[Music] good evening we are going to start the uh city of Columbus city council workshop on April 9th 2024 time is 5:3 36 we're going to do things a little bit out of order from the agenda um tonight our mayor is on his way back from the state capital where he did some testimony today so he'll be joining us in just a little bit so we're going to start with item number four which is the Cannabis ordinance discussion and I'll refer to um whoops before I do that we need to do our Pledge of Allegiance let's do our Pledge of Allegiance conations flag of United States America thank you so we will uh proceed then with item number four unless there's any changes or suggestions for the agenda other than changing the order of things do I see anything nope okay okay item number four cannabis ordinance discussion Mr Davis you can take it away thank you Janet in August of 2023 the Minnesota Legislature approved the cultivation manufacturing and sale of adult use cannabis the approved legislation creates the formation of the office of cannabis management which is tasked with the development of rules licensing and enforcement for this new industry currently cannabis is legal for individuals to possess use and grow in Minnesota subjects to limitations related to the amount possessed and produced state of Minnesota has yet to finalize their rules and regulations for cannabis Licensing in the league of Minnesota cities at this time has not created a sample ordinance to guide municip mun municipalities in their efforts relating to the regulating licensing and sale of the permitted products City staff is contacted the following cities Forest Lake Scandia North Branch asan Cambridge Lino Lakes Centerville Wyoming and East bethl to inquire about their status relating to their efforts to enact a cannabis ordinance of those contacted only Cambridge and asan have adopted ordinance regulating the sale of cannaboid products the others are still waiting for additional information from the office of cannabis management and the league of Minnesota cities as to the means to address this issues the ordinance for Cambridge Nan are fairly identical and there are lots of commonalities into both of them and they essentially relate to the licensing and sale and land use principles relating to this type of regulation for the product the city of Cambridge has also adopted hours of operations for sales where as Ian has not and they also have specific procedures for penalties fees suspension timelines and violations both of their ordinances are attached for your review this agenda item is just an update on the status of our neighboring municipalities regarding their status on this matter and open this is open for any discussion or direction that city council May deem appropriate to pursue the ordinances were going to be required for cannabis licensing regulation thank you Jack um are there any questions or discussions from the council uh so this is Sue my only question is um do you know if there's any changes to the timeline that the state is going to have their all their rules and everything completed I don't think anybody knows yet you know the anticipation is the product is going to be legal for sale sometime in early 2025 but again we've heard nothing we've contacted the league the league is says they're still waiting on some direction from the state and the State as I understand as of at least a week or 10 days ago doesn't even have a director of The Office of cannabis management so we're all just uh kind of groping our way along trying to find some direction here and I don't think anybody really wants to do too much until they know exactly what they're doing so you don't have to do it twice well that's why I was kind of surprised that um two of the Cities already have theirs done well and I think in talking to both of those they just wanted to have something in place I know that one of them already has had a store that deals in THC products so I think they did that to kind of get ahead of the curve and help some regulations with that and the other ones getting quite a few licensing request and they just wanted to get something out there so uh but of the other Seven Cities that haven't done anything they're all on the same boat that we are we're just waiting to see what's what what what the ground rules are for addressing this okay thank you Ryan do you have any questions no other than I like I said it's got to go before the Planning Commission what it's got a lot of work to be done on it I don't even really I wonder why we're talking about it well and I think that's why there isn't a deeper discussion I think originally we had intended to have um the City attorney here to sort of get us started but in discussing it further excuse me it didn't seem to make sense to have her come out when there's so many loose ends and unknowns yeah we could end up doing this two or three times over so um I think it's helpful to know what our neighboring communities are doing I think um my only question is has the league made any statement at all about whether they would you know Forge forward without the state I mean it's you know halfway through the year almost so there's been there's been indication that they're going to go at this independently okay and then I you know I would just also remind us all that we have done some work on this I mean we we you know prohibited uh the public use of cannabis in you know public spaces or in public facing spaces on private um property so I mean we have done some work on this but I think the rest of it really it could really be exercise in futility until we know what where the state is heading so so I think that makes sense but thank you for putting this together so that we can see what our neighbors are doing so then I'm going to move on to item number two which is the Lake Drive Corridor study and um Kevin could you start us off on that please yeah good evening uh council members Kevin Bitner city engineer uh tonight uh we're going to hear a presentation um our transportation group has been um contracted by anuka County to do a corridor study on Lake Drive and so they have uh requested an opportunity to come and and speak to the counil in regards to their study and some of their findings that they at have at this point and so with us to do this presentation is Mike lson he's in our transportation group and also Jack forsland who's uh within NOA County so I will turn this over to Mike to get us going thanks Kevin um yeah Mike Larson with Bolton m uh the project manager kind of leading this study um in partnership with the county of Lake Drive um uh our study really started off uh back in the fall um of this last year uh and the first step of our Corridor study is to really gather feedback do do a desktop analysis of of what the traffic data tells us how it's working today what works well what doesn't and then we had a public open house in December um of last year year um to go to the public listen to them uh listen uh to what are their thoughts on the corridor what works well what doesn't um and it's it's always interesting to see how that jives with with what the data tells us versus what the public perception is um next in the process is working through different Alternatives how can we solve those problems um and then ultimately our goal is to recommend a final concept um at the end of the study which will hopefully wrap up in the next few months here in the spring um from there uh we'll have a final concept and study report uh uh to be shared with both cities and uh the county um and then up from there it's up to the county to take it through preliminary and final design and ultimately construction um and Jack any update or anything to share on yeah this is well the the corter study from Main Street up to K River uh we know that we need to reconstruct this within probably the next 5 or 10 years so what we're doing now is uh just a quarter study which is our first uh really stab at trying to identify some Design Concepts that we would carry forward to predesign so this is where the project really starts and then preliminary design environmental work uh that's while we're trying to obtain funding right now it's not funded but we want to get everything ready to go for what it is so um yeah so yeah now's the time to figure out what to build when the time comes um to meet future goals future needs that sort of thing um so really when the study kicks off the main things we need need to identify what are the primary needs out here what must we fix with with the use of public dollars uh Jack you can go to the next slide please um so the main things are uh number one the infrastructure condition the the road bed is very very old it's pasted its serviceable life um and the county can't keep dumping money on top of the road it needs to be fully rebuilt from the bottom up so that that's one of the main drivers another one is the walkability and bikability of the corridor um and this is something that was confirmed by our public open hous is that uh both communities the county really see a need for um making Improv improvements for non-motorized travel whether it's a trail or sidewalk things like that um the next one is Vehicle Safety there are a few areas of this Corridor that are performing with above average crash rates um more crashes than we like to see uh we have seen a few fatal or Serious injury crashes in the news lately so those are all things we look at um a secondary need so not something we necessarily need to fix but um we do take a look at is the vehicle Mobility so making sure that uh we've got um reduced delays adequate um acceptable travel times things like that in the project area go ahead Jack um so I won't go through I guess all the technical background of what we've done just for time sake but um I I guess this is a board from our first open house where we explain to the public how the road is serving different travel modes today so we've got vehicles trucks bikes and pedestrians so your average passenger car is served pretty well by this roadway today there's not a lot of congestion um we know that sometimes on those summer Fridays when 35 is backed up we see a lot of cut through traffic that's not necessarily something we can fix um with this that's just kind of a something we'll have to live with on those few days of the year uh but generally delays on the highway people getting in and out of their driveways it's it's pretty acceptable um trucks there there's a lot of commercial and Industrial uh land use out on this Corridor so we do see a lot of truck traffic out here uh they're served relatively well but a lot of these businesses don't have turn Lanes um we're kind of missing that that deceleration space where those trucks can get out of the way of uh people moving through the corridor so room for improvement there um but the two modes that we really fail today are the bikes and the Peds um we do have some wide shoulders for bikers um which uh are okay um for some of the more experienced uh bikers who are more tolerable to biking next to high-speed traffic but uh families and people who aren't as comfortable biking on a roadway like that really aren't served and then the pedestrians there's really no pedestrian space to speak of outside of those wide shoulders so um taking stock of how it's working today and where there's room for an improvement um you go to the next one Jack and then a few other things we look at um we look at at traffic volumes and speeds so how many vehicles drive this roadway today how many cars how many trucks how many pedestrians and bikers uh we take a look at their speeds uh a lot of times we hear that from the public that people are always speeding on this road roadway so it's nice to have a data point and validate that uh crash history so we do look at Department of Public Safety crash history data to identify crash Trends crash locations uh get a good understanding of where there might be uh specific issues or uh I guess wholesale underlying issues throughout the corridor um we also look at the access inventory the management of of the uh this the study area uh this road is unique in that it it serves a very uh long trip purpose it's an rtio roadway so it serves long Regional trips uh but we do have a lot of accesses a lot of driveways on the corridor so that in a perfect world we wouldn't have very many accesses at all on a roadway like this but um just the nature of what we have uh that's something that we'll be battling here safety wise uh intersection traffic control so looking at how our our traffic signal at Main Street is working how our side street stops working uh We've Got a roundabout planned at Kettle River Drive so making sure that that's going to work acceptably uh turn lane needs uh we take stock of where there are turn Lanes today and how that meets the County's policy for where turn Lanes should be installed uh where do we need more where do they need to be longer that type of thing and then just taking stock at the existing speed limits out there it's a 55 mph Road throughout our study area go to the next one Jack um so then in our open house we we presented the public with this data we listened to their problems we also had an opportunity to let them vote on what they might like to see out here various typical sections of the roadway so do we want Trail do we want sidewalk do we like the rural feeling or do we like an urban feeling with curban gutter that sort of thing uh do we want a raised Center median uh a center two-way left turn lane um different variations all those so um kind of a an exercise to perform with the public to get them thinking on what's possible what do they like what what do they see out here and we'll take that and then we'll what we've done is kind of weighed how those things might actually work um go to the next one Jack so our first open house uh that was in December of last year I was very well attended uh we had over 50 people sign in and it probably upwards of 60 70 people um here at City Hall um got a lot of good feedback uh some of the key things we heard are uh a lot of the folks living on the corridor would like to see a multi-use Trail uh one side of the road they feel like is enough um another comment was on The Kettle River and Camp 3 project which the county has planned a lot of questions on how that ties into the study and I guess just questions specific to that project and not so much our study uh a lot of requests for turn Lanes I want to turn lane here at this business longer turn lane there that sort of thing um comments that they see people uh speeding there too many trucks um and then what we often hear on these types of projects is they want to know how it's going to impact their private property or their access so um all good comments that that um either confirm what we saw or uh we kind of go back and relook at things and then we definitely when we evaluate our Concepts we we do try to make sure that we we tick those boxes as well um and then with the voting uh the option the public most fa favorite and it was actually quite overwhelming was uh option three which was a three Lane section so that Center two-way left turn lane um presumably the benefit of that is um uh everyone's got a left turn lane in an out of their driveway sort of thing so there is a safety benefit typically with that uh a lot of people really don't want to see a raised concrete median obviously that might take away access to businesses and uh people's driveways uh next slide back um so I won't go into depth on everything we we do to evaluate these but um overall in the corridor we look at again where turn Lanes warranted making sure we have them in the appropriate places making sure we've got the right intersection traffic control um roundabouts signals all that sort of thing uh we do look at uh Water Resources um even driving here today I see there's water sitting in the ditch when it rained over a day ago so it at a high level looking it um where do we have water challenges where can we store it where can we treat it better uh constructibility and staging uh thinking ahead um some of these typical sections or Alternatives might be more challenging to build while maintaining access um so starting to think about um I guess the impacts of actually building something out here and do some of these Concepts make it easier to build and maintain access uh when we get to that point um and then actually start drawing up our typical sections our concept layouts how do things fit how expensive might they be uh how impactful might they be um those are all all the things that we'll eventually boil down and rate our Concepts on once we get to that point the next one Jack um so I guess where we're currently leaning um as far as our typical section is I guess what I'd call a hybrid three Lane section it wouldn't be striped in the middle as I guess with the two-way left turn arrows um there are a few reasons for that and and the main one is it's generally not recommended that those are used in a high-speed Corridor of 55 miles an hour if you have two left Turners uh driving in that lane opposing each other at high speed it's it's sometimes tricky to judge who's going to turn left when um um so you kind of hear the the term suicide Lane um in some areas that's it may not be the best fit to stripe something like that here um but what we have this striped median or the striped buffer area um it it doesn't necessarily encourage driving in that middle space for long periods of time um it's more so a spot to just decelerate and turn um as soon as you can um and that might not be a fit for the whole Corridor but it it's generally where we're feeling for most of the corridor that could be a good fit um of course at intersections we'd have traditional turn Lanes things like that so this is more of a mid block application uh we do have a trail on one side that would be a 10ft wide trail that could accommodate bikes and pedestrians and then we're maintaining the the rural section that there is today um and then last slide Jack if you could um I guess just charting forward our next steps here um we're hoping to determine what that final concept is this month um and then schedule a second open house with the public uh late April early May uh show them what our preferred concept is uh gather feedback on that and adjust accordingly uh make some tweaks and then hopefully have a final concept and uh report done by May um and that's um that's where we're at right now um I'll open it up to any questions or comments so this is Sue I do have one question and I'm not sure if I'm understanding that Middle Lane totally because I mean I've I know what a normal Middle Lane is for right turn or turning a Turney Lane um but when it's striped like that how do you how do you control like people are going