[0:00] [music] [0:03] Scott County, providing safe, healthy, [0:06] and livable communities. [0:09] [music] [0:12] Uh, item number five, uh, we're going to [0:15] receive information on the Scott County [0:16] delivers topic, specialty courts. So, [0:19] without further ado, Kitty Mica, [0:22] welcome. Take it away. [0:23] >> Thank you, Mr. Chair and commissioners. [0:25] Yes. Today we have specialty courts [0:27] which since its inception in 2016 each [0:30] year has been before the board. Um this [0:32] group includes of course your treatment [0:34] court and your uh veterans court as [0:36] well. I'll first ask my co-f [0:38] facilitators to introduce themselves and [0:40] their positions and then our panelists [0:42] as well please. [0:43] >> Adam Jessen, assistant county engineer [0:45] transportation services. [0:46] >> Good morning. Jen Schwarz, economic [0:48] assistance director in health and human [0:49] services. [0:50] >> Chris Logy. I'm a senior operations [0:54] analyst. uh with community services. [0:58] >> Captain Jamie Pearson, Shockby Police. [1:02] >> Mike Hayatt, County Attorney's Office. [1:03] I'm the prosecutor for both courts. [1:06] >> Carrie Lennon. I'm a judge here in Scott [1:08] County and I handle half of the [1:11] treatment court uh load. [1:13] >> Good morning everyone. Lindseay Scioa. [1:15] I'm the chief public defender for the [1:17] first judicial district. [1:19] >> Good morning everyone. Jared Linky. I'm [1:20] the probation officer for the Veterans [1:22] Treatment Court. I'm Samantha Hammond [1:25] and I'm the probation officer for [1:26] treatment court. [1:28] >> Good morning. I'm Molly Bruner, [1:29] community corrections director, health [1:30] and human services. [1:32] >> Robin Schultz. I'm the treatment court [1:34] coordinator and then I also coordinate [1:35] the West for Veterans Court. [1:38] >> Welcome. [1:39] >> Good morning. Thank you all for [1:40] introducing yourselves. Board, before we [1:42] begin, do you have any foundational [1:43] questions that would help you with this [1:45] conversation that you'd like to ask [1:46] right away? Of course, you're welcome [1:47] throughout the conversation and at the [1:49] end. [clears throat] [1:52] Not seeing anyone, [1:54] >> but we will jump in. [1:55] >> Appreciate it as always. [1:58] >> All right, Robin, did you have something [1:59] you'd like to say at the beginning? [2:00] >> Yes. Okay, please begin. [2:01] >> Um, so first off, I just wanted to thank [2:03] you to the board for being able to [2:04] support our program throughout the um [2:06] the 10 years that you guys have [2:07] supported it. And I want to talk about [2:10] our program just so that people in the [2:11] room are aware of what our program is. [2:13] So treatment court started in 2016 and [2:15] veterans court we merged with um the [2:18] first judicial district in May of 2025 [2:21] or May of 2024. Uh we have been doing [2:27] this program. Oh, sorry. Oh, I'll talk [2:30] about who's on the team. So, who's on [2:31] the team? So, like I mentioned myself, [2:33] the coordinator. Um we have a probation [2:35] officer for both treatment and veterans [2:37] court. We have a judge for both [2:39] treatment and veterans court. We have a [2:41] public defender for both courts. law [2:42] enforcement for both courts and then we [2:44] also have a treatment provider. On our [2:47] treatment court side, we have a mental [2:48] health professional who does our [2:50] diagnostic evaluations and meets with [2:51] participants throughout their time in [2:53] the program. And then we also have a [2:54] public health nurse. And then on our [2:56] veterans court side, we have a veteran [2:57] service officer for both Scott and [2:59] Carver County. And then we have a [3:01] veterans justice out specialist as well. [3:04] Um the screening process for getting [3:06] into treatment court and veterans court [3:07] is so I'll get referrals. I get them [3:09] from the county attorney's office, the [3:11] public defender's office. I get them [3:12] from the jail. Um, I get them from [3:15] therapists. I will get self- referrals, [3:17] family members, and I'll screen the [3:20] participants to see if they're eligible. [3:21] Um, we take people who are high-risisk, [3:23] high needs, so their mental health and [3:25] substance abuse um, needs for both [3:27] programs. [3:29] Some of the impacts that we've had with [3:31] our referrals over the last couple years [3:32] is the impact of the veterans veterans [3:35] restorative justice act which basically [3:37] is a new statute that would have them go [3:40] through another court process instead of [3:42] veterans court and also the [3:44] decriminalization of marijuana um with [3:47] the lower level cannabis offenses. Those [3:49] are not coming into our program anymore [3:51] as well. How we're increasing referrals [3:53] is I've been reaching out to the public [3:56] defender's office. I just met with the [3:57] county attorney's office recently [4:00] um to talk about different ways that we [4:02] can get referrals. And then we also had [4:04] some changes in March of 2025. So we [4:06] used to have offenses that were not [4:08] eligible. We still have mandatory [4:10] disqualifiers, but that has expanded or [4:13] has changed. So then we've been able to [4:15] accept more people into our program. [4:18] About the program, [clears throat] so [4:19] there's five phases. It takes about 14 [4:20] months to complete both programs. That's [4:22] obviously with no speed bumps. Um the [4:25] first phase is about stabilization, just [4:26] getting people stabilized, whether [4:28] that's in treatment, their mental health [4:29] needs, finding stable housing. The [4:31] second stage is about um psychological [4:33] stabilization. So more of them digging [4:35] into the treatment. Phase three is about [4:37] engagement and recovery and building [4:39] your network. Um phase four is finding [4:42] the path to recovery and then phase five [4:44] is life of recovery. Once they've [4:45] completed all five phases, then they [4:48] would apply for graduation and we'd have [4:49] a graduation ceremony once approved by [4:51] the team. Some of the things to note [4:53] that we've been doing um and so like I [4:56] mentioned there is the merger in 2024 [4:58] with the first judicial district. So I [5:01] oversee [clears throat] Scott and Carver [5:03] County on the west side and then Katie [5:05] Shoufelt, she oversees the east side and [5:08] her and I work very closely together. So [5:10] we had to have all three probation [5:12] systems be able to work together and [5:14] we're also working on expanding to other [5:15] counties in the first judicial district. [5:18] Um we also did the national conference [5:20] as well um where some of our team [5:22] members went out and we were making sure [5:24] that we're updated on best practices. [5:26] Our treatment court team has applied for [5:28] an operational tuneup um and that's just [5:30] to make sure that we're following our [5:32] standards and that we're getting [5:35] feedback for areas or tips for areas [5:37] that we can improve on. We've also had [5:39] some new team members. So myself, I [5:41] joined the team back in April. Jared [5:43] Link, he joined back in January, [5:46] I think, of who else is here. Oh, Mike [5:50] Hayek. He just joined our team a couple [5:52] weeks ago in the county attorney's [5:53] office and he oversees both treatment [5:55] court and veterans court. And then also [5:57] um we did not have a off like a we have [6:00] officer for um Scott County for [6:03] treatment court and we had a Carver [6:05] County officer, but we didn't have a [6:07] Scott County for veterans court. Um so [6:09] actually Detective Pearson helped [6:11] recruit some people. So now we have [6:12] Michael Detective Michael Mlan who was [6:14] on our team and he represents the Scott [6:16] County side of things. We've also had a [6:18] lot of collaboration with law [6:19] enforcement. So thank you for law [6:21] enforcement for collaborating to help [6:23] with getting people in the program as [6:25] well as doing curfew checks on our [6:27] participants. [6:28] We've had transformation houses. So we [6:30] have the three transformation houses [6:31] through the community corrections. [6:33] There's the two ma male houses and then [6:35] we just opened the female house in [6:36] October. Um and those transformation [6:38] houses have been able to help um eight [6:40] of our participants, seven from [6:42] treatment court and one from Veterans [6:43] Court um find housing in our community. [6:49] >> Thank you. Jen, do you want to start [6:50] with uh our first question for the [6:52] panelists? [6:53] >> Sure. Um let's start on page 10, the [6:55] number of treatment court referrals. Um, [6:58] Robin, you answered a little bit of of [6:59] my question, but if if you could expand [7:02] on what are the parameters or [7:05] requirements