting when we asked teachers "How How is behavior in your school?" And they're like, "Oh man, it's hard. It's really hard." And then we said, "Well, we put a few supports in place for you this year. We got You know, you have more administration. You have counselors." And then when I pointed it out, they were like, "Oh yeah, those things have been amazing. It's made such a difference." And I think it's just a matter of where you're looking. So when I go to fill out the check on my property taxes, am I like, "Okay, this $100 increase went towards the Field House?" Or is it like a cumulative increase of this much and my head explodes. And I think that's what our legislators hear is not this broken down itemized, "Here's how each entity who raised taxes did it frugally, but um here's the overwhelming result and burden on taxpayers." And so even though I love the result of the the survey, I'm cognizant that that is not the same thing as taxpayers feeling comfortable with their property tax dollar amount. >> But let's be on let's be um honest. Most of our legis- lots of our legislators don't understand property tax themselves. And that's why that's later on our schedule tonight to talk about how do we educate people of what this tax is. This is not a tax we all wanted. This is a tax that legislators have put on and some don't even understand some of the aspects of it. And so I think as we go out to explain this to people, I think that this is a perfect time to educate um our public on on our finances to be able to share those kinds of things and and I think give them a voice. I mean I don't know. Like these are real positive numbers to me. Um I don't need any elections not going to be 100% um unless you run unopposed. But >> Even then. >> Even then. But one like this is apt tax or those kinds of taxes, they're looking for 51% actually 50 plus one vote. So anyways. >> I don't know if I would I would frame this as the school district is asking for more money. I I can see the hesitancy there. And the reputation and the I I don't I don't want to be a board member of a board that's constantly asking the public for more money, but I don't think that's what we're doing here. I think what we're doing is asking them if they want to pay $100 a year to build schools uh to build field houses. We're not asking them for more money. We're asking them if they want to >> invest >> Yeah. >> And and the um we would most likely need to increase property taxes to include the $1.2 million that would be needed for the maintenance of the field house field houses also. I mean possibly. >> I am wondering how that would cut into the annual budget. The 1.2 maintenance of the six field houses. >> Are we ready to vote? Please. >> So uh to correct my information, the date uh is estimated to be August 20th. There would be two board meetings before that date would have to be held. So the way the calendar is currently you would either need to add some board meetings at the end of June and or July or you would need that decision made for that June board meeting. But it But the um August 20th is the date for the Lieutenant Governor. Which >> I don't remember the the costs for this motion. >> Yeah. >> Focus group. >> Oh, yeah. How much are the costs? Yes, please. >> Well, are you guys comfortable if I give costs here? Okay. Um Lighthouse had told us that um they would do focus groups three focus groups for 19950 four for 25800 six for 37500 or nine groups for 54 thousand. So the arrange there of three focus groups to nine focus groups between 19950 and 54 thousand. So if the board does proceed with focus groups, that is direction we would need to need we would need to proceed. >> But, we don't need to make the decision on which of those ranges. We just need to decide whether we're going to move forward with them right now or not. >> I think that's true. >> That what we're Is that what you're thinking, Bryce? >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Okay. So, the motion on the table, please correct me cuz there's been a lot of discussion since, was um that we move forward with focus groups um towards the field house decision. That was all that was in the motion. >> You have restated it correctly. >> Thank you. Okay. All in favor of that motion, please say I. >> I. >> I. And any opposed? >> Nay. >> Nay. >> A. That motion carries five to two. The opposing votes going to Mr. Barnett and Ms. Barrow. Correct? Okay. Um do we want to select a level for the focus groups now? I think if we're going to do this, I would like to get the ball rolling as soon as possible. >> I would like to do at least three. >> And I I I think we should do at least four. >> The lowest level was three? >> Because each group is only about 10 people, right? >> A. >> And And so, actually, I would I I would like to do at least five focus groups because that's only 50 people. >> But, a focus group is an hour, right? >> Can I ask Lighthouse a question? >> Yeah. >> So, we chose the 900 level for the survey. >> Correct. would >> a corresponding level for the focus groups? >> then. Good question. >> know that we necessarily have a corresponding level. Um 900 is a lot of surveys. We don't typically do that much. Um for a statewide survey, we can get away with 4 to 600 surveys and still be within that uh less than 5% margin of error. So, 900, that's a very large sample. For focus groups, um I don't think it's necessary to do the higher um number of focus groups. Um again, keep in mind that we're not looking for statistically valid data. So, I know that the the urge is to want to get as much input as possible, but we're looking at the quality, like the qualitative, right? The responses, the feelings and behaviors under underneath that. So, honestly, I would not recommend doing I don't think you I don't think it's necessary, I should say, to do nine focus groups, but I would say maybe three to five is a comfortable range. So. >> I'd like to add >> Yes. >> Sorry. When we do lots of focus groups, like nine, it's because we're looking at three very distinct groups of people. Um So, for example, if you wanted us to find people who are supportive of the bond, people who are in the middle, and people who are opposed, and put them in three different groups, we'd want to do nine groups. Um if we're looking for a mix of people, just general people, three is generally enough um to get a good idea of what people think. And as the groups agree or disagree with each other, we can find trends and ideas that tend to represent the general public. We're also not looking statewide here. We're looking at one school district, which I know for a lot of people they can look at it and say, "It's a whole school district." But it's actually a fairly small chunk of people that three can represent it fairly. If we did four or five, that would give you some more, but it wouldn't reach statistical status. Um so, it would still be sufficient, I would say, at the three level. Unless you want to look at groups of people, right? Sometimes we've done groups where we had men separate from women. I I don't recommend that for this. But in some cases we would, and then we would recommend three of each kind. Does that make sense? That's why we give ranges, sorry, ranges going from three to nine or even more focus groups depending on how you want to group people. >> Well, after that explanation, I feel like three is sufficient. I would love to have a motion before we can >> motion that we move forward with three focus groups. >> I'll second. >> Says the two that voted against focus groups. >> Yeah, it was >> But we're already We're already committed now, so I'm going to motion for the lowest one. >> So, we have a motion from Mr. Barnett, seconded by Ms. Barrow, that we move forward with Lighthouse holding three focus groups. Now, let's have discussion. >> a question. Would they Would you do that in one night? >> We We would do it in one night, and we would do it in an evening because that's typically when people are more likely to to show. However, we don't want to go too late because we found that if we go too late, people disengage and are ready to go home. >> If I remember right, they're about an hour, right? Like from the >> minutes. 90 minutes, and we hold them back-to-back, and so I'm thinking we would probably start for the evening around 3:00 or 3:30. >> Okay. Thank you. >> yeah. Right. Other discussion? Okay, hearing then, all in favor of the motion, please say I. >> I. I. >> And any opposed? Okay, that motion carries unanimously. Okay. Any other items that you want to discuss? >> there any more direction we would give Lighthouse uh as far as things we're interested in or is it all based on the survey and then Lighthouse determines? >> Yes this. Yes, we very much want your input because we want this to uh whether whatever the outcome is to be the most successful research as possible. And so we want to know from you what objectives do you have? Um we can rely on the survey. A lot of times the survey is a springboard that launches us into qualitative research, but um you may have other objectives that were not included in the survey. And so I we very much would happily rely on you for understanding what your objectives are. We've also found that when there's um any bond research that we've done, the more information you can provide about the bond, uh the better interaction and conversation and understanding we have with our participants. So. >> Thank you. Okay, is that enough for tonight or is there something >> My follow-up question would be what are what does the board do then next to provide more information to Lighthouse ahead of the focus groups? >> And I would propose that we get a head of ad hoc committee that was working on this. >> Working on questions >> Questions and moving this forward if we're going to move it forward, answering the little questions. I >> Are you suggesting a committee that is running a bond or just for focus group? >> Um both. It could It could work into running the bond, but just like some of the questions like uh 1.2 million seems a little high on maintenance, at least I believe. And I'd like to ask other districts. I'd like to see what the cost of these places that were and and compare it to other districts that are putting them in. Just different things like that. I just want more detail than we're and we're going to probably need it really fast, right? If we're going to put this on the ballot, we would we would need those questions answered. I might be the only one that thinks we need a focus group, but I think we do. >> Well, I think we already established that we want focus group. >> I mean, yeah, I'm talking to ad hocs. >> We're an ad hoc. Sorry. Um >> I can submit you to my questions right now. Or tonight, or tomorrow, or whenever you want them. >> I'm happy to do that as well, if that's the way we want to go. >> I'd love to hear other perspectives. Are you ready for a committee? Remind me, Mr. Larson, I feel I have never been on the board when we did a bond. So, um do we need that committee to act outside of the board? It's not kind of like the selection committee. Does that make any sense? >> I'm not sure what you mean by selection committee. >> No, I was just using an example like when we're acting as a committee for a specific um campaign like this, is it just board members or >> So, uh can I reflect on what happened for the 2016 bond? >> That would be so helpful. >> Um there are there are statutes that prohibit um employees of an entity doing a bond to be um advocating for its passage. >> That was what I was trying to get to. >> Um during during during business hours, right? Contract hours. Uh individuals are of course allowed to, you know, in the evenings or weekends, their own choices. But, uh yeah, there's nothing during the business hours that that can take place. But, my understanding of that and I'll ask the bond counsel on this cuz we're we're now getting closer here, but is that the board is acting as a the governing board can discuss things in its meetings uh differently and that's not advocating or not advocating. Does that make sense? Uh you guys are looked looked upon differently than employees in that sense. >> John, could this group this evening decide whether to put it on the bond or not or put it on the ballot or not? >> Uh tonight, if you wanted to go as far as you could, you could say move forward with putting it on the ballot. There's a bunch of legal procedures that have to happen for that to happen, but if you wanted us to proceed in that direction, that would be the vote would to say proceed in that direction to do that. And then I'll get the lawyers involved, the the finance people involved. >> So it would be a vote to proceed and then we would set up the next steps if that were the vote. >> Yes. Yeah. There was a committee that was done off hours in the evenings separate from everything that wanted to advocate for the bond. Uh and that group got together to discuss messaging and things outside of um office hours. In the prior bond >> have office hours. How would that work? >> That's why I want to consult with bond counsel on that, but my recollection was that the board was looked upon differently in that respect. Um the bond prior to 2016, of course, there was a group doing the opposite. They had committees against. Um So that that's what I mean about the evening stuff. >> Can I summarize to be sure I understand what John just said? So, the board could vote to ask us to put the procedures in place to put the bond on the ballot. And then we would consult with attorneys and bring things back. They can vote to have focus group at focus groups in place as they did in the number of focus groups that they want. And then if they voted to put it on the ballot, then we could talk about what a separate committee would look like and what the restrictions would be on how they would proceed with communicating about a bond campaign. Is that right? >> Yes. The I just got to be sure that we Yes, in general. The piece I would add that is that tonight you can't vote to do it because you haven't done those legal steps to do it. You could only vote to proceed to towards that. >> You'd be voting to direct staff to put everything in place so that you could vote for it. >> But it's not essential that that's done tonight. >> No. >> Sooner the better. >> that that be done before >> I would be more comfortable doing that in a business meeting personally. >> Well, that's what I mean. The legal procedures, part of that is public hearings, public input, uh notices, advertisements, those kinds of things. >> Can I re-restate? >> Re-restate? >> This is good. We don't do this a lot. I just want to So, you would have to direct us >> Start. >> to put everything in place in time for there to be two public hearings before August 20th. So, if you if you are I'm not trying to move things one direction or the other, but we would need time to set up two public hearings before you make the decision to put it on the ballot and in time to run a campaign. So, those are all of the factors to consider. In this meeting, you could vote for us to put the process in place. That is not necessarily a vote in favor of the bond. >> Right. That's what I was saying. >> So, I move that we direct staff to begin the procedure towards putting this on a ballot. >> I'll second it. >> Okay, we have a motion from Mr. Denford, a second from Dr. Robinson, to begin the process of moving towards a bond ballot initiative. Is that do what you need? Okay. Discussion. >> How much work is that if we don't end up voting to put it on the ballot? >> That's why we're here. It's not an exorbitant amount of work. It's just that we we research it, make sure that we're doing things properly. It's easier. It gives us the time to do it. I'm not trying to move it tonight. >> I'm not trying to move it tonight. It's a question of not how much work is it and how much work is it on a certain timeline. But again, whenever the board decides, whatever you decide, that's exactly we we have good people in place that we will work with to get good answers for you about the process and and how to proceed from there. >> May I ask what is involved in the campaign process where we are educating the public? Like is that something communications department does? How does that work, and are there uh >> There are legal requirements. >> Say that again. >> There are legal requirements that would need to be met >> Okay. >> in in educating the public on what the bond is >> Okay. >> with uh notices of statements for, statements against um all those processes to gather that and put them together and mail them out. >> But that is different than having staff employees, like if they wanted to meet after hours, like there's no conflict of interest in us educating versus like >> Yeah. >> promoting or >> educating versus advocating. Yes. Communications would educate. >> Okay. >> Employees, parents, others could advocate. >> I see. >> And board members could advocate within the restrictions that we would make clear to you after we consulted with experts in this area. But we would but communications, to answer your question, would educate and would work with attorneys to be sure that we didn't cross the line of advocating. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> And and in the past groups form, nonprofit groups that are you know friends of field houses. I think of good acronyms there, you know, or whatever. Um field house friends that would then advocate and do work, just like with any other political campaign. But we would want to make sure that the board and staff members had clarity about what they could and could not do in terms of educating versus advocating. >> Thank you. That's the first step in this process that we're voting on, right? >> And is it is it also pretty common that there would be a group of um enemies of field houses that run their own campaign, kind of a >> You're asking for a to do that, there is and enemies of bonds certainly. >> Yeah, and so they they just >> Mothers against field houses? >> a grassroots thing, right? They just get together and >> Mothers are positive, remember? >> Yeah, they're they're they're >> So, that's to be expected in this. >> Various groups would form and you would expect that, yes. On each side of the issue, right? >> That's outside of anything we might do. That's all right. >> Correct. Correct. >> Can I can I ask for an interpretation of the please proceed? I am to if if the board votes yes on that, then I am to start working with bond counsel and with our financial counsel to put together the process. >> information so we know that we're following an appropriate legal process I think is what I need first. >> Yep. >> I need to understand what my vote means. If we vote for this, how much money what's the commitment, who can help? >> Yeah, what's the process going forward? >> Exactly. >> Yeah, and that and that we establish the timeline. We have all the details for you so you know exactly what the process would be and then when you vote yes or no to put it on the ballot, you know exactly what would be happening as a result of that vote or not happening as a result of that vote. Yeah. >> President, tonight would just be administrative direction so that they can proceed. You're not formally taking any action. You're providing your administration with direction. >> By our own policy, if we ask them to do more than an hour's worth of work, it takes board directive. So, we're giving that board directive tonight. >> Okay. >> The reason I was asked Oh, I'm sorry. >> Sorry, go ahead. >> The reason I was asking is cuz that would engage additional groups. That's that's why I wondered if that was part of that direction. Okay. >> Hey. All those in favor of the motion, please say I. >> I. >> And any opposed? Hey, that motion passes unanimously. So, you have a good understanding of what we just asked. Perfect. Because we don't. All right. So, before >> And anyone who's interested in a field house at their high school can start planning your friends of field houses committees. >> Somebody make a call post. Okay. Before we move on, I am just curious. Are there people here who are planning to stay beyond this field house discussion? I'm just trying to decide if we should move. Okay. So, most of you are planning on leaving. We are so grateful that you were here and we're so grateful for your interest. And you are of course welcome to stay, but if you're leaving anyways, we're going to take a short break and go into the study session room. >> For like half an hour. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Welcome back to the Jordan School District Board of Education study session. Um, I feel like I've announced the date so many times tonight, but it is still Tuesday, April 14th, 2026. We still have all seven members of the Board of Education, as well as our superintendent, associate superintendent, business administrator, and board attorney present with us, as well as a few others. So, we're going to continue tonight's conversation with a review of child nutrition meal charges. So, we will turn it over to Dr. Larson, Mr. Thomas, and Ms. Katie Bastian. >> Sorry. Okay, uh board members of a few years ago, 3 years ago, you may recall well most uh may recall that we were here with a proposed meal charge increase. And um we're here for that same purpose tonight. So, we have Scott and Katie with us to discuss that and answer any questions you have about why it's being budget. In and out. >> Do you need new mics? >> Something It well, it's the speakers connecting to the mics. There's a problem. >> Awesome. Thank you so much. Thanks for letting me come to for come before you um to discuss these price um increases. Really, what I hope to do is kind of paint a picture of what um we are are dealing with and just not us, our child nutrition program, but um other programs in the state and across the nation. Um to get started with, I wanted to give a big thanks to John Larson and Jamie in accounting. We have worked closely with our accounting department, human resources with some other personnel things to have the most accurate data for this, and they have really helped us crunch the numbers, and I really appreciate that. Um so, our School Nutrition Association is a professional association Sorry. Okay. All right. Um for uh the nation and represents um child nutrition departments, uh they had a legislative action conference just in March last month, and we actually sent Katie Kolar, registered dietitian, with some other delegates from the SNA um presidency here in Utah. They went back to Washington, D.C., um and spoke with uh those on the hill about things that are um important and pressing for our uh program. Um a couple of the big things they brought up when meeting with different um senators and congressmen is they asked to increase federal reimbursement rates for our school meals. 45 cents for lunch and 28 cents for breakfast. They asked that our programs be protected from future funding cuts and help to address the rising operational costs to run school nutrition programs. And so really the idea here is we're just trying to keep um these programs sustainable nationwide. Now for Jordan specifically, just like John mentioned, we were here 3 years ago um discussing a price increase, and it had been many, many years before that um before our next recent price increase. So the price increase that um we did 3 years ago was 25 cents across the board for elementary breakfast, lunch, secondary breakfast and lunch. Our adult um breakfast went up 50 cents, and our adult lunch went up to 80 cents. We knew and at that time of the presentation that more increases would be needed. But again, at the end of every year, we take into account our budget, reimbursement rates, and we make those decisions as we go. Um and as we all know, we we buy our own groceries, inflation has increased by approximately 10%. That's just the best guess. So we know we had a huge jump with COVID and then everything is just kind of gone up from there. And then I'll show on the next slide our reimbursement rates when Well, I'll just go to the next slide. So, this slide shows if you're looking at the federal and the lunch portion in school year '22, we are getting reimbursed $4.39 for every meal because that's when we are doing free meals for all. So, for every meal we served, we got that nice high reimbursement rate. The next year we went back to free reduced paid structuring meaning based on students eligibility if they qualified for free reduced lunch or paid. We had a temporary bump in the reimbursement rates that year that we knew it just before a year. That's why when you see like in the lunch category, it goes from 85 cents to 40 cents cuz we lost that temporary bump. And then we are pretty much just back to regular reimbursement. And this is for paid students. So, you can see back in '22 we are getting paid or reimbursed for a paid student what we would get for a free student. But we receive much smaller reimbursement for paid students. And essentially and it's interesting to note also when we were getting reimbursed more, we were also receiving supply chain assistance funds. I'm not sure SCA funds and our district received quite a bit of money for that and those are no longer in play anymore. But as you can see from school year '24, '25, '26, the reimbursement rate for paid students has gone up pennies. And we all know inflation is much more than that. Breakfast is kind of the same state our state reimbursement, that's our liquor tax. It's also gone down a little bit from year to year. Let's see. I think that's all for that one. So, I'm for our year-end projection, this is why we're coming before the board for proposed price increase for next school year is these are we're talking about projected losses. So, our best case scenario as a loss is $3.1 million. Worst case scenario is $8.3 million and our current best guess is 6.4. So. Let me just make sure I didn't miss something. Okay. >> Explain that. What what you mean by loss exactly? >> Oh, yes, from our fund balance. So, a little bit later on we'll speak specifically to our fund balance and it's the amount of money that we have um and we draw it down if we are in the negative. We do have a fund balance and we'll talk about that. What our current fund balances and how we anticipate it drawing down over the next few years. Um sorry, I just wanted to make sure I didn't >> Does Does everybody understand the reimbursement rates for paid meals? Is there any questions there? Okay. >> Talk to me about what constitutes a loss. So, if a student pays the cost that we charge them, it actually costs us more to produce that lunch than what we charge the student. Is that right? >> Yeah. Well, we're not supposed to we get the federal reimbursement for a paid student. We're not charging our or for a free student. Sorry, we're not charging our paid students quite enough because we get liquor tax in Utah. So, that makes it cuz we can't subsidize a paid student with federal funds, but we can use liquor tax and that's what's kept our paid student meals so cheap or or so less expensive in Utah because we have that liquor tax. Um but we still in the end have to cover our costs. So, does that answer your question? >> so the things that would create like a a cost difference would be students not paying for their meals or um I'm I'm just trying to understand the meals are actually costing more to produce than the what the student paid. >> Yes. That's right. >> Okay. Especially for for Jordan in particular because and we'll we'll see this a little bit later on. We have such a low free and reduced percentage in Jordan, less than 20%. So, the majority of our population is paid students. So, for the majority of every meal we're getting less amount than if that was a free student and a district who has very high free and reduced percent, they're getting a lot more of those free reimbursement rates for those meals. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. So, this is what we're looking at our our guesses for anticipated losses. Um this next slide shows our current comparison of our prices and there's a lot of numbers there, but you can see Jordan's on the left side and really in just looking at the colors, green is good, red is is bad, and yellow is about right in the middle. So, currently the cost of our meals in comparison to other districts around us and we've reached out, I've talked to you know, directors. We have collaboration meetings to to try and have fairly accurate information. But so you as you can see Jordan on the far left, we're pretty much square in the middle and this is before any price increase. As we look at the price increase we are looking at this year, specifically um on the left, those are the prices that we are charging this school year. The middle column is the proposed increases this year. So, a 25 cent increase for elementary breakfast and elementary lunch, a 30 cent increase for secondary breakfast and secondary lunch, a 50% sorry, 50 cent increase for adult breakfast and 90 cent adult increase for adult lunch. Bringing it to the right column, which is where our meal prices would be for this next school year. >> So, on the chart you showed us before, it looked like adult lunch was green. It looked good. Why are we increasing that? >> Um, so it's not it's dark green. Yellow. Yeah. >> Oh. >> Low. If you >> So, green is low. >> Like that's a great price. >> Yeah. >> Oh. I thought you meant green meant we were doing a good job. >> green is like the very >> the best. I misunderstood. Sorry. >> We're losing money on the >> Yeah. >> And and with adult meals, you know, there's no reimbursement there. So, they have to be full freight. What it cost to produce the meal. >> Cost of the food and the labor. Yep. Um, and so in looking at these um, adult breakfast and meal prices, these would as we did the calculations with the federal things, these would cover what we would have to what would cover the cost of the meal and it puts us in line with several of the other adult meals for the other district, which is this next slide. So, this next slide is just like the one we saw before, but this is after our anticipated meal increases and the other districts that we've talked to haven't got a hold of Granite. They're just increasing their prices or not next year. They That's exactly. That's what we'll point out next. But as you can see, even with our price increase this year, um or anticipated for this next school year, we are still really middle-of-the-road in comparison to other districts. And there are other districts, everyone is making these same decisions. Do we increase our prices now? Do we wait? Do we do it incrementally? Um so, there are other several other districts who are considering price increases this year, next year. Um so, I just this is just a really good um visual representation of where we are even after a price increase. And then, just like you were asking at the bottom of the screen, you can see um the free and reduced. So, Jordan is 19.91. We are a very low free and reduced district. And so, we do not get that high reimbursement rate for lunch, $4.69 for most of our students. We're >> Yeah. I I just So, like with Granite, can you see how they're 41% which is why they can they their meals are they can charge less cuz they get almost double the reimbursement that Jordan would get. >> For >> Or more than >> for almost half of their students. So, it puts us in some ways a little bit of a disad- disadvantage, also cuz we are a very large district. Um so, we're serving more meals overall, which we love to do. You know, we we have high participation rates in Jordan, which also has made this math kind of work for years in the past is we serve so many meals, so many students. Okay. So, the impact of these changes, if we are looking at the price increase next year, the increase in our revenues would be 1.1 million dollars. When you look at that increase, we anticipate that there will probably probably be a downtick in participation, meaning we would lose um some students eating with us, at least initially. Um, we would hope that they would come back. But, so that would decrease our revenues. We just guestimated a percent, so maybe $716,000. Um, which would also decrease our food costs if we're not feeding those students. So, it it becomes a net decrease for 420. Um, the take home message here is that increasing our prices would give us a revenue of 1.1 uh, million dollars. And then if you take into account the decrease in participation and the decrease of the cost of food, we'd come out of a net. So, we would come out on top $716,000. And like >> Sorry to keep interrupting you. >> No, it's great. >> I'm just curious how many slides are left in your slide deck. >> We're about halfway through. We can break. >> We're halfway. >> Yeah. Would you mind if we just pause? I I hate to have people >> No, it's >> come for a short time and then we don't honor it. So, if that's okay, let's take a pause. We will hop over to public comment on school fees and then we'll pick back up. Sorry about that. >> We're fine. >> Are we going out there or are they coming in here? >> Is there a need to go out there? Okay. Are you guys okay in here? Perfect. All right. So, for those trying to follow along, we're pausing to um, discuss our school fees. We want to make sure that we have opportunities for public comment prior to the timeline when we need to vote. So, there's no changes on the school fees that we last proposed, but just an opportunity for public comment. So. Are they on the spreadsheet? >> They're not here to comment. They're here to >> Oh. Sorry, I thought you said we had two. >> We had two people, not two comments. >> apologize. Okay. Anyone here who was hoping to speak to public comment? We hear from you enough. I'm just kidding. We love having you here. Okay. Going, going. All right. Looks like no one here hoping to speak on public comment. We have one more opportunity, right? At our next meeting. Prior to the vote. Yeah. We'll vote in the next meeting, but not until we've heard one more time. So. All right. Sorry to make you move away for nothing, but let's continue hearing about school lunches. Sorry, shouldn't have unhooked. >> Can I ask about the the increase in those numbers? Um Is that Hold on. I'm reading through your numbers one more >> That's That's okay. I'm like the take-home message is if we raise lunch prices, we will um come out ahead $716,000 is what we anticipate. Even though the revenues would be higher, we have to count in the decrease in participation. So, those are all just guestimates. So, that's I'm just thinking about um you know, the cost of the food and cost of paying employees. Is that also still a net gain or does are those not included? >> Does >> Not yet. So, at some point we'd have to look at some other options. This would just slow down the decrease of the fund balance. Does that make sense? There's there's still going to be a loss even with the app. >> We we did take into account the decrease of some expenditures. So, we would think if we're feeding like if the participants Sorry, participation does decrease a little bit, we'll be feeding less kids. So, it would be a little bit less food costs. But at that point labor costs would still be the same until we make decisions going forward. >> Okay, thank you. >> Is the expectation to pay Obviously, the expectation should be to pay for the cost of the food with the revenues generated by charging students for lunch? Are we also anticipating paying labor costs and all basically all of the costs to run a nutrition program solely by the revenues generated by school lunch? Is that the expectation? >> We we are a stand-alone program. So, we do have to We do not take money from the district unless we run out of fund balance. Then the district it has to come out from the district budget. So, eventually and we're lucky that we do have state funds in Utah. Um but yes, eventually at some point the revenues have to make it so that our program runs in the green. At some point either revenues decreases and labors that that balance of that. >> I I'll just interject that another way to look at this is we don't use any property tax money to subsidize the school lunch program. >> All including all the staff that are needed to provide it. >> Correct. >> Have a completely separate budget of like the general I think the general fund, correct? >> Yeah. >> Why is that? Why isn't Why isn't school meals included in what property tax is spent on? >> It's a stand-alone fund and and it's a federal program. So we separate it apart from everything else to demonstrate compliance with all the federal rules cuz every every dollar that we receive in this program is considered under federal rules. And so we have to then mark it as abiding by those federal rules. And we have not um subsidized the school lunch program with >> Could we though? Could we do the truth and taxation and not raise any >> Yes. In fact, I think there's a slide that kind of talks about that coming up. >> I had >> I'll go ahead. >> I was just going to say is it unique that Utah state gives to the school lunch funds? Is that you >> The liquor tax is very unique and sometimes I'm like, "Oh, we don't want to talk about it too much cuz people will know about it." It's a huge advantage to to Utah child nutrition programs. That's well, and really if you to have other family members outside of the state of Utah if you ask them how much their lunches cost if they're not on free and reduced, I would guess that it's $4 to $5 easily because they don't have those those liquor tax the state funds to help keep the mail prices low cuz we can't subsidize the paid students with our federal dollars. >> So other schools are totally relying on federal funding. >> And charging their paid families more. Yeah. Definitely. a Is there any impact in uncollectible So, in other words, somebody who doesn't pay, is that pretty common and is that affecting the cost of lunch at all? I do know that we have good people in the community that will go and pay uncollected lunches, but how are we doing in that area? >> It it is something of concern and I think it's also on one of the other slides. I think our last amount that we looked at for the end of quarter three was uh deficit of $300,000 district-wide. Um I wouldn't say that's more than any other district when you take into account our size. Um it's also a problem. I it's not creating this price, you know, this the this problem that we have. It's definitely not helping it. If everyone would pay their bills, it would definitely help. Um but kind of a separate issue that is another issue that's continuing to grow for sure is the student meal deficit. So. >> And if we were to raise it, that could be worse. >> That there is a potential for that, too. Yeah. Mhm. Okay. Okay, so talking about our fund balance. This is some of the extra money, rainy day money that we received when we were getting those high participation rates. When everyone was getting um we were doing the free meals for all, is really when our fund balance um grew. Um so, you can see at the end of this past school year, our fund balance was very healthy, $19 million. Um but we had an operating loss last year of 2.4. So, um our fund balance was 22 or so before that. So, you can see the the loss of 2.4 brought it down to 19 and a half million. Um for next year with our protective our projected losses being anywhere from 3.1 million to worst case scenario 8.3 million. Um and then if you take into account the net impact of raising our prices from that the additional $716,000 um you can see we'll see in the next slides what impact that will have on our fund balance. And really the goal like our federal guidelines want us to keep at least an operating um 3 months operating balance. Um and so we've figured that to be about 33% of our expenditures or about $10 million is a good thing to keep in your fund balance. However, there are several districts who are not only losing those 3 months of operating expenditures, but who will be running out of their fund balance entirely and looking to their district, like you said, to subsidize or look at other options. Districts in this valley who will be running out of fund balance by next school year. So, let's see. Okay, so this will have a couple slides that will be similar and I'll just be going over the different scenarios. So, this is our worst case scenario. You can see on the far left side, that's the anticipated loss at 8.3 million. Um and then if you were to subtract that, so the bottom number is really what will be watching and that is a our fund balance. So, even with the worst case scenario, we lose 8.3 million even with our price increase, um put in that $716,000 gain to 96,000 100,000 loss, you can see at the end our fund balance goes to 3.683. Do you see that? And then you can see as it progresses from year to year how we will very, very quickly um not only uh go below what we like to, but we will deplete our fund balance entirely if the worst-case scenario um plays out. >> Are there any questions on that slide? Does that make sense? The bottom, the worst-case that we have you know, we have one more year basically. >> Go below our goal. >> So our goal. >> What determines what kind of scenario we have? Worst-case, average, or best-case scenario? What kinds of things determine that? >> good question, and why we're hoping like it's somewhere closer to the as you'll see there's a couple more scenarios. Our best-case scenario, or best guess, is like you saw several slides back. We receive the 75 cents per lunch of state reimbursement, which is the liquor tax. We also, at the end of the year, there is a um bucket of the liquor tax left, and whatever money is left, they distribute it according to the number of meals that they served. And so, just for example, last year in August, we got our bonus of over $2 million in liquor tax. So, really, that makes it really hard to plan in that we know that we're getting the 75 cents a meal from liquor tax, but we don't ever know what that end of the year bonus is going to look like, and that's why our worst-case and best guess are so vastly different and because it really depends on what happens with the liquor tax and how much there is at the end of the year. I wish that they would make it For a time, the state office made the meal so it had a $1.20 um state reimbursement, and that made it easier for us to plan, but I don't know if it makes it harder for the state to budget or what not. The state office of education, they quickly took it back to the 75 or 80 cents a meal knowing that we we hope and we plan on getting a bonus of whatever money is left in that pot