to actually turn in that lane right right but how do you control them not like entering too early and like you say run into somebody else that's right no that that's a great question and that's something we're we're chewing on still it's it it's a unique roadway and this would be a unique application um the the sheer number of accesses we have and the number of people we need to turn left into driveway ways is is something we're trying to accommodate and typically that that middle left turn lane really helps with that you don't have people slowing down in the through Lane no rear ends things like that people are people feel like they can take their time making that left turn because they don't have someone sitting behind them um so it's it's Unique and that it might be something that drivers will have to learn the best way to use because it is there isn't one in the area there's oh yeah my next question is there another one around that no no and that's when when we thought of this idea we we tried to look around I guess this area the metro and the metro in general for a roadway like lake Lake Drive in that it's highspeed it's Rural and there's a whole lot of access and there really aren't very many at all which is which is unique and it's challenge but um yeah so it it' be new and we expect the public to have some questions on how to actually how it actually works I'm glad you asked that question Sue because if you go towards the freeway on Lake Drive just after you cross Main Street there is a section there that's striped in the middle and I've known people that have been pulled over because they've gone over to that to turn left like to get into the bank sure and they've been told it's illegal to do that so I think it is going to be really confusing um I now again I I don't know the traffic rules that well to say whether or not that's in the little booklet or whatever but I didn't even know that was illegal I do it all the time I know but that's what I've been told and so you know a lot of people don't know it's illegal to pass on the right on a shoulder either but they still do it so right and I think that's one of our biggest challenges is the amount of traffic and the amount of turns and people that are coming up behind you when you're turning and they're like ah and they go on the shoulder which is illegal but also they don't know if there's somebody walking or biking or something like that which a lot of people do on the shoulder um so I I don't know I guess I'd have to I don't know if there's any other options for that um middle but I like the idea of something in the middle right right it's it's a unique Middle Ground between what we'd like to do which is that normal three lane and really nothing really which doesn't get at the problem that we see out here with safy and comfort and all that so and is the problem with turn Lanes just there'd be too many of them um I guess with the the normal like continuous left turn lane it it's really not meant for those higher speed roadways but what if it wasn't continuous what if you you didn't have a left turn to every single access point but you had a left turn to you know uh I don't know if there would be a frontage road or something that would get them to some of those other places sure sure yeah I I guess the the county has a policy and warrants for when left turn Lanes would be allowed um and a a frontage road system would definitely help with this this driveway problem but we've only got so much space to work with and money as well so um yeah that would be a great solution if it weren't for putting a frontage road in people's yards and and if I can add some stuff to yeah we have to have like a transition distance to to accommodate a left turn to come down from speed of 55 miles hour so the driveway access is so frequent in there uh we wouldn't be able to do that um regarding I think there are a couple examples of something like this like in St Michael I believe there's uh 241 I believe it is which is similar to them which is a higher speed roadway which U essentially straped off median so it's just it's not but you can use it to uh to cross and we did have a a meeting last week at the line of lakes uh city council workshop and it was asked the police department that was there what the policy is and they weren't aware of it as far as uh um Crossing or getting into that Center area to make a lane Crossing that and we're talking about it afterwards and it's almost like where you have a double lane highway right now and you have to turn off into it you can cross the double the double lines um but this a little bit different because you'd actually be in in those double lined areas but uh the police department they in linal legs which I think is where yeah it's where I'm talking about yes it may be that they're not consistent in doing it but um but I think that if that's the case then you'd really get inconsistency with how people used it and and if you're trying to avoid that whole suicide Lane I mean you got people who don't know what what they're supposed to be doing going 60 M an hour in opposite directions and and especially if they don't know exactly where the driveway is that they're trying to you know turn into oh I just yeah it's a difficult problem to to try to solve because we we don't have room to put in a frontage road you know system um and it's you know the driveway access that that's uh something that was done years ago nowadays we'd probably get the right way to put it in Frontage Road system for um heavily or a very important travel Corridor you know for highp Speed longer trips um well especially because of the number of trucks I mean I'm surprised when it says 400 a day it's got to be more than that yeah that's what we counted on the one day we were out there it could certainly fluctuate with when sstone is making concrete and when they're not or with yeah I mean because a lot of times people I mean even Vehicles car vehicles will use that as a bypass for whenever there's anything going on on the freeway that slows things down or I do really like the um the idea of that walking path though because I think that would at least remove the or make it uh more safety um with the people at least not walking on the shoulder I don't know if there wasn't any uh statistics on any pedestrians that were hurt on that road there in the whole study area there's only one pet and bike crash um and that was at the Main Street signal um maybe six seven years ago so not too many okay good thank goodness um my other question what was my other question well you definitely would um make the ditches look nice and green like that they'd start nice and green yeah yeah and if you can control the water you're hired yeah it's at our very high level screening of it it it's a challenge because the road is or the whole area is very flat some of the soils don't drain very well so it'll be a challenge once we get into prar oh I just remembered my other question um it says that the most um accidents happened between Main Street and Pine Street which is surprising to me because I've lived there for 35 years and I don't know that I've ever seen an accident in that area I've seen them between Pine and Kettle River sure but just curious yeah I I can't explain that that's what the data from mindat and the Department of Public Safety told us but um it I'd say they're more concentrated there but they're I guess that's only 3/4 of Mile yeah it's not very long but the I guess the Columbus segment those other three miles of the study it's it's a little bit everywhere yeah okay so yeah I got a question on this this project uh when it came out out or we started oh years ago about the roundabout or whatever down to Kettle River and Lake Drive so this is that a project that's kind of tied in with everything or is that a project that Anoka may look at doing prior to getting this thing all going that one we do have that funded The Kettle River roundabout at Lake Lake Drive that is funded we will be constructing I think in 2027 so this the other quarter that you're talking about now will be after that do you think or or would they do it all at once River well this study just goes from Main Street up to Kettle River okay that actually my my point what happens after Kettle River so you've got this nice section you're going to have a roundabout you're going to close off the the turn onto Kettle or onto uh Camp 3 but what happens to Lake Drive after Kettle River other study well that yeah that's that's a good question and what we're trying to do now is always do a study before we do any hard engineering on it so um is there going to be another open house yes um hopefully in the next month we'll look to schedule that soon and yeah see what the public thinks will that be here again in a I believe so yes and they do one down in Lio also or uh no we've been doing them joint together okay I remember the last one I thought it was rigged you thought it was what I thought it was rigged I I just know you got to watch those people with the Post-it notes I saw some of them stuffing the box with Post-it notes I seen one of them little younger we're aware of it the handwriting you know the handwriting yeah either that or a everybody gets one post to no when they walk in the door and that's all you get you can't buy them either yeah yeah we have an interactive uh map on the website people can leave comments there too okay but it's it's not a completely Democratic process we take input but at the end of the day it's going to be engineering judgment and yeah but we want to certainly do something that meets the public approval yep well you could throw a stop sign every two blocks or whatever down there that's slows traffic up well the roundabout will slow a few at least some of the trucks they aren't going to be taking that at 60 miles an hour but yeah they're very effective as as you probably know yeah you can't go really go any faster than 15 or 20 miles per hour through that and still make that curve although you know we have had a few people just decide to sail over the top of them so you might you might find a few of those still down there too usually their suspension probably go on their car too right well it doesn't it it it's not so good about the traffic on the other side of it either but yeah once they if they do it once they probably won't do it again no once is enough or it's broken well thank you anything else appreciate the update Kevin do you have anything you want to add I have nothing all right thanks for coming glad we could get you a little bit earlier so you can go home on this beautiful evening we'll see you at the end of April or May yep yeah Jack I don't know if do you want to do you want to go to the um the water system Improvement study or should we do should we just do pardon is Jesse online or no he was coming here oh here he comes Yay see all you have to do is threaten that we're going to move on to the next the next topic and then the mayor shows up so no no no you can have your gavel back go ahead no no you're here I can't I can't be in charge when you're here so we did we did item four and item two now let's go back up to item one Workshop topics we do have a a guest speaker for our water study so if we wanted to move that one up that would be well we also have people online that I promised we were going to do this first so very good I'm gonna sorry I'm gonna I'm gonna problem I'm gonna make you sit through this sir all right so we are moving on to number one a review City administrator rating sheets page one so well Janet's gonna kick it off yep I'm GNA kick it off and then sue is gonna um go in for the kill at the at the end so um there's a few handouts that you have and some of these you received by email and some of them you had received in Prior um city city meetings but I'm going to we wanted you to have everything here so you have a copy of the job description for the city administrator you have a copy of the recruitment brochure and you have a copy of the scoring sheet with a memo on the top that is from Sue and what my job is is to go over the sort of process and remind everybody of what it is that we're trying to do and we're going to have a discussion about a few items here um and hopefully come to consensus on the action items that I outlined in the memo that we sent out on April well we sent it dated it on April 9th but you got it on Monday from Jack so let's start let's start at the beginning so we we started the search um you heard from us a few weeks ago that we went through the process of scoring all of the qualified candidates there were 16 and we whittel that number down to um six semi-finalists so now the next job for us is to whittle the semi-finalist down to the finalist and that's what this topic is about and the way that we're going to do this is very similar to the way that we evaluated the um candidates or the the applicants and whittel them down to the semi-finalists but since Sue and I were the ones that were doing this behind the curtain and you guys weren't part of it we we needed to get you guys up to speed on what the processes so that's why we're having this conversation so if you look at the recruitment brochure and you go to page one two three it has a section that says the ideal candidate will be and then there's a number of bullet points there which are qualifications of what we were hoping to find um in our ideal candidate um prior to that um page there's also core duties of the position and these These are also um skills that we were looking for that they literally needed to be able to do in order for us to say that they were going to be qualified we worked on a a number of um interview questions for the semi-finalists and also interview questions that we will be using when we do an interview of the finalists and um we went over those today and we're going to um our HR consultant is on her way back from uh Europe and so she'll be looking at those also and weighing in on them they're pretty close to being final the interview questions are meant to um elicit information related to how the candidate or the semi-finalist fits these qualifications that are listed on this recruitment brochure the recruitment brochure qualifications came right from the job description they're a little bit easier to read on the recruitment brochure but you have the job description too if you want to really dig into what what the whole what the whole position is defined as so um when you look at the score sheet that's where all that information is coming from in in in very broad terms what happens is that you will have access to um a one drive folder that will contain a folder for each of the semi-finalists in the semi-finalist folder will be a copy of all their application materials the video of their um virtual interview with Ellen a copy of their assessment results and a summary from um Ellen on interpreting those results as well as her impressions from the uh interview so you'll have all that you will also have a copy of the interview questions so as you watch the video you can follow along and Sue has done a really great job of labeling the questions so that you know on your score sheet which question ties to which score sheet so you can write things down on the score sheet as you listen to the interview so everything will be in that folder for you you'll be able to access it you'll be able to print it download it whatever you want to do at home but but that's that's how you're going to get the information and certainly Ellen is available if you have any questions Sue and I are available if you have any questions and the idea is that you would go through all of this independently score your candidates turn those sheets into Sue Sue will um tally them up and it would be the top two to three candidates that we would move on to um to uh the finalists so with that very brief overview I'm going to turn it over to Sue and she can talk more specifically about the score sheet okay thanks Janet um okay so the score sheet that you're and I'm not sure if you have all six of them but no just one oh okay so you're GNA there's six pages every page is the same except there's one for each candidate so at the top it says candidate a next one says candidate B and so on through F and you will get um an email on which candidate correlates to that letter and so that'll all be done um separately in an email and the folders are also labeled that way yes um just to talk a little bit about this whole scoring sheet um this actually is in a spreadsheet that I have um drafted up we did it with the initial candidates and it's a waited score so we went through this whole process originally and uh have all these categories we had a weight we had a score just like this and then it all goes into the weighted um formula in the spreadsheet and calculates out the um the total score for each candidate so you're just seeing a picture of it because I didn't want to send you the spreadsheet and it it just can get all mued up really really quick so um so just to go through um the sheet the top the next thing down from the candidate is the score so you'll see the numbers and then um what each one identifies with you know minimal minimally qualified partially mostly fully and exceptionally um so we're just going to that we'll talk about that more once we get into the when you put it onto the sheet um so the First Column is the category the category is what Janet just explained in um from the brochure it's those bullets that are under the ideal candidate and some of them are kind of paraphrased a little bit we modified them just a little bit to make them a little more understandable um but that is so that's where that came from that is the one that also the questions that Janet mentioned are going to be in the interview and we have numbered them so you will see and actually I don't have the numbers on here but um those categories will be identified to which interview questions um there are so you can correlate them easily um the next column is the weight so the weight is what the Personnel committee has identified as the most important qualification through and it won't say least important because it's not that the lower scored ones are less important but we felt like the ones that we weighted higher were attributes that you can't learn or find somewhere else you know like for instance you know great leadership good communication um those types of things are you things you can't learn and and it has to be kind of an innate uh personality trait so um that's why we scored those higher um I'll just talk about the rest of the sheet and then we're going to go back and talk about these individual ones just to see if you agree with uh the importance the weight that we put on them um so the next column after the weight and you won't have