for kind of who gets in, [7:07] who who doesn't, [clears throat] and [7:09] what's the process or who kind of [7:10] decides [7:12] what what folks make it into the [7:14] treatment or or specialty court. [7:15] >> So, if someone applies or gets referred [7:18] um like through the county attorney's [7:19] office or public defenders office, [7:21] typically what happens is I'll meet with [7:22] them. Well, first I'll check their [7:23] offense and I'll make sure their offense [7:25] is eligible, whether it's for veterans [7:26] court or treatment court. Make sure that [7:28] it's eligible because we do have certain [7:29] offenses that we do not take. Um, after [7:31] I assess that it's eligible, I check [7:33] their address. Some do people do report [7:35] that they're homeless. So, especially if [7:37] they're in the jail, I'll go meet with [7:38] them over there and see if they're [7:40] established residents in our county. [7:42] After I do that, I will do a screening [7:44] assessment where I'll do an RANT [7:46] assessment. It's the high-risisk high [7:48] needs assessment. And then I also do an [7:49] LSMI, which is another assessment. and [7:52] that will determine if they're [7:53] high-risisk, high needs. After that, [7:55] I'll gather some other information, but [7:56] I'll notify law enforcement in our [7:58] county attorney's office. They'll do [8:00] their screening process, which I'll [8:01] defer to them for how their process [8:03] works. And then they'll have to observe [8:06] two times in if they're in treatment [8:08] court or veterans court, and then after [8:10] their observation, they can decide if [8:12] they want to play into the program or [8:13] not. [8:14] >> Okay. And so, it's those pretty severe [8:16] offenses that you're disqualifying off [8:18] the top. Is that [8:19] >> Yes. [8:21] Thanks. [8:23] >> Connected to that, if you look on page [8:25] three in your narrative, it talks about [8:27] the significant remote statute changes [8:29] in 2024 and 2025. So maybe the attorneys [8:32] could speak to how this impacts [8:34] referrals and participant numbers. [8:38] >> So [8:40] we did expand criteria to let more [8:42] people be eligible. Um, [clears throat] [8:43] of course when we do that and because [8:46] we're looking at high-risisk, high need [8:49] only because if you're not high- risk [8:51] and high need, you do not qualify. So [8:55] when we do that, we are looking at a a [8:58] subset of the population of who is in [9:01] for court. And so in doing that, we have [9:04] to also look at are there additional [9:07] public safety concerns that are too [9:09] severe to have law enforcement andor the [9:12] county attorney's office be comfortable [9:14] with them. So it does by expanding our [9:17] criteria, we're making our pool larger, [9:19] but we're not really changing the [9:22] character of who we have. So we're still [9:24] looking to help the same folks. We're [9:27] just looking to have additional [9:29] eligibility so that we can when Robin is [9:33] doing her first initial does this [9:35] offense qualify when she's doing her [9:37] screening we can get more people that [9:39] would qualify for that. [9:43] >> I would add additionally when the [9:46] mandatory minimums were reduced by the [9:48] sentencing guidelines many subsequent [9:50] drug crimes prior to 2024 2025 received [9:54] mandatory commits to prison. Meaning, if [9:56] someone was charged with a subsequent [9:58] felony level drug crime, depending on [10:00] what it was and for how much, those [10:02] clients of ours um or defendants were [10:06] looking at going to prison on what would [10:07] be mandatory minimum sentences to the [10:09] Department of Corrections. Those [10:12] clients, especially if they're [10:13] high-risisk, high need, would then be [10:15] potentially eligible for a departure to [10:18] probation. And normally the only way we [10:20] could facilitate that is through um a [10:23] treatment court setting where they get [10:25] intensive supervision from probation um [10:27] from the great community corrections [10:29] team that's here in Scott County that [10:30] does a fantastic job. They get [10:32] additional oversight from the judge. [10:35] They have a dedicated attorney team um [10:38] from my office who staffs this calendar [10:39] and also from the county attorney's [10:41] office. So a lot of these sentences that [10:43] we saw were like but for treatment court [10:47] these clients would have gone to prison. [10:49] So this is really a safety valve of [10:50] rather than send them to prison and just [10:52] kind of hope for the best. These clients [10:54] got wrap around treatment services [10:57] through the Scott County Treatment Court [10:59] so that then they would go back into the [11:01] community and more be more successful [11:02] contributors to the community. Their [11:04] recidivism rates were much lower. So [11:06] this was really a big safety valve for [11:08] many of those clients that were looking [11:09] at mandatory minimum sentences. Those [11:12] clients still exist. So those clients [11:15] are still coming through courts. Their [11:18] sentences are just slightly modified and [11:20] not as many of them are presumptive go [11:22] to prison cases due to some of these [11:23] changes by the sentencing guidelines. [11:26] But even if they're not on the track to [11:28] go to prison, many of these clients [11:30] would not get the services needed by [11:32] Scott County Treatment Courts. um if [11:36] this program weren't in place. So I [11:37] would just acknowledge the great benefit [11:39] that this treatment courts provides for [11:41] these clients who are high-risisk high [11:43] need who would be on the track to [11:44] otherwise go to prison who instead get [11:47] an opportunity to get exceptional [11:48] wraparound services from the entire team [11:51] um from the community from law [11:52] enforcement that does their checks. So [11:55] this program really offers an [11:58] exceptional kind of support mechanism [12:01] for many of these clients who are [12:02] high-risisk high need and as we would [12:04] kind of talk some really hightouch [12:06] clients that really need exceptional [12:07] services. Um Molly's team does a [12:10] fantastic job with our traditional [12:11] high-risisk, high need high clients, but [12:13] many of these treatment court clients [12:15] are yet another level of kind of [12:17] hands-on support and this treatment [12:20] court keeps many of those people out of [12:21] the streets and off um from committing [12:23] new offenses. So I would just add that [12:25] that when we talk about that reduced [12:27] mandatory minimum sentences, this [12:29] treatment court was really the only [12:30] mechanism to keep many of these clients [12:33] out of prison in terms of negotiating a [12:35] resolution between um the county [12:37] attorney's office and the defense [12:38] lawyers. [12:40] >> I'll just add one thing. I think when we [12:42] expand the the pool from which we can [12:44] choose, we're acknowledging that [12:47] addiction impacts more than just drug [12:50] crimes and theft crimes. You know, we [12:52] always used to think, oh, people steal [12:53] to support their drug. True. And they [12:56] have drug possession cases and that's [12:57] who we're really talking about. But [13:00] people with serious addiction issues, [13:02] they screw up all parts of their lives. [13:04] It's amazing. It's not a good thing. Um, [13:07] but we have found that by by expanding [13:11] our our base, so to speak, that we can [13:14] identify people whose addiction has [13:16] impacted other areas of their lives. and [13:21] that is something that we can address [13:24] through the the services that we can [13:26] provide um in our treatment court. So [13:28] that's been really I think meaningful [13:30] for some of our participants that we [13:32] would normally have not or traditionally [13:34] have not taken. on the page eight shows [13:37] some of the impact of [snorts] of that [13:39] um with the life factors that that would [13:41] see the change um from uh entering the [13:44] program to exiting the program in regard [13:46] to child contact, employment, housing, [13:49] and uh having a driver's license. Um so [13:52] obviously that shows the impact of those [13:53] wraparound services that you're all [13:55] talking about. um [clears throat] what [13:57] goes into and I think uh Robin you [13:59] talked about stage five um of the [14:02] program but what goes into ensuring that [14:04] those life factors are stable at [14:06] graduation and that that's going to that [14:08] trend is going to continue after the [14:09] fact and are there any considerations [14:11] for how they maintain contact whether [14:14] you know handing off to a lower-end [14:16] surface or to a nonprofit or where do [14:18] they go after they leave the program? [14:21] God, that's such a good question