for every district. So, which >> I don't know whether to be happy that we got 2 million extra in liquor tax money. >> Right. Buy more liquor, is that what you're concerned about? >> Everybody do your part. >> So, the next couple slides are very they're the same, but they're just showing the different. So, this is our best case. So, then this is showing if we were to lose the very least amount that we thought that we will, the 3.1 million, as you watch the fund balance along the bottom, we we draw it down so much slower, 16 million, 14 million, 11 million, and that gives us time to plan and prepare. Um so, we we hope this is closer, um but even with this best case scenario, you can see within three or four years it's taking us under what we would want for an operating cost in our fund balance, and that is another reason why we're still coming to the board at this this point for a price increase is I think we are looking at it that we would prefer to look at it and do incremental price increases and look at our budget, like I said, every year and evaluate things as we go rather than waiting till things get really bad and having to do a large price increase. We we want to keep our constituents, our our families in our district as transparent as we can, and I would say small incremental price increases are probably better, and it it looks closer to what other districts are doing as well. The last scenario is our best guess, and that was that's with an anticipated loss of 6.4. And you can see here that is still fairly significant. And if that's more what we're leaning towards this year, then our fund balance will also decrease quickly. And that's why in future in a couple of slides we'll talk about what else are we looking about other than just increasing prices for our program. Any questions on those? Okay. So, again, our recommendation to the board is that we increase um 25 cents for elementary breakfasts and lunches and 30 cents for secondary breakfasts and lunches, 50 cents for adult breakfast and 90 cent for adult lunches. And like I've mentioned, with this increase, we feel like it will give us a little bit more wiggle room to look again at next year and see where we are. Our last increase was 3 years ago. If we feel like we can push, you know, push it and and be able to last it a little bit longer without a price increase, we will. But we we will continue to work with um our accounting department and looking at our budget from year to year and our anticipated revenues with reimbursement rates, hoping that those go up. But um this gives us the ability to have a little bit of wiggle room and also continue to look at it for the future. Um so, we talked about some other changes that may be necessary. And we would also like to make these changes in um incremental year to year and again see where we are. For this school year, we are looking at reducing the number of staff in schools to uh meet the meal counts. So, we have staffing patterns in each of our schools and that's based on the number of meals per labor hour. Meaning, if your school serves this many meals, you have this many staff members to prepare the meals at your school. Um for the last couple years, we have had maybe a couple schools that are outside of their staffing patterns, and we've chosen to um work with those overages through attrition, meaning we you know, when a staff member retires, we choose not to rehire for that position. But just where we are financially right now, we we will be moving forward with a small riff. It's not a lot of employees. It's It's a handful, under 10 or so, that will be affected. And we're we've worked with our human resources department. And really, it's not picking and choosing what schools. It's very systematic because it's based on those staffing patterns and the number of meals per labor hour. And if one school is doing it with this employees this number of employees, every other school that's within that same number of meals should be doing it as well. So, that is at least for this year. Other things that we have brainstormed with our John and our accounting department, and possibly, we'll see where things are at, but looking in following years, is reducing the number of non-student contract days for our staff. So, we have the one health and wellness day, three teacher professional development days, and three days before school starts, and then any snow days. Anytime that we have those days, professional development days are relatively new in the calendar. I wasn't a director when it happened, but 5, 6, 7 years ago, and our contracts haven't changed. So, those days didn't used to exist in our calendar, or we had the students eating on those days. And those are now days where our staff is still set to have those as contract days, but we're losing the revenue of not having the students in the school eating. So, we pay all of our contract staff, as well as we lose revenue. So, we kind of get hit twice. So, we are looking at the possibility of reducing their contracts and taking out some of those days where the students are not in school eating. >> I have a question about the days before school starts. Is there any preparation that needs to happen in a kitchen before the students start being served meals, and how long does that take, and is it the um the nutrition services that does it, or can custodial staff do it? >> Mhm. >> Anyway, that's what I'm curious >> that's a very good question, and I uh you know, we had a lot of meetings with our staff to see the professional development days, and health and wellness day would probably be first. And then, as I was talking to my coordinators, you know, we have a lot of um people in our office who have years of service with our department, and we would still probably need to keep at least two days before school as contract days, even though students aren't there, because they have to be there to receive deliveries from Nicholas, from our warehouse, and then they also have to be there to open the kitchen, start cooking, start baking their desserts, cleaning everything. They can't just show up the day of and be ready to serve 800 kids for one of our larger schools. So, we anticipate we would still need to at least include at the minimum two days before school started to kind of get things up and running when we didn't have students um there for the revenue. Okay. Um looking further, and it seems like things get a little bit the we push them out farther because they're a little bit less palatable. But, looking into future use years, um reducing the number of hours for our staff. So, uh currently in Jordan, we pay uh benefits to all of our eligible employees. So, what most districts call cooks are 6-hour workers and our kitchen managers. Um we still pay benefits to all of those, insurance and uh URS benefits if they if they want them to all of our 6 hours and managers. Um, several years ago when when I think URS made the change, most districts, I guess some of them grandfathered in their current staff, but at this point they are no longer paying new staff members those cooks. They move them down to under 6 hours and they are not benefit eligible. So, at this point most others, um, districts in the state of Utah are only paying benefits to their managers who And so, we we are still doing that and we have always prided ourself in being able to do that, but it does show a cost to continue to do that. So, that's something we can continue to look at. We don't want to and hopefully that's why it's down the road a little bit, but it's something we need to at least address as a possibility. Um, and then also in the future it shows that some districts, like I said, some districts are running out of their fund balance entirely and looking to their district to cover their costs from the general fund. And there is, I think, Logan City School District. The director there said, when they took a price increase, of course, Logan City School District is quite a bit smaller, but their board chose to um, subsidize it for a year to put off price increases, but down to someone has to cover the cost eventually if those fund balance do run out. So, again, we we watch these numbers very carefully and we just like to reiterate that we we at the end of each year we really evaluate where we are and we take these decisions very seriously because, well, you know, it affects really everyone, our families, our staff and so, um, we know they're hard decisions, but decisions that we need to make to make sure that our program continues to run as it has. So, does anyone have any additional questions? >> So, can you talk to me about um when we did the last increase, what was the impact to users? Did Did you see a big drop-off? How did that affect you? >> We have seen a decrease in participation. However, in speaking with other um school districts in the state of Utah, it seems like there's a decrease in participation overall, and even a decrease in the amount of people applying for free and reduced meals. So, I'm not sure if to attribute our decrease, cuz it has steadily decreased, but in talking to other districts who may have not raised their prices at that particular time when we had, in general, I would say we are seeing a decline in participation for Utah in general. Um in the state office of education, we get um entitlement or USDA funds based on the number of meals we serve, and Utah as a whole, our numbers have declined for the last few years, and I don't know exactly what that is, but I would attribute some of it is to the price increase, but again, as long as we're keeping our price increases minimal and reasonable, it's really hard to pack a lunch for your child, especially if you're doing anything prepackaged, for a lot less than what we're providing them. And you know, they get hot food, fresh fruits and vegetables, milk, like there's so many offerings. It really is still a very um yeah, good value for our families. >> So, when you say the percent of users, because that we understand that our enrollment is declining in general. So, are you saying the percentage of kids enrolled, fewer of them are eating lunches or just there are fewer lunches being sold. They both because we know that our enrollment is falling, but I would say our participation is still probably falling a little bit greater than what I would attribute enrollment falling, but we have taken that into account as well. >> And uh President, one of the schedules we put in the AFR annual conference and financial report in the statistical section tracks that for you if you want to track the percentage of students that are eating um school lunch, you can see the history there what's what's happened. >> Thank you for reminding me of that. Now that you say it, I remember you pointing it out. >> I I have a question. >> Yeah. >> We established that this program is separate from all of our other funds and then it's supposed to uh provide for itself, fund itself. It's obvious from the slides that you showed that within a few years we're going to run out of or we're either going to run out of funding or we're going to drop below the level that we want to be at in that fund. We're kind of living off of a windfall, right? That we got earlier. So, my question is if that's the expectation that it's self-funding what would the increase need to be in order to be self-funding? So, that we break even, so that we're not so that we don't have a loss. What would we have to charge? >> That is a very good a question and I think that's why we evaluate it at the end of each year because we're looking at do we still have liquor tax? And aside from just price increases, like we say, we need to look at not only ways to increase our revenue, but we need to look at a ways to decrease our costs as well. And that's why some of these other options of decreasing contract days, possibly taking away benefits, um is going to decrease our costs. Um and so, it's hard to say what the amount I mean, if you look at what we're charging adults, you know, charging our paid students $4. But but we need to take into account we're still getting like as long as we're still receiving liquor taxes. And we can always keep our fingers crossed that the federal reimbursement will increase overall um more than just 1 or 2 cents a year. >> I I don't think it would be difficult to come up with that number. We have the numbers that you provided and there's a shortfall based on the 25 cent increase. Figure out if it's a dollar, if it's a dollar 50, that that loss would come down to zero at it's just a it's just a math problem. >> Yeah, I I could do that for you, but what Katie's mentioning would have to be the assumption. What do we assume the federal government's going to do about their reimbursement rates? We don't we don't know what they're going to do till July. >> But we've made assumptions in the numbers already. Yeah. So, just use those same assumptions. The only thing that we want to change is what would the Yeah. >> We we could look at the >> gap there, yeah. >> the math for that and just get, like you say, a best guess of what we would need to charge. >> For sure. It seems like that's Well, I don't want to say that's the only solution, but >> In the end, like you say, and like we've talked with John, in the end, our only option is to continue raising lunch prices and decreasing our costs as much as possible. But, if there isn't another thing that comes in to help us, that really is our only option when we've exhausted all other resources of being able to decrease our costs as much as possible. You're You're right, at some point we just have to continue increasing prices. >> Yeah, I just >> And then at what point does that then break participation? You know, that break point where >> We want to stay somewhere in the realms of what everyone else is doing, but everyone else is in the same boat, too. When talking to other school districts in Utah and nationwide, everyone is dealing with these same looking at their Most districts do have a fund balance. We're larger, so we have a larger one, but we also have larger losses. Um but, everyone is looking at the same thing and looking at each other, "Well, what are you going to do? What are you going to do?" And we're all hoping that something happens, but I would say year-to-year that's why we're we're really watching because I I don't want to, like Scott says, we don't want to do that large increase and lose it If we lose participation, we have to cut staff anyways because then we're not serving the number of meals. So, it's it's a very balance. >> Raising it 25 cents a year is not going to cut it. Obviously, we're going to be >> Right. >> underfunded in a matter of two or three years, so >> Given the static assumptions, 25 cents a year wouldn't cut it. There'd have to be other cost reductions elsewhere. >> Or cost increases, or both. >> Yes. >> Or greater than 25 cents a year. >> Yeah. >> Well, I'm wondering the income by like legislators, could that be one of our priorities to legislators? Because if this is happening everywhere, perhaps they can help fund, especially as we've lost money in the federal programs. >> Back to that one of the very first slides that Katie showed that that state reimbursement is all in. And although the state's theory is, well, that's okay, but we'll give you a big amount at the end. It makes it harder on our end to then plan for well, where we going to end the year with this money? Um so yeah, I suppose a legislative request could we could you just bump that up 5 cents a meal? >> So when we looked at those numbers, I think I remember seeing 80 cents and it went down to 75 cents from the state. Is that factoring in that bonus of the tax we get in August or is that separate? >> So the state numbers are over on the right-hand side and that's just the numbers I know when I do my claim each month, I know that I can plan on that amount. I have no idea what's coming this August to help us hopefully get closer to the best-case scenario for this year. >> So so what I'm what I'm asking is the fiscal year 24 that 80 cents, did that factor in the bonus you got August after? >> Okay. >> That's where the best and worst-case scenario factors >> going forward, yeah. >> I think I I mean that's what I understood is that's the unknown where it's somewhere >> here. >> That's why we get so afraid anytime they talk about like there was um some bills in legislation and I reached out to both uh um um John and Mike letting them know, hey, I have concerns with these bills cuz they're talking about taking a percent of the state's liquor tax and creating a new eligibility code for families who don't qualify for reduced. That would be great for those families, but they don't understand the impact it has on all of Utah's families. It's as soon as you take away and it's a the way it is right now, it's a very simple thing. We don't have to do. We just have to make sure we're meeting the federal guidelines and if we serve a reimbursable meal, we know we're guaranteed those funds. So. >> As strange as it is, um more liquor tax, more people drinking liquor, helps the school lunch program. It It That's the way this >> Just buying it. They don't have to drink it. >> That Well, there you go. >> Don't some people use it on their grass or something? >> And And the state when the state looks at programs to divert that money to something else, for whatever political purpose, then it just hurt all the families that participate in this program, whether they're free, reduced, or uh paying. >> Well, that's why I'd be interested in seeing if you factored in the bonus to the fiscal year reimbursement per every lunch and you divided that $2 million by how many lunches, where does that go and is that bonus decreasing? Is that bonus money? >> be a very Yeah, we could we could do that. See what we get for the total year and just divide it by the number of meals lunches that we served. >> Cuz that would give us at least some data to talk to legislators about rather than not counting it at all and then not knowing. Yeah. So, does it matter whether the student was on free or reduced lunch in terms of the amount that we are reimbursed from federal and state? Like, do we get less if it was a reduced lunch student? >> Um the free re the free reimbursement rate is essentially the same as the reduced. The reduced like we charge we can't choose what we charge our reduced students. It's set at 30 cents for breakfast and 40 cents at lunch. So, the reimbursement rates are set up so that the reduced reimbursement rate is 30 cents lower and 40 cents lower. So, in the end when the student chooses that meal and pays their reduced amount, we're receiving the same amount of money as we would for a free student. Yeah. >> Right now, correct me if I'm wrong, but there's no reduced lunches, right? If you qualify, you qualify for free. >> House Yeah, House Bill 100 um for Utah's legislature, we have to provide documentation and quarterly we're getting reimbursed. So, any family that qualifies reduced um is not paying for their their lunch. We're accounting for it. Um and then we are being reimbursed for it. They still have to pay for 30 cents for their breakfast, but reduced families in Utah do not have to pay the cost of their lunches. >> And that sunsets, right? When does that happen? >> I believe >> It sunset and they renewed it for one more year. My guess is they're just going to look at it every year. >> So, that's a potential another ding. And then I'm just curious how like rising gas prices are increasing the cost of food for everyone. Um so, when we heard your presentation at the last increase, we were told, "This is one in a series of increases. This is not going to do it." Um is that the case still? This We know this is just We're trying to make a dent and we will continue to increase until we levelize out the fund. >> I might want to use an analogy of landing a plane. >> Good analogy. >> John mentioned this. >> But but let's say matter. We're also hoping that costs come down. That's the thing we're we're trying to buy some time that inflation levelizes, costs come down, and we don't have to continue to increase that much. It's inflation that we're fighting right now. >> The problem is it's going the wrong direction with this war. >> It's definitely going the wrong direction, and we have to keep up. >> I think that's one of the reasons SNA was asking for such a substantial increase, 40 cents increase in our reimbursement rate, considering it's just been pennies, 1, 2 cents, 3 cents. A 40 cent increase reimbursement rate across the board would be fairly huge. Um and so I think that's one of the reasons SNA asked for that, is it just looks like for this program nationwide it's becoming not financially feasible to run it as it is with the costs and the you know, the increased food costs, operating costs, equipment costs, labor costs. We want to continue to pay our employees, and every time the district decides to give steps and lanes, we support that, but we feel it in our budget and that I don't have I have to cover that myself. The district isn't isn't covering that. >> It's the board that increases those costs for you. >> Well, not sorry. Just >> I'm compensating employees even better than before. >> We aren't either, you know. We say that that's always a cost that we support because we support our labor staff, and we have a large labor