to do anything with that column once you're scoring you just that's just for your reference the only area that you're going to enter information is in the third column the score column and that's where you're going to put your number from the top in that one score for each of those nine um and you're going to handr write them and that's what I'm going to put into the spreadsheet okay and then you you can write your notes and there's additional um room at the bottom for notes um let me just look at my notes here just to make sure I wasn't going to mention something else before we talk about the weights [Music] um okay okay thank you okay I think we covered everything that I wanted to cover so when we're talking about weights um at the top we have the leaders the great leadership and positive relationships collaborative leader able to establish positive and Cooperative working relationships with elected uh officials staff and other public officials in the public any questions on that one or should we just go down the line well I think I think we can just ask if anybody has any questions about any of the categories like are you unsure about what they actually mean I can see by Ron's Ron's ready to chomp at the bit to tell us all his questions well I I I I don't know how to approach this okay I I I read over this and I understand it kind of but the first five categories sound like a job performance review for a person in a management position that you've worked with before MH and I feel uncomfortable rating somebody that I haven't worked with then I get a 15minute or a 45 minute uh view on a TV or whatever of them I think it's a hard ball to catch to say that they great leadership and uh positive relationships in that 45 minutes and I mean maybe there's more other things in there but before I get to that I want to just ask these three questions does each member of the council have to sign their score sheet do they have to sign them yeah or do we have to initial them do we have to do anything well you're going to give them you're going to hand them in so it's going to be probably clear who who hand hands them to sue so if you're asking if they're Anonymous no they're not Anonymous okay so is this public information it will be after everything is done after so it it it's going to be the combined score that will be public information okay that score score will be y just the score not the comments notes no no okay and uh can members discuss this with other members or is it just single we're all alone in this when we do this in other words can a council person call another council person is said I looked at this one I think the open meeting law pertains to this so you can one can't do daisy chaining can't have can't have any unauthorized meetings without including the public y or you could talk or you could talk to alen yep yeah so if you have a question and you call me you're fine if you call me and then you call Sue no okay about the same thing no well I I looked like I said the first five kind of caught me like I'm not trained in HR okay yep so I was trained as a police officer so I can judge people but I can't I don't know if I can judge uh a great communicator unless I watch watch the the video and see that well they're talking pretty good you know well no no no the the the the questions are crafted so that they should answer these these they they should be giving examples or um answering the question in such a way that you will be able to say wow yeah I'm impressed by that or HM I'm not so sure about that they didn't answer and and that's why you have these different these different scores and you've got kind of in parentheses your your of confidence with that I think that's that's what really helped me so if you look on the very first page of Sue memo unsure so if you if if you're looking at the questions that pertain to the leadership and after hearing the interview and looking at their resume and their cover letter and their references and the skills assessment you're going I don't know I'm really I'm not convinced then you're an unsure 20 or maybe you're a little bit more than unsure maybe you're like kind of questionable but you know more than just a 20 then you're a 50 so you're I mean it's not a perfect system NE no interview is and that uncertainty that you're feeling is the same uncertainty you feel every time you're interviewing somebody I mean there's it's not a it's not a science well I understand it but like Problem Solver I mean I that's a pretty I mean I don't you know I think you'll feel better when you see the questions and I I do have one comment so and I totally understand when when you don't do this a lot that it's it doesn't come easily but we want your feedback so I would say just give it your best try and after after we are done with the scoring and somebody's just way off from everybody else's we can take a look and say well did you look at this or did you look at that we're going to talk about it so in a public meeting after everything is entered in so this is before we get to the two or the three yes yes this is how we get to the two or three to two or three yeah this so so when it comes to picking the one from the two or three you will be interviewing them in person along the whole Council will be interviewing them in person so and they will also meet meet with the staff and have a chance to be questioned by the staff and the public will also have an opportunity to to watch the interviews and meet them and greet them and ask them questions and things so the Personnel committee went through this list with all 16 people to start with so you scored all those people yes sir so are you going to rescore them again no because the questions are different we didn't we didn't have interview questions we just scored them according to the categories and what was on paper all we had was what was on paper so we basically did an assessment first to say did they meet our minimum qualification and I think three did not and the rest of all the you know applications we got three did not and the rest of them did and of the ones that met our minimum qualifications then we scored them and we looked at my top six and Sue's top six and there were there was concordance with most of them but there was a couple where there wasn't we talked about it and we agreed on what the top six should be but all we had to all we had to go on was the the applications the resumés the um cover letter that's all we had so that's as good a job as we could do on these things and there were some of these where we couldn't I mean they didn't address it and you couldn't really pull it off so that was the that was ones that got everybody got 20 well I that's I look at it and I I I look at the scoring you got there the weight of it the the 20s 2020s M why I I I understand the goal is you want someone I mean you want somebody that's a great leadership a real know you know whoever he or she is you want them to be the best out of the group but sometimes it's hard looking at that and if you're putting such a heavy load on one topic that they a great leader if you don't have it right you gave a lot of percentage to this one down here at the bottom they might know every law and uh order of procedures of everything you got to do in the elections and everything else and they get a little one and I just don't see how that levels out sometimes you if you want a whole person uh I mean it's great to have it all and maybe this this video will answer all those questions I have but I I just think 20 is a lot and I think that's why we're talking about it so if you feel like these weights aren't quite what they should be we should talk about it and if we you know and if you have a you know if you think leadership should be 15 or 10 or whatever let's talk about it because that's why we're doing this is that we you know we want to make sure everybody's comfortable with the way that we're proposing this is this is the Personnel committee's recommendation but that doesn't mean that has to be what we go with what what what does this sound ridiculous to put everything at an equal like 15 155 because if you're wrong on one thing really bad and everybody else's see something different I mean we could then we would take the weight out and just do an average score right yeah I mean that's that's something to think about I I just I I just look at it because I'm putting maybe too much emphasis on that first two and the process Improvement my management you know uh I just I see a lot of weight on that I I figured I got to watch what I right here because I could I could say well I don't think they have anything but they sure have everything else mhm well so I think you're bringing up really good points and part of the purpose of the discussion is to force us to kind of come in our own heads what are the most important attributes so what is it that we're looking for because different cities probably need um City administrators with different strengths right so if you're Columbus what is it that is most important for Columbus and if you're you know uh Blain maybe it's really different in Blain so so again from our discussion this is kind of how we felt and and if you look at the leadership and the process Improvement um time management or I think in the parentheses is what makes this really important is you fix what's wrong we know that there are there's a real lack of documentation and policies and procedures that are written and things like that and that needs to be fixed that needs to be a priority so if you have a candidate that that's not one of their strong suits that's going to be really hard to fix if that's not what they are good at or have had a lot of experience doing so you know when we came up with this we really tried to think about at least from our perspective what are the areas that are the most important for us to have greatness in and if you're you know um well versed with the laws rules and regulations of course that's important but we also have City attorneys that can help us with that kind of stuff so you have some kind of you know backup expertise you know you've got Engineers that know the rules and the laws related to that you've got you know um Jim that knows the the rules and the regulations related to his area and so you've got you've got some backup in those areas there's only one leader and there's only one person that sets the tone for this office and there's only one person that sets the tone for inter interacting with the public and with the council and so I I think that that was in our mind why we we we did those more heavily but it doesn't have to be the numbers we put down yeah or we could um shrink the range a little bit so we want I mean these are uh you know we could make them all so they're just Five Points apart why look at the last one for Five Points down there and I'm looking at it uh how other than looking at their resume kind of and seeing what that what's going on there kind of it's it's one of the questions that they're answering so if you're asked a question how do you keep up with everything and they go well know I wing it I wing it I or you know every those are nice easy ones then there there are some there are some pretty straightforward questions and then there are some harder questions but every one of these has at least one question that will give you a sense of where they're coming from and some of them have multiple the ones that are the higher scored ones have multiple questions so I think I think once you see the questions once they're finalized that it might give you a little bit more comfort and probably once you start doing it it's like okay now I get it it's really hard to conceptualize it if you haven't done it before but but you're bringing up really good points and this is why we're why we're having this conversation and I don't know you know I'm not going to be able to see if Rob raises his hand so I you might need to go to your other screen that shows who's who's on there so in case he has something he wants to weigh in on or I should see yeah J Janet actually I did for a little bit but that's that's a okay um one the one of the things I was just thinking about is you know someone that's able to delegate and is um not having reviewed the questions right now um is there something about how well do you delegate like work down to the people that and and trust that the people underneath you would do a good job at it is there some form of question like that Janet it's kind of underneath these categories but yeah there are there are questions that'll get to that okay yeah I think that's that's important and and the the biggest thing is just communication skills because that person person's working with every aspect of our our community and our governmental agency there and if there's friction or if someone doesn't communicate well that's that might not be a good thing right no it'll be important that's all thank you rob how about you I know you you have to transition from state government to local government well I've never I've never done the weighted thing before so and you don't have to you just have to score you just have to score well correct just understand the way you guys waited and they have nothing to say we'll give her a shot pleas so so let's go back so the action items that I had outlined here um was reviewing the remaining steps and timeline so we didn't talk about the timeline um one of the things that we're going to do at tomorrow's meeting is to set the date for the special meeting that we actually choose the semi-finalists the interviews are happening next week on Monday and Tuesday um and then Ellen will get them set up to do the assessment and they'll probably have like five days or so to do the assessment and then we will get all of that into the um folders for you and you'll have somewhere around a week to get through all of that maybe a little bit longer depending on what the date is of the special meeting but there'll be there'll be a time period defined for you to go through and look at everything and score everything get them to sue we'll number crunch it and then it'll be available to discuss at that special meeting so the special meeting will probably be sometime around the middle of May second third week in May depending on what we decide tomorrow night so what will we discuss all six or the two or three top we'll come back with the answers to who are the two top two or three and they will not be discussed by name they will be discussed by their letter okay and if and you'll have all the information and so if you're looking at that going n I'm not W I don't think so and we'll talk about it because sometimes the numbers aren't the only answer but by the time we discuss as a group it'll be down to two or three no that's what we're going to decide on that special meeting okay you're going to get all the information from the six and you're going to see how they rank so there'll be a number and you'll see from the top to the bottom of those six how they rank and if everybody's happy with yeah the top two or the top three are the ones that we want to go with then we're done if you're looking at that list and you're going this isn't the whole picture those might be the top numbers but there's more to think about that it wasn't captured that's totally legitimate so so don't worry that oh if you write this down and and you end up you know the top person isn't the top person you really think should be it and none of us do then they're not this is really just a way to help distill down a lot of information that you're getting and it but it's not it's not hard and fast it's it's a guidance does that make you feel any better I watch Jeopardy a lot [Laughter] so but I don't know what that means well what it means is you know they only give you a little bit and you got to figure it out we're not going to ask you to to frame it in the in the way of a question is that what you're worried about no I I I just I just don't I if the information's there I'll be happy the problem is I'm worried that I won't see it and I I just don't know how to judge somebody on leadership if I have no history other than an application and a comment they made for because they got well how many qu uh categories we got seven nine nine nine categories so if you got a question for each one no we got well we have multiple questions for some of them and you got a 45 minute period we're looking at a time period that that so you got five minutes on leadership or something and I got to make a decision on how to score that that's what I'm looking at M and anybody could throw a score up down well and you know part part of what will be nice too for the for the meeting um the special meeting is that you will hear what everybody else is saying and I know and when when Sue and I and Megan and Ellen went through this the first time some of the stuff that Sue picked up on or some of the stuff that I picked up on weighed in on like oh yeah you're right that that probably makes more sense I didn't think about that so we we we were able to augment you know information that one or one or the other may not have missed or may have interpreted it differently and so there's going to be five of us who are who are going to have all this in front of us you're going to know how you felt about your your scoring and you'll be able to say well the reason I gave that person this this score was because you know this is how they answered it this and then and it's like wow you're right I missed that yeah okay I agree with I agree with what you're saying this is open to the public this whole yes discussion yep it won't be with names though it'll just be with AB bcde e f well I guess we just go with it so I'm hearing that the steps and the timeline sound okay to everybody yep okay and and it sounds like this the score sheet the way that we're presenting it you're not coming up up with something that that changes it you're okay with going with it the way it is well I'm not happy with it but I'm just one person there's four others here well do you have do you have things you'd want I mean do you have suggestions for how to change it well I just think the 20s on those first where do I have it I don't know what anybody else's opinion on it I mean I just Rob did you get a chance to look at the um the weights no I did not when when was that email sent out I'm looking at my email right now yes was it yes Monday Monday it what it came from Sue okay so we can um maybe they want to think about it for one day and just email back to us that part and it would only be the weights that we would potentially modify well if you people don't if you think it's I shouldn't say you people but if if you think that's this thing will open my eyes watching it I'll go along I mean I think they're