so far I have a lot of questions so I don't if you want us to go for board member or uh you offer go ahead okay so the first question I have um I would say you know I'm fully in support of mcaps obviously you talked about how much um how that actually is in my mind when I looked at these Cuts I sort of categorized them into three three different buckets and I I categorized them into teachers and programs efficiencies and administrative cuts and when I looked at all these cuts um I came up with teachers and programs being about $3 million of the total cuts and that's about 73% of the cuts um it came up with efficiencies of about 672 which is only 16% of the cuts and then I came up with administrative being about 4 439,000 only 11% of the cuts and I feel like in for in in for a district to fairly make cuts across the board um you know I think I've sat here for many many board meetings and said I don't support cuts that impact our teachers and our students in the classroom directly and then in all fairness to our administrative team we as a board we were given the opportunity to give Administration some direction regarding this year's budget back in September of 2023 and that was a piece of paper that I handed out to everybody um we received that piece of paper in September and we never came back and gave Administration Direction on what were our budget priorities so I think that that's that's challenging because we're not giving them any direction as far as what our budget priorities really should been as a board so we're really taking their input and trying to and I think that's why these cards are difficult because we never give them the direction so shame on us previous board we never gave the board we never gave Administration the direction that we should have done I don't know why it didn't come back to the board for discussion um but that that is you know I'm I'm frustrated with that to be honest with you I don't think it's fair to Administration um I would also say to do a fair job of cuts we need to see more of a balance between the teachers and the programs and administrative cuts and so um I went through and I looked at mcaps that's an efficiency in my opinion like that makes sense great we're in goinging more kids that's our students that's wonderful um the elementary sped par changes not super supportive of that because again that's teacher and programs um and we don't know what the new kids coming into our district are going to be in 25 26 and we don't know what their needs are so I feel like as a board this is a disingenuous ask because we could come back next year and they and someone say we need three Elementary speds because we have three Kinders that came in with super High kns then we're going to be asked as a board to go over budget because we just made this cut because we can't not give the kids they what they need so I'm very concerned about those PA of cuts because I feel like how do you know we've been told we don't know what these kids are coming into the district um as far as eliminating online I know we lose a lot of students to other online programs I also know that we have other online programs that we use so the only reason that I'm sort of been supportive of this eliminating online is because it was put in place during covid and we're not it's not Co times and we don't have that Co money so I feel like for that one um I'm I'm a little bit more supportive of that one um reduction in iPads um that again is a program reduction in staff desktop computers I'm very concerned about that because I would like to better understand what do our what do our staff need in order to effectively do their jobs if they need a big screen I can tell you what I can't stand looking at a small screen all day it's very difficult to do a job oftentimes teachers use them as dual screens and like what is it going to cost to add a mouse and a keyboard and a big screen for these teachers to be able to effectively do their jobs um so I'm not support I I understand like reducing the desktop computers but I'd like to see what it would cost to give the staff what they need to successfully do their job um as far as eliminate educ climber Brain Pop um where did the Quil tricks go cuz that was on here before and now it's not on here anymore they won't release us from the contract okay so that cost is not included in anymore that's fine um all right and I'm supportive of that um transportation that's an efficiency very excited that we did that um reducing the T stosa stiens um I you know I put that under um programs um cuup adjustments make sense again an efficiency as far as the fur logo I'm I'm concerned about this because it doesn't fix a problem and all it does is and I understand you changed how it's listed on here and that it's actually struck it's not on here any longer okay all right cuz I was going to say it would be it would be voluntary so we're not going to bank for savings we've we've already made it for that well because I was going to say all it does is just say yes we got we got to do this again because we're not really making a cut um Administrative Assistant reductions that I put under Administration um and then we get into other reductions um the fitness committee expense of $115,000 it's such a minimal amount of money and my concern about that is that as a board we even it even says in like Minnesota State Statute that we are we are able to put in um staff and sener programs and and I would just like to know how many real staff incentive programs do we have in our in our district and taking away something from our staff that makes their day a little bit brighter and makes their job a little easier and it's $155,000 I feel like we could like find that someplace else um and then of course I've shared my thoughts about the pool um and that's it so I guess overall I personally and then oh I have one other thing I'm sorry the other thing is when we when I looked at the revenue um the revenue that was quoted tonight and then the expenses that gets us to about 4 and a half million that we need to reduce so my question is with these Bud budget reductions are we going to be bringing a balance budget forward to the board without tapping into fund balance because I'm showing short we're about $400,000 if I calculate this correctly yeah we will continue to work on getting that and again we don't know what our enrollment numbers are so a lot there's a lot of assumptions built into this and we're constantly revising it and going through I think there's some grants that we don't have included in here there's a couple other things that we can be looking at okay and then my suggestion is you know I wanted to see a budget another scenario um because I feel like the one thing that's missing from our strategic plan is that we have have this new plan in place and now how do we really put this plan in place so if we're looking at advanced classes or um academic Excellence I personally would like to see another like $2 million in administrative Cuts happening and taking that money and saying how can