and you know there was a lot more cars going that way and i get that you know but i'm sure glad to see him take those i can imagine we are true i i have a question for you um what was the city council action on the public hearing that we held last month on the junker yes version it was a unanimous uh no if i recall scotland that's correct yes uh of rejecting the application or turning it down appreciated our attention and focus to the project and the feedback that we gave and calm and yeah the cops weren't even needed they were here but they weren't needed all right so anything else all right so now we're gonna move on to the visitors slash public comment there's an opportunity for the public to address the commission with questions or concerns either on or not on the agenda tonight is there anyone here that has anything they want to talk about of the three people here all right so we'll move on to the public hearings we can start with ricky nelson i think you guys all have this packet there thank you mr chair i will give a brief opening rick nelson has made application for conditional use permit it would allow for a curb cut of more than 24 feet at 152 42 64th street north the applicant was granted a conditional use permit in july of 2020 for an attached garage and house edition the driveway is now the applicants now want to complete the driveway and had requested a 60-foot curb cut property is zoned r2 of course allowing residential as you can see from the site photo there's a couple site photos yeah you can see from that one the there's a surmountable curve on 64th meaning it's not a not a a hard curve it's surmountable um and it's in place along the length of the property the site plan indicates the proposed driveway will extend along the entire length of the garage to within five feet of the property line so as you're looking straight ahead you can see the garage and then to the left they want to extend uh almost to the property line air photo shows that the right of way of 64th street so that's the one as you're looking down what eric has up on the board that the right-of-way 64th street is 60 feet wide the property line is 6.2 feet from the front of the house that was part of the variance that we looked at for the garage edition and then 22.7 feet from the front of the garage so the houses is forward and then the the garage is set back area the boulevard from the property line to the curb at 64th street is approximately 17 feet wide this is a fairly wide area of boulevard in that in that area just to note that at the time the applicants had proposed a 24-foot curb cut with their with their site plan the ordinance uh indicates that no curb cut access she'll exceed 24 feet except by conditional use permit so that's why we're here tonight intent to this requirement within ordinances is just to maintain a more residential look to the street and neighborhood staff feels that the 60-foot driveway is not compatible with that neighborhood and is exceeds what normally you find for a single family house staff has reviewed the request recommend that no more than a 30-foot wide a curb cut be installed in that location that's roughly the width of the of the garage portion of the house um the as i indicated the report in looking at some surrounding properties uh those that are pretty much adjacent to the property you're looking at roughly between 24 and 28 feet now there is one as you're looking to the screen to the right it looks like there's a dual um a dual access point for two houses and that obviously is more than that more than that 28 feet but again pre-existing situation but those others as you're looking to the left uh just to the left of the the subject property those i believe i measured at about 26 or 28 feet so that's what's what's more normal for the or more common for the neighborhood so that is our recommendation um we have recommended uh that denial the 60-foot but would offer to the planet commission to discuss possibly a 24-foot wide curb cut a 30-foot curb cut in that area and that the area the bowl one of the conditions states that area the boulevard at least 15 feet and wide be planted with grass maintained from the west property line to that to that curb cut wherever we end up ending at so any questions at this point i have a question so from the aerial photo where the red line is until there's a blue line that's i don't know i guess so this one so i'm comparing it to this photo of the front of the house so that line's over here it's going this way so right here and our building was built changed it's changed you know why oak park wants to deny this i thought well yeah that sounds great but then when i looked at the photo i was like well that's their driveway already so what what does it matter it's already the curb is already how it is and what does that matter i mean i don't think it's going to be an unattractive or anything i mean are the neighbors come complaining i mean the public hearing hasn't opened yet so we'll give you a chance to speak to it so uh so the the intent to that again you know that unfortunately the aerials haven't been been updated um and it does show a surmountable curb at least on the pictures but again to to have consistency within the neighborhood relative consistency with the ordinance if we start allowing everyone to have the whole front yard being a driveway that you can pull up into you lose that residential character there is a there is a reason why the ordinance states 24 because that's what you