important and they are the top important things but I just don't I don't know if we all catch the importance of it compared to down at the bottom an active learner so the only thing I can see about active Learners if a question is do you go to school much or do you if you see a class oh yeah I go to you know that's easy to pick up and it's easy to look at their their uh resume and see what they've attended or whatever but I just look it's a lot up on something I don't know well I think the one thing too is that as you look at the top ones they're the ones that are harder to assess they have the higher scores cuz they're not so black and white it's unlikely that you're going to get 990s and 100s there you're going to get this the the lower numbers so when you think of 20% of 50 or 70 and then compared to the ones on the bottom which are pretty black and white where they're probably going to get the higher scores then the then the the actual numbers aren't the number differences aren't as great as it looks when you just look at the waiting so if you get a 100 on on one that's only 5% they get five points if you get a 50 on one that's 20% they get what 10 points am I doing my math right I'd have to look at my calculated spreadsheet y but then again if by great leadership and positive relationships if they just stand out you know as a good communicator answering the question they would get a high score right but then they probably are and that would be a good thing for us wouldn't it we keep it the way it is though Say Janet um I had a question on I did find that email came from Sue and Jack but so were you saying that it would be a weighted average or that number would be the number like the total of all their questions and then that's the number that advances them forward it'll be it'll be a weighted score and then we'll average the five weighted scores to be able to get a number for each candidate and then we'll rank them from the highest to the lowest okay what what is the reason for that versus just the just the straight score itself because I do something similar at work I when where we're doing a lot of interviews I'm actually do them tomorrow but it's it's like a it's a 100 point system asks them on of questions and then whoever gets then they go forward is that similar it's just I'm trying to understand uh the weighted portion you're probably going to have to repeat that because you broke up when you um I think I understood you did break up a lot but the reason for the weight is because the importance of some of the qualifications are just more important than some of the other ones so we want to weight those heavier um it's still a 100 point system though yes so so at the end of the day if you were if you were a 100 on all of these you'd get a score of a 100 okay let's do a little let's do a practice run okay we're all voting for Ron and we all give him a 100 right yep so I say 100 you say 100 he says 100 you say 100 Rob says 100 okay so far that's for the first one so then he gets 20 points for that so he gets 20 points yep so that's as full of scor as he can get that's the best score he can get on that first category okay so let's go down to Great Communicator 15 yep so we got a 15 a 15 that's 30 45 60 75 with if we all vote 15 no so we're not we're not adding up each of those at the you're you're adding them up individually and at the bottom let's say at the bottom Ron ends up with 75 so you add up he got 20 on the top he got 15 on the on the next one he got 15 on the next one oh he bombed down on the problem solver he's not a very good Problem Solver so I mean so you add up you add up all the all the scores because you're using these scores on the top of the sheet those are the scores that you can you can put in those categories and then they're multiplied by instead of a weight of 20 be 20% Which one are you on jennet the first one or the second I'm so look at the look at the score sheet and you see at the top these are the scores that you can choose from and what they mean so if if Ron is a great leader he gets 100 in that in that score he gets 20 points because 20% of 100 is 20 points yeah okay so in the next one process Improvement let's say he's really good at that too he gets 100 there so he gets 20 points there now he's got 40 points total then he gets to Great Communicator at all levels 15 uh he's only a 20 there we weren't we weren't convinced that he was a great communicator so 15% of 20 I don't know what is it five three something yeah y so so you start adding all those scores up and out of 100 points let's say Ron ends up with 75 so we go down the whole page and we you come up with your number yep at the bottom you got a total yep you so what what you're going to do is you're just going to come up with the scores yep Sue is going to enter it in and it's going to calculate the points yep at the bottom it will be a number like 75 or 55 or whatever the number is right or 90 or 100 so let's say let's say when when you do Ron you got 75 at the bottom yeah when I did Ron I only gave him 50 y when Sue did it she was somewhere in between us she gave him a 60 y when Rob did it he he's like H I'm not so sure about that guy I'm only giving him a 40 those numbers all get added up divided by five that's the average yep that's the number that you'll see when we get together on the on the May whatever for the special meeting you will see that number for each of the six candidates hold it so you see that number you guys see it and then you divide it by 15 no the spreadsheets going to calculate out what the the total score is for each candidate yep and then the Personnel committee is going to take those five scores for each candidate and average it just do a basic average so then each candidate will have our average score by our five people so then there will be six average scores and let's say the six average scores go from 75 to 40 good so let's say the scores are 75 60 50 50 and 40 yeah so the top two are 75 and 60 now we'll look at those and say are those really the top two that we want as our finalists let's say that we all agree on that we're done if if Ron looks at it and goes wait wait wait how in the world did we get 75 for that first person here's what here's what I saw and Sue goes gosh I missed that yeah you're right I I would probably change mine then and then so we say oh you know maybe that top one really isn't a good fit for us now we might go down to the you know the 60 and the 50 guy or gal and move them up yep so so again this is this is just helping us kind of sort through a lot of information and put it in some uh logical order to discuss it and when you when you have it all in front of you you will have everything in front of you and you can sit back and go Yep this I'm really comfortable with this or you can say I'm not because here's you know here's what I saw here's what I heard this is what I know and and we'll consider it and the reason I'm saying two or three is because if you end up with you know someone who's really clearly the top and then two people that are like one point apart you know we may want to say okay you know that's not enough to really separate these two so so that's that's that's the process so real real quick we you can go like 55 or 75 I knew you were going to ask that can you we just stick with the numbers that Sue gave you because what's you know what's what's a 50 you know we've got those defined 53 I don't know what a 53.4 means okay talk about wanting to make it complicated well and Ron you're right when you're just watching a video or short interview or whatever you never know I mean that's like a first date but once we go through it all Whittle it down and then you can ask any question you want then then with the last two or yes yes and that'll give us a much better idea what would you do if somebody wants a license and there's a tornado coming and Christmas is right around the corner you go Christmas shop there we go I I think that's why you should be the city administrator Ron I think you're right though I think all five of us we're all going to come up with something and when it gets merged together it'll work out it's the best you got best system I mean well the only like we talked about it today if if we didn't do it this way everybody's going to have their own IDE a of why they picked the person that's at their top and it could be one of a hundred things so we're just trying to get commonality and consensus on on the city council so we can at least all be approaching it the same and you're right that this looks a lot like a performance review that's on purpose because you you know you have a job description that says here are the job here are the responsibilities are the duties of this person this is what they're going to be held accountable for so you better pick somebody who's got the qualifications to do them that's the that's the point and everybody goes through this process everybody that hires somebody that's all they got is the resume the interview and if they know something else that I I don't know I guess you could call their employer and get a little more we will we'll have references on the finalists okay yep all right answered all my questions thank you so there's no action to be taken tonight it was really just a discussion to make sure that we were all on the same page moving forward and unless Rob do you have any other questions um I see how I just came off mute um just uh no I I trust that you put this together and no both you and Su work in managerial rules and stuff so I trust that you put a good set of questions together so thanks both of you and I will just also add that we had the City attorney and the HR consultant who's been with us every step of the way so it's not just Sue and I it's it's those two also so yeah well thanks to them as well okay and we're done we can move on to the next the next topic are we on the lake dve Corridor study or the water system study water system all right Kevin you're up thank you for waiting all right thank you um so I'll do a little introduction here and Jim may want to chime in with any additional information and then uh we're going to turn it over to Brian but um just to back up a little bit um we we initiated this study back in August and that was a result of uh Jim's desire to analyze the water system in more detail um number one from an operational standpoint but also from a water quality uh standpoint so we we put together proposal uh that was approved by the city council and our Environmental Group has been engaged in putting together the study and we will in the end have a written bound report um summarizing um all these um issues in detail and so um back in August you met um Seth Peterson uh Brian golden has been involved in this study and has basically put together the bulk of the report and he has put together a um PowerPoint to review with you Brian is a uh principal engineer in our Environmental Group and has lots of experience in doing these kinds of projects uh both for for cities of this very similar to Columbus and uh so Jim I don't know if you wanted to add anything at this point or so I I won't right now I'll let him go through his Spiel and then I'll answer any type of questions or just offer some thought processes on why we really got here so Brian all right thank Kevin good evening mayor and Council uh I did have hard copies here did anybody need one I'll take I would love one I'll take I'll take them thank you so I I thought you may may want to jot some notes I was going to say you you're may be looking forward to an easy conversation and maybe this one won't be that cuz usually when I'm here things are will it be easier than the one we just had you know we I'll let you guys be the judge so um but uh I want to give you an opportunity to take some notes because the the slideshow itself is is simplified down because there can be a lot of information here and I'm hoping to just communicate that verbally with you um rather than having a a bunch of words on the screen um but we are going to be talking about your water system both in terms of of distribution and quality and some of the concerns that that are there with the water system um so so there we are on that slide so just a few of the things we're going to run through is the the kind of the purpose of the study looking at historical water usage looking at water quality um and then getting into a review of the existing needs of the system um some treatment Alternatives uh any a preliminary cost evaluation and then a timeline so as we step through um so starting with the purpose um one of the main purposes of kind of the overall study is is get getting applications in for funding and so in the state of Minnesota there's the public facilities Authority that funds drinking water projects and there are applications due on a yearly basis to get on the initial funding list that due date is coming up in early May um and so one of the efforts of this study is to get on the list for funding now it is important to get on the list but I want you to realize getting on the list is not require you to do any work and you also have the flexibility to change course on the direction you may want to go with a project and so we will be moving forward to get you on that funding list based on the discussions tonight um but most of all want to provide the flexibility for you to make future decisions regarding the water system and have that funding available um so that's one of the primary things um with this study and then giving you guys some background on the system the concerns that are there um the cost associated with some of the alternatives for addressing those concerns um we can go to the next slide uh so just a quick look at historical water usage uh Over The Last 5 Years um you can see there in 2020 there was a dip um because of the pandemic and the shutdown of commercial and Industrial users in your system so we definitely saw a dip in 2020 um but if we we took that dip out you can see a general Trend upward in the yearly water usage across your system and that is expected to continue going forward with with added growth to the system so that's yearly water usage and then each subsequent graph here is going to get a little bit more detailed uh so this slide shows a monthly average water use and you can see those Peaks and valleys throughout the year and because of the commercial industrial use you see more of a seasonal change over time for water usage so when you look at the graph there you're going to notice that during the winter months flows are lower obviously there's also no irrigation and things like that going on and then you see the Peaks uh during the summer and then uh the next graph gets a bit more detailed and this is kind of the daily usage and so one of the important things we're looking at on the daily usage is what are the maximum day usage and as you look at this graph you're seeing the maximum days between 2 and 300,000 gallons per day and um there's some with the existing system and how things are monitored there's some discrepancies in that daily usage and so we are going to dig a little bit deeper into that to make sure we're on the same page as staff on what those exact Peaks are because as we've dug into some things we've realize that because of the monitoring over the weekend and sometimes the data is collected Mondays and not through the weekend to make sure we've gotten rid of any of those um spikes that aren't actually spikes in the system um because that um that Peak day will become important when we start talking about treatment Alternatives that you may consider of what a treatment plant would be sized for if that was needed um so just a general overview and and when it comes to I realize sitting here that um I didn't add the future flows uh to this and I apologize for that but basically over the 20-year design period we be be looking about doubling the existing Peak flows so if we're in the 2 to 300,000 gallon range we're in that 5 to 600,000 gallon range uh over the next 20 years so as we plan improvements that would be the design year that we're looking at 2044 uh the next graph um is the same data we just saw but what's added to this is your current well capacity and so uh there are two lines shown um there's a firm well capacity and that is your Your Capacity with the largest well out of service and then the orange line at the top would be the total Wells and so what what you want as a you as a system would be your firm capacity to always be greater than your Peak day and what's shown here is you have a lot of excess capacity in the wells because of the size of those Wells so in general the concept here is you do not have any um capacity concerns your existing Wells are much bigger than what you would need to meet your demands um so going to the next slide um water quality um as you see on this table there's a couple parameters on here and this will be a little bit uh deeper discussion on this slide and so we have two parameters on here one is manganese and one is iron uh historically these compounds did not have any health risks associated with them but they do cause staining so you'll see brown or black staining from Iron and manganese and the concentrations you have of iron and manganese in your wells would likely cause some of those color complaints coming uh recently uh EPA has been looking into manganese and potential health related risks with manganese and um they have set guidelines for um Health advisory guidelines for manganes um the interesting thing right now is these are not mandated so there is no requirement to meet them but they do have some health guidelines so it's a it's a interesting place right now because there is um public information about potential health risks but there is no requirement to meet these levels um but if you see that uh in the mdh health risk limit there is a 0.14 infants less than one year old and then a three for adults and children and if you look at your wells um if you if you average these out you are above both the infant and the adult level for manganese um the iron uh the stand for iron there is a secondary standard which is purely based on Aesthetics so above three you may have staining complaints and dirty water complaints and so your iron is kind of hovering right around that level it is high enough that it would likely cause some staining issues um but but jumping back to the manganese item um this is one of uh one of the items in the report that's critical along with the water tower which we'll get into is the consideration for possible treatment um to address manganes in the water you would need to add a treatment facility to do that um in the current funding through the state they do offer grants for manganese treatment the as it was currently constituted it was