we invest this back into our students in our programs and I'm I think we can do that from you know just looking at the chart and looking at the information that we received our administrative um support has increased over the years and so that was kind of my challenge back to um back to Dr Thomas in my feedback and that's something that I would like to personally see come back so that we can make these Investments back into the classroom it's particularly around the special and talented and gifted programs and like our Advanced options advanced math in the Middle School whatever it may be so okay program wide are you want them to move forward as listed yes move forward as listed I'll just go around director um [Music] yes I mean we're we're we all have our things right and whether we have a personal connection to something or we have or we don't you know it all it it just it you know is I keep going back to you know what Dr Thomas says you know the things that people love don't come for free and even though we have our new strategic plan and I am 100% committed to that strategic plan and um you know I don't you know I'm I'm not a fan of taking PD away from teachers and not of you know all all of these different things we all have our things right and it's just hard and at the end of the day you know we I thought we were very transparent with our community you know during the lovey process and said you know this could happen and we're there unfortunately and we're going to be here again next year and um I that's what I'm really I'm trying to think future too that I'm not looking forward to that either um and I'm not trying to dismiss it and say looking forward I mean it stinks this all stinks um nobody wants to do this um but at the end of the day our community spoke and so that's what we have to go by and um so yes unfortunately and with a very heavy heart I say yes director Mason um I mean generally I I feel like we can do a better job keeping the cuts away from our students in programming also I think I've been very clear about that I think that we can do a better job um um targeting some other places um you know I'm supportive of the mcaps move I'm supportive of um eliminating the online um the transportation um you know the pool I guess depends on what comes back but um you know I think my biggest concern with these proposals is that we are not freeing up funds to focus more on academic outcomes and um that's concerning to me so I've asked you know many questions around the new Investments we made in 23 24 that we've spent nearly a million dollars on and um the number of staff that we have administrative assistance and um looking for organizational rationalization and realignment in some of the programs and administration overall student support staff that I think that we could do a better job um addressing versus removing some of these programs and um to also free out more money to focus on academic outcomes which I think we are missing the mark on huge and that's um I'm not supportive of this budget for that reason I think we need to free up more money to focus on that I think that's my biggest concern Dr Johnson um Dr Thomas you mentioned earlier talking about um titles or the positions the positions can you explain part yeah that's our next topic um you want to finish this and then we'll jump into that to kind of round some of that out too well that I think might might that might be something direct foration was talking about because that that whole 23 24 that's just looking at one of the things that came out if you're okay we'll jump into that conversation to to talk a little bit about that that's okay maybe help balance can I make a comment though um as I stated I'm good going forward but I did have one question I didn't get a chance to ask earlier um before um Dan came up and spoke about the pool and the long-term facilities maintenance and that's that um while we are talking about the mcaps savings of not having the transportation to and from the Lakeville site and we also talked about the reduction in the administrator and of course the administrative assistance there and reallocating that workload to the existing educators mhm um it concurrent to that you mentioned the increase in enrollment to mcaps um have we or have you looked at a threshold because when you start to reallocate that workload we've got a resource utilization um cap that is based upon human capacity MH and we've got a lot of people are already operating on our subsistence level due to the lack of funds while we're trying to increase educational outcome comes to a very very well-respected program so um the only thing that I would ask is that we look at that enrollment into maps and make sure that we can adequately service those students with our existing resources and not over tax that because then we will see diminishing returns from that program yeah other than that everything here we have to do we don't have a choice and unfortunately it's only going to get worse CH white thank you for that uh chair white before we go into there maybe we can do a little quick relief for sure was in the back yeah I that 9:05 okay sounds good sorry fir back up here that's two for two all right thank you thank you chair white and directors um yeah so I'm I'm going to actually turn the floor over to director Herman who will um walk through kind of a Reconciliation conversation to make better meaning of some of the data that's out there and being discussed uh with varing reports so with that I'll turn it over to director so as a supplemental document to the budget presentation I added the administrators um comparisons of number of positions um from the previous plan years dating back to 16117 which was one of the original request um uh a while ago actually um and I apologize for some of you that have been on the board um this is a repeat but I just want to make sure that that everyone is aware unfortunately Skyward um lacks significant um position control capabilities and each contract and how each contract um has been negotiated over the years an FTE mean something a little bit different depending on that and then also with changes and when people leave the system come into the system leaves all that kind of stuff um it's it's very wildly inefficient reporting capabilities that SkyWars had to actually truly reflect how many positions were there um with the mandatory upgrade to the new Skyward we are working very hard and diligently between business office and HR to to build out so we can have a true position control so that these reports that we should be able to easily produce as part of like a monthly report to you all um will be available moving forward but historically the data is extremely difficult to get out so it takes a very long time unfortunately to come up with these reports so I started with administrators um if it's the will of the board I'm happy to assign and work on that within my team within the the capabilities that we have to do this similar report for other positions or maybe just look at one specific