staff. We employ over 500 people in Jordan School District, so yeah. Other questions? >> So the end question for the board is this one here is are you comfortable with us moving forward with that price increase? Cuz there's things that we need to be doing uh like registration materials, need to get that out. There's uh preparing the budget for approval in June. Uh getting information on website and other um promoting free and reduced lunch applications. So if you're if you're not comfortable with us moving forward with it, please tell us. But if you are, then those are the type of things we're going to start doing to in preparation for the approval in the budget hearing in June. >> Can I make a little request? I am supportive of this increase, but I would like to know prior to you decreasing benefits for employees what your intentions are so that the board understands and then has an opportunity to decide whether we'd like to find another way to supplement. Um, I'm I'm pretty comfortable with the top group being but the bottom made me squirm. I I agree that I'm like that it's it's the most unsettling. I'm like that's >> the least thing I would want to do and that's why we've put it out a couple of years, but we would definitely want to come before the board and say again, this is where we're at. We're doing all we can to lower costs and increase revenue and and get your guys's feedback as well, definitely. >> when you get to that point and I understand that right now they're considerations, but if they become realities, I would like to hear about it before >> So we often speak in terms of red, yellow, green proposals in terms of impact to families versus impact to our programs. So if you want to come in and say, here's how we can solve this problem and not raise incre- and not raise meals. And that's when you say, we could do that, but it would this is what it would cost in terms of our personnel. Or we could and I would very much support a proposal that said, here are multiple ways to solve this problem, and before you assume don't assume that we were going to go all the way to the red. Give us a chance to find a solution that's in the orange or the yellow. >> Yeah, I I totally agree and that's why we we are bringing this to to you now with because I thought again, you know, sticking to our staffing patterns and doing a modest price increase is the first step and then letting you guys know this is where we're at. They're ideas that we have, but we are definitely, you know, open to suggestions and and want your input as we move forward as well. >> May I ask for clarification on both those comments on Can you go back one slide so we can see it? The first one you're comfortable with. Or on us not to even do that one unless we come to the board first. >> I'll just speak for myself. I'm comfortable with the first and second bullet. The third bullet, I would just reduce it by one day. And those things I'm comfortable with you doing without coming to us. But if you need to go more than that, that's where I'm at. What do you think? >> what I would say is there's a very reasonable expectation that everyone should have. It's a reasonable expectation that when, you know, the number of meals go down, the staff go down. That's a reasonable expectation. Uh if we're not preparing a meal for wellness day, we're not going to pay you for that meal for wellness day. That's a reasonable expectation. But for someone to all of a sudden be told I'm going to be working less so that we can cut costs, that's not a reasonable expectation. That's something that I would like to be involved with. So, I would say where I'm at is make all the reasonable accommodations, but >> a good idea. when when you're going to hurt someone that has an expectation that that shouldn't happen, that's where I would say maybe come to the board and see if we can propose an alternative. >> Or or like work the same amount, but now you get paid less for what you have always been doing. That makes me really >> That's not a reasonable expectation. >> So, like if we were going to say now you don't have insurance, but we still have the same expectation of you. I really want to be involved in that. >> I I was under the impression though that the board has delegated these types of responsibilities to the superintendent and his staff. Hiring and firing, benefits, all those kinds of things are out of our We have delegated that, the hiring and firing, to the staff. >> Not necessarily, like >> isn't necessarily hiring and >> It is it's firing. >> Avery. >> Possibly. >> That's the >> It's letting people go. >> A reduction in forces. >> That's still our That's still our lane, I think. I mean, we did it for educators, our teachers. I'm not sure why we're not doing it for our support personnel. We have a riff policy. And we solved that problem by putting them in a sub league, and I'm wondering if we could if we had to let someone go, if there's some way we can reallocate them to somewhere else and and that they would be happy, you know, and and and put together a policy to help our support professionals in that kind of case. I mean, we can't guarantee all the time that there's you know, I I I had someone call me about a teacher that was recently um put in the riff, and you know, we can't always guarantee that there's a place in every school for everybody, but we can promise as a board, and I think this is our lane to do right with that employee and try to you know get them in another school or or get them a different position if they're willing to take it. >> My response to Oh, sorry. >> I agree with Brian. I think to me where this becomes relevant is because to get to a point we might then say we want to use general fund money to cover this. So, we're not making employment decisions, but we might choose to give money so they don't have to cut. That's where I see our role as. >> My response is the superintendent saying, "I have no choice but to do this." And the board says, "Right. Given your resources that's what you would have to do, but we're going to provide additional resources." That's why That's what I'm asking for. Is before the superintendent says, "I'm going to have to make these cuts and I have the power to do it. I have no other option given the circumstances." I would like him to come to the board to say, "Do you want to change my circumstances?" So, therefore I don't have to make those cuts. >> Especially where it's our decision on pay structure directly affects this budget, right? Like we tell them what they will pay. We don't give them an infusion of money like we might otherwise if we did a true thing. >> So, are they ESPs? Is that And so, whenever we vote to increase ESP pay, they have to figure out how to cover that. >> And I'll take that out a little further, right? The same would apply if a principal has used TSS A funds to hire someone. Then poof, now that costs more than you budgeted for because we we chose to increase benefit, but I think that's why we want to be cognizant, not why we want to stop increasing benefit. >> Thank you. That helped me greatly. Should we >> Do you need more Do you need a formal vote tonight? >> No, I want to, but it we just need the nod proceed. >> Wait with at least the price increase and just the planned uh riffs for next year, which fall in line with the staffing patterns of all the other schools. I would Why don't I take a motion? >> Before we do that, I I would like to have a motion to move forward, but a a regular vote in the general session. Because I don't like taking votes on things that I heard for the first time. >> Vote the Oh, we'll have to. Part of my intent was >> That part of the budget. >> that it would be part of the budget. But if if you want to do it separate from the budget, we can do that. >> That's the appropriate place. >> Either way, I would like to have I would like to be able to say to people So, I'm making the motion today, should I make it a motion that we move forward with the proposal that we've heard today on nutritional services be able to ratify that in a budget hearing. So, is that >> Is >> for the next screen shot there's a lot of prep work >> Clarify that real quick. >> Clarify. >> Because the proposal on that last slide was that we start reducing staff. >> Oh, we talked about that. >> Excuse me. Is that included in your motion? bringing those districts or those schools who are outside of the staffing pattern in line with what every other school who serve >> That That's outside of our realm, though. Isn't it? >> Yeah, she's just wondering are you including all of that in your mo >> Just the increase in meal prices. >> Increase in meal prices. I don't know that we have to tell you to reduce that. >> Where was the last slide that said Like the question, right? Like are you comfortable with this moving forward? What did that say? There we go. It's just the price increase that they're asking. >> my motion just to clarify is to move forward with the price increase and allow you to make the decisions you need to with the understanding that the board can support you in those decisions. So That's very clear. That's probably I don't know. Let's make the motion. >> I move that we accept the recommendation for the price increases and for the RIF according to your staffing model. >> Perfect. That's what we >> I'll second it. It's so much better. >> I can talk. We have a motion by Ms. Wood and second by Dr. Robinson that we begin moving forward with an increase in the costs of meals as well as appropriately aligning staff to the student population. Did that cover that? Okay. Um more discussion on that? Hearing none, all in favor please say I. >> I. >> And any opposed? Okay, that motion carries unanimously. >> Thank you. >> All right. Our next agenda item are calendar committee recommendations for proposed calendars for the 27-28 school year. That is next year. Um and these are just some edits because of state law, right? >> No, this is >> We have a couple of calendars. One is an edit to state law for the next school year. >> Not this year. >> And that's 3D, though. >> Oh, the next one down. Okay. Perfect. So, we will turn it over to Dr. Anderson and Mr. Olson. >> Thank you. Yes, we have a couple of agenda items regarding to the the calendar, but the first is going to review the proposed calendars for the 27-28 school year. And is here to explain that. We just appreciate the work he's done with the calendar committee. You'll see a lot of grids with numbers and letters on them, but really the calendars that are approved by this board kind of they're they represent the operational backbone for our community, I think, because people schedule work schedules around them, child care, vacations. Um, these calendars dictate even other other schools' calendars, um, other charter schools and private schools and and preschools and so forth. So, it really is a tremendous undertaking that Mr. Olson and his committee of employees and parents take on each year. We appreciate the the diligent efforts that they've they've had here, and with that, I'll turn it to Mr. Olson. >> All right. Uh, thank you so much for that introduction. As Dr. Anderson said, um, I'm here representing the calendar committee, which is made up of a parent from each feeder system, uh, representatives from GEA and JESPA, and, um, administration from each level, and we meet annually to come up with calendar options. Uh, our meeting this year was February 27th, and we have three options to present to the board. Um, just as a point of order, there are no Utah visible solar eclipses that occur during the 27-28 school year. >> Wait, wait, wait, wait. There is a ring of fire on January 26th, 2028. It is Thursday. Um it is in between Dirk Burton's birthday and Dan McKay's birthday, which are on the side, so >> Listening and anticipating. You got something brown on your nose. >> I'm having a hard time I'm having a hard time decide if I'm going to go to the Ecuador, Peru, Colombia party or the Northern Morocco party. >> 2045 right here. >> We don't want anyone to fall into a burning ring of fire, so we're going to have them in school on that day. >> Again, there are no some minor visible solar eclipses. >> you put the Utah visible in there. >> Uh I have this picture here to remind the board of a couple of things. Um those of you who have had a Thanksgiving know that there are multiple ways you can carve a turkey. Some of them work better than others, but no matter how you carve a turkey, there will only be two drumsticks. In that statement, substitute calendar for turkey and you hopefully understand the point I'm trying to make. I don't know what the drumsticks represent. There are lots of ways we can make calendars. There are not a lot of ways we can make calendars that everyone is going to like. The calendar committee does some wonderful work to create calendars that are functional and meet the requirements of state law and will work for the district. That doesn't mean they're the best calendar that everyone has ever seen. Um likewise, just as a Thanksgiving dinner is often a a point of contention for many families, calendars are a hot-button item and we have tried to as always respond to the needs of our community as part of the survey that we go through each year, we ask the community for their preference on a variety of items and we use those to influence the following year's calendar options as we create them. So, the the calendars proposed may not be the favorite of everyone who will take the survey, but they all work. Um there are also trade-offs and consequences for all of those. So, moving into those options. Option one to provide for you is the early spring recess option. Under this option, teachers would start back on August 10th. Students would begin on August 18th and 19th. Fall recess plus a grade transmittal day would take place on October 22nd through the 29th. Winter recess plus a professional development day, and I'll just call that out. We have the winter recess here at the end of December as usual. This January 3rd day would be a a professional development day, so it'd be a teacher work day, but it would not be a student day, just to kind of provide a transition back into uh January. That would last >> Where quarters are where quarters end. >> So, I will tell you right here. First quarter would end on October 21st and a grade transmittal day on the 22nd. Second quarter would end on January 14th after winter recess and that PD day with a grade on January 18th. >> January 14th or 4th? >> 14th. We would go into third quarter, which would last through into March with a grade transmittal day on the 24th, followed by spring recess, and fourth quarter would then last through to June 2nd. >> That's a lot of light days. >> So, it is a lot of light days. The reason for that comes up in our next agenda item, so you can hold that thought for a moment if you would. This is the early spring recess option because spring recess is early. Um that's all there is to it. Option two is the late spring recess option. I don't want to spoil it, but this is called this because spring recess is late in this option. For teachers, we would come back on the 9th with students beginning on the 17th and 18th of August. First quarter would go through October 15th with a grade transmittal day on the 18th followed by fall recess. Second quarter would then begin on the 25th continuing through we have a two-week winter recess again a professional development day on that one day back and the quarter would end on January 14th with a grade transmittal day on the 18th. Third quarter continues through to March 23rd with a grade transmittal day on the 24th and then after two weeks we have spring recess there in April. >> When is Easter? >> Easter in this calendar I believe is the 16th of April. I would have to double check but I believe it's the 16th so uh this is one of the years where it's quite late. Yes. School year would end on June 2nd. Okay? Option number three. This is a December semester change. Now before we get to too much into this option there are some trade-offs with this calendar and I will talk you through those in just a minute. Teachers would begin back on August 6th. To my knowledge this would be the earliest return back for teachers that the district has ever had. Students would begin on August 16th. This would only be the second time that we have started back on the 16th and it is the earliest start date we've had for students. So this calendar has an early start for teachers and for students. First quarter would last through October 13th with a grade transmittal day on the 14th followed by two days of fall recess on the 15th and the 18th. Again there are a lot of ways to carve the turkey but there's only so much turkey to go around. So as you make one choice there are other choices that have to accompany that. To make a a semester change in December, fall recess is shorter to make that happen. The second quarter begins on the 19th. In this option, we have a professional development day on November 1st. >> Thank you very much. >> Moving forward into December, this >> And on this calendar, >> this the quarter ends on January or excuse me, December 21st followed by a grade transmittal day on the 22nd. Winter recess continues through January 4th. Third quarter begins on January 5th. We third quarter would go from January 5th through to March 10th with a grade transmittal day on the 13th. We would then have 3 weeks of fourth quarter before spring recess. And the school year would end on Friday the 26th prior to Memorial Day. Now, I said I mentioned that there were some tradeoffs. Let me explain a few of those to you. To accomplish this, semesters and quarters cannot be equal lengths. We try very hard to prioritize making semesters equal whenever we can at 90 days each. There may be some variation. First and second quarters may be different lengths, third and fourth, but if we can have them equal 90, that's ideal because if you're a teacher who does a semester class, to have one semester have five or seven or eight extra days is difficult. This option, there is no way to accomplish that without having the school year start in July. It is very difficult to do. We are also bumping up against some limits for classes that have seat time requirements. Because first semester is so short, some of those classes will be very hard pressed to meet their seat time requirements in the class time that's available to them. >> How many days difference are we talking? >> Five. >> It's it's about five days. >> 25 and 95. >> Which doesn't sound like a lot, but it is a significant amount. The semester would end in December and come back in January. The Jordan District has not done that to my knowledge. It would be a significant shift that would require a good deal of of planning and adjustment. The last thing I would point out >> is the school year under this option ends on the Friday before Memorial Day. Now, that may sound appealing. However, the orphan districts of Alpine graduate that week. So, our ability to have graduation venues is significantly harder because instead of having a week to ourself, we are competing with three other districts. And competing with three other districts is really the case because right now Alpine can schedule their graduations however they want. But, that will no longer be the case because each district will want their own day. Also, as board member Robinson has mentioned several times, UHSAA spring sports are still in state tournaments at that point. So, you would be asking some students to make a choice between walking at graduation and completing in a state tournament. >> Why couldn't we push the last day of school to June 1st? And and then throw those three extra days in that long period of stretch of time in >> So, we absolutely could add days off somewhere. The feedback we have fairly consistently had is that parents don't enjoy random days off. It makes it tough to plan when there is just a Friday or just a Thursday and Friday that is not connected to something. That's one of the reasons why um for uh several years now for the fall uh conferences, we have split those so that when secondary are on their comp day, elementary has a teacher professional development day. So, on that Friday, no students are in attendance. The following week when elementary has their comp day, secondary has a teacher prep professional day. So, no students are in attendance to make it more consistent for families and easier to plan. Another way we've attempted to address that, this year was the first time we did it, February conferences, we have typically had secondary on the week before Washington and Lincoln Day with a comp day making a 4-day weekend. Elementary was the following week having Monday off and a comp day off on Friday, but then we had elementary and secondary with different schedules. This year we combined those into a single week so that all students had a common comp day on Friday and Monday off for Washington and Lincoln Day to try to minimize that. Um the other potential consequence that happens when we just add extra days off somewhere is everything else has to shift. So, a case in point, if we were to say, "Well, let's add uh 3 days off to the beginning of March." And on this calendar we put them on March 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. That then potentially pushes this the end of that