know typically you find in in uh in suburban and city residential development i just don't think that that neighborhood is there's anything too much typical it's not a very cookie cutter so i don't know that's my only i don't see a problem okay um any other questions for staff before you open public hearing so we will open the public hearing at 6 10. um if afghan would like to address the commission so to answer your question right now it is all gravel and the whole thing from the garage side all the way to the property we do have some weeds growing up in that area and we have been told that we need to take care of those weeds and concrete would definitely fix those weeds so if you guys put whatever they say they're 30 feet you'd have concrete 30 feet and then you'd have to maintain like grass or something is that what they're saying well we're trying to figure that out and that's why we're here today i brought a couple different options with us that we could maybe go through and see if you guys have any ideas or thoughts or what you like about it what you don't like about it and then we can kind of just go from there you have copies for everyone excellent thank you thank you very much okay on the first page you can see that's our proposed what we wanted was the 60 feet and then on the left side we have a five foot extension for greenway um and that's that was our first option and what we would really like to do overall the second option would to be just as 32 feet so not quite 30 feet it'd be 32 feet so you're coming off the building just a little bit so you get more of a way to get through and put cars through so that we can park in the back we have three boys they're all going to be driving and so with that we don't have parking on the south on the north side or the south side of our entire block i know that blake has put no parking signs in his yard it's a pain in the ass people come down and they don't park and then they park and you can't park on the street so we have nowhere to park so if you let us have a driveway we can safely and by the law park in our driveway excuse me so there's if i could ask there's no parking signs if if a private resident obviously have blake but doesn't can't can well obviously those are not official signs so you no there's no signs posted they're posted but they follow them so blake put them up so that okay wait okay let's wait here there are no parking signs that blake put up there are no parking signs that oak park hike has had in place for many years okay so i don't think blake put them up blake did put signs up when there was an art exhibition saying no okay so they're not they're not public signs that are they're they're constantly there okay because if the city has put signs up that's ask call me and talk to me about it and i'll take care of that so i don't i don't know what when i get into the personal issues here there's no personal issues i'm pointing out a fact that you can't park on the south side so our parking is so their city has the city has city no parking signs on that street okay thank you due to the hill for plowing okay fair enough there's uh there's an ordinance about streets that you can't park on and the south side of 64th street is one of them it's very well-made it's in the organization but you can park at least from the aerial shows i don't know if it's legal or not but there are cars parked on the north side of 64. yeah you can park them or that's all just outside in the ordinance that i saw but um i was looking for any kind of restrictions on it you can't get by if there's so i love the app so the option so the second option just shows that you get the 32 foot then you have the green space which is 30 foot what 31 foot wide and five feet deep which is the city's property and then the option number three is the same idea where it's 30 foot cut and then 29 feet of green space and then a three foot space of green space leading to the back so those were the three options that we kind of came up with and we were kind of just to see what you guys thought and yeah um do you have any questions for that i'll wait till i don't think i have any questions of the applicant i it just seems like um so you're looking for basically four stalls wide of car parking and then yeah along the side of the garage you want to be able to park four cars there yeah okay trucking a trailer i don't know if yeah i mean i saw i was out there today and i saw the truck and trailer two trucks in the trailer um for the parking pad is there any width thing for how wide it can be no okay so it can be as wide as you want as long as it comes off the normal garage right exactly yeah see i don't well all right i don't have any if you have any questions or we'll close the public hearing we have anything else does anybody else here want to speak um well all right get up and speak come on address yourself come come online tell us your name where you live um i'm andy rollwagon i live at pecan avenue north so just to the south of of the subject property of south and east um i didn't see the plans or the charts so none of that stuff came up i don't know what it's going to look like but i happen to have an island i'm not suggesting that that's the solution but um i suppose if you if i didn't have an island it'd probably be 60 feet like they're asking for i'm not i'm not a fan of being able to just you know pull in park and park and park and parks i'm seeing cars going in like they go on a driveway normally you know straight in but