year for all positions but um unfortunately just it takes it takes a significant amount of time to go through this um but this is where we started um with a administrators not all administrative staff which some people have different definitions of what that means so again if it's the will of the board for us to go um into a deep dive on um a historical analysis of our staffing um happy to to to do that and try to see what my team's capabilities are of how long that will take us to do I just want to be really clear on what everybody's definition is and the will of the board of that definition um because this is an example of what we could do but it does take significant amount of time to get that done and then the other piece of that that I would just like to to offer is if there are any positions um that anybody has some questions around like what does that position do um and maybe what compliance related work it does or what essential work it does versus what maybe those um I think some of use the word today luxuries or whatever else that may be happy to um either help answer those questions or connect you with those um administrators so they can talk to you about what that functionality is for each of them because even with um I believe somebody made a reference to administrative assistance administrative assistance all have different um projects that they oversee or compliance related um work that they do um but it's all a little bit different from each other their classifications might be the same because the rules and the scope of it are the same pay grade but it really just depends on which one you're looking at so I'm happy to give a little bit more in-depth analysis of that um that essential work that they do if that would be something that would be helpful as well but I just wanted to show this as an example of what we could do if it's the will of the board if this would be helpful um in the long run looking at as you all have mentioned this is just year one we're continuing to find different resources optimizing them um and then looking at next year but um as you can see from this report there's just a lot of moves even with titles restructuring assignments cutting from here adding over here um all that kind of stuff so um I don't know if this helps with the administrators but just wanted it as a talking point to talk about and then make sure to get the will of the board of what work to move forward with because again um I think this is the fourth time I've said this but um it takes a a takes a lot of time unfortunately with our Skyward inabilities to do this work director Could you um I'm sorry for I was just going to ask a really quick question because not all of these things are are some of them are funded by Grant but it looks like some of them may also be funded out of Community Ed this is all positions that we when we talk about administrator this is all positions that we talk about but this is these are funded by multiple different funds um this is just the whole list of all positions in the district um not specific to the general fund that would be just nice to know um like which ones are funded from fund two fund four or Grant uh because again um some things are not going to be within the fund one um you know some of the discussion that we've talked about with um the titles and the positions and stuff like that to really get an understanding of where they are that was my only um ask and I don't um just sorry um director br's members board I don't know if we'll have the capacity to do a historical look at that no I'm not for that either we and I believe we did do that already for the District staff of like overall breakdown of what they all are um we could give more specifics individual positions if if if that would be helpful in the will of the board um but historically to show all of the number of positions over the years plus which ones are or not in different funds I think would get very convol because there's a lot of fluidity to that as well hisorical I I don't know anybody I can't speak for anybody else but oh sorry the colors I apologize um so as as our team was going through and making sure the data was accurate to the best of our abilities um we were adding and when there was an ad it's a green when there's a reduction it's a red um because we were also tracking when there was title changes um or positions were being realigned just to make sure that we were tracking all that and then we were going to take that off but we also felt that it might be helpful for you all to see that it just you know when looking at what positions have been added over the years um or which positions have been reduced over the years so we just left that color coding in there just to help maybe draw the eye to which positions have been either restructured and moved around or new titles or um just changes in general and director Herman would you walk through one or two um positions just to kind of illustrate the point to like walk them through Reading across left to right what happened to a certain position that might have been renamed and so it looks like it got eliminated but it's actually just or it looks like we added but we actually just um renamed and things of that nature just give assistant principal because that's that one has a lot of changes and I was going to ask that same question for so the assistant principal one for an example is when we move the um I'm sorry I should have had numbered by the rules that would have been very helpful um when you look at the area Learning Center coordinator reduction in 2324 that wasn't a reduction of an FTE it was they were um moved into the uh principal assistant principal bargaining unit and are not classifi as assistant principal so then you see a corresponding increase um in the assistant principal group for example um a good example what Dr Thomas was asking for um if um director P doesn't mind me using the his Department his department has gone through uh quite a bit of restructuring either titles or realigning um uh you know where they're at just the most recent one is on the slide deck today but whether it's changing it from director of operations operation Services operational Services operation Transportation like over the years those titles have changed quite a bit um so it just correlates to a bunch of different lines so again I um I'm unfortunately Skyward is not awesome about really tracking all of that for us so um and I didn't want to miss anything on here so if you're looking back at different org charts or past org charts we left those titles there so that you can align those with that but that's a really good example of not only organizational structure changes like this currently happened but also the operation services department has gone through quite a bit different title changes as things have been outlined them are moved um in different directions um what is so I think it was at the last board meeting we got a FTE by building location does that come out of the same system or how that's the new Skyward um so we're