a 50% Grant up to $3 million um can you say that again is a 50% Grant up to 3 million oh okay so you you'd have a 50% share and then the max was 3 million and that's what was currently funded in the legislature any funds that were in the program for it are already spoken for so future funds would be based on the legislature continuing to fund that program um so um I think we'll I guess is there any questions let me just pause there I guess on the mangines item um we can come back to discussions on that but any questions I just have I'm not even sure I thought magn manganese was good for you but maybe not at this level right so all most minerals right have some health benefits too and so right in the state or even EPA wise this has not been regulated ever as a drinking water standard the first Safe Drinking Water Act was in the 70s so this has never been regulated um so there's new research that it could have neurological impacts um um and so like a lot of things I guess moderation is good and excess can be detrimental um and so this is one of the the new items is a magnesium is that hard on equipment um what happens with both iron and manganese is that they precipitate into a solid and so um like manganese you might notice in your in your toilet BS more so in the in the in the water tank because it takes a while for it to turn into a particulate when it comes out of the ground it's dissolved in the water so the water's clear but then as it's air rated or mixed with chlorine or other things that precipitates out so I actually have manganes at my house and where I see it is in the the tanks of my toilets if I take them off I'll have a black layer in the bottom that builds up um so you can get accumulation in water heaters and things like that you can get clothes staining um you know if you have sprinkler systems and they spray on the house all of a sudden you see these these lines where the sprinkler has been hitting the house because it's getting Brown um so in terms of equipment stuff that is sensitive to those type of solids but I wouldn't say uh I wouldn't say you have a lot of it like in in your home or anything that's going to cause problems with I just wondering if they have to clean a water tower or anything like that sits with it so currently the way your system tries to handle that is there's a chemical added that tries to keep the manganese and iron dissolved so it kind of ties it up to prevent it from becoming a solid but that only lasts for maybe 24 to 48 hours so if that water isn't used quick enough it'll start to come out of solution and make a solid that's going to cause staining so right now that's kind of how it's dealt with but that doesn't remove it so from a consumption standpoint or health impact it it doesn't really impact it because it's still in the water um what is that chemical it's a phosphate compound um and and phosphate can do a couple things it's also corrosion inhibitor so if you were tuned into the Flint Michigan item you may have heard about a phosphate that was a different scenario because it was being used to protect piping from corrosion yeah that has a couple different purposes I just want to throw that out there in case you've heard it before and you're like oh Flint Michigan no different purpose and is there any kind of guidelines how many glasses of water you have to drink a day to have a problem so with the manganese um I don't know if there's anything specific on that one nor normally what it's based on is uh is an adult drinking a liter a day well I shouldn't say an adult in this case there's infant so I I don't know about the infants but I know other health risks are usually based on an adult drinking a liter a day and usually the guidelines are set at an extended period of that consumption but here we have the infants and so obviously that's not going to be an extended period because it changes after a year so unfortunately I don't know the details behind how they developed those standards I shouldn't say standards advisory levels because that'd be a lot of water for oneye old to be drinking right so they they um they must have based that on what a normal infant would be drinking I assume in in a um well make it in the formula formula right yeah it could be a liter I mean if they drink six bottles a day and they're making it they're making it themselves with the water with the powder formula okay so I I have a question on the slide above that um back to the historical water usage where it shows so it's our numbers from the previous slide and then showing what our capacity is yep and it it looks like we have a lot of capacity even though our numbers are going to go up how how far can we go up until it gets so that that green line of the 1.7 MGD that's for capacity so if you lose your biggest well that's what you still have left mhm is is that's the line you want to stay below and so the 2044 projection I apologize for not putting it on here is about double the current capacity so you're at about maybe 6 okay so you're still barely at 30% of what your current well capacity is such that even in the report we we looked out to 2075 even and you you know a lot could change and you could have big big users come in but your projected have capacity available for a long time and that was one of the reasons why we did we doing the study kind looking at capacity um so one of the big reasons and I which I haven't gotten to yet is is the the I guess lack of a water tower and so right now you have a pumped system um and so maybe most of you are on like home Wells and so in your home well this is the best way I can probably communicate it is that in your home you you have a pressure tank somewhere in the basement a lot of times they a blue tank um and your well pumps into that and that tank has a bladder in it and it pressurizes and then as you use water that bladder Goes Down And once it gets to a low enough pressure your well pump needs to kick on to fill that tank again and so that's kind of how your system operates now except you have three of those that are were separated and now they're kind of connected and and they're kind of just fighting each other I guess is the best way to put it if you want information on that I can kind of go over that but I mean he kind of hit it in a nutshell we have three I'm going to call it three systems so we have wellhouse 23 which is by prer preserve we have wellhouse one which is by Freeway Mini Storage and then we have the Ziggler water tank which is down by Ziggler all three of those systems came on at at different times so they all hypothetically work together but individually so we have a pressure pump system we have a air over water system which is similar to what you guys have at home it's not a bladder tank it's just literally air over water and then we have a pressure system they all work differently they can all come on at the same time for different reasons so our system it works it's got us this far um we increment put different things on which makes it extremely difficult to operate so if Running Aces which you see those peaks in there Running Aces causes a lot of Peaks for us because they're filling a pool or they're filling their water truck to uh wet the track so so that creates a high demand for us which is hard on our system because we don't have that water tower capacity which creates pressure in our system we have to make pressure so if we have that high demand at Running Aces the close as well to that's going to kick on there's no capacity there that is solely operated off of there's a demand I need to supply it so now Wells turn on because that demand is very quick so we go from call it 60 PSI to 40 PSI really quick because you suck that water right out of the system now that wellhouse says oh boy there's something going on here I need to react both Wells are going to kick on now we're pumping 2,000 gallons a minute or 2100 gallons a minute at a very high rate of speed to try to supply that and then as that works its way down to wellhouse one and Ziggler pump house I kind of took Jack on a tour today so he kind of got some idea on what it is then those things start to incrementally react too so once all of that stuff starts to work now we're potentially pumping you know 2500 gallons a minute 3,500 gallons a minute and then that water stops and now you're pumping that kind of Supply into the system and there's nowhere for it to go so it really screws with our system which makes it very difficult to operate and I get that I threw a lot of stuff out there and I am willing to take anybody on a field trip to kind of show them what it is you can't really see what I explained but I can show you when each one came on and kind of how they operate individually but kind of work together MH so the three very different systems that we've molded together over time to try to get to where we are today okay just to summarize that we do have a water system but essentially it's three different types of facilities that are comprised of semi compatible components that don't always operate in concert at different times of demand so it does place a lot of stress and strain on the operation of the system and it's not the ideal setup and again too one of the big issues is lack of storage capacity so we're essentially dependent on drawing water up from the well to meet demand rather than having storage one thing in water and sewer systems your best friend is gravity and gravity comes from tanks for the water system and from sewer system it's essentially more or less based on either have the topography to it or you don't so don't we have a tank at Ziggler a storage tank at Ziggler we do but so here in lies the problem the tank is at the South End of the system where we have virtually no users and the high demand is on the North End so when that high demand kicks in Imagine I'm going to take a stab because I haven't calculated but between Running Aces and the Ziggler Pump House I'm going to say there's somewhere between 2 and 500,000 gallons of water in the line okay cuz I mean it it kind of Ventures off all over the place by the time they open a well and the Ziggler Pump House senses that loss wellhouse 23 is already dropped from 70 PSI to 30 or 40 well one which is kind of in the middle of those two is dropping pressure at a rapid rate of speed and then that system down there sees it because it's so far away that that one says oh boy something's going on here I need to start pumping two which is why I say they all turn on and now I have this high demand of water trying to supply Running Aces or a fire hydrant or you know some some higher demand you know what I mean if if people are flushing toilets or running their sinks or filling a bathtub you don't see that crazy flow you know what I mean and the pressure drops really slow but that's not indicative of what we see especially in the spring summer and towards fall because of how our system operates so so that's the that's the Dilemma right we we have some water capacity and don't don't take that as a water tower cuz that's just above ground storage it's not water tower so it doesn't create pressure in the system we have pump to help create that pressure right but it's so far away if that system was right next to Running Aces mhm it would work a thousand times better than it does and it gives us capacity so if there was a building that was on fire and their fire suppression started kicking on and that demand starts and it runs for a long period of time our system levels out and then everything starts to manage back but when you lose pressure here and I haven't lost it here it really shakes it up because we're trying to run our system off of Ziggler and our big users are on the opposite end of town and the reason we got into that was you know we built our first wellhouse by Freeway Mini Storage that well initially when they were test drilling was 1,000 gallons a minute when they drilled the well that we're going to connect we only had 400 gallons a minute well they need 17 00 for fire suppression so they built that tank system down there with the caveat that we were going to buy it so that was our next phase instead of water tower water treatment we were going to move into that system which bought us another you know five or six years but now we're just we're past that point now that you know it's it's creating us too much trouble does that cause hammering oh absolutely they can really feel it so if you're sitting in the wellhouse and you watch yeah you'll see pressures that are pushing 90 plus PSI and and that creates some serious troubles so because you because you turn all that capacity on and you know Running Aces is filling a I'm not picking on them by the way but they are clearly that crazy user when they turn on and off that water like that they're flowing out of a 4in pipe probably you know 3,000 gallons a minute and then you go from 3,000 Gall a minute to zero that's a lot of water that's moving that direction and then it stops and it hits the wall and then it goes back the other way and you'll watch it you'll watch the gauges they just go like this for two or three minutes that affect the hydrant then yes I I mean hypothetically you could have a you could have a blowout somewhere it could separate a pipe I mean it could do all sorts of things that that could be really ugly we've not onone would have not ever had that trouble and I take some of that to our system is new and the pipes in the ground are plastic so maybe they expand and contract a little bit differently than what ductal iron would do even though you know duct all Iron is a good good pipe as well but there's just some things there that make it really difficult now that we've grown to to try to manage can you tell if there's a leak in the line somewhere um it depends on how big it is so I mean if it's you know 250 gallons a minute yeah you'll you'll know it I mean because your pumps are running and you know at some point that demand it might take you a little bit of time to figure it out but our pumps don't run non-stop so I mean they'll run and shut off run and shut off because we can supply that demand but if you have that steady flow you're going to see that hey something's running and if hypothetical Ziggler pump house is running that will if one of those pumps run for a certain period of time it'll hit a timer and it'll it'll call and say hey I've been running a long time um maybe there's something wrong so it calls us and says hey there's you know this pump has been running um maybe you should check it out so yeah you can you can figure those things out but so I didn't mean to hijack but I wanted to give them a little bit of History so it kind of maybe makes a little more sense y right our problem is not a capacity problem our problem is more of a of a um our problem is a a a usage Peak and I mean the the variation in usage is what's hard on our system it's not that we don't have the capacity to provide the water we need to it's just not where it needs to be is one of the bigger problems Plus you know you can't you can't beat a gravity system right I mean there's water up and it just flows down and it's steady pressure all the time M our system is not steady pressure ever so that's that's the hard part when you operate a pressure type of system which is what ours is you have you have crazy high high high numbers low numbers I mean you could get down to you know 30 PSI and and hypothetically if you start getting into that 20 psi now you start having department of health issues because um you can actually draw water in from somewhere else because you've sucked enough pressure out of your system that it doesn't hold anything out so hypothetically if I had a garden hose in my yard and it was sitting down in the drainage ditch by my cow feeder um it could actually suck that water back into the system and then you then it creates a catastrophe a nasty problem yeah yeah so that's where you've seen what would have happened in Blaine I don't know how many year ago years ago it's in but they lost system pressure and then there's a boil water notice because once you lose pressure in that pipe you can get contaminants coming into the pipe where when the pipe's pressurized it's going to leak outward um so on low pressure pressure situations you can get into those conditions if you get below 20 psi um so um see so yeah really the the difficulty with that system the maintenance and you know even having well pumps starting and stopping frequently is is hard on on those Wells usually it's something you want to run steadily for a while and then turn off um that was the Big Driver to start looking at this but we didn't want to we wanted to look holistically at the water too and see you know is there quality concerns is there treatment concerns so really the the pressure issue was the the main concern initially and then as the report came you know the manganes became became a a second item um so with with the water tower that that's one of the primary needs of the system for smaller systems you know when these systems were separated running lower lower volumes those systems work as you get bigger and bigger and more complicated you're relying on mechanical equipment to provide your your system pressure um where once the water's in the air with your water tower typically What would happen the water tow gets filled up by the wells and then slowly drains down as people use it and because it's all up in the air if Running Aces takes 2,000 gallons a minute for 5 minutes it the tower just dropped a little and then once it gets to a a low point the wells kick on fill it back up and then shut off um and then you have water there if you lost power or mechanical equipment went down you still have water in the tower your pipes are still pressurized whereas when you're on mechanical equipment if you have failures and you can't pump water your pressure can be gone really quickly um so the tower just the stability of it with the pressure the fire protection all of those things um for community of your size in terms of your water supply needs that that's a that's a really big need for the system and it's going to um it's going to provide uh reliability in the system but it's also going to reduce maintenance um so any more questions on yeah the only thing I was going to ask is you said you didn't put the future you know however into the future on that um map will you provide that yes that is in the report I'm sorry that's not in here and so we will have a finalized report um after we have the discussion night and see if there's any other updates for it okay um but that has projections in it and then the future flow requ IR Ms and so essentially um looking at a 20-year planning period is what we would normally do um again that size would double um and then the water tower we're