then one two three four i mean and no offense everybody's doing everything to keep their property and up to speed but you know there's a lot of business material you know containers and things from time to time and i just think if it's open it's it's never going to be finished in the sense that you're going to have uh impermeable or something i mean i don't know what if what the surface is going to be but would seem to be an island or something in the middle would be perfect and then you'd have 24 feet and 24 feet and 20 feet in the middle or 18. i mean it's just a thought but i'm not i mean we pay property taxes and i know all the streets aren't finished barry i love you and my neighbors and i know that uh you know things are grandfathered maybe uh because uh barry and others have been here for way before me i've only been a resident for 30 years but i love it we absolutely love it and i just want what's best and um not for the 60 plus foot opening okay thank you thank you very much do we have any other public comments if we did an island so to say 24 plus 24 is 48 that would be 48 feet that would be requested we're not asking for 48. asking so okay do you have any other comments one question so i'm assuming if you've got like a work truck with a trailer behind it it's going to be easier to have that 60 foot like that and like so say if you can't get it and you and you're doing the 32 whatever is it difficult for you to get your your work trailer and your and your truck off in through that little that little where it kind of between the garage and this is it hard for you to get your vehicles it would be 35 would make a lot more sense but it's i don't know we're just told have a different couple different options okay so if we could do 35 i'd be happy with 35 too but okay it's just a matter of what we get approved for okay i was just wondering okay it's different when you see it you know when you have to work with it then when it's on paper so i just want to know what's convenient for you guys you know so just a clarification what you're proposing with these green areas is only five feet from the curve right of landscape area what we're suggesting is 15 feet which still allows 24 feet it allows a substantial area here 15 feet seemed reasonable if it's 10 feet whatever i think five feet a little narrow for maintenance and so forth but that's just just a stack opinion on that okay any other comments we're going to close the public hearing then we can talk about it emotion that we make a motion that we uh close public hearing is that good motion all in favor all all right public meeting is now closed so we can talk about this a little bit who would like to go first excuse me thank you i'll go nobody else wants to um i'm not i'm not a big fan of um having residential properties look like commercial properties and i drove by today and that's what it looks like looks like a commercial property um maybe it's just because of the trucks that were in the driveway the trailer behind it but it looks like a commercial property i don't have a problem with what the staff recommended just making a little bit wider and if there's no restriction on how wide how many cars they can park back there i don't see that being a problem but it was interesting what the other guy said about putting a little island if you put an island north and south in between you know like off the corner the left corner of your garage not all the way up to the garage but i understand that but he has two compact vehicles an island is easy for him but i have two large sharks in that trailer that's not going to work okay no i'm talking about two 24 foot wide openings one on each side of that it might look silly but it um and i and i would prefer to have you use 130 foot or whatever opening myself but it's probably easier for you to do 24 foot ones i mean if that technically meets the letter of the law um i don't know unless unless it says you can only have one i wouldn't cut is there i guess i can't have the yeah the back and forth it can't be this back and forth i need to address my comments to you my concern another concern to be aware of is the site is residential their use of the site is beginning to border on commercial with the number of trailers and the number of trucks i don't think it's a wise move for the city to continue to enable that type of engagement i get they want to be able to have their property conducive to their entire use as being trucks and trailers and all that that's great but it's a residential district it's a residential zone enabling that type of use is not consistent with the ordinance you know their request of seeing it being 30 or even 35 feet probably seems reasonable and it probably very much is but the expanding that to enable the trucks and the trailers for commercial use is what you're enabling i get the number of children they have we all have cars and and and but yeah this is well but i mean we all have families and and we want to get our i mean i have a side we have three cars and that that doesn't make it easy either but we jockey and this and that but i don't know scott what are your what's your take on the one thing i just wanted to uh clarify is that the question about the islands and the number of curb cuts you're allowed one curb cut for 125 feet so yeah it's another um another uh doesn't say anything about the cup on there probably a variance but again i wouldn't entertain that uh again we're trying to maintain either if we're trying to maintain