quarter back by 3 days as well. So, the quarter would end on Friday. District policy requires that a grade transmittal day be the next school day after a quarter ends. So, the quarter would end on end on Wednesday, a grade transmittal day on Thursday where students don't attend, and a Friday where everyone is back in school. So, one of the common questions that one of the common flavors of questions that comes up is a a why don't you Why don't you just Why don't you just um >> But the great transmittal day is something that we can control, right? It's not mandated. In fact, this board has even talked about doing away with it at one time. >> They are in policy. >> They're in po- Well, is it policy? Cuz I thought we tried to get all that stuff out of the >> It is in policy. It's not negotiated, but it it is in detail as well. >> to get back to that. >> The The other thing to keep in mind is one of the ways Not one of how we tend to do the calendars in the committee is we start at winter recess and then work backwards to the start date and work forward to the end date. So, little shifts like that can have dramatic impacts one way or the other. So, uh we'll have some some option for other comment or feedback. Tonight, we're presenting these to the board prior to public survey. That survey survey will begin within the next day or two and run through April 27th. On the 28th, we will return with the results of that survey, provide a recommendation to the board for a calendar to approve and in business meeting ask the board to take a vote to approve a calendar option. >> Do you know that in none of these three calendar options are you giving any consideration to leap day? >> Is there a leap day this year? >> I'm against frogs, I think. >> Is it leap year? >> It is leap year. We're going to have to go to school on a day that's day doesn't exist. >> President Georgia might add you asked you asked about um Easter and there was a law that was passed this year that requires us to consider um Good Friday and other religious holidays. So, the committee will, you know, this that this didn't go into effect until after the committee met, but they do consider those holidays and as part of their as part of their process. >> They don't have to be a day off. We just have to >> We have to give it consideration. >> that it's a >> That's great. >> If we are able to schedule it as a recess, I that we do so. Um we have considered Good Friday for every year that I've been involved in the calendar. However, we also consider the results of the the community survey. And one of the the preferences in that survey is to have spring recess attached to the end of third quarter. And that doesn't always work with Good Friday. >> Talk to me more about the impact of having unbalanced semesters. How big of a deal is that to teachers? >> Big deal to teachers. We hear about that. >> So, we also hear that if the quarter ends and then I get my break, then I actually get to relax and enjoy the break. Which one will win in their priority list? Like would it be worth having unbalanced semesters to get those breaks because this does a good job of giving you a real break. It is a quarter. >> I would not presume to speak on behalf of a majority of teachers on such divisive issues. But I do believe that there are lots of teachers who start third quarter work during second quarter. They say, "Oh, by the eighth week, end of the eighth week of the quarter, all of this quarter's work is due and we start on the next quarter." So, I'm not sure that there's this void of work over the break regardless of how we structure things. I also have heard that if the semester break is right up against the um winter break. And of course other districts do that. It any of these options will work for some people. Just like we can't do we can do anything we want, we just can't do everything we want. We can please anyone, we just can't please everyone. And if we it if you picture the how hectic December is and then you add on top of that for students and teachers that there is a big deadline for a grade. I've heard that that creates a different type of stress even if you do get a break following that. But we talked about getting rid of the um we've talked various times over the years about getting rid of the grade transmittal days because then we have more flexibility in the calendar, but teachers have continually said I need that time to get my grades together and to to to kind of reset. So >> How many of them are actually in the building working on that day though? >> Some, always. There always some working. But I would say a a minority of teachers probably are in person, but there's some at every school that are there. >> And I believe the negotiated agreement doesn't require in-person work, so many may take advantage of the ability to work remotely. >> You mentioned something about um seat time, how how much time, what does that entail with the What is that about? >> So there are certain classes that we offer including many that are taught here in this building that have a set number of hours that they are required to hit in order to provide certifications or in order for students to qualify for for testing or for other other areas. Um Driver's Ed is a a great example. There are are a set number of hours that have to be hit. Some of those we have abilities to be flexible with if we were to add some virtual instructions. Some of them we do not. What we have tried to do um previously is to not have a quarter shorter than 43 days because that tends to be about as low as we can go or as low as as people have been comfortable with going. Um I believe we're lower than that in option one. So or excuse me, option three. So what is the potential impact? I will be honest, I have no idea. I just know it is an impact that that will come up. Um and it will be difficult for certain classes to address because of the loss of basically five days of instructional time. >> Like Driver's Ed, is that >> Well, that's one that we have some ability to be flexible with. Um I think it would be more of a concern for many of the CTE classes that are offered that have seat time and hour requirements that have to be met. >> Are there any of those semester long? Yeah, I think of the JROTC program >> I think there might be a horticulture one that is a semester. >> Semester engineering classes. >> Over there. >> One advantage of ending the school year earlier is you have more time before AP tests. Um so that's one that you'll you'll hear from an AP teacher, I think. >> Bryce, is there any way you can work with Utah High School Activities Association that they can change like a game because of two teams and graduation times? I think at that point you're down to like eight. >> They've made arrangements with the facility years earlier. >> Couldn't they shift like 3A and 2A around? And sometimes it's just a baseball field that >> We've probably talked a lot about it. The problem is we don't know until right then and there are so many other things at play. >> That's my biggest reason why I probably would >> I just don't think >> I don't think it's fair to the kid. I don't think it's fair to the school. I don't think it's fair to the parents. >> Yeah, we brought it we've talked about it many times, but when they walk through all the things at play and what would have to happen almost immediately as soon as we find out who's playing, it's nearly impossible. >> Some of them it's the night before, I know, like baseball. >> So, is what the board is to decide tonight if we want a survey to go out with all three or just some of the three? >> I'm really anxious about sending an option out to survey that we don't know the impact of. I love that one. I think this is what my constituents consistently ask me for. I see on calendar three. But if it's going to stop a student from being able to get a certification or the hours that are necessary, I'm really uncomfortable not knowing that before we send it out. >> For the past couple of years, the calendar committee has tried to make a a calendar that can do this. In some years it just doesn't work. So, um in this year a calendar was created that works. Again, as I mentioned, it doesn't guarantee that it's the best calendar. >> Or would be able to be a consistent one. So, we may end the semester one year, which means teachers have to revamp lesson planning and and calendaring and, you know, AP prep etc. Not to mention the holiday drives that we do in December that are so impactful in our schools. Um that's one of my chief concerns with that calendar as well. >> So, is the question whether or not we withdraw option three? Is that kind of >> That's my question. >> Or or ask it to be studied for a little bit longer. We don't have to send the survey out tomorrow, right? We can send it out in 2 weeks. And ask staff to really decide if this is an I think if you offer it to them and they pick it, we have to we have to do it. And so, is this really truly a an option we want to we want to send? >> I I think it's important um to it seems like option three is a little bit like the shorter fall break option. I mean, it's seems like other years it's been longer fall and spring break versus shorter fall and spring break. And um maybe it isn't important to have that, but I think I I'm interested to know whether people I like people to have the option of a shorter or a longer uh fall or spring break. >> ending before Is it Labor Day? Is such a big deal. So many people >> Yeah, a lot of people are really interested >> Memorial >> I have it Memorial. Thank you. >> I don't think I can pull off Labor Day. >> I never remember which is which. >> Yeah, if you get into school before Memorial Day >> Memorial somewhere. >> Or Labor Day. >> But um I think that is something that other districts have started to successfully implement, and I hear about it almost every year. >> I will say that this is the most hot-button issue that I hear the most about every single year. I started in January. I started comments from constituents. And so, I went and I looked up Canyons and Davis and Granite and Salt Lake just to compare. And And I know that this is very difficult for you and your committee, and there's so much to consider. And so, I'm not going to pretend like I know what that's like. That's got to be very hard. But, I don't I'd like to try to understand how these other districts are starting on >> You know. >> August 17th, getting out on May 27th. >> They're not starting on August 17th. >> Canyons for 2026-2027 starting school on August 17th and ending on May 27th. >> They might not have a 2-week >> They have 3 days for fall break. They have 2 weeks for winter and 5 days for spring. And so, I was just It's hard to wrap my head around. The calendar's so complex. And so, >> They have um grade transmittals? >> They have >> we're the only district that still has a grade transmittal day in that fashion. There are some districts that take the equivalent of our 6 days prior to the school year and sprinkle a few of those throughout the year for an equivalent purpose. The grade transmittal day does impact that. Having a shorter fall recess does impact that. Um because I think we have been the only one of the only, if not the only district in the state for several years that has done a week at fall recess. Um the survey that we do annually, having a longer fall break had 30% of patrons, which was the high highest single group who indicated that is like a great deal. Um so that's one that we try to do because it has has decent return. Co- um for comparison, having 2 weeks at Christmas, I believe is about 50% of patrons that they liked that a great deal. So that's why most all of these options have 2 weeks at Christmas because that tends to be something that uh the community enjoys. So we try to >> I seem to remember last year we gave them a similar option of getting out bef- by Memorial Day, and it >> It was very >> Oh, was it? Okay. And I I I don't know the minds of the um district employees, but I think that um a lot of district employees like the option to take a vacation, a meaningful type of vacation, for fall break or spring break, um as well as the the winter break. So anyway, it seems like people consistently, at least since I've been on the board and have had kids in school, have opted for the longer break options. >> Everyone I pretty consistently hear from constituents a distaste for is 2-day school weeks. And I mean these calendars do a good job of avoiding those. >> Because we have to get 180 days in cuz someone decided like 50 or 60 years ago that 180 days is the number of days we should go, and if we went 179, that's not good enough. Anyways, enough of that. And that was serious. Some of my comments are sarcastic, but another serious one that I wanted to bring up is I hear that our teachers are not real happy with wellness day in February. They'd rather have it later in the year like April or May. Now, this got to be new teachers because I remember February was the hardest month ever in the beginning of my career and I'll just tell you this last February was the best February. So, have we explored if wellness day is the best day and should we and can we? I'm just passing that on from people I've that have passed it on to me. I like where it's at, I think, but >> But, the superintendent speak to exactly the placement, but I would point out I have option two up here on the screen. You'll notice that spring break goes through April 14th, which is the second week of April. That is about as late as we can have a a vacation day without causing impacts to testing to AP testing and other things. We We have on occasion had a professional development day that's on the third Friday of of April. Um a few years ago we tried >> day. >> It was Godfrey and Larson day and the name did not catch on, but um we've we've tried some other things, but the putting an extra day in May is is pretty much non-negotiable because there just is is too much else that happens. >> April 14th, which is that third term has started. I mean, I actually don't think the fourth term is very long. It goes by so fast. It's >> I think in April you can see the light at the end of the tunnel. Um in February the days are short and dark and it's difficult to see the light. >> Literally. >> I I like where it's at, but I have had people say that I should we should explore that. So, I don't I'll leave that in your hands. >> I I take that feet as uh an indication that they value health and wellness day and wanting on the best day possible >> I'm not hearing anyone say they don't want it. >> I I and I think there's a good argument for April, but I think February for me wins the day just because of the it's after the second semester has started and it's distant from um spring break and from the end of the year and >> Yes, it's not so much about wellness day as having a holiday or having a day off later April, early May is what they were asking for and they don't understand clearly the impact of testing. So, but anyways, I just wanted to pass that >> Can I make a motion? >> Sure. >> I move I move that we approve option one and two for surveying and option three pending further confirmation that it will not conflict with credits, etc. >> I will second that. >> I'll second it. >> A motion by Ms. Wood, a second by Ms. Barrow that we approve options one and two for survey and option three is approved pending um it not interfering with student certifications and other needs. Did I say that right? I don't know. Okay. More discussion there? >> So, will we as a board want the information back be for or or will do we want um >> That's what I was going to ask. >> like or to um decide what the impacts would be. >> I would be comfortable with an email saying this will not hurt a kid or cut. >> I I feel comfortable with just an email also and then move forward if >> So do I. Anyone have concerns with that? >> Clarify the email. Is that a email saying it does therefore we are not going to survey on calendar three or it does not and we look at it looks like we can move forward with option three. It's not a decision by the board. It's just us saying upper down. >> Yeah, this either does or does not critically impact classes. So and by critically impact I'm saying like oh now only first semester kids are able to get their certification but second can that's reversed. >> The email does that come from superintendent who's going to >> I'll send it to you. >> It's totally up to him if he feels that we can pull it off yes and if not no. >> I'm happy to send this out just because it's different and it feels like a real option but not if it hurts a kid. Okay. We haven't voted yet. I was just making sure. I'm looking for anxious people reaching for a microphone. Okay. All in favor of the motion please say I. I. Anyone opposed? Okay, that motion carries unanimously. Thank you for your work on this. It's fun work but it's hard. Okay, but don't leave because our next agenda item rolls right in to calendar committee recommendations for proposed revisions to the 2026-27 school year calendars. Dr. Anderson and Mr. O >> One of the bills that passed in this legislative session was SB 58. Among other things, SB 58 changed the definition of an instructional day. I mean, to be considered an instructional day, there now must be scheduled periods with direct instruction between a teacher and a student. This impacted health and wellness day because previously we had counted that as an instructional day because instruction was provided and made available to families. With that change, we have to make an adjustment to the calendar for next year to be able to continue and we have to also make calendars to or adjustments to the calendar options that we are presenting for survey. That change was already made to the calendar options that you just saw, but we have a a proposal for the change to next year because it is a previously approved calendar that needs to have an adjustment. So, the current calendar is there at the top. Again, I would point out that this is February of 2027 that we're speaking about. We have health and wellness day scheduled for the 5th followed by the combined conferences, parent-teacher conferences, with a combined student and teacher compensatory day and Washington and Lincoln Day. We skip over March and in April, there was a teacher professional teacher professional development day scheduled on April 16th. In consultation with cabinet and looking at our options, the proposal that we have is to take that teacher professional development day from April and move it to health and wellness day. So, health and wellness day would become the fourth of the four days we are allowed to convert from regular instructions to a day for teacher professional development or preparation. So, that would make a longer stretch in April where there is not a professional development day. And to Vice President Dunford's comment on, I believe, option one, that was why on that option there was no PD day scheduled in April because it had been relocated to health and wellness day. Now, this may have impacts on future calendars. You saw that just by happenstance, option two uh disconnected spring recess from the end of quarter three. We may see that happening more often on calendar options to provide a a break into April. Um spring recess can feel awfully early when it starts in March. And we may see that happening in in calendars where it's feasible. So, that is the change as proposed. It would require a vote in a business meeting, which we would want to happen on April 28th. One of the reasons why this needs to happen on April 28th is state law requires that when instructional days are converted to use as a professional development day or a teacher work day, they have to be done in a public meeting uh that is more than 90 days prior to the start of the school year. That 90-day window is mid-May. So, the April 28th business meeting would be the last opportunity to make that uh to have that vote take place. >> I love our health and wellness day. I'm I want to put that out there before I say what I'm about to say. But, would it be worth surveying teachers on if they love it enough to give up a professional development day? Is this going to shift it from this treat to Well, now I have to choose if I'm >> We didn't used to give them the professional development day. By law, we were always able to do four and we didn't do four until COVID. We did one. We used to not even do one. >> I didn't know that. >> It's only since COVID that we used all four. Yeah. >> So, what you're saying is it gives them just more options for that day. >> Yeah. The law The law says 180 days and four professional development days if we want to use them, and we used to not give any, and then I think it was the testing day that we decided to work something out, and then I think when COVID came, we decided let's take all four. So, there's probably a um with so many new teachers, probably there's a um feeling that we're entitled to this cuz it's been given, but I think your old-time teachers would realize that >> We can certainly survey. We can certainly survey them on that. >> I don't know that we I I would love to hear other If others aren't concerned, then don't do it on my account is what I'm trying to say. So, they'd have maybe health and wellness day, and then two professional development days