looking at would be like 150,000 gallons approximately is what the size would be um so I think let's see yep we're jumping ahead a few here we got we got through the main system needs um so when it comes to the treatment options there's there's a couple different options and again we wanted to take a holistic approach and see what all the needs may be and so the two kind of options looked at our our gravity filtration or a general filtration is is going to remove iron and manganes that's the main things it's going to do it doesn't provide much more treatment than that there's a lot of iron and manganese treatment facilities in the state of Minnesota um because that's a those are primary contaminants that are that are in the state um another option um because your your water is also hard is would you ever look at a softening facility um and so reverse asmosis is another option that would take on softening which would um right now we have home softeners and your users are softening at their Lo at their local is if you did it centrally they could eliminate that process um one of the main drivers we see for that in the state right now is actually on the Wastewater side that chlorides are becoming a limit on Wastewater discharges and when home softeners are used salt is used to uh do an ion exchange process and that discharges chlorides into the water stream which end up in the Wastewater Plant which end up in the discharge which end up in the receiving water and so as these chloride limits are more prominent across the state facilities are needing to look at softening their drinking water to get rid of the softener systems in houses because those contribute chlorides to the water whereas like a central facility we would design that doesn't use that same technology so the chlorides are not introduced into the water um so that is one of the primary drivers for softening and a reason we wanted to discuss it is there's new regulations coming out all the time and chlorides are one that you may have heard about um that are becoming more prevalent out there so um so sorry I jumped ahead again I think the the next slide talked about the gravity filtration um and then also the filtration with reverse osmosis um so at this time going to a softening facility would likely not make sense in terms of treatment but we did want to mention it because at some point those chloride limits you know may come down um so uh Brian question in regards to does does met Council put on chloride limits on because obviously all our Wastewater goes to the council PL yes So eventually you know it's it's all going to trickle uphill water flows downhill but this is going to come uphill right so if we have regulations from that Council that they have to meet a chloride limit they are going to have to go out to all their users um because trying to address that issue at their facility is going to be problematic so then it it would kind of trickle back out um so as far as where they're at right now with it I I don't know what me met council is face for chlorides but just knowing how regulations work it's worth mentioning because if they're if it's talked about in the state at some point in the future we all have to be thinking that it's going to affect everybody well the hard part for us too on the chlorides is our water system is very small so there's very small amount of users that would be there's a very small amount of users right so so we don't pump that many gallons of water every year or that much sewage as far as that goes but in our system there's a high percentage of chloride users meaning that almost everybody has a water softener because the water is hard enough that they're trying to get rid of that staining so if they work off of a percentage that says if you put a million gallons of water in and you're you're at an 80% number I I don't know how they're going to do it but we would probably likely meet that standard because you know you look at the um water softening system in running ases I mean it's a room half this size so I mean they have a massive water softening system in there I don't know what Blain Brothers put in but if you go down to Ziggler they have a relatively large system in there so I mean most of the big commercial users are putting that stuff in as well so it's not just residential so I I don't know how they're going to calculate but conceivably we could meet that standard it depending on how they how they say regulate um okay let's see I think we can go to the the next slide so uh when it comes to either sighting a treatment facility or the Water Tower or both uh there was three sites looked at um so one two and three are listed on here and then actually the next slide uh gives a little bit of a zoom in on each of those um so probably the the most important things to point out here are uh we'll get into talking about next steps and and preferred Alternatives um if there's a land purchase happening we would recommend that there is room there's enough room there for a tower and treatment facility even if say you'd only do a tower at this time it would be wise to have enough property there to set it up for treatment in the future if you think that's something that would happen in the future um so site one has the existing wellhouse on site the uh one of the challenges there we can go to the next slide is uh Zooms in on those I think um is just there's there's uh old ponds on site and there's wetlands and so it's it's a tough site to navigate to fit both a treatment plant and a tower on and the wells are there so it was initially looked at because they're close but the site is just not going to be conducive to to building those other structures on so if treatment is added we'd have to get a raw water line to the eventual site for the treatment plant just so people know site one is where wellhouse 23 sits that's the prer property prer Preserve I'm going to say it's prer preserve I don't know what we call it at this point but it's across from prer preserve um site number two is across the Northerly driveway of um Running Aces and then site number three is the property just north of I'm going to call them rvs.com or Gander Outdoors I'm not really sure what their name is at this point if you go with a gravity filtration system will you have to have a backwash p on to these sets uh typically now we we see a reclaim Basin being used and so the filters need backwashing and generates a a waste water we can recoup about 90% of that clean water we let the solid settle out take the clean water off the top and go back through the treatment plant to significantly reduce the amount of waste and then that would be the waste would be pumped to the sanitary sewer system I guess what my question is would that addition surface facility affect some of the limited acreage on some of these sites um that facility is is fairly small that that Reclamation tank um and so in general for a treatment facility if we're looking at U 600,000 gallons a day you're probably looking close to two acres acre and a half to 2 Aces would be a um a comfortable site um the reason the the site shrinks down is when we have portable water tanks below the ground you have to have a 50 foot setback from any source of contamination and property lines and so whatever property you take you have to draw a 50ft box around the property line and we can't put any tanks within that 50t of the proper line so it starts to shrink a little bit faster um um so on on the different sites here for sites two and three we've kind of shown where a water tower could go and then the potential land needs for the water treatment facility um and so just a rough outline of of the amount of property being shown there on each of the sites um the preferred site U from us in staff would be site three um that uh is has the most central location uh the raw water piping for a treatment plant from the wells um would be a manageable distance and so site three is the preferred site and also if you were to have a water tower there at site 3 it's a billboard along the interstate um that would display um the city's name city of columus on it and another cell phone tower probably a to that's right you can do some leases on there and it is equidistant more or less between uh the two well houses um so that uh you could tie in all of the wells um much more conveniently okay so the next slide is the the one everybody's been waiting for right so how much do these things cost right um well we're going to get funding so it doesn't matter right right right for some of it for some of it right so uh a very Minal preliminary cost evaluation here um and this is based on recent projects we've done uh recent sizes I do want to mention that with like the treatment facility there are different materials to look at you can look at concrete you can look at steel and some of that gets into the life cycle cost where concrete's going to be there for a long time steel needs to be painted and possibly replaced um so there are lots of different things to consider within the cost um but a rough cost for the water treatment plant you see there at 6 and a half million uh the Water Tower at 1.5 uh there would be some raw water man if there is a treatment facility to get the wells to the treatment facility um and then land acquisition so initially they're 8.8 million we have a lot of unknowns at this point so you see a contingency in there just for planning uh purposes um and then with engineering you know we have the total at 12.6 million I have a range on that because there's lots of other decisions to make in terms of building materials and things like that um what I mentioned before is the current grant for U manganes is 50% at $3 million um and in terms of other Grant sources for a project like this there are there are no other like um public facilities Authority funding options likely for your community so you'd probably be looking at um you know direct bonding things like that working through the legislature um but as we've talked about it the the tower is a primary need that that needs to be addressed the manganes treatment you know this is a difficult one for the council because there are Health advisory limits out there but it is not a mandated so it is a decision for the council if you would want to consider treatment at this time or if it's something that you would um consider in the future it is possible that manganese could become a standard in the future which means then you would have to meet the limit um I have no indication of if and when that would occur um the state has not really provided any information on that um so at at at this point for the funding application which I talked about at the beginning which is the primary Next Step um we can apply for both treatment and Tower and get on the list and like I said there is no requirement for you to do any of those projects so we would recommend getting on the list and and you can be on the list for it'll just carry over year to year and however you decide to implement projects you'll be one step closer to the funding on that um and and to clarify too the the funding through the PFA could be a combination of the grant that you discussed and and then low interest loans correct yes thank you Kevin um so funding for these would be available through PFA you very easily could get a loan which is a low interest loan over 20 years they're going to be below Market rates um I think currently they maybe still been around 2% for their loans so that loan is pretty readily available it's the grants that are that are a little bit more difficult um so um so I guess questions comments what size tank did you say you were recommending uh about 150,000 gallon tank does that meet 20y year future growth plans yes yep and what kind of shaped tank would it be would be just a cylinder um um bowl shaped what the the most economic for that size is what we call spheroid but that's kind of the the normal bowl shaped you would see um I think that's going to be what you would go with for for that size of tank we don't we don't you don't see the legged Towers anymore with the four legs um just structurally and Rehab cost and all those things those have kind of been phased out B on a pedestal would it be what what would the height of it be 198 ft less than 200 me FAA standards or so your height um you're probably looking at 15 probably to get the necessary pressure you'd want in your system and what would the difference in the cost be if you went up say to 250,000 gallons do you have any reductions in cost as you go up because you've got some things fixed already covered or is that something it's even worth looking at uh there is an economy of scale there because you got to get the water there so you have that whole structure being built so the you you're yes there will be economy a scale if you go up um I'd have to look at the pricing and we we could definitely do an evaluation of 50,000 gallon increments for you guys to see how that cost changes per volume can you can can you just kind of briefly touch on what the criteria is for sizing the bowl or the sure the capacity so there there's a couple different parameters for sizing that Tower one is kind of your average day usage and so you want enough in the bowl for your average day um and so you would the 150,000 would meet that criteria for 2044 the other one is fir flow and so you want enough storage to be able to fight a fire now as you saw earlier your well capacity is is really quite High compared to your usage and so one of the things that is keeping that Tower a little bit smaller is the fact that you have such big Wells because if you're fighting a fire you can have a pump running and take from the tower at the same time um and so normal communities that would have 150,000 gallon Tower probably have well pumps that do 200 gallons a minute where you guys have well pumps that are at two of them at a th and so you have a lot more capacity coming out of the wells to supplement what would be coming out of the tower at the same time so if you fought a fire for 60 minutes at 2,000 gallons a minute you would take 60,000 gallons from the tower and 60,000 gallons from the well pump um so that would you know drain you down to 990,000 in the tower if you're 150 so that's kind of a unique thing here with the capacity in the wells what what's your experience been when these towers are put in how it affects ISO ratings and does that result in any kind of significant reduction in people's insurances it it can if there isn't proper fire flow before the tower and so I don't know how that would affect it here because you still you have the fir flow capacity I I think here hypothetically if we built 150,000 gallon water tower we have 150,000 gallon above ground storage right now so it's potentially a wash in my head but cuz we can still Supply that we can supply it it might be ugly but we can supply it where you know the water towers with seamless pressure right yeah so I like I don't have experience with this particular scenario usually we see it where there's inadequate pressures and fire Flows at a hydrant so you might have a section of town that only gets 500 gallons a minute from a hydrant and if we Loop a system now we can get 1,500 gallons a minute so that affects this I don't know if they would give credit for elevated storage versus like pumped fire flow that's that's an El Newman question and I because we have we have capacity and the it would be equal capacity right if if we look at them identically just ones on gravity and one's a pump so I I don't [Music] know you know we have generators at at our pumping facilities so hypothetically if the power goes out we can we can still Supply it so I I don't really know that answer if they if they rate a gravity system because it's always going to be there so long as there's water in it but we could ask Al that question and he'd I'm guessing he'd have to ask somebody too because that's just it's one of those it's a capacity for capacity so I don't know well he'll be here in two weeks we'll add that to his list I just have one quick question so you mentioned it we'd still have the water pumps so even if we put in a tower we'd still keep the water pumps you would still have your well pumps or well pump yes the well you'd still have that to to get the water out of the ground but you could eliminate um the other tank and other other pumps from the from the zagler tank okay so we potentially wouldn't fill those tanks I think I think the intent in my head anyways is they stay there we own them um we just don't use them at this point and if we thought there's going to be hey we're going to we need to do some water tower maintenance then we disinfect that tank and we fill it and we operate old school it and if you wanted to utilize them as storage you you still could you have the pumpage there and it can provide storage because now if you had a tower you've you've taken care of that pressure fluctuation issue um so it kind of would come down to ongoing maintenance of keeping that structure ready versus what function you'd have for it um which is always kind of a balance you have a piece of infrastructure right so we've heard some from Jim about what the ongoing maintenance of our current system is how does that change with a water tower and a treatment center I mean that how much more do you have to do to maintain it especially if you're running parallel systems if you've got what we have right now plus you're putting in a water tower I mean how much more like are we going to need three more guys to do this or so so basically the crazy system goes away and you operate off of a water tower so now basically your supply and demand is going to come off of what the water tower is telling you but but is is there additional you know water quality checks and things that you have to do to make sure that that water that's sitting in the tank is portable and and not contaminated and I mean I would imagine it's got to be different than when you got a flow of water that's always going I mean when you got hundreds a thousand same it's so you're doing the same thing for water quality checks we'll be doing we'll be doing the exact same thing okay so like the Ziggler water tank we have to take we have to take that down that has to be cleaned and inspected uh above ground storage is treated the same as elevated storage so a water tower at some point has to be inspected and cleaned and you know potentially painted and maintained all of the same uh water quality criterias are the same you're still supposed to turn your water over in a certain amount of time you're still adding the same chemicals all of that stuff stays the same it is just a simpler system to operate and you could operate with the same number of people we have now okay yeah the the water