because [14:24] that's the biggest worry. And then and [14:26] we used to say to people, you know, [14:27] we're giving you all these skills and we [14:30] know that addiction is a lifelong [14:32] problem, but what we want is for if [14:35] there's a stumble in the future that you [14:37] don't fall all the way back down the [14:39] mountain. And so we've given them all [14:42] kinds of tools to help themselves in the [14:46] community. And the people that we see [14:49] that have the best long-term success [14:52] outside of when they complete our [14:54] program are ones who have gotten [14:55] involved in the sober support community [14:58] and they're helping others. And by [15:01] helping others, they are maintaining [15:04] their own stability going forward. And I [15:07] hate to say it, this is super sexist, [15:09] but for the guys, if they get a good [15:11] woman who doesn't take any crap, that's [15:13] the best category. They are the people [15:14] that do the best long term. [15:16] [clears throat] That's what they need. [15:17] They all need somebody going, "Uh-uh." [15:19] [laughter] [15:20] >> Truth is truth. [15:21] >> It's true. The board acknowledge that [15:24] >> the board approved. [snorts] [15:26] >> Thank you. [15:30] >> Uh I'm going to talk about on um page [15:34] 13. It's been brought up a couple times [15:36] about the law enforcement check-in. And [15:38] I'm just curious if you can give us some [15:41] information about um why is this data [15:43] important? What do those checks entail? [15:47] >> Yeah, so the curfew checks, anybody [15:49] who's living within the county, in the [15:51] communities, um they're subject to the [15:54] curfew checks by law enforcement. Um [15:56] some agencies participate more than [15:59] others. Um call load depends on how [16:02] often it happens. Um but we communicate [16:06] to them what the curfew is. the [16:08] participants know what the expectations [16:10] are that they're to be home between, you [16:13] know, whatever the hours are. Um, and [16:16] the officers go out there and they knock [16:17] on the door and they make sure that [16:18] they're home. That is our opportunity to [16:21] build the relationship with the [16:22] participants and that's where you see [16:25] kind of the minds mind shift um with the [16:28] participants and their view of law [16:30] enforcement. And our hope is they can [16:33] build the relationship with the officers [16:34] doing the curfew checks and um it just [16:37] kind of grows from there. Um you know, [16:40] if they're in violation of a curfew, the [16:43] judge can sanction them at their next [16:46] court hearing. Um it's usually it's not [16:49] jail or anything like that. Um, [16:52] and yeah, it's just a really great [16:55] opportunity for us to hold them [16:57] accountable um, and build the [17:00] relationship and be a level of support [17:03] for them outside of the courtroom every [17:05] week. Um, every officer approaches it a [17:09] little bit different. You got to be a [17:11] little bit careful that you're not [17:12] getting too personal with the [17:13] participants and things like that. Um, [17:16] uh, but they share their work cell phone [17:18] numbers with them. um they encourage [17:20] them to call if they're struggling, if [17:22] they need help at any moment and it's 2 [17:25] o'clock in the [snorts] morning, uh call [17:27] us. That's what we're here for. Um so, [17:31] you know, it's evolved over time and we [17:33] have the ability to be super creative [17:35] with it and it really rely depends on [17:38] the officers [17:40] um you know, how how interested are they [17:42] in it. Are they just going to knock on [17:44] the door? Yep, you're home. Sounds good. [17:45] See you later. Or are they going to put [17:47] the time and the effort in? Um, I of [17:50] course encourage everybody to put the [17:51] the time and the effort in. I recognize [17:54] that not everybody has the same level of [17:56] passion for this work as I do. So, um, [18:00] if they're just simply doing the check [18:01] and and not having those conversations, [18:04] you know, how do you how do you force [18:06] that upon them? Don't. But the important [18:08] thing is is that they're checking on [18:10] them and they're home and they're [18:11] following the rules and and things like [18:13] that. So, [18:14] >> it's part of the accountability of the [18:16] program. We're we're providing them the [18:19] real experience of we are here to [18:22] support you and we are going to be [18:25] keeping tabs on you all the time, [18:26] including at night. Um, so they they [18:30] know that we are always there for them [18:35] um and that we're always part of their [18:39] journey so that we are providing the [18:41] wraparound services. And I just want to [18:44] add to that um for the six months that [18:46] I've been here for the people who have [18:47] graduated at graduation like everybody [18:50] from the team can go around and say like [18:52] things that they've seen from like start [18:54] to finish and I I always hear like the [18:56] most positive things of like okay this [18:58] is where you were a couple years ago [18:59] when you started the program compared to [19:01] now with law enforcement. You can just [19:02] see [laughter] the the gap that it's [19:04] like closed from law enforcement and the [19:07] participants in our program. [19:12] Uh let's see on page 12 the treatment [19:15] court outcomes by year. Kind of just a [19:18] broader question. You've been doing this [19:19] about eight years now. What have you [19:21] learned and what have you modified over [19:23] time um that has worked or or kind of [19:27] things that you think you might be [19:29] looking to do in the future? [19:32] >> I think I can start on that one. Um, I [19:35] have learned that mental health is a far [19:39] bigger concern than we thought initially [19:43] and Dr. Schul, who is our favorite [19:46] member of the team, [laughter] [19:49] >> um, has done a super job of walking that [19:52] in her own line of not violating the [19:54] confidentiality of her clients, but [19:55] still helping us be sensitive to [19:57] people's mental health needs. We've [19:59] started using Earth's facilities more [20:01] than we ever have in the past. That's [20:03] been a a huge change. The other huge [20:06] change I think is the transformation [20:09] houses and having that stable housing [20:13] for people because that is just such a [20:16] challenge and and that I give huge kudos [20:20] to the um to the county for that [20:24] opportunity to have that that housing [20:26] available for for some of our folks [20:28] because that's a big deal. So, we've [20:29] certainly learned that. Um, and I think [20:32] we've learned more about [20:35] what the warning signs are. I was kind [20:38] of naive when I started and I just doing [20:41] this work and all of a sudden I'm like, [20:43] uh, let's see. I'm my my suspicion level [20:46] comes up faster and I think we're we're [20:48] more responsive being like, okay, we [20:52] [clears throat] need to step in now. We [20:53] can't wait until this is a crisis. [20:57] I I will add from my perspective on the [20:59] housing piece, I think the [21:01] transformation houses are gigantic step [21:05] in the right direction for this program [21:07] because it keeps our participants in the [21:10] county. They're living in the county. [21:12] We're able to better supervise them when [21:14] they're in the county and we can have [21:16] that close contact with them where if [21:19] they're in a sober house in Minneapolis, [21:22] you know, Sam is traveling to [21:24] Minneapolis to visit with them. How [21:26] often is she able to do that with her [21:27] case load? I can't go to Minneapolis and [21:30] visit with them in the middle of the [21:31] night, but if they're here in the [21:33] county, it allows us to have that close [21:35] contact with them. So, the housing is [21:38] essential. And I think the more we can [21:41] keep our participants in the county, [21:44] obviously, the more accountable we can [21:45] hold them to the program. [21:49] >> And I would add, you know, judge, you [21:51] mentioned the relationship piece. I [21:53] think that what not only these homes [21:54] provide but family resource center, [21:56] Destiny Way program or uh Destiny Dad's [21:59] program, we're going to start a mom's [22:01] program. Um that peers, family [22:04] relationships, right, are so core to [22:06] building those social supports. The [22:09] homes are voluntary clients as well as [22:10] this program is a voluntary program. So [22:12] you're surrounded by people that are [22:13] trying to improve their lives, right? [22:15] They're on the same kind of trajectory [22:17] towards hopefully exiting the system. [22:19] And the more you surround yourself with [22:21] people doing that in whatever capacity, [22:23] the better people