very optim I'm sorry uh director Mason members of the board that's out of the new system the Skyward q that also took quite a bit of cleanup to do um but not not as much as the previous one we are still working through and trying to build out so that we can optimize the new system as best as possible so we can get to a true position control system um but that report was pulled out of the the new one um and then cleaned up from there and then the every year after that is the old one and we only have very limited access to that data um and then there's even some data previous to that so for me that was a better picture I was able to export that into Excel dump it throw a quick pivot in there in five minutes that I can see you know by job code and position and building anything you know all that information is there so for me that's a better report I I guess when you look at this one that you shared right now I struggle with it doesn't match to the one that was produced last time as well as it doesn't match to some of the numbers that were even in our financial statement like there's all the numbers are all different and I suspect is probably just what you're calling administrators versus Administration versus I mean even like when I looked at the dump from the last meeting we have you know most of our teachers that are classified you know our Deans our psychologists our social workers our counselors they're all classified as teachers right so I mean that's what's hard I feel like it's easier for me to look at that FTE by building because I can see that more personally but and if it's the will of the board for like a specific year um that you want to dive deeper into that's a report that we could then focus on and look at in cleaning up historically that'll be very difficult but um happy if there's like a specific point in time that you all want to reference back to um we can look at pulling a similar report to what was provided in the last one for the current year um and getting that cleaned up for that I think for me the this data is only it only paints part of the picture right because there's no Deans there's no administrative assistance and those in my mind are administrative roles so unless they're in a classroom teaching a student um or supporting a student like a parah in my mind they're administrative and where I'm struggling with the historical data is that we have a report right in our financial report I know it's the MD Stars data report um where there is historical data so like why wouldn't we have that historical data if we have it in a different format and and to me this apprciate all your work I think that you know and I appreciate all the explanation of it but to me this doesn't paint a picture of what we're what in my mind I'm trying to understand um is really where have we seen the increase of Staff when we see declining enrollment and we've seen increase in staff and to me you have to look at that and optimize your resources I apologize for missing the mark on this um just trying to get historical access to all of our data for you all but um and I don't know if you want me to explain the star report again and why that's not apples apples and how that doesn't even include all of our ft in it or or what I can go into that that explanation again if you all want no and I mean I took the Stars report and I even compared it to other districts and they don't have the increase in their what they call Total administrative staff so that's where I'm looking at ours and saying okay I'm sorry in my mind the total administrative staff has seen a big increase double of what we were back in 2016 2017 so I'm just trying to get the data to be able to like director Mason said the report you la did last time it had every job code it was super easy to see this is how many positions this how many FTE and I understand why that might be difficult to go back and look at because how do you go back and track all that data but I would assuming based on the fact that we're a public school and we have public data I don't I don't know why we wouldn't have that so ACC and members of the board I'm I'm happy to go back and and find it um and and get a report that would be similar to it um it just would be very helpful for me to get a better understanding of the will of the board because it's going to be a lot of work um and we have a lot of work coming up for the Department um so I just want to make sure I'm prioritizing the essential work and compliance work of my department along with getting the information at the will of the board wants so I'm happy I I'm happy to look at if you want to compare it to last year or 10 years ago or whatever that is I just I would like to have a better direction of what year that is and what is all hope for on that and I can appreciate what you're saying director ainson except that if we go back to a point in time and wonder why there's there's there's a different amount of Administrators more or less even that's not an Apples to Apples because what what if what are are the reporting requirements the same as they were in 2016 have they changed to now I mean this seems like an awful lot of work to to lay out this map when you still won't be able to accurately compare the number of ministers we had in say 17 18 with 2425 because who knows how many of the requirements of the staff have changed since then which would then lend itself to whatever increases we're talking about or decreases either way I'm struggling with with having the Emily's Department spend that inord amount of time when even if we get what we want is it really accurate does it really tell the entire story you understand what I'm saying yeah because we have the MD the MD Stars data which to me it shows it shows the data that I need to see even though you say well it's not exactly right they're not exactly CL class guide it has to show our total licensed positions because that's what the report says so to me we have the data I personally I agree with what you're saying I understand the amount of work this that you created um I think given the fact that we are past setting budg budget priorities because as a board we didn't do it last year for this year um I feel like this only this exercise would only be relevant as we're setting our board priorities for the 26 27 year and that what would be I think would be a better use of our District's time is to do more of a um what did you call it direct direct Mason when you said more of like a or chart type of exercise organizational rationalization or I mean yeah where you're really looking at and say okay does this staff member have this many direct reports or you know how many executive staff have administrative assistance what's that role could that role be absorbed into a different role I mean that's the type of things that I think would be a better use of your time because I agree with you even our students needs were different 10 years ago than they are today so they require different staff and different needs so your way um I just think if I may in listening