treatment facility would add a little bit of time there's some you're now treating so you'd be running some tests maybe daily or or couple times a week to make sure that that treatment facility is running you have extra equipment in there that you're checking recording things on um but that's you know maybe four hours a week of and and do you always have to have water treatment facility along with a a water tower or is that only if you're going to treat for manganes and it would just be the manganes so you have the options of saying the tower will solve the pressure issues and all those maintenance issues and that can be a standalone a project and say yes we we realize we need the tower um the treatment can be added to that or it can be done without it and can is is the water treatment facility fairly easily added on after the fact if you know there gets to be regulations that says oh sorry but now you have to yep I I think the biggest thing would be having enough acreage by the tower to be able to put the plant there because having the plant next to the tower can have some benefits when you design that facility so looking at the numbers then though in the First Column alternative one the water treatment facility cost of 6.5 million that that's that piece so if we didn't do that it would be if we looked at just the water tower the construction cost we have here is 1.5 so the total C you may be around 2 million for the water tower oh okay I was noticing that's the least cost of the whole thing besides the land is the actual water tower yes and and that is pro is probably your biggest need and the manganese is a little subjective right on on the health risk level um we've had some communities that say yes we're going to do this we're going to put in treatment and we have others that don't so um it wasn't worth doing the study without looking at all yeah I so I mean you're doing that study Y and we know that it's a it's a potential need um to to make the water quality better it's not mandated at the moment but potentially could be so you know at the end of the day if we say that we're not going to entertain the treatment side of it you know the water tower is still in need and would make sense to buy enough land to add water treatment later yep that makes sense a a driver I've seen in other communities for the manganes is that they've maybe already had dirty water complaints everybody doesn't like the water because it's colored and now there comes along an opportunity to get some Grant funds to deal with that because of the manganes I think that's where we've seen people kind of jump on that because it offers a potential Grant opportunity to solve a problem they were already interested in solving um do we have muchi we do get those calls oh F two of them today huh oh you know cuz I I don't know how different it is with private Wells but I don't have any of that problem with my in fact I barely have to soften mine because when I test for hardness just it's it's almost I mean it's almost perfect coming out of the ground some some wells are fantastic my well at home is terrible so I have the perb verbial you know orange sidewalks and orange siding that I have to try to clean once you know once or twice a year and I had a lady call me I I'm not sure where she lived it was either I I'm assuming that it was St Clair Lakes but it could have been prer MH um but you know according to her we've wrecked every faucet in her house and her sinks are brown so I I mean I get that that's potentially not a true statement but um she's definitely noticing some discoloration that she's potentially not used to yeah so and the water's hard these water towers have agitators in them you you can a lot of people are putting them in now for a couple reasons but to prevent freezing um and there's some pretty good Technologies out there that are fairly cheap that that mix the tower to prevent ice build up I just wondering about that because everything out there that's on it you see the cycle go down you're not using much water during the winter time yep you'd almost have to have one in there a a lot of places have gone to him because they ice in the tower it happens a lot but it can have catastrophic failures when it goes wrong um and you know we've seen Towers collapse from ice in it um so I know one in years ago one in for Lake fls and it turned into being well it wasn't that bad you know yeah and and depending on what your usage is a lot of times you will not fill you just have a little water in the bottom of the bowl yeah a lot of cities in in Winter will lower the level so they with so they want to turn it over because they're not using enough water it's kind of a ying and a yanging then CU if your Tower is not full you also don't have fire protection so it's kind of a balancing act and that's where most places now are putting mixers in so for us we do run a slightly less level in the winter in the Ziggler pump house but the Ziggler pump house actually has heaters in it so so that I mean it's not hot water coming out of there but it keeps it at like oh do you have a color chart so we can look and see what colors they are whatever you want and you you can look at some places where they hire an artist to go paint their logo so I would like I would like a teapot shaped one like they have in Lindstrom I think they got that copyrighted yeah I will say this when you go to put the the name on it if you can draw it with a stencil it's much cheaper is if as long as they can stencil it it doesn't cost much but we've had some that are interested in almost custom art and there's a big dollar amount well you can go get one of those guys that do the railroad carts you know give them a couple canas spray paint send them up there one of the lengthiest City Council meetings I ever attended was attended was about the color and the font of the lettering on a water tank yeah we triple and quadruple check that before that painter goes up there so um um so I guess you know in in terms of action for the council the biggest thing is that we we will be putting in these funding applications we will include both treatment and how we're on those um there's no harm in doing that and and then it positions you if for decisions down the road um but then I think ultimately not necessarily has to be tonight and if there's more information for the council we we will be finalizing the report and sending that to you the next steps would be determining what is there a project you're ready to move forward with and then kind of moving into those those design steps and moving forward with a project Brian is there a resolution that's required for the application there's there's not a resolution required um and and um the applications are fairly simple and we'll put those together and then they they'll go on City letterhead so we would just uh send those over and you guys can send them back and we can submit them on your behalf um that funding list they're they're due in here in May but it actually gets published in August September and then how does the funding work you said you don't have to do it so like the must be some time limit if you don't use it you're going to lose it no well so the the loans are kind of would likely be there for you and those are kind of perpetually sitting there and and you can just hang on the list um if you want to work towards the grant funding um there's usually steps you may need to take to get your project up the list more and and one of those is actually designing it and getting the design approved um so if you can imagine everybody's got a wish list of stuff they want to do and so you're kind of on one part of the list well if you actually go design it and and get it approved by Department of Health it bumps you up the list because now you're shovel ready project and so if you were pursuing the grants for the water treatment that would probably be a necessary step to try to move yourself up that that ranking list um but the list is very flexible so you can be on the list and you can St for 5 years and do nothing and is there only grant funding for the water treatment not for the water tower right through the Department of Health and the PFA there's really two funding sources that are are normal through that and there's this emerging contaminant Grant which covers the manganes and then there's an affordability based grant which is basically on median household income um but they don't fund that's for residential costs and since you have such a high commercial industrial user base when that comes to calculating those grants for affordability because you don't have a lot of residential usage they're not going to you're not going to get those affordability grants and when you when you borrow money to do this does that end up getting assessed back to the property owners or what how does it work the same way as any utilities CU I would not want to hit those people with another the the ones that just hooked up you you normally fund it through user rates so it would be through your water costs um and so that that's a big part of of this process too is working with your financial advisor and and those commercial industrial users because you're going to have some big users on the system that potentially would have the biggest impact of this um any rate increases um and then that was my other question is are there any potential new businesses that are going in or that are thinking about going in that would be big water users that might you know like I've heard rumor of like a car wash or a truck wash I have no idea how big a user they are you guys really know more about that than I do but I'm just making it up just as as an example like if you had one of those going in are they big water users or do they recycle so much of their water they're not really I'm not I am not sure how truck Washings or car washes work the couple that I know of they recycle a certain amount of water um you know one of the bigger users potentially in the mix right now would be the apartment complex I mean that's you know we all know about that one I mean you put 15 rooms in there um they'll they'll use a fair amount of water on that truck wash proposed Truck Wash facility I would assume that there's some recycling in it not only is there it's a double whammy you get hit on the water Cost Plus you get hit on the increased sewer cost too mhm so what happens if we did nothing something goes down I mean well I can tell you the last time that it went down was the other night at 1: in the morning when somebody ran a car it when we had 12 Ines of snow Oh I thought it didn't go down when the car hit it uh the well kind of but I mean no I mean nobody noticed anything right um but when our system went out of whack I'm going to call it because like I said it's three individual systems trying to play nice together um we actually every once in a while have to make adjustments you don't generally make an adjustment on a Tuesday at 10:00 in the morning it's usually on a Sunday night or like I said the last time it snowed when we had how many inches of snow and I actually wasn't feeling very well so I wasn't even going to work and my phone started blowing up at 1 or 1:30 in the morning so I called and I'm like what what's going on here and Bill and Brady were at the wellhouse wellhouse one because the that air over uh water tank if that water if the usage gets funky what it'll do is it'll actually overfill that tank and then it loses pressure and then the well pumps don't turn on and it really it screws everything up so without getting into too much detail you have to basically drain a bunch of water out of the tank and then pressurize it again and then get everything reset and then start everything back up so that always happens at very inconvenient times so but what would the cost to mean it would you blow a pump for something I mean is it we talked about hammering and stuff like that what kind of damage are you talking could we do a million dollars damage if the thing went wacko or the whole thing shut down I I think so my fear is not that we blow a pump my fear is that the system goes in ay kind of like I just described and Running Aces or Ziggler or somebody starts on fire and we don't have any water because what happens is our wells operate off of that that air tank and if that says there's 4T of water in there those Wells won't run and the Ziggler Pump House can pump water but it'll just keep pumping water until it hits the low point and at some point and we've been there it's at 6 feet of water and the no and no Wells are running and you can't get them to run so now you have to go in there and you know override the Ziggler pump house so it'll pump lower than the minimum or than what we're calling the minimum and then restabilize the system and then fire up all the wells so I mean it's not it can be tragic I will tell you that today it's way less stressful for me than it was before we hooked up the Ziggler pump house because we only had that air over water tank which is 7500 gallons that we fill halfway and you get to use about 500 gall of that before you're out of pressure so really by the time hypothetically let's just say something went wrong something started on fire they started running water um before our system would even say there's a problem and call me we're done and then by the way I got to drive 20 minutes to get there so I mean it was a real problem before and that is probably why I don't have any hair at the moment because that was nerve-wracking so you ultimately have these high demand high capacity users that you know they don't use water till they need it and when they need it they take it and you're out and then I mean you could end up like a Blaine pretty quick and the goal of Public Works is to never make the paper and you'd make the paper at that point so you know Ziggler started on fire and you know our Municipal system didn't Supply any water that's a bad day what caused it to go out Jim the night of the snow it was only 6 in that was not it had nothing to do with the snow it was just bad timing so basically what happens is um you know people were using water at some point and over time that tank just got out of whack and what does that mean it got out of whack meaning that it lost all the pressure in the tank because of that water hammer so that water hammer runs back and forth and then it over pressurizes that tank that tank has a blowoff valve on it it blows a bunch of air out so then what happens is um there's less pressure in there ultimately it's easier to push water into it because it doesn't compress as hard so then you fill it up a little bit more and pretty soon it's now it's over 4 feet now it's at 4.1 4.2 4.3 4.6 right and the Ziggler pump pulse will just keep running but at some point it says hey I need to fill up and then then things start going into alarm because the wells won't turn on because the tank is over full and there's no pressure in it so there's no way to synchronize those better than what we have them the trouble is is they don't all work together as well as they could because of the distance between them and where our capacity is versus where our demand is and they operate off of radios so there's some delay in time for when things start and stop there's there's all sorts of little nuances that create you know you take a little take a little take a little pretty soon I got a lot and there's no way to um kind of like what they do with the with the electrical grid where you try to push some of your high usage to less peak times is there any way of doing that so if if if running es is filling their tank at 10: in the morning could they fill it at 10: at night and it would be less of a drain on the system and probably no no big deal for them I don't I I don't think so this time of year our demand is not very high right so it's a lot of little things that add up to a catastrophe for us you know what I mean so it's I mean Running Aces clearly uses the most amount of water with them in the hotel so I mean they're doing laundry at night they're doing this they're I don't know what they do there right but they use water and you know all of those little things just show up and then all of a sudden there's an alarm so I mean we we look at it every day and you know everything looks normal but it goes out of whack pretty quick but Running Aces doesn't have their own storage tank they just they pull out of the system when they need it they use our water right yeah I'm just asking if you know if you're if your Excel Energy you offer a uh discount if you use your air you know use your your big draws on off peak hours right is there a way to do that with our water where businesses could be incentivized if they if if their usage was such that they could schedule it differently I I mean I can't tell you that that would help us or not I I mean because if you if you take hypothetically the 100 users that we have and they all use a small amount of water at the same time mhm that's a draw to the system so how do you the the things that people don't think about when they're on city sewer and water is a tornado comes through their toilet still works and their water still works that's because our side we have not at my house but not at your house that's right but that's why I said city sewer and water people because there's always works MH so they if they got gas stoves their their gas stove always works they can always go to the bathroom they can take a shower I mean they have those facilities to them all the time and people use them all the time so and the thing is that the data isn't that granular where you would know exactly when the users what time of day users draw water it's just basically out you've got a monthly meter read correct well I was going to say you can't get that from the meter read I would have to read The Meters every day but I wouldn't know know when they used it if I read it you know what I mean if I read it at 8:00 every day I don't know when they used it it's just a 24-hour period but it you know they could have used their high capacity during the day and thrown my system off and I don't know it until I know it if that makes sense I I yeah I I just I assume that maybe there was some like somebody wasn't just running out looking at a meter that there was some sort of electronic feed that it gets and so you could get into that level of granularity if you wanted to sounds like not I don't [Music] know I don't know exactly how it works because I don't play around so our site is called Beacon right I don't play around in it very often so it's one of those things that I know we can go in there and I can look at somebody's house and see that they're running water and how much water theyve they run but unless I was staring at it all the time or I was doing a read every