are, right? Um I've [22:26] heard the you're the average of the 10 [22:27] people you hang out with the most, [22:28] right? And so where are our folks [22:30] hanging out with? Where do they have [22:31] access to meet new friends, new people, [22:34] um and to have that sober community as [22:36] was already mentioned? And so I just [22:38] think there's a multitude of things that [22:39] are going really well and that we've [22:41] learned over the years. So [22:45] >> on uh page seven, we have some data [22:48] about [22:49] treatment court recidivism. [22:51] Um, and looking at the data, I know [22:53] there's some some blanks towards the [22:54] towards the end as we don't have the [22:56] data from for two and three years out, [22:58] but uh, looking at 2021 and 2022, I see [23:01] some zeros there, which looks like good [23:03] news to me are and [23:04] >> it was a pandemic. [23:06] >> Maybe [laughter] [23:07] that's the case. know what anyone was [23:08] doing. [23:09] >> If there were any strategies that came [23:10] into play during that time frame or [23:12] maybe it was just kind of what was going [23:14] on in the world or um maybe we feel like [23:17] the program has improved with some of [23:19] those lessons learned we've we've [23:20] implemented and we're we're seeing the [23:22] data says that we're doing a better job [23:24] over time. So kind of curious about that [23:26] and then also if there are any lessons [23:28] or strategies that have been learned [23:29] through this program that apply back to [23:31] kind of the general court that can help [23:33] recapture some of the investment that we [23:34] we put into this program. Now we're it's [23:36] helping us actually, you know, across [23:37] the board. [23:42] >> I'll just give an example really quick. [23:43] So I was talking with my lawyers that [23:45] staff this calendar. So we're talking [23:47] about recidivism rates and we're talking [23:49] about wraparound services. The judge [23:51] mentioned mental health. Um Peg Case [23:55] works with a lot of our um challenging [23:57] clients. I see people here on the panel [23:59] nodding with me. Um but she was working [24:01] with a client of ours who not only had [24:03] chemical dependency issues but again [24:06] normally we have MICD clients come [24:08] through mental illness and chemical [24:09] dependency issues. You know this client [24:12] was really challenging to deal with and [24:15] I think but for PEG going above and [24:16] beyond to stay in touch with this [24:18] individual get them connected eventually [24:21] get them into an earth they were on a [24:22] waiting list this person likely would [24:24] have spiraled out of control and [24:26] probably committed a new offense [24:27] somewhere. So, and if we're looking at [24:30] how do we impact recidivism, it's how do [24:32] we get that on the front end. Um, it's [24:34] like anybody who's running a business, [24:36] if you invest on the front end, you pay [24:37] dividends in the back end. So, I think [24:39] having people like Peg Case work with [24:41] some of our really hightouch challenging [24:43] clients is where you see these [24:45] recidivism numbers come down and really [24:47] have that close connection with the [24:49] client. getting them into an ERS [24:51] facility that where we really see these [24:53] recidivism numbers really drop off [24:54] because we're investing in people that [24:56] need extra handholding on the front end [24:59] so they're not committing new offenses [25:00] and they're not committing new crimes in [25:02] the community which brings public safety [25:04] down, [25:06] >> you know, and that's a great point that [25:07] that I should have made earlier is that [25:09] we also our folks establish [25:11] relationships with county resources like [25:14] Peg. Uh, Peg Case is very, very good at [25:19] her job and I think people establish a [25:21] relationship with her and they remember [25:23] her [25:24] >> and then they get into a crisis when [25:26] they're all done with us and they know [25:27] that they can go back there. They know [25:29] they can go back to Dr. Schult. They [25:31] know that they can reach out to some of [25:33] these county resources. And I think it's [25:36] been such a value to all of us to [25:38] establish these relationships across [25:40] departmental lines so that we know in a [25:43] pinch that there's somebody that we can [25:45] call on and and ask questions of and and [25:48] that's just that's just what makes us [25:52] all better at all of the work we do, not [25:55] just our treatment court work. [25:57] >> Yeah. to go off that me addressing the [25:59] mental health things are has been so [26:01] important because we can treat the CD [26:06] the chemical dependency side but if the [26:08] participant is also dealing with mental [26:10] health issues we can only have those [26:13] guard rails up so high because we're not [26:15] actually addressing the real issues that [26:17] are causing the CD issues. Um I mean [26:20] just yesterday in in veterans court [26:22] there was someone who was describing [26:24] themselves saying that the alcohol isn't [26:27] the problem. [26:29] >> The problem is my mental health issues [26:31] that I am using the alcohol to treat. M [26:34] >> and he had come to that realization [26:36] through his treatment that this is it [26:40] looks like the problem [snorts] but it's [26:42] just a symptom right and you treat the [26:44] symptom sure the symptom can go away but [26:47] there's going to be a different solution [26:49] to the underlying problem and I think [26:52] it's important to note when looking at [26:53] these rec recidivism numbers these are [26:56] all for high-risisk highnee people who [26:58] if left to their own devices [27:00] would be very likely to be committed new [27:03] crimes because they have they're at a [27:06] high risk to commit new offenses and [27:08] they are have high needs. So, we're [27:10] taking folks who are in a very difficult [27:13] spot and providing all of these services [27:16] to [27:18] help them so that we're not simply [27:21] spending the money elsewhere through law [27:23] enforcement and court [clears throat] [27:25] involvement and more [27:28] unsuccessful treatment programs because [27:30] the unsuccessful treatment program [27:32] they're getting on probation isn't [27:33] addressing every need because the person [27:36] with a traditional probation case load [27:39] cannot [27:39] identify all of the issues that people [27:41] have. [27:43] >> With our programs and our ability to [27:45] work with clients and get some more [27:47] information ahead of time before they [27:48] start working with our programs, we are [27:50] able to maintain a much more proactive [27:54] and forward focused work kind of [27:58] philosophy with those clients. We're [27:59] able to support them in a different way [28:00] than traditional court would be able to [28:02] be able to where it's more reactive. [28:04] That proactiveness allows us to case [28:06] plan and build around their successes [28:09] and help them build up to find ways to [28:12] be more successful in the community and [28:13] to live a life that they see as more [28:16] fitting and more appropriate. [28:21] I as the probation officers on the [28:23] teams, I'm wondering if you could kind [28:25] of connect um what this looks like in [28:28] reality for people anonymized of course, [28:30] but when we talk about recidivism rates [28:32] and that change happening, but then also [28:34] those life factors, if you guys had any [28:36] that you wouldn't mind sharing today, I [28:37] think that would also be helpful because [28:39] talking about num numbers, but then [28:40] these numbers are are people. [28:42] >> Absolutely. Our we have a number of [28:44] examples of clients that we could share. [28:46] One specific thing I wanted to talk [28:48] about. Um, we can call him John for now [28:52] just because names will be a little more [28:53] private. Um, when John came to us, he [28:56] was homeless, using on a daily basis, [29:00] and consistently struggling with mental [29:02] health. It was something he wasn't [29:04] willing to seek treatment for. He wasn't [29:06] comfortable approaching the VA for that [29:07] treatment. And he's been working with us [29:10] for about nine months now. He is now [29:12] housed regularly attending weekly [29:14] therapy, has a number of medications for [29:18] him, and is sober. to be able to provide [29:20] that to a veteran, to someone who has [29:22] served their country and has provided [29:25] truly something I'm very thankful for. [29:28] To be able to help them walk that path, [29:30] to walk with them to pick them up where [29:33] they're living and take them to a hotel [29:35] to try and look at that hotel, to take [29:37] them to a an apartment to see if that [29:40] would be a good fit for them, to get the [29:42] benefits