a single-family appearance it's it should be a boulevard area so that's landscaped so my comments about the property is the the pitch of the roof didn't match the original plans so the house already doesn't look like it matches what is in the plans that we have in our packet today the neighborhood if you've driven around the neighborhood has lots of the 2426 wide driveways with the triangle off and parking beside the houses there's multiple properties up and down that road that you can look at that have that style layout um so i think it would be conducive to keep it the width of the garage which is conducive to the neighborhood looks the way the neighborhood is it's very consistent across the board i think andy has he has the one that's got the in and out with the island on it i think that's the only house that has that in the neighborhood um that doesn't sound like the ordinance allows that he probably yeah he's probably grandfather's in but if the ordinance doesn't allow it then the ordinance doesn't allow it yes so you can see there's the pretty consistent there with the way they are this is that's the google picture so that's that's current that's the new one there yeah yeah so i mean i just don't think it would look good it's just a giant slab of concrete um and like staff said it's enabling a business use when it's supposed to be a residential property um i think the standard driveway like staff recommended the width of the garage makes sense to me i think a 45 with the 15 foot grassy space coming back the grassy space between the other property between them which i think the recommendation was 15 feet off the main boulevard would make that look more fitting with the rest of the neighborhood okay that makes sense scott do you think do you think here's the image right and one of the designs that they provided was you know a 32 foot in front of the garage for example would for in the current process the city is undertaken and i'm not saying the applicant would want to do this hypothetically let's say one of the curb cuts in front of the garage was 20 feet just just hypothetically and they put in a horseshoe where so in and out in and out thing and then on the other exit so to speak was 10 feet again i'm just throwing it out there and that way if they do have a trailer they can drive through and back it in and they don't have to jockey quite so much it's certainly it's the two access points but it it might make maneuverability actually easier the width of the curb cuts somewhat irrelevant i mean we've all had a nightmare of driving trailers and boats and things but if you can drive it around and then back it up straight is there is that something we could the count you could do that but we're going to have to re-advertise okay so there's a variance so that's that's a different process okay yeah just there's a just the ordinance allows for the cup for the uh for the more than 24 feet width okay doesn't allow the same for the the multiple curves the garage is 30 feet right right yeah it's roughly 30 feet most of the driveways in the neighborhood come up the garage to the road just to clarify though we're um we're entertaining the making a recommendation of the city council for conditional use permit to allow it to be something other than 24 feet that's correct yeah that's what we need to keep in mind or else we're going to have to go back isn't that correct that's correct so i mean if the island thing or some of these other options came up that's not no matter how creative they are it's not going to work tonight i would feel uncomfortable because we did not advertise specifically for our variants right we advertise for conditions okay if we're adding just yet another conditional use from it i'd feel okay with it but again it's a whole different process okay i didn't clean the organs i know actually you know 24 feet's one thing but being able to drive around the horseshoe and then back up might be actually easier even if it's 10 feet i think that you're um you know when i look at just drawing from to scale the fact that the applicants say there's 28 feet to the gr from the garage to the to a five foot green space from the property line i don't see i i got to tell you i don't see 30 some feet there 33 feet is that yeah the property is from the garage so the shadow is about 28 feet and then the because i'm looking at the just the scale of the garage so that's a 30 foot wide garage and you got so it's 34 feet and there's no chance here yep so yep so i'm saying that you couldn't take another copy of that house for instance and put it next to it without being into the other house 28 feet plus 5 feet that's 33 feet there's no way that there's 33 feet here so i measured the from the aerial photograph again so the house is um you know what we're not seeing is is the property line so the house is six point um two feet from the uh property line and the front of the garage then is 22.7 feet and the area the boulevard then is 17 feet in front in front between the curb line talking about on the west side on the west side okay on the west side of that garage they're saying that they want to have 28 feet of parking and then five feet let me see if there's space and there's there's no way that there's that much room on the factory line in the uh in your in your topic at hand in your packet there's this aerial photo so if you if you which shows the the lot light light the lot line of the right-of-way so it looks like it's just at the at the bottom at the