five minutes MH I don't know how I would know when they were using their majority of water and that would be a massive amount of data by the way well so one of the the charts that you showed I thought was on a daily basis obviously not for a particular business but yeah that was that was com total City usage so that that's your your well flow meters that are tied in and that and that's based off of when Tim bill or Brady or myself go in and read it so it could be at 10 o'clock in the morning it could be at 2 in the afternoon depending on what we're doing but that's just a a potential 24-hour period so let's just say that we check it at the same time every day that's just that number and just in in general I I think as you think about this is is kind of just the general stability of your utility you know as you're if you're growing community and there's there's indust you know industrial commercial coming in there's the apartment complex is that as more people come in your system's just going to get more complicated more users and there's more liability in you providing a reliable source of water um because as you have those commercial industrial users and maybe you have hiccups you know does does a business shut down for 24 hours because water wasn't available you know and so I I think it's hard to quantify that but the general Li um reliability of your system as you get bigger is one of the things that where the tower comes in yeah I mean the reason I was asking the question is because what I was understanding was the problem with the fluctuation in in draw was because running ases was a big user and that was creating problems for the pumps because the pumps are way over here and running ases is here and so that's why I said if there was a way to smooth that out a little bit more maybe that buys you time and and protects your system a little bit more and if it wasn't if it wasn't you know difficult to implement it on their end for all intensive purposes we don't have those glitches very often so so when I say that it's not like it happens once a week right I mean we could go for months or six months and not not have that trouble but it happens so so that's the that's the hard part so for me to for me to try to narrow down a day that it's going to happen I I think it's kind of one of those things that all the stars align to day and it happened so I mean I look at it seriously almost every night before I go to bed because I want to know what I'm in for right so it's one of those things that I can look at I can see that everything says that it's where it's supposed to be I go to bed um I've looked at it sometimes and it's like oh this doesn't look right right so then you watch it and then you know everything corrects you know be you know cuz something you know this pump was running and not that pump or you know something was a little funky but it stabilizes cuz it literally is three systems that try to work together and all three can operate differently and that's really what makes it so difficult I've had people come in so people that deal with this stuff every day to say I need some help because I'm not sure if if I'm doing this right right I mean you know how how how could we run this better and they look at it and they're like I don't know I've never seen anything like this so I mean it's just we've we've grown and we've adapted to that and at some point it's getting to be a really big animal I really am probably the one that knows the most about it because I was here for all three implementations um Tim biller Brady there's things that they don't know about well one how how does it really work and I was telling Jack today if I stood in front of the panel today I would probably stand there for an hour and scroll through everything that it does to just try to wrap my head around what we were doing when we started that one so I mean it's there's just a lot of things that happen in there one one one thing to consider when we talk about buying time and I think that's a very good alternative to look at is that a lot of this stuff is cumulative in these surges that we have in the system the huge differentials and pressure and it just keeps wearing on certain pieces and eventually it'll find the weak point and hopefully it may blow a hydrant off its off its stem generally with the fire hydrant when you put it in where the 90 goes up there's a big water of concrete behind it but if you get a little leak soes get a little loose and you have these surges it could blow one off it could blow pip loose it could break a pipe but is it going to happen tomorrow is it going to last for another 10 years that's you know we just don't know that any other questions anyone do you did you want to go through the schedule I mean maybe one of the things that um if if we get on the funding list like Brian said we would we would know in August or September where we would rank um in that system um and if we were only to go forward with the with a water tower which is probably the the highest priority what kind of schedule would we be looking at for something like that right so the one that was in here was was a combination of both of them so if it was just the tower um You' you'd normally be looking at uh a design period of um I mean probably the one of the bigger things in here to work through would be the land acquisition right because that's going to have some some outside influences on it um but in terms of just the design of it um you know say this was uh authorized after the funding list came out in August September time frame um there' be and we had the land in place that that's kind of the caveat there the design is not going to be super long on say just a Tower project um you know so we're looking in a few months that you could have things out to bid um and then there's going to be a procurement timeline for that so um you know within probably uh you're on the tower you're probably going to have a 6 to 8 month construction schedule from the time you to prove it uh if they can get on site and erect the tower and get it painted um and so um I think the biggest thing would be that land acquisition piece to to how that would fit in the entire schedule um well looking at the schedule you have the months are in the second column and the project completion is 48 does it take 48 months to project so that was with the water treatment facility and then also pursuing some Grant funds in there and so if you if you get through that funding cycle to where you design it and then you'd likely wait a second funding cycle so to get those grants you you would apply this year you would move through a design phase next winter and actually get the plans approved and then the fall of 25 is when maybe you'd get those grand funds so that schedule gets a lot longer if you're going after the treatment facility with those grand funds the tow work could happen much sooner if you apply this spring you would likely be on the list for a loan already come September okay and the only funding for just the water tower is the low interest loan through the public facilities Authority be a low interest loan okay um so if it's just the tower and you wanted to go after grant opportunities probably um direct Appropriations would be an option through your representatives that would probably be the other top option for funding of a tower okay well I think this is a lot more complicated than our previous discussion just thinking the I have a habit of doing wow I'll take our scoring Matrix any day over this you know it's a lot to wrap your head around yeah it is you have to be careful when you enter the municipal game because people are coming here here because we have the utilities MH and they're basing their business designs all of that stuff off of our utilities and we have we said that we were going to supply them so so that's the hard part right we've entered the game now now you got to play yeah and and that's and it and it's not it's not a cheap game and once once you get in the game you can't get out so there's no other option to smooth out the fluctuations in other than a water Tower there's no other solution you could I mean we'd have to look into kind of a a complex control system to [Music] see I think you would need more monitoring and and then you're dealing with communication so I I don't want to say there's there's no way MH um but I think as you dig into that and the complexity of it um you're you're paying People Like Us or others to to try to figure it out I mean it becomes more more Technology based which requires more analysis I mean it just sound it sounds like we're unusual that the capacity isn't our our problem it's this it's this other fluctuation thing that's a problem so I'm just was just saying is there any other solution to the fluctuation problem since capacity we have plenty of capacity yeah and one of the other client communities that Brian and I are working in is there was a tremendous capacity issue they were running out of they're running out of water in the summertime yeah then I get then I get why you need to do something now different but I feel like our situation is not that and I mean I'm not an engineer so I don't know you guys our situation is just getting to the point that it's really hard to manage and it's not it's not stable and that not a position that's fun to be in I mean you guys are in the position to say shoot I got to spend 12 million dollar that's not fun to be in either right and and you potentially make that paper for that thought process too right I'm on the other side and I'm the guy that you guys are going to beat down my door at 2: in the morning saying somebody ran out of water this building burned down cuz we don't have any water what the heck happened you know so so that's the other side of the game right um we we both feel the pain just it's different sides of the spectrum and and it is it it seriously is nerve-wracking I mean that's not um to go from where we started to where we are today way less nerve-wracking right and and I'm confident that our system works but it has some glitches and there's some things in it that functionally you just don't want to happen in your water system so we talk about water water hammer water hammer also creates turbulated water which we flush our hydrants out every year or our system you turn them on the water comes out nice and Crystal Clear then all of a sudden it's black black so that stuff is in the lines so every time you get water hammer it just hammers that stuff back and forth and the water is just dirty all the time and and I can't fix that yeah and and and your and your demand is increasing I mean obviously we've had development we've had businesses go in we've had loves who's probably another significant water user because of the type of business they are uh we've been talking about a an apartment complex 150 units um you know hi ve who knows um other other development there along Hornsby um you know so your demand isn't going down it's going to go up and I get it one one one other thing to consider too is when you start talking about these types of projects you just don't say we're going to do it and you start on it in three months you start on it now and it might be implemented maybe in three years MH so the time to start doing some initial planning and prep work is now whether you able whether you actually do anything or not is the second question but you know to me one of the key things to do is at a minimum maybe start looking at which is going to be the preferred site you know see if we can do the land acquisition then maybe we do it in in the other two stages but if we want something done in three to five years now is the time just at least start the Preparatory work on it is is land acquisition eligible in the funding yes it is um is it is it retro is it it'll be retro because your funding package doesn't start till you get to the construction phase so you could get reimbursed you could get so you could buy the land now and then put it into the cost of the project and get funded for it so and and just going back to the last discussion about other control methods or other things that could be done um I think what we're seeing is is you've been this Growing System that's kind of pieced things together as you needed it and if you take another step to kind of piece things together at you know there's going to be a point down the road where you look back and go oh we should have pulled the Band-Aid off right there right and you know not stuck $500,000 into trying to make this system work again that's where we should have stopped and said okay we got to just do it right and I think that's a little bit of where you're at is you know could we look into some other Alternatives that buy some more time you could but then as you continue to grow and grow 15 years from now or 10 years from now there's going to be different Council up here you're looking back and going why did they do that back then they should have put a water tower in right and I I think that's a little bit of where you are right now is it's a difficult decision because you're kind of at that fork in the road um but other Solutions then other than a tower are going to probably continue to be that kind of shortterm that buys you some time um just one more one more piece to the dysfunctional system we wouldn't want you to lose any more hair I'm getting pretty lean right now I'm going to start knocking on your guys' door I can't go to Jack so same boat I'm in so it's what this job will do to you what's that I said it's what's this job will do to you it sure is all right so we don't need I mean obviously it's a workshop so we don't take any action tonight but when would this come before us for an action you you wouldn't need to take any action I mean this in order to submit the application is is a couple hours of work so it's really kind of built into our our current budget um we could take care of that all we need is is the city letterhead and so there's really no official action at this point it's The Next Step Beyond that when you would have to decide okay what are we going to do um from here so okay yeah there's so much new information tonight this is not a decision-making meeting cuz this is a lot to to kind of digest um that was helpful though thank you you did a really nice job and like I said if if anybody wants to take a field trip I'll I'll show you I mean you you won't be able to see the disfunction right M but I can explain what each well or Pump House does and you can kind of at least wrap your head around what we're talking about cuz sometimes it is a little nicer to at least visually see it I know Jesse's been in a pump house or two around but um the rest of you have not so I mean and just out of curiosity is the one that got plowed into fixed now say again the pump house that got plowed into by the car is it fixed now no oh it's so it has a temporary wall in there um we've just recently went out to get some quotes from from a couple contractors and and uh once we get those back then we'll just keep moving forward but um hopefully hopefully relatively soon yeah the the water side of it's fixed it's the building structure that needs to be yeah so so it just has a wood wall where it used to be concrete but you know we've had some of the electrical removed that was broken off that'll have to get put back and you know between Tim Bill Brady and I we rebuilt a bunch of the you know water lines inside that were for prel Lubes and things like that and put all that stuff back together and has there been any information on the person who did it in their insurance coverage we so we know obviously who it is and we have their insurance information and that was given to the league of Minnesota cities so basically the way that insurance thing works is the league is going to pay for it yep and then the league goes after and oh we pay our deductible and I think it's $500 or something yeah um then basically if the league gets $1 back from the I'll call them the perpetrator um then we get our whole deductible back so I I don't see any reason why we why we wouldn't win this yeah you know battle but you know it's just a it's an inconvenience but you know but we don't know what actually happened no and I mean we got a police report but it it looked like my computer screen right now yeah I know and you were going to see if you can get something that was less redacted right is that didn't it didn't work they weren't willing to do that I haven't heard back from them on that I can follow up to see if they would remove some of that information I just was curious I don't believe that all the information that was redacted is are things that they normally do I'm I'm kind of curious I'm glad you reminded me that I want to check on it I I because I have never had one redacted I mean they've always given us everything no matter what happened I mean we've always gotten a full report I have never seen one like this so when I opened it I'm like I mean I probably probably somebody new on the job say again somebody new on the job potentially yep well that's all public information though accidents right right I mean I know that why I said it's probably somebody new on the job and they just haven't talk to Jessica or liaison but I haven't I haven't seen her for a while so I mean really for me talking to the deputies I mean we have a pretty good idea on what happened and how it All Shook out I mean there's some small details that we don't know that and my head doesn't really matter at this point but um we have the important things you know nobody got hurt um how and how can that be I mean how do you plow your car into a brick wall at 100 miles an hour and everybody wears seat belts and it was a really nice car so I mean you're still your your internal organs are still traveling at 100 miles an hour so when they hit that wall that is the other side of your body oh yeah it's not good no I mean and I mean that was a literal dead stop from however fast they were going right yeah yeah um and and those and there's some Unk no ones there right but I mean at the end of the day nobody got hurt that's it's a relatively good small inconvenience for us at this point it didn't hamper our system at all so I I mean it's as good as of a bad situation at that point so okay all right thank you very much thank you thank you Kevin thank you you're welcome all right I think we're done I think that was it already do the lake try we did well we only have five more items on the agenda all right anything else done you still have to go through them right oh go ahead no oh you're kidding I'm kidding thank you anybody else anybody no let all right then we'll adjourn our meeting and we'll see everybody tomorrow Nate okay talk about have a good night everyone thanks [Music] bye