in place that this person can [29:44] be supportive and can be successful in [29:46] the community. That's incredibly [29:48] important. And to see him flourish now [29:51] in a new apartment, sober, taking his [29:54] medications is really an incredibly [29:56] moving thing. [snorts] And I wish he was [29:57] here to speak to his story as well. [30:01] >> Um, I have another example as well. I [30:05] I've worked with a um a woman who [30:10] was [30:11] addicted to meth. Um she had all three [30:16] of her kids removed from the house. Uh [30:19] working with child protection. Um lost [30:22] her children for many years, [30:26] was bouncing in between homes. Um really [30:29] didn't have any success and then she [30:32] decided to participate in treatment [30:34] court. Um [clears throat] fast forward, [30:36] she's sober. She is working um as a CPR [30:43] or she was working as a CPRS, meaning [30:45] she was giving back to the sober [30:47] community. Um she was working at an [30:50] outpatient treatment facility helping [30:52] others stay sober and she got all three [30:56] of her kids back. Um it was a great [30:59] success story. She's living on her own. [31:02] She has her own income. She has her own [31:05] place and um she's very happy. [31:09] >> Can I ask what happens to those kids? Do [31:12] they have problems down the road then or [31:15] >> we ever follow that? [31:17] >> Not just those kids but from [31:21] >> it's we don't collect any data on that. [31:24] Um as far as I know it's just it's that [31:27] would be a challenge. They'd have to be [31:28] involved in the system in some kind of [31:30] way. I'm sure there is data you can find [31:31] somewhere, but specifically for us, we [31:33] don't have that necessarily right now. [31:35] >> I only Sorry, I was going to say the [31:38] only data that we track was is from the [31:39] start of their time in the program to [31:41] the end of their time in the program. [31:42] So, we keep [clears throat] track like [31:44] if they're involved with CPS at the [31:45] beginning or if they custody, how much [31:47] contact they had and at the end when [31:49] they graduate or if they're terminated, [31:50] we would also enter that data. And when [31:53] we have families that that are involved [31:56] in CPS, we do try and work really [31:58] closely with CPS to make sure that the [32:01] children are getting um the needs [32:04] >> their needs met. So, uh like for this [32:07] family, they were attending weekly [32:10] family therapy sessions hopefully hoping [32:13] [snorts] that will help. [32:14] >> Commissioner Wolf, why don't we let [32:16] Suzanne maybe address that and aces and [32:18] what it means? [32:21] >> Sure. Good morning. Uh Mr. Chair, [32:23] commissioners, [clears throat] so I [32:24] think as um your panelists already [32:26] referenced that um when there is sort of [32:28] the co-involvement with treatment court [32:30] um and child protection, it is really [32:32] around how are we coordinating services [32:34] for kids and their parents. In this [32:37] case, um again, I don't know what case [32:39] or the details, but kids are in foster [32:41] care. Those are generally then um [32:43] juvenile cases that are overseen by the [32:45] child protection um courts. And we [32:47] certainly work in tandem to look at how [32:50] do we uh facilitate safe reunification [32:53] and then safe really post county [32:56] involvement of any kind. What are the [32:58] safety networks that can remain intact [33:01] and in place to support the kids and [33:03] families long term? Um because we know [33:05] that whether it's treatment court or [33:07] child protection, we're not a lifelong [33:09] service. But how do we set them up in [33:10] the community to be to be as successful [33:12] as possible? [33:20] Uh, if we look at page 11, um, it's [33:23] talking about the number of treatment [33:24] court denials. A lot of the categories [33:27] are pretty self-explanatory, but I'm [33:29] curious, uh, if you can talk about some [33:31] of the reasons for denial from some of [33:33] the other areas that maybe aren't so [33:36] cut and dry. [33:39] >> Yes. So, I'll first talk about the not a [33:40] resident one. Um, so not a resident. [33:43] That would basically be if someone is [33:46] referred to the program and we don't [33:48] know where they're at, like if they're [33:49] reporting homeless. I get a lot of jail [33:51] referrals where the person in jail will [33:53] message me directly and they'll put [33:55] homeless in there. Um, and so that would [33:57] count as a referral. Um, so that would [33:59] be where they're not a resident. Um, [34:01] non-compliance would be something where [34:04] someone isn't compliant with the [34:05] screening process where like you can't [34:07] get a hold of them or they're not [34:08] calling you back. [34:10] um the criminal history section. So that [34:14] typically is where if I'm just screening [34:17] them and I've noticed throughout their [34:20] like once I do the screening that they [34:22] have maybe a like a past defense that [34:25] would make them ineligible for the [34:27] program. That would be the criminal [34:29] history. The county attorney too if they [34:31] ever see that but that would be [34:33] considered a also I guess a criminal [34:36] history one. And then just other [34:41] one is [34:42] >> the other one I guess depends on what it [34:44] is. Like I recently just had one where [34:46] the person had out of state matters that [34:48] they were dealing with um that had to be [34:50] taken care of before. So that one just [34:52] would depend on the specific [34:54] person. [34:56] >> I would add as someone who tracks often [34:59] where our clients live and come from. [35:02] Um, I often refer to Scott County as my [35:06] county as this is my Clark County or Las [35:07] Vegas of the first district because so [35:10] many of our so many of our I like to [35:13] think positively about that um are not [35:16] actually from Scott County because of [35:19] all of the wonderful attractions that [35:21] Scounty has that bring in a lot of [35:22] wonderful revenue to the county. But [35:24] many of um our clients especially come [35:27] through the public defender office if [35:29] they're getting picked up at Mystic Lake [35:31] Canterbury Valley Fair or wherever that [35:33] new golf place is going to go. Um many [35:35] of those clients come from not Scott [35:37] County and then they otherwise would be [35:39] really great treatment court candidates [35:41] but they don't live here. or we we [35:43] [clears throat] just had a client that [35:44] oh this person would have been a great [35:46] treatment court candidate but when we [35:47] looked at the homeless factors there [35:49] weren't enough nexus or ties to Scott [35:50] County to anchor them here to kind of [35:52] justify investing Scott color resources [35:55] especially for um the curfew checks um [35:59] that were were mentioned as well but I [36:01] would say a lot of our clients that come [36:03] through that might come through the jail [36:04] as referrals for treatment court might [36:06] look like good candidates but the more [36:07] we dig they're just not from Scott [36:09] County specifically because they don't [36:11] live here because we have so any out of [36:12] county clients that come through that [36:15] get picked up doing silly things they're [36:17] not supposed to be doing while they're [36:18] here [36:20] >> as it relates to the county attorney [36:24] um denials. So the program is set up [36:28] where there's effectively two tracks for [36:31] screening. Um, Robin, our coordinator, [36:35] does screening to check eligibility [36:37] criteria and then assuming someone [36:39] passes that, then it goes on to the [36:42] county attorney's office for review. And [36:44] our review process involves law [36:46] enforcement. So, in any any of those [36:48] situations, I reach out to Captain [36:49] Pearson and she checks with law [36:51] enforcement about their feedback. um [36:53] because our review is primarily directed [36:58] around the public safety aspect of this [37:01] and public safety includes the other [37:04] participants in the program. So [37:08] we can get candidates who on paper look [37:10] like they would be a good fit. They meet [37:13] high-risisk high need. They live in the [37:16] county. Um they don't have any mandatory [37:19] disqualifying offenses. [37:21] But then, for example, we'll check with [37:24] law enforcement and law enforcement will [37:26] have information that isn't formal [37:29] charges or other things like that, but [37:32] they have information that perhaps this [37:33] person is highly connected to really [37:37] high level drug distribution. Our [37:40] concern is that if we put someone like [37:42] that in a treatment court with a bunch [37:44] of people who are struggling in [37:45] recovery, we have given someone with [37:48] great connections for dealing a new [37:50] client base. [37:52] >> Um that is not to say that every drug [37:54] dis drug sale charge is vetoed. We [37:58] evaluate every case on its own. Uh we [38:01] take feedback from law enforcement. We [38:03] then do our own internal review. I work [38:06] with the attorney who has assigned the [38:08] case, if it's not me, about their [38:11] thoughts, concerns about what h has [38:13] happened with the case so far, what they [38:15] know about it. I discuss with the county [38:17] attorney himself about each referral. Um [38:21] there are times when public safety risk [38:23] is too significant uh for us to agree [38:27] and the county attorney has a veto power [38:30] for referral when that public safety [38:33] issue is too concerning because we do [38:35] not want to set back everyone else in [38:38] the program by giving someone a shot. Uh [38:40] we want to be very careful and [38:42] protective of our group because [38:43] otherwise we'll see [38:46] our estimation is that we will see that [38:48] termination number go way up because [38:50] then a lot of people will backslide very [38:52] far because a bad apple can spoil the [38:54] bunch. [38:57] >> With respect to time, I want to finish [38:58] up with just two questions if you don't [39:00] mind. the first of which being for Judge [39:01] Lennon um referring to our veterans [39:03] court. If you could speak to the [39:05] collaboration amongst the different [39:06] counties and across the judicial [39:08] district and talk about why you think [39:10] you're having success in that regards. [39:13] >> I think we're having success in that [39:14] regard, aren't we, Jared? Okay. [39:16] >> [laughter] [39:17] >> Um, back at the time I was chief of the [39:19] district, I was able to start talking [39:22] about collaborating, working together [39:24] because individually a lot of counties [39:26] don't have the high enough numbers to [39:28] justify a standalone court. So, we [39:31] combined um Dakota, Carver, and Scott [39:34] into one umbrella um first districtwide [39:39] veterans court and we are open to [39:42] accepting other folks from Lassour, [39:44] Mloud, Sibi, and Good Hugh. We have it. [39:49] um we've consolidated some of the the [39:54] needs for that group to hopefully [39:57] make that more efficient as well as to [39:59] kind of save money in the big picture. [40:02] Uh that was a collaboration that [40:07] well the devil was in the details and so [40:09] I started I kind of came in and said we [40:11] should do this. Isn't this a great idea? [40:13] Let's all work together. Okay. See you. [40:16] And then I walked away and made other [40:18] people like follow through on the [40:20] details. Poor Molly. She probably has to [40:23] cover the gray hair now that was caused [40:25] by that process. But [laughter] [40:27] um we we felt like it was the right [40:30] thing to do at the time. We have a [40:32] couple judges who are super interested [40:34] in doing it and they and because of of [40:38] this umbrella district, we can we can [40:40] move judges around in the district to [40:42] cover these um calendars without needing [40:45] to have someone specialized in the [40:47] particular county. And so that's been [40:49] super helpful. Bryce Man, who was a [40:52] county attorney here in Scott years ago, [40:55] now handles our our what we call our [40:58] West End um veterans court group. And [41:02] then we have Judge O'Brien, who also [41:04] used to be here, who does our East End. [41:06] And we are finding that this [41:09] collaboration has allowed for people, we [41:12] talk about this housing issue. If you [41:14] can't find housing for someone in your [41:16] exact county, we have much more [41:18] flexibility now because we we're [41:20] crossing county lines within the [41:22] district and can and can handle that can [41:24] handle that supervision, can handle [41:26] where we where we hear that case. So, [41:29] that's been a real um plus. We've been [41:32] very happy about it. We've had super [41:34] cooperation between um the corrections [41:38] folks, which is what was, [41:40] [clears throat] you know, the real the [41:41] real crux of it in getting that done. [41:43] Um, we got uh some accolades from the [41:47] judicial council for that effort and [41:50] we're encouraging that effort in other [41:52] districts um to allow for both veterans [41:55] courts and treatment courts to be um to [41:58] work at a at a combined um function so [42:03] that they can serve more folks and and [42:05] do it more economically. [42:07] >> Thank you, Judge. Um and then final [42:09] question before we turn it back to Mr. [42:10] Chair and the board. Uh Molly, could you [42:12] speak to on page three of the narrative, [42:14] you talk about a quality insurance [42:15] review? Um what this might mean and what [42:18] you're hoping to learn from that. [42:20] >> Yes, absolutely. Thank you. Um so I [42:22] think Robin mentioned this at the [42:23] beginning. [clears throat] Uh but there [42:25] is so Allrise is the National [42:27] Organization for Specialty Courts. Um [42:29] that application has been submitted. We [42:31] don't know back yet, right? Okay. We're [42:33] waiting to hear a response, but that [42:35] would be um a real they come in and they [42:38] do again that quality assurance check. [42:39] So how close are we aligning to the best [42:41] practices nationally recommendations [42:43] being able to take a a look at that. Um [42:45] in conjunction with that we have uh been [42:48] conducting an ongoing thirdparty [42:49] evaluation of treatment court. So it's a [42:52] deep deep dive into some of the graphs [42:53] that you see here. And so we are [42:56] prepared for January. We're going to do [42:58] a board workshop with you or we'll we [43:00] can bring that data to you um and again [43:02] take a deeper dive into some of the [43:04] things that uh were discussed today. And [43:07] so, uh, stay tuned for that as well. [43:10] >> Thank you. I'll I'll turn it back to Mr. [43:12] Chair and [43:12] >> Great. Thank you so much. [43:14] >> I have one. [43:15] >> Yeah, please. [43:16] >> I'm I'm thinking of life factors before [43:19] and after u whether it's treatment court [43:22] or drug uh or veterans court. And I'll [43:25] just give you a little quick little [43:27] story. I used to do uh jail church [43:29] services for about 20 years in the Scott [43:31] County Jail. And every once in a while [43:33] there'd be somebody that says, "You're [43:34] never going to see me here again. I'm [43:36] never coming back. [43:38] >> Well, then sometime later I'd see him. [43:40] I'd go, "You're back. Why are you back?" [43:44] "Well, I was with a friend and you Fred [43:46] had drugs in the car and I was on [43:48] probation and that got me back here." [43:51] And then I told him a Bible verse and I [43:53] think this will be the first time I [43:54] reference a Bible verse as a county [43:56] commissioner. A companion of fools [43:58] suffers harm. [44:00] >> That's what I told him. I said, "If you [44:01] want to live a new life, you're going to [44:03] have to have new friends." I mean [44:05] they'll drag you where you don't want to [44:07] go the old friends. And so I I think of [44:10] life factors, you know, and this these [44:11] are all objective easily checked that do [44:13] they have are they employed? Do they [44:16] have stable housing? But this the [44:18] subjective one of a life factor of [44:20] social network. I don't know how you [44:22] deal with that but that's that's a [44:23] critical component I would [44:25] >> oh we talk about it all the time. Who [44:27] are your sober friends? Who are your [44:28] people? Who are the ones you can go to? [44:30] every phase okay [44:32] >> development we talk about who are the [44:34] people that are you need to [44:37] >> be be combined with now because you [44:40] can't you know what happens if you go [44:44] back with these old fools they don't [44:45] want to see you succeed [44:47] >> and we've had a couple people and and [44:49] that's the great thing about the group [44:51] is because somebody will be like oh my [44:54] friend Barry I thought it would be okay [44:56] if I just went with him and then it [44:58] turns into this disaster and [snorts] we [45:00] can talk about that in front of the with [45:01] the whole group and say, "Wow, Barry, we [45:05] should have known he would, you know, I [45:07] I mean, you just [45:10] Yeah, it seems so obvious to us sitting [45:12] here, but it isn't obvious for people [45:14] that don't have a big network of [45:15] friends. They that they have to cut off [45:17] these folks." So, we really use a lot of [45:19] teachable moments with the example of [45:22] one person for the rest of the group. [45:25] >> I just [45:26] >> Okay, good. [45:26] >> I just want to add to that, too. In one [45:28] of the risk assessments we do with the [45:29] LSCMI, they do talk about like peers and [45:33] social activities and so people may come [45:34] back high-risisk on that. And then [45:36] that's also something that I track in a [45:38] separate system through the state as a [45:39] coordinator where I'll track at the [45:42] beginning of their program and at the [45:43] end of their program if they've had like [45:45] how that changes throughout time. [45:48] >> Yeah. Truth is truth, right? Because [45:49] that sounds like a proverb that came [45:51] which is a book of wisdom, right? Wisdom [45:53] whether you believe or not. It's a it's [45:54] a it's a book of wisdom. The judge rep [45:56] truth is truth, right? whether it's uh [45:58] finding a good woman or finding some [46:00] truth wherever. [46:01] >> That's right. [46:04] >> So, I mean that is a big that's that's [46:06] big. So, the fact that you guys focus on [46:08] that because that was one of my [46:09] questions, you know, where do we [46:11] collectively the collective we not just [46:14] people in this building or the connected [46:16] buildings, but the collective we of [46:17] Scott County or any other county [46:21] individuals. Is there [46:23] entry points where I'm going to say [46:26] common folk, you know, not professional, [46:28] not trained, um, [46:31] can enter in and help kind of contend [46:34] and stand with some of these folks, you [46:36] know, and I know there's mental health [46:37] issues notwithstanding, but sometimes is [46:40] it, you know, the chicken and the egg is [46:42] it somebody said mentioned that, well, [46:44] it's not the booze, it's the mental [46:45] health, so the booze, but in some there [46:49] it has to be like, well, I always asked [46:51] the question. When does a series of just [46:53] bad choices, [46:55] you know, pretty soon you're in that [46:57] hole and then mental health is kind of [46:58] the hammer that we all carry like, oh, [47:00] mental health. Oh, mental health, sure, [47:02] but if you didn't make those 17, I don't [47:04] know why that's the number today, bad [47:06] decisions, [47:08] it wouldn't have been a mental health [47:09] thing. So then you you know booze or [47:12] whatever else. Is there going back to [47:15] the question um spots where regular folk [47:19] can somehow be a part of walking [47:22] alongside some of these folks? Um or do [47:25] we tend to get a little bristly and [47:28] nervous like oh we're paid to be good [47:29] you're good for nothing so let us do do [47:31] the work. Um just feel like you know as [47:34] a county we're always trying to look for [47:35] those opportunities. How do we break [47:37] these cycles? to John's I think was one [47:38] of your questions or maybe it was [47:40] Commissioner Wolf talking about um [47:42] Commissioner Alrich um what happened to [47:45] those kids like did we break the cycle [47:48] >> because I always talk about I know [47:50] rambling but [47:51] >> I thought I saw Loopy here someplace [47:52] county sheriff or Pam um now Barb you [47:56] know our director of HHS or you know [47:59] dealing with when they were social [48:01] workers or deputies or worked in the [48:02] jail having to go out and arrest John [48:05] use that name John for drunken [48:07] disorderly and beating his wife and they [48:09] had to go take care of that and now that [48:11] they're in their now Barb in their role. [48:13] Now the next generation of deputies and [48:15] health and human service workers and [48:17] mental health are going out and [48:18] arresting John Junior's family because [48:21] well that's what he was raised in. So [48:23] you know I'm always like how do we break [48:25] those cycles with everything that we do? [48:27] And yes people have to want to I like I [48:29] always throw that out there. We can't [48:31] make someone, but boy, we can have just [48:33] that horse to water. That water is just, [48:35] oh, I want to jump in. It's tasty. Like, [48:37] oh, [48:38] >> punch my thirst. Like, how do we make [48:40] that environment so rich that people [48:43] can't help but want to make that change? [48:46] Because they have to do it internally, [48:47] right? Um, but we have the paid [48:50] professionals, but is there also [48:53] some level of opportunity for regular [48:56] folk to come in and walk alongside some [48:59] of these people? Not only I asked that [49:01] question here and other things that we [49:02] do. Um sorry that was about eight [49:05] minutes. Um [49:08] >> I can add to that real quick. [49:10] >> Um so Sam mentioned a PRSS which is [49:13] something a lot of the people who go [49:15] through treatment once they're recovery. [49:17] >> Go get them judge. [49:18] >> Sorry. [49:20] >> They can [49:21] >> um support people who are in recovery. [49:23] And we actually Peg Case I know she was [49:25] mentioned earlier. She introduced me to [49:28] PRSS and they are coming to our next [49:29] monthly meeting to meet the team and [49:32] kind of see about bringing PRSS on our [49:34] like not on our team officially but like [49:36] to come into the program to meet other [49:38] participants be able to help walk [49:40] because they've walked through it [49:40] before. None of us have walked through [49:42] what they've walked through. So being [49:44] able to have that I think is going to be [49:45] really helpful. [49:45] >> And who is that just for me? For my own [49:48] >> PRSS the person well it's from a company [49:51] that they're [49:51] >> what what do you know what that stands [49:53] for? Is it it's like a nonprofit a third [49:54] party? I think it's called a pure peer [49:57] recovery specialist. Yeah, peer recovery [50:00] support specialist. [50:01] >> Okay. [50:02] >> But [50:03] >> a lot of Wait, [50:04] >> I was just going to say, do you want to [50:06] speak about the mentor? [50:08] >> And the mentors. Yeah. [50:09] >> Got to come to the green, [50:11] >> Mr. VA. Got to come to the green so we [50:12] can all hear your questions. I know. [50:14] [laughter] [50:15] >> You're going to go Tik Tok viral here. [50:16] We're going to get you there. [50:21] >> Oh, nice. Nice. [50:22] >> And that I just want to mention is for [50:24] treatment court. what he's well talked [50:25] for is Veterans Court. [50:26] >> Now, you might not get on camera, so [50:28] Well, no, we got cameras someplace here. [50:30] I think you might be fine. [50:32] >> Uh, the Veterans Treatment Court has a [50:34] mentor program um that is comprised of [50:37] of um veterans who live in primarily [50:40] Scott or Carver County, many of which [50:43] are in recovery for lengths of time [50:46] themselves. But when a new veteran comes [50:49] into the veterans treatment court, they [50:50] get assigned one of these mentors who's, [50:53] you know, like I said, they're not part [50:54] of the team. They're just another [50:56] they're another veteran. Veterans are [50:58] just generally more comfortable with [50:59] each other than we are everyone else. [51:02] >> Sure. Yeah. [51:03] >> Um we assign them to somebody who is [51:05] just there as a a source of positivity [51:09] and a ear or a piece of advice when they [51:12] need it. But it's a very effective [51:14] program. [51:14] >> Yeah. kind of that 2 am buddy. Like, [51:16] hey, if you get a call or text at 2 am, [51:19] >> answer the phone. [51:20] >> And they do sometimes. [51:21] >> Yeah. I mean, it's huge, right? We're [51:24] built for community and so whatever [51:26] avenue we can do. So, that's that's very [51:28] heartening to know that we have and [51:30] foster that. [51:31] >> One of the things I do out of my office [51:32] is always actively looking for more. We [51:35] get asked about volunteering quite [51:37] frequently. So, I try to direct them. [51:39] This is a great way to volunteer. Well, [51:41] then then and I maybe you already are, [51:43] but we have an outreach group right over [51:45] on this side of the building. You're on [51:46] that side of the building. They're on [51:48] this side of the building like to make [51:49] sure that we are [51:50] >> when I had my lunch last week, the [51:52] mentors had a table out there recruiting [51:54] people that were coming through. So, [51:57] [clears throat] [51:58] >> which was delicious and awesome by the [51:59] way. [52:00] >> Agree. And it served with gravy. So, [52:02] >> yeah, I was going to say, yeah, [52:03] [laughter] you did a great job. Uh, you [52:05] know, most people are rated how they [52:07] carry their own water. You carried the [52:09] gravy well. So, thank you for that. [52:10] [laughter] [52:12] >> And and Commissioner, on the treatment [52:13] court side, [52:16] we as Judge Lennon described, we are [52:19] always talking to the participants about [52:22] making sure they have a support network, [52:24] making sure they have community because [52:26] often times folks in recovery sometimes [52:29] their behaviors are counterintuitive. [52:31] >> So, if you have someone