since we've got three. Is that correct? >> Right. And the way the professional development day is currently structured is that principals have from 8:00 to noon to present. Is it 4 hours or 3? >> It's in the morning. >> It's 3. Yeah, you're right. As soon as I said it. So, they have from 8:00 Principals have from 8:00 till 11:00, and the rest is supposed to be left for teachers. So, this takes away that professional development at the school level in the afternoon time. To help offset that and to respond to concerns that we've had from elementary principals, we would have or an elementary teachers, rather. We would suggest or we would ask principals not to have PLC time that health and wellness day week and instead allow for prep during PLC time to give a little extra prep before that health and wellness day. Because health and wellness day has been an instructional day the day before, we have not had a shortened schedule like we do normally the last day of the week in elementary because Thursday was not the last day of the week. Monday was the last day of the week. But we would try to give some prep time by saying PLCs this particular week just um allow for some prep time to offset that. But we could certainly survey and say would you prefer a health and wellness day or would you prefer a professional development day? >> I I would be curious about that. How do teachers feel? >> I don't have strong feelings either way, so whichever way the board wants to go. >> I'd be shocked if they said no, but if they did, then we shouldn't not be providing it like >> It's a lot of work. >> I think the thing that has really set it apart in the minds of teachers is like, holy cow, this is a Some of that impact might be diminished, but I don't think all of it is. So maybe we don't survey, but we just keep our ear to the ground for future decisions. >> Hey, address two items, uh President George. One of the it moving health and wellness day from February comes up frequently in the committee. One of the reasons that um I have provided to the committee after talking with Dr. Withers and others is health and wellness day now having been done for 5 years, correct? Um has a significant amount of community support for our educators. And that support becomes easier to build and to count on when it happens at the same time each year. So, it moving health and wellness day in a lot of ways would would be leaving behind 5 years of of growth and support that we have built up. The second item to mention uh Board member Barrow, you you mentioned three professional development days. There are four um and if I may explain that for the thousands of people watching the stream because it does come up quite frequently. This is the current school year calendar. The first of the professional development days is why high school starts one day earlier. So, the 19th was a professional development day for elementary school and grades 8 and 9 and for 7th grade teachers in the afternoon. We have 7th grade orientation that morning which we make them hold on at the end of the year because 7th graders don't come on the last day of school. So, they get equivalent amount. High school starts a day early because high school has two days in the year where only a portion of the school attends in the morning and they split their PD day into those two afternoon sessions. So, that's where high school gets their first day. The second day comes in conferences where we have the split PD day. So, there's day two. On this calendar, day three was at the beginning of March and day four is this Friday. So, there have always been four during the time that I've been involved. It's just some of them take a slightly different form and are broken up or split or not everyone in the district is having a PDD at the same time. >> Thank you for explaining that because I was curious about November 10th and March 16th and what those days were about. >> So, can I ask an unrelated question, but pertinent? Does that mean a snow day is really a snow day now? >> No, the law. Um we appreciated that Senator Fillmore listened to feedback he received that, "Hey, sometimes we have to call a snow day. Sometimes at Bingham years ago, we had a pipe burst or I can't remember what the issue was and so we needed a virtual day. So, you can have an emergency virtual day for very narrow purposes, but not as part of your scheduled calendar unless you are a virtual school. >> So, in your review, you will do the same >> Yes. Any natural disaster does the trick. Arranging a natural disaster in 68 schools on precisely the same day would be difficult to arrange. >> Might be a >> Or not desirable. >> Also, might not build relationships with our legislature. >> A motion? >> I move that we accept the new draft for the calendar 26-27. >> Second. >> A motion by Ms. Woods, second by Ms. Dean to accept >> No, no, Ms. Barrow. >> Oh, so Ms. Barrow, goodness. See what's happening? Um anyways, uh Ms. Barrow, that we accept the draft of the calendar that has been presented. Um any more discussion to that motion? Hearing none, all in favor, please say I. >> I. >> And any opposed? Motion carries unanimously. >> For clarification, uh, you're saying that you approve it to go to the next meeting. I'd rather not to approve >> Formally approve it. Yeah. >> Thank you for that clarification. All right. Let's move on to agenda item 3E, a discussion on videos regarding school finance, and we will turn it to Ms. Wood. >> And do I need to present my presentation or does somebody else pull that up? It's attached to board book. Do you mind? Unless there's a way for me to >> so. >> connect my laptop. So, um, I first want to acknowledge, uh, the time and expertise given to this effort by Mr. Larson. It could not have happened without him. Um, so, very grateful for his investment in that in this uh, I've just got a brief presentation and then some feedback we'll be asking uh, from board members on next steps. So, I wanted to start off by just kind of clarifying what the objectives of this effort are, and um, make sure we're all aligned. So, feel free to provide feedback on that. Um, yeah, thanks. There we go. So, uh, fundamentally, an objective is just to clarify misconceptions um, by the public about the complexities of school funding, to build trust by giving them information and being transparent, and uh the hopes that it would improve community members' engagement in the processes, discussions, and decisions on school funding that we make going forward. So, here are some of the things uh as we've been formulating a list of topics and scripts, um a desire to be unbiased, um as unbiased as possible in this delivery, accessible to all. So, part of the process for this was I I was given information from John about school finances and work that had been done previously. I edited this draft script, and then I put it through AI and asked AI to put it at a fourth-grade level in hopes that that would be the appropriate level for a broad audience to understand very complex concepts. Uh the script length, the goal is under 3 minutes. As you can imagine, because of the complexity of school funding, this is a challenge in and of itself. Um so, that is the goal. We'll see how close we get to it. Um but generally, we have a sense that the preference is for short videos, even if that means more of them are produced rather than long ones. Uh engaging graphics. Well, I don't know if it's possible, it's appealing to consider the whiteboard animation that you may be familiar with. Evergreen content. We just want to keep this timeless so that it doesn't quickly become outdated. So, anything we can do in the script that will last the test of time is preferred. And then adult narration and if possible maybe an AI narration so that if a script needs to be changed, it can be easily changed and that narration updated without having to re-record an entirety of a script. Any questions so far or any additions to these objectives or considerations? Okay. >> Question. >> Yes. >> On the first slide or the clarifying the purpose slide um I was curious you I I don't get a lot of questions about taxes. I'm just curious do other people I mean is there is there like a lot of I'm just I guess I'm questioning what's the audience? Is this is this overkill? Is there not too many people interested in this? Uh along those lines. >> Question. I don't get I don't personally get lots of questions. I get lots of misinformation or assumptions. And then it's difficult to explain the complexities of property taxes that per- perhaps this bid had nothing to do with property taxes. >> Mhm. >> I I get a lot I solicit stuff. Um and I get a lot of even legislators who don't understand it. Um and have misquoted to me their understanding of the of the law. And even when Mr. Larson gave us a presentation in our last board meeting or two board meetings ago he enlightened me like how business property tax works that I didn't have that understanding. So, I think what my purpose of what I really wanted is a unification between our stakeholders, our patrons, and us, and legislators of understanding what this tax is, and who's levying it cuz lots of times when your taxes go up, they want to blame the Jordan School Board, but it's not. It's the legislator, and they don't understand pass-through taxes that go to charter schools, and so there's a lot of things that And I I think it's part of our responsibility is to explain this is how the money's being taken, this is how the money's being used. So, I I think it's I think it's part of what who we are is to explain what we're doing with your money and why we're taking it. There's a lot of angry people with property tax. >> So, the the one of the purposes of this would be when someone asks us questions or makes comments that we think aren't quite accurate, we would email them a link to one of these videos. Is that kind of how we're envisioning it? >> work that way. Mhm. >> Could could be there, and I think this there's an appetite for this statewide, but nobody's really leading out on it. I think this is big topics in USBA conferences recently, and as we've attended there, um a few districts have tried a little bit, but nobody's led out on this, and I would love it if we got it going, and then other districts either jumped in to assist us cuz it's this is common information statewide, right? Um maybe how we spend the money would be unique to us, but how we get the money would be very common throughout the state. And so, I would hope that USBA or USBE or other districts would jump in and and help create a bigger understanding of property tax. I I love it, but I do love it a lot more than when I was just the patron cuz I understand it a lot better. >> And I would also suggest a possible use for these videos could be in anticipation of something coming up. So, when we know we're about to review the budget or when the WPU gets announced, that whatever is happening, it's helpful to just have something that goes out on social media or parent square or whatever to just say, "Hey, you might be interested to know da da da." Um so that you can kind of stop some of the misinformation before it starts when it's pertinent to the people being affected. >> I don't know about stopping it, but curb it. >> One of the things people were most angry when we had our big tax increase is businesses also had really bad year. So, 8% of that increase was businesses were failing everywhere cuz out of COVID. And so, like, we got the blame for the whole share, not just our part in raising it. And so, and we get no inflation increase, which bugs me. But, anyways. >> Any other questions before we move on? So, I've I have a list of about 12 to 15 potential topics. Uh these are the top three that seem to be good ones to start with or to consider starting with. Uh I'd be happy to share the entire list with the board if there's interest, but um my intention today is to see where the board stands, not just on the videos generally, but on the topics I have attached the a draft for each of these scripts. It's not a final draft. It is a work in progress, but I think it's come a long way in a short amount of time. Um to see what the board prioritizes out of these three and how you'd like to proceed. One of the things that I've realized is tricky is there you can introduce some general topics and it almost requires a follow-up video to give more detail to feel like it's more comprehensive or more accurate. Um I don't know that any of these three necessarily require it. Um but they are all interrelated. >> But like I felt like these three were pertinent to each other. >> Mhm. Flowed well. >> Super good place to start. >> So if we were to choose one, does the board have a sense or an opinion on the one to start with or would you defer maybe to Mr. Larson's judgment or communications? >> For me, the most important >> written one on that list right now is property taxes versus sales and income taxes in Utah. I feel like that's what people are hearing from their legislators. That's what legislators are reporting people are complaining to them about. So for me that feels really um relevant to today. >> So if we want to if we want to go to the next step, just some some potential future steps. If the board wants to proceed, we would decide on which script uh and a timeline where we would want a final product, so the communications team knows under what time frame they're working uh and that we could review a a final product before it's distributed. I list a few different ways that it could be distributed. And then my sense is after we have one that's published we assess how how much resource consumption was there, how much did it cost in time etc. Are there any changes we'd like to make to the production process? And then do we want to continue or have a one-and-done? Thoughts on that process? Any steps missing or other considerations? Would you like to proceed and ask communications to start working with us on one of these scripts and producing a video for our review. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Do we want to do the um property taxes versus sales and income taxes first? >> I think so. >> Great. >> My thoughts is that um these three topics are so interrelated, I I kind of fear one video will leave enough out that it will itself be misleading. >> Mhm. Do you think the other two would you recommend we produce three at a time or is there just one out of those? >> Or what if we just do property taxes? Instead of property taxes, sales taxes, and income taxes. Cuz the idea is understanding your property taxes and local schools. That alone is a hefty lift. But to do property taxes and sales tax and income tax, you're not going to do property tax appropriately. >> But go ahead. >> I'll work on this. >> Scott's already talked to me about it, too. He's so now they're uh personnel. Um the I think between these three, I think it covers it. And I think that what we dive into sales tax just enough and income tax just enough that it's okay cuz the the the main focus is on property tax, but it's trying to separate from taxes that are easier to understand because they're uh frequent. And they're a little they're designed in a simpler fashion. So I I think between the three, we cover property taxes pretty well. I'm just worried about the idea of releasing one and not the other for fear someone's going to say, "Well, but you And then it in and of itself, a video becomes incomplete without the other information. >> And and even when we have three, I I do wonder if we need a disclaimer that says something like, "This video is not intended to be be of all the complexities and multiple factors in school funding. >> I would love that. >> task >> Or even at the end of the video say, "Future videos will include these." To say we recognize we've left some some material out and we intend to address them. >> I'm happy to do a teaser of, "You'll hear more about this in video four." But only if we do video four. You know what I mean. >> Yeah. I am nervous about committing beyond these three until we but I And perhaps I'm too close to this, but I I want something that's complete enough that I feel like it doesn't misrepresent either. >> But these would be the top three. If you were to choose three, these would be them. Dr. Godfrey. >> Those who are uh teeming with anticipation, you could go back a couple of board meetings and listen to a rather lengthy uh um exposition on district finances. >> We could link that. >> I'm pointing out that we do This is not our our only time to talk about it. And I would rather talk, I know we're not wordsmithing, about what it is rather than what it isn't. Not that we've left a lot out cuz we have It's a short video. It's like, "This is an overview of the general concepts around this. For more information, watch for future videos instead of part X." And then see where that takes us. We also I think that our audience is mostly people who are wanting some clarification or curious, not those who are looking for a deep deep dive. >> Mr. Van Goumen. >> I I think on the second topic for one, I think it's it's not really the message that we're trying to say. We're trying to point out that property tax is tax neutral. And you're really not you The only way you're receiving more property tax as a district is because of growth, but that's not the message that you're sending. It I think what you're trying to say is why are my property taxes different? >> This was tricky. I've changed this title three or four times because we're the question actually that's we're attempting to answer is why did Jordan get 1.5 million this year when they got 1 million last year? That's that video is about why did the total that that we received increase if in video one you talked about revenue neutrality. >> But don't we only get to keep, right, a certain amount? If we collect more, we have to pass it on. I don't know if that's accurate. >> But that's that makes my point. >> Yeah. I'm curious if board members are comfortable if our pilot is a three-part series. >> I'm I'm all in. I No one else is doing this. So, let's step forward and do it. And then more people will do it, and then we can link to each other's, but I I am all in. Let's be the district that educates the public. >> I do like this a lot. I loved the three scripts. I did have a couple, you know, questions or input on some of them, but we are a education entity, and I would love to educate our public on this topic, and I feel like we would need all three of these because as I read a script, and then I read the next one, I'm like, oh yeah, these these connect. This helps me have a bigger picture. So, >> I think a lot of things are aligning, too, because we have a brilliant business administrator, a very effective communications team, and a board that very much wants to educate the public. And so, I think we're all in. >> I do think that there's a good possibility that when districts see what it is, that others might start helping carry the load. I think USBA could potentially say, "Oh, that's what you meant? Yeah, let's do that." It was on a like a a survey that had a list of items and you got to prioritize them. And it just didn't hit the priority cut off. So, it is something that's being discussed at USBA and I think like Dr. Robinson said, a great way to lead out. >> So, part of the intention was to keep it district neutral. Not Jordan specific. Out of all of the potential future content topics we have, I think only one is Jordan specific and it's just says it's how do Jordan School District taxes compare in 2026? So, that one would be the most narrow. Um but if we're looking at context So, >> Do we want to put our logo in? >> Well, that's that that would be phase two. We're still in phase one. >> There's no question we brand it. >> Brought to you by >> Oh, you mean the video? The videos as well. >> has to say >> Jordan logo on every >> Jordan leads the way or something. Like your district won't do this. >> I think we'd want to Actually, should we write that on there? >> Just what we need. Everyone moving to our corner of the valley. >> Yeah. >> Everyone's buying school lunch. >> Wait a minute. >> I think it would behoove us to at least say produced by >> Well, for sure. >> or provided by. >> Jordan School District, taxing you since the early 1950s. >> Any other feedback? Feel free to email me with feedback. Um if the board agrees, we will go ahead and once we feel the script is ready for communications or working with communications on a final script because it does need some finessing that only our communications team can lend it, then we would go ahead and produce it and then talk again once we provide that to you. Does that sound >> Also open to if if communications has needs, like they want to add a program to their arsenal or something like that, I am open to that. Like if it costs a little bit of money to do this. I don't want them to not do the job they wanted to do because they were trying to do it for free. But I'm only 1/7 of a brain. >> I agree. >> Dr. Godfrey, any other direction that you think the communications team will want that we have not provided? >> May have missed this. When do you want the three videos to be completed? >> Thank you for circling back to that. We have not decided on a timeline. I don't personally have one. Does the board have something in mind? >> They perhaps give us