bottom of the of the southern gable here's the other person's house no i realize that but then if you look at the map you can then draw that line imaginary line east and you can kind of see that lot line is probably about here i i'm not i'm not talking about anything on the south side of the building oh okay talking about on the west side of the building okay between the house the garage and the retaining wall he says 28 feet well i think it's i think i added the five foot off that rock so that would knock that down to 23. okay that makes more sense to me i'm just just looking at it i didn't understand you're talking about having the total between your property line and your building about the same size as your roof doesn't it's just not i mean you look at it's like no there's not enough there and it may be out of scale but they're all out of i mean it's all out of scale so it's still relative to that building but um that's neither here nor there i don't know i don't even know if there's any requirement for a parking pad that can't go up to the property you can go right to the property yeah i mean it's not um if you're looking for green space there's supposed to be some in the front in the boulevard area but we gave a the city gave them a variance for the front of the building right to the front to the property line the property line which is what six feet six for the house six from the from the house in the house and then 22 uh point um seven feet from the front of the garage oh is that what it is 22 and then and then to the curb and then it's another 17 oh okay so there's plenty of room in the front yeah there's a lot of book space even with a 15 foot um boulevard area you still have 24 feet between the garage and that with that 15 feet you're not even to the property line yet i mean they're still about two feet away right two feet off yeah so you're still in the city's right way at that point yeah it i'm just trying to get get a scale you know when i when i drove by there that building looks huge i mean um as i kept driving by going this is all still the same building so i mean it looks huge so i don't know that that means anything um just that i'm trying to get some scale in my scale of the you know what you're looking for here i mean what you have drawn on here showed a parking pad on the side of that just like we talked about and that's the drawing from the first variance request and it shows a 24 foot opening and then a way to get around it i mean i um to me i'm supportive of the 30 feet but i don't know that i'm supportive of anything wider than that and as long as you stay the rest of it stays within the ordinance which you know you could make it as wide as long as you stay away from that property line um you should still be able to back a trade i mean drive past it and back it up by the look of the trucks and trailers you know how to back up a trailer just one trailer i mean i have a similar thing at my house and i have a parking pad and i have a trailer it's a smaller motorcycle trailer but and another vehicle that i leave parked outside and um not a big deal backing it in there at all you know so i think 30 would make it i think i agree i think 30 would make it match the neighborhood 45 off to that parking panel like the rest of the neighborhoods pads are yeah you have that angle off and then put the 15 foot boulevard of grass in like the staff recommends yeah i guess i see it now it's a different you know i didn't understand it reading it and then seeing the picture just connecting in my mind so your emotion then if you i would entertain emotion i i would like to make a motion um to follow the staff's recommendation and i just want to make sure that i'm clear on this the staffs i guess i would like to recommend a 30 foot curb cut be allowed at the front of the garage with those those three four conditions um well the fourth is any other conditions you might want to add yeah yeah and i don't i don't see any other conditions i don't see any other either so so basically the three conditions and then if the council wants to add conditions they can do that too but um so there's four i guess it's i'm my motion is to approve a 30-foot curve i recommend that we that they approve a 30-foot curb cut um with the four conditions as listed in the staff report that's my motion second do we have any other additional discussion either i just want to confirm the point number three 15 feet wide is from the west so the guys adjacent garage it's 15 feet wide and it can be whatever deep there's no depth no expectation 50 foot deep 15 foot i think we got to change the wording yeah i just that's a good point because i just added as i'm as you're talking that through the language an area boulevard at least 15 feet wide from the curb should be um planted with grass so adding the word 15 foot wide from the curb right should be planted grass maintained so yeah i can see where that can be confused with a sidebar setback so but that to me my understanding of is that we're talking about um north south 15 feet from the curb line right needs to be planted from that 30 foot wide over to the property line landscaping just grass landscape green space no it says so i'm gonna also add a clarifying point on the west property line then so i think we need to write in here under condition four what that definitive like that easement needs to be before the concrete starts because we know there's going to be an adjacent pad next to the garage from the the retaining wall of the