to all of the things talked about regarding this it's challenging for these asks because it seems as though it's being assumed that they haven't done the organizational work in which that's what they're that's their that's their um position to do so I I guess I'm challenged to I wouldn't ask the I wouldn't ask for recreating all this and spending all this time doing this type of work that's looking in the rear view mirror I just I even even if if it was the will of the board I guess helped me understand what you do with the information once received I think when you look at what I was trying to look you can look at the stars report you can see that right here it says back in administration for fiscal year 2018 we had 24.6 licensed positions and now we have 50.3 so I would ask why and the teaching staff is about the same so it's really understanding our staffing models and um where do those budget reductions come into place but like I said I feel like we are doing something I would think it's a waste of your time until we get to the point of setting our board's next budget priorities I feel like this is we we're past this already right and it's almost like I don't even know I appreciate the data but you can't analyze the data if it's not complete so I just say we we had the Stars report explained to us and I mean it's the same for every District it's not accurate to how districts have their work charts and the titles and stuff like that and it's it's been talked about multiple times last year that those that the Stars report is not an accurate representation uh and how they actually do the allocation things like that um so I think that what we need to do is move Beyond because we're not going to change the way the mde organizes their stuff um and it isn't reflective of of many districts especially those who have people that travel between buildings and have multiple jobs and all that kind of stuff so um again that that has been explained um gosh at least three or four times now I believe um one time very very detailed I think it was last year spring um but um I do I don't want to have you guys do my personal opinion is I don't want to have you guys do more work we have an or chart that's in our audit it's in our budget report um um my only concern is making sure that when we're looking at these sites is that we know which fund they belong to because there's so many things that aren't going to impact fund one and some things that we can't touch um and I'd like to look at current um instead of trying to compare back 10 years ago and figure out at the same title the same position Etc and also the the same designation um that was in the old AGR system still fits I I don't think that's a worthwhile uh exercise um so that's just my opinion so can I ask a clarifying question director Herman um the Stars report can you refresh I mean if this has been T I know that it's been talked about I don't I wouldn't be able to rearticulate or even recall all of the specifics regarding it but the Stars report is the Stars report mandatory something that the the all all districts are mandatory reporting to um or is this a outside can you help me remember it's Vice chair bullan members of the board the star report is a yearly very um time consuming requirement um for all school districts to do and it is utilized to ensure that it's its main functionality is utilized to ensure that we have the proper licensers to teaching the proper classes and the proper licens administrators overseeing those classes but then that data gets utilized and pulled in multiple different directions that makes it very clunky and difficult and causes significant amount of confusion which we've talked about um so the main purpose of it is really to make sure that school districts are not in violation of lure and ensure that they're meeting their lure requirements so um I I I looked through my stuff and unfortunately I didn't have the star report um my hand out here but I have the admin report that um director Frederickson had to read for me the day that I lost my voice but um a good example of it is that you know it doesn't it doesn't it's not accurate because if you look at the 2022 school year it says we have 11 administrative assistants that year we had 55.7 um and there are some years that it reports like from 2013 to 2019 it relist us as having zero directors that's that's not accurate it's because every single year the star report changes its classifications it changes its coding the you fars manual changes every single year that changes where Things Fall different um districts um report um into that utilizing how they classify things where they think where things go all that kind of stuff um there's violations every single year there are false violations that then get fixed in the back end um a lot with like changes in early childhood licensures and all this other kind of stuff happens with the data that's really its primary purpose is to make sure that we're properly we're following statute own Li insures um so it's it's difficult because it's understandable it's causing quite a bit of confusion when it's out there and it's reporting these significant changes from zero directors to nine directors but those nine directors existed previously it's just not they're not showing up in the other things so and I think what we've captured here director Herman if I may uh in in your in the spreadsheet again this is an example of just just our administrator categories that we call administrators disregard star okay um because we don't we don't I'm soring I'm except for like tosa I mean except for the Deans they're they're a tosa so they wouldn't be on here right correct the these are admit because th those fall under the teacher contract and so by State Statute they're teachers social workers psychologists counselors they all fall under the teacher contract and so are going to be in that category so what what Emily and her team has done is with our data our or structure our titles we've categorized for you every administrator that big group um that's who you see here dating back to 16117 at the very bottom grand total you'll see the change over time we didn't add all all these administrators which has I I've never been in a district where that narrative hasn't been out on as Street data right people are always saying oh you're adding all these administrators you can see there was some elevation as a result of Co where some high administrative overhead to manage through that that that Suns seted we're coming back down now you know for this year so year-over-year averages the variance is very slight and what she was offering and and again I would just say this unpacking I'm hoping that you understand we don't have all of this fat Administration Dr Atkinson you talked about some of the cuts of how you categorized your spreadsheet um you know with what we saw tonight and 73% was teachers and 11% was Administration kind of makes sense 85% of our being people we only make up 3% of the budget yet we're taking 11% in administrative costs to