an estimate, like you can lay it out for them. This is what we're thinking. How long do you think that would take you guys reason? >> So the message would be we have no firm timeline. Tell us what you think is reasonable and >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Cuz in terms of cost, the only cost I predict is if it needs to be done within a certain amount of time and we don't have the bandwidth to do it without outside help. But if we have some flexibility time-wise, no one we ever hire does this the folks have internally. So, and I'm not talking long periods of time. I think I'll get an estimate from them. And just say, "This is when we think we could have that in place." >> When you said that, I was thinking of like it was suggested to use one of those whiteboard doodle programs or something like that. >> I see. >> If they want something like that and they don't have it, >> stock footage, >> Yeah. >> back back ground music. They find that for free mostly. But, >> voice, I'm >> Yeah. That for free. >> There you go. That's right. >> volunteers >> Dr. Godfrey, they have a one a colored doodle now. It's pretty cool. I bought it. It was like $75 for a lifetime subscription, but they might want to consider it would be cool if it was created in a way that what I like about the doodles is every time you'd see one, you'd recognize, "Oh, yeah, that ties to the other one." But, doesn't have to be that, but I would like and they're good at this. I would like it to be something that even if they didn't see the logo, they'd know it's they would know it's part of a series. >> It's helpful. >> I like Friday I like Friday fun facts. You know how they branded that years ago. >> Brenda, thank you for your work on this, Ms. Wood, and Mr. Larson and whoever else was also helping. I >> I did want to say I did consult with Dr. Anderson in part to make sure that we were being sensitive to our community partners and not misstating or saying things in such a way that might harm those. So, appreciate that feedback. >> I think it's always a wise move to consult with Dr. Anderson. Okay. Um, and and Dr. Godfrey, do you feel like you have what you need on that? >> I do. Thank you. >> Okay, let's move into a review of the 2026 National School Boards Association Conference. Um five board members were able to attend a conference over this last weekend um focused on being better board members and um increasing outcomes for our students. So, we wanted to give some time to report back on that experience. Anyone want to go? >> I'm happy to go first. Uh just a few highlights. I went to a couple of sessions about that were about superintendent, business administrator, and board relationships, roles uh and responsibilities. And just a couple of highlights was about creating an environment where there's no surprises. So, where possible, asking questions ahead of board meetings to those who might be presenting or or letting them know what questions or if you have opposition, to give courtesy um to the superintendent or business administrator on those items. Um encouraging participation from every team member in board meetings and assuming the best of intentions. I also wrote down a question for myself, do you dominate the conversation? That was a question they suggested we ask ourselves. Um specifically for the business administrator, this presenter recommended getting to know the why and understanding the challenges, including the laws and the regulations and referring to the BA as a as a resource for the board. Um the question that I'm still pondering was, what does it look like to take the board to the next level? However we're functioning, what's the next level to become more effective or cohesive or what it might be. Um one school district that was um not much smaller than ours talked about um not only creating their strategic action plan, but also doing a comprehensive policy audit, which took them a year to do. Um part of that was updating board operating procedures to ensure consistency consistency. And they recommended a book that I had just purchased not long ago, but I haven't started yet. I don't know if any of you have read it, but the Governance Core 2.0. So I've elevated that on my next to read list. It's about school board superintendents and schools working together. And those are my highlights. >> I'll go next. >> I don't know why we're all just jumping and ready to talk. >> Um I am very grateful I was able to go and do some professional development at this conference. Um I had a really wonderful time meeting people from across our nation. I met people from Oklahoma and New York and Kansas and Washington and Arizona and Kentucky and California and Texas and Delaware and Michigan. And I had a lot of fun writing their names down and their states so that I could remember, you know, help me remember them and um I met someone who served on their school board for 41 years, and I met someone who's only served for 4 months. So there was a wide range. Um but the whole conference was very eye-opening and educational for me to see what other districts are doing, the struggles they have, and the strengths that they have. And every class um gave me something to think about, and I've walked away with questions about how we're doing something compared to what I heard, uh to ask questions about maybe what are some hurdles we have that um we can help with, areas um areas to strengthen, and maybe how we could even collaborate more with legislators. Um but there were just a few kind of quotes that stood out to me that I took from some of the sessions. Uh I got to go to a session put on by the San Antonio Independent School District, and they talked about leading with emotional intelligence, uh specifically using the acronym HEART, which is to hear, empathize, apologize, respond, and thank. And they had gone through a right-sizing of their district, where they eventually ended up needing to close 15 of their campuses, which was crazy, but to hear their process and how engaging they were with their community and leading with heart was was really cool to hear. Um there was a two keynote speakers I was able to listen to, and they were both really great. One talked about gratitude and respect, and how gratitude fosters resilience in our uh students and in ourselves. Um Oh, I went to a class on um our students with disabilities and LRE, least restrictive environment. And that one was really educational for me. And there was a quote they gave that said, "Every system is perfectly designed to get the results it gets." And so just to be intentional with our policy and um our actions and and just reflecting on potential biases that might uh unintentionally be, you know, inhibiting our students or staff. Um that was a really good one to help me reflect. Um The one of the keynote speakers was Brandon Fleming, and he is the author of Miseducated, uh a really wonderful educator himself. But he had lots of wonderful things um that he taught us. A quote he said was that, you know, stories change people more than information ever will. And I really like that. I feel like we have been told that time and time again in communicating with legislators to tell them stories of our students and our teachers to help them understand what's going on in our school district. Um and in just communicating with everyone. He mentioned the the phrase that uh we might not have a content issue, but we have a connection issue. If students are disengaged or something that education and is a lot about connection, not just content. So I I appreciated that. He mentioned the 30 70 or 70/30 framework where our decisions are 70% emotional and 30% logical. I thought that was interesting and um but there were lots of wonderful things that I got from it and will be ruminating on and researching and uh so I'm really grateful I was able to attend. >> You want me to go ahead? >> Yeah. >> Cuz I mine's somewhat I went to a different class, but it's a national trend to close schools. Like it's happening everywhere. I was shocked with that. Even little districts in our state, Park City closed one. Murray's closing some. Provo told me they are. Even Lake Mountain is closing some and and and then nationally it's huge. It's big. It's it's because of the demographics and stuff everywhere. And so um Littleton School District put on one called From Empty Desks to Full Dreams. It was transforming school closures into community connections. So one thing they said is we're going to close schools, make it more efficient, but we don't want to give up the properties cuz we don't know what the next trend's going to be or what we're going to need. They want to be very careful before they give it up. So they actually went into um went into closing this school as a and turned it into community center and work with the community, the county, and I thought that was a brilliant idea. Um I would hope as we look at closing schools in our own district that we not only just look to closing it, but what are we going to do with the school after? That should be part of the decision of closing is what are we going to transform that into? And um I think this is going to be on our plate for a while. Um we're lucky, I think, because compared to other districts, I don't think we have as big of a problem in this. But I do think that if we're not continually working at this, it will become like other districts where they have to close huge handfuls. There's some people that are closing double digits in schools instead of one here, one there. I thought that was pretty interesting. Um I was very interested in the title of this. I didn't realize the speakers, but breaking the burnout cycle, supporting educators mental health and um the great people in education. I got in and I realized I knew a lot of this stuff cuz it was the Cook Center for Human Connections and we had connected with them very early and they they they said a lot. They didn't use our name, but they used reference that they had used this. But one of the things that they really brought up that is a huge concern to me is the burnout rate and turnover among our leadership. Cuz we always think about teachers and we have a wellness day for teachers and stuff, but uh I think our leaders need some help. I I remember once we said what can we take off teachers' plates and we started working on that. That I I think that we need to have some conversations of what can we take off our leaders' plates. Uh turnover around uh with superintendents is um is way higher than in Fortune 500 clubs. So a tur a superintendent nationally lasts 2.7 years. A uh CEO lasts 7.5 years. So 78% of all superintendents focus says that their work um is often or always stressful. Now, ours are probably never stressful, but um I'm super concerned not just I mean, they should have a life outside of work and they should also take care of their health. So anyways, that was just something that was really, really important to me. Um I went to Andro Andrew Edels' class. He's a Canyons School District. He taught it at the USBA about working smarter with artificial intelligence as board members. And I went mostly just to support a good friend, but he taught me a lot more. Like he'd picked up two or three good hints of like using Notebook LM, which is one that I'm now starting to look at. And my Facebook posts were all AI generated. Not all, but a lot were general were were done live as they said something cool. I would just say, "Hey, put this in there." And it just did save me a ton of time. And figuring out how to work more smart with me. Um another couple classes I took together, and I took this with Amber Shill. Um we both went to the same ones, but the power of partnerships with uh career accelerated programs. So, these are cap programs where districts work directly with businesses, and then they align students with businesses to do internships. Um I saw Wasatch School District um do this. I went and looked had first-hand experience when I was working on my doctorate, and I've always wanted to have something like this. I know that we have some things in the same area, but nothing like a CAPS program. Um when I was talking with Park City, they go, "Oh, you think Wasatch is good? Come see ours." So, I I want to go see like who else has a CAPS program and how we could accelerate that with the next class that we both went to is the career and technology education in an age of acceleration. And just what our J Tech programs can be. And it was really cool just to hear almost an affirmation that hey, uh we're doing a great job with this. Years ago, we looked at what kind of things we could do to have innovative schools and we found out that we have it and it's called JTech and um I would be really interested working on expanding that and giving more opportunities to kids. I think that's the future. Um the keynote speakers uh for whatever reason did not um excite me and even the last one at first didn't but when you all you all left Zach Cass like he rocked it. He was uh one of the heads of Open AI and he's a AI futurist which I think I am and he kind of saw his vision of what it was and he's alarmed with like cell phones among kids and he's for a bell to bell and wants to get rid of social media and some of these things but he also just talked about some really cool things that I think is like if AI is going to do these things for us cheaper and better what are we doing with the extra time? He advocates for a smaller work week. He thinks that we should be working maybe 30 hours a week and that time should be devoted with family and friends and and your well-being of your life and so um AI is just here to stay. It's not going to go away. We can't close our eyes and it's going to go away but it's going to do a lot of things for us. I know my wife uh tomorrow will end her 36th year of doing taxes and um as an accountant and she told me this year has been the very easiest cuz she's been able to use AI in preparing taxes and um as we move into this we need to not only learn how to use it right but um what our future should be and we need to be on the forefront and so that we can shape that future and not let that future shape us. He writes a new book called uh New Renaissance which I'm excited to read. So anyways that was probably like one of my favorite and I think Nikki prob- and Aaron I all knew that like I wasn't too excited about that at at first. And when you all left, that that was really a pretty exciting presentation. But anyways, um >> Aaron, we only heard about 5 minutes by the time NSBA. >> As you were leaving, I thought, "Oh, is this the guy? Like, is this the main guy?" And I will say that um overall, like the classes are really good. I don't like the politics of this organization. It's getting worse and worse. Um I think we're the only conservative state that's involved with these guys anymore because all the other conservatives left. I didn't really like a lot of the political rhetoric. Um I wouldn't mind trying a couple others. Um I don't know if it's this year or next year, but um even NSBA does one called Cube, which Canyons District did last year. And there's another one that's called the COSSBA, cuz we can't just call it what it is, but it's the Council of School Business Administrators. And they do a little bit more collaborative work instead of instructional work, kind of like we do. And so, this is the break-off group um from the NSBA. So, I don't know if we need to do it now, or maybe we want to send somebody to that one and this this one and compare them, or as a state we need to look at this. The state could said that they were going to stay with NSBA for a while, but they might move to that. So, I'd be interested to know if we're going to the right conference. Um they are getting smaller and smaller and the selections to pick are less and less, but um it still was well worth my time and was still good. Um I learned a lot and I want to continue to follow up on some of the things that I heard. So. >> I checked with Mark Clement while we were waiting for our flight >> Oh, cool. >> and he said we were about a 25% reduction this year. >> 25 >> of Utah attendees. >> I thought there was more Utah this year than last year though. >> Definitely less for urban. >> I think Yeah, well, I think last year was just you and me and all of Utah but >> That's right. >> But it was it was a good number this time even though that even within Utah it's reduced some so. The timing might be the wrong too like it's around spring break time a lot a lot of them are over the summer, you know, which might be a little bit easier or so I don't know. Anyways, I just wouldn't mind at least exploring that for future but I do enjoy these conferences. I learn a lot and I want to follow up on some of the things I heard so. >> Timing of the other groups. >> It's in mid-March, I think. >> And the CASA is September, 1st of September. >> Oh. That's different than what we're from what I saw. >> September 20 This year's was Oh, federal advocacy. I don't know. >> That may was like March 12th was when I just remember it because that's my >> two conferences. I think when they go to DC and they advocate with the federal government. >> CUE was is October was October 1st of 2026 so that's coming up. So. For the urban board >> of urban boards of education, I think. >> And I don't know like I said, I don't know if it's better to >> It is part of NSBA. CUE is part of NSBA and I think it is Council of Urban Boards of Education. And I think it's an additional membership on top of NSBA to do CUE. >> I'm not sure if I'm not excited about that, but anyways. I think you can attend one without a membership though. It's just a higher price. So. At least if we could talk to other people that have gone to them maybe, I don't know. Anyways. >> It'd be interesting. I hear there were a few Utah districts that went to the COSPA or whatever it is. >> Oh, yeah, COSPA. I know that Idaho's joined them, Arizona, Wyoming. >> There were several Utah boards that >> went there also. >> Yeah, they were telling me a couple. Anyway. >> Anyways. But, overall it was super good. They was good classes. >> Okay. Um I'll read some of the titles of the sessions that I went to and um and maybe give a little bit of what I got from it. The one of the classes or sessions I went to was called Bridging Education and Industry and this was very interesting about different types of um internships and ways to really help students move forward in their um future. What they want to do with their future. Another one, Bridging Strategy and Trust, Best Practices in Superintendent and Board Relations. And there was uh an analogy that was given that I thought was interesting where um a school district was compared to a team, an athletic team, where the board members are the owners of the team, the superintendent is the head coach, administrators are assistant coaches, and employees are the team, where the board can tell the coach what to do, but then the coach is in charge of all all the rest of the people. Um and one thing that I got from that class too that I thought was an interesting idea was a board information hub where one district they when they have questions about um agenda items they have a hub an online hub where they ask the question and it is answered in a place where all board members can have access to it and I I thought that's an interesting idea as long as it's within open meeting laws. Um another session I went to was strengthening boards through teamwork and this was Provo City School Dis- School Board and they did such a great job. I I really appreciated um their preparation and >> Jennifer mentioned they're doing that USBE so that's easier. >> Nice and was the question was what type of team do we want as a school board and we need to create it intentionally and this requires effort and I I something that I really appreciated from this presentation too was um the board intentionally utilizing each board members strengths. Um and then I too went to the school right-sizing with HEART and that acronym and some of the things that I thought were were very interesting as they were making these hard decisions they um that people felt strongly about was they held space for community pain in their meetings and somebody another attendee even asked how do we lower the temperature at the um um at these town halls?" And I shared this with other board members who were there. And one of the board members answered and said, "We're not trying to turn down the temperature. We want our patrons to be able to feel what they're feeling about the possibility of their school closing." And they said, "We go out of our way to make sure they feel welcome to come and express the emotions they're feeling about this hard decision that they're facing. We make sure there are enough seats. We make sure that the air conditioner is cranked up because we don't want anybody to be uncomfortable and hot when they are already feeling um dismayed about this this type of decision." And I I really appreciated that whole sentiment of um wanting patrons and stakeholders to be able to have a place to safely express their discomfort and um and emotions about what is happening in the school district. Um and then um they also talked about emotional intelligence through data. I don't know if you mentioned that where it it a lot of it was about emotional intelligence in