garage it's going to be concrete that's how they've shown it i think writing in there what the the easement is how much space can be between the lot line and the start of the concrete should be written in here as well as a but but the ordinance doesn't require anything okay but they're proposing are you saying from the west property line over they're proposing five feet and if we want to put that within the uh the conditions that's a good idea but it could be zero it can go concrete it goes all the way to the block okay as long as that's the ordinance then it doesn't really matter so but it's a conditional use from it and you can put reasonable conditions on it right we're giving them an extra allowance i think we need some green space i would say we should have what is written here is grass not rock because if it's crack we just drive on it and might as well just pour concrete so it's grass it can be landscaped it can be just we people landscape their boulevards and this and that what we know is the boulevards are our public pro it's public space and and the expectation is that that is grass or some nice landscaping we have rain gardens in different ones we're not asking for that it's just sod is is them is the minimum right expectation where they put it laterally on the property is what i think you're you're correct so your point is 15 feet wide is clear it's in the front off the curb but then the west side toward the garage i think blake and i are saying the same thing that there's got to be a lane assad there too what it is if it's three feet five feet from the well it's gonna look like a commercial parking space so does okay so is is like the rock considered the hard surface and not a permeable or anything like that you know so where we're going with this is unclear to me maybe this needs to be tabled for a month you want to consider that and so we have a drawing i think we should totally i'm okay with that too i mean or take a recess for 15 minutes we can draw this i mean because it seems vague that because when we go to enforce this which is what i am going to have to do i would like language to be clear and i don't think it's going to make everybody happy but scott i need to take a recess i think we can okay here's what i propose so on the third condition an area of the boulevard at least 15 feet wide from the curb shall be planted with grass or landscaping and maintained from the west from five feet from the west property line to the curb cut minimum five feet minimum five feet right okay i've got a drawing here it creates a setback basically a setback from the west park correct correct so a 15 foot from the curb of 64th and 5 feet from the west property line can you define landscaping what does that mean not not drivable minimum grass but if they want to do rain gardens bushes bushes they want to do rain gardens bushes you know can't be a driveway it can't be drivable it's not we're not putting rock in there and driving like i mean like when i say rock it be this small this you know huge so i i like the staff's recommendations of grass it's consistent with the other neighborhood houses in the area so i'm sticking with so let me let me uh read it again an area of uh boulevard at least 15 feet wide from the curb um shall be planted with grass or landscaping and maintain a minimum of five feet from the west property line to the curb cut which is just like this little sketch here so essentially what you got is your this is your garage this is your property line on the west side this is the curb but this is the property line and so you're going to get it 30 feet wide so everybody can see that 30 feet wide and then from here it goes over to 5 feet from the property line does it have to be 45 it doesn't have to be 45 it doesn't have to be 45 as long as you get 15 feet here you go right over there you know i mean i don't i don't see an issue with that because it's going to make it more maneuverable for your trailer you know what i mean but essentially what we're doing is asking for grass in the right of way outside of the 30 feet that we're recommending you getting landscaping is a live plant you can't just do rock i mean i don't think we have any other maybe we do here any just purely rock boulevard areas this is public right-of-way that they're talking about right we will not allow rocks pavers installations of things it can be grass it can be a garden it can be something that's going to be maintained by the budding property owner that's you guys that does not include gravel that does not include pavers that does not include anything derivable or landscape stock even actually the ordnance rock is the ordinance clarifies it okay so grass and plantings and lands grass plantings and landscaping should be provided in all areas bordering the parking area so whether it's the west or the boulevard grass or landscape and that's what the language government thank you all right so i need to entertain a motion to eliminate the old motion so [Music] amendment to my motion and then you'll just have to approve it as a second all right so what are the let's read it off again please try to write down the motions here um an area boulevard at least 15 feet wide from the curb shall be planted with grass or landscaping grass and or landscaping and maintain from the a minimum of five feet from the west property line to the curb cut and then the other two conditions all right yep so tim has made a friendly amendment and jen has that amendment is is part of what