this budget so proportionally we're you know more than double of where we fall in terms of sheer composition we will get to a point folks where you know we can talk about some of the core functions particularly in in uh director frck and Shop um but administrative assistance aren't people answering calls getting emails they're doing core functional work that by state law has to be segregated by duties and and so these are not maybe the title's misleading okay we can talk about that but the core functions you can't replicate some of these things to say well let's just cut that because we have too many admin assistants um it it's not that simple so this is a luster tip to show you and this this kind of breakout is very similar with other categories of our staff so the notion through a star report that all the staff has been added when in fact like you said the directors and you know my my push around that direct one especially is by law we have to have a special ed director but according to the star report we didn't have one we had one okay so I I I ask you all to look at this as an example of how we've been able to replicate and try to write the narrative that's out there at Street data that's act that's more factual based and so I wouldn't propose a seven years history because to chair White's Point education looked fundamentally different back in 201617 the the needs the structures the the the statutes the the policies mandates Etc very different time compared to what we're living in now and so if you want to do a year-over-year maybe a twoyear over twoyear comparison that's about as reliable as the data set is going to be anything beyond that the context is you're not comparing the same context can can I ask a question that might help um we had talked in last month in our in our um meetings that um Treasurer meet with the financial team to figure out you know what reports would be most beneficial for us governing uh I'm wondering if there could be same sort of you know when um you know as board members Staffing it is something that we want to understand and and be monitoring in in a way that is actually accurate to our district I'm wondering if if it wouldn't help if we figured out what kind of um type of a report is more feasible for your team um along with maybe you know what does that look like I think I appreciate what you've done and I I appreciate also that you're asking for the will of the board because um it's very I can only imagine how challenging it is to try to um get us you know what we're what many of us are asking in different you know we're trying our understandings are all seven people's understandings is very different so I'm wondering if that might be a direction that we could do is is um having someone I don't know maybe it's uh I don't I don't even know who who that would be if it was like committee based you know or someone on the board to say maybe it's well I would does that make sense yes and I was just going to say I to me I'm going to I'm just going to to assume in the 2425 column that that that's the right size for 2425 frankly I don't care about anything past that because to director aon's Point moving forward um when this board sometime this summer or early fall sets budget parameters um my guess is Administration is going to have to make a case for all 39 of these so that we can make an accurate ask of you and not just say uh Dr Thomas we want all 39 administrators gone M so that so we I mean and it gets to your your point of maybe a more accurate job title that lends itself to what they actually do I mean Administrative Assistant could be anything but like you said there are certain things in Tammy's office she can't do those have to be split out for audit reasons so I'm more interested in in in in that last column um bringing bringing all these positions where it's needed to Clarity so that when we when we set those parameters um later this year we know exactly what we're asking of you um because you're probably going to be put in a position where you're going to have to make a case well okay we can cut this but then that makes more sense to me than work than diving back into history where through I would agree with that I I would have chair white I'm hearing from a couple of you that that sounds very similar to just different language use of on like organizational um that would lent itself to an or yeah I mean I'm wondering if that is the will of the board for us to dedicate our resources to that to bring forward sometime in the summer um as your I don't know what time if you want it before budget parameters are set or after budget parameters set but um is is that more the will of the board than us to go back to look at historical data I would be oh I would agree too yes but I would say not filtered data that you have here because I think what you're calling administrators doesn't include a lot of the things that we would consider non-direct teaching staff so when I look at all of the additional headcount that I've seen in various things over the last few years it seems to me a lot of those ads are in counselors Dean psychologists social workers that are teachers on the report so for me it's easier to look at the one I don't know what's easier for you to produce so I guess that's the question but for me it's easier to look at the one that you did by building that's literally the entire staff of a dump and we can my understanding of the will of the board is that would be an entire organizational chart look through with all positions not specific to any group but all positions right um within the group so that's and I I am also hearing all so correct me if I'm wrong if you don't want us to be looking at different funds like if you don't want us to do organizational look at Community Ed or Child Nutrition um you know if it's just because that's going to get that's going to when it's going to get difficult because there will be some positions are split so do you want all positions to have that analysis or only positions that have a portion of funding from L one F what's easy for you to produce like I think I'm fine slicing and dicing this information in Excel but I'm okay at that so I don't know what other people can do but like what's easier for you to produce like the report that was provided last meeting was that easy or director Mason the report that was provided last meeting I don't recall it had the fun differentials fun I can kind of like tell from and the hard thing is like for um I'll speak to my department specifically we have um some of our like our our uh some of our positions have like 5% are covered by Child Nutrition and 8% are covered by Comm but the vast majority is general fund um other positions have similar things like that so um I think there are some that's very clear like that whole position is Child Nutrition but there's going to be others that are either different funds or grant-based or whatever that may be um so I I think in terms I'll just answer it this way I think what will be the easiest if we have a very clear will of the board