who hasn't [52:32] struggled, they're not going to [52:34] understand or recognize issues. So, [52:36] there's some risk in having folks not [52:40] familiar with that type of lifestyle [52:44] because they don't realize all of the [52:46] the pitfalls that may be out there, [52:48] right? If so, we we really focus on [52:52] making sure they each participant gets [52:55] their own sober support network of [52:57] people who are in recovery or who have [53:00] strong understandings of that. Because [53:03] if someone not in recovery goes to [53:06] dinner with someone who is, they might [53:08] order a drink not thinking anything of [53:10] it. That might be a problem, right? So, [53:13] it's making sure they have their support [53:15] network of folks who understand them, [53:17] who aren't [53:18] >> professionals, just regular everyday [53:21] people who have life experiences, who [53:23] are similar enough where they can form [53:26] those strong connections. [53:28] >> Yes. And whatever. I totally get that. [53:30] Like that's the whole if you're causing [53:31] someone else to sin, you ought not do [53:33] that, right? Even though it might be [53:34] okay for you, it's not okay for that [53:36] person. Um, so even if we're looking at [53:39] supplementing, augmenting, whatever the [53:42] volunteers to be able to have those [53:43] types of things as a training basics. So [53:46] yeah, I'm not saying we're displacing [53:48] professionals, but boy, the more just [53:50] feels like there's not enough hands and [53:51] feet on this side of the table. Not to [53:54] say you guys aren't doing, but you get [53:55] what I'm saying, right? Um, so whatever [53:57] we can do to come alongside and not [54:00] overlap, not stay in our lane, um, but [54:03] fill the lanes. [54:05] >> We've also done some work with a program [54:07] called Every Third Saturday that occurs [54:09] in Minneapolis. They have a lot of, uh, [54:12] volunteering opportunities for people if [54:14] they're looking for it. And they also [54:16] have a donation center where they run [54:18] their own kind of little Goodwill store [54:19] for veterans to help take care of people [54:21] who need them in the cities. [54:22] >> Yeah. And part of the time there's so [54:24] much good work happening. We just don't [54:27] always know what the left and the right [54:29] hand because they're not rel, you know. [54:31] So whatever we can do as a county as a [54:33] convenor or a aggregator of sorts, like [54:36] we we want to do that. We have a history [54:37] of doing that and I think we're doubling [54:38] down on that to make those types of [54:41] opportunities. You know, Derrick's [54:42] probably full aware of that, but you [54:43] know, how do we [54:45] keep that in the forefront because we're [54:47] all so busy trying to run down things [54:49] and make change in people's lives. So [54:51] that's that's a good I don't know how we [54:52] cate categorize that but [54:56] I like that. Thank you. [54:59] Sorry monopolized. [55:00] >> I want to give this board a lot of [55:02] credit. I sit on the justice steering [55:04] committee with your county administrator [55:06] over here Leslie Vermillion. And as [55:08] someone that goes to a lot of meetings [55:10] not just across the district but [55:11] statewide. Um, I think this board needs [55:13] to just acknowledge the immense [55:15] investment that it spends on its [55:17] community for people who are re-entering [55:19] the community or might need services. [55:21] Um, we look at often our jail numbers [55:23] and our clients that are in custody. And [55:25] I think this board is really committed [55:27] to making sure there's an investment in [55:29] its people and its community to make [55:30] sure that we keep recidivism rates down, [55:32] that we're keeping the community safe, [55:34] and it's investing in people. It's [55:36] again, it's that business concept of if [55:37] we invest on the front end, it pays [55:39] dividends on the back end. So, you're [55:40] asking about like people in the [55:42] community that can help. And I think [55:43] this county board's really invested in [55:45] that in terms of getting housing for [55:47] families that are in transition, making [55:49] sure that people have resources to get [55:50] access to employment and how this county [55:52] looks and employing people that might [55:55] have been out of the workforce for a [55:56] while. So, I think there's a lot of [55:58] factors. there's individual connections [56:00] that we have, but I think there having [56:01] those programs available for referrals [56:03] makes a huge difference in what those [56:06] numbers look like in terms of the [56:07] clients that are coming back and recidiv [56:09] the recidivism rates and kind of your [56:11] public safety in your community. So, I [56:13] just wanted to acknowledge this board. I [56:14] don't often get to appear in front of [56:16] you, but um on behalf of our clients in [56:18] our office, I just recognize the work [56:20] you do and the numbers that I see that [56:22] the county invests in and how well it's [56:24] working out for our clients and the [56:26] community you serve. So, thank you. [56:27] >> No, it's good. It's good to hear that [56:28] because we we do want to be about change [56:30] and outcomes, right? We all do, right? [56:31] We all want to be about real outcomes, [56:34] not just kicking the can down the road [56:36] so the next group of folks and [56:37] professionals here and there in 10 years [56:40] or three years or 20 years are talking [56:41] about the same dumb stuff like how do we [56:44] really move this needle? So, but thank [56:46] you for for that, [56:48] >> Mr. Chair. Yes, please. [56:49] >> Yeah, thank you. Thank you for that, [56:50] Linda. That's very very nice to hear and [56:52] that that really was a good segue into [56:54] my question. And I I as we talked about [56:57] earlier uh the specialy courts have been [57:00] in front of the board every year and we [57:02] do care and and we have made some of [57:04] those investments and I think it's [57:06] really important I I don't think it's [57:07] something to answer today but in your [57:09] your respective departments to to make [57:11] sure you let us know you know we've [57:13] tried to fill some of those gaps. We're [57:14] not going to fill them all the way, but [57:16] you know, the things we've done in [57:17] housing, the things we've done with [57:18] parenting, um hopefully getting our [57:21] local ZS uh ready and able to take take [57:23] more people. Um but I I think it's [57:27] important to think about even as we try [57:29] and sustain those or spin them off so [57:31] they're not fully on levy, that type of [57:33] thing, what's the next thing to be [57:35] working on that helps [57:37] >> Yeah. helps folks not go back to jail [57:40] and prison, not need the other services [57:42] we need. So that's important. And I I [57:44] think you brought up jobs and I think [57:45] there's maybe more we can be thinking [57:47] about and doing there and convening, you [57:49] know, not offering them but convening. [57:51] >> But just [57:52] >> something to to think about as you have [57:54] ideas, please please forward to them to [57:56] us. We care and we have been trying to [57:59] with whatever ability we have, you know, [58:02] put some resources into those big gaps [58:04] knowing that um we we want to see [58:07] different lives for folks and we want to [58:09] work ourselves out of a job, frankly. [58:11] >> Yes. Be awesome. [58:12] >> Thank you. [58:14] I mean, that is the rub that we're we're [58:16] everyone's feeling the squeeze and and a [58:19] lot of those areas that we can give on [58:21] or give up or cut are the things we [58:23] probably don't want to because they're [58:25] they seem to be working where Suzanne [58:28] was talking. Can we prove those numbers? [58:29] Not not that we're not believing that [58:31] there there's impacts, but it just be [58:33] such a stronger position to say yes [58:36] because of A, B, and C, we're seeing [58:39] elemental P like change dramatically. [58:41] Um, we're seeing the change. We just [58:42] can't 100% [58:45] correlate the two, but we do believe in [58:46] our hearts that that is that is working. [58:48] So, it would be So, if any state reps or [58:51] senators are listening, please fund [58:53] things appropriately. And by the way, [58:55] this guy, I can't listen to him without [58:57] thinking of a certain representative [59:00] like a Scooby-Doo. I want to take a mask [59:02] off and see if a certain representative [59:04] said it's great voice, great cadence, [59:06] and everything. So, [59:09] sorry. Sorry. Okay, I digress. [59:12] Any other questions? Great topic. Keep [59:15] changing people's lives. Um, let us know [59:17] how we can help or get out of the way. [59:19] Sometimes that's the answer, right? [59:21] Okay. Thank you so much.