i'm asking for in my mode i'm amending my motion to change those two spots in condition number three and are you okay with that as a second okay the person that's second to none with that yes okay so we have a motion in a second do we have any other additional discussion eric scott tyler i'm good all right we can all those in favor say aye all right all right all those opposed same side motion carry all right when do they go to the council so this one will go to the city council on tuesday september 27th all right so we're going to move on to the next topic at hand tonight we've got sodium cigar and thank you thank you very much scott yes thank you mr chair uh we have um a application for design guidelines site plan review at 5946 osgood avenue north it's a site plan and design guideline review for the stillwater crossings shopping center they're planning an addition to the south of that building of 470 square feet it's an area that's currently landscaped and there's a small patio there also this would accommodate expansion of saudi cigars a property zoned a b-2 general business district um the app can go through some detail as to what they plan to use that space for and how it's to be used setbacks of the building within that area that's now just landscaped the building will be compliant there's no impact to the parking area no impact to the curbs there's more than adequate parking with this particular expansion based upon the shopping center the shopping center parking requirements there will be some removal of some rather nice landscaping but will be replaced with a building the lighting they do propose a wall light fixture at the rear entrance door uh again it'll just have to be a full cut off which typically is what we're seeing with with everything now rarely are we seeing the floodlights being proposed so really no changes to the grading drainage city engineers looked at and said does not see any issues with it it's surrounded by curb the i'd say an additional sign there's actually a sign right now on that south around saudis cigar sign on the south they're just going to move that oh yeah it shows it on the air on the photograph is it a sign yeah and it's not a bit sign so and then there was a discussion uh that there would be uh additional mechanical equipment added to the roof that will have to be properly screened or hidden within the the paraplegics of the building so pretty a straightforward addition to the building and uh we're recommending uh favorably with the four conditions that are listed in the report thank you scott would the applicant like to speak about anything perfect no one else wants to speak i would entertain a motion to close the public hearing did you open it and i open it i guess you got to open the public hearing open it until the king's opens okay 47. okay i can make a motion since there's nobody to talk to close the public hearing yeah second we have a motion and a second hollows in favor all right all's opposed same side all right watch how fast this will go what let's get his timer going i can see it so the only thing the only question i had about this one is the building's gonna be right on the road when it's done or the driveway right so how far off of the driveway is the building actually gonna be scott it's actually going to be if you look at the plans uh close enough and see would pull that out it will essentially be on the curb and one of the considerations i had well would it create some issues with visibility um and [Music] you know i looked at when i was out on the site i looked at it there's the loading area in the back and obviously they're probably pulling in and pulling out again um so there's probably a reduction there but a visibility was wouldn't see a truck pulling back as soon as you would if it was just landscaping but again i don't think there's that much traffic there that's that we have to worry about it if it's if it's backing up there's backup backup horns yeah and i i just think that the when you look at the existing condition of the landscaping that's there if you're in a car you can't see around that either it is pretty pretty pretty thick it's pretty thick that's true too i mean i don't see i don't see that being a concern i i have a question though um does the ordinance have a percentage of impervious surface requirement it's we don't okay not for them then i don't for residential areas mr chair one so if i got you correctly you're basically saying if there's some there were some bollards here or something to prevent people from walking around this might be a wise idea exactly thank you you know i i'm envisioning you know i if you go to mcdonald's here in town and you walk out that east door there's a little there's a little gate there which is quite effective because if you don't not paying attention you'll walk out that door and you'll step right into the drive-through lane so i just envisioned something like that that should be installed on that end of that sidewalk well and i think i think ballers would keep someone from accidentally hitting your building yeah something i think would i think we need something there it might be a wise idea because i feel like it's going to be right on the property and right on the edge which is fine there's other commercial properties look that way but i just feel like depending on where that door is placed someone's going to turn it's that blind spot coming around the corner and we're going to have a near miss so the door is shared with the