of what the board is looking for and then we will do our best to meet that and if we can't systematically meet that then we can come back to the board to ask for Clarity on what direction to move forward differently and I can give you an example of one of the challenges that we have as as um director Herman and I work together is we have in Skyward you have a position person attached to a position and you can match their salary to what the collective bargaining agreement is for their contract and then there's also a line that may have um they have they're entitled to longevity so there's another line with the same position the same person that says longevity the amount that they get for longevity and each of those has a one FTE well for us in the business office it's not a one FTE it's one person and we only budget one FTE but because it's a separate line that they're tracking in the assignment in the HR side we have to scrub that data in order to make it make sense for what we use it for and again HR would be using it for a different purpose so they're tracking how much total people are getting paid whereas I'm just trying to look at what we're budgeting as FTE per FTE so there's just challenges that we so we can produce whatever report you want just understand that it's Skyward is not really conducive to a really clean position Control director Herman if you did this one time for everyone I understand that you're saying it's going to be extremely difficult say that's the will of the board I'm going to say thanks in advance if you did it one time would it be easier if we asked for it and again or is it just going to be just as difficult again because you have to start from zero DOR Johnson can I ask for clarity are you referring to the historical dat or starting from tomorrow okay moving forward yeah are you referring to the number of positions are you referring to the organizational analysis of positions everyone the number of positions tomorrow okay um I think moving forward will we'll be able to pull the very similar report that director Mason was referring to earlier and that cleanup is significantly less covers some than the clean up of all the system historical data and other system um so that report would be very easy to provide um to the board and then adding the fund in there would how much if you did that once would it CH wait may may I just U the I'm tapping back into what director Mason um suggested that would was more clear from your Vantage Point given your HR background and some of the work that you've done my ask is can we start with that report as our starting point to see is is this the perspective because we have that as a reference point and um and then and then make any modifications from there and are we talking about just fund one and and my I don't know I know why we need anything else my next question was going to be a fund one only um because our continued conversations are going to center around general fund reductions um at least for now right um I say that just because I know there's some legislation out there that might co-mingle funds but that day that day has not come but that way we have a narrower approach and it also cuts down on how many staff are trying to generate this report director Herman what are your thoughts on that narrowed this would that also help I think it' be very helpful I would I would really like to work with you director Mason on what you've seen in the past and we can look to and do a comparison like here's a model of what you've seen and then how does that compare to what we've already produced and see any kind of tweaks and then use that as our start point to present something back for consideration if that works with the board can I make a suggestion too because we get an entire staff directory mhm with titles and because the Skyward thing was the different I I scraped that the entire directory into a spreadsheet and have this nurse you know focuses on these has to travel between these three elementary schools and we have so many counselors at the middle in each middle school because it gives you to buy building and all that kind of stuff and now I'm not suggesting everyone do that I'm not suggesting you do it but when you actually have a question about what somebody or something does that staff directory is quite powerful it's and it's descriptive um so um when people think well this person is like just a writes memos and you know whatever answers emails or you know something like that you can actually see what they do more specifically in that building like there's really only one and then they have support help you know Etc you could also see a student service support but it it the directory is wonderful and um uh so that helps with you know and and also parents use that when they go on our website to find somebody so you can see exactly what they're doing and I I just find that reference to be very simple and easy and and also by the way it does show a significant reduction in the in the number of Staff like assistant superintendent gone you're handling you know a couple of roles stuff like that so you can actually see that collapse year over-year um and that helps and then the new ones that have come up you can actually see that too so using that as a reference has been quite illustrative so are we agreement that's starting point you one and so I'll make uh an arrangement for director Herman and I to sit down with Dr Mason as a comparison starting point like we did with some finance and then and bring forth uh an example for you all that have some discussion okay before I forget we were almost draw the table record Johnson on the Budget moving forward yeah I I I have basically agree with um essentially everyone else that well especially I think with director ainson that what she said you know um previous didn't really give the administration team parameters of what to do and that's where we're and where we're at now so good with moving forward as am I um we will have directors Mason and Johnson and fr by the time you're done you nothing changes you will a chance to cut $40 million during your during your term so congratulations I just think that moving forward we have no choice we're nibbling around the edges at this point and have to do this so many more times in a row that then we move on and try to do a a cleaner job next year for this fall and do the best we can so um having said that didn't forget this time future agenda topics anybody have any suggestions just so you know what I have so far knocked off a couple tonight uh at the opening beginning of the year we we did have a uh agreement to talk about modifying that $25,000 authorization statement we're going to discuss that the potential of an ad hoc committee uh around negotiations um whether the board is interested in moving in that direction or not um Schoolboard Town Halls is something that has been um submitted um and then as well as that um potentially working on board goals and agenda development regarding recorded presentations of administrative reports