making these really difficult types of decisions. Um So, and in modeling using that emotional intelligence with the data that um prompts these type of difficult decisions to model calm and clarity. And it's also a good opportunity for a school board to model norms for healthy conflict. Um And by empha empha emphasizing curiosity and empathy. Um like why would our patrons feel this way and under trying to understand why they they do. Um And another phrase from this course that I thought was really interesting was um in these decisions, it's important to balance board members' perspectives, community needs, and superintendent vision. Um And then I went to a class where we talked about Plyler v. Doe, which was an 1982 Supreme Court case that um where it was ruled that it is um unlawful in the United States to deny a public education to any student based on um ability to prove lawful residence um in the United States. And that was an interesting court uh session, also. Um I went to a course called When Adults Misbehave, Students Pay the Price. Um I went to another one, Modeling Civility. I I it might seem like I had something on my mind about trying to be a better board member and and being more civil in board meetings. Um and probably one of my favorite sessions was Why School Boards Matter by Scott R. Levy. And this he has done extensive research on the history of school boards. And he wrote a book, and I ordered the book, and it's also called Why School Boards Matter. And then there is a subtitle that I don't remember what it is. And I I think that it's possible that this could be a very um good book study book for our board and something he mentioned too was in the corporate world there is no question about a board the importance of a board in making decisions for the corporation whereas school boards are always called into question and people question the legitimacy of a of a board making decisions in the public school setting and some of the things that he talked about that I it his whole presentation really piqued my interest in his book and I could not take notes fast enough so I decided to just really pay attention and enjoy what he was presenting but he even had quotes about um parental dissatisfaction about control and um anyway they were so similar but one was from uh the 1912 smallpox um thing and the other one was from a 2021 COVID thing and they sounded they were so similar and it was very interesting how board work and issues have been so similar through the decades and um I I really I I just want to read part of the I just want to read the learning objectives for this session. Participants will understand societal trends that make governance more difficult and how to navigate them. Participants will understand how school boards are uniquely positioned to strengthen school districts. And the third one, participants will be inspired as they see how their work in the boardroom improves our overall democracy. And I I really felt like he touched on all of those points. But like I said, it was very interesting to hear about the history of boards and why they matter. And anyway, I I really appreciated that. And And that's that's all. >> I'll try to be brief. Um I think one way to illustrate the biggest value that I got out of this conference was on multiple occasions, I would be walking between sessions with a board member. This happened to with Aaron and Daryl. And then all of a sudden, one of us would say, "What room are you going to?" Well, my room was like 5 minutes ago. I was walking you to your room because I didn't want to end the conversation. And then they would say, "Well, mine was also 5 minutes ago, so." I think that that is um such a powerful part of this experience is being with each other in a different environment and having the opportunity to talk about big concepts, not problems that we're solving today, but big concepts that broaden our minds and the perspective that we gain as we hear from different different board members who have different scenarios. So, um first and foremost, that was such a delight for me. And thank you to all of you who were there. Um I tried to focus a lot of my time on the Ready Set Governance series because I think it has a direct tie-in to my ability to be a good board member. Um and so, just really quickly, a couple of things that I'll limit my comments to things that I pulled out that I thought, "Man, this might help us." So, the first one, sometimes I remember us having conversations about is it okay to vote on something in a study session? And they explained that work sessions are not decision-making meetings because there's no opportunity for comment. And so, I think keeping that one criteria in mind, is this something that we should be hearing from constituents about? Then we probably shouldn't be voting on it. If it's something procedural or next steps, I think that's very appropriate to take a motion during a work study. Um the next one, I hope doesn't sound like I'm trying to be in charge because heaven knows I'm not. But, understanding the role of the chair and why it is in Robert's Rules that all discussion goes through the chair has nothing to do with the chair being the center of the universe, but in making sure that we have equal voice around the table. And one thing that has um concerned me for some time is I worry that I'm not seeing the cues when people want to talk um and stopping the conversation and making sure they get a spot. And sometimes, even when I do see the cues, in this meeting, I've watched it a couple of times, where people are trying to jump in, but the conversation is going um so fast they can't get a turn. And so, that is the beauty of Robert's Rules and having a a chair who calls on the speakers. And that is why I would really love to our board meetings with a system that allows us to say, "Hey, I have a comment to make." so that we're making sure that we're hearing from everyone. Um >> By the way, according to Robert's Rules of of Order, strictly speaking, no one should speak a second time until everyone has had a chance to speak one. >> talk about that. And I was like, "Oh, I got to do better at at guiding that." And I think it would help all of us to have something that was a visual display. Like, "Oh, I'm not the only one with my light on." Maybe. So, that's something that I I think would make us more effective as board members. Okay, then I'm just skipping through a lot of this. One thing that I thought was interesting was we were talking about how Lisa already talked about this, being uniquely positioned as board members to help our district be successful. And one thing that I want to just keep in my mind all the time is um protecting teachers from too many initiatives. So, research has shown that the sweet spot is no more than six initiatives at once if you want success. And when when we have a focused initiative, student achievement increased five times just by limiting how many new things we're throwing at our teachers. Um which I was like, "Man, we could do that. That's so simple." And then on influencing the climate, I again, the same the same data point that Daryl talked about. It was talking about the average superintendent tenure, it's about 3 years. Thankfully, we're odd beaters in this district. So, hopefully ours is 30 years. But, the board superintendent relationship was a part that he talked about and he said they did a survey of like boards, how important do you think you are in impact? And they rated themselves it was like 40% and then they asked superintendents what they felt like the board impact was and it was significantly higher like a 95% impact. And so I think sometimes understanding our roles and not being afraid to use those roles to support one another is something that I want to increase. And then the last one I thought was such an interesting um title and it was one of the ready set governance but it was the importance of policy and self-care for all board members. I was like policy and self-care that feels so backwards. So I'm just going to pull out one thing that that they taught. When policies, practices, and procedures are aligned that that actually leads us to higher levels of confidence and lower levels of stress associated with governance roles and responsibilities because we know that we are seated in a safe place. We our policies protect us legally. Our procedures are linked directly to those policies and then just I don't know why it was such a light bulb moment for me but um what policy is versus what procedure is. So policy should be the why and the what. Um and that's as much as it should go and I it's so hard for me because I'm this special ed teacher who wants really specific measurable goals. But that's not policy. Um and so shifting that in my mind, why do we need this and what is it that we're asking for and then the rest of it shifts to this side of the room. The The who, when, where, and how goes to the procedural pieces, and that can kind of help us um in making sure that we're supporting each other in our roles. So, with that, I will That's I could keep talking. It's such a good um experience, but I just want to call out the sacrifice. I recognize that it is moving mountains and asking a lot of our counterparts and our families when we leave. Um so, thank you for setting aside the time. I hope that you found value in it. Um and I hope that we will continue to make this a high priority for our board to not just learn, but to learn together. Okay, with that, anything else on this topic? Okay. Let's go ahead and move on to 3G, a review of board policies GP 113, 14, and 15. >> President, I I move that we postpone item G. We're way ahead of the policy committee. It's late, and I just think it would be better served postponing. >> I'll second it. >> I think that is a very fair motion, especially considering I should warn you that we have a second closed session to that we need to get to tonight, and it is going to be big. So. Um all right. Uh is anyone Oh, well, was that a motion? Okay. We have a motion by Mr. Dunford, a second by Dr. Robinson that we postpone the discussion of item 3G until a future board meeting. Any discussion? Okay, hearing none, all in favor, please say I. >> I. >> Any opposed? Okay, that motion carries unanimously. Okay, board and superintendent reports and comments. >> I want to jump in real quick. Um, I have been asked to sit in on a meeting of the Healthy South Jordan Coalition. I was asked by a constituent of mine that I met at a PTA meeting at one of my elementary schools. Uh, they're wanting to know if there's anything that the city of South Jordan can do for the school district, specifically their healthy coalition. Um, because they're out in the community a lot uh, with lots of different events. They focus on active living, access to healthy foods, and mental well-being. I am interested in going um, to their meeting and to represent Jordan School District if anyone has, sorry, the Board of Education, if anybody has any concerns, I Yeah, I don't know what it will be alike. It just they just asked if I'd come to one of their quarterly meetings to see if there's anything they can do for us. Does anybody have questions or concerns about me going to that? >> It's awesome. >> I think it's a great opportunity and um, appreciate you being willing to take the time to do it. Um, and thanks for filling us in. That's helpful to know where we have a voice. >> I'll have questions for uh, Katie Bastian. That might be something to mention to her. >> Oh, okay. Okay, great. Thank you. I'm I'm already set up a meeting with her and Scott. So, I can ask her a bunch of questions. So, I'll bring that up to her then. Great. >> Um for the Jordan Education Foundation, the um the challenge run is on the 9th of May, Saturday at 9:00 a.m. at Veterans Memorial Park. It is $20 per person and Jordan School District teachers are free. Um and also there's that prize for the school that has the most um registrants. Also, on the 25th of June, it it's going to be at 8:00 a.m. Links to Schools Golf Tournament. Um slots fill up quickly, so hurry and register if you want to participate. Also, if you are interested in being a corporate sponsor and sponsoring um a hole, then reach out to the Jordan Education Foundation. Also, this isn't necessarily on the um I'm it's not listed as something that I'm a part of for the school district, but on April 27th, I will be I'm I'm part of the health materials review committee and I will be um reviewing health materials that have been requested by teachers and then I will report that I went to that meeting the next day on the 28th. So. >> What Is that a part of a committee or is that something that popped up for you? >> It's It's something that um I can't remember if I volunteered or if I was asked to do it. There needs to be a member of the school board on the health review committee um because of state law. And what it is is when Do you know what happens on this health review committee? >> I mean >> It's when teachers are requesting Well, it's when teachers are requesting to use materials, then the committee reviews these materials and decides whether or not they're within um state standards and whether or not teachers can use them. So. >> So, yeah, that's interesting that it's a requirement to have a board member there and we didn't know about it. >> I mean, this will be This is not the first time that I've gone. And I've reported on it be- fore, but the report is this. I attended the Health Review Committee meeting. So. So, that Does that answer your question? It's It's a >> Yeah. >> requirement by Isn't it? Or So, it might just go along with the District 7 seat. >> Well, we should maybe put that on our list of a of assignments because it sounds like it should be a board assignment. >> Yeah, and if if you're unhappy with the job I'm doing here, feel free to pull me from it. >> I'm just trying to make sure I'm doing my job over here. You're wonderful. Okay. I'll report on a couple of committees. The Government Relations Committee recently met to discuss meeting with legislators in the month of May. Um individually just to talk about bills ahead of opening bill files and hear what they have to say and hopefully they'll hear what we have to say and we'll report back after those meetings. Thanks to Dr. Anderson for reminding >> Could you present our plan to possibly bond for field houses and just >> Get a sense of what they're thinking. >> "Look, we're not This isn't something we're pushing. This is something the public has asked of us. And so we're putting it on the public. I don't want any pushback from legislators thinking we're abusing our power. I think that's a captive audience to say this is the direction we're headed. We haven't made those decisions yet, but just so you know." >> It'd be good cuz we're thinking of doing it in school. It would be nice to be able to maybe paint the vision for them. >> We're planning on doing it at a high school even, so Great, great idea. Thank you. Uh GEC if you want to write down, I've got three events coming up. We'll have another meeting uh another board meeting before these events, so as I get more information, I'll share it there. But we have two on May 7th. So, the language and cultural services are having their multicultural senior night at Bingham from 6:00 to 8:00 p.m. And that same night from 5:00 to 7:30 at West Jordan Middle School is the Native Community and Senior Night. >> Oh, yeah. >> Last year that was here, but it's at Was it there? >> West Jordan Middle >> Oh, it must have been a different I took my kids. It was lovely. >> And and before that it's been at West Jordan High School also. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> So, when you say senior night, are you talking about I am in my last year of high school, or are you talking about >> Yes. >> Okay. >> So, is that specific to >> Bingham High School and then >> That's just the location of it. >> Remind me the time of the multicultural >> It's from 6:00 to 8:00 p.m. It's well I should repeat it. I I say it fast. So that same night is the Native Community and Senior Night, West Jordan Middle. >> 5:00 to 7:30. >> So so if you want me to hear it again, probably helps my microphone's going in and out. >> the the um Native American Community Night at 5:00 and then hustle over to the Language and Culture Services Senior Night, Multicultural Night. at 6:00. >> If you want a nightcap, run over to my house. It is my birthday. We'll have a big party. Get presents. >> Careful, you just invited the whole public. >> All the public's welcome. >> The one at West Jordan Middle is 5:00 to 7:00. >> 7:30. >> 5:00 to 7:30. And the other one is 6:00 to 8:00. >> Yes. And I'll provide more details at the next business meeting. The third event is the following week, May 13th. This is the Family Engagement Center Certification Night. Yeah, exciting night of recognition. That is from 6:00 to 7:30 at Sunset Ridge Middle. So 5:13, May 13th, Family Engagement Center Certification Night 6:00 to 7:30 p.m. at Sunset Ridge Middle. Those are all of my updates. >> Before I get I'm also going to report on J Peg. I feel like this was a month ago. >> It was a long time ago. >> weeks and weeks. It was on March 25th, right before spring break, and probably cuz spring break was forever, I feel like. Um we had a really great turnout yet again with so many parents showing up representing our schools. Uh a great presentation by Dr. Anderson on legislative bills, things that passed, um things that didn't, things we were keeping our eye on. Lots of great questions and conversation with uh the parents that showed up and them asking just really great questions like, "What about this? And what about that?" And we're like, "Yes, that that's a good point." And like like >> They were pretty quick to point out some of the ironies in some of the bills that, you know, that existed out there and yeah, it was It was a great and engaging group. Uh tremendous turnout as well, as you said. >> Yeah, they yeah, it was really great. So. Can't wait to hold the next J-PAC, so it's always It's been really good so far. >> And it was nice at the JLC. >> Yeah, it's a great building to hold that there. >> Add on Google calendar. Who do we call for that? >> No, yeah, maps, sorry. >> Yeah, I don't know how to do that, but I'll mention it online a lot. Google's always reading what I say online. Okay. >> I will report on Utah High School Activities Association. Rob Cuff, as you know, has retired or is retiring. We have hired Ryan Bishop, the principal of Wasatch High School to replace him as the director of Utah High School Activities Association. And as we prepare for our realignment, it has been a major problem to have 17 6A schools, and I have been very committed to mhm fixing that error. And I got the board to commit. We will have no less than 21 6A schools in the next realignment. Um that we've streamlined the process to kind of take a lot of judgment out of it. There's a scoring system based on size, based on success factors, and then we can just kind of say, "Here's how all the schools in Utah rank." And there's the 6A line, and there's the 5A line, and there's the 4A line. >> So, Daniel threw away like one or two of the >> Yeah. >> combined teams and small ones. >> So, anyway, moving forward, but no less than 21 schools in 6A. That's great news. >> Can I ask a Utah high schools question? Just because I know you'll know. So, the 20 hours a week of practice, is that cumulative across a variety of sports, or is that per sport? >> Per sport. >> So, and does it count as practice if it's like off-season, like how the football team works out every day, even if it's not football season? >> It counts if they're not in the the four-week the eight-week moratorium for their sport. >> Okay. Okay. I was just talking to a student who goes to school at 5:00 a.m. and gets home about 10:00 every night. And I was like, "What?" And he was like, "It's because I do this sport and that sport, and oh, we always lift at 5:00 for football." >> Conditioning does not count. >> Concerning. Wow. It's a big ask for anyone. announce I have JLC this week um on Friday, and then USBA the next week, so. Well, the next weekend, that will be my St. George big meeting. Okay. I'm I'm watching for >> I guess I can just say that uh facilities committee has some recommendations. We're going to hold off a little while before we present them to the board, but we're continuing on our list of of schools to review. >> Superintendent, anything from you? >> I don't think so. Thank you. >> Okay, great. So, we have reached the end of our agenda. We do need to go into closed session. >> I move that we go into closed session for discussion of character and competence of individuals, property, potential litigation, negotiations, and security here at the JATC South building. Whereupon completion, we will adjourn. >> That's good wording. I should write that down. I second. >> Okay, perfect. So, we have a motion by Ms. Wood, a second by Ms. Barrow, that we go into closed session, and we will following that closed session, um adjourn our meeting. So, we'll do a roll call vote. Mr. Barnett? >> Yes. >> Mr. Dunford? >> Yes. >> Ms. Barrow? >> Yes. >> Dr. Robinson? >> Yes. >> Ms. Wood? >> Yes. >> Ms. Dean? >> Yes. >> I am also a yes. We are unanimous. Thank you for joining us. We are now in closed session. >> Mhm.