salon the front doors yeah so you're not walking out the door right there and there's a sidewalk there in the front right yeah unless you're going down to those parking spaces you know you can see we parked down there and i'm just saying it's a warning of some form to that might impede some somebody looking at their phone not you know out of that never happens besides for the the specific owner that's here i'm surprised bike rack hasn't come up because there's the salon there's car ponies there's i didn't see one out there but the old report the old report says that there was one in place so i don't know if i think there's one is there one up in front of carbon i think there's one up there if i remember oh it's in their smoking section yeah the people that are going to get cigars are not going to come but what to do that was my only comment because i thought that might be something it should be considered i'm trying to think how it uh phrase that so applicants shall provide uh warnings i i want to keep it open so not limited just to boulevards but to whatever makes sense any thoughts on some language for that eric what uh i don't know at the at the southern terminus of that front sidewalk um owner shall install uh bollards or something bollards or gate to prevent um you know you know for pedestrian safety pedestrian safety conditions so they don't walk on the street and get smashed right that is the official term a safety mechanism should be installed on the south edge of the sidewalk there you go perfect that'll work because i was thinking clean and simple i was singing on the back corner too it's not as hectic or as tight as like walgreens right but with that being a through street now how much more traffic is going to go back behind the building on accident it might come through the parking lot because that coming from the front of the establishment to the back that back corner what's the likelihood of seeing a truck back there but also you're not you're not in anybody behind the building i would argue is probably there as an employee or they're not there they're delivery they're they're not they're not customers and pedestrians yeah i think your main concern is maybe maybe on that uh that front sidewalk so um for the streams i think it is but i but i also i mean whether it's a condition of the approval or not i think that bollards along the south side of that building might be a good idea where the cars are driving but now that i look at it the back side of the building is the same thing but there's a curb you know as far as having to put ball ball yours isn't this hard because you've got a regular um on the back non-surmountable curb yeah it's just the front i was a little concerned yeah okay do we have any other discussion on others that entertain emotion i think the only other question i had was the signage point so the applicant has to come back with the details of the sign the backlit nature yeah the the sun though yeah and that's the kind of standard condition we have and the if you're going to uh put the same type of painted sign on there's no requirements for internal elimination illumination correct or are are you considering maybe a a lit sign on that south facing yeah okay so it'll just have to meet the uh the lighting requirements yeah julie julia will catch that when when those permits come through for sure oh yeah yeah i make a motion to approve the applicant's uh permit as the staff recommends with the added condition of including a safety mechanism on the front south side of the sidewalk do we have a second i'll second it um i i have a question though if we're going to discuss that i just want to ask just clarification so you're saying that the four um conditions that are in the staff report are included in your motion that we're adding a fifth that was the safety for the pedestrian correct okay that's clarification it's a pretty straightforward project it's gonna expand the business it's just yep and the way i've worded that if this sounds good to you um a pedestrian safety device shall be installed uh at the south edge of the front sidewalk i'm sorry that's pretty much what you yeah yeah okay good yep okay we got a vote all those in favor all right second in that motion i'm sorry oh jim no i didn't i'm sorry i didn't tell you okay thanks i thought it was somebody here let me make sure i got all those opposed same side all right so again uh we're just making recommendations to the city council so the city council will have the final say on this and it will go before the city council on the 27th this month so 20 seconds 27 2 7 is it seven 27 27 27 all right wrote that down all right so we'll move on do we have anything thank you very much we have no new business do we have any old business seeing no old business do we have anything informational we have the upcoming meetings uh we talked about the ribbon cutting that's coming up exciting go to the river county um you should have all those um council representation for tuesday the 27th i might not be here so i might need a trade with someone if someone could go instead i might be here i don't know i might have to go to arizona for work if you got to go we can just flip flop september october okay if i will if that's okay with everyone tyler and i'll flip flop um do we have anything else well i can make a motion to adjourn well i have a motion a second to adjourn any discussion seeing none all those in favor say hi hi all right all those opposed same sign we are adjourned yay you