ahead of time that's posted so we have a chance to look at them ahead of time um so those those few I have um I have written down is there just so you know so I'm trying to spread these out now Wonder properly we want to talk about them there any other poal yes um chair white um does not um in the immediate uh in the immediate future but I'd like to have a discussion on the K through3 policy what context it's more it's a discussion on what it means what what potentially changes I know it there's no there's you're talking legislatively legislatively yes the legisl it's just what that means for our district again not we have other priorities as a board but just as a discussion I'd just be interested information discussion learning more well we'll we'll we'll that's actually on our platform so we'll be breing the board back as as bills come through we'll we'll be sharing anything that's on the platform we'll come back to you all and find a time to update you on kind of what that's all entailing where going whole point was it was on our platform I'm glad to see it on our platform we just haven't really discussed it much I was actually on the phone with representative bber this morning about that um and um there not much movement has happened yet they're still kind of back gathering on what is the lived experiences in in districts and I will say he will be looking for parents um that he can bring forth um from testimony on both sides of those who who have had kids in disregulated states to those who are experiencing the disregulation and they have to get evacuated and everything between so more to come on that so we'll all make sure I work with chair white to find ways that we have those touch points when we get those legislative updates to you guys that we do and director Al said we did do a behavior update like it was like last year we had a behavior update so would that be similar to what you're looking for or it's two it's two different things actually that's that's that's tied that's a data set that is fueling the legislative compensation no I understand but is it the data that you're looking for no it's the update on the legislative platform yeah we would do the non-exclusion disciplinary sorry I shouldn't have start talking about it but that's that the non-exclusionary discipline um uh legislation we will provide updates and um Dr Thomas that we would hopefully get a comprehensive legislative update on where some of those bills oh absolutely as as things move through we will be giving you those briefings you all get them too through msba so um but we'll formally do it for our community anyone else um yes you you mentioned it director ainson but uh discipline Behavior update along with rency MH um Lake Hill just had a phenomenal study session on it I was able watch that whole thing so I would love to do that yeah I'll look at our timing we have that coming as well we do that every year and so I just have to look at where it falls on the calendar but we do have that March we will be reviewing fast bridge scores and I mean I would love to see some sort of standing like curriculum review or something that we can really focus on academics just given strategic plan I feel like that needs to be a consistent agenda item somehow I don't know how we can do that yeah so Hastings just did a curriculum audit I know I had mentioned to that to you and so I think what that what that means and I that was actually my number one thing on our list is as we've developed our um strategic plan I feel like we need to make sure that our curriculum is aligned to our strategic plan of meeting academic excellence and what whether that means and in our in our strategic plan it says that curriculum is challenging rigorous and relevant so challenging rigorous and then relevant would be does it meet our standards doesn't meet MD standards um and I think that would also help for us to be more transparent with our stakeholders as well on what curriculum are we actually teaching because other districts have like on their websites this is the curriculum that's being used for middle school math English and so I think it actually would be a good thing for two reasons so I would um reiterate what director Mason said in saying I would like to see a curriculum audit K through 12 um come to the board and then it could feed into like I said add updating the website to be more transparent with our community of what the curriculum is in our district and ensuring that it meets aligns with our strategic plan other thoughts seem reasonable everyone so I'll get with Dr Thomas about timing because I'm sure that's going to take a little bit of effort it's a big undertaking I know but I think it's important given our new plan y I'm sorry I didn't mean to interrupt you did you have something else okay sorry I just want to add more context to what I was thinking around that so okay what else um and then also are we relooking at our Ani funds um as far as aligning those to the Strategic plan as well yeah I think that's uh that's another thing that we can talk about being used MH and just given some of the changes that are happening federally um as just supposed to state laws and statutes I think there's probably a good opportunity to do some updates as we're learning more um with that at the state level so add that to the to the list sorry and then I have one more thing I'm not trying to be we this was something that I believe I feel was owed coming out of the cell phone conversation that we had back yes I did bring this up yeah we were looking I I thought it was very clear in that study session that we would work towards something a little bit more um how do you say and maybe this is old board directors who are on whatever but I feel like a cell phone update at the middle school and the high school what's working what's not working do we need to tweak the policy revise the policy sure um is is relevant if everybody else agrees with that so I agree y one more item I apologize to right sure um I know that there was a a safety audit done I think it was last year or maybe was the year before something like that it's ly came up with new like to talk about that we had a lot of discussion over that in the policy Committee just maybe digging into that a little bit more maybe getting have the building principles come in I know director a and I think maybe even maybe Jess brought it up too I think at the last meeting um just how using so they brought up ltfm funds and and things like that over safety standards and protocols within the schools doesn't have to was a legislative part of part of our legislative piece and the briefing that we did director Johnson was a Clos meeting briefing um with the board because of we don't want bad people to listen to all of our security stuff we talked about that a lot actually so yeah yeah so um I'm trying to understand maybe what let me let me rethink that okay and then um you and I can connect and talk and all okay yeah all right okay good all right I think if there's nothing else we are adjourned for the evening